Mafia 1013 - Prozacs Basic Theme - Game has ENDED

[Blackberry]

I think now might be a good time to reveal to my husband that I am really a MAN O_O.

[Blackberry]

Gurlllllllllllllllll, I caught my husband cheating on me once wit da help of Cheaters. He da king of all liars foo'. I'm woop his azz when I see him next.

^_^

But on the serious side. I saw this on wiki:

RQS

The Random Questioning Stage (RQS) is an alternative method to the RVS to start a game of Mafia. It can take a couple of forms, either with the instigating player posting a string of questions to each player (typically all in the first post), with each player in the game getting one question, or doing it survey-style and posing about 5 or so questions for the whole game to answer. Questions can either be centered around Mafia itself ("Do you prefer town or scum?") to something way off-topic ("Who's that in your avatar?"), depending on how the user approaches the method

This looks a lot funner than "Random Voting" (something I am not particularly a fan of because I am an unusual person). Although, I have no idea if it will give us any information. Probably just give us people's personal opinions, we'll see.

So let's start:

Anon

- If I say "I dislike random voting" how does that make you react?

Blackberry

- Damn fool, why you so damn sexy? And so weird? XD

Budja

- Are you the type of person who tends to be bias agains't people that play differently than others? Why or why not?

Fishythefish

- Do you think people who get angry easily and use cuss words/act like the other person is stupid is more likely to me mafia, or it is 100% personality?

Flameaxe

- If you were mafia, who would your partners be in this game?

Jack

- Are you the type of person who tends to be bias agains't people that play differently than others? Why or why not?

llamaeatataco

- If I say "I dislike random voting" how does that make you react?

mallowgeno

- Do you think people who get angry easily and use cuss words/act like the other person is stupid is more likely to me mafia, or it is 100% personality?

Mitsuru Kirijo

- If you were mafia, who would your partners be in this game?

Raivann

- Are you the type of person who tends to be bias agains't people that play differently than others? Why or why not?

StrangerCoug

- If you were mafia, who would your partners be in this game?

xvart

- Do you think people who get angry easily and use cuss words/act like the other person is stupid is more likely to me mafia, or it is 100% personality?

[Blackberry]

O_o @ the last three posting all having the same question.

For the record, although I may be experienced, I prefer to call myself MS-challenged . I don't play the same way people expect "experienced MS players" to play. For Example: I never use the terms FOS, WIFOM, etc. Plus I am not a fan of Random Voting. I think I basically just do not like conforming and the fact that I like to have fun and be odd (which often makes me stick out as a target for an easy lynch because I try to have fun ).

I've noticed a lot of people (not a majority, but there's always that one or two player each game) on here get off by arguing and debating (I think a lot of people just come here to prove they are better debaters - trying to use logic to twist what has happened to their advantage). I prefer to just have fun and use my not-so-impressive skills to catch mafia (although I think I downplay my skills, there are certain things I catch that make me go "Aha! He is mafia! Lynch him!" but nobody sees my point and I'm not the best of using said twisted logic to make people see things how I see it ). I don't know what the point of writing all that is. Just so everyone can see my point-of-view/playstyle and be prepared? Lol.

[Blackberry]

Did I paste them without reading?

--> That doesn't make any sense. I wrote them all and just asked some people the same questions instead of making up a different question for each person or instead of asking everyone the same exact question. If you hadn't noticed, for each question, I gave it to two or three people.

Did you notice that?

I'm not smilie biased mind you, your post just seems overly smilie and thus suspicious to me.

It is noted that you find my

personality

suspcious. (You wouldn't be the first ). I don't fully understand what you mean when you say "sucking up."

Also,

Vote: mallowgeno

for the moment. Him not responding to my question suggests he may not have read any of the other posts (though I doubt this considering I bolded everyone's names). So I'll see what he says .

[Blackberry]

O_o @ the last three posting all having the same question.

Oh, I just now got this.
I thought you were talking about your last 3 questions you asked, dur.

As for sucking up i mean to the town in general like saying "hey don't worry about me I'm all loveable smiles" whilst you slit our throats in the night.

The fact that you aren't voting me right away makes me think you aren't mafia (I think mafia would take the "Blackberry is different" opportunity and use it to vote me). The fact you have not done so suggests you're most likely an open-minded townsperson.

-------

unvote, vote: Blackberry

I agree with Raivann about the attitude of his first post. Adding to this is the way he spends quite a bit of it discussing his own playstyle. Blackberry seems to be thinking a lot about how he is seen by others, and that makes him likely scum.

I would clarify that the intention of my post is to let people know that I play differently than expected (even though I am experienced) and let people know that first-hand. That way, down the line, when I don't do something like an experienced player would (aka, such as disagreeing with random voting) mafia won't be like "But you're an experienced player- yadda, yadda" and try to vote me for that reason.

What I have found is that in (now) all of the games I've recently joined, I get attacked quite quickly because of my expressing myself and not being afraid to say what I think I should say and talking about how I play differently. What I haven't discovered yet is whether these attacks are often mafia (which is my current theory, although I do NOT think everyone that attacks me is mafia, I am certain there is atleast one leading it to get an "easy" lynch). Although one of those games is over and the main attacker of me was mafia -- so my theory may prove decent.

I agree with StrangerCoug though, why is thinking about how I am seen by others make me more likely scum?

If you are town, do you not care if other people think you are mafia or not?

-----

Yes. I am basing my vote on one post. I think that post is attempting to get people to like Blackberry, and that the focus on BB's playstyle in the first paragraph shows he is focused on his own image. Of course that can be a personality thing, but I think it's a bit more likely to come from scum than town - as scum people spend more time worrying about how they are perceived. I think it's more likely to be right than voting on a total nulltell.

Why would scum care more than town about how they are percieved? I think both town and scum should be equally concerned about how they are potrayed. A part of being a good townsplayer is defending yourself and expressing that you are indeed an innocent.

And the best way for a true townsperson to do that is to write and be open with your thoughts and feelings (some people might disagree with this [or maybe they are mafia in my other games] but I think the more you write/ the more you give off oppotunities for others to read you, thus by expressing myself more I am able to give other townspeople to get a good read off me). On the other hand, mafia should be afraid to express themselves and write too much, because there is a greater opportunity for people to see through their fakeness.

-----

^ Dislike your phrasing. Elaborate on Jack?

@BB, biased against scummy play, not odd play.

vote:Blackberry

FoS: SC

I would appreciate it if you elaborated at your viewpoint of why a FoS on SC, and if your vote on me is more-seriousnish than elaborate on your reasonings.

[Blackberry]

I agree with StrangerCoug though, why is thinking about how I am seen by others make me more likely scum?

I didn't voice my taking a stance on the matter. I only said that it's possible that Jack's vote on you is opportunistic. (If anything having to do directly with you, I do think about what I write as town, too.)

Sorry - I meant llama.

As scum, I am paranoid about how I am percieved, as town it matter less.
Re. SC, its not the subject matter but the phrasing. Tiptoeing around his opinion.
Re. Seriousness, its one up from a random vote.

I disagree that it matters less about how you are percieved when you are town (or maybe that is just me, when I play mafia IRL people always target me early because I'm one of the few people in my group of friends that doesn't have a facial/body language tell and because I started the whole club, and thus people think I am always lying to them, lol). In other words, I am very used to having to defend myself early and making sure the group percieves me for what I am.

Also, please explain how I am tiptoeing around my opinion? I really do not understand that.

[Blackberry]

Unvote

Vote: Budja

I want to see how you react to this. You've done something that raises a red flag to me (I'm not revealing what it is - because it is a tell that I think is more accurate than a lot of other tells, and by revealing it - it prevents mafia from doing that tell in the future).

---

SC - I would like you to elaborate on your vote for mallow.

---

I disagree with Jack. I don't think SC would bandwagon so quickly if SC was scum. But that's just my opinion.

[Blackberry]

Unvote

Vote: Budja

I want to see how you react to this. You've done something that raises a red flag to me (I'm not revealing what it is - because it is a tell that I think is more accurate than a lot of other tells, and by revealing it - it prevents mafia from doing that tell in the future).

Why are you making a face at this? Express yourself in words please.

I disagree with Jack. I don't think SC would bandwagon so quickly if SC was scum. But that's just my opinion.

Why don't you think he would? When scum see a VI on the road to being strung up they often like to be on early. Or he could have been scum uncomfortable with his vote and looking to switch.

Because scum wouldn't want to be that obvious. I don't think. I agree that what SC did looked like obvious bandwagoning or what you explained. But I think it was too obvious and scum would be smarter than that.

[Blackberry]

What does this mean?

It means I think you are being lazy and I don't want to let you get away with that (plus, I'd rather see HOW you respond rather than just post a smiley face).

[Blackberry]

So how about ocho and uno pairing up?

Huh?

Also, you didn't answer my question.

[Blackberry]

Also, you didn't answer my question.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4eY4qU80lPM#t=7m58s

This is what I think of whenever anyone says that.

...

I feel like you are trying to just provoke me. Which isn't very helpful for anyone. Are you going to answer the question?

[Blackberry]

I am disappointed. I just spent so much time looking through things on two players and still don't have any ideas of what to make of it:

Budja

- in all your other games you are prone to making smiley faces quite often, yet you haven't made a single one this game (however, you've done this as mafia as well in the past, so I can't really make anything of it except you lost your emotions ) - and the thing that yall refer to as a "secret scumtell" Budja has done in the past as a town. However, I still want you to give more of yourself. Something about you makes me think you are mafia.

StrangerCoug was the other player I read up on (it took me forever to find a game where you were mafia). I didn't notice any difference in what I was looking for.

I am now looking at Jack and Fishy.

[Blackberry]

I was about to do Fishy, but reading Fishy's post I decided I'd do Raivvan instead. Here are my interesting results:

* Two of the three times he was previously mafia, his reasons for voting someone were "trying to make himself look like town" or too "townie" or something along those lines.

FoS:Blackberry

for 5 smilies and 1 Lol in 1 post, if you count the first O_o. With that many in a short post it looks like sucking up.

--> I thought at some point he accused me of being "too townie", looking back I realize that was Fishy -_- ... I thought I'd post this anyways since I'm wasting so much time looking at all this stuff.

* Also, I could only find one game where you were playing with Budja - in which you were lynched for being mafia. So the argument of "I always get lynched early" sounds silly in that case.

-----

To be blunt, I really have no idea what to make of anyone at this moment (probably because I'm tired ). Jack still has not answered my question, and I want that question answered.

Vote: Jack

[Blackberry]

((I had more time than I thought))

Anon

- I found my post where someone calls someone "too town"

Budja

- not really sure what to think, also, bandwagon on me, post 67 - when reading through old games, you said "bla blah's point is OK" when you were SCUM

Fishythefish

- second to take the bait, end of 52 sounds like scum

Flameaxe

- i originally thought he may be being nice to me, nothing he has done though as struck me as unusual yet, 64 looks like backtracking

Jack

- noncooperative? also, bandwagon on me without stating anything

llamaeatataco

- attacks the players attacking me (indirectly defending me, read: more an open-minded and logical player), his reasons for voting Fishy sounded legitimate and it sounded sincere, but him switching to someone else doesn't sound like town (it almost sounds like Mafia who gave up on his other wagon idea)

mallowgeno

- the only thing I have to note is that you didn't read my original post asking questions, indicating you weren't paying attention

Mitsuru Kirijo

- one of her early posts made me think town, post 60 - i don't see why anyone would think EVERYTHING SAID was overreacting-that indirectly means you think none of them are mafia almost?

Raivann

- first to take the bait, however, didn't really vote me, just started it

StrangerCoug

- attacks the players attacking me (indirectly defending me, read: more an open-minded and logical player), 55 just looks odd

xvart

- i didn't write anything down about you on my reread, i guess you didn't do anything that caught my attention

----

This is a side note away from the game. What exactly is a Prozac?

There are three definitions:

1: My medication

...

2: Medication for people with Depression or Anxiety (Panic Attacks). It inhibits the serotonin-reuptake.

3: It is also a nickname for Porochaz because (insert reason).

---

Also, why are people saying they're read on Jack is going up/sour? My read on Jack is going NO WHERE is he is being an uncooperative asshole.

[Blackberry]

Yes and No

My strategy was make myself vulnerable, see who attacks me as an "easy target" and make judgments from there. Although I think I did accomplish making me look vulnerable, no one actually attacked me for what I expected them to attack me for (the non-conforming thing).

I did not set a deliberate of a trap as I have in the past (I would refer to it as a reaction test, trap makes it sound like it is only meant for mafia, where in this case, it is meant to see who will jump the gun early enough and make accusations, who I suspect would be mafia).

[Blackberry]

Your defense of BB is unfounded and its ilogical coming from a townie entity that early in the game. You even decide to attack another player based on his accusations against BB. Yet some posts later you agree that the attacks can make sense. Flifflop FTL.

I don't like this. I disagree completely. A town seeing what looks like mafia jumping on an easy target would totally interfere.

* Why do you say it is illogical?

* Why do you say it is unfounded?

-----

Yes and No

My strategy was make myself vulnerable, see who attacks me as an "easy target" and make judgments from there. Although I think I did accomplish making me look vulnerable, no one actually attacked me for what I expected them to attack me for (the non-conforming thing).

I did not set a deliberate of a trap as I have in the past (I would refer to it as a reaction test, trap makes it sound like it is only meant for mafia, where in this case, it is meant to see who will jump the gun early enough and make accusations, who I suspect would be mafia).

What is the non conforming thing ?

I'm not quite sure I'm buying what your selling here. So you make yourself appear an easy target how?

I'm not trying to "sell" anything. I made myself an easy target by being vulenrable and exposing myself and how I think and how I am not the "typical" player The non-conforming thing is in my post on the first page.

That's not what I meant, I don't find that scummy. It actually gets old repeating things three times, I agree.
But you don't strike me as a "lazy" player, more like fakeraging flailing scum.

Flailing is a word I see scum use to make town people look bad.

-----

Flameaxe is town. And I think he is smart based on one of his recent posts. The fact Anon is trying to go after Flameaxe in a recent posts only makes me suspect Anon more.

...

I am leaving my vote on Jack until he answers my question or he is replaced. Him being uncooperative is not going to help us at all and it's hard to get a read on him. It's really pissing me off.

POROCHAZ:

Is it possible to get Jack replaced on the fact he isn't being cooperative, and being uncooperative works against one's win condition either way, thus, he is not playing by the rules and working towards his win condition.

[Blackberry]

I'm really drunk right now. So I'm going to skim the thread with an open mind and see if the power of drunk intuition can enlighten me as to who mafia is.

Btw, Flameaxe is the only person who, without a second thought, is 100% town.

[Blackberry]

Anon- MAFIA
Budja- TOWN
Fishythefish- TOWN
Flameaxe- TOWN
Jack- TOWN
llamaeatataco- TOWN
mallowgeno- TOWN
Mitsuru Kirijo- MAFIA
Raivann- TOWN
StrangerCoug- TOWN
xvart- MAFIA

-- This was my drunk intuitive read. Don't know where it's going. After briefly skimming, just looking at the usernames and posts I SEE either town (faded) or MAFIA (bold). I'll re-examine it when I am sober.

[Blackberry]

Mitsuru - I'm fairly confident Jack is not really a "DayCop".

Gah what is it that you want me to explain? You and Mitsuru both said that I'm confusing you, but you're the ones who are confusing me.

I got a daycop result on you...it said you were guilty but the flavor hinted at miller (townie who appears guilty), is that really your role?

you really think people are that stupid, jack?

Some of them.

----

I think I am going to ignore my drunk accusations for the time being. Although Anon is someone the strikes me as scum, Mitsuru is not.

----

Jack, will you answer the question about the smiley in words and reasons?
Why did you not answer the question about the smiley earlier?

[Blackberry]

Be back later for a real post, but for now:

Why did BB publicly ask in the thread for Jack's replacement, and not in a PM? What would he gain by publicizing that request?

Because I want Jack to know the seriousness of my frustration.

[Blackberry]

Not exactly. I'm fine with a gut feeling, as long as you can show me something to reinforce that feeling. I (and anyone else in this game) has very little reason to trust your gut. Do I use my gut when playing? Yes. Do I hold it to much weight? No.

Check my other games to see how accurate my gut is. The problem, I think, is that we have different definitions of gut. Gut for me is as an extension of subjective logic that goes online when trying to decide subjective nulltells, as active posting, long posting, vote hopping, easy targetness, etc. Ill try to explain my gut in a playerlist Ill compile in my followng post.

Now, meta reasons are a whole different story. I believe meta reasons are rarely a strong form of a read. I know from experience that I've tried to play differently in different games, and I can only assume I'm not the only one. Who's to say someone isn't playing different from their meta to throw the town off? It's just too shaky in terms of reasoning to me.

This is just stupid. Meta is a very very useful in my experience. Its cool you have tried to play different in different games but your assumption about everyone is wrong. The essence of a player is very difficult to fake and thats what meta aims to.

Just curious, can you show me some of your games and explain the different playstyle you've tried?

Who are you talking to in this post? You quoting yourself confuses me, lol.

I don't like this. I disagree completely. A town seeing what looks like mafia jumping on an easy target would totally interfere.
* Why do you say it is illogical?
* Why do you say it is unfounded?

Except llama didnt think raivann was mafia. He thought he was stupid.

Just fyi, you should ask questions before explicitly disagreeing with someone.

Ill explain why llama is scum in this post.

I didn't ask why llama was scum, I asked other questions . Mafia use words to attack other players. Town use words that they genuinely believe, thus, if you were town I'd assume you could back up your choice of words.

Noobish scum would have sheeped to BB (or any other active vocal player in RVS), regardless of berry's alignment.

I would think noobish scum, or scum in general, would attack me as an easy target, not support me. No?

Flameaxe is town. And I think he is smart based on one of his recent posts. The fact Anon is trying to go after Flameaxe in a recent posts only makes me suspect Anon more.

Why do you think he is town?

His read on me wasn't just good, it was

perfect

, in a sense anyways. Although rethinking it, I guess a mafia could be working really hard at actually looking at people's behavior. But I'm leaning towards only a town would be able to do that really well.

----

I have to go back and read. I remember something xvart wrote made me think something. And I remember someone asking me something, which I want to answer and respond to, but I don't know who so I need to find that. Expect another post shortly.

[Blackberry]

The two things I mentioned above were one in the same, lol.

POROCHAZ:

Is it possible to get Jack replaced on the fact he isn't being cooperative, and being uncooperative works against one's win condition either way, thus, he is not playing by the rules and working towards his win condition.

Do you really think Prozac is going to force replace someone under those conditions you describe? I think this is ludacris and I don't believe your intentions are genuine as described.

Why don't you think my intentions are genuine? And yes, I think I had a shot at convincing the moderator to do something that most would see as "impossible".

In my last game I convinced the moderator to reveal that the person I replaced was inactive during the night

. Which nobody thought I was going to be able to do.

-----

Yes and No

My strategy was make myself vulnerable, see who attacks me as an "easy target" and make judgments from there. Although I think I did accomplish making me look vulnerable, no one actually attacked me for what I expected them to attack me for (the non-conforming thing).

I did not set a deliberate of a trap as I have in the past (I would refer to it as a reaction test, trap makes it sound like it is only meant for mafia, where in this case, it is meant to see who will jump the gun early enough and make accusations, who I suspect would be mafia).

Did you expect anyone in particular to attack you or just scum in general? Can you point me to a completed game where you set a trap? Please link directly to the post where you set the trap and then where you exposed the results of your trap.

Did you even consider doing your own research?

Since this new forum, I've only played two other games besides this one. The first one I replaced into.

I opened myself up and was genuine with my feelings and thoughts. I noticed that the mafia was quick to jump on to me because of my vulnerability.

The other game is currently on-going where I started from the beginning and wasn't a replacement. You are more than welcome to read that if you want to see me setting a trap.

[Blackberry]

Jack - can you please stop ignoring me and answer the question?

[Blackberry]

Thank you Jack.

StrangerCoug looked like he kept changing his suspects a lot (thus why I looked up his history to see if he does it often). But then I realized (AFTER doing my reread) he wasn't actually voting them (in this game), but just saying stuff suggesting he suspects them and pointing out fishy things. He has been someone that has peaked my radar, but I don't actually think he is scum. I really don't know why. Reading his posts I don't get the feel he is a mafia player trying to throw out suspcions on random people, but that he is playing for real. Although I am mostly uncertain, nothing really pops out as "scum" to me at this point (and after reviewing his previous play).

[Blackberry]

Unvote, Vote: Anon

in a hurry, but I saw my vote was still on Jack and wanted to change. Will relook at this later.

[Blackberry]

Playstyle change? It amounts to nothing more than I quit for almost two years and came back to play one game at a time. Comparing how I played in 2008 to how I play in this single game only proves my previous point.

I have to second this with my playstyle. I haven't played on mafiascum in a very long time, I don't think my playstyle is simular at all, although I don't really remember it. I know I look for different things nowadays. I don't remember what I looked for in the past, lol.

Unvote

Vote: Budja

I want to see how you react to this. You've done something that raises a red flag to me (I'm not revealing what it is - because it is a tell that I think is more accurate than a lot of other tells, and by revealing it - it prevents mafia from doing that tell in the future).

Did Budja's answer satisfy you? Or are you voting Anon because you consider him more scummy?[/quote]

Reading Budja, I saw him do my secret scumtell as both town and mafia (or it may have been just town, I don't recall 100%) - just that I realized he had done it before as town.

Well good for you on your last game. Your suggestion to have him forced replaced was unfounded and would never have happened. By your reference to your last game you know that it was something that was not going to go well.

Ummm, it did go well, I got what I wanted.

alleged drunk observations

Does alleged indicate you think I was faking drunk? I think that sounds really stupid. If anything I was either drunk and a mafia pretend to hunt, or I am drunk and a townsperson thinking I am seeing things. What purpose does it serve someone to pretend to be drunk?

Also, your reference to the on going game as trap setting is irrelevant and unprovable. I would suggest not following this train of thought.

This does not seem like something a town would say who is trying to figure out the facts and previous history.

To call me an open minded townsperson like that pinged my scumdar. But it wasn't until his stunt where asked for Jack to be replaced for not answering questions that really got me thinking scum.

Why is calling someone an open minded townsperson something scum would do?

Why is asking for Jack to be replaced something scum would do?

** I though I added it to my quotes, but Jack changing his vote after Flameaxe's explanation of not playing for awhile gives him town points.

[Blackberry]

That was a quick vote Fishy. You didn't even wait for me to answer your setup questions.
Hmmm...maybe my reads are off.

Ummm, you aren't very good at answering questions. Why did you answer one question but fail to answer the other when they are right next to eachother?

Why is asking for Jack to be replaced something scum would do?

[Blackberry]

I'm not really believing Raivann's read on Flameaxe. I don't feel it's a natural reaction to someone criticising your reads to call them scummy for defending those players and disagreeing with you. Similarly, I seriously dislike the OMGUS of calling Budja scum simply for being the third vote on his wagon. He seems far more concerned with undermining people who attack him than explaining his votes, defending himself or determining people's alignments.

unvote, vote: Raivann

I never called Budja scum.
Thats why you thought you could get away with hopping on my wagon too, and hope nobody paid attention to Jack's case on you, but, no.

@BB- xvart already covered that better than I could. I didn't know what to make of it when I read it.
I thought maybe Jack pissed you off in the scumQT or something. It struck me as odd to ask for Jack to be replaced, he seemed to be scumhunting to me.
How could you think you could get someone replaced just because you didn't like their answers?
It doesn't mak any sense unless your trying somehow to get townie points.

I think you just revealed you are scum O_o.

Do you even know WHY I was asking for Jack's replacement? It was because he wasn't

answering a question

. You saying maybe I was mad with his answer suggests you didn't even read my post. If you genuiney though I was scum- don't you think you'd read my posts and analyze my reasons and what I say?

Also, if that was your thinking (that I got mad at him in a scumQT?) - why not say so earlier and consider voting Jack?

Unvote, Vote: Raivaan

Scum QT

Just out of curiosity - is scum using a QT typical? I haven't played in a year + and we never did that back in those days. I was just wondering if that is what is done nowadays? Or is that a possible slip by Raivann? If it is very common, I am not asking this to clear myself, I genuinely do not know.

[Blackberry]

That put him at 5.

[Blackberry]

Raivann feels like scum who thinks he can get people to stop voting him by attacking them whenever they do.

Of course, that point is undermined somewhat by the fact that you very rarely see play like this from scum either. Two things give me pause for thought. The speed of the wagon, and to a lesser extent the VT claim. Neither of these are typical of scum wagons.

* You see play like this from town? It doesn't even look like he's trying to hunt for scum. All of his reaction posts are short and fling accusations somewhere else. Almost waiting to see if one sticks.

* Claiming VT makes you want to lynch someone less? It makes me want to lynch someone more. I think scum know that fakeclaiming a PR only draws more attention to them, claiming a VT is safe because it makes one

look

honest. Worst case scenario, he turns up VT, atleast we didn't lose a power role.

It's very easy to get a scumread on Raivann, but I'm not sure it's actually right.

* This sounds odd.

[Blackberry]

So then, now that you were lynched, can you tell us whether you were actually a VT?

^Townie post.

^ I disagree. Mitsuru asking that question almost looks fake. If you are a town, does anyone else see themselves asking a question like that? Why not wait for the moderator to post? I think Mitsuru knew Raivann was at 6 at this point and was either asking to try to get her possible scum partner-Raivann to say yes and clear him, or asking because she thought she could trick Raivaan into admitting he wasn't. No way do I see this as making her town, because it doesn't feel like it's something one would ask as town sincerely (and by this, I mean, she knew he was only at six).

[Blackberry]

@BB: I don't see play like this from town. Do you see play like this from scum?

I don't remember what scum act like when they're going down. But he is acting lazy in his scumhunting even though he is getting pressured. If you're town you try and look for something real and prevent your fellow townies from making a mistake, not just accuse the last person to post. He strikes me as someone who is scum and is too lazy to care about trying too hard so is going to see if anything he throws sticks.

Let me explain what I mean about my scumread on Raivann. It's very easy to get a

that makes no sense as town

read on him. But his play makes no sense from scum either. It's a question of which it makes less sense as, and the more I think about that the less obvious it is.

What do you assume scum would be doing in this situation?

[Blackberry]

XVART

- I'm going to list off all the things you misrepresented, and I want you to tell me how you came to those inaccurate conclusions. I feel like you're trying to expand on something you thought was an argument because people said they "liked it." But I think you're showing you really don't have any argument and your logic behind your accusations is inaccurate.

Vote 2

, 84 - votes Budja for secret, more reliable than most scumtells, tell; later retracted because he discovered the Budja committed this tell as both town and scum, and possibly only as town; also admits he himself has committed this reliable tell as town (if that makes any sense at all)

Where

have I said I've done it as town? The tell is something I don't do period because I point-blank don't believe in it.

Vote 5

, 395 - Votes Raivaan and joins the popular bandwagon for revealing that he is scum in post 387, for saying there was a scum QT (I think this was what was considered to be revealing scum).

No where in my post do I say it is because of the QT thing. In fact, that QT thing is mentioned last and is a small detail I had a question about. Nothing about why I voted for Raivaan.

Also questions Raivaan's intentions behind commenting on his asking for Jack to be forced replaced.

I wasn't asking intentions, I was asking for explanation of logical thinking.

Out of all of those votes, the only one that can be argued as legitimate is the last one, and that, in my opinion is highly debatable. It looks to me as more of a way to get on the Raivaan wagon than anything.

So you thinking voting people for reactions isn't legitimate? Also, if you read back, I had been questioning Raivaan before.

The reason I'm harping on the secret tell thing so much is because it looks to be obvious backpeddling. A tell that is more reliable than most scum tells suddenly becomes something the target does as town

(and might only do as town)

, and also

the accuser of guilty of doing as town

, is hardly a more accurate tell than most scumtells. If this is not backpeddling, I don't know what is.

Underline #1: I never said he

only

did it as town. I only said I saw him do it as town, which is reason enough to know it probably isn't realiable in this instance.
Underline #2: I never said I did it before - as I don't do it period.

[Blackberry]

((I have to write this really quick because I have to leave on Vacation))

Where

have I said I've done it as town? The tell is something I don't do period because I point-blank don't believe in it.

You are right. I am unable to locate where I got this, but by my recollection and link reference I must have misread your 368 once and didn't double check it. Misrep noted. And since you mention it, what kind of tell is it that you don't even believe in it? Regardless of the fact that you never said it, the point remains that you backpeddled on your accurate scumtell once questioned about its legitimacy. Also, tells are generally something people do not do regardless. The fact that you say you don't do it because it you don't believe in it doesn't make sense.

The tell is using the term "WIFOM." Especially in an unnecessary/exxagerated scenario. For example, I think Budja's use of WIFOM was not called for.

I don't believe in it because for the most part I think using WIFOM is silly and is just a way for people to try to confuse you. Most things are pretty black-and-white and can be observed with a keen eye.

Well, pardon me for not understanding; but you indicated that there was something in Raivaan's post that revealed him to be scum, meaning a serious scumslip or having knowledge of something only scum would know. The only thing that resembles a scum outting himself is knowledge of a scum QT. Your other reasonings include Raivaan not understanding why you were asking for Jack to be force replaced and your accusation that Raivaan didn't even read your post. But to be clear and to give you the benefit of the doubt, what in Raivaan's post outted him as scum?

I said:

I think you just revealed you are scum O_o.

Do you even know WHY I was asking for Jack's replacement? It was because he wasn't answering a question. You saying maybe I was mad with his answer suggests you didn't even read my post. If you genuiney though I was scum- don't you think you'd read my posts and analyze my reasons and what I say?

This is what I was referring to when I said he revealed himself as scum, by making accusations that are inaccurate had he read my posts.

So you thinking voting people for reactions isn't legitimate? Also, if you read back, I had been questioning Raivaan before.

If you read back, I clearly said your Raivaan vote could be debated as being legitimate.

This was not referring to my Raivaan vote. This was referring to my mallow, Jack, and even Budja vote (to a lesser extent).

Explain your sudden jump to Anon and lack of following up as you said you would; and why you never explained why he wasn't worthy of a vote afterall.

Why I changed my vote off Jack to someone else: I didn't really suspect Jack as scum for mentioned reasons previously, plus the purpose of the vote wa sout of frustration. At that time, I wanted it elsewhere.
Why I changed my vote off of Anon: I liked the Raivaan wagon. He wasn't acting like town. His accusations weren't logical deductions for town to make.

Why I voted Anon: He was someone that struck me as possible scum. I can reread and explain why later. I do not have the time at this moment as I am about to leave. I should have limited access either tonight or possibly tomorrow night ((if I have neither, I apologize)).

Worst case scenario I am

V/LA till Monday night Moderator

[Blackberry]

A) I had no idea the wiki said thing, it was something I thought of myself that scum are probably more likely to use it to confuse town

B) Budja was not asking someone about WIFOM. He was saying to someone that, regarding me, "speculating on whether it is personality" is WIFOM. Like I said, using it in that context suggests he is trying to put doubt that it is a personaltiy thing. Which is something I would consider scum to do.

C) All votes are used for the purpose of examining the reaction of the person you are voting, even if it is a secondary motive. So I consider all my vote reaction votes. Also, you completely undermine my calling those specific votes reaction votes by saying "it's not a reaction vote because you didn't say so" and then saying "it's not a reaction vote because you stated it was and thus defeated the purpose." And for the record, my opinion is stating you are doing something (such as telling someone you are strongly looking at how they react to something) only invokes intimidation into those that are scum and invokes more honesty from those that are town and is not at all a bad thing.

D) I already explained why I unvoted Anon - I found Raivaan more attractive.

** Now I'll reread about Anon to tell you why I thought he was a good vote.

[Blackberry]

About Anon:

To be honest, I just remember thinking Anon was someone looking scummy. If you look back at my posts - you can clearly see he is probably one of the top people I question and address before my vote.

[Blackberry]

B) Budja already counterclaimed your assertion, so I don't need to.

Budja's statement proves me more correct over you.

C) Telling someone you are looking for reactions undermines the reaction you are trying to get. Scum could easily work around and figure out what kind of reaction you might consider scummy just by knowing that it is reaction fishing.

Disagree. It only put more pressure on scum to try harder. What I look for is faking - so that is something rather difficult to "figure out."

And if Raivaan comes in with a claim that is believable/confirmable then we have a secondary wagon already put together. In fact, Raivaan, why did you not claim? You are L-1.

xvart.

This says three things:

A) xvart hasn't read Raivaan's posts at all to try to get a read on him. Why wouldn't he be looking at the person that's getting the most votes? Unless you are his partner.
B) This suggests you aren't reading MY posts either, as I have mentioned in one of my posts that Raivaan has claimed Vanilla Townie. If you're suspscious of someone, I'd think you would read all their posts and not just the ones you can use to make a case agains't.
C) Once again, this looks like giving directions and hoping Raivaan will claim a PR to get pressure off his back. If Raivaan comes up scum: huge scum points for xvart.

------

Also, Fishy and mitsu - why are you trying to lynch someone at the last minute over someone that has claimed VT and who isn't even legitamitly scumhunting (Raivaan has only made short posts attacking whoever has posted recently)? Also, Fishy, why do you not think Raivaan is scum anymore?

[Blackberry]

Wow, so reading last night. I came to the conclusion of a Fishy-Flameaxe-StrangerCoug team.

Mostly because of Fishy's behavior striked me as scum. And reading through their posts, Stranger and Fishy don't comment much about the other two. And Flameaxe straight out voted those two at the very beginning as random votes (not really much to go off of, just could be a good distancing technique).

But now with two killing teams, I am no longer sure at all.

This is important to me: Is the Arsonist person most likely to be a loner type of role? And the shot most likely to be the mafia?

Is it possible the arsonists ARE the mafia, and the shot is a vigilante or serial killer or something?

-----

Rereading the story (I didn't actually read it thoughrouly as I am hung over right now, lol).

Does it sound like a Paranoid Gun Owner shot Jack? Pretend Jack wasn't a Vanilla Townie, if it had come up that he had a power role that he could target someone, would you think it was a Paranoid Gun Owner?

[Blackberry]

vote Jack

Did you get a guilty on Jack or something? lol

[Blackberry]

Arsonist = SK. Firefighter blocks Arsonist.
I find it suss that BB posts the correct role-name but not the correct role-info.

I am used to playing Mafia with a group of people in person. The one time we did use an arsonist we had two arsonists working together like a mafia.

There are quite a few things I wish to say, but I am going to be smart for once (LOL) and wait for more people to post their thoughts and opinions.

[Blackberry]

@BB, did you have firefighter/s in that game.

Yes, that is why I drew the conclusion there was an arsonist of sorts (although the burn does hint at it, a firefighter role solidifies it).

[Blackberry]

mallow, I really want you to post.

I would also like those that haven't posted yet to post, however, after rethinking and rereading some things, I no longer have the same thoughts and reasons to ask this. But it would be helpful.

[Blackberry]

I am not sure what to make of Fishy attacking Stranger. This throws me off a bit.

Also - would an arsonist have some sort of Immunity from kills?

[Blackberry]

vote Jack

^Me not paying attention

I do not comprehend why you wouldn't look to see who died. Your reason for voting Jack is because you weren't paying attention? Who doesn't pay attention to who is dead?

I want you to explain why you were not paying attention.

[Blackberry]

I promise you that my vote on Jack was a big mistake. I didn't read the scene close enough and I thought

Flameaxe

was killed when I first read it.

WOW, WOW, WOW, WOW.

MALLWOGENO IS

MAFIA

(NOT ARSONIST). IF I AM WRONG YOU CAN KILL ME TOMORROW. MALLOWGENO JUST CONFESSED TO BEING MAFIA.

TRUST ME

.

VOTE: MALLOWGENO

[Blackberry]

Trust Me. Is all I need to say. Although, it probably would have been better if I stayed low and tried to get him lynched subtley. I got over-excited.

[Blackberry]

Gimmee a little while. I'm still rereading over the week I missed.

I reread over the thread during the night phase.

Blantant contradiction. I am now full-thruttle tunneling on mallow because I know he is mafia.

[Blackberry]

My thoughts:

Confucius is also scum.

~ Not certain, but my next top pick after Mallow.

Also - would an arsonist have some sort of Immunity from kills?

I asked this for one purpose: to get scum to think that the arsonist has night-kill immunity and that their target last night was the arsonist. I was waiting to see if anyone would have voted the person that mafia tried to kill last night that didn't die. If Mafia believed that the person they targetted last night could be the arsonist/have night-kill immunity, their only hope of killing them was to get him lynched during the day.

Mafia and me both know their target last night didn't die

. Confuscious/FISHY (who already struck me as odd) then votes Flameaxe.

Has Fishy fallen into my trap? Only time will tell.

------

Flameaxe isn't

mafia

~ 100%.

StrangerCoug isn't

mafia

for already being on Mallow.

HOWEVER, to be honest (I was going to save this till later because I want mafia out first, although at this point, I have no idea if I'll survive tonight, so I may as well let the people know):

Flameaxe strikes me as a strong possibility as the Arsonist.

If he was the arsonist, he WOULD be genuinely looking for the mafia as he has been doing. The first thing that struck me as

off

was him not voting mallow, yet he had been suspcious of mallow before my post. The only reason I could see him not voting mallow is if he didn't want to be on mafia's bad side, in other words, he didn't want Mafia to target him. Also, last night, I was trying to map out who I think Flameaxe would kill if he were mafia. I narrowed it down to Jack or Mitsu (I don't really have good reasoning for this, just what I had expected after skimming through things and who Flame would kill).

A) Mitsu was burned by the arsonist.
B) Someone else commented that an exp. player would do that.
C) Flameaxe has made an accusation on mallow as being the arsonist and having motive to kill Mitsu. I believe Flameaxe is the type of intelligent person, who, if he would accuse someone because of this.

------

Mafia - you are more than welcome to kill Flameaxe tonight. If he had night-kill immunity he wouldn't be trying so hard to get on your good side. I'm not helping him again because I'd rather him be dead and the knowledge of whether he is or isn't the arsonist out of the way. I have NO idea if I'm right about him being arsonist. He could just be a town-player. Either way, he is a threat to you because he is the only person who is 100% cleared of being mafia (This is confirmed by me/will be confirmed by me 100% if I die).

If I am correct about Fishy/Conscious... I am not sure who the other mafia is, other than it isn't Flameaxe nor StrangerCoug. Anyone could be it. If there's a cop out there, I'd use it an investigation Fishy/Conscious. Don't waste an investigation on Flameaxe. If and when I die, it will be 100% clear that he wasn't

mafia

.

I predict I'll probably die and/or possibly be roleblocked tonight. Meaning I'll have no control over what happens. Best case scenario: me dying/being roleblocked will allow a Cop and/or Doctor to make their moves.

Happy hunting killers.

[Blackberry]

Scum (particularly Mafia) probably know exactly what is happening right now in the Blackberry-mallowgeno relationship. The rest of us do not. If you are not claiming information, be clear. I feel that at least one person voting with you is voting because they believe you have information (or are willing to use this as an excuse for their vote).

Actually, Mafia could have thought that maybe I had tracked mallow and knew he targetted Flameaxe, and thus he admitting he thought Flameaxe was dead would be a scumslip.

I have not revealed my hand until now. Although, if you read some of my questions, especially the ones xvart questioned and pointed out (I fought myself really hard on what to say and what to ignore, I probably typed up two messages, that I ended up deleting and not pressing submit because I knew it'd be smarter to wait and see what happens with people, like to see if anyone would attack Flameaxe after my suggestion of him having night-kill immunity, or if maybe scum would have suggested the possibility I tracked mallow and would have taken that as how I knew instead of being on to my real game), you could put two and two together and realize what I am and why I asked lots of the questions I asked.

Mallow calling me innocent, but keeping his vote on me

, sounds like he is giving up. If I made the mistake I'm confident that he did, I would consider giving up as well and am not surprised that that's what it appears Mallow is doing.

[Blackberry]

Flameaxe: At this point, I don't know if you are or aren't the arsonist. Just an idea that formulated in my head that didn't have any issues and made sense to me. I DO know you aren't the mafia, and my personal preference is to get rid of Mafia since I know that you aren't one, and they'll probably be easier to find, and because if I go for people that I think are mafia, there's always the chance they will luckily turn up as the arsonist instead. ^_^

[Blackberry]

Flameaxe I can 100% confirm isn't

Mafia

.

I don't think Coug is mafia because he was on mallowgeno before he slipped. Not 100%, but a good bet.

--- ---

I don't see a problem with secrecy at this point. If I die at night, you can just look at my role and deduce what happened. If I am alive tomorrow, I can (and probably will) explain then. We only need one more vote to verify if I am right or not. Plus, I'd rather people do less talking and more voting. The quicker we end the day, the less info mafia has to make their decisions tonight.

[Blackberry]

I think smart people *may* know who I am.

As I've said before:

I'd rather people do less talking and more voting. The quicker we end the day, the less info mafia has to make their decisions tonight.

If you have information you think clears mallow or something along those lines, I would post it. If you are a role and do have info that you think could be helpful in a certain way, you *MAY* indeed actually say something that you, unknowingly, could point to another mafia if you are not mafia.

I think you are mafia. But if you're not, it may do you good to post your info now before the night so we can make sense of it while both of us are still alive.

[Blackberry]

So I have this long post that I've written out (where I claim and give out all my details), and now it is copyed in case I change my mind and want to post it. I keep battling whether it is better to keep it a secret from the off-chance mafia is still confused about my knowledge (although I suspect Flameaxe may have an idea).

Point-blank, with my knowledge: There is

no

reason at this point to assume Flameaxe has night-kill Immunity.

As I said earlier, mafia have free reign to kill him tonight if they wish. I suspect if he is arsonist he will be gunning for mafia anyways.

Also, your claim has made things more difficult for me. Although I am still not sure whether to believe it. I was hoping you would claim tracker or watcher on something relevant. Your claim does change my actions of what I'm going to do tonight and my intentions (which is defintely a good thing).

CONFUCIUS: If mallow comes up ROLEBLOCKER, save ME and I guarantee (Not 100%, but very close) you, me and you will both be alive tomorrow. This is another

Trust Me

.

[Blackberry]

Confucius: I "saved" Flameaxe, and, furthermore, I KNOW he was the mafia's target. Although I think Flameaxe is a good candidate for Arsonist, I have no guarantee that he is indeed the Arsonist. Mallow has made a slip that only a mafia would have made.

Flameaxe: You're a smart person and should have a decent idea of what I am, and yet you still haven't voted mallow. This still pings me as you are the Arsonist without night-kill immunity, who wants to get on the mafia's good side so that they don't kill you. There is no logical reason for you not to have voted mallow at this point.

Also: If there are three mafia, and we don't kill one today (aka if we killed Flameaxe- A GUARANTEED NON-MAFIA). Then we *COULD* wake up tomorrow at Lynch or Lose for the rest of the game.

[Blackberry]

Flameaxe, if you think you have an idea, and read all my posts from this day, and your idea makes sense. You're right.

[Blackberry]

I forgot to add: and vote mallow. Why haven't you done so by now?

[Blackberry]

Finally. Although at this point I'm pretty sure Mafia might know what I am too. Unless both mafia have no idea *Cross fingers?*.

[Blackberry]

Actually, rethinking. If you were a Doctor would you *REALLY* claim just based off of that information? [[I have an idea what your answer might be if you were being sincere, but I want to see you say it yourself since you're on now]]

Also: At this point in time, it doesn't benefit any town people to know what I am when they're already voting. All my information is on the table. If I die and my role is revealed, the logical deductions can be made. Right now it wouldn only benefit scum if they knew my role.

[Blackberry]

Also, Confuc: Just so you know, and since I'm saying it now it really doesn't mean anything, but I just thought I'd let you know. I did consider unvoting Mallow because I wanted to hear your info. But once you claimed, there was nothing else I needed to hear concerning your role info and I knew Mallow was still the correct lynch. As I've iterated before, my point is wanted a lynch now is because the less info mafia have, the better.

[Blackberry]

Booooo, I wish you were on so you could answer the question of why you claimed Doctor when under no pressure.

Also, your quote of thinking you have a "couple of ideas" of what I am: doesn't seem right to me.

Also, if you had read about StrangerCoug, you would have known he was on mallow BEFORE mallow made his slip.

[Blackberry]

You did not give me the reasoning I was expecting for you to have claimed Doctor. You didn't even give a reason, you just complained that you claimed and I didn't. I thought of ONE legitimate reason for you to have claimed when you did, but you are not saying that is the reason you claimed. This makes me think you are not a real doctor.

Me not claiming has nothing to do with pride, it has to do with strategy.

[Blackberry]

Does everyone agree that I start first? If we do this, I say we do popcorn, where whoever claims chooses the next person.

Anon - SCUM
Blackberry - TOWN
Budja - UNKNOWN
Confucius Fishythefish - TOWN
Flameaxe - ARSONIST
StrangerCoug - SCUM
xvart - UNKNOWN

...

This was my initial thought after the results of last night. Reading back just now, I noticed: XVART, ANON and BUDJA never vote or FOS one another. STRANGER does a FOS to Budja, but that is all. I am confident all of the scum are within those four.

I believe Confucius' claim. I don't know if Anon was the target for mafia, if mafia decided to no-kill out of fear of my role, I think they may have tried to kill Flameaxe and he could have NK immunity.

Anon was actually my top suspect for mafia after yesterday... so if he was the mafia's target, it'd be kind of odd to me.

[Blackberry]

I am a BUS-DRIVER.

I switched FLAMEAXE with JACK Night 1.

Mallow slipping that Flameaxe was the target screamed scum. Not only that, but he voted Jack. If you are mafia, and you look at day, you could see someone was shot and skip it because you assume it's your kill (MALLOW SAID HE THOUGHT IT SAID FLAMEAXE) and he skips down to the person and sees there is an arsonist because someone is burned.

Also, my first two times I misread Jack's death and thought Jack had gone onto someone else's property and the property owner show him (PGO). Knowing Jack was switched, I figured it concievable the person I switched him with had a role that visited a PGO. However, after reading it a third time, I realize it was someone on Jack's property.

Also, this is why I asked if Mallow got a guilty on Jack, and why I repeatedly said I wanted to hear from Mallow. I thought mallow may have been a cop, got a guilty, didn't even bother reading the deaths because he knew he got a guilty, and voted Jack right away. However, I knew if he did get a guilty that this would actually implicate FLAMEAXE as scum (this is when I was thinking the PGO still).

That is why I am saying FLAMEAXE isn't

mafia

, because he was their target of Mafia's kill Night 1.

I believe Confuc's claim as Doctor.

I think all of the mafia are within: Xvart, Stranger, Budja, Anon.

XVART

: I find it concievable Anon was saved, but at this point, if he was, that in my mind leaves Budja, you, and Stranger as the scum. And something that caught me as odd was that Anon said he believed me, yet didn't vote with me. Although, I could see the possibility of two scum: Budja and Stranger.

Neither of them have done anything town-worthy.

CONFUCIUS

: Mafia didn't try to kill you last night, thus, they were hunting for the Arsonist. And in all possibilities, the arsonist could have night-kill immunity. Meaning it wasn't necessairly Anon that was saved.

If I had to choose who to claim next, I'd say Stranger or Budja. I'll let yall discuss.

[Blackberry]

Anon was actually my top suspect for mafia after yesterday... so if he was the mafia's target, it'd be kind of odd to me.

Really? He was even more of a suspect than your 100% scum read on Mallow (who flipped town)?

Also, I said AFTER YESTERDAY. Aka, after mallow's role was revealed.

[Blackberry]

I thought I wrote this.

I did not use my ability last night. I figured with the possibility of two deaths, and having six alive in the morning, and that there are possibly 3 mafia: That Mafia would target arsonist in hopes of an auto win and that arsonist would target mafia. I also did not want to be responsible for f*cking everything up if I switched someone (example: let's say I switched you and budja in an attempt to save u, but in fact the arsonist tried to kill budja). Aka, I didn't want to be responsible for the town loss. I also didn't think I would be in danger (as I looked like I would appear scum) and I also didn't think you would be in danger because Arsonist wouldn't want to kill you and if Mafia killed you, that guarantees the arsonist is still in.

[Blackberry]

Certainly not a "basic" role for a "basic" game.

Now claim your Night Two action.

It's not like its a theme game or something.

/in to mod, this is a basic game, it will have roles that might not necessarily fit into a mini normal but will not be too out there (ie. you have heard of the roles before), it'll be swingy but will be as balanced as I can make it. There will be flavour but it won't be specific. (ie. no theme - like Lost or Batman) and there will be no weird mechanics and the ruleset will be pretty much standard.

Requirements are that you have 1 completed game and that you have a good replacement record, (as in you havent been replaced for no reason recently)

Flameaxe, ever since I've called you out as being the arsonist, you've really done nothing for the game. Also, I think this post only supports Confucius' misconception that we are scum together. I think you

WANT

me to get lynched up today. Where are YOUR thoughts and opinions on ANYTHING?

[Blackberry]

You don't think Llama was a high scum suspect? And that arsonist would want to kill scum?

[Blackberry]

I have been doing some background research on Porochaz since Blackberry’s claim. It looks as if Bus Driver is actually a role Porochaz may be prone to implementing, even in a claimed “basic” theme. In the “Explicitly Normal / non-Normal Roles” discussion in Mafia Discussion, Porochaz posted:

I would pretty much say any normal game I run has a chance to have a bus driver in it, unless I state specifically that it doesn't, I think the role is normal...

however I dont really know why we constantly need to define things... a general normal modding do's and don't's would suffice.

More evidence that Confucius is not scum.

Also, Flameaxe, as I said, if Mafia killed arsonist and arsonist killed a townie, mafia would have an auto-win (this is assuming there is 3 mafia, although someone at one point suggested there was only 2- although in games with 12 players were there is a SK, isn't there still typically 3 scum? - I may be mistaken, just what I recall - the only instances I remember seeing a 2man team in a 12 player game is when there are two opposing mafias, with 2 scum each).

[Blackberry]

At this moment:

Xvart looks the most scum. Between him and Budja, Budja has atleast had more town tells. Xvart's questions and pestering sounds like scum to me trying to find something to attack.

I actually believe Stranger's claim, especially with Flameaxe confirming it (unless they are both faking it, which I find hard to believe, and like it was said, he crumbed, so I believe it).

One thing that does strike me: Why would Flameaxe arsonist have a BEER? I can see an arsonist using alcohol to start a fire, but a beer? No.

Random thought (because I am having a hard time figuring out who is who, aka, I believe Confucius and Stranger, why would Flameaxe arsonist have a beer?... there is still the possibility that Anon-Budja-Xvart are ALL mafia though...) Anyways, my random thought was this: One night-kill immune Arsonist and One night-kill immune Serial Killer. But then I realize Confuc says his role protects from mafia...

Confuc - just for confirmation, does it say you protect from MAFIA? Or what specifically do you protect from? (I am reading myself type this and I realize it would be rather silly to have a doctor that just protects from a SK and there be no mafia, lol)

Stranger - he had a BEER or alcohol? (I know you said beer, so you probably mean beer, but I'd figure I'd ask anyway... the image in my mind is an arsonist with an alcohol/vodka bottle with that little cloth thing in it and they throw it into a building to start a fire... so an alcohol bottle, makes sense, but a beer bottle, doesn't make sense).

Also: Budja/Xvart/Anon -- two could be mafia, one could be arsonist is another possibility.

[Blackberry]

Budja - What is your flavor? *lick*

You don't taste Vanilla to me.

Xvart - You "like computer games"? Your background says "I like video games." Could you be more specific?

Anon - Claim please? With flavor. After Budja.

[Blackberry]

I'm really tired. Just got done moving into my new apartment. I literally only read the past two/three posts. Poisoner: The purpose of the poisoner is that their kill takes effect at a later date. In other words: someone could have poisoned Flameaxe last nigth, and he dies Mid-day today. If you've noticed, it says Day three AND A HALF. If it was a day-kill, it wouldn't say AND A HALF. That specific phrase suggests it is part of a role. Also, reading Poisoner, as I believe I've mentioned, it states that if the mafia Poisoner performs the kill, the poison is used/the target dies at a later date. Explaining why no one died last night at the hands of the mafia.

Also, I don't think a real Arsonist would Counterclaim at this point. Also, I don't see a problem in killing a claimed arsonist either:
* If we kill arsonist, there's one mafia kill tonight. Confic will protect either me or Stranger (I assume). I will therefore either bus either me or Confuc with one of the remaining scum. Mathematically, we have a 66% chance of protecting correctly. Thus, next day occurs and we outnumber scum 3 to 2.
* If we kill scum claiming arsonist, it doesn't hurt us. One down, two to go. We still protect the same people, good chance all or atleast 2 survive till tomorrow.
* Also, Doctor can only protect from mafia kills, whereas Arsonist can still kill those people. Just saying.

Xvart is who I want to lynch.

Also, we could consider No Lynch. If we did this and went to night and Arsonist kills a townie, it's a guaranteed loss for the arsonist, because

if we wake up with 2 mafia, 1 arsonist, and 2 townies

, no one has any idea who the REAL arsonsit is, except the arsonist, and we may mistakenly lynch him. The arsonist has no choice but to kill a mafia in this scenario. But I think No Lynch is probably bad, Xvart = good kill. =D

Night!

[Blackberry]

Xvart, the title got changed to Day Three and a Half. And if you look up the role of Poisoner, it is a mafia role that takes affect at a later time.

-----

If anyone looks at Xvart's posts, all he does is ask non-relevant questions. He also tries to use the info he gets to turn it around on the person. This is why I want to lynch him ^_^.

Does your flavor indicate something about a poison syringe? The fact that you were accused of medical malpractice makes me wonder if something strange is going on here.

My secret is that I don't like living in the village anymore, I've lived here for a decently long time and the place has changed too much. But I can't leave because I am too old. I want to spend as much time away from the village, so I got the job of a bus driver and I drive people between the highlands (?) and city.

Also, my husband appears not to be in the setup.

----

Also, there is nothing in my

storyline

that would suggest what a thief would steal from me. Thus, leaving me to believe that someone would get something based off of my role. I don't know why I thought it was relevant, just throwing it out there.

----

Actually, Budja, what is your character's name?

Vote: Xvart

----

Just throwing this out there. I have considered claiming SK as scum I believe. But since no one is CCing, Anon and Xvart are pretty much scum-confirmed, as Confucius and Stranger have cleared themselves in my opinion.

[Blackberry]

Unvote

- Although I do want to kill Xvart. I want to rethink things through when I have time to to read through everything.

Stranger - I also suggested killing Arsonist. Thoughts?
(Reason being: mafia can only kill one, I can bus, and Confuc can save... 2/3 chance we protect correctly XD)

[Blackberry]

^ You two cannot coordinate. I'd make it just over a 50/50 chance.

I know what the real chances were, I just wanted to intimidate. >=( Why are you helping Mafia?

[Blackberry]

Anon- MAFIA
Budja- TOWN
Fishythefish- TOWN
Flameaxe- TOWN
Jack- TOWN
llamaeatataco- TOWN
mallowgeno- TOWN
Mitsuru Kirijo- MAFIA
Raivann- TOWN
StrangerCoug- TOWN
xvart- MAFIA

-- This was my drunk intuitive read. Don't know where it's going. After briefly skimming, just looking at the usernames and posts I SEE either town (faded) or MAFIA (bold). I'll re-examine it when I am sober.

If there's only two mafia, instead of three, then this isn't bad if I was accurate!

I did a drunk read in my other game, and one of the people I listed as Mafia came up as Mafia (then again, I listed 4 people as Mafia in that drunk read and I don't know why, lol).

Vote: Xvart

again.

[Blackberry]

Nice try scumbag.

~ Sounds like something mafia would say. It doesn't seem sincere. Although I don't think I have to convince anyone, lol.

[Blackberry]

Why are you saying you No-Lynch tomorrow? Two people could wind up dead and it be mafia-arsonist-town left.

If a town has to choose between Budja and mafia, kill Budja please. XD

[Blackberry]

Confuciusssss, why didn't you save Stranger? =(

Vote: Confucius

[Blackberry]

Blackberry - Was leaning town until this whole "easy target" business. Moved a bit back up my list at the moment.

I said Flameaxe's read was perfect because... that thing was a half-truth/half-lie (I reread and realized it was what I did in my other game, not this one), it is my typical strategy, but I was mixing my other game I was in with this one in which they both had the same outcome of people going after me for a silly reason.