Cereal Killers - Mini 1027 (Game Over)

[charter]

They're after me Lucky Charms!

[charter]

You had better not be fucking serious.

In case you aren't, I will

vote XScorpion

because he is very much obvscum. I had this theory where the scum were Snap, Crackle, and Pop, but looks like that's wrong.

[charter]

Wait, I just noticed Robocopter voted for himself. We should lynch him to punish this behavior, OR MAYBE DAYKILL HIM HAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHA.

[charter]

SSBF, xvart, Xscorpion, hiphop, Kirbyoshi, and Sawyer. Why did none of you comment on how Robocopter voted himself?

Robocopter, why shouldn't we lynch you right now?

[charter]

Guys, I am 99% sure that XScorpion is scum. I've already identified three townies. The rest of you are making this very difficult to figure out who his buddies are (except Sawyer, who is making it very easy to see he is scum).

Actually, it's probably SSBF with his whole "There is definently an overreaction to Kirbyoshi's fake daykill attempt. I knew this wasn't serious, so I saw no point in making a negative reaction to it." speech.

XScorpion, Sawyer, and SSBF, what is your opinion of the other two?

[charter]

MOD, can we get a list of players not voting in the votecounts as well, please?

[charter]

Sawyer is a little hasty to call Kirby town, but I like him otherwise.
SSBF is behaving consistently with his town meta, but I don't know his scum meta.
So...why are you 99% sure I'm scum? Also why aren't you voting Robo?

Your whole "vote Robo and see what happens idea" is inherently scummy in nature, and as such, I believe (quite strongly by this point) that you are scum. Scum "wait and see what happens" whereas townies "make stuff happen". Plus, your timing of it was bad, how you posted some, then did some RVSing. Then, the degree that you're pushing the idea (of which nobody seems to have much interest in following) I find pretty bad.

What about Sawyer do you like? His active lurking, his deflecting questions, his poor voting, or something else?
How is SSBF behaving consistent with his town meta? You didn't really give an opinion on him, I would still like one.

I'm not voting Robo because I don't think he's scum.

[charter]

You can add rolefishing to reasons I think you're scum as well.

[charter]

About Sawyer: What questions is he deflecting?

Why did none of you comment on how Robocopter voted himself?

Better question: Why would I?

How is he lurking any more than say, Zang?

I said he was active lurking, not lurking. And it's not a contest. Just because someone else might be doing something, doesn't mean that Sawyer isn't.

Why is his vote bad?

I have no idea why he's voting Xvart. Do you?

So, back to my original question (of which you didn't answer, but instead tried to spin my questions back on me), why do you like Sawyer?

Also charter: Any particular reason you think Robocopter is town?

I didn't say I think he's town. I said I don't think he's scum. I don't have much of a read on him one way or the other.

After SSBF and Sawyer's latest posts, I'm feeling better about them. XScorpion, on the other hand, is digging his grave with a bulldozer.

[charter]

I missed this before, Spyrex, what did you mean here?

Given a smalltown setup and there's really actual role to scum speculation going on? Seriously?

Jenniwren is shaping up nicely for the slot of lurkerscum, we'll have to see how that pans out as time goes by. Actually, now that I actually read her post 53, I believe we've got another scum hooked.

Jenniwren, if you had to vote someone right now, who would you vote and why? What do you think of XScorpion?


I'm not sure who else is scum at the moment.

Charter: what was it in SSBF's and Sawyer's last posts that makes you feel better about them? You don't give any indication of feeling better about Sawyer anywhere except your next to last statement, and I'm curious about the turnaround.

I got the sense that they were interested in answering my questions in a direct manor. I put myself in their shoes and answered the question, and I came up with something similar to what they said.

[charter]

Robo, why are you entertaining this nonsense?

[charter]

Spyrex and Robo, who do you think are XScorpion's buddies?

[charter]

Seriously? You have already identified three townies? Wow you are good. How certain are you with these reads on page three? What's the margin of error? Also, I guess we should all apologize for interrupting your scum relationship hunting. It's a little too early to be building scum teams, don't you think?

Am I certain? Of course not, but I have to start somewhere. Am I expecting everyone else to think the same as me? No. I didn't even say who I had the reads on. It's never too early to hunt for scumteams. If you're going to try and discredit my arguments by saying I'm scum because I'm looking for scumteams so soon, you're going to have to do a whole heck of a lot better job.

If he's not scum, like you said, then what could he be?

I said I didn't think he's scum (I don't have a scum read on him) and I said I don't think he's town (I don't have a town read on him). He is one or the other, but I don't have a clue as to what he is right now.

Xvart, what's your opinion of XScorpion?
XScorpion, who's your top pick for scum (right this minute)?

[charter]

Xvart, do you see a difference in how XScorpion responded to me calling him scum versus how Sawyer or SSBF responded?

[charter]

@hiphop, my bad, didn't realize you did say something about it. I just lumped you in with everyone else.

Hiphop goes on the town list with stuff like "really do not like how there was so much arguing about kirby's day-kill"

You might have to be more specific in which responses to which you are referring. I don't even see where Sawyer responded directly to you calling him scum. But SSBF's and XScorp's responses are as follows:

It's not their direct response, but the manner in which they gave it. XScorpion's post tried to spin the questions back as an attack on me. Sawyer and SSBF just answered the questions, and didn't try and turn it into an attack.

What was the purpose of this question?

I wanted to know why they didn't comment on his self vote. I didn't follow up on it because there was nothing to follow up on. People gave their responses and they were all satisfactory. I think something did come out of it, Sawyer's deflecting.

I would like to point out that you never really explain what you think is scummy about my post. Care to share?

I thought this comment of you was extremely scummy.

Charter did something similar--calling for a lynch--in reaction to Robo's self-vote (post #38), and that action has not garnered quite so much discussion as Xvart's threat to vote.

Where you are trying to tell someone (I'm not sure who, but it doesn't matter, it kind of sounds like everyone) that I did something scummy too, but no one is paying much attention to it. First off, I don't think the situations are similar at all, and second, the way you try and soil my good name all slyly like that, quite scummy.

The rest of Jenniwren's "case" on me is just little potshots that don't show why I am scum at all (bonus points if you can guess why). Her case on Spyrex is about 10 times worse. The case on Kirby is practically nonexistent.

But Jenni does bring up some nice points on Charter and Spyre

What points are these?

I didn't read the last wallotext there.

I'm actually more sure of Jenniwren at this point, but I really can't imagine XScorpion and Jenniwren not being scum together.

[charter]

You never answered the question I asked: Why would I comment on Robo's self vote?

You could for any number of reasons. It wasn't random. It wasn't smart. Anything. It was an innocuous question, which just about any actual answer would have been fine, but you didn't answer, you had to question back.

[charter]

Um, how did Robo edit his post there?

[charter]

Um, how did Robo edit his post there?

I fixed the one color tag, I swear thats all I did. If the Mod feels it is Modkill worthy due to me fixing a Color tag, thats his decision. Sorry.

That's nice, but how did you do it? Something like this needs to be fixed so we don't have people running around editing their posts in games.

If I'm perfectly honest, I wish this day was over right now with a XScorpion lynch, because this massive swamp him and Robo are making is giving me a headache. (and when he flips scum we can lynch Jenniwren).

[charter]

I don't think you should be modkilled, since looking at your post, I don't see where you have changed any slip up or anything important. I'm more concerned that people could do this in other games. I have much more to say about this, but not until the game is over.

[charter]

I'm actually more sure of Jenniwren at this point, but I really can't imagine XScorpion and Jenniwren not being scum together.

Do you have any evidence supporting that those two have links to each other?

Other than them both independently being extremely scummy, there is their near total ignoring (to the point where it's suspicious how neither one of them wants to mention the other) of each other and Jenniwren's giant chainsaw defense of XScorpion.

[charter]

Is this a correct observation?

Yes

But it is quite a stretch to say that he is spinning the questions back on you in an attempt to attack you.

I don't think it's a stretch. It's the fact that he had the mentality of doing it, not the extent to which he did, that I find scummy.

So, in this game, who is lurking, who is active lurking? Which is worse?

Lurkers: Confid, Zang
Active Lurkers: XScorp

Active lurking is worse.

Why was it relevant? What did you expect to get?

You're really making a mountain out of a molehill here. It was something to discuss. Did I expect to catch scum with that question? No, but you never know when someone is going to go off the deep end on a basic question.

What would have been an unsatisfactory answer?

Sawyer's lack of an answer.

[charter]

This cloud of noise that is Robo v XScorp in the eye bleed fest 2000 needs to go. With a XS lynch.

You have this way with words I can only dream about...

@Charter: As hard as it may be for you, try to imagine the following scenario: I'm town, and dead because you got me lynched day 1. SSBF is nightkilled. Who is scum in this case?

Still Jenniwren. But we all know you aren't town.

[charter]

Spyrex is so obviously town, every time you try and call him scum I just get 100% more sure you are scum.

The giant backpedal with your Spyrex and Kirby (and a little bit of Charter) scum reads is pretty scummy.

I'm debating trying to lynch Jenniwren over XScorpion. Spyrex and Hiphop, what do you think about a Jenniwren lynch?

[charter]

Because it would be a crime to remove support from an XScorpion lynch unless it would result in a Jenniwren lynch.

[charter]

Pretty much

[charter]

Looks like hiphop dies day three.

[charter]

If I had a vote on XScorp I would unvote, lets NOT lynch him today please.

Good thing you have no say in who we lynch today.

[charter]

You and Jenniwren can form the "bad cases with no possibility of leading to a lynch on Charter club". Unfortunately, it's not going to be a popular club.

There's no need for all this explaining you keep clamoring for. You see how Five people are voting for XScorpion? You think I'm scum because I didn't concoct some elaborate case on him. The real explanation is there is no need to because the other townies see the same thing I do. It's the same reason I don't need to elaborate on why Spyrex is town. Scum hate when townies identify each other, and you know what they do? They try to undermine it so that the idea doesn't catch on. I'm sure anyone who has played with Spyrex before sees he's town, whether or not they're as vocal about it as me, they are thinking it in their noggin.



(and yeah, I meant Xvart in post 195, pretty obvious I didn't mean Hiphop)

[charter]

I'm not sold on Sawyer, to be honest. Before I was thinking Xvart was probably town, with how ridiculously obvious his defense of XScorpScum was, but I can't write it off like that any more. I agree that Sawyer isn't going to actually get much town cred when XScorp flips scum.

Anyhow, on to more important things, like this deadline in four days. It would be a total catastrophe to not lynch today. While Zang is paying the rest of MS attention and ignoring us, we can't sit here and wait for three more days for him to make a post, then scurry around questioning him. It would be great if he or Confid decide to start posting here, but you can't delay progressing the game on the account of them.

So, hiphop, are you willing to vote XScorp? Confid/Zang, are either of you willing to vote XScorp? Two of the three of you need to commit before deadline, either to voting XScorp or definitively stating you won't vote XScorp, even if that means a no-lynch. It's getting time to run him up to a claim, since I'm sure he's got something that's going to cause people to unvote, so we need to do this with plenty of time left in the day in order to run up Jenniwren.

Elaborate. You two are buddying so much that even scum will need a crowbar to break you 2 apart. Something that strong has a reason that isn't gut. Show me.

Also third game with Spyrex(one I was scum and the other he was) and am leaning scum, unless you have evidence I believe the way he has posted it only looks like the leaning will continue. So show me why he is town.

His suspicions and thoughts mesh with mine pretty much exactly. So I know I'm town, so someone who's thinking the same thing as me looks awful town as well. The last time I was town where Spyrex was scum, he was much different and it was pretty easy to pick up on.

Really? When you say hiphop dies day 3, I don't think it is obvious that you intend to push for an xvart lynch day 3. And why are you setting up lynches? You don't even know how the first will flip. Now you gave an awfully strong towntell, but setting up lynches? That is setting up to lose, unless of course your scum.

No, it wasn't obvious I meant Xvart, just that I didn't mean you (since I called you town in a recent post). I wish people would learn what "setting up lynches" is, and the reason it's scummy. First off, lining up scum lynches, which is what I'm doing, isn't scummy. I'm simply saying lynch Jenniwren after XScorpion flips scum, and lynch XVart after Jenniwren flips scum. The scummy kind of setting up lynches is saying something like this "lynch person X if person Y flips town". How is my saying 'lynch Jenniwren after XScorpion flips scum, and lynch XVart after Jenniwren flips scum' of any benefit to me as scum? Where does this get me if I'm scum and XScorpion isn't scum?

[charter]

Oh, I see Zang has joined us. Zang, are you willing to vote XScorp?

[charter]

@charter: Why did you originally suspect hiphop?

I didn't, I meant Xvart, not hiphop.

[charter]

You're voting me because you think I'm a SK? And there is what evidence of a SK being in this game? That has to be the most obvious bullshit reason for voting someone I've ever seen. You can do better than that.

[charter]

How much you want to bet Spyrex that no one questions XScorp for voting with no reason?

I believe this fuck up rests squarely on hiphop.

[charter]

3 days to deadline, and we're EVEN CLOSER to a no lynch.

The scums are sitting back and hoping that happens, but of course, trying to get a lynch is probably a scumtell in this game

Hiphop, you are enabling them to do this.

[charter]

How and why can his claim look legit? Why should this save him from a lynch? Why does this erase his obvscumness? I don't think this should save him from the noose.

[charter]

I'm not claiming, either.

[charter]

Claiming isn't the "townie" thing to do. Are you daft? How many times have you seen scum not claim when threatened with a lynch? You all are probably going to let him live, kill a townie (probably one of the few that has some damn sense) and then "confirm" him and lose. Scum are always eager to claim, whether it's necessary or not, since they know that most people will lap up their bs like a cat with milk or "scared to lynch a power role". Maybe I have a reason for not claiming. I'll give you a hint, ITS NOT BECAUSE I CANT THINK OF SOMETHING TO CLAIM.

I'm probably done, you all are gonna screw this up and this was gonna be a real easy game to win. If any of you actually look at the ridiculously poor arguments Jenniwren, XVart, and Hiphop are voting me on, you'd see why I don't even bother defending myself.

How does being able to kill confirm him as town? I think I missed that part. Even if he hits scum (not going to happen, but we're going with theoreticals) HE COULD BE A SK, OLOLOL LETS LYNCH HIM!1!11

[charter]

Yeah, my flavor fits my role, as well. Good catch Zang.

Even better is how XScorp is trying to defend himself with what the mod wrote. It's the old 'scum caught but don't think it's fair how' routine.

[charter]

I also think a no-lynch would be a disaster, despite what Charter would have everyone believe.

It would be a total catastrophe to not lynch today.

You know how to avoid a no lynch? Vote for XScorpion.

[charter]

I was going to say that Scorp, Jenni, and Xvart were all maf. But lately Xvart has been posting well. We can save him for last, if need be. In the meantime, MORE XSCORPION VOTES!

Good stuff.

Just an fyi, I'm going to be out of town this weekend. I'll have access tomorrow morning, maybe tomorrow night, probably not saturday. I won't be claiming.

[charter]

I actually don't think I've ever seen anyone, regardless of alignment, not claim when threatened with a lynch. Unless, of course, they were V/LA or something like that.

There is no possible way I believe this, or that this can even be true. There's numerous situations where claiming as town is anti town, I don't believe that you've been on MS for a year and don't know this. Don't believe it one bit.

[charter]

Why would you claim one-shot otherwise? An SK would get busted properlike gangsta style and that being a mafia only makes sense if they have a 1 shot vig... which is unlikely at best.

Because he doesn't need to live until the end? Maybe he's a mafia one shot vig?

[charter]

I'd still be down for a Jenniwren lynch, of course. Since obviously lynching me is bad, and it looks like a XScorp one might be falling apart. I'll check tomorrow morning.

That's gotta be the dumbest thing I've ever heard on this site.

That's cool. I've been in games with mafia 1 shot vigs. I've been a mafia vig. I'm sure others have as well.

Can you give me an example of when it is pro-town as town to not claim when the threat of hammer is looming?

Just about every time you're a vanilla for starters. Go read some MD. It'll explain.

[charter]

Wrong thread.

Here's one I found searching real fast, there are others.
http://mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopic.ph ... ilit=claim

As for games I've been in with mafia vigs, off the top of my head I remember these.
http://www.mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=11495 (oh look, we even lynched a mafia one shot vig day one )
http://www.mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopi ... 07&start=0

Pretty sure I've been in mini's with them, but I can only remember a few memorable specific minis.

I still don't believe XScorp, but I'm arguing against the claim making him town to convince others to vote him.

[charter]

What's my pro scum motivation to not claim? I can easily make something up that will save me for the day.

[charter]

I already showed pro town motivation for not claiming.

[charter]

Deal. I'll let the pot simmer overnight.

unvote, vote Jenniwren

[charter]

Jenniwren is not scumhunting at all. Are you serious when you say that she is? Have you read her arguments? They are all craplogic. She called me, Kirby, and Spyrex scum, and that's the extent to faking it she's gone, and then backpedaled in like her next post. I kind of want to be lynched, since then you all will lynch the actual scum with swift retribution once you see the amazing role I sacrificed for the good of the town. I'll give you this much, I'm not vanilla, and I'm an AMAZING role.

I'm up to like five scum/hopeless idiots right now. I don't see how town is gonna win this game.

[charter]

I'm still baffled by why XScorp was never lynched. Oh well, good job scum.