Mafia on Holy Orders (Game Over!)

[Me=Weird]

After all this buzz about LL, I decided to look into him. Here are my results.
Hypocritically votes beef for posting for the sake of posting.
Tries to deflect any ani or furc suspicion by meta and gut. Meta being weak, and gut worthless to everyone else.
How exactly is talking about post restrictions scummy? Why would scum be more likely to do it than town? And well, your post just screamed of posting for the sake of posting.
He then says he thinks beef/I is/are scummy because of OMGUS, set-up speculation(I don't see why this is scummy) and me thinking vezo is scummy.
He's also suspicious of pacman for not liking meta and LaL, but calling people out on AtE, which I also don't see as scummy.
Wait, calling people out on basic things is scum-tell now? How'd I miss that?
That's zwet and plum now you've called likely town without reasons.
Votes vezo, which means he thinks I'm scum for things beef did, and therefore I can't defend against.
LL: "the hidden people might be scum!!"
Friend: "wouldn't it be unbalanced if they were scum since they're untargetable?"
LL: "well, wouldn't it be unbalanced if they're town?"
*headdesk smiley*
So in your opinion, the only reasonable attack on you is reasonable? Well, I guess I'm okay with people calling themselves scummy.

So yeah. Not sure if I want him at L-1 yet though, I'd rather wait until I have a response, cause he definitely has something to defend against now.

I still find vezo very scummy though.

[Socrates]

THEN AGAIN Locke has done barrels of nothing all game. AND Soc <3

I wanna settle with Pac, but if y'all have reservations elsewhere . . .

UNVOTE:
VOTE: Locke Lamora

<3. We need more posts like this.

vote: vezokpiraka

You get your ass off Vezo and back on LL or consider my town read on you revoked.

[Socrates]

I still find vezo very scummy though.

Thats fantastic. Everyone finds him such. The thing is, is that he is town.

So who is your number 2? LL?

[Vi]

Vote Count XXX

~ Activity, yes; progress, maybe

Locke Lamora (L-2) ~ Socrates, Iecerint, Friend, Plum,

Furcolow,

curiouskarmadog

vezokpiraka (L-3) ~ Me=Weird, AGar, Chronopie, Furcolow
pacman (L-5) ~ SocioPath, vezokpiraka
Me=Weird (L-6) ~

Furcolow,

Locke Lamora

curiouskarmadog (L-7) ~

Furcolow

Plum (L-7) ~

curiouskarmadog

Not Voting:

pacman

AGar 0 | Chronopie 2 PROD1 9 PROD2 3 | Me= 0 PROD1 1 | Friend 1 | Furc 0 | Iece 0 | Locke 0 | pacman 0 | Plum 1 PROD1 16 | ckd 0 | Socio 0 | Socrates 0 | vezo 0

--With 13 alive, it takes 7 to lynch.

Battery power:

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(43%)

[curiouskarmadog]

answer the questions.

so instead of answering my question you vote me?

try again, why are you defending your locke vote here instead of explaining why you think he is scummy.

what about me on "this page" do you find scummy?

unvote;
vote: locke lamora

been suspicious off locke since RVS, multiple FoS from me i'm pretty sure

funny when people vote, they usually explain why a person is scummy, why are you defending your vote?

also, you put him at -2, why did you not expect him to get to -1?

[Plum]

Hey CKD. What was up in your head when you posted this?:

vote plum

I gots a feeling, plum, would you characterize yourself as a good scum hunter? why or why not?

[curiouskarmadog]

Hey CKD. What was up in your head when you posted this?:

vote plum

I gots a feeling, plum, would you characterize yourself as a good scum hunter? why or why not?

I have seen you play before as a mod and as a player. I have seen you mod a game. You are a decent player and I feel you have some good instincts. Also I feel like you are analytical...

I am not seeing any of that in this game. thus "my feeling"....I still have that feeling, but your answer didnt seem scummy aannnnd, I am barking up other trees to see what scum bags fall out.

also, for whatever reason....the fact that you are bringing it back up (right now) seems non-scummish...Scum, would probably let my vote/unvote go and be joyful the heat was gone. Unless of course, you are prideful and you feel like you got an awesome scum game and are just curious as to what I was picking up on.....but if that was the case you could just ask me after the game.

(shrug)....short answer, scum hunting.

[Furcolow]

THEN AGAIN Locke has done barrels of nothing all game. AND Soc <3

I wanna settle with Pac, but if y'all have reservations elsewhere . . .

UNVOTE:
VOTE: Locke Lamora

<3. We need more posts like this.

vote: vezokpiraka

You get your ass off Vezo and back on LL or consider my town read on you revoked.

i am not your lapdog

[Plum]

I was wondering why you dropped it so fast without a word is all,

but

your answer doesn't seem scummy either, so.

[pacman281292]

ISO'd Locke, found very little stuff.
Hmm...
Note: For all my ISO's, I post facts as normal letters, and I post analysis as

italics.

ISO 0-1: RVS, then V/LA.
ISO2: Votes Beester because of posting for the sake of posting.

Indeed, hypocritical, as he had posted nothing in the game. Much better would have been at least trying to read the f***in' game.

ISO3: Ani is ani. Furc is townspammer.
ISO4: Tries to rebuff an accusation of fence-sitting, then launchs a real case on Beefster.

Locke wasn't fence-sitting; he was plain lurking. The case seems sensical, at least in comparision to some bullshit cases that have appeared from time to time.

ISO5: Again on V/LA.
ISO6: Posts a list of scummy people, with reasonings.

The list seems to make some sense (OH WAIT I AM AT THAT LIST LOL), but his case on Beef/M=W is starting to look awfully like tunneling. Humm...

ISO7: Votes M=W, attacks me for "going for the OBV wagon".
ISO8-9: Plum is town, attacks iecerint for criticizing the M=W wagon.

This post does actually look odd. That attack on Iecerint seems like overreacting to the fact his wagon decision is being attacked.
wut.

ISO10: Busy.
ISO11: Suddenly hops on the vezo wagon, citing some reasons vaguely based on meta. Wary on a massclaim

I'm not sure on whether or not I can consider this case a legit case.

ISO12: Back to M=W, adresses massclaim issue again, then refers to glow-smoke stuff.

I'd like you did elaborate in your pinion about massclaim as stated in this post. Not sure on the glow stuff; I think that it would be possible that the "mystery players" are just players that don't account for the game, and that they are some sort of "refferees" which might wind up meeing us up.

ISO13: More talk about glow/smoke, then asks what could be gained from a Locke lynch.
ISO14: Asks for reasons for the wagon on him.
The answer to the ISO13 question (Furc's reply, not Locke's) was very very shitty. I think that, while Locke would be guilty of tunneling M=W in a way that makes my head asplode, the case on him is weak, altough his dodginess while at L-1 doesn't help him much. My read on Locke is still null, with a very slight scum lean (very little content, and his tunneling on M=W).

And now I need yet another reread. The twist of action is starting to make me put my eyes on Furc (YEAH again, his latest posts have been no good), and slightly on Plum (she seems to be assuming I'm confirmed scum on every post of hers, and she is starting to lack on contribution, despite calling for town seriousness on D1/D2). I seem to be also overlooking CKD's posts way too much.

[Furcolow]

ha
take another look at me, i'm squeaky clean this game

locke saying I spam as town is actually insightful. Let me check that iso out, then I'll comment on that.

[Furcolow]

He didn't say that I spam as town at all, he said he found me weird and town more so than that I spam as town. That is also a very old post. Opinions can change. I was of the mind he was scum at that point in the game.

[Furcolow]

reasoning: has smoke, also wagons way too much, which limits my analysis or the ability to hold him accountable

This post disagrees with your belief in your vote.

"Has smoke" is terrible reasoning to vote someone.

Let me clarify...

WE HAVE NO FUCKING CLUE WHAT SMOKE MEANS OR LIGHT MEANS. THERE IS NO UNDERSTANDING OF THE MECHANIC AMONG THE PLAYERBASE.

You also are wagoning just as much as him.

So are you saying you're scum?

I'm all for a vezok wagon, but I do believe that Furc is scum. His recent play has convinced me against my initial idiot-town read.

smoke implies lies and deceitfulness
light implies goodness and justification
smoke is bad, light is good
do you really disagree with that?

[Furcolow]

answer the questions.

so instead of answering my question you vote me?

i have a temper sometimes with people, and i've had a rough week.

try again, why are you defending your locke vote here instead of explaining why you think he is scummy.

why would you ever try to vote plum at this stage of any game? do you really expect a wagon? I'm not voting locke, am I?

what about me on "this page" do you find scummy?

the way you asked for a claim

unvote;
vote: locke lamora

been suspicious off locke since RVS, multiple FoS from me i'm pretty sure

funny when people vote, they usually explain why a person is scummy, why are you defending your vote?

i am defending wanting to wagon as town in a vezokpirakian manner

also, you put him at -2, why did you not expect him to get to -1?

I was sort of hoping that we could lynch scum, and don't want a claim from him yet. Sorry. It would have been funny if scum tried to hammer right after I unvoted. I've done this multiple times in real life mafia and caught scum that way, but with this editing preview I don't think I'll ever be able to pull that one off unless the player doesn't read previews.

there you go ckd


Lets take a look at the LL wagon.
Locke Lamora (L-3) ~ Socrates, Iecerint, Friend, Plum
Guess what they all have in common? They were all just voting pacman. Both Sociopath and Vezokpiraka were voting pacman with him to bring him to L-1. I was on there at one point, but I have been very unsure of my voting this game. I am not slinging mud onto any of these 4, so don't take this the wrong way. I view them all as town. I am just feeling that SocioPath/Vezokpiraka were then the likelier scum on the wagon, and cannot shift their vote towards Locke because he is scum. In this scenario, we would have dual scum wagons going.

I can see that as being possible. Vezokpiraka rides wagons. There is only one time he would not ride a wagon ALWAYS, and that is when it is his scumbuddy. Otherwise, he would wagon the fuck out of any of you, pardon my French. With him NOT wagoning Locke, therefore, it is pretty telling that he is scum either not wanting to appear to have mislynched, or that Locke is scum with him. I therefore feel like vezokpiraka is scum either way locke flips.
I am leaning towards it being because they're scumbuddies.

[Furcolow]

Also, this makes him voting LL after this null and void and would be potentially bussing as I have now called him out on it.

[Iecerint]

Soc claimed vez is confirmed town. So, you think Soc is wrong? If Soc isn't wrong, does that change matters much?

[Furcolow]

ok so perhaps vezokpiraka/soc/LL are all scum
or soc is wrong if he is town

unless you can give me another reason vezokpiraka wouldn't be NOT reading and NOT wagoning
that is what he does

[Furcolow]

pardon the double negative, that's really awful

[Socrates]

Furc: This is Vezo's first post after the Locke wagon formed:

Claim. And die.
CKD. Do you understand how stupid it is to ask someone who doesn't want to claim and has been called obvtown?

Locke was already at L-1.

So are you saying a town Vezo blindly hammers instead of asking for a claim first?

[Furcolow]

I am saying that vezokpiraka would have been on that wagon earlier had they not be scumbuddies because he wagons at any given opportunity.

[Socrates]

I am saying that vezokpiraka would have been on that wagon earlier had they not be scumbuddies because he wagons at any given opportunity.

But he hadn't posted on site at all during the interval that the wagon grew. (Remember that he hit L-1 in less than a day) Isn't him being late on the wagon more likely to be attributable to the fact that he wasn't at the keyboard?

[Furcolow]

if you can safely say he wasnt here to wagon, i will agree with you. since you are the most helpful to the town, i will vote with you

vote: locke lamora

L-1, right?

[Furcolow]

actually,

unvote

after reading socrates in iso
he was the first vote on locke, and locke has a pretty good point in that there is no case on him really.

I hate to flip flop on this, but i'm simply not convinced.
I am going to let him claim/respond to me=weird/both before I put my vote back on him if I'm going to

[Locke Lamora]

Should I claim, or not? You guys seem to be quite up for repeatedly forcing claims but apart from M=W and Pacman, who aren't even on the wagon, there seems to be very little effort from anyone to actually address my play and I'm not claiming unnecessarily.

CKD: I was asking Furc because in his previous vote justification he explained what information he thought we would gain from a M=W lynch. This time it was just that he'd basically suspected me all game. I wanted to see if he was voting me just because it was the trend or if he actually had any strong personal desire to vote for me. His reactions thus far indicate he was mostly just going along with the wagon, but then most people on my wagon seem to have jumped on it because Socrates has.

On Me=Weird's points:
-My vote for Beefster was made for perfectly valid reasons. People keep taking issue with it because I hadn't posted much at the time I made it, not because there was anything wrong with the reasons themselves (as far as I can see). It looked like he had to put some real effort into making that post and he actually had very little to say about the game, hence the asking about battery power and speculation on post restrictions to compensate for his lack of content. That's scummy. As town, I don't sit around thinking 'well, I think that's scummy but it could be argued I've done that myself, so I won't comment on it'. That's not my mindset. I personally don't think I was doing the same as Beefster anyway; I took a stance and made a vote, while he offered some vague suspicion and excuses for not contributing.
-I thought Pacman was shooting down a lot of points by saying he didn't like things like meta and LaL, then falling back on another fairly general scumtell, AtE. The vibe I got was that he was using them as easy reasons to score points off other people and discredit cases while he was using a general tell that requires very little genuine analysis or effort to apply. That's why it pinged my scumdar.
-I don't explain all my town reads. I don't think it's necessary.
-The smoke/light speculation and assuming those two players are both town-aligned is ridiculous, from my perspective. I disagree with Friend's logic.
-Yeah, Plum is right, I haven't said much. There are reasons for it but I'd rather just get on with the game than re-stating them. If you think my lack of contributions is scummy, fine.

I think that covers the main points.

[Furcolow]

afaik glows appear when people are talking about the lack of voting justification
i have yet to research why smoke appears, but i will possibly figure it out