Mafia on Holy Orders (Game Over!)

[SocioPath]

I choose to withhold my vote for now.

[AGar]

Wow. Just wow.

/facepalmofepicproportions

We have scum handed to us on a silver platter, and pac follows up with Lincoln-esque tunneling and Furc has more bad logic. (Conf town Iec =/= guaranteed masons. He could target scum, ya know).

A re-read is necessary at this point.

[Iecerint]

I asked Furc who he thought I should Neighborize next in our QT awhile ago, and he never answered. So I was waiting on that.

I've now sent in a tentative target (I can change it after first submitting it so long as it's before the day ends), so I won't be caught with no one targeted anymore.

@ CKD -- I get the same vibe as you from that, kinda, except that Furc is probably town via mothy IIRC.

vez should have presents for us now that we know he was scum.

[Iecerint]

Reading vez in iso, the thing that stands out is that he has an extremely schizophrenic attitude toward Furco. Whether this is scum frustration at Furco being both extremely scummy and hard to lynch, or distancing/bussing made effective for that very reason, I'm not sure. I went back and forth as I read through. I'm leaning the former just because of how intense it was, but there are several moments where he seems to say that Furc is scum and then quickly unvote him or try to lynch someone else.

[Plum]

Hmmm.

AGar is more Town now (and was pretty Town when last we saw him; he'd have to have a fetish for premature bussing to be scum at this point) and Chronopie is almost definitely Town. I can find the votecounts and stuff indicating this later; I originally worked on this stuff last night and had the tabs open (am in school now, actually. Should be studying for my Psych test). Furc is about as Town as before. That is, almost definitely.

Iec trying to weasel around whether Furc is scummy or Townish here doesn't sit right with me.

Read this quote and tell me what's wrong with it:

Guys.

I just got something important.

I received a message, presumably from either a player or one of the "holy ones." Here's what it contained:

bothhaveglow&smoke

Oh well.

otherisscum

This pretty much proves Locke's theory.
However, I think it's possible that it might actually be the scum talking, and trying to confuse us. Humm...

vezlie-d2ability

Interesting.

idme/wexplain-GGSCHB

???

batery->rolepoints

That means we need to lynch quickly?

Does anybody know what the GGSCHB means? We need to find out who these players are, because one of them is scum.

This is big.

CKD's response to Friend's info is null. Iecerint response is scummy. AGar response (as above) is Town. Pacman (see above) is scummy.

SOCIOPATH IS USELESS.

[curiouskarmadog]

i agree about Agar....but still not getting where all the Chrono love is coming from.

[Iecerint]

Plum, which part of that post, if any, do you disagree with? Or are you considering that issue settled because of extraneous stuff like mothFurc? I posted about it because my test is done now, so I had time to skim vezo (short), and that was the main impression I got.

(Only other notes are his "town" list, which was Plum/Soc/Iec, which doesn't do me much good, and a SP->Furc thing that I think I interpreted to mean they couldn't all be scum together.)

I am way more nuanced with my reads as town than as scum. For example -- as scum I do something very similar to what pacman did a few pages ago re: CKD. The only exception is when no scum are under suspicion whatsoever (irrelevant in the current circumstance, because I've personally been under a degree of suspicion, so it wouldn't be in play if I were scum). [/self-meta]

[Iecerint]

I read through Fate and zwet, and I can't figure out why they were killed. It looks like they mainly say nice things about scum and lead wagons on town.

The only player still alive that they really attack is Furc. Fate goes after pacman a little, but zwet defends him.

Probably just reputation and then looking town for the PR stuff were the reasons idk.

[Iecerint]

I made a post, but it looks like it got lost. Whatever.

Having read pacman in iso, I think he's scum for his interactions with vez/haylen and mothrax. His reads on everyone else just follow town->town suspicions, all the way to the end of D4.

Guys, I might seem like tunneling, but that's it. Neither vezo nor mothrax need the noose yet (I see both them scummy, but not much; vezo has been lurking (inactive?) and wagon-hopping like hell, and I like Friend's (or who's?) case on mothrax). Furcolow has clearly earned it himself.

A typical (well, a particularly bad, but not unrepresentative) pacman post.

There is a 0% chance that pacman is scum with Furc.

Chrono is next.

[Iecerint]

Ani looks extremely scummy, Chrono looks extremely townie.

@ whoever didn't understand the Chrono love...read him in iso...

[Iecerint]

Well. Read page 1 in iso. Page 2 is a little iffy in that it includes this:

So plum is in control of three votes, provided They aren't aimed at a) Pacman, or b) Haylen (without good reason.)

<_<

[Furcolow]

I feel like I am getting ready to get into the Furc vortex where I will only end up being pissed because nothing he says makes sense to a normal person but..

Furc, I dont think you know the difference between masons and neighbors..please wiki it. Also, how is making someone a neighbor help the town?

"CKD dying and seeing Iece's alignment"..what is the fucking difference?...how will me dying help you see Iece's alignment? When I flip town that will tell you what? Iece is scum?....no...it wont...it will only tell you that I am town. This is nohting more than a set up lynch...."Well, CKD was town, so Iece must be scum"...bullshit or crazy person reasoning.

its ok, you can get in a boat, the world is not flat....its round.

I know the difference, but here it can be near-masons
Socrates said either you/Iecerint/me are scum, not all 3, and "furc is out because he's town" which i am fucking out because I'm town - deal with it. If you don't want to play with me REPLACE THE FUCK OUT KID. Quit whining. Where you/iecerint are polarized, if you're scum he's my fucking mason essentially. sure, he'd be my neighbor that i was confident on, but who gives a shit?

If you die, iecerint is scum based upon the mothrax wagon and vote shifting around it. It's not bullshit. Are you saying Socrates was crazy? I disagree.

Wow. Just wow.

/facepalmofepicproportions

We have scum handed to us on a silver platter, and pac follows up with Lincoln-esque tunneling and Furc has more bad logic. (Conf town Iec =/= guaranteed masons. He could target scum, ya know).

A re-read is necessary at this point.

why the fuck are you not sure i'm town?
everyone in our alliance is sure but you

I asked Furc who he thought I should Neighborize next in our QT awhile ago, and he never answered. So I was waiting on that.

I've now sent in a tentative target (I can change it after first submitting it so long as it's before the day ends), so I won't be caught with no one targeted anymore.

@ CKD -- I get the same vibe as you from that, kinda, except that Furc is probably town via mothy IIRC.

vez should have presents for us now that we know he was scum.

you need to neighborize plum, chronopie, or agar

i agree about Agar....but still not getting where all the Chrono love is coming from.

From me, believe it or not.

actually, mothrax hopped on the animorpher wagon with a terrible post. chronopie is very likely town. unvote him.

when he hopped on, it was actually important and useless bandwagonning. Sure, he's not cleared, but I'm pretty fucking sure he's town.

I read through Fate and zwet, and I can't figure out why they were killed. It looks like they mainly say nice things about scum and lead wagons on town.

The only player still alive that they really attack is Furc. Fate goes after pacman a little, but zwet defends him.

Probably just reputation and then looking town for the PR stuff were the reasons idk.

WIFOM
why push me if you are going to neighborize me at all? makes no sense.
you neighborize someone you trust if you're town
pushing me after neighborizing me = scummy

[Iecerint]

I've already said that the main reason I neighborized you was that I knew you would never be NK'd ever. It's true that I had a relative town read on you, which helped matters, BUT I didn't really have any very strong town reads at all at the time.

Part of the reason is that I hadn't really done rereads because I did meh on my last exam irl, so I had to focus a bit. But today was epic win, so today I felt motivated to do a bunch of isos, etc.

It's not WIFOM to look at NK analysis IMO. Well, I mean, it IS technically WIFOM, but that doesn't mean it isn't useful. 90% of the time I NK as scum because someone's making me uncomfortable. No one is making me uncomfortable the other 10% of the time.

At any rate, the result this time (especially in light of the pacman iso) was that I think they were killed for being difficult to lynch rather than anything else.

Incidentally, I would have been less suspicious of you if you didn't invite it so much in our QT.

[Furcolow]

consider i won for the town the last LyLo I was alive in, would you keep your first statement?
what is your point talking about NK analysis?

I don't care how suspicious you are of me. Either CKD/you are scum, and not both.
seems pretty cut and dry.
I also feel comfortable mislynching once since we just got rid of a scum

[curiouskarmadog]

I also feel comfortable mislynching once since we just got rid of a scum

speechless.

thanks for avoiding my questions, I didnt really want to get wrapped into that fucking bizzaro reasoning..

I would like a link to that game that you "won" at lylo.

[curiouskarmadog]

Ani looks extremely scummy, Chrono looks extremely townie.

@ whoever didn't understand the Chrono love...read him in iso...

that is me...i would like to hear it in your words please.

[curiouskarmadog]

I also feel comfortable mislynching once since we just got rid of a scum

thanks for avoiding my questions, I didnt really want to get wrapped into that fucking bizzaro reasoning..

ignore this, i see you did "answer" the questions.

[Iecerint]

Yeah. I think you're unlikely to be NK'd as town for the same reason I mentioned in the Brave and the Beautiful.

I unvoted mothy to get him off of L-1 after a PR claim. That's pretty normative IMO. And CKD only had him unvoted for a few moments before following up with rhetoric that contributed to his lynch. So you have one thing that any idiot would do (null to alignment, and has nothing to do with what CKD did, because I did it independent of his action), and another thing that's offset by pro-town results.

Soc's assumption was that scum must have unvoted, but I think the confirmable PR claim makes it a less-than-fullproof heuristic.

CKD might be scum, but I don't think it's cut-and-dried, and I think pacman is the most obvious scum candidate from the isos I've done. Haven't done CKD yet, though.

[curiouskarmadog]

my problem with the Pac = scum theory is that he was the counter wagon to moth...given our track record, I really doubt that we nailed scum that accurately that day.

my problem with Furc = scum thoery is that, yes, he did get off the moth wagon, but if he was trying to save his buddy...he should have jumped on the pac wagon...unless they are scum together (which I doubt)

wait a minute..how many more scum do you think we are looking for now?

[Iecerint]

@ CKD:

1. Chrono's lampshades moth and vez getting smoke in his first real post. On checking again, neither was a top wagon at the time, so this isn't as good a sign as it would've otherwise been, though.

(Also, said checking reminded me that vezok pushed pacman a lot. Not really with rhetoric IIRC, though. Ew.)

2. Hammers mothy, indicates vezok as a good lynch candidate for the following day.

3. Some anti-town suggestion that we NL to see what'll happen, but I don't really see the scum motive in that, especially since there's daytalk.

4. L-1's vezok to the Soc-convincing softclaim. Then he gets all lurky in the aftermath. This is the sort of reaction I would expect from a player who feels like WTF IS UP after someone calls your scumread mostly confirmed town.

5. Pushes vez again the next day til after repHaylen's claim.

6. OK-to-lynch list (Soc, pacman, me) looks good.

[Iecerint]

I think there are most likely 2 more scum, (plus a !!!!!scum), but I'm not sure.

We actually had a pretty good record early on, lynches notwithstanding. mothrax and vez were early consistent suspects.

But that's a good point.

[Iecerint]

@ Furco -- my point in talking about NK analysis is that I did it, so I posted about it.

Now people that aren't sure whether I'm town have more tools to determine whether I'm town, and players who think I'm town (or that I wouldn't radically distort something like that) don't have to reinvent the wheel doing NK analysis.

[Iecerint]

Having read mothrax, the probability that Furco is scum is 0%.

[Iecerint]

Having also read Sebguer, CKD being scum would require all the scum to have been like HEY DUDES LET'S MISLYNCH FURCO IT'S GONNA BE AWESOME.

Which actually they have daytalk so that is not quite out of the question but you'd think at least one of them would do something different. <_<

[Iecerint]

Having read CKD through page 3, I don't think he's scum.

Who were the players who thought Sebguer was scum early game? I remember some people saying it, even though Seb did nothing except call Furc scum for bad reasons.

Edit: Pages 4-7 are just him repeating his gut case on me over and over so ye know.

Next is VC analysis. I will channel my inner DGB.