Mini 1084: The New Jersey Shore (Game Over)

[Hanzo_5]

VOTE: Chaotic Neutrality

I saw v for vendetta, his mask was white, white are the color the walls in a insane asylum, insane asylum's abbreviation is I.A. HERES THE KICKER: C is at the begining of your name, is creates a K sound K.+I.A. spells kia, i dont like there cars. there fore U R SCUM BY ASSOCIATION (gotta love rvs)

[Hanzo_5]

UNVOTE:
VOTE: xsrk/vote]

for

No vote yet.

[Hanzo_5]

VOTE: xsrk damn tags dont like me

[Hanzo_5]

I didn't even notice... I might have to still this whenever I get a chance to play mafia.

[Hanzo_5]

Don't pay to much attention to carrotcake's vote on me she's silly and doesn't have the slightest clue of the super dee duper smartyness of my voting campaign.

[Hanzo_5]

Llamarble, i needed to show him how fun voting is.

[Hanzo_5]

Golly Gee I wanted to have this game, I

wanted

to be comedic relief! But i see I have to be super aggressive (as per usual) for anyone to think i'm town.

Everyone, my first two votes were random votes. I'm always very suspicious of the person who brings us out of random voting stage. However, he actually brings up a good; point the man himself is role fishing. I normally wouldn't say anything in the hopes that he would hang himself even further, but after it was brought he continued to attempt to and didnt respond to what seemed like questions aimed at him.

Before you read on, I think its quite ludicrous carrotcake compiled her scum tells from RVS. that in my opinion is a scum tell, along with your weak arguments.

Carrotcake, i find case "a)" on me quite faulty. Mainly in that your argument at its core is based on a voting pattern that i do not exhibit. Also trying to guess what I'm thinking without asking me, seems to only make ur guesses seem like WIFOM to me. It is also based on the notion that I am trying to look town, and i dont see how i can look anything if we r in RVS

Case "b)" is a defense, I am not gonna refute ur vote, what I do find interesting is why you think i would, or why its a refutable vote based on what your initial reason was.

Case "c)" In my opinion it is your play style to assume, if you do that I, and any percieved scum, can out ur argument with "i never said that". However i do think thats scummy and an even better way to

be invisible

Your conclusion while being the best part of your argument, it is based on the idea that acting like town is not acting like town, and being neutral is acting like town. I could quote you but its all here on the same page.

In my mind you are scum number one, reasons:

You said my last vote spread votes thin, but my last vote was for xsrk and internet stranger voted for him before me. U lied Honesty is always the best policy as town.

In actuality your vote on me spread votes thin.

Your case has too many holes in it. If i were ur scum buddy, themanhimself, i could easily get out of ur fake case against me.

I'm sure you saw this coming as u know what im probably thinking, and themanhimslef said he would be calling himself psychic if i flipped mafia.

UNVOTE:
VOTE: Carrotcake

[Hanzo_5]

Your avatar looks like an OMGUS vote .

Atleat give a reason as to why this is an OMGUS vote, instead of leaving me in the dark and putting no fact backed thoughts into peoples mind.

[Hanzo_5]

Guderian, Thank you for clarifying. Did you read my post or just skim I gave every reason for why I voted for her. In my opinion my reasons do not indicate OMGUS. So, what about my reasons for voting are OMGUS?

[Hanzo_5]

themanhimself, i dont understand what you mean by flip votes... when I said:

I'm sure you saw this coming as u know what im probably thinking, and themanhimslef said he would be calling himself psychic if i flipped mafia.

flipped mafia means, if/when I'm lynched you it will be revealed that I am mafia, however I am a vanilla townie.

Jase, I see that the two of you agree that my defense is weak, what exactly is weak about it?

Everyone, I'm getting the vibe from you all that my innocents is only proven upon dying and flipping townie. If you are all in agreement with this Lynch me now. If the flaws i pointed out in ccs argument are that weak, and my case against carrotcake is that OMGUS. Lynch my ass, what do u have to lose. If carrotcake is right and im mafia ur good. If carrot cake is wrong and i'm town... What I think is the strongest case i have ever presented is merelt "meh" to all of you and who needs a townie like that anyway?

[Hanzo_5]

Noooo chaotic your doing it wrong, jump on the hanzo wagon because that case has some serious implications and not at all a bunch of well countered rubbish.

[Hanzo_5]

Looks like im gonna have to get more detailed and quote stuff and bold stuff, because the weakness in my argument is that you couldnt understand it. so here we go again....

In the passage below puts forth the idea, that "trying to appear to be town is" anti-town/scummy and "actually scum hunting" is pro-town/not scummy. Remember this idea in regards to the argument, it will help u understand my defence better.

2.) I firmly believe that people open fresh games with two strategies in mind. The first strategy is to hunt scum for the sake of taking giving them a good hanging. The second strategy is to scumhunt for the sake of appearing town. To condense it: one who cares about appearances above all else is scum, but one who cares about results is town. On the early game I tend to organize posts. Does it belong on the "try to appear town box", or the "actually hunting scum box". Granted it isn't a verifiable thing, but I trust it while on the bareness of the early game.

Carrotcoke then goes on to present her case against me, Her initial argument points out 1 thing, that I voted for a person who had not been voted for in the initial wave of random votes. This part is true.

Let's look at hanzo.
a.) He was the last vote on an unvoted person on the initial wave of random votes. What does it tell me? It certainly isn't coincidental. His joke of an explanation felt substantial. As if; although baseless, it was a thought-out descision. What would he think about? Perhaps: he wanted to spread the votes as to not cause ripples upon the pond. He chose to vote a solitary person - to not even begin a wagon- to

be invisible

. (Am I allowed to bold non-votes, mod?). By ¬trying¬ to look town, he becomes scum.

The rest of her case is merely speculation, and I can prove it! She claims my vote isn't coincidental but she does not establish a patern that can prove im voting in a manner that would keep me under the radar.

He was the last vote on an unvoted person on the initial wave of random votes. What does it tell me? It certainly isn't coincidental.

Keep in mind I made another vote soon after for an actual reason: his he didn't vote, if thats not trying to go unlooked i dont know what is, in any case it seems to be wokring for him.

UNVOTE:
VOTE: xsrk/vote]

for

No vote yet.

Make note, she further proves that she is voting for my first vote by saying this.

b.) I voted against him not for the vote hop, but his initial vote.

So her initial point was made through complete speculation about my first vote, which was complete RVS. I thought it was a cool idea for an rvs to string random loose facts together. Maybe i'll use a poem next time... or maybe i will state that I'm not voting cause that worked wonders for xsrk.

oh wait...

c.) He probably believes no-voting post one is scummy. I disagree. Making it explicitly clear your vote is a joke or you took it by randomize.org is much more scummy imho. It's become tradition to think like this, sadly, and I'm not quite in the mood to brave the currents right now. The hop itself is not scummy, gives how common it is.

So my random vote is scummy because:

His joke of an explanation felt substantial. As if; although baseless, it was a thought-out descision.

and ofcourse ur own speculation as to what my motives are.

and a no vote ain't, excuse french, but, get the fudge out of here!

Your final thought

d.) Put it all together thought, and then it becomes scummy.
" Look at me, I like to test reactions" over "I need to become perfectly still, i don't want people to think i'm reacting"
It's all appearances. Scummy.

This is where that bit at the begining comes into play. In her case she puts forth the idea, that "trying to appear to be town is" anti-town/scummy and "actually scum hunting" is pro-town/not scummy. Yet her whole argument is based on the idea that my first post is my attempt at being invisible. At this point point one should ask themselves how trying to be invisible is like trying to be town. And before you think, her number two has nothing to do with the case against me see if u can find whats bolded below in her arguments.

he wanted to spread the votes as to not cause ripples upon the pond. He chose to vote a solitary person - to not even begin a wagon- to

be invisible

. (Am I allowed to bold non-votes, mod?).

By ¬trying¬ to look town, he becomes scum

I'm ashamed at myself for posting like a big ass baby, crying "lynch me then". I'm unimpressed by my first defense for its admitted "hard to read" impression. I feel that this is a repost in greater detail. However, her argument was (cool person term)->"stupid weak"<-(cool person term) and quite scummy. The scummyness being the huge case over nothing but an RVS vote. this is my first non newb game, and my second game ever. but I think I can play at a high level when i am not being a jack ass.

also

FOS: The man himself

for doing something like role fishing.

[Hanzo_5]

I would appreciate everyones thoughts on my defence before they move on.

[Hanzo_5]

Jase to answer your questions:

1)Carrotcake, reasons:
Her case against me was purely speculative. She also stated that a no vote in the rvs stage is perfectly fine, I think its a shared thought that the point of the rvs is to set up band wagons for pressure. A no vote doesn't support my idea of that shared idea. And then she just went under the radar.... along with my second most scummiest suspect.

2)Xsrk, reasons:
He did not vote during that rvs. and has not posted since.

3)themanhimself, reasons:
For semi role fishing, for being in a agreement with carrotcake on a psychic level,

Although, these people are the top 3 anit-town/scummiest in my opinion, I am tempted to point the FOS at all of you that thought carrotcakes logic was sound. To clarify I dont think all of your are scum, I think that not reading through the previous posts and seeing all the speculative evidence, but instead just going with the flow of her case is very anti-town.

Also you are right I'm vanilla townie, I'm claiming it. I'm sure someone will find that scummy. Will you give your thoughts on my defense?

[Hanzo_5]

Llamarble, I see how my flailing can be misread as me feeling the weight of carrotcake's argument, but it was actually a my reaction to the quick band wagon on me caused by that crap case. For a minute there I was really under the impression that the town was being mislead so easily. To say the least I was very upest. I feel tho still like no one cares about what I have to say, it's quite discouraging and while i know I can present some awesome FACT based cases but the more active posters seem to nto want to interract with me .

So everyone, are you treating me like the elephant in the middle of the room and ignoring me? if not what are your thoughts on my defense?

[Hanzo_5]

everyone, is it really that hard to login and post?

Guthrie, what don't you like about my explanations?

Internet stranger, why is it that you can only make light of your views after carrotcake posts?

The man himself, would you agree that my defense is more fact based, meaning who would you say is reaching more carrotcake or me?

[Hanzo_5]

Guthrie, can you quote what i said that felt evasive to you? I feel as if you are avoiding reasoning for your opinions.

[Hanzo_5]

I was only lookin for ur thoughts no detailed post, as i've said... i think people "sweeping it under the rug". everyone could simply say it exists.

[Hanzo_5]

the man himself, fair enough, while im not happy with ur view, it has reason behind it. I don't know how logic based on the idea that my first post, a random vote, is trying to look town which means im trying to be invisible is less reachy than, my defense, wich in a nutshell is: trying to be town is not trying to be invisible. Which raises my next question, keeping in mind the nature of my posting do you honostly believe I am trying to be invisible?

I see your point on the claim, any claim is scummy.

[Hanzo_5]

The man himself, okay that makes more sense to me, except, how can you agree with her opinion of me being invisible if you say I'm not? am I missing something?

Guthrie, to be more direct which explanation do you feel is evasive? or are u doing more of this:

unvote
Vote Hanzo

I had a strange feeling from your first voting post. It looks like you tought too much about it.
And after Carrot's post, i felt it was good to vote you. Anyway, we need a wagon to heat things up, do we not?

In other words both you and carrot think im trying to go under the radar/ be invisible/ go unnoticed/ be evasive. I have been anything but evasive. I don't like that you and carrotcake have similar opinions, opinions that don't add up. votes based on opinions have no weight, with no weight to what you do you don't have to take responsibility for a myslynch. Carrotcake is not posting I think an extra vote on you will do more for the town. as far as encouraging to give weight to what you say goes.

UNVOTE:
VOTE: Guthrie

[Hanzo_5]

The man himself, now THAT makes a helluvalota sense! It is my hope that you will realize what an active poster I am and that its not some epic game long counter . That is if i survive day and night 1.

[Hanzo_5]

The man himself and guthrie, looking forward to your answers.

The man himself, I'm glad your making a huge deal out of my vanilla townie claim. The reason being is that when a real case is presented on an actual mafia player, I can count on u to not be swayed by it. Defending carrotcakes arguments makes you seem more scummy to me, i will elaborate on this later. pleas do hold me to that elaboration.

Rain, In my opinion ignoring a scum-tell, especially after it has been presented is a scum-tell. What are your thoughts on this idea? Also, do you think xsrk is lurking?

[Hanzo_5]

Themanhimself, I'm not gonna back out of the claim and i don't have any intention too, that would be extremely scummy and confuse the town as well. I'd like to make it clear that the only post I find to have a complete logical thought process is this:

@Hanzo, I agreed that you appeared to be not trying make a splash when she initially posted that and at that point it was true. Now that you a trying to avoid being lynched, of course you would counter everything she said and begin posting more. Besides the fact that so many posts have personally called you out that you have no choice but to respond or be lynched.

I see my mistake in claiming a particular town, and will refrain from doing so in later games, as it does add to the process of elimination. But since I did it here to repeat myself I won't by backing away from it. I am a Vanilla Townie. I see that u already answered my question too, silly me . Elaboration coming soon, real life beckons.

[Hanzo_5]

Guderian, my reasons for viewing it as a mistake are in that quote, post something i actually have to answer next time.

[Hanzo_5]

Themanhimself, those quotes are out of context shame on you.

[Hanzo_5]

Guthrie, you didn't answer my question, can you just say that your not going to answer it so i can make it even more direct.

[Hanzo_5]

Guderian, My defense was that those quotes were lifted out of context. Twice now you have missed my reasoning and asked for it. Are you not reading my posts?

Themanhimself, I'm not gonna jump all over someone for resisting to answer a question they feel makes no sense. And if what you assume is true, he's hanging himself by giving me more examples of him being evasive. What will your defense be if your push for the lynch on me succeeds and I flip town?

Guthrie, To be more clear, can you quote one post where I said something that felt evasive to you? After all its only your opinion don't be afraid to add weight to it.

[Hanzo_5]

Chaotic Neutrality, My votes are not OMGUS, if i weren't being targeted my reasons would be completely valid. Further more i use a lot of qualifiers when I post so there is no misinterpretation of what I mean. If I am quoted with those qualifiers removed than my quote is taken out of context. Point 10 of TMH's is the only one I can agree with, rest is all based off of opinion with evidence presented in a way to reflect that opinion. Shame on you for failing to see that. If i did the same thing it would only needed to be pointed out for you sheep to be breathing down my neck. I'm quite fed up with the lot of you feeding into all the weak accusations against me. At any rate you're all only human/sheep what can I expect. Don't ever answer a question i didn't direct to you, your not answering everyones questions directed at me.

Further more, speaking of failing to provide proper context, why haven't you looked into why Guthrie can't give weight to his "feeling". He's basically telling me to stfu. Why didn't anyone ask why chaotic neutrality basically created the grounds for TMH's defense of role fishing with post #49 (if he did not create them her certainly echoed them). No one has come to my aid in preparing a defense. No one will even give me credit for my defense; acting as if carrotcake brought up a good point. Yeah I thought about what i said, it takes thought to post such a ridiculously brilliant random vote. AND if it caught so much of ur attention how is that vote trying to look invisible? Do you all even think for yourselves... yeah wagoning is cool and all but at least wagon for good reason ffs.

I have scumhunted, when i did the lot of you said it was OMGUS and ignored my reasoning. If i scum hunt now, TMH will say its counter accusation or some other BS.

SHEEP/TOWN, Wake the fuck up, and see that your being played. I think my martyrdom is the only thing that can save this town from itself and the mafia.

UNVOTE:
VOTE: Hanzo_5

[Hanzo_5]

I self hammered cause i was tired of defending myself from bs. Also see my rant, its my suicide note lol

[Hanzo_5]

Thats what you get for wagoning the noob! ahahahahaha if only carrot didnt present such a faulty case, i would've never said the things that u thought were scummy.... and i would've had so much pressure. and i would've never self hammered. This game wasnt very fun for me either. maybe next time ya wont let the lurkers lurk. maybe next time ya wont jump on the wagon and push it to L-1 so early. have fun on d2

Mafia, Don't kill themanhimself if he is town. He can easily lead another wagon on chkflip, and guderian. I don't want this sheep town to win

[Hanzo_5]

Obligitory BAH! post