Mini 1094 - Mariposa Peak Mafia - Game Over!

[Reckamonic]

We're here!

Sorry, we've been having some...relational issues...and haven't really been focusing on mafia lately -_-
All good now though =D

Vote: AGar

because he isn't Asian.

[Reckamonic]

We like Thor665 already =P

(PS, Thor, didn't you play in a Newbie game that Reck modded?)

[Reckamonic]

EBWOP: Ah, yes you did. That's the one where Reck fucked up completely and modkilled you.

[Reckamonic]

^ What he said.

We're actually xRECKONERx & dramonic, but when united, we combine to form one faggy, superscumhunting, cuddly beast! Muahahahahaha!

[Reckamonic]

Now with added rainbows!

[Reckamonic]

Hey guys! We'll get something up this weekend sometime. Good reasons. Promise.

[Reckamonic]

~Dram says~

Unvote
Vote: Guderian

ITT, evasiveness and bussing.

We can also lynch Sim. Carrotcake needs a bullet too.

More concise post once me and m'love have talked extensively, but I wanted to put it out there! <3

[Reckamonic]

Hey guys - we've arranged for a time tonight when we'll both be able to catchup. Expect a post sometime between 9pm and midnight.

[Reckamonic]

HI GUYS.
WE ARE CURRENTLY DISCUSSING THIS GAME AND WRITING UP A POST.

THIS IS RECK HERE, AND I'M BASHING MY FUCKING HEAD AGAINST A WALL AND WANTING TO BLOW MY BRAINS OUT AFTER READING EIGHT PAGES OF THAT BULLSHIT.

WHY DO I EVEN BOTHER;KAOW8RJ8AJ3R;LIANSDLFN.AJF983J[FA8HEF;ADKLSFJ

[Reckamonic]

before we begin this collective catchup post, Reck would like to extend a giant HOLY SHIT I HATE ALL OF YOU to the people involved in this game.
dramonic had nothing to do with this italicized portion. now, without further ado...

Guderian's "gut vote" on Blood Queen on page one is superblah.

The first alarming thing is Thor's #45. This reasoning is just bullshit. [more explanation here once I can focus]. The fact that AGar joined up with him is also quite alarming, as we both expected AGar to be a tad bit more vigilant in his play.

The amount of "You're awesome!" "No, YOU'RE awesome!" circlejerking going on in the early pages between singersigner/Thor665/AGar/Guderian is nauseating. Stop please. We're not playing that other game, we're playing this one, so stay on topic.

Sidenote: Carrotcake's posting style is obnoxious. Like, really obnoxious. And reading a back and forth between singer & carrot is a fate far worse than death. In fact, why the HELL couldn't Fate be in this game to scream some sense into them. >_>

GOD DAMMIT WHY DIDN'T WE SEE AGAR'S TLDR ON PAGE FOUR BEFORE WE HAD TO READ ALL THAT SHIT!? FUCK. +town points for alleviating our collective headache.

FoS: sims5487

for saying that there is little to go on besides CC vs. SS in 84. Thor, AGar, and Guderian have posted

some

content, although most of it is terribad. And ConfidAnon's follow up post puts him in his place quite nicely.
…then sims5487 responds…
…then ConfidAnon responds.

Basically, at this point, there are three separate little arguments going on. CC vs. SS, AGar & Thor vs. whoever, and ConfidAnon vs. sims. Out of ALL of that, the only people we find ourselves seeing as quite townie is ConfidAnon. He's the only one making a damn bit of sense to us. Thor also having a town read on ConfidAnon makes us feel better about his alignment.

singersigner insulting Fate makes us want to POLICY LYNCH THE FUCK OUT OF HER. HEY. HEY. HEY. SINGER. IS THIS ENOUGH CAPS LOCK FOR YOU? WHOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO.

PS, we're really not seeing the Powerrox case. He's being useless, but not specifically scummy.

PSS, we're not sure what the hell Guderian was trying to accomplish with #133, but it's irritating. It's like he's responding to the previous post from singersigner and trying to use a failed attempt at humor in order to invalidate her point.

Strongly disliking Guderian's suggestion that we're in a 3:1:8 setup. Is there ANYTHING that would suggest that that town would know about? (hint, there isn't)

AGar's "let me explain some theory!" post in #167 doesn't feel genuine. It feels like scum trying to get people to see things rationally so that they don't appear scummy, rather than a townie genuinely believing what he/she is saying.

Guderian trying to push a lynch on Thor is laughable, especially considering his lack of case. When asked for one, going "nu-huh you make it!" is not a good argument.
scummy
as
fuck

loving where our vote is.

[Reckamonic]

We knew we liked you, Sera.

[Reckamonic]

You expect us to cut a deal with a pure anti-town role?

Carrot, you will not be crucifying anybody tomorrow.

Count yourself lucky though, with Gud claiming SK, there's probably no vig to nightkill you!

[Reckamonic]

Carrot is talking in third person?

Let the ignoring begin... now.

[Reckamonic]

@sims - that play seems too obvious and risky to work. By claiming SK (a claim he has since said isn't true, fyi everyone) Gud basically put a 'kill me before mylo/lylo card on his chest and lit it up with sparklers. No scum is likely to try that on Day 1 methinks. I actually am taking it as a towntell simply because it's such an in your face reaction test that he basically screamed that he should have everyone pay attention to him - which is not something scum normally do. They either try to stay under radars or they try to look town - I've yet to see one try to look scummy/anti-town.

I actually agree that Carrot looks bad, but I think she does so independent of Gud's actions.

Claiming SK is not a towntell. Ever.

[Reckamonic]

Scum motivation to claim SK: draw attention off of self, hopefully displace it somewhere else. A bit of misdirection, perhaps, or maybe just a gambit to try and get scum to survive to the endgame.

SK motivation for claiming SK: Uh, just go look at Skillville Mafia, which just ended. SK claimed, fucked over scum AND town, made it to endgame.

Town motivation for claiming SK: Um. ...yeah, nothing.

[Reckamonic]

Carrotcake voted Thor?
LOL.

[Reckamonic]

The only rocking I see is "hey, let's do something stupidly scummy and see what happens"

here's what happens: You get lynched

Please self-vote.

[Reckamonic]

oh, and by the way:

3:9 Closed Mini Normals (171 games) (46.6%)

Mafia wins: 107 (62.6%)
Town Wins: 62 (36.3%)
Draw: 2 (1.1%)


3:1:8 Closed Mini Normals (3rd party = SK) (77 games) (21%)

Mafia wins: 35 (45.4%)
Town wins: 37 (48.1%)
SK wins: 5 (6.5%)


2:1:9 Closed Mini Normals (3rd party = SK) (31 games) (8.5%)

Mafia wins: 6 (19.3%)
Town wins: 20 (64.5%)
SK wins: 5 (16.2%)


2:10 Closed Mini Normals (13 games) (3.5%)

Mafia wins: 10 (77%)
Town wins: 3 (23%)


2:2:8 Closed Mini normals (8 games) (2.2%)

Mafia wins: 5 (62.5%)
Town wins: 3 (37.5%)

Try again in another game.

[Reckamonic]

here's what happens: You get lynched

Please self-vote

self voting. didnt know that was good for town.

It's not. Except you're not town, so...

[Reckamonic]

Carrot's case on Seraphim in 280 is really, really, really weak. But we're not going to respond to it. We'll let Sera take care of that.

[Reckamonic]

Partly because we've BOTH been extremely busy with finals and end of the semester and stuff, and partly because you're obviously scum.

[Reckamonic]

Actually, I have found that usually only scum call others "obv scum".

Which is why you're scum.

logical fallacy much?

If you were actually playing mafia instead of playing "let's be scummy and say it's intended", perhaps we might unvote you.

[Reckamonic]

ergo they aren't committing scum actions

That's a good one.

[Reckamonic]

Guderian in ISO. It's a fascinating read when you want to know what scum looks like!

0: hello world
1: love me please?
2: I now have a read on a person whose only post is a random vote and a joke
3: This "I'm a Queen. I don't need to say hello" is very nervous and scummy!
4: OMG SOMEONE ASKED ME A QUESTION! evasive answer... be vague as possible...
5: Ah, that good ol game that has nothing to do with this one!
6: I dont know how scum plays or who scum is, I'm not scum. Derp derp! I also think scums have personalities!
7: Tee hee, I'm making a funny comment. Wait, this isnt why I vote BQ earlier right?
8: Explain to me why I'm scum so I can not be scum against next game. Also, don't mind the fact you should explain your comment when I dont have to explain my BQ vote.
9: I shall now heavily misrep AGar, that will mostly appear town!
10: Oh, let's add another vote without explanation, since my vote shouldn't be explained, unlike people calling me scum!
11: Actually, let's put my vote somewhere else...
12: teehee, I made a funny!
13: Hey, the world totally changed since 60 games ago. Also, it's 3scum a sk, but dont tell anyone!
14: OMG, I'M POSTING AN OPINION!
15: Did I mention I love misrepping AGar? WEll, I do.
16: Sim disagrees with me! He MUST be scum!
17: newbies are aaaaaall identical!
18: SS, Tell me why I'm wrong, please.
19: No, I will NOT explain why I want to lynch Thor, that's not my job... right?
20: I ALREADY SAID YOU MUST FIND WHY THOR IS SCUM, LEAVE ME ALOOOOONE!
21: STOOOOOOOOOOP IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIT!
22: Guys, I think there's scum within half the playerlist! Also, I'M a SK, lawls!
23: Guys, COnfid is scum! His reads can change, he doesnt like lurkers and he wants me to make a case.
24: I'm cryyyyyptic!
25: I have a master plan, now that I have brought all the lights on myself I can execute it!
26: seraph, do you believe me? tell meeeee!
27: I dont like your post, so I wont answer.
28: Power, I may not do anything worthwhile, but YOU should.
29: AGar, how dare you put me at L-1 and ask for a claim when that is how the game has always been played? Also, I was kidding earlier, I won't claim in case someone doesnt believe me, although I'm totally honest, yep!
Also, it hurts the anti-town people to put every spotlight on myself by being super scummy and softclaiming a PR on which I can give no detail. Really, it does!
30: give me a second, I'm not done reading
31: Good defense, doesn't mean my case is bad at all.
32: OOOOOOOH you are an idiot sim!
33: According to these flawed data I got (ignore the fact I stated earlier that 60 game ago is incompatible with now), I think scum wins because they do nothing, and I'm doing stuff, so I'm town! Also, we should information hunt before having info, and sometimes on day 2 town is lynched, so you guys dont know how to play the game! Also, lookit my ego ^^
34: I wont claim, because I've nothing to actually claim. THat or my information will hurt the town, even though if I have any role the doc can surely protect me and I'll be roleblocked to submission if a roleblocker exists. Also, if my role is reflexive I'll fuck over the doc, so I shouldn't claim, no sir!
35: If you lynch me you'll get lynched, because apparently my scumminess transfers to you. This is not a threat, at all.
36: I love the newbies, so let's not lynch them! If I die, the newbies die. Hey, I heard that coming from a gangster in a movie I saw the other day!
37: I won't reply to your argument, because you're crazy. That makes me town.
38: Newbies, do a non-suicide pact for me please. I can read your minds, and you'll want to lynch each other. threeaaaaaaaaaaaaaats.
39: I haz unexplained townreads
40: pictures are funny, even though this one is cryptic
41: Look at the shiny kitties, they dont like me! KILL THEM! Don't ISO them, there are only posts about me there.
42: You're scum for calling me scum. HAH, GOT YOU!
43: I can't understand SS, therefore I'll daykill her after claiming she's town multiple times

[Reckamonic]

Blatant misrepresentation on almost every post. If I am alive tomorrow, you're next.

Yet you don't explain how any of the post is a misrep.
And you might want to consider explaining WHY THE FUCK you shot one of your townreads...

Considering Gud-scum,

Where are the scumbuddies?
Where is the counterwagon?

Bussing you (sim) and going "hey, we should compromise" (carrotcake)
The counterwagon would be Seraphim, except nobody is buying into Carrot's crap, so it's not taking off.

[Reckamonic]

Hold on. Don't get anxious at L-1? I just let and be hammered?

Dont have a grasp on the games?

People are at L-1 all the time, only VIs would hammer someone at L-1 without a claim. The fact you're scared of being hammered post claim is laughable at best if you're town.

Also, you've failed to adress how we established your stats are bullock.

If you had ANY grasp on how the games work, you wouldn't be faking daykills, you would be answering points made against you, you'd post cases when asked to explain how a player is scummy, you wouldn't claim an anti-town role for the lols, you wouldn't refuse to claim at L-1, you wouldn't be trying to blackmail your town reads and you would not be on the verge of a lynch because you think you're smart.

If there's only one thing you get from this game, we very much hope it's humility.

[Reckamonic]

The last 50 3:9 games are 37 mafia, 13 town

3:9 Closed Mini Normals (171 games) (46.6%)

Mafia wins: 107 (62.6%)
Town Wins: 62 (36.3%)
Draw: 2 (1.1%)

Don't use stats if you're going to use all of them

Typing wall of text post is anti-town and why the town loses so much. I have 3 newer players on my lynch because they thought I was a legit SK, 2 scum, and seraphim.

You know, there's a very good possibility the "newer" players on your list are better than you are (or ever will be, with your current mentality) and are voting you for much more than your little claim

You haven't given a case on either of the player you're calling scum.

[Reckamonic]

I was talking to Agar...

When most of a post is directed at us, it's not avoiding to suppose the last line also is =_=

[Reckamonic]

Fun fact: of your three "newer players", only 1 is newer than you <<

[Reckamonic]

Good luck getting your answer, he DID try to shoot you <<

[Reckamonic]

(How about this recka. If i'm town, both of your hyrdas are IP banned from this site forever. I'll take the exact same bet. If im scum, I'm gone. Want to?)

That's laughable.

[Reckamonic]

I think the best thing for town is if you hung your head between your legs and took it like a man.

That's probably impractical for a lynch though...

[Reckamonic]

Alert: this is the last post I will post any sort of defense about.

And now you're just refusing to defend yourself, which is

what the fuck you do when you play mafia

?

You're one of the most arrogant, pretentious, and all around

awful

players we've ever encountered. Please enjoy your rope and subsequent lynch.

[Reckamonic]

0_o

[Reckamonic]

Confid, that hammer was awful.

Gud needed to hang, but under the precept he was being honest you should have let him post his read/opinion/something for situations like this where he actually flips town.

Now all we have is troll-Gud's BS =_=

[Reckamonic]

You're all about to see something I've never done before, making a (sort-of) PBPA on the NK'd player (Rhinox in this case). I know I'm not the best person at doing this.

Some post are left out because I don't feel like they need to be commented
_________________
2: Analyzing a situation in a townie way and puts pressure on Gud.
3: Response to Gud's response to the pressure.
4 + 5: Responding to Sims overreaction after Sims being criticized for making random votes when we were no longer in the RVS
7 + 9: Again analyzing a situation, this time on AGar's case on BQ, still townie but with more pressure. Really good arguments here but...

...I'm still waiting for BQ before deciding what to do from here.

...
Considering he's dead, you don't really have to mention if his posts are scummy or townie...

[Reckamonic]

Can we have a dayvig to shoot Carrotcake please? God he's annoyingish.

Mod, half of the hydra is semi-V/LA until he gets his internet connected at his new apartment. Just a warning.

Noted. I'll put your hydra on the V/LA list regardless.

[Reckamonic]

Vote: AGar

[Reckamonic]

The two of us only had about ten minutes of time today to talk about the game. It went something like...

"We should try to post in Mariposa."

"Yeah, we should... apparently, there's a wagon on Carrotcake going on."

"Interesting. Why do I remember saying AGar is scummy?"

"I'm not sure, I remember thinking that too."

"Let's just vote him. We can put together our thoughts into words after the holidays are over.

"Works for me." *posts our vote*

TL;DR we're posting our full case after Christmas and the holidays and stuff

[Reckamonic]

Fucking fuck fuck.

Looks like this V/LA will last a bit longer. Will try to post a bit during the week. If worst comes to worst, dram will be arriving in Raleigh in 6 days, 7 hours, and 4 minutes to stay with me for two weeks, so we'll definitely be active then.

[Reckamonic]

only half of us at a time Thor.

[Reckamonic]

Five Day Extension: Yes

[Reckamonic]

Here's what has us bugged about AGar:

Early on, his policy vote on Singersigner didn't sit well with us, but we managed to chalk it up to RVS nonsense. In retrospect, though, he didn't pursue the SS vote any further after Thor provided a convenient reason to vote Powerrox, which AGar happily parroted while also laying down some weird FoS on Thor… immediately after agreeing with his position on Powerrox. You'll see in our first big catchup post that we noted AGar's agreement with Thor's case on Powerrox caused us to raise our eyebrows. But he still leaves a door open to hop back on the SS wagon if need be, when given the opportunity later on by Blood Queen.

His original reason for voting Guderan was due to… well, we're not sure, exactly. He says it's because it's scummy to state how Gud expected a three-man scumteam to behave, but never explains why, exactly, that is scummy. We don't even think AGar believed it himself. That's why Rhinox had to remind him to change his vote.

This is more speculation than anything concrete, but his PBPA of SS/CC's back-and-forth has the potential to be "trying to appear helpful/town" instead of actual pro-towniness.

The way he quickly bails on this, as he puts it, "fruitful" wagon on Guderian

in the very same post where he votes for him

is complete and utter bullshit. He gives no reason in the post… he just narrows it down to four potential scum, then votes one of them. However, when he sees he can easily rejoin the Guderian wagon, first he sits on the fence, then RANDOMLY shows up later on, quotes one of Gud's posts, and just declares him as scum out of nowhere. He wanted to get his vote back on Gud, but didn't wanna catch any heat in wagon hopping so blatantly again, so he needed that "cushion" post to ease the blow.

By the end of D1, AGar had expressed a willingness to lynch Guderian, Singer, sims, and Blood Queen. He never took a hard stance on any one of them and instead remained mostly fluid, bouncing from wagon to wagon, until eventually feeling comfortable sitting on the Guderian wagon while still throwing suspicion towards everyone else should he need to make a quick escape. Then he has the gall to come in D2 and state… wait, just let me quote his iso 24 for everyone:

My top suspects are undecided at this point, for those wondering. I need to re-read this, as I feel I was potentially barking way up the wrong tree yesterday.

Translation: I'm scum who played like shit D1, so I need time to let the rest of you come up with another case for me to parrot and wagon.

Eventually, today, he laid down a vote on Carrotcake,

after

he had a wagon going on him and his hand was forced. Looking through his post, there is very little active scumhunting or case-making. It's mostly flippant declarations of who is scummy and who is townie with very little reasoning put behind it, or him being defensive, or some kind of meta/theory discussion. This is

not

how real townies play - this is how scumbags play when they're trying to appear town.

Dramatic confirmation vote, complete with waving of hands: AGar

[Reckamonic]

Nacho, what about our case on AGar? What points in it do you agree/disagree with? Stop ignoring us, goddammit.

[Reckamonic]

In order to give the replacements some time to catch up UNVOTE:

Hey mothrax, sorry for not saying this earlier

Hey Lateralus!

PIIIIIIIIING

[Reckamonic]

DERP DERP, MOD, CAN YOU DELETE THE ABOVE POST? WE POSTED FROM THE WRONG ACCOUNT.

@Nacho: While we can buy the fact that sims was, as you put it, "tin-foil hatty", we can easily chalk that up to newbish nerves, or overeagerness, or something to that effect. Meanwhile, AGar has been around long enough to know better than that. His play here compared to his play in Reck's Lost games (which dram played in) are completely different. Something is definitely off.

PS, we're not liking how you tell Lateralus that sims, AGar, and singersinger are the scumteam… but then tell him, in the very same post, to 'watch Reckamonic closely'. Reasons?

@Lateralus: Okay, so we kinda like your case on SS. It has some valid points…but we've never played with her before, and there was someone at the start of the game (might've been AGar, can't remember who) that said her playstyle was quite…odd. At least she's actively attacking/scumhunting and is pretty transparent with her reasons for doing so, unlike AGar.

HOLY SHIT SINGER, COULD #473 BE A BIGGER OMGUS? WE THINK NOT. JESUS CHRIST.

Psst, Lateralus, it's just MO, not MOI. *nod nod*

I literally can not understand what you're saying here. Please clarify.

We lol'd.

So basically, we're starting to buy Singerscum, but we're wary of the fact that this seems to be Carrotcake vs. Singersinger all over again (from her replacement). It would appear today's lynch is either going to be AGar or Lateralus22, and out of the two, Lateralus has ALREADY done WAY more good in like two pages than AGar has done the entire game.

SERAPHIM, CONTRIBUTE MORE OR DIE

[Reckamonic]

Lat - Offering to cut a deal with the SK does not constitute pro-town action. By ignoring the wagon, I more mean "tried to avert it in any way possible," than actually not responding to it. If you think any player will completely ignore a player... then that's just bad play.

Anyways. Trying to desperately avert a wagon who claims an anti-town role isn't a pro-town action, like you're cracking it up to be.

I fail to see any outlying cause to believe SS is scum. Saying "She hasn't presented herself in a readable manner." doesn't constitute a case, especially coming from a player like Recka. Just because you can't read a player doesn't mean that they aren't making themselves readable. Just means you aren't trying.

Lat's attacks on both myself and SS are really,

really

weak. His attack on SS is baseless, while his attack on me consists of "I don't want to die, so I'm going to pick at something awful in the hopes that it sticks."

I'm very comfortable with my vote where it's sitting.

nice refutal of our case bro
lol jk

[Reckamonic]

"AGar is town because he isn't scum" might be one of the worst sentences posted in this game so far.

@mothrax: What exactly about Carrotcake's interactions with the Gudwagon make that playerslot scummy?

You're completely and totally disregarding our case on AGar based on "lol meta".

FoS: mothrax

, could turn into a vote depending on AGar's flip.

[Reckamonic]

Your gut says "Let's vote who my previous vote is voting"?
That's... worrisome.

Go sober up.

[Reckamonic]

bussing implies Later is scum, and he's a bigger wagon.
You really ARE basing your biggest scumread on your second biggest scumread...

[Reckamonic]

What happens if Singer flips town though, scumread wise?

[Reckamonic]

That was an excellent catchup post, IAAUN.
Who are you replacing, exactly?

[Reckamonic]

I'm back. Quick catchup;

iamauser looks pretty town to me.
I'm not sure about the Seraphim case, that still looks like a town slot as well.
I think singer is town - it's not a super strong read, but I've seen her as town and scum and she really does play this way as both, so much of the scumspicion on her just looks weak at the moment.
Nacho feels like town Nacho...please be town Nacho.
I'm still pretty happy with the AGar wagon, sorry buddy, you gots to die.
Power or Lat are probably my current seconds.

You forgot us.

[Reckamonic]

What are everyone's thoughts on massclaiming today, then no lynching, then lynching tomorrow?

[Reckamonic]

Neutral - I usually trust PRs to puzzle out their own reveals.
Advantage you foresee?

If there are counterclaims of any sort, one extra night can help us figure out who's lying and who isn't, rather than locking into a 1v1 today and giving us a 50% chance of lynching wrongly and losing the game.

[Reckamonic]

The advantage is the advantage of a fucking massclaim...

Listen, we're essentially at the endgame. Scum HAVE to counterclaim power roles, otherwise there will be an overload of VTs and we'll know the scum reside somewhere in there. We have had ALL VT deaths so far in this game, so there are plenty of power roles out there right now that could either confirm each other via cross-reports or at least make it harder for the scum to have a decent fakeclaim.

We suppose it wouldn't hurt to wait until tomorrow, but if we're going to no lynch anyway, I think another NK worth of information would be worth it, especially if we lose a PR tonight.

[Reckamonic]

NACHO EDIT: I suppose we could all just step forward and not say if we're a PR, but just say if we have any potentially incriminating results.

If we're going to go half-claim, I say just do the full monte. But I'll let the rest of the town decide.
So far it's 3 for, 1 against, and 1 neutral.

[Reckamonic]

Okay, nevermind.

After further discussion with dramonic, we've decided that a massclaim today would tell the scum exactly who to kill. It's better to just end the day quickly with a no lynch and send them blindly into the dark.

Vote: No Lynch

[Reckamonic]

We have no problem starting the massclaim.

We are a vanilla townie, though we were neighborized with mothrax.

Our QT was very empty. We got neighborized at the start of D2. Dramonic forgot to inform Reck of the neighborization, so we completely forgot we even had a QT with him until the mod prodded us to go check it. Very vague comments were made in passing:

mothrax asked us for our opinion on Thor, to which we replied that he felt townie.
mothrax said he was leaning towards Lat & singer being scum and pulling off "one hell of a bussing act".
N3, we talked about how we felt the people who were pro-massclaim were more likely to be scum, aka Seraphim & Powerrox.

Given that context, we'd like to send the popcorn claim over to Seraphim.

You're up.

[Reckamonic]

Aha, this is open. Anyway, I'm fairly sure I have a guilty result today that should make things considerably easier.

I'm a watcher, first of all.

I targeted Thor N1. He was my strongest town read and I felt, out of all the players, he was the towniest. No one visited him.
I targeted Nachomamma N2. Same deal with N1. No one visited him.
I targeted Mothrax N3. I targeted him because of a vibe I got...I dunno Guess what? I got a result. Mothrax was visited last night. Mothrax died last night. Let's do the math. The visitor was the one and only singersigner.

Unless there are some shenanigans in the works, I think the lynch is clear.

I want SS to claim next.

This claim smells funny.

Too much theatrics; something is sitting weirdly with us. Though we don't necessarily like singer's response.

This whole thing kinda reeks of scum bussing scum, to be completely honest. Not sure why this would be optimal play in endgame. We'll wait for the rest of the claims before we make a decision.

Regardless, we've caught at least one scum here:

If Seraphim is telling the truth, singer is scum.
If Seraphim is lying, singer is town and Seraphim is scum.
If Seraphim is bussing, they're both scum.

Waiting to hear the rest of the claims at this point. Who's up next?

[Reckamonic]

Vote: singersigner

This is absolutely and completely obvious. If singer is town, she just gave the scum a free ride into the endgame.

And he forgot to vote her in his post? When he had a VISIT on last night's kill?

[Reckamonic]

Oh, right. Okay.

Carry on then.

GO LAT GO.

[Reckamonic]

Is there any other way of explaining a false result on a VT other than it being claimed by scum? I'm pretty sure there isn't in a normal...

Reck...what about my response? Also, Nacho's right. Either that, or if I were a cop/doctor. I can't think of too many other scenarios...

The weird thing, here, is that you're looking for a way to clear Seraphim as town. Reck does that too...when he's scum and a town PR catches him. If you know you're a VT, your *first* response should be that he's scum lying in endgame in order to secure a mislynch,

not

"Hmm, let's see what ridiculous circumstances would lead to him getting a result on me".

At this point, it looks like singer has a more likely chance of being scum than Seraphim. And what about your response?

@singer - if you were a cop/doc then watcher Seraph should have seen two people target mothrax. In all honesty Nacho was more on the money then myself because really the only way for you not to be scum in Seraph's eyes is if there is a scum ninja role (or a bus driver/redirector sorta deal?)

I'll be wanting to discuss the mothrax targeting in any case once the claims are done with.

@Lat - also, delay to claim is scummy. Speed is pro-town

Can you explain what a scum ninja is?

[Reckamonic]

Also, Thor, it seems as though you've already decided to believe Seraph's claim ("because really the only way for you not to be scum in Seraph's eyes is if..."). Why?

You're completely misrepping Thor - he's saying from Seraph's point of view, you have to be scum unless you're a ninja. He in no way, shape, or form implied anything from HIS point of view.

Reck, do you believe this is an honest bussing deal? Because scum would have to get through another day that way. It's been established that we're in LYLO, so it would be more beneficial for scum to go three*scum* against one*townie* as opposed to two*scum* against one*scum*. There would be no reason for scum to go against one of their own unless they genuinely thought they couldn't get one of the remaining three townies on board with their mislynch target.

Did you even read what we wrote? Here, allow us to bold it for you:

This whole thing kinda reeks of scum bussing scum, to be completely honest.

Not sure why this would be optimal play in endgame.

We were implying that the attacks between the two of you didn't feel genuine on either end. Seraphim due to the theatrics of his claim, and then you due to the fact that you tried to help Seraphim weasel out of it.

Re: my response, you said you didn't like it. Since it's more or less incriminating to just state something is worthy of disapproval without explaining why...mostly just curious as to why you didn't like it, that's all.

Here, it's this part, specifically.

I'm only a Vanilla Townie, so

unless DH was playing a sick game

with some really weird role (like an insane or random watcher??), or

he messed up somewhere

(which I highly doubt considering the circumstances)…

It sat wrong with us because you were so damn open to the idea of there being an error or wacky mechanic somewhere… which doesn't jive with the rest of your post, which includes a vote on Seraphim and a blatant statement of this being a 1v1 scenario.

What's that? Flailing scum?

Oh, irony, how we love thee. Your response to Seraphim's claim has been textbook flailing: attempt to rationalize why there would be a guilty result on you (instead of directly attacking Seraphim's claim himself), then once the noose started to get tighter and tighter around your neck, you started to misrep people and take their arguments/statements out of context, all the while attacking your attackers (OMGUS much?).

You obviously

had

to counterclaim Seraphim's watch result, but what makes you think Thor665 is more likely to be scum than us? The fact of the matter is, sitting on this end, you have yet to list a reason on why Thor is scummier/we are townier.
What about Lateralus? Or Nachomamma? Or really, anyone else?

You are grasping at straws in order to make people believe your cries of "Conspiracy! Conspiracy!" in hopes that they will turn on your attackers. Occam's Razor would imply that you ARE caught scum. The only thing that is really bothering me now (meh, guess the theatrics can be forgiven) is the fact that Seraphim chose to watch mothrax… who would CERTAINLY not have been our first pick to be watched were we watcher. Not particularly liking Seraphim's #617 where he can't even find an explanation as to why he picked mothrax, but we're disliking SS's reaction and play here much more.

[Reckamonic]

We're both about to walk out the door, so we don't have time to respond to much... but Thor, we never said we had meta on Seraphim's theatrics. We just dislike the theatrics in general. Apparently, Nacho is the one with theatrics-meta on Seraphim.

The theatrics don't bother me. The theatrics are a call back to the old Seraphim, the anime avatar Seraphim.

[Reckamonic]

...what the fuck?

We won't say anything until Powerrox claims. Something is already not sitting well with us. (Obviously.)

[Reckamonic]

singer, shut the fuck up scumbag. Seriously.

Reck, you too.

No one says shit until PR claims though I have a theory as to what he's going to claim.

Stop trying to be Fate. You're not. Just because you outed yourself to me doesn't give you the right to start talking to me like that because all of a sudden your plan didn't go the way you wanted it to. No one's buying it, and I'm pretty sure you just outed your scum buddies, too. We'll see...

And seriously, stop playing god. You act like you're in a position of power or something.

Is anyone familiar with this aggressive playstyle from Seraph?

Stop fishing for someone else to make a meta case for you.

Also, you say nobody's buying it, but clearly some people are giving SOME weight to what Seraphim is saying.

Powerrox needs to show up and claim so we can break this down.

[Reckamonic]

We...

well yeah.

Really. we do.

But we don't wanna say too much.

[Reckamonic]

Okay, we were thinking roleblocker, but that works too.

Need time to process this.

[Reckamonic]

That means for Seraph to be town that both singer and Powerrox are scum

I'm missing why this is true.

Because that would mean Powerrox is fakecounterclaiming you as Watcher, and singer lied about her visit to mothrax. They have to both be scum if you're not.

FWIW, the breadcrumb is relaxing me about Seraphim right now, but I can't imagine why a scumteam, who has YET to run into any problems and only needs ONE town vote in order to win the game, would be pulling this weird ass, fucked up claim on the final day. It just doesn't jive, unless the scum really are that dumb.

IMO, we need to lynch between Powerrox & Seraphim today.

[Reckamonic]

I'm sorry, what?

[Reckamonic]

...because we have TWO WATCHER CLAIMS?

What am I missing, here?

[Reckamonic]

Derp.

[Reckamonic]

TBQH, Powerrox's adamant anger over the "trickery" thing screams scum that is butthurt over being outdone by a well-placed breadcrumb from town.

[Reckamonic]

TBQH, Powerrox's adamant anger over the "trickery" thing screams scum that is butthurt over being outdone by a well-placed breadcrumb from town.

You find Seraph's breadcrumb awesome and well placed? He used the word watch.

First of all, it screams inexperienced who's pissed off there's no way to prove his claim.

Second of all, I agree with Thor. Seraph's breadcrumb doesn't prove anything. It's so easy to place

one

faulty-breadcrumb. I might be more inclined to believe someone who breadcrumbed results, too.

YOU'RE RIGHT
IT SCREAAAAAAAAMS IT

Second off, Powerrox's quickvote on us actually, surprisingly, made him seem more townish. Frustrated newbtown or something.

We seriously have no idea what to do here. It's possible for us to pull through with a scumlynch here, but we could literally see anybody being scum EXCEPT for Nachomamma8.

[Reckamonic]

Unless, y'know,

you're scum and lynching singersigner ends the game in a scum win

.

[Reckamonic]

Dram & I are really emotionally/mentally drained from dealing with a whole lot of bullshit. We'll get around to this game in the next day or so. Sorry for the delay.

[Reckamonic]

Meh. Whatever. We can go with that.

Vote: Seraphim

Not much hope in winning this game anyways with scum still at full strength. If this is town vs. town, it's game over. If this is town vs. scum, we have a 50% chance of being right.

[Reckamonic]

Someone hammer and end this game please.

[Reckamonic]

...and Reck has seemed pretty damn scummy to

us

BEST SCUMSLIP EVER

[Reckamonic]

LAT I JUST POINTED OUT WHY NACHOMAMMA IS SCUM AND SERAPHIM IS HIS BUDDY HE'S TRYING TO HELP WIN THE GAME WITH

PLZ REVOTE

[Reckamonic]

No.

[Reckamonic]

I swear to god if Lat doesn't revote he's scum with nacho & sera

[Reckamonic]

There was a Zorblag game that had two trackers. I'd like to check if it was normal or theme.
Hence the unvote request.

Hey look it's scum trying to stall their scumbuddy's lynch in lylo
how about the scumslip i caught you on, yeah?

[Reckamonic]

Also this is reck and im drunk so if i start acting like an asshole you can fucking deal with it

[Reckamonic]

you're both supposed to be town though >.<

Reck's gotta be town cuz it's MO to bus and he generally makes good points and Nacho is town for good scum hunting too. I don't like singer but she can't be scum, come to think of it why the hell would singer scum even send in a nk or kill IAU when he thought she was town AND was attacking Sera.

ohai wifom
ss is town
nacho & seraph are scum
maybe with powerrox

idk i cant think thru the claims right now
powerrox rb would fit with seraph & nacho scum right

[Reckamonic]

Then that makes thor the third.

[Reckamonic]

Seraph is obvscum, Nacho is obv his scumbuddy, and barring any weird ploys, Thor is the third.

[Reckamonic]

WAIT.
Powerrox refuses to hammer

Unvote; Vote: singersinger

[Reckamonic]

unvote

i need to not do this when drunl]l

[Reckamonic]

I can has confused
drunky times

night night

PREDIT I KNOW THATS WHY I SAID I NEED TO BE DRUNK

[Reckamonic]

i meant sober

[Reckamonic]

FINE W/E
HAMMERTIME BC I DUN CARE ANYOMORE
DOMS GONNA YELL

VOTE SERAPHIM

[Reckamonic]

INB4ENDGAME

[Reckamonic]

no like im pretty sure i just hammered town
fucking a singersigner
you admit it right now
you fucking admittit

[Reckamonic]

SO ITS A TWO MAN SCUM TEAM? WHY THE FUCK DID YOU PUT TWO WATCHERS IN THIS GAME DEMON.

im sorry what

[Reckamonic]

confirmed
lat was scum watcher

[Reckamonic]

quick lynch thor tomorrow plz. town win 2011

if you're town then this is the way we're going with this

[Reckamonic]

if it's 2man it's sera and thor
if it's 3man it's sera nacho and thor

[Reckamonic]

WHY THE *FUCK*
WAS THE JAILKEEPER
NOT ON THE CONFIRMED FUCKING WATCHER

[Reckamonic]

I'm getting fucking tired of waiting, and everyone continuing to conspicuously disappear when it's crunch-time is not giving me good vibes.

I don't know who to think is scum anymore, other than to know that singer is 100% town. Which means, out of the final three, there is two scum, making our odds of lynching correctly pretty damn high. ALL of them are scummy, though. Before today I would've just been like, "Thor & Nacho, gg"... but a JAILKEEPER WHO DOESN'T PROTECT FUCKING CONFIRMED TOWN is pinging my scumdar A LOT.

PREVIEW EDIT: JESUS CHRIST NACHO

[Reckamonic]

Will wait for everyone to check in. Thor could be scum bussing Nacho with such a dirty move.

@Thor: What kind of intelligent...nay, semi-intelligent town JK would NOT keep confirmed town? It's mind-bogglingly dumb. That being said, I'm only convinced singer is town at this point, and I'm leaning towards a you/Thor scumteam for the reasons singer pointed out.

[Reckamonic]

Your claim + Lat claim + singer claim + Seraph claim = Seraph scum, basically.

still waiting to know who you JKed yesterday.

[Reckamonic]

Wait, how do we know Nacho is scum?

Also, Powerrox, that was a really stupid decision.

[Reckamonic]

WAIT.

That means Thor is confirmed town, no?

[Reckamonic]

V/LA lasting longer than expected, but I will make a post in here tomorrow.

Fuck this shit.

Vote: Nacho

If we're wrong, gg scum.

[Reckamonic]

multiple synchronized real life issues, please standby.

[Reckamonic]

...Nacho, that was a horrible attempt at scum trying to use town logic to appear town.
NOBODY ELSE vote for us, or Nacho's buddy (Thor) will likely switch wagons and hammer us.

Kinda genius strategy, actually.

[Reckamonic]

Nacho isn't stupid. That "slip" was on purpose so that after he inevitably gets lynched and flips scum, everyone will look at that statement tomorrow and call it a "scumslip" and use it to lynch me over Thor. He's flailing now, and it's 100% that Thor is his scumbuddy.

[Reckamonic]

That's why I said it "strongly suggests" not "proves" There are two nights (one of which there were only two scum) where I, if scum, must not have been the one who sent in the kill. That makes me more likely town statistically. It especially blows holes in Reck's Thor/Nacho pairing. Since you're so excited by my scum meta feel free to look at my scum games and see how often I volunteer and desire to send in the kill because usually I am pretty confident in how townish I look.

Also, note how I'm the only one of the three suspects today who apparently believed we were the three suspects at the start of the day. The others sort of slowly dredged into the idea (Reck had to give up on his PR as scum theory and a sort of vague tossing up his hands post when he voted Nacho, and Nacho by coming to the brilliant conclusion that PR was town) Each of them sprang on the other one when this happened even though they are clearly both of the stated belief that I'm the scumbuddy. Hello distancing action.

Sweet misrep.
We never had a PR is scum theory.

[Reckamonic]

Will wait for everyone to check in. Thor could be scum bussing Nacho with such a dirty move.

@Thor: What kind of intelligent...nay, semi-intelligent town JK would NOT keep confirmed town? It's mind-bogglingly dumb. That being said, I'm only convinced singer is town at this point, and I'm leaning towards a you/Thor scumteam for the reasons singer pointed out.

[Reckamonic]

Our vote for you, Nacho, was one of exasperation. This game feels like it has been dragging, nobody is posting any real content, and you're confscum at this point.

"Fuck this shit" means "Fuck it, we're tired of waiting around".

And, look! You haven't been quicklynched yet! Clearly, if the votes were on a townie, then the lynch would've gone through much quicker (unless his scumbuddy is already on the wagon... OH HAI THOR).

Another question is why didn't you vote earlier? After Thor voted, it kind of seemed like voting was fair game, considering I had made a big deal about powerrox NOT voting so hammering could be done. Were you trying to protect your scum team?

Look, we've been fairly V/LA recently due to some fucked up shit IRL, so the fact that we haven't been both paying clear attention to this game is no surprise. Check our other games. We've been inactive there too. The only difference is that we felt an obligation to post in this game since we've been here since the start and it's near the end of the game.

I don't know who to think is scum anymore, other than to know that singer is 100% town. Which means, out of the final three, there is two scum

, making our odds of lynching correctly pretty damn high. ALL of them are scummy, though. Before today I would've just been like, "Thor & Nacho, gg"... but a JAILKEEPER WHO DOESN'T PROTECT FUCKING CONFIRMED TOWN is pinging my scumdar A LOT.

Singer = 100% town.

Final three have two scum.

I'll go out on a limb and presume you weren't counting yourself in the final three, so...misrep?

Way to paint us wrong here. We never called him scum. All we said was that we didn't understand his choices, and were it NOT for the easy PoE involved, we'd be considering him scum.

The attempt for Thor to bus his scumbuddy and then go on the offensive against us is just insulting at this point. If you feel so much more strongly about us than Nacho, then why isn't your vote on us, instead?

Right. Because you're waiting for somebody other than your scumbuddy to jump on our wagon so you can lay down the hammervote and end this game in a scum win.

[Reckamonic]

A bit of miscommunication and lack of paying attention.

That's literally all we can give you.

[Reckamonic]

Vote: Thor665

We fucking saw this coming before night even started. As soon as Powerrox publicly announced his night action like that, we KNEW there wouldn't be a kill. WHY WOULD THOR KILL IN ENDGAME WHEN HE KNOWS IT WOULD CONFIRM HIM AS SCUM?

Thor purposely no-killed in order to frame us, and Powerrox is bad bad bad for telegraphing his move like that. Had he stayed quiet, Thor would've had to guess at who Powerrox was jailkeeping.

[Reckamonic]

THOR.
THERE IS NO WAY FOR YOU TO WIN THIS GAME.

WE HAVE A FUCKING JAILKEEPER.
EVEN IF YOU GET US MISLYNCHED TODAY, POWERROX WILL JUST KEEP YOU AGAIN OVERNIGHT AND IT'S G FUCKING G ON D7.

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA.

Man, scum seriously fell apart with all that infighting and bussing. Fucking seriously.

[Reckamonic]

Enjoy being wrong, singer, you fucking awful player.

Vote: Reckamonic