There Will Be Bloodshed (Game Over)

[TwoHeadedBoy]

Oh hey, the game started.

Vote: Pine

His rambling is giving me scummy vibes.

Grey voting NL is a nulltell, btw.

~Pie

[TwoHeadedBoy]

Oh and

Unvote

No need for my original joke vote to remain when we have prime scumspects coming out of the wood work now.

May I ask why you unvoted, yet didn't re-vote, even though "we have prime scumspects"? You even listed

your

two suspects in the post before this... seems odd to unvote instead of changing your vote to one of them.

~Pie

[TwoHeadedBoy]

Oh and

Unvote

No need for my original joke vote to remain when we have prime scumspects coming out of the wood work now.

May I ask why you unvoted, yet didn't re-vote, even though "we have prime scumspects"? You even listed

your

two suspects in the post before this... seems odd to unvote instead of changing your vote to one of them.

~Pie

Haven't decided which of the two I think is more scum yet.

So you're scum waiting to see which bandwagon forms first. Good to know.

Unvote, Vote: C-Worl

~Pie

[TwoHeadedBoy]

So you're scum waiting to see which bandwagon forms first. Good to know.

Unvote, Vote: C-Worl

~Pie

No, if that were true I would've voted Pine who had 3 votes on him at the time. I'm legit giving them a chance to respond before I vote.

So you're scum waiting to see if the Pine wagon keeps up or dies down. Again, good to know.

Confid's vote is funny. He actually had better reasoning for voting

me

.

~Pie

P.S. - Fugitive is in Maine at the moment and has limited internet. So he won't be showing up for a while, but I'll sign my posts regardless.

[TwoHeadedBoy]

105 is almost too stupid to be scummy... I'll give C-Worl a newb pass for the time being. Plus, my vote'll do better here:

Unvote, Vote: Pine

Still wouldn't mind a C-Worl wagon though, and I could be convinced to join Confid's wagon - his discarded vote of us did have better reasoning than his AGar vote, but that's the only scummy thing I noticed about his post. I'll go back and read it again later to see if I'm missing something.

*headdesk @ 154*

~Pie

[TwoHeadedBoy]

I don't give a fuck what Calcifer (or Grey, even though I still <3) says, I think Pine is scum.

Vote stays. Everyone else can feel free to hop back on.

PEdit: lol C-Worl
PEdit2: *nod*

~Pie

[TwoHeadedBoy]

Also, 183 is :goodposting: but 188 makes me a sad panda.

And the nod was at Antihero's PEdit.

~Pie

[TwoHeadedBoy]

Will people stop calling me

newbtown

, idiot town, and village idiot. IT really hurts my feelings. I'm at least trying out here.

Can I call you newbscum, then?

~Pie

[TwoHeadedBoy]

I'm confused as to why Calcifer is buddying Pine so hard. The rest of his reads confuse me as well... I have a null on [winger], leaning town on Friend, and leaning scum on Jerbs and C-Worl.

@Calc, you can attempt to get me lynched all you want, but I'm not budging on my vote just because you have a strong gut read. So nyeh.

Yeah, because I'm the one that got pissed that people suddenly started changing their votes just because Mastah Calcifer said so, that makes me scum. Honestly, you people are sheep.

Ya know, at this point I'm pretty sure all mighty Calcifer would derail any of my other scumspects so whatevs.

Vote: Friend

...although this really makes me want to change my vote back to C-Worl again.

~Pie

[TwoHeadedBoy]

Wraith seems like he needs one of these:

Calcifer, GreyICE, kindly stop buddying up to me so hard. My vote can't be bought by defending me, and I'll damn well defend myself when necessary. Plus, you make all of us look scummy when you do it.

You know, if it wasn't for the fact that scum wouldn't obviously defend their mates so damn hard even on D1 (thus [Calc or Grey] + [Pine] are unlikely as a scumteam), this would really seem suspicious... Actually, this post reads weird to me even

with

that in mind. Seems... artificial. Do not like.

Grey is just being weird this game. Like in 264, for example. Not scummy, just weird. Opinion on Jerbs, Grey? Since we don't seem to share the same reads on scum otherwise and you haven't mentioned him (I don't think).

~Pie

[TwoHeadedBoy]

Because being wagoned for something I don't understand is frustrating as all hell,

especially when there's so many more scummy people around me.

Holy deflection, Batman. There goes my leaning town read.

~Pie

[TwoHeadedBoy]

Hey guy, Fugi here. Don't know if you noticed, but everything was signed by Pie up to this point. I had a V/LA that started before the game did and didn't bother to announce it since Pie could keep the account running without prod. I've skimmed the thread and talked to Pie about it so I'm relatively caught up. I'll give the thread a good solid read later when I'm less exhausted.

~Fugi

[TwoHeadedBoy]

Did you really have to make sure we knew that you found Grey's vote to be a nulltell? Why?

Because town and scum alike vote NL as a way of getting out of RVS (someone votes them for voting NL, and then other people vote THOSE people...). It was worth a mention that Grey's vote was indeed a nulltell. It was the only thing that really stuck out at the time, so I brought it up. I'm more curious as to why you're asking why I'm giving my reads - more information helps the town, does it not?

In addition, concerning Post 158/ISO 4 of mine, is the why addressed to:
Why my vote would do better on Pine? I still find him suspicious and there were more votes on him and more support for a lynch than on C-Worl. I enjoy placing my vote where it has more importance, especially if I'm deciding between two people I find scummy.
Why I said it was too stupid to be scummy? I'll quote it for you and you can read it yourself:

@Calcifer If you're not going to explain your list then I will.

As scum you're posting a fake list. The list of town includes your scum buddies and a list of random players. It's designed for the town players to see that you think they're town and so they won't question you or the other players on that list. Your list of scum likely includes one real scum so that if you get lynched he'll be safe or if he gets lynched you'll be safe. Therefore I feel inclined to:

Vote: Calcifer

If that's not just plain silly, then I don't know what silly means. It's not as bad as silver's 154/ISO 13, but still.

---

The AtE/apathy from Friend is not making him look more town in my eyes.

Parama, any other reads or thoughts aside from Confid?

~Pie

[TwoHeadedBoy]

Ugh, reading. Where'd my other head go?

*goes to catch up*

~Pie

[TwoHeadedBoy]

Perhaps someone can enlighten me regarding the merits of continuing to pile onto the Friend wagon? We don't want a speedlynch, and forcing him to roleclaim won't likely help. If he's a town PR, he'll get killed by the scum on N1. If he

claims

a PR, most people will be dissuaded from following through, which will get him off the hook if scum. So...why build the wagon this big nine days out from deadline?

Then how do you suppose we lynch scum in this game? Just sit around with our thumbs up our asses until deadline? That's an even worse idea.

Someone explain to me how Pine is town again, please.

Well, I'm not involved in any of the arguments, and I'd rather move on to investigating others. I'll grant that Friend is the scummiest at this point, but there's plenty of other things to do. Ignoring that and speed-lynching just gives scum a free pass. To do what you're suggesting they'd have to lurk

successfully

"Sure, the largest bandwagon is scummy, but I want other people to be pressured/voted."

Seriously, Calcifer, this guy is town?

Never thought I'd say this, but... *sigh* ^

351 + 352 (and practically all of Parama's ISO) is Parama showing the douchey part of his meta. 'Course, I don't know if that says anything about his alignment... nullread for now. Also, not sure what to think of diddin. Like Parama, I'm getting a nullread from his recent posts; maybe I'm missing something? Finally, I'm liking silver less and less. Tons of fluff posts and Friend-pushing with not a lot of other content? Rubs me the wrong way.

I'll read everything over again tomorrow night when I'm less tired. Pine vote stays, though.

~Pie

[TwoHeadedBoy]

-TwoHeaded

Tons of fluff posts and Friend-pushing with not a lot of other content?

Seriously? I mean... seriously? no joke? are you kidding?

I was mostly talking about your recent posts. Observe:

Friend is the way to go day 1 people......

*hides in bunker before the flame war commences*

Calcifer's recent string of posts has me say this
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DV1fUwKMdAI

Perhaps someone can enlighten me regarding the merits of continuing to pile onto the Friend wagon?

Friend = scum.

I feel like hammen threw that in there to spite me...

....

Or maybe he's trying to dissuade the theory because I was correct and he's protecting his scumbuddies?!

-nhammen

I'm thinkin on that.

. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .

Explain what about Wraith's quote was "scummy as hell"

You do realize I asked this a couple pages ago and have since been constantly ignored about it... right?

*headdesk*

Friend... is scummyererer

*seconds the Friend wagon*

Only 32 and 33 seem close to content, the rest is, like I said, fluff or baseless Friend-pushing.

~Pie

[TwoHeadedBoy]

I'm actually asking why you gave that as a read, but had no other reads.

That's all I had to comment on at the time.

I was asking why your vote was on Pine. You mentioned him multiple times, but never mentioned any suspicions of him before that post. And you did not give reasons in that post either.

Like I said in my very first post, his rambling gave me scummy vibes. His posts haven't given me a town vibe at any point in this game, so I've left my vote.


Pine's sudden caving-in and voting of Friend seems unsettling, mostly because of what Wraith said in 389.

~Pie

P.S. - I just realized when I looked through my ISO, I said Fugitive was in Maine. I meant Massachusetts. Same difference. :P (still dunno where he is right now though)

[TwoHeadedBoy]

Tired. Don't want to catch up. Will find time to catch up tomorrow though.

GreyICE and Hiraki are now in the same game. Well, there goes my alt theory.

~Pie

[TwoHeadedBoy]

Silverbullet, he's asking questions that people have already asked, he's being vague about the Pine wagon, and he's slightly rolefishing.

YOU PEOPLE

ARE LITERALLY FUCKING ILLITERATE. I AM SO DONE WITH THIS GODDAMN AWFUL TOWN.

Hey...

Friend & Empking = scumbuddies?

Smacks of desperately looking for someone to deflect attention onto.

Isn't that exactly what you're trying to do with this post?

^

I'll make a case on Pine later. I skimmed the wall and other content and don't have much else to add.

~Pie

[TwoHeadedBoy]

I've played a few games on forums, and I learned in a big damn hurry that most of the skills I'd honed in live games were utterly useless in this medium, such as reading body language, analyzing tone and inflection, and straight-up looking people in the eye and asking them blunt questions. Despite that, I've done a lot of research on the Mafiascum wiki on theory, though I'm sure there are some gaps in my ad hoc education.

"Here's my experience - with a disclaimer that excuses any bad/scummy play."

@Calcifer: Thanks for the offer of instruction, but no thanks. [snip]. But thanks for the thought, if you are Town.

Note that that's not a FOS, per se, just wariness. We can talk after this game about our apparently-similar styles.

Casts suspicion on Calcifer, then even gets over-defensive about it.

This provides some solid information that can be fact-checked against the player's history where applicable (i.e. go to my Newbie thread, you'll see the same play style there, and same on the Myth-weavers.com Game 4A, wherein I was a Cop.)

I dislike people providing their own specific games for meta reasons. I shouldn't have to elaborate why. But while I'm here, Pine, care to give a direct link to this offsite game? I can't find it.

For that matter, asserting that an individual is Town or probably Town without backing it up, or defending anyone without obvious reasons this early in the game, is just as suspicious.

Actually, if anything, giving townreads with explanation is more scummy. /theory

As much as I can understand fucking with someone's head, a No Lynch vote is just...I'm not sure there's a good word for it. Given the explanation, I'm inclined to not think it as scummy as I would otherwise, but...No Lynch isn't a good thing for Town.

@ConfidAnon: The intent behind my "wall post" was to address and analyze as much as I could at that point. This has served me very well in the past, even in live games, where I have been known to sit silent for half the discussion time and then conduct a point-by-point dissection of what's been said. It is clear to me that this adaptation of live strategy is not being received well in this crowd, and I'm now scrambling to adjust to water that is suddenly over my head.

Remember how I said he could fall back on his playstyle disclaimer later to excuse his scummy play?

@GreyICE: 1) Did you really think I thought you were Mastin? No, but as noted above, I was under the mistaken impression that responding to everything was a good idea.

P.P.S. If that was a short wall from Pine, I say we report him to the moderator, Mastin is running two accounts. My god man, take a minute or two and edit your post down into something that makes sense. I've been diagnosed with ADD, that doesn't mean you have to inflict rambling wallposts on the world

I am not Mastin. Correlation does not imply causality.

Seems pretty serious to me.

TL;DR: I've gone from being a big fish in a small pond to medium at best in a big pond. Stuff that's been effective for me in the past no longer is. I'm going to scale back the aggressiveness of my style, and would like you all to cut me a small but reasonable amount of slack. I'm going to try and pipe down a bit for the next day or two, and figure out how to appropriately integrate. I'm not going to do anyone any good by getting lynched on Day One for not knowing how to play with the big kids.

Remember how I said he could fall back on his playstyle disclaimer later to excuse his scummy play?

There aren't many (good) reasons for Town to put up unsubstantiated lists like that, but a big one is to see

who gets defensive or overly concerned about fingers waved in their general direction.

Spoiler: In my defense

Good god. Have a nice 10-hour spring break sleep and wake up to a lynch mob.

Re: Going to bed-Seriously? I went to bed. There were a couple of hours of intense back-and-forth, and by the time it was getting into the early AMs, I had had enough. I was declaring my intent not to respond to anything for a while, as I'd be unconscious. Regardless of the fact that I played Starcraft 2 for a while before actually going to sleep.

@DLG: Your reasons boil down to 1) Expressing uncertainty 2) Taking a blow to my ego and actually learning from it and 3) The math discussion, which I didn't actually start, got goaded into, and have tried repeatedly to suppress or end. I'm not sure whether this is tunnel vision or whether you're just squinting as hard as you can in order to make the case you've already decided upon.

Re: Trying too hard: Yeah, I was. So now that I'm trying to back off, as half the thread was clamoring for me to do, it's even more suspicious? I don't get you people. Simply put, I've made mistakes regardless of my alignment. As Town, I've pissed people off and let ego get in the way, and distract people from hunting actual scum. As Mafia, I've gotten too greedy and too obvious. As SK, I've stuck my neck out way too far and gotten noticed. As some other third or fourth party...well, it'd depend on the role, but it still isn't good.

My actions thus far have included a lot of

mistakes

. I screwed up early, and of course I'm trying to fix things now. I put myself into a lose/lose/lose position, and which 'lose' I'm in depends only on alignment. Bad for Town and bad for scum=novice errors. Null tells.

Right now, I'm taking on water. I'll return to actual scumhunting once I've bailed out and gotten back on course. I've noticed things, but I don't think they'd be taken seriously by about half the group right now.

e_e

Calcifer, GreyICE, kindly stop buddying up to me so hard. My vote can't be bought by defending me, and I'll damn well defend myself when necessary. Plus, you make all of us look scummy when you do it.

This just screams artificial-ness.

Perhaps someone can enlighten me regarding the merits of continuing to pile onto the Friend wagon? We don't want a speedlynch, and forcing him to roleclaim won't likely help.

I'll grant that Friend is the scummiest at this point, but there's plenty of other things to do.

We can come back to Friend at any time, he's not going anywhere.

And pushing for a speed lynch [on Friend] is a great way to be anti-Town while not appearing it.

Does anyone else see what I'm seeing here?

So, are people willing to pursue other options, with Friend as our backup in the case others don't present themselves? Or are you all committed to finishing Friend off now?

Keep in mind his vote's on Friend at this point. And he's casting suspicion on those voting for him.

If we're going with Friend, let's get it over. If not, then let's keep him on the back burner and look at someone else.

I thought you didn't want a speedlynch?

Friend & Empking = scumbuddies?

Smacks of desperately looking for someone to

deflect attention

onto.

Speaking of deflection...

Because I'm pissed the fuck off. This is exactly what happened in Succession Mafia. Lynch me now please.

There's a clear least common denominator there.

Clever to point out a game with a similar situation where you flipped Town, though.

This provides some solid information that can be fact-checked against the player's history where applicable (i.e. go to my Newbie thread, you'll see the same play style there, and same on the Myth-weavers.com Game 4A, wherein I was a Cop.)

...

WTF does that mean, C-Worl? He answered the questions, though belatedly and not very satisfactorily.

Defending AND casting suspicion? Atta boy, scum!

That's what I mean by playing hardball. He's making us run around in circles to get information out of him and he's mad at us for not listening.

And you're just feeding into it. Friend knows he's going down,

and probably doing his best to get as many people looking suspicious before going down and muddy the waters.

And he's doing a good job, too. So stop helping him.

He recently has casted suspicion on Friend, Empking, and C-Worl, as I've shown above. Funny, this is.

@Hiraki: I ISO'd Calcifer like you suggested, and you're right, I spotted a few scummy things I had missed when they were spread out. However, I also noticed that at Calc's last town/scum rundown, he had DLG pegged as scum. Considering that you inherited DLG's role and are just now reading those accusations, I wonder whether they hit a bit close to the mark. Especially as you solidified your case against Calc at around the same time you read them.

So the result of ISOing Calc was to drop both you and him from a Townie read to neutral at best.

"You're right, but I'm going to call you scummy so I can join either bandwagon when they pick up."

---

Remind me again, Grey and Calc, why Pine is town.

~Pie

[TwoHeadedBoy]

Oh yeah.

@Mod: votecount at your nearest convenience. Much thanks.

[TwoHeadedBoy]

Pie said he was looking through his iso. I would normally consider that scummy.

~Pie

P.S. - I dunno if this is even technically a hydra since Fugi's made like one post. :U

[TwoHeadedBoy]

Caught up now. (For the most part, a few of the walls I just skimmed).

UNVOTE: Pine
You're being an idiot, IPie. I will detail to you why later, but Pine is town.

VOTE: Friend
http://mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopic.ph ... 6#p2874616
http://mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopic.ph ... 9#p2874669

No sense in clogging the thread by restating what's been said, I'll just say that those cases sum up my feeling on Friend pretty nicely with very little difference in opinion and have ultimately the same conclusion as my own.

~Fugi

P.P.S.

P.S. - I dunno if this is even technically a hydra since Fugi's made like one post. :U

I TOLD YOU I'D START POSTING.

[TwoHeadedBoy]

EBWOP:

That's L-1.

~Fugi

[TwoHeadedBoy]

Fugi. Explain why C-Whorl shouldn't die then.

No case provided, no hammer provided

Friend is scummier. C-Worl's two posts after mine have rubbed me the wrong way though. I'd still rather a Friend lynch at this moment.

~Fugi

[TwoHeadedBoy]

Fugi won't let me move our vote. And I'm still not convinced on Friend-scum. He's not exactly super-town, but we really do have bigger fish to fry.

Also, Fugi completely forgets that I called mongoose-scum in MPM and he was completely wrong and maybe he should have more faith in my reads. >:|

~Pie

P.S. - *throws an Ultra Ball*

[TwoHeadedBoy]

I'm gonna sussinctly reply to this: Balls.

I'M GOING TO ASSUME THIS IS THE GREYICE HEAD

I WANT THOUGHTS ON MY PINE CASE

~Pie

[TwoHeadedBoy]

I WANT THOUGHTS ON MY PINE CASE

~Pie

I DON'T WANNA LYNCH PINE. CALCIFER HAS UNVERIFIED POTENTIALLY PR RELATED INFORMATION ON HIM.

IT'S DAY ONE YOU DOUCHE CANOE

I think pine is scum, but lets follow what Calc said.

H8

~Pie

[TwoHeadedBoy]

>post Pine case
>still no comments from anyone else, or Pine
>sad

DIDDIN, GET BACK ON PINE

Pine's scum. Don't trust the people defending me - they know how I'm gonna flip. Easy town cred when I do.

I like this post. Speaking of defending, I'm also becoming increasingly suspicious of Hiraki, even though I'm pseudo-defending Friend as well for trying to get a wagon on Pine. Difference is, I have a nullread on Friend (with Fugi having a scumread).

Concerning Friend's other reads, I haven't seen anything scummy from Confid, but he's one of the players that hasn't been in the spotlight much so I haven't been paying much attention to him. Calcifer... not sure how to feel. I don't think scum would call someone "confirmed town" based off of what seems to be just D1-gut-reasoning. Too risky to do as scum, but that's WIFOM, so I'm null leaning town for now. His play of defending Pine is also similar to that of Hiraki defending Friend, no? That kinda mixes up my reads on both of them.

Gut-wise, I'm leaning towards Hiraki-scum and Calcifer-town.

Obviously I have no comment on his scumread of me/us (the only thing I can really say being 'hurr you're wrong'). Reasoning for

all

your reads would be nice, Friend.

And y'know what, fuck you Fugi. We're gonna lynch a scumread of mine today.

Unvote, Vote: Pine

I'll only move our vote back if we need to hammer to end the day, or something similar to that scenario.

~Pie

[TwoHeadedBoy]

UNVOTE: Pine
VOTE: Friend

Stop it, you manwhore.

~Fugi

[TwoHeadedBoy]

Unvote
Vote: Pine

~Pie

[TwoHeadedBoy]

ಠ_ಠ

~Fugi

P.S. Get on IRC.

[TwoHeadedBoy]

*TwoHeadedBoy bows due to overwhelming popularity now

Well, Pie and I have talked it over in IRC (It's like QT on speed, AGar, so stop complaining). I'm basically siding with nhammen that he's nitpicking too much and pointed out that the vast majority of Pine's text is very progressive and town-like. He still disagrees based off the tells in his wall. We didn't exactly come to an agreement though, as he's still convinced of Pine scum and neutral Friend while I'm convinced of Pine town and scum Friend. Pie, however, just left to go to a party because of his lolsociallife which means I have control of the account for a few hours to the rest of the night.

UNVOTE: Pine
VOTE: Friend

Take that.

---

Also, Hiraki looks pretty bad, but I'm reluctant to call him scum because I've never been able to read him right. I know, meta iz st00p3d and stuff, but I'm keeping an eye on him.

C-Worl's posting has been off recently too, especially his reactions to Friend's wagon.

So we're either lynching scum or we're getting rid of an unneeded role anyway.

Don't get me wrong, being VT sucks.

and

Why should I get lynched? I haven't done anything wrong (that I know of)

particularly this one, are what I'm talking about. I mentioned it last night but I want to quote them tonight for emphasis. Keeping an eye on him for now.

~Fugi

P.BTW: ur quite w3lcum, C-Worl.

[TwoHeadedBoy]

EBWOP: Just thought I'd let you guys know why I'm fighting Pie so hard on this:

Too lazy.

ConfidAnon is probscum. THB is too. Calcifer is iffy.

So from rank for you it'd be

1. Pine
2. Confid / THB
3. Calc

?

Sure.

From my experience this kind of apathy in this situation is a scum-tell. He seems to know his reads won't be taken seriously after his flip. That's the main reason I care to replace my vote on Friend and want to see him lynched.

[TwoHeadedBoy]

Pie, however, just left to go to a party because of his lolsociallife

Which I slightly regret.

That said, I feel too much like shit to start up another vote-change-war (even though you're asleep) and I'll concede for now. Friend wants the rope, he'll get the rope. Not a loss from this head's POV. And I

guess

Fugi has a point concerning apathy.

We lynch Pine tomorrow, regardless of any flips.

I WANT THOUGHTS ON MY PINE CASE

~Pie

I DON'T WANNA LYNCH PINE. CALCIFER HAS UNVERIFIED POTENTIALLY PR RELATED INFORMATION ON HIM.

IT'S DAY ONE YOU DOUCHE CANOE

...

BRAINS

FUCK YOU, ZOMBIE

~Pie

[TwoHeadedBoy]

But yeah, as long as the "OMG NO!" bickering leaves the thread, we're good

~Pie

[TwoHeadedBoy]

Stop doing things when I have to work.

Vote: Pine

Parama should stop mimicking my catchphrase (catchemote?). (b' ')b

~Pie

[TwoHeadedBoy]

Pie won't let me change out vote because I was wrong about friend, and though I'm not as confident as Mastin, I'm pretty sure Pine is town.

If I had a vote it would be on C-Worl for the reasons I listed at the end of yesterday.

~Fugi

[TwoHeadedBoy]

what the

where is my Pinewagon

>:|

~Pie

[TwoHeadedBoy]

I'm still working on the wall. But a tl;dr of what the wall will be?

I'm so convinced Pine is town, that I swear,

if Pine is scum,

I will retire from Mafia

forever

under the name of Mastin--that's right; I'm so confident that if I am wrong,

I will NEVER make another post, not in a game, not even in MD, completely abandoning the site for an eternity

. I'm dead-serious.
Who here is that sure Pine is scum?
'Cause I'm that sure, THAT confident, that Pine is town. And will write the Wall to prove it, too.

Oh, that's where my Pinewagon went. e_e


Not completely sure what to think about C-Worl's attempted hammer. Gives him a few townie points in my eyes; I bet my other head disagrees.

~Pie

[TwoHeadedBoy]

Curiously, there's been almost nothing new mentioned against me in over a dozen pages, which leads me to think that the people constantly wagoning on me are either scum or afflicted with tunnel vision. THB (Pie) a good example. He decided I was scum within the first couple pages, and hasn't reconsidered it since, despite being attached to Fugitive.

I made a case on you yesterday, so it's not like I'm blatantly bandwagoning. When I feel like doing mafia-work (between WoW and Pokemon and other shit, I've been lazy), I'll dissect your recent posts.

~Pie

[TwoHeadedBoy]

THIS IS EVERYONE:

Vote: Pine

He's scum

...I am stunned and impressed by your concise and well-considered post, Jerbs. Bravo.

Most awkward scum-scum interaction I've seen in a while. Props to you two. d(''d)

easons I think Pine is scum (I'll back off him because of what Calcifer said tho)

This pretext is hilarious. "HERE'S MY CASE, EVEN THOUGH I'M NOT GONNA KEEP PUSHING IT!"

I say we let Pine live today, as Calcifer seems so sure he's town.

Uh... and?

I think pine is scum, but lets follow what Calc said.

There is literally only one other explanation for this, but I don't exactly want to even hint at it atm.

Vote: Pine

As said by everyone else

What about "As said by me, Jerbs, yesterday"?

I think pine is scum, but lets follow what Calc said.

^Shit like this is why Jerbs should be lynched. Also, look how he's using any means he can to avoid voting Pine while still having a scumread on him.

Very minimal content - Only ever talks about Pine. Even unvotes Pine in the post immediately following his most substantial one - which was a case saying Pine was scum. Also, it seems the only player he's ever even spoken of was Pine. He backs off of Pine only because Calcifer says Pine is Town, and then when Day 2 comes just votes Pine again. The inconsistency and the very small activity combine to from a scum read.

Jerbs hasn't said anything worth value in this whole game, which is a lot like several other players here.

Then again:

Last visited: Mon Mar 21, 2011 6:22 pm

An explanation, in a big damn hurry, would be appropriate, Jerbs. At that time, there were four votes on you, and not a peep?

Vote: Pine

As said by everyone else

Can people not see how scummy this guy is?

Rationale for Jerbs would be awesome.

Seriously? Are you his buddy?

THIS IS JERBS:

I'm a VT

~Pie

[TwoHeadedBoy]

In other news, I need to confer with Fugi. Will post stuff later.

~Pie

[TwoHeadedBoy]

UNVOTE:
VOTE: Jerbs

~Fugi

[TwoHeadedBoy]

~Pie

[TwoHeadedBoy]

Well, that's hammer, I guess. Short consultation.

You're implying we consulted... hence "Nevermind".

~Pie

[TwoHeadedBoy]

Vote: Pine

That's not moving. See you in 72 hours.

~Pie

[TwoHeadedBoy]

Oh hey! THB's going for two mislynches in a row!

Just one head. I still don't endorse this vote.

Don't much care for the Wraith wagon either, for what it's worth.

When I have time this weekend I'm going to look at the two lynch wagons (and maybe some other wagons but mostly the lynch ones since we know the alignment of the lynchee) and find some scum.

~Fugi

[TwoHeadedBoy]

The other thing, I would like Fugi to explain WHY IN THE HECK he hammered after day had been open for just over 48 hours!! I cannot see why this hammer makes any sense from a town perspective. Until I get that explanation (and probably after), I will
VOTE: TwoHeaded

¯\(°_o)/¯

He seemed pretty conclusively scum and everyone else was dancing around the hammer when he clearly wasn't going to say anything. I'm mean his fucking post said "I'm a VT." No need to drag things out. Also, it pissed Pie off because he told me I couldn't vote that day. You can get your answers today, no need to throw a fit, your vote on us seems like a massive overreaction IMVHO - you still got your mini wall in and he was going to get lynched anyway. I'm keeping an eye on you for that vote, by the way. Call it an OMGUS if you want, but I rarely see votes on Day 3 with so few reasons and such poor reasoning as this. Your suspicion feels forced and feigned.

~Fugi

P.S. You can abbreviate our name THB (The Hammer Bros.) if you want, it's a lot shorter than TwoHeaded. 2HB is cool too.

[TwoHeadedBoy]

silverbullet: If you don't assume there is at least one protective role in a large game then you're doing it wrong.

C-Worl: I don't think there's any need for overly complicated theories.

Everyone: There IS a protective role (probably more than one) in this game and they would have been on diddin last night. End of story. Case closed. Now stop discussing this, it's distracting from scum hunting.

~Fugi

[TwoHeadedBoy]

I changed my mind. EPM dies tomorrow.

Guess who died last night!

FoS EPM

~Fugi

[TwoHeadedBoy]

This head will make that long-awaited catchup post (including more reasons for Pinescum) tomorrow on his day off.

In the meantime, Fugi can move our vote if he absolutely wishes to, but I'm moving it back to Pine after I make my case, unless I'm convinced otherwise (which at this point is doubtful).

I have a lot of reading to do.

~Pie

[TwoHeadedBoy]

UGH.

I have to catch up on

this

game now. I just wanna play WoW, dammit! *goes to read, content within an hour or two*

~Pie

[TwoHeadedBoy]

In all fairness to THB, I was getting ready to hammer too.

Of course you were.

Vote: Pine

He
s highly condescending and hypocritical. Also, so many people have claimed him to be town that I generally want to lynch him just to see how he flips.

Oh my God, I think Pine is scum too but this is TERRIBLE REASONING.

Unvote, Vote: C-Worl

.

Still want a Pinelynch, but this is alright too. I've realized I might be starting to get a little tunnel-visioned too, which is also affecting my read on Pine... I'm gonna need to look over some of Pine's D2 posts later. But this looks like scum trying to get an easy bus in. Do not like, at all.

Unvote

Honestly, he's probably not scum (as much as I hate to admit it) his wagon built up quickly day 2, that really only effectively happens when scum are busing it, and that quickly at the beginning of the day indicates that scum were probably busing. Also, if Calcifer is scum I doubt he'd blatantly defend a scum buddy like this. Pine is probably random townie that Calcifer decided to defend for brownie points.

FOS: Calcifer, Hiraki, and Silver

Calcifer for every single post he's made in this thread.

Hiraki for justifying lynches before and after the flips in order to distance.

Silver for lack of content except when pressured which is where he tunneled on the one who applied said pressure.

"I'm gonna HoS but not vote because I'm waiting to see which wagon builds first." - is what this looks like to me. Yeah, I'm alright with moving my vote off Pine for now.

skimskimskim nothing else of value, I'm gonna go catch up on another game and go play WoW now. :D

BTW, I haven't really looked at either Wraith or Rom much this game. Guess I should do that sometime.

~Pie

[TwoHeadedBoy]

Oh my God, I think Pine is scum too but this is TERRIBLE REASONING.

Unvote, Vote: C-Worl

.

~Pie

Good Pie, you're finally catching on. Didn't even have to yell at your via IRC for you to finally see the light.

C-Worl is an exceptional lynch, I've rarely seen this much flailing in a game. Coupled with the reasons I left at the end of Day 1 (I think) and a noose around that boy's neck is just what's needed.

I lean toward believing Wraith claim. Then again, I didn't like the wagon on him to begin with.

Sorry that I haven't gotten those wagon analysis up yet, real life issues and what not. I wouldn't be in this game if I weren't part of a hydra, so apologies about Pie doing most of the work. I'll have them up eventually, hopefully tonight, and then I'll try to keep up and stay more active. At the moment just know that I agree with Pie's actions against C-Worl and still disagree with any actions he takes against Pine.

~Fugi

[TwoHeadedBoy]

If you noticed I dropped all my suspicions of Pine. You're ALL full of fail and it saddens me that you're going to give scum an easy win with the way things have been going.

So you're appealing to the reason everyone found you suspicious? What were the reasons you dropped your suspicion?

(Sorry if you said somewhere, I might have missed it.)

~Fugi

[TwoHeadedBoy]

My initials are not freaking EMP. It's EPM. Not that hard.

Hardcore overreaction, bro. Especially with someone named

Emp

king in the game. Not even sure if telling of alignment, just kinda douche-tell. Calm down and post content.

~Fugi

[TwoHeadedBoy]

Just drop it, bro.

~Fugi

[TwoHeadedBoy]

Wraith - I believe the claim. It seems to match up with his play, and to anyone who still thinks he's scum: we're not gonna lynch a claimed protective role today anyways. So let's move on.


C-Worl - I don't like his early claiming at ALL. Screams over-defensive scum, and I'm still suspicious of him from his Pinevote earlier. What I like even less though, is Pine's crazy theory for pushing a C-Worl lynch. Did no one else read that at all?

unvote, Vote: Pine

- back to the tree.


EPM - I don't remember his meta from other games, so I can't use that to make any judgements. But I'm not liking Post 1058. Also:

Calc, have either of you ever played with Pie before?

I don't think I've played with Mastin. But I believe I have played with Nacho in a game or two.


Romanus - I'm not seeing the case on Romanus exactly. And he actually does have good points on silver in Post 866 (ISO 20).


silver - Rom has a point with the whole "oh shit reaction" at the end of the day. This combined with all the fluffposting he's been doing (and I know I've called him out on this at least once) doesn't help.

FoS: Silver

nhammen - Asks a lot of questions. Aside from that, I'm not liking 1041. It just reads... funny. Something to note.


Confid - Parking a vote on Emp, who is not a main focus of the day, with no reasoning behind the vote. Suspicious!

FoS: Confid

No one else has really stood out.

Scum are most likely in the group of C-Worl/Pine/silver/Confid. At least two of those players have to be scum, or my reads just blow. EPM and nhammen are giving me bad vibes, but I don't think I can see them as scum just yet. At least one of Emp/Anti/Hiraki is probably scum as well, if I had to guess.

~Pie

[TwoHeadedBoy]

lastly what "oh shit" reaction... my counterattacks on attacks?

rom was the better way to go me thinks

~3.14

[TwoHeadedBoy]

I can confirm that we're a neighbor with IceyCupcake and (were) with Calcifer.

VOTE: Pine

~Pie

[TwoHeadedBoy]

THB
also why aren't you confirming pine is part of your neighborhood.

Eh, sorry didn't think to or forgot. I'm tired after work but it kind of goes without saying.

~Pie

[TwoHeadedBoy]

Oh, and:

Did you read
Anything
That Nacho or Mastin Wrote?

Give me a fucking better vote. Or explain a DAMN SIGHT better than you chose to in the quicktopic (say, not at all)

I skimmed it, but I still don't believe Pine is town. I tried giving my reads in the QT, but I've been busy, so I just commented on what the apparent gameplan was for today. I've explained in-thread reasons for Pinescum and think that you made a terrible lapse in judgment by recruiting him.

Unvote

until I can talk with Fugi and get his reads.

~Pie

[TwoHeadedBoy]

Let's have Empking claim next.

~Pie

[TwoHeadedBoy]

WTF is that?

You can click the pic, y'know. It's a Vanillite. A Pokemon from the 5th Generation games. AKA I claim Vanilla.

~Pie

[TwoHeadedBoy]

Okay, long awaited VCA that I promised like last week... I think. I focused mainly on the lynch vote totals, but also on anything I found significant. I generally don’t draw attention to Not Voting category because I’ve found through my games that it’s a null tell. If I missed coloring anyone green that’s flipped it’s because I’m a derp.

Spoiler: VCA

Day 1 lynch

Friend (10):

silverbullet999,

AGar, Parama,

Wraith, C-worl, Iceycupcake,

Calcifer,

nhammen, Twoheadedboy, Pine
Pine (4): Empking,

Friend, evilpacman18

, Diddin
Wraith : ConfidAnon
diddin : [winger]
silverbullet999: Hiraki

Assuming 5 scum, there’s 2-3 on this wagon. I’m liking C-Worl and nhammen for scum, most likely. If 3 scum then I like silverbullet third. Empking seems more likely scum as I look at the small Pine wagon.

Note: Safe votes during this period are Hiraki, [winger] (currently Romanus), and Confid.

Day 2 first votal (with votes)

Pine (7) : Diddin (2), Empking,

Parama

, Wraith,

Jerbs, Evilpacman18

Parama (2)

: Pine, Romanus

Calcifer

: Hiraki

1-2 scum are on Pine in this wagon . Diddin is pretty much clear, Wraith seems fairly clear, so I’m willing to bet hard money Empking scum. I won't be entirely surprised if Wraith is scum, because it seems likely that 2 scum were on this quick wagon, but it really depends on if we have any other protective roles claimed. 4 more claims will tell.

Also note Hiraki with the safe vote again on confirmed town.

Day 2 lynch votal

Pine (3) : Wraith,

Jerbs, Evilpacman18

Jerbs (9): Calcifer, Parama

, Hiraki, Diddin (2), ConfidAnon, Empking, C-worl, TwoHeadedBoy
Wraith : Pine

Evilpacman18

: IceyCupcake
Romanus: Silverbullet999
Silverbullet999: Romanus

1-3 scum probably exist on the Jerbs wagon. Hiraki, Confid, Emp, and C-Worl are like my top suspects (nh is the only suspect omitted from that list) so I’m just going to give all 4 a little scumpoint for that wagon. I literally cannot decide if Wraith’s placement screams scum or town to me (leaning town), but I feel like it’s significant. Overall null, but I’m really interested in a Pine or Wraith flip based on that position alone. Again, I want to wait for claims. If we don't have any other protective role claims then I'll pretty much confirm Wraith as town to myself.

Safe vote awards go to Pine, IceyCupcake, Silverbullet, and Romanus.

Day 3 lynch votals

Wraith (2): ConfidAnon,

Evilpacman18

Pine (2): Empking, TwoHeadedBoy
Romanus(2): Wraith
EmpKing: ConfidAnon

Evilpacman18 (8): silverbullet999, Diddin (2), nhammen,

Calcifer

, IceyCupcake, Pine, C-worl

This vote total is of great interest to me. 100% certain there’s at least 2 scum on that epm wagon. Silver, nhammen, C-Worl would be my best guesses at the scum.

Wraith and Confid also get this VC’s safe vote award! YAY!

With that all said my top suspects on the basis of this VCA exercise (that was probably more for my benefit that anyone who actually reads this) is Romanus, Empking, Confid, silverbullet, C-Worl, nhammen – in about that order. I left a lot of the “confirmed” town and my heavy town reads out of the VCA. For the most part I assumed diddin was town, and gave IceyCupcake, and Pine heavy town reads. Wraith was an interesting addition because I feel like his claim screams town, but on VCA alone he's scummy as shit.

I’m totally fine with a Romanus lynch, BUT I’m 95.7% sure that Empking is scum based on the VCA and his posting. This wagon in particular:
Pine (7) : Diddin (2), Empking,

Parama

, Wraith,

Jerbs, Evilpacman18

His votes on Pine day 1 and Jerbs day 2 don't lend me to anything but a scum read either. His vote on Pine Day 3 looks a lot like playing it safe after being on two town lynches (and yes, I realize the irony of that being that we're voting exactly the same, which means if he flips town we must be scum and you can lynch my ass up because that's the scummiest series of votes ever now that I look at it).

I didn’t do any Day 4 because I saw no point when looking at the vote totals.

Vote: Empking

I’m positive this will be a scum lynch.

~Fugi

[TwoHeadedBoy]

Yep, 95.7% positive. (It's not based solely off that single wagon.)

~Fugi

[TwoHeadedBoy]

Not-Fugi: Are you positive that the logic that proves you to be scum is unshakable?

I can see where Fugi's coming from, and how we look scummy by the same logic he's using on you. We discussed some of the points he made in IRC before he posted and I have no problems with his choice of vote. He's using sound logic. Whether Pine is scum or town, there's most likely scum on that seven-vote wagon. So barring scum doublevoter or Wraithscum... that leaves you. C-Worl actually has a point.

~Pie

[TwoHeadedBoy]

How about we just don't lynch at all until the replacement comes in. kthx.

~Fugi

[TwoHeadedBoy]

Who else is unclaimed. I'd say anyone left can claim just so we have more to work with.

Be patient. We have about 11 days until deadline. Let's keep going in order.

Vote: THB

- If Pie is posiotive he's scum then there's not much to talk about.

You're an idiot. And nice OMGUS, bro.

~Fugi

[TwoHeadedBoy]

Pine needs to buddy up to us more IMO. If he keeps defending us like crazy maybe I'll stop thinking he's scum.

Anyhow, I can kind of see where Emp is coming from (being that we did point out we can be seen as scummy by VCA in a semi-neutral POV), but... no. Fugi also mentioned that Wraith looks scummy as hell from VCA, but he is an unCCed protective role, and unless someone claims another prot role, he's most likely town. I don't see the logic in "pointing out that someone being scummy by VCA but are most likely town is scummy". [I can't think of a better way to word that. x_x]

Like Fugi pointed out, this looks like blatant OMGUS (or at least a scummy countervote) and an easy way for Emp to try and force a wagon on to those making a good case against him.

What the hell are you talking about, Emp? You're really starting to shake my town read.

If you bus him now I'll give you townpoints.

THB: Have you ruled out Romanus from contention of being scum?

From a look at the last three lynch votals, Rom/[winger has parked his vote off the main bandwagons the first two days, and apparently wasn't voting for anyone D3. So yeah, I think he's pretty scummy.

If you want Fugi's opinion, he did kinda say that Rom was his second top suspect.

So no, we haven't ruled out that possibility at all.

~Pie

[TwoHeadedBoy]

Emp: No, I'm positive you're scum for doing some of the things we've done PLUS some other things we haven't done. You seem to be so focused on the fact that we're finding you scummy for something we've also done that you're ignoring the scummy things that you've done that we haven't.

Pine: It's not, Pie just holds an unhealthy grudge against you that I can't seem to break him of. Zeus knows he's gone on in IRC about it far more than I'd like to hear.

~Fugi

[TwoHeadedBoy]

Emp: No, I'm positive you're scum for doing some of the things we've done PLUS some other things we haven't done. You seem to be so focused on the fact that we're finding you scummy for something we've also done that you're ignoring the scummy things that you've done that we haven't.

Like being second on a Pine wagon. Oh waitb that can't be it. What scummy thing did I do and not you?

Why did you answer your own question and then dismiss it as though that wasn't it?

Clever (if it worked), but I'm not going to let you slide that easy.

If you want reasons other than that Pine vote with the 6 person wagon then I also don't like the safe"ish" Pine vote Day 1, and that has nothing to do with us. Your play style in general factors into the vote and that has no relation to the VCA. You're unhelpful and not vocal until you have suspicion and then you're overly aggressive and OMGUSy. Definitely a common scum play-style I've noticed over a lot of games.

~Fugi

[TwoHeadedBoy]

aaaaaaaaaaaaand Pine is the winner of this set. (by a pretty lofty margin too if I do say so myself)

diddin brought up no valid points and if he weren't practically cleared as town I'd find his soft defense of Hiraki rather suspicious. It's not WIFOM to infer that a scummy action, like active lurking, could mean someone is scum, bro. The example you gave of WIFOM was WIFOM, but that wasn't even remotely similar to what Pine had said. I'm stepping in to call a winner because I'm 82.6% sure that this is town v. town and nothing even resembling productive discussion/argument has come of it.

Also, C-Worl got called out big time.

~Fugi

[TwoHeadedBoy]

~Pie

[TwoHeadedBoy]

Hey guys, I'm bored. I talked to two people about replacing in but they both didn't want to get into a 53 page game. Have a mafia related image for future use while we wait:



And while I'm sharing shit everyone should read this.

[TwoHeadedBoy]

Technically a fallacy? More like definitely a fallacy. I've never found lurking to be anything but a null-tell.

Now active lurking is a different story.

~Fugi

[TwoHeadedBoy]

Pfft. I'm MORE active when scum.

That said, I'm the top poster, so...yeah. Whatever that does or does not mean.

~Pie

[TwoHeadedBoy]

Mmm, good point. I took lurking to simply mean posting infrequently. What you described with nhammen seems to be a form of what I'd call active lurking. Just different definitions for the same thing, I suppose.

~Fugi

[TwoHeadedBoy]

What's the downside of a cop claiming to save a townie? The scum kill the cop.

What's the downside of a hider claiming to save a townie? The scum might shoot into scummy mislynches hoping to hit the hider?

LAWL

What's the downside of making up a fake claim where you never have to explain not being NKed as a power role, can confirm buddies town in LyLo, and convienently having one living target that's a totally explicable night kill?

NONE

To be fair, isn't that last point kinda circular reasoning? Regardless, Anti is so obvscum it hurts.

Unvote, Vote: Anti

Pine also claimed scum in-thread like I pointed out but it seems I'm beating a dead horse, so.

If it's cool with the mod, I can PM a few people I know to see if they wanna replace in so we can get our massclaim over with.

~Pie

[TwoHeadedBoy]

He did explain it, pine. I'm beginning to see pine scum a bit more. This is a really inopportune time to soft defend your buddy if you're scum, bro. That claim pretty much confirms him as scum.

~Fugi

[TwoHeadedBoy]

I agree that lynching anti based on the fact that he's failtown is stupid as fuck, even if he deserves it. Our vote is NOT under the premise that he's town that failed, our vote is on anti because he's scum. Grey's motivations for the vote feel a bit sketchy, but I don't think looking into it that much is worthwhile because his claim and actions still read super town to me.

~Fugi

[TwoHeadedBoy]

You know, it's easier to remember you're a hydra when your hydra buddy does more than post once a week in the QT.

Irc or some form of live chat (even texting) is where it's at, bro.

[TwoHeadedBoy]

I believe that's L-2. I'm personally okay with an Anti hammer without anything else from him, especially as it seems unlikely he would even post again within a few days, but I also wouldn't mind a defense or a scumlist to use for information purposes from him. Up to the non-voters, I won't be taking our vote off Anti til he's hanged in all likelihood.

~Fugi

[TwoHeadedBoy]

I'm okay with an Antihammer (insert joke here) as well, but we also have a massclaim to finish. And a week and two days till deadline.

~Pie

PEdit: ninja'd

[TwoHeadedBoy]

I like to WIFOM scum lists >:| It's not useless no matter what says. He won't just list buddies as town and town as scum.

I'm gonna talk to a few more people too to try to fill the two slots. Hopefully I can find someone. Most seem to really be turned off by 56 pages. :-/

~Fugi

[TwoHeadedBoy]

I've asked a grand total of 24 people if they were interested in replacing in. Let's see if we get someone.

~Pie

[TwoHeadedBoy]

I wanna take a second to break this down.

Ugh, well that blew up in my face, for some...reason.

"Ugh, I got caught"

Alright, I'll come clean. I'm a cop. I investigated Jerbs, EPM, and TBH and got innos on all of them (wasn't expecting them, though). I investigated TBH because of the less than great looking hammer and Jerbs and EPM because I thought they were scum and I would get a guilty and I could feel good about pushing their lynch the next day.

Why would you investigate us of all people? Surely if you're looking for scum you would have investigated Romanus or Empking or someone. The "hammer" reason seems forced and the reasons given for Jerbs and EPM (still both conveniently dead) are just kinda thrown out there without thought. Regardless, thanks for confirming us town.

I lied and claimed hider because a) I wanted to avoid the RB and b) to avoid the NK and c) to protect what looks like the most powerful role here. Guess it's not going to matter now that Grey has completely clung to this lynch (for some odd reason) and everyone is going "herp-derp" and following.

Everyone: Note reason b and reason c are exactly the same. He pretty much just reworded it to try to force out more reasons for a fake claim than there really were. To me, this is the most damning piece of evidence that he's actually scum who changed his claim, there's no reason for town to force fluff out for why they did something.

------------

Anti: No one is "herp-derp"ing with Grey and mindlessly bandwagoning, it's all for the same reason and you know very well what that reason is.

Question time:
1) Why would you need to claim hider if you can know with like 95% certainty that there is a protective role out there? Be it Wraith or someone unclaimed. The only dead members are VTs, so I'm not following this "I need to protect myself" logic at all.

2) Can I have a scum list?

The only way I read this post is "Oh shit I got caught time to try something different."

~Fugi

[TwoHeadedBoy]

I'd be willing to bet he's mixing up games (again).

[TwoHeadedBoy]

EBWOP: If a post isn't signed it's likely Fugi, for what it's worth. Pie's freakishly good at remembering, even in quick little posts.

~Fugi

[TwoHeadedBoy]

EBWOP: If a post isn't signed it's likely Fugi, for what it's worth. Pie's freakishly good at remembering, even in quick little posts.

~Fugi

Yep.

~Pie

[TwoHeadedBoy]

Oh, and I agree with Fugi for once. It's funny how once Grey (assuming) points out what "optimal" hider play is (which is basically claiming cop), Anti changes his claim to... cop.

Wow.

Lynch all liars? Lynch all liars.

~Pie

[TwoHeadedBoy]

Oh, and I agree with Fugi for once.

~Pie

We agreed on Emp too, dickface.

~Fugi

[TwoHeadedBoy]

Oh, and I agree with Fugi for once.

~Pie

We agreed on Emp too, dickface.

~Fugi

Fuck your mother with a rake. :D

---

Let me clarify on my stance on LaL.

I can understand lying in certain situations, like PGO as Vengeful Townie (*twitch*, *twitch* >:|) or Doc/Cop as Bulletproof, or... you get the idea. But it's the timing and context here that makes me think Anti is Scummy McScummerson. Especially given the whole lack of defending the innos thing Grey pointed out earlier.

~Pie

[TwoHeadedBoy]

~Fugi

[TwoHeadedBoy]

~Pie

[TwoHeadedBoy]

~Fugi

[TwoHeadedBoy]

C-C-C-C-COMBO BREAKER

(we're totally getting modkilled for threadspam)

~Pie

[TwoHeadedBoy]

YOU ONLY HAD TO DO ONE MORE IMAGE TO COMPLETE THE CYCLE

GOD I HATE YOU SOMETIMES.

~FURIOTIVE

[TwoHeadedBoy]

inb4diddin hammers to spite Wraith

~Fugi

[TwoHeadedBoy]

Speaking of leaving it at L-2, does anyone still have suspicions of diddin at this point?

Just curious because I coulda sworn at least one of you thought he might be doublevoting scum. Too lazy to look up the posts though.

~Pie

PEdit: Yeah Fugi basically beat me to the point I was gonna imply.

[TwoHeadedBoy]

Speaking of leaving it at L-2, does anyone still have suspicions of diddin at this point?

Just curious because I coulda sworn at least one of you thought he might be doublevoting scum. Too lazy to look up the posts though.

~Pie

PEdit: Yeah Fugi basically beat me to the point I was gonna imply.

I'm suspicious of him.

[TwoHeadedBoy]

EBWOP:

~Pie

(of course I forget right after Fugi points it out)

[TwoHeadedBoy]

Translation: He's shocked and confused by the fact that you find diddin suspicious because diddin is more than likely town.

I, personally, understand the suspicion, though it's a little unwarranted because with proof of his role being what it is diddin is almost guaranteed town, even if he's super scummy acting.

~Fugi

[TwoHeadedBoy]

I'm saying your actions and posts read fairly scummy and if it weren't for your claim I think at this point in time I'd be highly suspicious of you. I'm not saying I am suspicious though.

~Fugi

[TwoHeadedBoy]

Let's sing a tune or something

♪

TWOOOO HEEEAAAAADEDDD BOOOOOOY

ALLLL FLOOOOOAAATING IN GLAAAAAAAASSSSSS

THE SUUUN IT IS PAST

NOW IT'S BLAAACKER THAN BLACK

I CAN HEAR YOU AS YOU TAAAP ON YOUR JAAAAAAAAAAR

♪

~Fugi

[TwoHeadedBoy]

DAMMIT SILVER

[TwoHeadedBoy]

Let's do something productive while we wait.



~Fugi

P.S. (not Friday in my timezone anymore so no dice there. )

[TwoHeadedBoy]

Let's do something productive while we wait.

Force of Static Friction = μs x Force Normal

Force Normal = Mass x g; g= 9.8 m/s2

Force of Static Friction Front = .5 x 9.8 m/s2 x 50kg (40kg + 10kg) = 245 N

Force of Static Friction Back = .7 x 9.8 m/s2 x 40kg = 274.4 N

The Back Seat.

~Pie

[TwoHeadedBoy]

Or you could just:

5x5 < 4x7

~Fugi

[TwoHeadedBoy]

Let S be a (possibly infinite) subset of a vector space V. Prove that S is linearly dependent if and only if there is a vector v contained in S such that span (S - {v}) = span(S).

~Pie

[TwoHeadedBoy]

I'm an English major. Fuck everything about that.

~Fugi

[TwoHeadedBoy]

Is your spoon sad that your cake is gone now, silver?

~Fugi

[TwoHeadedBoy]

Spoiler:

~Pie

[TwoHeadedBoy]

OKay, we're getting sidetracked. Let's get back to business.

Grey: 1/3 + 1/3 + 1/3 = 1, correct?

[TwoHeadedBoy]

~Fugi

[TwoHeadedBoy]

What the fux happened

We're bored because we need 2 more players.

~Fugi

[TwoHeadedBoy]

Slaxx, I asked 24 people for Cthulu's sake.

You'd think, law of averages...


Thanks for blowing my mind, Grey. There is most likely a fallacy in there somewhere but I'm too tired to look for it.

~Pie

[TwoHeadedBoy]

Thanks for blowing my mind, Grey. There is most likely a fallacy in there somewhere but I'm too tired to look for it.

~Pie

Divide both sides by (a^2 - ab)

a^2 - ab = 0

dividing by 0 fallacy.

You're welcome Pie.

----------

zdenek: Hi, thanks for replacing in! We played together once before in mini normal if memory serves.

C-Worl: Anti's claim is cop atm.

~Fugi

[TwoHeadedBoy]

Hi Hoppster, thanks for replacing in!

Claim please. You're last in our massclaim.

~Fugi

[TwoHeadedBoy]

I'm still convinced someone is hiding a PR. This town is just so weak with just those three roles it's not even funny.

But whatever. I think the scumteam is:

Antihero
EmpKing
Romnus/Zdenek
Someone else

Nhammen is a plausible choice for the fourth scum, at least for now, but my scumread on him is tenuous at best.

I'd go with Hiraki over nhammen if I had to pick a fourth, but I wouldn't rule out the possibility of nh being scum either. nh's posts rub me the wrong way, where Hiraki is just... I don't even know how to describe his posts. I'm kinda flip-flopping read-wise on both of them to be honest.

Interested in hearing from our replacements. After they speak their peace, it's hammertime.

~Pie

[TwoHeadedBoy]

^Agreed. But replace Hiraki with Romanus/Zdenek and keep nhammen as the fourth.

You realize that I also want you dead. I just figured since it's so obvious I think you're scum that it'd be beating a dead horse to mention it again.

Now to re-think my reads about Hiraki/nh.

~Pie

[TwoHeadedBoy]

Pine: You are all he talks about in IRC...

Hiraki: He doesn't mention you much.

/me runs

~Fugi

[TwoHeadedBoy]

SLAXX I WILL GIVE YOU SEXUAL FAVORS IN RETURN FOR VIG SHOTS

LOTS OF VIG SHOTS

CAN I SHOOT MY OTHER HEAD TOO PLZ

~Pie

[TwoHeadedBoy]

That's just like you to overreact, Pie. Always dragging our problems into public. Have fun on the couch tonight.

~Fugi

[TwoHeadedBoy]

I would find it hilarious if you were actually Devin.

~Fugi

[TwoHeadedBoy]

VOTE: Empking

Continuation of my reasons from yesterday. Let's just lynch scum already.

~Fugi

[TwoHeadedBoy]

I'm not joining yet. I want more content.

Noted for later analysis.

What content do you think can possibly come out of this day being longer without a single dead scum?

~Fugi

[TwoHeadedBoy]

@Hiraki: You should probably pose questions to silver or something then because I see nothing for him to respond to, atm.

Kinda forgot about Zdenek and Hoppster though, good call there. Replacements need to give some thread analysis.

~Fugi

PEdit:
@C-Worl: You're seriously doubting the existence of the neighbor QT? I link this way too much.

We're going after Emp because he's scum. I know it looks sudden, but we discussed this at length in the Neighbor QT. Not to mention if you look back just a single day I give numerous reasons for my vote on him.

[TwoHeadedBoy]

You were almost neighborized, Hiraki, but in the end it was decided you were too scummy.

~Fugi

P.S. nice questions

[TwoHeadedBoy]

C-Worl: From what I've witnessed consistent reads is more of a scum tell. Town have more malleable reads because they're actually real. That's not convincing me of anything.

Hiraki: We're a half scum half town hydra. You have to figure out which head is which.

~Fugi

[TwoHeadedBoy]

Then you have to figure out how to kill one head.

~Fugi

[TwoHeadedBoy]

OH SHIT GUYS

C-WORL GOT US

THE ENTIRE SCUMTEAM DECIDED TO CLAIM NEIGHBORIZER+NEIGHBORHOOD

BECAUSE THAT'S AN INCREDIBLY SMART AND SAFE THING FOR SCUM TO DO

~Pie

PEDIT: OH SHIT HIRAKI'S ONTO US TOO. DAMMIT FUGI, YOU JUST HAD TO BE OBVSCUM DIDN'T YOU

PEDIT: FUCKING FUGI YOU'RE RUINING MY SARCASM

PEDIT: STOP POSTING, WHORE

[TwoHeadedBoy]

Reasons that by reading his ISO don't really stand out. He's been consistent in his thoughts that Pine is scum which means he probably thinks that Pine is scum. His ISO doesn't look scummy to me. And a quick lynch when we've lynched 4 townies in a row isn't a good thing under any circumstances. WHAT IF YOU'RE WRONG? I obviously think you are but you need to ask yourself that question. WHAT IF YOU'RE WRONG? At least give everyone time to post today, restate your case, and let him try to defend himself. Don't just speed it through or you run a serious risk of a fifth mislynch which could very well be a scum win.

PS: Emp, failing to accurately defend yourself like you did in your last post is not a TOWN move. At this point, if you're town, then you know you're town, then you know your lynch would be bad for town. YOU NEED TO DEFEND YOURSELF IF YOU'RE TOWN.

This is such a horrible defense, it's then added with a Post Script. I guess Fugi started that trend too. Anyway, the P.S. isn't even needed because it's pretty obvious that you're not working toward your wincon if you don't defend. Have you seen good scum that hasn't defended? I didn't think so.

Btw, the first paragraph contains all pronouns except for Pine is currently unreadable. Whoops. Of course Pine is in there, but you're obv. not talking about Pine.

Btw, you've still convinced no one to vote Pine. YOU REALIZE THAT IF YOU THINK PINE IS SCUM, YOU MUST CONVINCE US WHY, RIGHT?

Preview Edit;

Pie is a Templar, so he's always scum. This game is over.

Preview Edit 2:

See? Pie is already scumclaiming.

Does anyone else find this post entirely incomprehensible? Can I get a translator?

~Fugi

[TwoHeadedBoy]

ALSO C-WORL'S PINE VOTE GIVES ME COMFORT

BECAUSE IF

HE

THINKS PINE IS SCUM

THEN I

MUST

BE INSANE WHEN IT COMES TO THAT READ

JUST LIKE I SAID IN THE

NEIGHBORHOOD

SCUM QT YESTERDAY


Hiraki: This head is leaning VI-read on C-Worl.

~Pie

[TwoHeadedBoy]

Leaning VI as well, but only slightly. He's on my 5 person scum team, didn't quite make the cut for the 4 person list.

IT SHOWS HOW USELESS C-WHORL'S POST IS. DOES THAT HELP? (y/n)

y

~Fugi

PEdit: I don't see a quicklynch, C-Worl.

We just use the game thread to discuss endgame.

[TwoHeadedBoy]

I was looking forward to picking his brain.

Pick it in thread.

~Fugi

[TwoHeadedBoy]

Wraith: Who did you protect and why?

~Fugi

[TwoHeadedBoy]

what's the difference between lynching one now and later?

We have probably 1, maybe 0 (unlikely though) mislynches left, so I'd rather lynch the people I'm more certain are scum. I'm CERTAIN Emp is scum, less certain on Z even though I'm still pretty sure, therefore Emp first. That's why it matters.

~Fugi

PEdit: Yeah Pine, scum is gonna kill our suspect for us if he's town so we can avoid a mislynch. Duh! Why can't you just follow Wraith's flawless logic?

[TwoHeadedBoy]

THB you've been on three town wagons... you even admit that there's probably 1 mislynch we have left so worse case the next day we lynch emp if rom somehow does not flip scum.

I don't understand the relevance of your first statement in relation to your post, but I can address the rest. Just because we have a mislynch left doesn't mean I want to use it. I like to stay as far away from worst case scenarios as possible. I'd rather just 4-5 consecutive scum lynches in a row, k? K. We start with Emp. He'll flip scum and then I want to judge reactions, positions on his wagon, and his relationships with others. I'll still probably think Zdenek is scum after, but I want to go with my certain scum today - and I'm not alone in that though.

Sidenote: Going to concur with Pine that you should start calling him Zdenek now too so we can avoid confusion. Just refer to Romanus when it's something Rom did.

Can someone verify emp's claim?

It's VT. Just remember everyone claimed VT minus Anti, Grey, diddin, and Wraith.

~Fugi

[TwoHeadedBoy]

At the least post a case on emp

Look back one day.

~Fugi

[TwoHeadedBoy]

At the least post a case on emp

Look back one day.

~Fugi

Isn't your main reason for voting me because he don't like having a list of seven green names?

No.

~Fugi

[TwoHeadedBoy]

My top reason, I suppose if I had to pick one, would be the entirety of your voting history, notably in its relation to the voted player and the others on the wagons you've been a part of.

~Fugi

[TwoHeadedBoy]

Added comments and fixed your list for you. Overall I agree with the names on it, but not most of the reasons or the order. Also took myself out because giving reads on yourself is stupid.

*glares at Pine* ಠ_ಠ

Town (in order of descending certainty)

Wraith (Possibly brilliant fakeclaim -

No. The only possible way he's scum is if this is bastard modded (which shouldn't occur in normal games) and there is no protective role or is someone is being a total fucking moron and not CCing him.

)

Icey (Confirmed -

Not confirmed but very very very very very unlikely scum based on actions and role (which is confirmed)

)

Silver (I'm pretty damn confident)

Pine (

lolnot

Confirmed -

but still very probably town based on VCA, reads, and actions

)

Slight fix to your scum list too:

Empking
Zdenek
Nhammen
Hiraki
Hoppster
C-Worl

@silver - Still hate you. It's Wednesday.

~Fugi

[TwoHeadedBoy]

Jesus fuck it's Thursday, I fail.

~Fugi

[TwoHeadedBoy]

My other head has the wrong definition of "bastard mod", because it's completely possible that a game has zero protective roles. Bastard modding is lying to the players, and in a closed setup, no protective roles isn't "lying".

So Pine's just trying to cast suspicion on Wraith for no good NO YOU'RE INSANE WHEN IT COMES TO THAT READ PINE HAS TO BE TOWN DAMMIT STOP

...

Slaxx is obvscum?

~Pie

[TwoHeadedBoy]

The fact that you think I magically arrived at the conclusion that you're scum even though I've listed numerous reasons and detailed why assures me that you're scum.

See you post game, Emp.

~Fugi

[TwoHeadedBoy]

Wraith, he was saying those people said those things. >_>

~Fugi

[TwoHeadedBoy]

~Pies

[TwoHeadedBoy]

Oh, and silver, you know the Neighbor QT is closed during the day, right?

Just a heads-up.

~Pies

[TwoHeadedBoy]

thb if you weren't "confirmed" town (which I'm going to assume is true and you aren't a godfather) I would kick your ass..

~Pies

[TwoHeadedBoy]

[18:12:19] <+TL|> hey pie and fugi
[18:12:25] <+TL|> I need your opinion on a scumtell
[18:12:27] <@Fugitive> hey TL|
[18:12:30] <@Fugitive> shoot
[18:12:35] <+TL|> and dango if he posts
[18:12:39] <+TL|> wifom
[18:12:40] <+TL|> ie stuff like
[18:12:49] <+TL|> "If I was scum..." and stuff similar to that
[18:12:59] <+TL|> I caught like a few scum with it before but I'm wondering if it's reliable
[18:13:01] <@Dango> it's scummy.
[18:13:07] <+InflatablePie> vote: dango
[18:13:11] <+InflatablePie> also, nulltell
[18:13:19] <+TL|> vengekill: InflatablePie
[18:13:20] <+InflatablePie> depends on context and tone, but usually null.
[18:13:21] <@Dango> it's always scummy
[18:13:23] <@Fugitive> it's scummy, I agree

--2 hours and 19 minutes later--

If I were scum they might believe you but because I'm town they don't want to mislynch in LyLo.

---

Anyway, I don't like Hopp and C-Worl's reactions to silver telling them to unvote and them just obeying. To me that establishes silver as more likely town and at least one or both of them as scum. That kind of obidience it absurd for someone who's not even clear. And to think my two lynch candidates before even 20 posts in this day were only nhammen and Zdenek. I can tell this is going to be a long day.

~Fugi

[TwoHeadedBoy]

-THB
expand on why you dislike Hopp's reaction.

Anyway, I don't like Hopp and C-Worl's reactions to silver telling them to unvote and

them just obeying.

To me that establishes silver as more likely town and at least one or both of them as scum.

That kind of obidience it absurd for someone who's not even clear.

Seriously? I thought it was pretty damn clear. But I'll refrain from pointing out the obvious, for fear of offending Your Majesty.

~Fugi

[TwoHeadedBoy]

Damn it thb and zded, respond already

I posted 1 hour and 12 minutes after my prior post. Don't expect me to be here any more frequently than that. I'm getting a little annoyed at the aggressive nature and constant urgency. What happened to the fun-loving joking silver just yesterday?

---

PEdit: Expand on what exactly? He obeyed and unvoted when Z was no where near getting hammered. It doesn't matter what he said, the actions matter (they speak louder than words, y'know?). It didn't strike me as a town reaction and neither did C-Worl's. I cannot possibly be more clear than that. Now chill dude, we have like 2 weeks until we have to lynch someone, you don't have to post every 5 minutes and get every shred of information in one real day's time.

~Fugi

[TwoHeadedBoy]

Silver's turned crazier than a bag of cats.

I agree.

~Pies

[TwoHeadedBoy]

I agree entirely with your post, C-Worl, if you just add C-Worl to that scum list. You were my fifth neutral read before the day started but that caving to silver immediately doesn't feel right. There's really not much to comment on besides that.

~Fugi

[TwoHeadedBoy]

so we're gonna ignore my post for some fluff?

We took a melatonin tablet and can't concentrate for more than 15 minutes at this point.

So there'll be a post tomorrow from this head.

These heads, you mean?

...good question. And if anyone's annoyed by the orange/purple...

Deal with it or suggest replacement colors.

PEdit: Silver asking for patience?

After how he's been acting today?

Funny.

~Pies

[TwoHeadedBoy]

I'm saying I'm about equally suspicious of everyone on your list if you add yourself. I'm not saying there is 5 scum when there's very probably not. (the only way there'd be 5 scum is if we had some kid of unclaimed dayvig or something so I'm very near 100% there's 4. I don't know why I'm rambling about this.)

[TwoHeadedBoy]

^ Fugi or Pie?

Sorry, Fugi. Pie's doing that weird schizo color thing so all regular text is me at this moment. He also forgets to sign less than I do so if it's not signed it's likely me.

@Silver - I believe it's his torn read on Pine. His gut is telling him scum but his mind is telling him town. I think he just exploded with all the frustration surrounding no scum deaths. It's more elaborate in the NQT once you get a chance to read that.

~Fugi

[TwoHeadedBoy]

-Pie
What made you crack and go ummm what's that disorder called? I'll just say why are you acting like schmeagal all of a sudden?

Schizophrenia?

Yeah, that's it. And I think he means Smeagol.

Nice LotR reference. I only saw the first movie and some parts of the second.

Did you read the books?

Did you?

I... er, right.

Pine and Fugi are both right.

At least I realize I'm crazy though.

And hey, is it still schizophrenia if there's only one alternate personality?

You know, I'm not sure.

...

...

What?

~Pies

[TwoHeadedBoy]

Schizophrenia =/= Multiple Personality Disorder.

Schizophrenia = voices

Make up your mind, Pie(s).

~Fugi

[TwoHeadedBoy]

Close enough. Anyways, I'm really starting to like the Zdenek wagon. Rom never exactly read townie to me (not that I can remember anyhow), and between Zd's apparent contradiction and seemingly forced "With two votes on me, town's loss is inevitable" AtE, I'd be okay with jumping on if Fugi is.

Piegut is never wrong. Ever. Pine is scum. Fuck C-Worl's read on him, fuck Grey/Fugi/Calcifer, PINE IS SCUMMY SCUM AND I CAN'T EXPLAIN WHY BUT HE IS.

Hmm. nhammen is most likely scum as well. His posts just come off as forced and half his questions don't seem to have a follow-up. But like we've said in our QT, it shouldn't matter which of the two we lynch first - nh or Zd. nhammen refrains from voting Zd despite how scummy he finds him... scum waiting to bus his buddy? I understand it's LYLO, yeah, but the way he explains himself seems... forced.

Well, if he's bussing his buddy, we can lynch Zdenek. Anyways, who's the fourth? C-Worl/Hiraki/Hopp?

Most likely... Hopp. C-Worl's reading as VI more than scum for me still.

So, Zdenek/nhammen/Pine/Hopp?

Yep. Except replace Pine with Hiraki. Your gut is wrong.

Agreed.

*sadface*

6. Hoppster - Zd/???/???/???
8. TwoHeadedBoy - Zdenek/nhammen/[Hopp or C-Worl]/Hiraki? (Fugi) + Zdenek/nhammen/Hoppster/[Hiraki or Pine] (Pie)
9. Hiraki - C-Worl/Pine/???/??? (?)
13. Ice - nhammen/Hoppster/Zdenek/???
14. nhammen - Zdenek/C-Worl/Hiraki/Hoppster (?)
15. C-worl - Hiraki/Zdenek/Hoppster/nhammen
16. Zdenek - nhammen/Hiraki/Hoppster/???
17. Pine - C-Worl/Zdenek/Hiraki?/???
19. silverbullet999 - Zdenek/nhammen/[C-Worl or Ice or THB (pick two; possibly Hiraki)]

Got these from quick skimming the day so far, and ISO-ing anyone with only a few reads.

Everyone who has one or more ??? in there should state their four choices for the scumteam.

And please, correct us if we made a mistake.

PEdit:

I didn't mean that. There's an entire slew of reasons why I believe Calc is town now.

e

_

e

~Pies

[TwoHeadedBoy]

As much as I agree with the sentiment of a Zdenek and Nhammen lynches, stop setting them up (silver, Pine, anyone else). It's scummy and/or unhelpful (if you're town) to have a solid plan that you can't deviate from. I don't mind the lynch being between the two right now, but if something happens that makes someone a better candidate today or tomorrow I'm going for them. Play it by ear, folks.

As soon as I catch Pie on IRC we'll decide what to do with our vote.

~Fugi

[TwoHeadedBoy]

Right now, I'm actually starting to think I was wrong about Hiraki.

I realize that Zdenek is scum, but it is against everything that I hold true and dear to join a wagon with someone I'm extremely sure is scum.

Scum vote scum too, y'know.

~Fugi

[TwoHeadedBoy]

Zdenek, whose scum on your wagon?

Nhammen and possibly hoppster.

Nhammen isn't on your wagon, bro.

~Fugi

[TwoHeadedBoy]

VOTE: ZDENEK

~TwoHeadedBoy

[TwoHeadedBoy]

[TwoHeadedBoy]

Fuck me if you do, but seems doubtful.

[TwoHeadedBoy]

Why did I die N1, I'm curious?

Everyone was scared of your mad scumhunting skills. Seriously. I wanted to leave you alive though for fear of a doc protect on a player of notoriety. That and I wasn't afraid of your scumhunting after playing Manhattan Special with you.