So if you think my flip will clear DRK and vise versa, you'd better vote him coz I'm certainly not a scum AND your reads on DRK is almost the same as mine!havingfitz wrote:I'm wrong all the time. Trouble is I don't realize it until whoever I suspect flips. Only time/votes will tell.
So how is that supporting a policy lynch when my vote was already on him? If I had had no prior suspicions of }|{opa I would not have voted him for based on his self-vote alone...though it would have been, and is, a negative IMO.Sundy wrote:@Fitz: you said of Opa you were fine with "letting drama kings commit suicide" since a self-vote is anti-town regardless of alignment.
Thank you. I looked into this and as noted havingfitz has a better more indepth view of DRK scum points but has a vote on Jora because of this:yabba wrote:havingfitz is voting Jora yet FOSing DRK, which doesn't stack in my mind. Couple that with the vote opportunism near the end of the wagon and you've got a scummy combo.
which at this point is the pot calling the kettle black.having wrote:I didn't have any suspicions towards }|{opa until his DRK GF post/Star vote.
Bad logic. Scum self vote, yah town. Town self vote, bad for the town. If you think he is scum there is no reason to believe it's idioticToastyToast wrote:Because self-votes are idiotic. I suspect him, but a lynch this early is a HUGE no.
No.havingfitz wrote: @farside...if you think yabba is scum for his vote on me...do you think he was doing it to save a scumbuddy in }|{opa? If yabba is scum in your opinion how would that jive with the possibility of }|{opa being town? (ie...why bother defending him?)
I'll vote who I like 
I used your quote with reasoning sir. Your only reason listed and main reason was that he voted for a lurker over someone he suspects more. If there are more reason's then spell them out. Why is Jora scum in your view?havingfitz wrote:farside...my suspicions of }|{opa and DRK are totally independant of each other. I can and do suspect them both. I just find the suspicion I hold of }|{opa to be more significant att than DRK. And how is anything I have done hypocritical? I'm voting who I think is scum....}|{opa isn't. I'm voting someone who has provided a lot of information to work with, }|{opa isn't. Where is the hypocrisy? And what makes my vote opportunistic? The fact I placed it? <headshake>
Thats right. Besides, I started suspect animorph and DRK before I saw DRK's games.farside22 wrote:looks like you have no better case to go on
Of course, coz imma illiterate ass.havingfitz wrote:you are just trying to hurt my feelings
You said you were fine with him committing suicide, and that would really mean he had four other people on his wagon, including one who have to vote after his self-vote. I looked up the definition of policy lynch of wiki, and it's true you're not voting for a reason EXCLUDING scumminess, but you are still advocating for a lynch that is partly based on behavior you said would be blame-worthy regardless of his alignment. Do you think he should be killed now?havingfitz wrote:So how is that supporting a policy lynch when my vote was already on him? If I had had no prior suspicions of }|{opa I would not have voted him for based on his self-vote alone...though it would have been, and is, a negative IMO.Sundy wrote:@Fitz: you said of Opa you were fine with "letting drama kings commit suicide" since a self-vote is anti-town regardless of alignment.
You're quoting Fitz there. Did you think he was breaking the "good townie rule"? Does that make you suspicious or not? Or did you think he had a good point when he said you were being scummy? And why are you still voting for yourself?Opa wrote:You know what else is "negative"? This: "While I didn't realize I had placed you at L-2"
Good townie Rule #1: you should always count votes before going on bandwagon.
And this: "Maybe you have 4 votes because you are coming across as scummy " Good point, isn't it?
I agree, that wagon is the most interesting thing in the game so far. Farside attacking yabbas vote on havingfitz is interesting as well. I don't find that an empty vote at all, but a justified one. Oh well, farside comes around to the havingfitz wagon eventually. Puzzled by this,yabbaguy wrote:Seriously a wagon that's just very, very, very, very, very, very well too quickly developed for my liking.
I don't see how they would react differently. I don't see what distinguishes their reaction from others.}|{opa wrote:I almost sure Toasty and havingfitz are towns. Their reaction on my self-vote is natural.
When a town does it out of frustration. I don't consider scum doing it idiotic but strategy. Yes file that as WIFOM.Sunday wrote:@Farside, in which situation would a self-vote not be idiotic?
So you don't have a better reason for voting for Jora then the one I quoted? I did ask for more reason's which you neglected from your post.havingfitz wrote:@farside...there is nothing hypocritical about my voting }|{opa and suspecting DRK. Feel free to disagree of course but IMO you are misrepresentng my vote as something it is not.
I actual touched on this a bit earlier. Yabba came back with a reason and a case on someone that no one else brought up. That earned a town point and an unvote. He's still someone I will keep an eye on. I won't take slacking off from him lightly.strat wrote:I agree, that wagon is the most interesting thing in the game so far. Farside attacking yabbas vote on havingfitz is interesting as well. I don't find that an empty vote at all, but a justified one. Oh well, farside comes around to the havingfitz wagon eventually. Puzzled by this,
Not sure I find it worth it to respond to most of what Jora said if he's town. Not sure there's much to respond to again "I think you're scum trying to draw a cop investigation!" If that's what being aggressive looks like, then so be it. Also, I think you're town. I therefore offer you thisTT wrote:@DRK: response to }|{'s post?
Timing is everything.HF wrote:-DRK for accusing Sundy on NK comment (TT did too??)
I thought it was pretty decent for early pressureHF wrote:-DRK pushing Sundy votes for NK comment. (bad)
-DRK overexagerrating animorph's "too early" for serious votes comment. (bad)
-DRK accusing anomorph of defending Sundy (bad)
In his very first post of the game, he posted something to the effect of "Whoa! Two people died!" with no other comment on it at the time. No reference to scum dying. No reference to vig dying. Basically, it seems like he just mentioned it to fit in, when there was plenty I would expect someone commenting on NKs to possibly want to say.HF wrote:-DRK...why is Sundy scummy if not for analyzing the nk when he commented on them?
Is this the same situation?HF wrote:-DRK (who earlier argues the likelihood of a Vig killing N0) states he wouldn't expect a one-shot vig to shoot night 1.
Post 74 was me telling people to hold off until we had information to work with to start speculating on what roles were in the game, not me speculating on the setup.HF wrote:-Posts 73 DRK tells people to not speculate on setup and then in the next post (post 74) he speculates on setup .
If you don't think the actions themselves are scummy, is it the pattern of actions you think is scummy? And, yes, I over-exaggerated on ani. I don't like people making excuses for my targets....HF wrote:Bad because I did not agree with them...not necessarily bad in a scummy way (individually) but all together things I would keep in mind.
1) I didn't find anything too suspicious with Sundy's opening post/nk assessment. As I did not see what DRK could have hoped for Sundy to have said, considering the NKs had comments to relate them to, I found his reason to voting Sundy a bit weak...and to suggest in two subsequent posts to others that a Sundy vote was better than a RV IMO exhibited overeagerness to form a Sundy wagon.
2&3) It appeared animorph had a similar assessment of DRK's thoughts on Sundy so therefore I disagreed with most of what DRK said in his exchange with Animorph. It seemed to me to be an overexaggeration, i.e. making a bigger deal than necessary, when DRK said animorph was defending Sundy and when he said animorph was content with random votes for 20 pages.
I've been in all those games since the start, plus one more under an alt. Until stopped posting for marathon weekend, would you ever have guessed?Jora wrote:I don't see how he can be helpful if he overloaded with the graet amount of games he's currently in. So how could we ever know whether he is scummy or just inattentive?! I don't wanna see him in LyLo.
Scum like to congratulate themselves, especially in a game like this when there are kills but no suspicion on anyone yet.cjdrum wrote: And, how lucky is it (for the Mafia) that they got the Vig, and for us that the Vig got his kill in (on a Mafioso), too! The irony.
?
1 isn't true AT ALL.cjdrum wrote: 1) SKs basically never win. They aren't exactly thestrongestplayers - they have only one death and their kill is gone, and want to kill Mafiaas well asTown. In fact, it makes more sense for the SK to start on Mafia, as if the endgame comes with >1 Mafia vs. SK, Mafia wins.
2) I intended that post to be jocular and not-to-be-taken-seriously. Turns out, the above thinking leaked through, but this was my original intention.
