Open 295 -- Island Paradise Mafia -- Game Over

[Jora]

I don't know what useful to say today. I have rather positive reads on Sundy, but I must to agree with havingfitz.

[farside22]

And I'm sorry about the lurking, farside, finals coming up.

@farside: If you are referencing the fact that I'm more active in other games, know that I consider those games to be more important because something is actually going on.

You want to explain the differences for excuses here TT.

unvote:
vote: TT

Also I'm going to say this as a pev of mine from anyone that is town. If your town and you see things not active and continuing that way instead of not pushing the game forward how about calling out those things you do see and get the game moving forward. I know scum like to stall the game more then town.
Also at fitz: That comment you made about Sundy was my feel too. He reminds me of my own play as scum before. He's moved up the list.

[ToastyToast]

my posting has remained consistent in the game. Posted quotes were marking my frustration with this game.
So you are now voting me because I'm stalling?
I've been plenty active in 1) the opa wagon and 2) my calling out on cjdrum. To say that I am stalling is BS.
Have I faded into the background? Yeah, but I am not stalling.

[ZeroFang]

Up to page 7

Actually, I saw this

@ Mod: Do Godfather appears innocent to Cop?

Would someone who is either godfather or cop ask this? NO
Would a cop blatantly reveal themselves to remaining scum with this breadcrumb? NO

I want to point out, in my limited experience, I've only seen non-cops ask this. Cops ask by PM. Scum would ask in the scum QT, or if it's the godfather himself, by PM. I hesitate to say Jora is not a threat, persay. However...

Does the single post by startransmission really outweight your accusation on DRK?

You protecting lurkers. Typical mistake. That's what all the lurkers hope for. They trying to stay below a radar untill RVS would over and one or two major bandwagons will be formed. The common practice shows that it profitable.

I'm going against the grain. But it doesn't mean that I'm scummy.

Actually, you're putting a great focus on voting for lurkers rather than people who have acted scummy. Which

is

suspicious in and of itself. If it were not for your other posts, I might be more suspicious of you. For now I'll stick with my belief that you're just an ancy towny. IGMEOY.

Or how's this...Good

townie

Rule #1a:

If you are town

don't ever vote yourself.

It's bad play, unless you are self-hammering as scum/jester

Fixed that for you.

[ZeroFang]

I'm expecting a lot of pictures of me being eaten.

[Nobody Special]

Votecount 1.13

TheJakalope - 2 - }|{opa, yabbaguy
Sundy - 2 - DeathRowKitty, cjdrum
DeathRowKitty - 1 - havingfitz
ToastyToast - 1 - farside22
yabbaguy - 1 - ToastyToast

Not Voting: ZeroFang, Sundy, TheJakalope

With ten alive, it takes six to lynch.

Deadline: April 15.

V/LA: cjdrum, April 13-18

[Nobody Special]

TheJakalope has been prodded.

[farside22]

my posting has remained consistent in the game. Posted quotes were marking my frustration with this game.
So you are now voting me because I'm stalling?
I've been plenty active in 1) the opa wagon and 2) my calling out on cjdrum. To say that I am stalling is BS.
Have I faded into the background? Yeah, but I am not stalling.

No I'm voting you for you inconstant reasons for not being here and playing the game.
You first state finals coming up then in your next post your more active in other game because their more active.

[ToastyToast]

@farside: They both are contributing factors. Since I've been busy IRL, I've ultimately had to reduce my time on the site across the board. When I do catch up, this one tends to come last because I rarely see anything new. It was just a giant argument between you and havingfitz for days, which gave me no information other than causing me to see you both as town.

I'm expecting a lot of pictures of me being eaten.

[ZeroFang]

I'm now reading over HF's banter with Farside. This vote screams OMGUS. Maybe not OMGUS specifically, but it seems that he votes farside simply for disagreeing with him, rather than doing anything scummy (which IMO is along the same lines as an OMGUS vote). In addition to that, he has generally weak reasoning for his votes, and finishes with a "don't ask me for more reasons", casting his vote in steel, refusing any further discussion. This is extremely anti-town behavior and should not be tolerated.

[ZeroFang]

I hope you are lynched soon because this game can not progress alone on the ridiculous exchange between us perpetuated by you. Just keep you vote on my and focus on finding another mislynch to target or perhaps bus a partner or something. This exchange is getting us nowhere.

Now, here is a possible game-changing question. Is his attitude of "I hope you die, the game is constipated and it's all your fault" more likely to be perpetrated by scum or town?

[farside22]

I'm now reading over HF's banter with Farside. This vote screams OMGUS. Maybe not OMGUS specifically, but it seems that he votes farside simply for disagreeing with him, rather than doing anything scummy (which IMO is along the same lines as an OMGUS vote). In addition to that, he has generally weak reasoning for his votes, and finishes with a "don't ask me for more reasons", casting his vote in steel, refusing any further discussion. This is extremely anti-town behavior and should not be tolerated.

I could kiss you. No seriously I thought I was going crazy thinking I completely was wrong on my read of that vote and reason.
But I determined later he was stubborn town based on lack of comments from anyone but Yabba. Scum would have jumped on the wagon. No one saying much of anything leads me to believe it was a town on town argument. And fitz sticking to bad rational that no one else notices seems weird to me. Like really weird. So I took myself out of it and I have a tendency to argue with town when I'm town more often then not.

*note: Please ignore blathing it just makes me feel better to know I'm not completely off my rocker.

[farside22]

@farside: They both are contributing factors. Since I've been busy IRL, I've ultimately had to reduce my time on the site across the board. When I do catch up, this one tends to come last because I rarely see anything new. It was just a giant argument between you and havingfitz for days, which gave me no information other than causing me to see you both as town.

Here's a novel concept. How about bring up something that breaks the fight apart if you believe it's town on town. Or bring out points you notice from others in the game instead of others making insight.
Grrrrr

I want your reads of each player with reason's on why they are town/scum or null.

[TheJakalope]

I've read through the thread a couple times and I find yabbaguy the most suspicious mostly because of his combination of posting very little yet always being very hostile when he does post.

VOTE: yabbaguy

[ZeroFang]

Wait. This whole farside/havingfitz thing... What?

After the last post by each of them, I have to believe havingfitz.

No one

keeps a calm and level head at that stage... Unless they were constantly Previewing and checking how scummy they sounded with their outburst!

No. If farside was more angry, or confused, or something... Currently, it's as if she's got it all under her control. Like she's driving this, and it's all going to plan. havingfitz is, IMHO, just another person who's gotten one or two of their posts torn apart by someone who's going down anyway, so has to make a mess of it all.

vote: farside22

This logic is just awful. Keeping a level head is a life skill, that happens to be useful when playing mafia. It isn't indicative of either side. Emotions, on the other hand, can be read, and depending on the person/situation it can be used to indicate which side the player is on. I don't have enough experience to tell what his lethal attitude shows, which is why I just asked everyone what it meant.

I'll take this opportunity to point out that farside is very experienced and very active. So much so that she used to be(?) a list mod, and after three years, she's maintained an average of 12.28 posts per day. It doesn't surprise me at all that she can keep a level head in a cat fight.

Call it pot-kettle-black all you want, but I'm still of the belief that scum are in the mega-lurkers. 'Cause there is no pot-kettle-black, that's the tu quoque fallacy. Trouble is, I don't know which lurker 'cause they haven't done anything actively scummy. ._.

If you'd like to pursue that belief, it's quite easy. Attack the lurkers until they either spend so much time defending themselves that they expose themselves as scum, or they are forced to become a productive, active player in this game.

I <3 you yabba. I'd love more activity from you. Pwease?

So, may be we should just lynch the animorph/bv slot as a compromise, and voilà! day is over, scum lynched. I saw star at least maked some attempts, but animorph/bv slot is a totally abusive null.

This post is exceptionally scummy. Suggesting the notion of lynching a slot just to end the day. What's more, Yabba was the only one that caught it, and he didn't pursue it like it needed to be pursued. This, coupled with the fact that Jora's been pushing lurker lynches instead of scumhunting raises my suspicion of him.

[ZeroFang]

I've read through the thread a couple times and I find yabbaguy the most suspicious mostly because of his combination of posting very little yet always being very hostile when he does post.

VOTE: yabbaguy

You've had three days. This is it? Really? REALLY?

[ZeroFang]

My main suspects are Jora (}|{opa) and havingfitz, for aforementioned reasons. I'm nearly positive farside is town, my only doubt stemming from the fact that she's a very experienced player and I wouldn't know her scum game from her town game. I'm suspicious of cj and yabba, cj because of his general ignorance and flaky/bi-polar posts, and yabba because he has not contributed to this game much, and I know he is capable of being a lot more useful. I'm neutral on DRK, her emotions aren't exactly helping, but she hasn't done anything overwhelmingly scummy either. Everyone else I forgot about, so you're obviously lurking and you need to

DIE IN A FIRE

post more often and contribute to the game.

I really hate to see half this game descend into the dark abyss of lurkville. It's upsetting. Let's see if I can make this clear.

Lurking ruins games.

And it makes them very unfun to play. If you're town, add to the discussion. Even if it's minor. Pick on people. Pick a fight. Some discussion is better than none, even if it's completely pointless. In town on town fights, you can still pick things up from the people shouting on the sidelines. Someone's bound to make a scumslip

somewhere

.

Don't fight with emotions (

*ahem*, DRK

). It doesn't work, and in my personal opinion, it severely discredits you as a reliable source of reason.

[farside22]

I'll take this opportunity to point out that farside is very experienced and very active. So much so that she used to be(?) a list mod, and after three years, she's maintained an average of 12.28 posts per day. It doesn't surprise me at all that she can keep a level head in a cat fight

God that's so funny. Remind me tomorrow to give you some of my more less then stellar moments of fighting with people in other games.
I actually thought Cj was an alt because I usually am not controlled by any means, which is why I have cj a big town point on his view.
I'm still a list mod by the way. And I thought my posting average went down this past year (since my job took MS away. IE: blocked MS site from my computer). Not sure if it's still that high.

@Jackolope: My vote is hoovering close to your neck. If that is the best you have while saying nothing about anyone else, it's beyond lurking it's scummy.

[ZeroFang]

ZeroFang replaces bv310 effective immediately.

Oh, useless! ZeroFang's just going to lurk his way through and drive us further up the wall. >:(

(@ZF: That's me challenging you.)

[ToastyToast]

BUTTERED TOAST

DRK: I don't think her arguments are based on emotion; love her 309. The inactive to active means nothing, and she is scum-hunting better than most in this game
Havingfitz AND farside22: I've already mentioned that I think its town on town. The points got weak over time, but more importantly no one seemed to comment on it. Scum probably didn't care either way, and were waiting for townies to pick sides. No one did.

TOAST

Zerofang (leaning town): Lack of info from ani/bv made me suspicious, but Zero has redeemed his slot with all the recent goodposting
cjdrum: responses to my vote was good, but I still don't like his 'joking' approach (past games might be helpful for comparisons)
Sundy: Really have no opinion on him. Couldn't find anything significant in my ISO of him; wiling to change his vote in light of new evidence is a good quality, but null nonetheless.
Jora (leaning scum): I didn't like his early game, and some of his more recent posts, like recommending cjdrum unvote, disagree with most of his reads. On the other hand, he has calmed down since the wagon and could simply be having the same problem as me in regards to getting into the game.

BURNT TOAST

yabbaguy:I'm voting him. The only read he's properly explained is his read on startransmission, and even then there isn't much. see 341
TheJackalope: His recent vote on yabba makes me uncomfortable. Startransmission never helped out town. The fact that there is no large wagon makes this a perfect time for distancing. Startransmission never game his scumreads, I would like a more complete stance by Jackalope.

[havingfitz]

Usually when a player role gets to it's 3rd replacement I feel that slot is town regardless of how bad a player they are. I figure people who play mafia don't get many opportunities to be scum so when they do get the chance...they don't like to waste it. ani and bv have both been posting regularly since this game began so I take their absence to be lack of interest in this game/their position. So town read on ZF for now. That said, and not being one to squash discussion, I'll entertain your accusations.

One thing I noticed in your post on me is it has a few

misrepresentations

(underlined) in it and

overexaggerates

(in bold) a bit.

I'm now reading over HF's banter with Farside.

You're one of the few I'm sure. My condolences.

This vote

screams

OMGUS. Maybe not OMGUS specifically,

So it "

screams OMGUS

" but "maybe not OMGUS specifically?" How can those two situations co-exist? It screams it but it's not specifically it. The "screams" OMGUS would appear to be an overexaggeration if you yourself feel it may not specifically be OMGUS.

That said...I don't care if my votes are ever viewed as OMGUS. If I find suspicions with someone I will vote them regardless of where their vote or suspicions are directed. So whether anyone considers my earlier farside vote OMGUS not doesn't matter IMO...what does matter IMO is you being so forceful in proclaiming it OMGUS and immediately stepping back.

it seems that

he votes farside simply for disagreeing with him

, rather than doing anything scummy (which IMO is along the same lines as an OMGUS vote).

It "seems?" Way to take a stance (btw...why no vote atm?). Nowhere do I say I'm voting farside for disagreeing with me. I am voting farside for the same reasons she was voting me (opportunistic + accusations of poor reasoning) and FMPOV, misrepresentations and pushing the aforementioned non-existent case. Do those reasons equate to "simply for disagreeing?"

In addition to that, he has generally weak reasoning for his votes, and

finishes with a "don't ask me for more reasons",

Which reasons of mine do you feel are "generally weak?" Do you agree with farsides suspicions towards me? If so...can you remind me which of her reasons you agree with? Also...I do not appreciate you cutting my quote in half in effect creating a misrep. I said "don't ask me for more reasons

becuase the ones mentioned above are all I have atm.

If you have two or three reasons for voting for someone and someone else keeps asking you for reasons above and beyond those two or three reasons....you can not give them more reasons if you do not have more reasons to give!

casting his vote in steel

,

refusing any further discussion.

Over exaggeration seems to be your forte. Where did I refuse any discussion? Let me give a simple example of what is taking place here so that it might be clear to you.

farside: HF...how many thumbs do you have?
HF: Two.
farside: HF...how many thumbs do you have?
HF: Two.
farside: HF...do you have more thumbs?
HF: No.
farside: HF...do you have more thumbs?
HF: No! Stop asking me if I have more thumbs.
ZF: HAVINGFITZ IS REFUSING ANY FURTHER DISCUSSION! ANTI-TOWN! DO!...NOT!...TOLERATE!

This is extremely anti-town behavior and should not be tolerated.

<stands at attention> SIR, YES SIR! So what are your thoughts on DRK actually doing what you falsely accuse me of (i.e. wanting to restrict discussion)?

Also, did you plan on going anywhere with your "possible game changing question" and why haven't you voted anyone?

[ZeroFang]

This vote

screams

OMGUS. Maybe not OMGUS specifically,

So it "

screams OMGUS

" but "maybe not OMGUS specifically?" How can those two situations co-exist? It screams it but it's not specifically it. The "screams" OMGUS would appear to be an overexaggeration if you yourself feel it may not specifically be OMGUS.

That said...I don't care if my votes are ever viewed as OMGUS. If I find suspicions with someone I will vote them regardless of where their vote or suspicions are directed. So whether anyone considers my earlier farside vote OMGUS not doesn't matter IMO...what does matter IMO is you being so forceful in proclaiming it OMGUS and immediately stepping back.

I strongly believe that your vote on farside was a vote simply because she disagreed with you, rather than because farside did anything scummy herself. So you're voting farside and cite your reasoning as "Oh my god, u SUCK!". And you're content to just drop the discussion before the issues were resolved. That doesn't speak town to me. The only reason I'm hesitant to say it's an OMGUS vote is because it doesn't fit within the term's typically defined perimeters (you vote who's voting you because they voted you).

it seems that

he votes farside simply for disagreeing with him

, rather than doing anything scummy (which IMO is along the same lines as an OMGUS vote).

It "seems?" Way to take a stance (btw...why no vote atm?).

It seems. Yes. Because I know nothing with 100% certainty. Also, thank you for reminding me to vote. We only have 3 days left.

In addition to that, he has generally weak reasoning for his votes, and

finishes with a "don't ask me for more reasons",

Which reasons of mine do you feel are "generally weak?" Do you agree with farsides suspicions towards me? If so...can you remind me which of her reasons you agree with? Also...I do not appreciate you cutting my quote in half in effect creating a misrep.

I'm responding to this later, when I'm not in a rush to get ready for school. If I forget remind me, but I shouldn't forget. I cut quotes in half because it's more concise. Easier to digest.

casting his vote in steel

,

refusing any further discussion.

Over exaggeration seems to be your forte. Where did I refuse any discussion?

About right here. Re-reading I realize you simply refused to give further reasoning, and didn't continue

that

discussion. But thank you for pointing that out. I did not intend to make it seem like you refused

all

discussion.

This is extremely anti-town behavior and should not be tolerated.

<stands at attention> SIR, YES SIR! So what are your thoughts on DRK actually doing what you falsely accuse me of (i.e. wanting to restrict discussion)?

Also, did you plan on going anywhere with your "possible game changing question" and why haven't you voted anyone?

DRK has been moreso lurking/active lurking and avoiding discussion, rather than stopping it (although, that reminds me, her activity stepped up when I started accusing her. That's definitely something to look into.)

I did plan on going somewhere with my "game changing question". Due to lack of experience/social awkwardness I really don't know what to make of that, which is why I asked everyone for their input. As it stands I'm just going to let the game breathe a bit and see how that goes.

[ZeroFang]

VOTE: Jora.

I believe I've already explained why.

[farside22]

And TT is back on my good list.
Zero moves up the list and out of scum territory.

This leaves: Jackolope, Yabba or Sundy.

I would like any of the 3 lynched today.

unvote:
vote: Jackolope

Congrats Yabba you are moving up, but I still find you scummy.

Zero: I get your views on Jora. Let me ask you something, if your scum partner died N1 would you play it aggressive and make comments that will get you at L-1 day 1 or play low under the radar to nonexistant?

[Sundy]

Ok I broke my computer on Sunday so I've been reading via phone.

I'm liking CJ/Toast's reactions to my questions, good vibes in general. Lurkers: Both have finally done things that can give reads. Jakalope's vote on Yabba was weird. Explain more please.

But...

vote: Fang

I originally thought he was being useful and trending up, but I re-read the last page and there's something's off on his finally voting Jora. His suspicions don't seem to add up to his vote. He twice makes a point that's essentially "IMGEOU but I think you're town for now." He says Jora is focusing on lurkers rather than scum-hunting (whereas I think Jora has been actively hunting), and condemns him for suggesting we lynch a lurker. He finally has fitz and Jora as suspects (been EXTREMELY vocal on Fitz, for reasons that seemed more plausible) and --when pressured to vote by fitz who challenges his read, goes for Jora and says he's "already explained why." don't like it.