Mini 1186: Repo! The Genetic Mafia - Game Over!

[Medicated Lain]

Here, and ready for surgery, surgery!

vote:Camn

For having such a cool icon and not having seen such a cool movie!

[Medicated Lain]

fos:green crayons

I definitely felt like Magua's post was clear about what was serious. Seems like Crayons was digging for gold where there was none.

[Medicated Lain]

I know trip, and he's often busy at work. I'm inclined to believe that it wasn't scum lurking, and just a case of mafia being open in the background.
I FoSed because I guess I generally don't take voting very lightly. But it got what I wanted, just more in detail of what you were thinking. Your point is clear now, and reading again, you phrased your question pretty clearly in the first place. Was Magua just not paying attention to what you asked? That's a pretty interesting thing to hint at in day one, not sure if I'd call it scummy.

Seriously Camn, mass claim first day? That's no fun at all! I'm thinking I'll keep my vote here for a while.

[Medicated Lain]

mass NAME claim. A very different thing.

You are against it then? Why?

A mass claim is so much more helpful towards scum than it is towards town. Repo is certainly a movie where we can speculate who might have what role and be scum, but that doesn't mean it would be in line with the game mechanics. Assuming our mod mixed up the roles, the mafia will know who each other are, and based on names, they could have a much easier time figuring out who are power roles versus who are not. This reeks of looking for night kills.

[Medicated Lain]

Sorry folk. Being sick + busy week = lacking of mafia. I will post something of actual content when I get home from work today.

[Medicated Lain]

MEDICATED LAIN: Your first post will be a detailed analysis of Bvoigt and if you wanna get in Crayon's good books, Yosarian(2). I really dont want to see any random generic rubbish, we need focus.

I'm not interested in following your orders for approval, and certainly not interested in buddying with crayons at this point. I may have been out of mafia for some many years, and I may have a different style from some of this town's... I get the feeling so far anyway. But is it that necessary to boss me around on what to do? I'll play by my own style, thank you.

Read through the game as a whole, and ISOd the first half today. That is where my comments and questions will lay.

@peregrine: why so many posts in other games, but such little attention here? There's not much else that can be said, Magua is right, #58 is weird... what were you even doing there? I don't understand that post at all.

@mehplus rahr... uhm... do you exist? Are we getting a replacement soon?

about pine: I admit I agree that the post against camn was worded funny. But i guess I've learned from recent experience that that doesn't always mean everything. Looking at everything beyond that post, I personally think pine is about the most town looking person in this game so far.... although I do think it's interesting to note that Magua thinks he's getting more personally involved than he usually would, I will keep this in mind.

about green crayons: I think he is scum. The more I look, the more I wonder about you, crayons.
question: Why did you wait so long, over a day and multiple posts in between talking about trip at all? You made no mention of him, and then suddenly bring it up and kind of bash on it for a few posts, and move away again.
Looking at crayons over all trend, this is what happens, he seems to be making a point of addressing folk as much as possible... Magua, trip, me, Yos, pine, haylen, camn, pere. I guess to me, it feels like attempts at seeming active and keeping in touch with the town, without actually doing anything.
I understand not throwing a vote around, but you sure do question, interrogate, suspect people quite a lot for not having moved your vote from the very first one of the game.

unvote, vote: green crayons

about bvoigt: Doesn't seem the cleanest but certainly better looking than crayons. I can look at the game in context and understand why the votes placed were done so. The bickering with Pine seemed really unnecessary, since Pine had declared what he meant, it looked like just trying to keep the fuel going. I don't like this.

@Magua:

and VOTE: MAGUA
THis is a grudge-vote, strictly.

Camn, if you vote Yosarian, I promise not to daykill you today.

The mention of promising not to day kill this game, is this a reference to the last game you two played together?

I will be looking over the rest tomorrow, and probably placing a vote on crayons then.

[Medicated Lain]

No worries, I'm not an angry person, just aggressive when need be ^^

You'll get one tomorrow. I only allocate so much time of my life to back reading in games, so tomorrow will be the second half of the town.

Wow, I guess there was a little too much zydrate in my cereal this morning. I will leave my vote on him until tomorrow, and see if anyone looks anymore suspicious. First I want some answers to some of these questions.

[Medicated Lain]

Sorry about the delay there. I ran off into the night following a bug and got caught up in the wrong crowd. Will be a bit busy for the rest of the weekend, but much easier to follow along from where I am. You guys are a fun town!

Incog: I can see your case about Haylen, but I find it very interesting that the same point you were using against trip, is completely oppositely true of Haylen. You stated that Trip's lack of saying anything while being on is a sign of holding out on posting to be careful, while Haylen is very obviously taking no concern at all. Trip's back from a long hiatus with me, and is also generally picking up the game all over again. Why is it that you would suspect such a high level of play from him, yet have no such expectations from Haylen?

camn: Your call for a mass claim was terrible... then you went on to say you know it was scummy, it was to draw people out, and now you discuss the benefits of it again? I don't understand this at all. Mass name claiming in a game like this may be fun for some folk, certainly posts could be more interesting, but for game play, it would be so much more fun for the mafia, who would hold the biggest advantage in town. Also, for being very strongly against using metas, you certainly went far out of your way to use your own to prove what you were saying before.

fos:camn

Haylen: everyone sure has a lot to say about Haylen. I don't think the play is good, but it seems just less attentive to what is going on, if you ask me. I'd call it inefficient/anti town play, but not enough right now to categorize it scummy, but I want to hear more from you Haylen.

Battle mage: I like the thinking here, and agree with a lot of it. I'm so sad you'd be willing to look at me day one! I came back to this site with Trip, this is only my second game back, yet you are willing to give him a free pass, but I get none? I feel unloved

trip: Oh man, I finally get to talk about you! Trip can't be scum this game, because I'm not! (last game we played together reference)
Well, putting that aside, the first few posts felt a little funny to me, but I really like the case against Incog, it looks flawless to me.

Yos: Mixed readings. Don't feel like he's a good lynch today because his movie quotes are the best in the town! Definitely not understanding the trip case though. BM's point about yos pinpointing on trip is dead on, and trip's case on incog looks pretty solid. Incog doesn't seem scott-free.. That's a fair amount of disagreement...


More on green crayons: Everything about the situation with Magua sits so wrong with me. If Magua hadn't of been referencing an old game, would it really make sense to pull someone with a day kill ability out on day one? They're obviously not scum, because giving scum a day kill ability in this game.. I just don't see that happening. Does it make sense to direct someone with a day kill on day one? I'm thinking about an argument that came up in the other game I'm playing now, about how day one is the worse day for the town. We're in day one, there was no night one first, which means the only people that have information on other people in the game are the mafia, and I guess if there's a mason group... but the only one we can be certain on, is the mafia. That means they hold a higher amount of information than everyone else, and thus have a higher ability of manipulating the town. So why is it, that it makes sense for you to direct someone who you think is a day killer to make an extra kill on the day that we are most blind in our abilities to judge the information we see?

All this being said, the only person you've voted for this whole game is Magua himself, yet you throw questions and comments in every direction. You talk about other players pretending to contribute, while not actually. But I think you are more guilty of this than any others here.

[Medicated Lain]

So Yosarian, according to you, it isn't a reason to vote someone for being inconsistent, and placing the first vote of the game with meaning behind it, directly followed by a random decision openly declared for a second vote? I certainly find that at least a bit suspicious.

[Medicated Lain]

Posting to say that I am here. I will view some of the cases again tonight or tomorrow.. headed out soon, so no time right now.
@green crayons: So you sincerely believe that taking a shot in the dark just because the majority of the people in town are controlling it? The idea that I am saying is that with 100% no solid information on the town side, plus a mafia which is generally three people.. that's a little less than 25% of the town... Versus less than 8% per single player. The likely-hood that the mafia could control the direction that the votes are going in is much higher than any other day.

[Medicated Lain]

Interesting developments... One idea that comes to mind immediately to me... zydrate black market mafia? Amber, Grave Robber, and maybe even a small character like one of the alley girls started up a black market for mafia, and that's what we're after? Just trying to think of interesting plots that could go with the events that unfolded.

vote: Cognito

GC and Yos2 look very likely town to me too based on interactions.

There's a nice circle of suspicious-looking people in {TripMyWire, Medicated Lain, Fugitive} with the latter of the three being mainly due to complete non-contribution. camn looks the shadiest to me of the people who were on the PeregrineV-town wagon.

What? That makes no sense.

I had a nice ride in an ambulance this morning for the first time, to the emergency room. I'm not feeling that well, so I don't know if I'll be posting again today.

[Medicated Lain]

Not feeling the Pine-hate; I think he's likely town.

He's being pretty silly right now

but town.

Sadly, Haylen could possibly be town too based on interactions with BM,

but I want to see her finish that analysis.

camn

looks the shadiest to me

of the people who were on the PeregrineV-town wagon.

I've bolded the contradictory parts of your reads for you since you're not being intellectually honest (which is typically a scum trait). They're all lines that you could fall back on to change those reads if necessary. "Yeah, I called Pine town but he's so silly maybe I was wrong." "Yeah, Haylen might be town but her analysis might be bad and therefore scum." "camn looks the shadiest of those people, sure, but that doesn't make her shadier than the people off the wagon."

Understand now? Good.

I'll look around for more after work, if I can't find any I'll concede your point to a single fluke post.

[Medicated Lain]

It's true, I'm probably quite biased in preferring not to vote trip. I was so worried when I read through BM's posts, and definitely saw what people were saying about the BM/trip connection.

Then I looked through at Trip's posts pretty closely. The one thing that I certainly noticed that should be pointed out: ***Trip mentioned everyone in this game in some way or another, on day one, except for Magua. Magua is now dead, bodyguard. I don't believe that trip killed him, but I was more thinking, that as a new player, being scum, if I were to forget mentioning anyone day one, it would definitely be my scum partners. Yet there's only one person not mentioned, and that person was not scum. It is true he only very briefly mentioned BM... but there's no one else with such a dynamic, so there would not be room for a third partner under such circumstances. What does everyone else think of this?

The only other thing about Trip that sincerely concerns me, is the Pine hate for killing off Pere. If I were paying more attention, and saw someone claiming townie Luigi day one, I would have been just as willing to make that vote.. certainly a lot of information to come from that, plus since it was a townie claim, it's not like it was like suddenly calling to kill out someone that's really going to hurt the town, which the probability rises on, by choosing to pursue elsewhere after a claim.

I like how Medicated Lain is attacking me for something that Trip, not me, is guilty of.

I saw in Trip's earlier game that this was true a bit, but the difference is, you know what you are doing. Those of us that are less experienced are less likely to take strong stances I think. This is day two, and I found this to be true of you, I see no excuse in your case.

[Medicated Lain]

I looked through this, and I'm really not seeing this. While it's true that Trip didn't mention anything about Magua throughout Day 1, I think there's a whole bunch of other people Trip didn't really mention on Day 1 also. In fact, I'd include you in that bunch, and I'd include BM in that bunch too. I can't see why you just randomly decided to disinclude him when his lack of mentioning BM completely throws your whole reason for defending Trip out the window.

When I said mention, I mean literally address in some way or another, not necessarily mention an opinion on.

Well, I was still going on my random vote and since you're now my #1 suspect why wouldn't I vote you? A quick review reveals it became the only vote on you at the time so it's not like it was too threatening. You seriously voted me for just being online when the PMs sent out, and you rolled dice for another vote... I don't see it being all that radical by comparison.

He's trying to downplay the importance of his vote. He's doing everything he can to imply that his vote on Incog is meaningless and shouldn't be worried about. That's not what you do when you actually think that you're voting for a scum; you try to pressure them, you try to get other people to agree with you. It looks like what Trip wants here is for everyone to just forget about his vote and ignore him.

I'm not trying to downplay it at all. Incognito said he was surprised by my vote and I was pointing out how it compares to his votes... kinda saying the pot calling the kettle black or whatever. Oh, and it did bring attention to him... BM even voted for him. If you believe that I'm scum trying to stick a vote on someone hoping that everyone will forget about it, why would I put it on someone without any votes already on them and try to make a whole new case for them? Wouldn't that bring about MORE attention than if I were to put it on one of the bandwagons going on at the time? Much easier for a vote to get lost among others that way.

This is the only time Trip mentioned BM through all of day one... it's not really the kind of post I'd expect to see of scum mentioning scum day one. I would expect maybe more hesitation to go near scum partner at all, or if saying anything, maybe an FoS... but I'm curious what the rest of you think, because as I said, biased.

Incog still seems like a good choice to me.

[Medicated Lain]

alright, I'm here, but not very strongly tonight. My vote is doing nothing, as it stands.

unvote, vote: camn

scum tactics anyone?

[Medicated Lain]

This game needs some momentum, so I am changing course based on this.

OK, crayons.. I have bought into the idea that BM-scum calls at least one of his partners scum on Day 1.

Lets review:
PEOPLE BM CALLS SCUM:

Also the falcon is scum.
PeregrineV is scum.

Vote: PeregrineV

Obv.. we know now Peregrine was town.

I think Pine could be scum.

Unvote, Vote: Pine

Medicated Lain is also scum.

Vote: Incognito

How can you be against a lynch of Incog??

Unvote, Vote: Yosarian2

Let's turn up the HEEEEAAAAT!

So.. there are not really that many suspects.
At this point, even though my hangover is not letting me show it.. I actually do have some thoughts/plans. But on the Battle-tip, I note this post:

I think we're lynching one of Incognito, Medicated Lain or Yosarian2 today.

And I think there MUST be one scum in there.
BM was clearly setting up a pool of players that he was willing to push cases on for as long as he might live. ONE of them would have to flip scum for him to make endgame. There is one in there.

Another tidbit:

according to the scum-quicktopic i have been prodded.

I think BM was doing something that I have actually been enjoying doing lately. I think he was trying to be as truthful as he could be, as scum.. thus I think that was true.
Additionally, I think THIS is true, in the same vein.

I am voting for Incognito because his Haylen-vote was contrived, the reasoning eminently fictitious.

Incog: Are you scum? I hesitate.. because it seems like I have gotten A LOT of scumreads on you over the years.. and you have flipped town every godsforsaken time. So wtf? Is this finally it?

So you went from not thinking that BM was bussing, to specifically pointing out people? Not even based on any actual content of theirs, just chose a single post of BM's and stated that one of our scum MUST be one of those three? I certainly believe scum would POINT to a scum partner day one, but why would there be any reason to risk a scum partner that early in the game? This just REAKS of hardcore scum tactics.

[Medicated Lain]

So camn, who do you really think is scum from that list?

[Medicated Lain]

You can call me scum, but it won't help the town. You're not giving any reasoning behind anything, just making statements, and this is exactly why I'm voting for you now.

[Medicated Lain]

"BM mentioned you! ...as well as more than half the other town. But YOU must be scum!"

[Medicated Lain]

I don't understand your question camn, what are you asking me to clarify? You have mentioned three people, and gave no in particular reason for voting them except for that BM mentioned them on day one. Why is this scummy? Because I've done this exact thing as scum before.

Does no one else find this incredibly scummy?

On top of this, your actions yesterday certainly weren't clean either. Bringing up the idea of a mass role claim, and going back and forth on whether you were serious about it or not.
The more and more I interact with you, the more convinced I am that you are scum. You are trying to get me to answer questions you aren't even asking me through OMGUS talk, and still not giving any REAL reasons for anything. With that, I think that the only reason you are pointing to me out of those three people, is because I am pointing to you. You're either scum, or easily offended by accusations.

Seems like some people in town know camn, how in character is this?

[Medicated Lain]

I disagree with any notion that #395 is pro town. You just point to players that BM mentioned, and say that one *must* be scum, but give no further reasoning than simply that connection. This is lazy scum play, just looking for an easy place to point to. I've done it myself in the past as scum, and that's why I voted you. Your responses have been nothing but OMGUS, "you must be scum, because you're pointing to me." Which has done nothing to convince me other wise.

Anyways, if I were pointing to anyone based on BM connections, it would definitely be Trip based on their interactions day one, sorry trip >< ... I'm less inclined to vote for trip early on because it's been forever since we've played together.. so he gets a temporary free pass from me. There's certainly a bit of merit behind the other two players that camn mentioned... more so Incog than Yos, but I find a lot more merit behind the camn vote at this point.

What does the rest of the town think?

[Medicated Lain]

I find it interesting that Incog also is for the camn vote. I'm inclined to believe that one of camn or incog, but not both... is scum, but I am unsure of which. Lining up lynches day after day... fugitive today, camn tomorrow, isn't helping incog look any better to me.

Incog: what do you think camn and fugitive/new fugitive are exactly? Do you really think it's more common for someone playing as scum to want to back out? I'm inclined to believe quite the opposite.. on top of that Meh basically just didn't bother with the game, I don't think I'd necessarily call that lurking in the way it played out. Fugitive actually made an attempt, and then the game lost all it's momentum midway. I don't see this pattern as something a scum role would do.. but then I've been away for a while, so feel free to enlighten me other wise.

Camn: I certainly believe that scum will bus as a tactic. I however, am not 100% convinced that they would force themselves to bus on day one. Suppose BM died on night two, and not night one. Day two, BM buses an entirely new set of three people. Assuming we were in that situation, would you specifically choose the people that BM pointed to day one, over day two? I certainly wouldn't. There's information to be gained from what a scum member posted, but without connecting those points to anything else, it just looks like easy targeting.

Trip:

[Medicated Lain]

Eeerrr that was mid post...
Trip: Yay! I'm still loved! I still love you too, even if I kinda think you might be scum.
You are asking questions of folk, but if you had to point out any two people in town, who would they be, and why?

Pine: Agreeing that you need to say some more in this game. You looked all good to me day one, but today, there's just nothing.

[Medicated Lain]

Soo... deadline in a week anyone?
all you have to do is pull the trigger...

[Medicated Lain]

Medicated Lain is weaksauce - he can go be scum for attacking for nonsense reasons.

AHEM. Pronouns.

Also, what is wrong for looking for a reason to vote someone on day one? Attempting to both sway a nightkill, and bring attention to someone you believe is a power role, all on day one, is absolutely scummy, and those are points I will not remove from Green Crayons.. though today looks a bit better for him, and I am willing to forgive mistakes if a player is not seemingly scum after all. That you are willing to defend such actions however, means that perhaps you are someone that I don't want to meet at the opera tonight.

[Medicated Lain]

So let me get this straight, you want me to stop seeing you as scum, simply because you no longer want to call me scum? My feelings won't change on your actions. Trying to create such a bargain looks even more odd to me.

The only other option that I feel pretty strongly about is Incognito. Pine expressed interest in an Incog lynch, but I don't like how he's approached it.
@pine: so why areyou interested in incog?

What an interesting circumstance I'm put in.

[Medicated Lain]

You sure do think a lot of yourself Thor. Did you see what this game's post per day rate was at before camn and mine's interactions? If she gets any points at all, it's for at least trying to bring this town back to life.

There's still another 5 days left on today, I'm going to look over the game one more time... hopefully that'll come by the end of the day, if I've got enough time.

[Medicated Lain]

I am about half way through the game.

unvote

Completely agreeing with Yos at this point. I was being lazy early in the day. Definitely looking at Camn again however.

Very serious

.

Then I propose that you day kill first person to five votes (so as to not chance anything with a person at six votes) today to replace what would (potentially) become our first D1 lynch. This will give us an "extra" lynch round in not having to go to night, using your day kill as a stand in for the first lynch.

vote: BattleMage.

Green Crayon's first vote of the day. Everything about this post that caught my eye.. now it's right back there. I'd say there's a 99.999% chance that there's no possible way for BM, GC, and Magua to be scum together. Magua actually seems quite pro town, in my opinion... Green Crayons is back in my eye... I guess going through day one again, I'll post more about this later.. but does anyone think anything of this?

Fixed the tags for ya. ~iPie

[Medicated Lain]

hey mod, if you'd like to fix my last post at all, I'd appreciate.

[Medicated Lain]

Right, will pay more attention in the next post I make.

It wasn't baseless.. obviously Magua wasn't scum. I'm not particularly grouping anyone together, so much as asking what everyone thinks of your vote there.

[Medicated Lain]

vote:PINE

Let's do this folk! Our day is nearing an end, and it's about time for the repoman to strike!

#1 scummiest player here, hands down. Great lacking of much content in about anything posted. The desire to hold a constant, consistent position, even when it doesn't matter any more... the case for this is Incog.

Incog, your first couple of posts just struck me oddly. I can't really put my finger on it, but it comes off as nervous and too-eager to make a good impression. Then when you had two people you were expressing suspicion of, you used a random number generator to choose which to vote for, instead of logical deduction.

It looked out of place to me, but not a definitive tell one way or the other. Suspicious, but not damning. Hence, FOS.

I am deliberately choosing to ignore camn et al for now. This debate has rapidly devolved from rational to mudslinging and strawman attacks, and I will not be a party to that. I am considering replacing out, as this is not the kind of environment I want to play this game in.

@Mod: Hey Pie, can you do something to reign in your players? I'm not easily offended, but this just isn't fun for me.

This post is especially damning. This is where he puts his choice on Incog, and this is the *only* time he says anything particularly pointing to Incog. I'll admit, I had my suspicions on incog too around this point, so all seemed alright then. However, we are on day two, and Pine has done *nothing* to contribute anything further to this game, he posts, but greatly lacking content.. just barely keeping in the game. Meanwhile, his stance stays on Incog, despite even by his own admission, he couldn't really explain why he was doing it.

Beyond that, the thing that really gets me, is Magua's post after:

No, Pine doesn't get let off the hook because of his join date. I've seen him play in three other games, and he's done just fine. I've never seen him (IMO) overreact like this to pressure before, so that's new.

@Pine:

Let me rephrase my question. Do you actually think camn is scum? If you couldn't vote camn, who would you be voting now?

Knowing for a fact that Magua's information was on the town side, I take this post far more seriously now. I believe we have a higher chance of hitting scum with pine, than anywhere else.

[Medicated Lain]

If you can get behind camn, that's one I'd highly support as well. I get pretty heavy town reads from Yos at this point... I'm in heavy agreement with incog about camn or thor.. but I think Pine should be on that list too.

I'm disgusted by the way the Incog wagon formed so fast, and after looking back, Yos and bvoigt are quite right about Incog... BM was seriously pushing a lynch in the directions he was looking in, and I don't think he'd do that to a partner day one. The way camn is fixated on those three people is just like incog said, flailing scum, and that's why I voted for camn in the first place when she made that post about how one *must* be scum. Her play day one gave me mixed reads. Sometimes I like what she does, sometimes I don't... but particularly because her fixation on that set of people is the exact tactic i used in the last game I played as scum, I get incredibly bad vibes from her.. not to mention her trying to to sway me not to look at her simply because she wasn't looking at me... there was no justification in her accusations on the people she's made, there still isn't in my eyes, so I don't see how that was supposed to convince me of anything.

The only thing that's weird to me about incog, is that he isn't pushing camn more... or making a case there more. Given that there's been much talk about her meta from other games, from Incog himself even, that kind of baffles me a bit. But honestly, camn's case against incog isn't solid at all to me, I feel like there's an attempt for me to be turned into a sheep.

I am giving until tomorrow(game day) to decide anything on trip, mainly because I know he is limited in what he can do because of surgery and such right now.. I certainly won't go out of my way to defend his game... and the BM thing is still lingering in my head... the way he attacks is not aggressive, and bothers me, but the way he defends himself doesn't seem in the slightest the way a scum would do such. All I'll say is, Trip hon, step it up a notch!

The fact that camn would specifically call trip not scummy, and call incog scummy for pointing at trip completely baffles me. I'll agree that I don't understand the haylen case at all.. and even today, I didn't understand the fugitive accusation... now that Thor has placed in, I can certainly see some scumminess there, so maybe there was something I was missing.

All this being said:

unvote, vote: camn

Sorry camn, next game when you're not scum, maybe we can be friends. For now, you need to take a trip to the graveyard.

[Medicated Lain]

I have no idea what you meant by that first part.

I already told you why incog looks town. All you need to do is look at Yos's post. BM wasn't throwing an arrow around, he was sincerely looking to hunt. I don't think BM would sincerely look to lynch his partner on day one, especially if that partner is a more experienced player, which I get the feeling is true with Incog.

Didn't your buddy camn already say she gets a town read from trip?

I reread Trip Wire.. and I am not convinced he is that scummy. The more I read it, them more scumvibes I get from INCOGNITO.
I would support a deadline lynch of Trip just to see what kind of light the flip would throw on INCOG.. but I think it is time for this:

VOTE: INCOGNITO
case:
First... his Trip vote, His Me-vote, and his Haylen-vote... all on out-of game reasons. Trip for post timing, me and Hayl for meta-reasons.. his reasons on me especially were inaccurate, poorly researched meta reasons.

I also agree that I'm a little less inclined to believe that he's scum, because I know he's not as experienced. Even though I see points against him, if you look at the way he defends himself in an ISO, it doesn't give me the impression that he's scum... he's actually trying to defend himself. I would be more worried if he were just ignoring all suspicions.

She would support a trip vote at the end of the day, but has stated that she doesn't see the scumminess there, and even used the fact that incog attacked trip as a reason for voting incog. That certainly doesn't sound very pro town to me.

Pine definitely doesn't look pro town, and the moer I hear from you Thor, the more I'm thinking a kill in your direction looks good too.

[Medicated Lain]

Pine: I don't understand your logic. Why would incog turning out to be scum point to me being scummy? Unless you're following Camn's ridiculous claim that *good scum would stick to pointing out their partners every day,* which certainly seems stupid to me, and that you'd be willing to follow along such logic just makes you look even worse.
I don't see how people can think that Pine is town.

Thor: I didn't understand your reads at all. We see opposite on about everything, and that is generally something I've seen in scum trends when I'm town. Now that you've explained that you actually know Camn's play from other games, I find it a little less concerning..

I will choose to vote in the way of pine, in case anyone wants to join in another wagon! You folk talk a lot about how scummy Trip is, but doesn't the lack of play in general say anything? It's not like he's following along on votes or anything, I can see a case for either way, but my instinct says not to vote trip right now.

unvote, vote: pine

Camn: you may be off the hook for right now, but I've got my surgically enhanced eye on you.

[Medicated Lain]

Well, I won't be a part of it.

About Camn: I've never played with her before, I've never played with anyone here except trip and yos. The fact that you've played with her before suggests that you may have a better feel on her character than me. So it's something I wouldn't call any defining point.

[Medicated Lain]

Go Pine vote go!

[Medicated Lain]

Alright Trip, Thor may not be interested, but I'm interested in a claim from you before this happens!

[Medicated Lain]

I call for a claim.

[Medicated Lain]

Agree with requesting a deadline extension!

[Medicated Lain]

You're working my 'be kind to Newbs' angle well here, I love being buddied. I know the bulk of the case on you is silly, because I've seen you as town do the same thing, but the PoE is kind of damning, f'r'instance;

Pine is not a smart lynch. There was a point where Yos(?...Incog? I forget) was digging into Fugitive. Pine came out and chainsaw defended/attacked over the call. Since I'm town and since the slot was a useless slot Pine, as scum, would have been cutting off an easy mislynch option for himself *and* raising his attention level from one of the slots that is active and/or considered generally pro town. Doesn't add up as a scumtactic to my mind.

PoE? I also don't actually know what chainsawing is. These terms, I'd like to know.

Thor: given that you've seen trip in another game as town acting like this, why were you pushing so hard for a trip lynch until now?

Supremely odd.

Thor: Incog was mainly the one digging into the fugitive case... I certainly believe that scum will choose to create random buddies in town, but beyond buddying, there was no way that Incog was convincing anyone about the fugitive place being scum... that was one of the main reasons that I was so into the Incog vote earlier in this day. I myself, among others, criticized Incog for having those suspicions, because it didn't make sense. The fact that Pine was also defending that slot, is really just going along with the majority of town opinion, and in no way at all is it cutting off an easy mislynch.

***I feel wary of Thor's last few posts.

Haylen: Bvoigt is about the most protown looking player I see here based on my read through the game. Who do you have feels on in this game?

People I'd be interested in lynching: Pine, Thor, possibly Haylen.

[Medicated Lain]

I stated exactly why I felt wary. As far as I can recall from this game, you never once before that post above had posted anything about knowing Trip's play, you just continued to attack and call lynch on him, based on his play-style which you have witnessed as non-scum behavior from him before. Meanwhile it was Trip that brought up that you played another game together, not you. And you responded as if perhaps some one might look that up.
This is in contrast to camn, where you mentioned in her defense that you have witnessed her play, and don't find her scummy. I still think Camn's play reeks, but I'm not willing to risk it at this moment.

The fact that Yos was the target and not incog is a little clearing for you, but I don't think it takes pine off the hook as you suggest. With Pine having a wagon against him at that point, he may have been playing extra cautious in just who he was buddying/attacking to try and release some pressure. The over all pattern of Pine seems to be to just barely post anything to stay in, and just throw in a few things every here and there, but no seriously strong stances anywhere.. yet incredibly defensive when personally attacked, as we witnessed with camn.

[Medicated Lain]

@thorn: Alright, I'll admit I'm not the best at remembering everything that's been said. My mind even has a terrible tendency to corrupt data sometimes. The more I read, the more it absorbs in.. but you can't expect anyone to remember everything that occurs in one of these games, that's why it's good to be able to defend one self.

With that, I wonder now if the Incog vote could really be a good way to go after all. Thor, you seem pretty town at this point. Camn, I've got bad feelings on.. but it's too risky. Bvoigt seems like obv town to me. Trip, I'm confused by, but honestly I don't think he's scum. Haylen confuses me a lot.

Yos... Yos I'm not really sure on... but given the way he defends Incog, it's like what Thor was saying about Pine, except there's really an actual case there. Incog had 4 votes, and Yos really stepped in to save Incog, so either there's some win condition where they must be alive together, or Yos is town.
After I reviewed the game, Yos is definitely right that BM was genuinely pushing a lynch. BM pointed at both incog and yos day one.. I was in there too, but I'm town. What would the chances be that incog and yos are both scum? I see no reason to lynch Yos without first getting Incog to know what happened there. But if Incog isn't scum, there's no way I could see Yos being so.

I still think the case on Pine is quite strong too though.

[Medicated Lain]

Interesting that mine and Crayon's posts should come at the same time. I read your post and all Crayons, so let's have a look see here:
A is certainly an interesting point.
B I don't particularly get the distancing case. Is it not generally seen that scum will interact directly with town folk? I've certainly done it as scum. What do others think of this?
C.... is more like cdefgh... you get the picture. I'll agree, that the activity level certainly isn't in a place where I would say he's pro town based on it... but I just played another game with him, and it doesn't strike me as any what a different pattern, and he was town in that game, so it's not setting off any triggers per say.
His argument against Trip was sound. I don't understand what trip meant at all by saying that it seems like Camn is more scummy in this game for doing something she would usually do as pro town... and I certainly thought it was weird. (Personally I am inclined to believe that this is just over thinking the situation..) The case against camn was 110% sound. Mass claim calls should never be considered town, and the points he made were not repeating what I nor anyone else said, like you suggest, he just seemed to have his own point to chime in.
D You say that Yos defends incog because Incog has been on his side... but would Yos as scum sincerely go to that heavy a level to stop a lynch that was two votes away from occurring? It seems just far too unlikely unless there is some other reason to keep Incog alive.. it just doesn't balance out.
E Yos made valid points, and I haven't understood the bulk of your arguments. I'd much rather see you lynched before Yos, even.. perhaps especially because of this most recent post.

[Medicated Lain]

Alright folk, we were given a deadline exchange to decide. I've decided no on no lynch.

vote: Incognito

[Medicated Lain]

So basically what I'm hearing is everything you say I should make sure to go fact check because you basically have like a 50% chance to just be totally making something up in your own head?

You know you're a bully, right?

It's not a 50% chance on anything. It's mafia, we look at what we see and interpret it how we see it. Human error exists. Even with that, we learn a lot based on the reactions from the people we are addressing. Furthermore, if some one is voting anyone based on the sole information that one person is providing (especially without quotes referencing... I've been kinda lazy I guess), then personally I think they are scum too. So I certainly would hope you would do a bit of checking too. The main reason for giving your own reasoning on something, is simply to show the town what you are thinking.

How sure on Incog am I? More sure than I am on Trip. Less sure than I am on Pine... but no one's willing to go there with me.

[Medicated Lain]

Well at this point it pretty much can't be helped. Yos seems quite set, and it's definitely very convincing, that's all I'll say on the matter for now. Seems like the trip lynch is inevitable at this point... I'm not convinced 100% that sibelian COULDN'T be scum, i think it's hiiiiighly unlikely, and such a waste. I suspect we are probably missing the real scum today.

[Medicated Lain]

Ah that be trip by another name. ^^

[Medicated Lain]

Wow Yos, can't help but wonder why you didn't lynch me last game! Out of curiosity, what do you think of GC today?

[Medicated Lain]

I need not explain anything. I already told you I wasn't voting for Trip on day two. He just had surgery, so I was excusing the lack of play. Now that it's day three however, I consider this real game, and will not hesitate if I feel that he is scum. That being said, I don't actually think that trip is scum. BM's posting more than anything is the only thing that really makes me think anything of Trip... but I'm just not sure what to make of it right now. Thor, you know exactly what I am talking about with trip's play, so why are you voting him? If this is meant to kill, then my suspicions lean right back to you.

@Trip: If you want to help the town, it's time to throw in your real voice. Analyzing each player individually, and coming up with a real idea for who looks scummy, and who not, will help your case. Unless I hear what you say today, I cannot excuse the lack of play any further my dear!

Yos: I'm trying to understand your logic on "trip must be scum" but I just don't see it. I certainly don't believe we have a scum team larger than 3 people in a town this size. For all we know, it could even just be a partnership. So let's look at the scenerios:

Assume Trip is scum. 0-1 more scum member. 10 People alive. 5 people voting yes. 1 person the candidate, and that leaves 4 other people. How do these numbers in any way point to Trip being scum? If there's another mafia, chances are he was probably already busing. If the other mafia wasn't busing, that still leaves 3 other chances for Trip to be hatched away. That's just too big to say it makes sense.

Now let's look at other wise. Trip is not scum. 1-2 other people are scum. Scum generally want to kill, not end in mislynch. Likely our scum would be on this wagon.... HOWEVER...

Consider this:

No, Yos, if there's a vig, it's gotta be Nathan. Luigi is plausible as SK, but I'm seeing the Largo family as the Mafia here. Four Mafia is a bit much for a game this size, so there's probably some internal Mafia politics, that would fit with the flavor. I just finished playing a Star Wars-themed game (on a different site) where there were more Mafia than usual, but they had Usurper mechanics in line with the Sith Rule of Two...there's a similar flavor going on with the Largo family here.
,
Graverobber as third party. Maybe some kind of unique mechanic to reflect stealing from the dead or Survivor. Shiloh is a VT role. Amber may be the non-Mafia Largo, she's the most self-interested and least...evil. Pavi may have some kind of mechanic related to his face-changing. Blind Mag is probably some kind of investigative role. Watcher maybe?

But yeah. I can't see Luigi Largo as Town, and certainly not as a VT.

UNVOTE: Camn <--Holy shit, I thought I unvoted a while ago.
VOTE: PeregrineV

Here is Pine throwing the hammer at Peregrine day one, not even with the deadline there to approach and make it necessary. What I wonder: is why pine was so hesitant day two, given that there was no problem with it on day one. He posted within the realm of opportunity, but delayed, hesitated...

Was about to ask for a claim out of Trip, but I ISO'd him first. Looks like I blinked and missed his claim. I find the claim plausible but unlikely. It's just too obscure, when Repo! hardly lacks for enough characters to fill a mini. Otherwise, I'm not an especially big fan of the case on Trip, but Incog clearly isn't the lynch for today, and Trip is. I'll take an informative lynch that some of my Town-reads are advocating over a no-lynch ten days out of ten.

Unvote

THIS IS INTENT TO HAMMER.

Trip, please make a final post with your outgoing reads and last words. It will be heartily ignored if you flip scum, and taken seriously if you flip Town.

Obviously he was working hard to get Trip lynched, he really agreed that this should happen.

I have my smartphone. I'll give Trip until 10:30 EDT (30 minutes before deadline) to post, then make it happen.

Why hesitate? This last post shows, he really wanted to get trip thrown overboard... but why the concern on if he's the one doing this? Why is trip posting one more time, that important? The Peregrine thing happened so fast, honestly I didn't even get to see the game from Peregrine posting his claim until after day one was already over. June 22nd, with a deadline of July 1st. Yet day two ends with a no lynch because Pine wanted to see one more post from trip.

I suspect, assuming Pine is scum, and trip not, that Pine would be thinking that people would look at his actions two days in a row of throwing the hammer on a mislynch, and use it to build more of a case on him. It's the only real reason I can see for Pine to take such hasty actions in day one, yet be so afraid to do anything in day two. Pine, I'll love to hear your defense on this.

vote: Pine

I'm very serious about this, and Thor I'd love to see you throw your "Pine is so obv town" at this case. I've given you so many reasons why he's scum now, you can look at my ISO if you want more.

[Medicated Lain]

a cricket chirps. Trip hunters are wasting time and holding up the game. Yos is gone for a while, there's no one here to defend incog but himself.. so Incog, what's going on?

[Medicated Lain]

Trip: and the fact that I can't read you. Give us some substance!

[Medicated Lain]

So people still don't agree about Pine then? I will likely push here again with another post pointing everythign out, but for now...

unvote, vote: camn

I don't see how information can be more harmful than less. Her actions have been scummy throughout the game, and the way she has been handling anything about her role is incredibly suspicious.

[Medicated Lain]

I didn't ask you for a claim camn, I said the way you are handling your role is suspicious. What I mean is that, to say that you have you have information that would hurt the town rather than help it, sounds like a scum tactic to keep people away... make them think you are important. I personally don't believe that you are.

What do others think?

Also, yes, personally I think single person claims are a MUCH better situation than mass claims.

[Medicated Lain]

Ugh, alright, we are just waiting and waiting right now. Trip: I give you 48 hours to post something of substance and convince me not to vote you. Otherwise, I will vote you, and have this game move on. Unless others find a reason to object.

[Medicated Lain]

What about any one else in the town?

[Medicated Lain]

Thor, I don't understand your sayings. You are voting for trip, yet you think it is scummy if I pull the trigger on him, because you don't think he is scummy, yet you are voting for him?
Trip is likely not scum.. though is definitely a player whom should be paying more attention...! Triiiiiip! Rest of town, where is your head on them?
I can see camn as likely scum. My guess would be that either one of Incog or Camn is scum, but based on my readings, I'm more likely to think that camn is scum than Incog.

[Medicated Lain]

Oh camn, you are about as Sweet as Amber, but she is already dead, so perhaps not.
I'm going to say something now. Forgive me, I do not mean this in an anti town nature, but in the nature that this is why my vote is not being placed on Incognito, and we need something ot make the game move.
I am not voting for incog, based on the way that Yos defended him. Yos seemed in his defense like he had some definite reason for not voting, like there is some kind of link, and he knew it would be a bad idea for us.
I wonder if it may be bad for the town mentioning this, but scum would have probably noticed and made their own opinions anyway. Right now, this game needs a topic, so I'm giving us something to talk about.

[Medicated Lain]

@incog: I voted for you because it was an option.

The fact is, I do think that one of either incog or camn is probably scum. I would be down with lynching either or right now. Trip is going up and up on this list, because I'm just not seeing any real motives behind ideas... but this is more as ineffective town, rather than scummy actions... given that we are day three, we need to be taking lynches seriously. I do also agree that pine is incredibly scummy. I would prefer over anyone, to lynch in that direction, I think there's a high chance of hitting scum, but no one else seems to agree.

So... @town. Top 3 candidates, and why?

[Medicated Lain]

You really don't think it's possible for both Yos and Incog to be town?

[Medicated Lain]

It is an answer. Voting anyone else wouldn't have had enough weight to shift anything. I tried voting around/throwing ideas around a bit, and nothing conjures up anything. We have an extremely bad case of lazy town going on! So Incog, who are your eyes set on as scum?
I do think there is something to be said that I guess Yos could be scum, and Incog not... but it just seems so highly unlikely that Yos would make such a heavy case in favor of a player whom has a fairly large portion of the town suspecting them. What do others think about this?

[Medicated Lain]

unvote, vote: haylen

The logic there doesn't make sense anyway. Bvoigt seems town to me. So let's see what happens.

[Medicated Lain]

I want what is best for the town.

unvote, vote: Tripmywire

This may be the only way to get that right now.

[Medicated Lain]

By weigh in, you mean state an opinion, or a vote? i would certainly vote for her too, if requested, and plausible. I think the chances she is scum are higher than the chances that Trip is scum... but I want this game to move on a bit.

[Medicated Lain]

What do you mean she is tricksy?

[Medicated Lain]

drats!

[Medicated Lain]

I didn't know there was a Dead QT either! aaahh! Anyways, I was fooled completely this game. I must be a very bad scum hunter ><