TT; Book 1: Bible Verse Mafia - Game over!

[Dragon Phoenix]

I'm happy with my vote.

[mith]

Fritz: That, and the sweet taste of hunch.

[Fritzler]

Fritz: That, and the sweet taste of hunch.

Is it weird that I think its weird for you to be suspicous of me for bandwagoning but not for a hunch?

[RoadBird]

I'm a bit curious about DP's tendency to vote for Thoth and inHim's vote for VitaminR. Am I misinterpreting VitaminR and Thoth's posts?

Since inHim is found not guilty by LML i'll

vote DP

. If LML's investigations are correct (and if he really is a cop) it will work itself out later on. DP has contributed as much to finding scum as Pooky but rereading some games told Pooky is not playing any different than usual.

Fritzler's overdefensiveness strikes me as somewhat odd too.

[PookyTheMagicalBear]

I've contributed to that environment precisely because there is no discussion!

If there was any bloody discussion on anything damn near relevant I would be in the bloody thick of it.

Instead there's a lot of foot schuffling and mumbling about "yo which lurker noncontributor should we lynch today?"

Lynching lurkers DOES NOT GIVE THE TOWN ANY INFORMATION OR ANY HELP WHATSOEVER!

It's the an absolutely horrible strategy that replaces the actual arguments about a lynch with a "let's lynch that lurker" followed by a helluva lot of head nodding from every1 else who can't bother to do anything.

You're frigging ACCUSING ME OF BEING NONCONTRIBUTIVE!??!

I'm sorry you didn't get the memo but Mafia usually involves CONVERSATION, it involves ARGUMENTS, it involves LOGIC BASED ON THE ACTIONS OF ANOTHER.

I can't argue, converse or offer much logic because there's NOBODY TO DO THIS WITH!

When all I can hear in this frigging thread is the nodding of heads, the lack of logic and the echo of my own voice, how the hell am I supposed to give you any sort of conversation or argument that might give you an insight into my views and those who I argue with if I can't find any1 to do this with?

Do you all realize how absolutely ludicrious it is to tell me to build a !@#$ing house without giving me any bricks and then threatening to lynch me when I tell you that this is bloody impossible and you're !@#$ing nuts!?

[RoadBird]

One more thing

Also, FOS armlx

Post please, too!

He's dead! Pay attention.

[Commodore Amazing]

@LML - Why did you investigate the people that you investigated?

[Thoth]

I don't really like the Pooky wagon. Mostly because he's defending the same way I'm defending when there's a wagon on me and I have no clue why, so he looks genuine to me.

vote:DP

I don't like the way he switched from Kerplunk to Pooky like it was a given that we need to lynch one of those today.

[Glork]

Unvote

I think I have some re-reading to do, and I just don't have time to do that right now.

[Dragon Phoenix]

I'm a bit curious about DP's tendency to vote for Thoth

What

are

you talking about? I never voted for Thoth.

[Thoth]

What! Then I'm retaliation voting for nothing.

[mith]

http://www.mafiascum.net/Oregon%202005/ ... _pooky.jpg

But I still think he's scum.

[PookyTheMagicalBear]

aww mith, mebbe u should post a link to the one that tally took of us under da sheets togetha

But no, I'm seriously not scum and you've still yet to present any reason why I would be other than a "hunch"

[RoadBird]

I'm soooooo tempted to vote Thoth on the off-chance that he is scum, and will not stop gloating if we let him get away with this.....

I didn't say you voted for Thoth.

[Commodore Amazing]

Pooky hasn't done much to convince me he isn't scum. But then no one has really convinced me that he is scum.

I reread DP's posts and was pretty underwhelmed. I especially didn't like the parts where he called me a bad player and echoed Fuldu when Fuldu called me out.

I'm starting to respect the Roadbird.

vote: Dragon Phoenix

[VitaminR]

Pooky, calm down. Swearing and shouting isn't going to help nor is it going to make people listen.

You can't contribute in this environment? That is an excuse for a vicious circle of complete inactivity. There is always room for an attempt at productivity.

I don't like the dichotonous attitude, but DP is not the only one guilty of that as far as I can see.

[PookyTheMagicalBear]

I guess ur suggesting that I calmly fold my hands and sit down and try to use gentle logic to bring you guys around so that we can actually get a game going instead of shouting at the top of my lungs in fustration at the screen?

Oh wait, that's what I was doing for the last three weeks before I got angry and started ranting! As I remember, you guys just nodded alot and said vote: Pooky without actuaylly giving any reasons or logic.

Shoot that path sure turned out to be a winner no?

If you want me to stop trying to wake the town up? You want the town to keep stumbling towards its grave in some sort of lethargic trance?

IF you don't, then post something more than a 3 lines which talks about productivity(which you haven't shown), telling me to quiet down(when really the problem is you being too quiet), and telling us DP isn't the only one guilty(duh we know, you're guilty of it too).

[EnderX]

Sorry for the delay in posting. I've been trying to keep up with the thread, but until today I hadn't specifically tried to read through it solidly. (I've just been keeping tabs on new posts.)

About the current Pookywagon: I can't specifically point to what, but something about Pooky rings true with me. Even with his lack of defense, I suspect he really is a protown role. Voting him probably isn't the way to go today.

Current standing:

FoS: Commodore Amazing

. In the same way that Pooky's posts are ringing true with me, CA's are ringing false somehow. Again, I can't pinpoint it, but I'm hoping that eventually I will be able to. It's not a vote since I can't back it up with anything but a gut reaction, but that'll change if I do find evidence on further rereading.

Again, sorry about the non-participativeness. I'll try to do better at that.

[Commodore Amazing]

About the current Pookywagon: I can't specifically point to what, but something about Pooky rings true with me. Even with his lack of defense, I suspect he really is a protown role. Voting him probably isn't the way to go today.

Pooky's pretty good at making a fuss even if he is scum, so I wouldn't put too much stock into it. I think if we have anything on him, though, I'll get a better read on him.

[Glork]

I guess ur suggesting that I calmly fold my hands and sit down and try to use gentle logic to bring you guys around so that we can actually get a game going instead of shouting at the top of my lungs in fustration at the screen?

Oh wait, that's what I was doing for the last three weeks before I got angry and started ranting! As I remember, you guys just nodded alot and said vote: Pooky without actuaylly giving any reasons or logic.

I call "FOUL!!" right here.

Vote: Pooky

.
Here's the "actual reasoning" you've been looking for.

By clicking on ye olde Pooky's posts in the thread link (conveniently given to us by the mod in the player list), it's pretty apparent that your posts have had a very distinct lack of logic. Post-by-post, here is the "content" and "logic" you claim to have given:
0: Confirm post.
1: Random vote for Coron. Joke about Coron-wagoning
2: Explanation of why you haven't been posting, talking about lynching Coron
3: Vote for Flying Dutchman with no logic or backing whatsoever. A bandwagon vote, in fact, against the townie who was lynched that day. Small red flag.
4: Pushing for FD's lynch. Not much to be said there.
5: "Good Riddance" after FD finished himself off. Really productive, eh?
6: Jumping on another bandwagon on Day Two. Note that you still haven't done *ANYTHING* productive. Big red flag. Scummeter++;
7: You switch votes to VisMaior, and seem to be fishing for information from RoadBird. Another Red Flag.
8: *Smack* A switch to *ANOTHER* bandwagon. You enjoy this bandwagoning shindig, don't you?
9: Hey, you finally said something somewhat insightful! Congratulations.
10: "The current play is totally not pooky." Another helpful post, if ever I've seen one. (I hope my sarcasm is apparent by now.)
11: Hopping aboard another bandwagon, this time against a lurker. Which happened to turn into me. Who happens to be town-aligned.
12: Unvoted once I came in to replace. I personally appreciate it, but I also note that it still contains no other content.
13: You don't understand why the play isn't you. I'm very much beginning to understand why the play is you. Repeated blatant bandwagoning, lack of content, and general lurking-ness. I think that's plenty reason to pressure you..... possibly even enough reason to lynch you.
14: This is, what... the second post with real insight? You are quite right in saying that scum often paint a situation as black or white, as two-sided with no other alternatives. Previous posters may have backed up their vote with little reasoning, but I hope that this post provides the reasoning you've been clamoring for.
15: "What am I supposed to be defending myself from?" The third post like this... it's becoming very bothersome. Personally, I think you're sluffing off the suspicions by claiming ignorance.
16-17: Your rant-posts
18: Spam/Joking. Another "I'm not going to defend myself because I don't think I have reason to" post.
19: Your last post, the one to which I am responding.


Here's my more-than-two-line response. I certainly have given myself enough conviction to vote for you. I said it before, but I'll say it again:
You've lurked, making posts with little to no helpful content.
You've bandwagoned repeatedly, against Flying Dutchman and LyingBrian, both of whom turned out as citizens. You also hopped on the Kerplunk lurkerwagon, giving *me* extra reason to suspect you of being scum.
You're using the "I don't see a case against me" defense.... one that I know I've used in the past as scum, and one that just got a scumbag killed in another game (TSAGod in Norse Myth Mafia, if anyone cares to check/verify this). I feel it's a scumtell, so I'm adding it to my list of reasons.


There, I've presented a real case against you. Start defending yourself, scumbag.

[VisMaior]

I have limited access untill Friay or so. Sorry.

[Cadmium]

Vote count:

3 Kerplunk (VisMaior, VitaminR, Fritzler)

4 PookyTheMagicalBear (LoudmouthLee, mith, Dragon Phoenix, Glork)

1 VitaminR (inHimshallibe)
3 Dragon Phoenix (RoadBird, Thoth, Commodore Amazing)

not voting (3): Coron, EnderX, PookyTheMagicalBear

8 to lynch.

[PookyTheMagicalBear]

Thank you Glork, usually a case is presented before the bandwagon starts, though better late than never right?

0: Confirm post.
Shit you expected me not to confirm?
1: Random vote for Coron. Joke about Coron-wagoning
Trying to get Coron to start posting b4 he lethargically falls asleep and lurks through most of the game, if you've read some of the games Coron's played here, you'd realize he has a habit of lurking.
2: Explanation of why you haven't been posting, talking about lynching Coron
You would've rather had me not explain myself?
3: Vote for Flying Dutchman with no logic or backing whatsoever. A bandwagon vote, in fact, against the townie who was lynched that day. Small red flag.
Something's gotta get done, FD's typically a noncontributor and often needs to be prodded to do something in a game, review of FD's previous games where he's lurked and such is easily viewable.
4: Pushing for FD's lynch. Not much to be said there.
Yes, because if we didn't push for a lynch on people who we want to lynch, we wouldn't have anything to do and the day would be slow and boring. Would you rather me have just lurked thru it like most people did?
5: "Good Riddance" after FD finished himself off. Really productive, eh?
So what else was I supposed to post after FD decided to ax himself as a townie? My actual bitter fustration that even in death FD decided to deny us information as to what his role was or who was looking to cast the last vote on him(mafia usually have difficulty choosing between ending the day by voting on some1 not in their family and thus looking bad tommorrow and just letting the day drag on with the hope that some townie will do the job for him) It wasn't helpful at all to the town for FD to vote for himself when he knew he was innocent, some1's who's so clearly trying to hurt his own side out of fustration(I can understand a townie who's trying to help the town and messes up, I can't understand one who's actively trying to mess the town up) is one which I am very glad to be rid of. He could've at least tried and I was quite upset when he didn't and I'm glad that such a person is no longer with us.
6: Jumping on another bandwagon on Day Two. Note that you still haven't done *ANYTHING* productive. Big red flag. Scummeter++;
Yes I have done something productive, I helped get rid of a player who was going to be nothing but a hindrance to the town later on in the game day 1. I helped build a bandwagon that would show things later in the game when some of the bandwagon was dead and when we had lynch information to work with. Hell did you expect me not to get on a bandwagon and just wiggle my bloody toes Day 2? You know how far we'd get if everyone did that?
7: You switch votes to VisMaior, and seem to be fishing for information from RoadBird. Another Red Flag.
I switched because of RB's claim, fishing for info from a townie? Or trying to verify the fact he's actually a townie? 2 very different things here Glork
8: *Smack* A switch to *ANOTHER* bandwagon. You enjoy this bandwagoning shindig, don't you?
A review of my gameplay history would reveal that I do enjoy bandwagoning, it makes the game move and it's more effective than sitting around and twiddling toes until the mod deadlines the game and then we're stuck rushing a lynch as the clock ticks down and we have much less time to assess claims/counterclaims than if we just bandwagoned without waiting for the moderator to call time on us. If we all just laid back and never bandwagoned, the game wouldn't get anywhere.
9: Hey, you finally said something somewhat insightful! Congratulations.
Thank you.
10: "The current play is totally not pooky." Another helpful post, if ever I've seen one. (I hope my sarcasm is apparent by now.)
I presented a defense that was as informative as the argument against me, that post was made to show the case against me at that time for what it was, a baseless skeleton with no evidence. A bit of irony if you will.
11: Hopping aboard another bandwagon, this time against a lurker. Which happened to turn into me. Who happens to be town-aligned.
This is coming from a guy who wants to lynch lurkers?
12: Unvoted once I came in to replace. I personally appreciate it, but I also note that it still contains no other content.
Wait, so you're saying we should lynch lurkers, I voted to lynch a lurker, then unvoted once the lurker got replaced, but yet somehow I did the wrong thing?
Should I have baked you a jello cake to welcome you into the game?
13: You don't understand why the play isn't you. I'm very much beginning to understand why the play is you. Repeated blatant bandwagoning, lack of content, and general lurking-ness. I think that's plenty reason to pressure you..... possibly even enough reason to lynch you.
I don't understand why the play is me because there's been no bloody logical case presented against me at that point. I've already addressed the other issues.
14: This is, what... the second post with real insight? You are quite right in saying that scum often paint a situation as black or white, as two-sided with no other alternatives. Previous posters may have backed up their vote with little reasoning, but I hope that this post provides the reasoning you've been clamoring for.
Ok Glork, why don't you read other people's posts and see how many "real insights" they provide?
15: "What am I supposed to be defending myself from?" The third post like this... it's becoming very bothersome. Personally, I think you're sluffing off the suspicions by claiming ignorance.
Because I'm supposed to be able to psychically tell what I'm being accused of when those who accuse me do not state any case in thread other than hunches and plays? Must be an act! Maybe I'm really PSYCHIC and can tell what those people voting me are thinking and I'm acting frigging ignorant in order to brush them away! You must wonder why super psychic scumbag me hasn't decided to nail the cop yet, but that's because I know the cop is naive since I can read the moderator's mind!
16-17: Your rant-posts
I apologize for trying so very hard to stop people from lynching me, I guess you'd much rather me behave like FD, just shut up, wait for the votes to pile up and then lynch myself. That's SO much more productive.
18: Spam/Joking. Another "I'm not going to defend myself because I don't think I have reason to" post.
I didn't defend myself because there was nothing to defend myself from. You honestly do expect me to make a house without bricks don't you?
19: Your last post, the one to which I am responding.
Ball's back on your side of the court buddy. If there's any point you feel I haven't addressed, just let me know.

[PookyTheMagicalBear]

BTW here's a synopis of DP's posts for you glork, you might find it similar.

Post 0:
*goes off to read*
Post 1:
Vote for FD
Post 2:
unvote FD mumbles something about CA pretending to have an investigation
Post 3:
vote FD again
Post 4:
vote roadbird
Post 5:
Tells CA to bug off
Post 6:
Says Fuldu(SCUMBAG) had the right interpretation of his post "Couldn't have said it better himself"
Post7:
Tells us he's sticking with his vote
Post8:
unvotes Roadbird, says he'll re-read
Post9:
Mentions a thoth wagon based on pretty much nothing, sounds like fishing for a wagon on marginal information.
Post10:
Presents the Black-or-White statement, basically makes it sound like day 3 isn't about looking at the information we've gotten from the past 2 days, but really just about choosing one of the 2 people who are alledgedly lurking and lynching them, this is while he only has 10 posts and most of them are 1-liners that contribute or show absolutely nada.
Post11:
unvotes Kerplunk after replacement
Post12:
Black's not working, time for white! Votes for Pooky
Post 13:
There could be possibly a plan C, right even though you've already stated this day was going to be either Pooky or Kerplunk, but really you're not presenting a fallacious dichotomous thinking, you're simply presenting fallacious dichotomous thinking with a secret plan C kept in reserve in case any1 calls you on it.
Post 14:
"I'm happy with my vote"(As if we couldn't tell by the fact that you hadn't changed it)
Post 15:
Asks RB what he's talking bout in terms of DP's tendency to vote for thoth, apparently forgot about that time he tried to fish for a thoth-wagon based on marginal information and utterly failed, kind of hard to see how he could forget as he's only posted 15 times in the thread total and some of them look along the lines of:
"reading"
"rereading"
"happy with my vote"

It looks to me that DP's far more guilty of lurking/noncontributiveness than I am.

Just look through his posts with that function used on me and tell me how many posts with "real insight" or that are helpful are there.

Then tell me why the hell your vote is on me instead of him when he's far more guilty than me of the sins that you've accused me of.
"sticking with my vote"

[Cadmium]

Ameliaslay will be replacing Coron as of now.