Double Vote Mafia -Mini 1239- Over

[Alnara]

/confirm.

[Alnara]

Ohhey, game started.

Vote: hiphop

because the interaction with whoever he was bitching at early is odd from a town PoV.

Vote: malpascp

because one post.

I'm a hydra. I think this is a worthy early topic of discussion. Does anyone have any questions about my being a hydra?

[Alnara]

Friend Mairsil, that was your fourth post. Learn to count, and come back.

[Alnara]

My vote on malp was mostly a placeholder for my other head; the nice thing about hydra'ing in this game is that we have one vote apiece. My other head would prefer a Christine vote because she has yet to post anything but fluff.

I'll be trying to keep my tone and actions as consistent as possible as though I were one person, in order to not fuck up everyone's scumdars, so I woin't be signing my posts or anything, but little moments of "other head disagrees" like this will happen.

Vox and Hiraki, reread the early interplay between hiphop and killerjester. hiphop more-or-less freaks out over being voted and his "okay, so you're not being town at all? got it" post feels scummy to me. If he really thought killerjester was scum, he'd have immediately started pushing a lynch rather than trading insults with someone he thinks is scum. So if he is town, I can only assume he's the kind of person who really believes arguing with scum is worth it because if you snark hard enough they'll admit it. I like that vote where it is.

Then look at it from killerjester. Scum tend to weaken just a little bit under pressure, and killerjester's attitude was basically "come at me bro." He did not seem fazed at all by the scum accusation, which tells me he's either good scum being attacked by a scummy-looking townie, one scum being lightly bussed by another (Vox's theory, I believe), or just a townie. I find the third most likely. Either way, if killerjester is scum, hiphop is also likely to be scum.

I'd like everyone's thoughts on this but most notably hiphop's (on the killerjester bit), killerjester (on the hiphop bit), and Vox and Hiraki (on both bits).

UNVOTE: malpckawhatever
VOTE: Christine

[Alnara]

I'll tell you who my heads are.

One of them is Phate, who has played at MS off and on (with a few alts) since 2008, and who plays as Phayt on the GlobalGamers #mafia IRC channel. Phayt is the best player in the channel, an honor some on MS would compare to being the smartest kid on the short bus, but nevertheless IRC mafia taught him to read people quickly and well, primarily based on cognitive dissonance.

The other head is SFG, who has also played a few games on MS (incomplete record along with a set of rules for townies can be found on her wiki page), and has played as SFG on the GlobalGamers #mafia IRC channel. SFG is very analytical and good at taking objective views to reduce tunneling.

I'm not going to sign posts, because it's my belief that playing a hydra as two disjointed players makes it much harder to read the player slot. What if you find one head scummy and one not at all? Instead, we're endeavoring to keep the tone of our posts consistent and conferring with each other before we post to keep the content consistent also, when we can.

[Alnara]

EBWOP: Phate actually has been playing on MS since 2007, and feels old.

[Alnara]

I keep seeing people wagoning Hiraki for active-lurking but I don't think he is actually lurking or active-lurking at all, just claiming to lurk. To prove this, I will give you the post-by-post for you to evaluate, starting from when Thad starts the game.

post 57 - Makes the first post after the game starts.
post 59 - response to pseudo-omgus.
post 64 - Hiraki's original request to lurk.
post 68, 99, and 102 - The first two posts here are indeed fluff and active lurking, but the third post offers an explanation: "I haven't seen anything worth posting on."
post 108 - Hiraki offers an opinion and a wagon vote. He still isn't giving reasoning but this is participation.
post 111 - Hiraki makes his first argument. Don't let the sarcasm fool you, he just called killer's argument for Voxscum bullshit.
post 112 - And in the next post, Hiraki revises his argument to be more accurate. Not exactly active-lurking.
post 115 - goes into more detailed reasoning on his argument that killer is using bullshit arguments, and cements it with a vote.
post 155 - fluffy, but reminiscent of the fact that the other players are mostly involved in a shouting match of the same two arguments.
post 176 - At this point I'm starting to think that Hiraki's apparent "active lurking" is more reminiscent of his passive-aggressive playstyle than anything else. This post contains an argument against killer AND a request for a case on NS, but is poorly phrased enough to be viewed as active lurking.

tl;dr - out of Hiraki's 11 post-game-start posts, 7 of them contain useful contributions and 4 are fluff. That hardly counts as active lurking.

So we have four

oh and by the way your votecount is wrong, mod

- four votes on Hiraki each for the same reason that, as illustrated, is bullshit. Friend Mairsil I'm willing to give a bit of a pass because it was an uncertain vote and she's new, and NS similarly gets by for now because of his meta for being useless and not explaining his votes until badgered. Voidedmafia and nintendo are pushing pretty hard, though. I need to go reread nintendo, but I'm happy right now with a Voided vote for pushing a wagon hard on clearly false reasoning.

UNVOTE: Christine
VOTE: Voidedmafia

[Alnara]

Mod: Can we get a votecount, please?

[Alnara]

Mod: We are voting for VoidedMafia, not Christine.

fixed

[Alnara]

First off, sorry about the lapse in posting.

AurorusVox - begins the game tunneling on jester for dubious reasons. Spends his first four posts or so vote-hopping onto jester and back off, all the time insisting that he's scum. We think he is testing the waters for a wagon. Teamhunting on early D1 is dumb from a town perspective but great from scum perspective because it lets them look like strong players while casting suspicion based on weak or nonexistent tells. Post 145: "This game was won during the RVS. If you want someone to sheep, sheep me." Post 187: he buddies himself with us. Post 249: he continues to try to orchestrate multiple lynches. Shortly thereafter, he posts a ridiculous number of "no I'm town, really" posts and manages to slide out of being lynched. Makes a case against nintendo; this interaction will be important once we have a flip. Later posts show a distinct trailing off of interest as the wagons shift elsewhere.

hiphop/rainbow - hiphop was pretty scummy for the whole KJ attack, and he lurked out just when the wagon on Vox was starting. Rainbow appears and immediately begins pushing hard for a massclaim, which, even if it were relevant, would be horrible for town. The next several posts are setup speculation on a mountainous setup. Post 408 contains this interesting clause: "it would otherwise hurt scum and clear a whole bunch of ponies." This is interesting because there is no way massclaiming could CLEAR anyone. Furthermore, rainbow claims that "I know this setup." Pause for a moment, class, and consider what role would know the setup in an open mountainous setup. This is a bizarre claim at any rate, and deserves further attention. Post 422 defends Vox while pushing for a lynch on Mairsil, an easy lynch, and sets up false dichotomies where if AV is scum, everyone he's attacking is town. Post 432 and 434 continue to defend Vox. "Give me a little time and I will find the scum on AV wagon. Gut says we have two." Slinging spaghetti and seeing which wagon sticks is not scumhunting.

malp/robot - they exist? malp posted once to say he was V/LA and robot hasn't shown up yet.

nintendo - amusingly votes Hiraki for lurking while most of his posts are one-liners both before and after. On further thought, this appears to be his playstyle and thus a null-tell. Post 296 is decently done and he has a few good points here and there that are out of line with what scum would want. We suppose that is the best reason we have for his not being scum; his stated desires frequently do not align with any decent scum strategy. We consider him to be null with bits of town thrown in.

Voided - Makes some decent arguments early on but does this nasty backtrack off the Hiraki wagon the minute pressure is applied to it. Post 185 shows the start of that and in post 198 he does a complete flip of his reads to make them perfectly align with ours. Post 214 he puts down a placeholder vote despite the fact that he's stated his reads by now. Overall is mostly surfing wagons that have already formed and taking the easy road. He is being nicely scummy while trying to appear townie.

We are willing to lynch Vox, Rainbow, robot, or Voided today. The deadline is coming up, so we would suggest the rest of the players decide that sooner rather than later, although Rainbow seems to have started consolidating top suspects already.

[Alnara]

UNVOTE: VoidedMafia
VOTE: AurorusVox

[Alnara]

OK I'm posting without my other head (who is usually the one to set the tone of the posts btw) because this game is driving me fucking INSANE. Page 21 on Day 1 with no end in sight (my bad about the deadline btw, I thought it was 2 weeks like most games around here) because no one is willing to form a wagon that actually lynches anyone. The reason we have a relatively low density of posts is because we comment when there is something to comment on and you guys have been talking yourselves around in circles for the past 10 pages or so. I think its time that you face the fact that NOTHING RELEVANT WILL HAPPEN just by waffling and doing nothing, and the only purpose it serves is to bore townies out of the game.

I suggest we lynch someone within the next 5 pages. Try to hit scum but at least hit SOMETHING so that we can move on tomorrow a little more sane and with a little more information.

Mr. Rainbow, you keep asking for "top votes." Consider our top vote to be on you. I would also highly recommend that whenever you finish collecting everyone's "top vote," we lynch the person with the most "top votes" for the aforementioned reasons.