Imperial Intrigue (Endgame, OUT OF NOWHERE)

[Otolia]

SleepyKrew daykilled me on his first post.
SleepyKrew pulled a pathetic gambit on flavor so that he could out VT which I totally disapproved and feel it should deserve a modkill.

Good luck on your game, Wraith.

[Otolia]

SleepyKrew daykilled me on his first post.
SleepyKrew pulled a pathetic gambit on flavor so that he could out VT which I totally disapproved and feel it should deserve a modkill.

Good luck on your game, Wraith.

You aren't even going to bother scumhunting or doing something positive before your death?

You spit on my face. I have no interest in playing this game anymore if you are in it and if it happens that you don't have a daykill, I'll probably ask for replacement. It's as easy as that. I thought you deserved another chance after the extremely bad showing in our last game together, I was proved that you are still as childish. I don't wanna get worked up for you, so you can keep your taunting to yourself - though this request will most likely fall into deaf ears.

In the event that I am not Daykill, I don't want to destroy the game for my replacement, so I'm not gonna divulge any information I might know right now until Wraith comes back.

[Otolia]

• A jester wouldn't make any sense in that flavor. An executioner is possible though (personal agenda)
  
• Loyalists
  are the town. Some of them have abilities, some not. We do not know if the House Argelev is among us but in any case house Argelev are the legitimate heirs to the throne and should be considered as such by all the VT (the
  Loyalists
  )
  
• The term 'Imperialists' don't makes much sense because it would means that those ones are the townies - since according to the flavor the Beran try to maintain the cohesion of the Imperium. It's a bad choice of word from SK and I believe that should prove that he was lying.
  
• I believe that some house may have alignment change capacity.

For presentation record, I am House Delmar, rulers of the great port of Mov Fovar.

@DX

: It is possible that SK is bringing personal issues from another game. He stated after out last game that he put me on his banlist.

[Otolia]

If House Argelev is the House we have to defend and considering that their representant might be ingame, I think they must be some sort of NK and alignment protected role. A town godfather of some sort. However considering that it is a game of power, it is possible that there might be more than one House Argelev fighting among us. Like differents heirs to the throne.

@Magua

: I understand what SK tried to achievedand playing on the flavor when people haven't been introduced completely to the game is something I dissaprove of, but that's just me and it has nothing to do with alignment more with my personal enjoyment of a mafia game. On the other hand, SK did use allegedly a DayKill ability in his first post for (more than likely) out of the game reasons, it's normal that I take it personally since I was targeted.

The key point now is : Is House Argelev among us or is House Argelev an outside House that the townies have to protect by eliminating all threats to them ? Or is House Argelev many people who try to struggle for power while the Loyalists try to protect them all ? Answering this question should give us our first lynch of the game.

Since it's so crucial,

everyone has to claim its House name

and if possible where they rule (for the fun)

----

SleepyKrew - House Keiger
tclawren - Claimed to belong to House Argelev
kdowns - Claimed to belong to House Argelev
David Xanados - Claimed (not very clear) to

be

House Argelev
manho - Claimed to be of house argelev and

loyalist

.
JGDA - House McKarn
Otolia - House Delmar
sodaspirit - Claimed to

be

House Argelev

That's a lot of people who either can't read a PM or there is indeed many House Argelev ... and the Loyalists have to think about their WinCon ...
----
Didn't see that at first :

We are Neighbors and his QT posts are reeking of scum.

I am not in any Neighborhood.

[Otolia]

To clarify.

I am a member of the House of Argalev. I am not a Loyalist, I am of the house itself. I come from the West, where I was trapped due to the last War.

PEdit: Bogre. He specifically said "What if", "What if", et cetera. Those were directed responses.

What is the exact wording of your PM ?

That's most likely to be forbidden by the rules

---

Is there really anything to suggest that this layout is specifically scum vs. town? I am getting the feeling that there is far more to it than that. I am thinking that the scum are a hidden faction and Argelev and its dissidents are too busy at each others throats to notice.

I am of House Morvanus, oldest and most loyal to House Argelev. It is my duty to do my utmost to eliminate all threats to House Argelev. At this stage the greatest threat to House Argelev is very clearly the one who has painted the rightful heir to the throne as scum.

vote: SleepyKrew

Read my posts. Is your resolve unqestionnable ?

[Otolia]

House Argelev is the town. I thought this was kind of obvious from the flavor and setup of the game, but whatevs. I suspect that a mass-House claim isn't going to be terribly useful to the Town, because the scum will be "traitors" within the Houses, maybe with some specific House goals to represent vendettas or something.

Can you please play along. I have something in mind and since you consider me as town, you have no reasons not to state your House Name and any kind of flavor that does not reveal your role.

[Otolia]

Otolia > If there's a specific part you are interested in, particularly if it's flavour related, I can doubtless paraphrase it. I'd run whatever I post in that respect past Wraith first though.

Magua > Given that SK and Otolia have/had an issue that actually arose in the signup thread, it was perfectly reasonable in my eyes that, had he drawn the role, he'd do something like that to spite Otolia. I fail to see how my reaction to the potential waste of what could have been one of our strongest assets is bad.

@Mod: Thanks. I feel rather foolish now, but at least we have clarification now.

Then try to paraphrase everything that isn't related to abilities or alignment (and not in italic)

[Otolia]

We have been an honorable liege to the rightful ruler for longer than any other. Our resolve cannot be questioned. In answer for your request of what lands we hold, the land is known as Anoria. The people, Anorians.

Alright thank you.

[Otolia]

Can you please play along. I have something in mind and since you consider me as town, you have no reasons not to state your House Name and any kind of flavor that does not reveal your role.

You being town and you being correct are two *wildly* different concepts.

I may be not right but I'd like your House name and any information that you could afford to say. David Xanatos did it so why wouldn't you ?

[Otolia]

If the true house Argelev, the one that the Loyalist are suppose to protect is indeed in game, I have flavor reasons to believe in David Xanatos for now. The word used to describe his flavors matches with mine. I won't use specifics since it could make it easy to counter claim but since so many people claimed to belong to House Argelev or to be House Argelev when the Loyalists has been clearly given differents names (that's a certainty) I think that lynching David Xanatos now is not a good idea.

And please, could you all claim the

name of your house

, not claiming it makes it easy to pinpoint you as someone having a greater role in the setup (compared to the loyalists whose role is known)

[Otolia]

Who claimed the port house? They're prob scum too.

That's me and I'd like more infos on that claim. And before pointing out fingers, you should read all my posts trying to explain the setup and numerously attempting to get people to claim their name. So I am also waiting for yours

[Otolia]

VOTE: Otolia

Do NOT claim houses ANYMORE. If even one more person claims their house, I will do everything in my power to make sure they die. In the meantime, Otolia dies for ignoring that I ALREADY TOLD HIM scum probably have an alternate wincon to kill of all rightful heirs.

I am sorry I missed that post. Effectively it changes everything and correspond to my own thinking on the topic. Now I find it funny that you attack me for that when your situation is clearly more precarious ... you know what I mean, mister I-choose-my-alignment ...

[Otolia]

And there is NO WAY you missed that post by anything other than on purpose. there are like two pages of content that are talking about nothing else.

Mistakes happen. I did missed your post as I went to sleep approximately at that time. I apologize but thete is little I can do besides that. Fortunately nobody listened to me, what you don't say though, is that before you explained your role people refused to claim house and these should be suspected (Magua is one)

[Otolia]

And there is NO WAY you missed that post by anything other than on purpose. there are like two pages of content that are talking about nothing else.

Mistakes happen. I did missed your post as I went to sleep approximately at that time. I apologize but thete is little I can do besides that. Fortunately nobody listened to me, what you don't say though, is that before you explained your role people refused to claim house and these should be suspected (Magua is one)

[Otolia]

Otolia, why did you think my kill was real?

You don't strike me as someone who particularly mannered, so I didn't speculate on it and waited for Wraith.

I think everyone should pay attention to what gandalf said in his second post. The name of the House is irrelevant except when the people are from House Argelev which means they are heirs to the throne. Do they fight among them, do the loyalists need to keep only one alive, do they have protective abilities ? Those are relevant questions, unfortunately I don't see a way we could get that right now.

However, I am fairly confident that DX know enough town flavor to prevent us from lynching him D1. Even though Wraith says that flavor is irrelevant, he might have forgotten someting. He mentionned a name that I have as heir to house Argelev which should from my PoV prove his innocence.

[Otolia]

I'm undecided about Otolia. On the one hand, I want to call his reaction to the fake daykill a newb tell because faking a daykill very early in the game is not uncommon, but on the other hand I don't know if the term "newb" is still correct.

What is strange in my reaction ? I was surprised at first, re-read the thread (because it was hard as hell to understand) write another post. After people were pretty much convinced it was a fake DayKill, I moved on and didn't talk about it. If that's your read on me, then my read on you is that you don't do enough for this game (read more likely to be scum in D1), there is much more you could have said but you decided to speak about something not game related. If SK and me were actually still arguing and insulting each other, it would makes sense but it doesn't right now.

So I'd like you to give another read on me.

[Otolia]

I am

The Motherfucking Entire Imperial Skyfleet, Loyalist Macho X-Shot Bulltetproof X-Shot Dayvig.

Flavor stuff:
I'm Macho because nobody can defend better than the Fleet.
I'm Bulletproof cause of armor.
I'm Dayvig cause of weaponnz.
Not revealing number of shots because that would be stupid.
I crumbed it when I "shot" Otolia, because "Death from above" is the Fleet's motto.

If I weren't

that

smart, I would probably say "Y U SO SERIOUS BRO !"

You are bad at making fakeclaim. Everyone here is a person and unless you have your tiny

weenie

Skyfleet in your pocket, I don't see how you could use it appropriately.

[Otolia]

Yeah I'm calling bullshit on DX. He needs to die sooner and quicker.

Care to elaborate ? I think exactly the opposite and I'd like to see your reasons.

[Otolia]

I just realized I worded that wrong :/
Should be "Stop pretending you are a Town PR when it's obvious you aren't" or
something simialr.

Irregardless, the rest of the convo should be pretty clear I think he's not a Town PR.

David (0)-
Samantha (0)-

Once again, I appreciate if you tried a little harder to understand the setup instead of overflooding people minds with your gambits ... DX didn't say he was a town PR, he said he was a heir which is some kind of town aligned group whose role is to survive collectively (I think we can summarize that way)

[Otolia]

Break this down. David is not a town PR because he thought Loyalist was a VT. David is not a VT because his role is not Loyalist.

David's role does not contain the word "Loyalist" in it at all.

David is not town.

Unless you didn't read gandalf's posts at all, I don't see why you would say that. Claiming House Argelev is claiming someone that the town has to protect (thus aligned with VT), gandalf's role assure and the flavor David Xanatos used is specifically similar to mine.

[Otolia]

It's so tempting to hammer SK to get rid of him ... but I believe he his aligned with me.

[Otolia]

Much as I didn't want to have to do this, it looks like I will.

Mason. With Monk.

Once again I am repeating myself :

David Xanatos is more than likely truthful when he claims to be House Argelev.

[Otolia]

No, there are multiple CLAIMED heirs.

Rightful means what it says. Only one person can be the RIGHTFUL heir. That's me.

Join me and I'll make you a Duke. Can't say fairer than that.

Are you playing to your WinCon ? I am legitimately doubting that with that post.

[Otolia]

How do you think he's *not* playing to his wincon?

I have reasons to be he could have a special importance for me (considering some mechanics are not revealed to us). His WinCon definitely have a survive condition (even an shared one with the other claimant), so why he is bragging about being

the

heir when that is detrimental to his WinCon and the WinCon of the

Loyalists

?

[Otolia]

How do you think he's *not* playing to his wincon?

I have reasons to be he could have a special importance for me (considering some mechanics are not revealed to us). His WinCon definitely have a survive condition (even an shared one with the other claimant), so why he is bragging about being

the

heir when that is detrimental to his WinCon and the WinCon of the

Loyalists

?

I'm pretty sure this is a non-town claim.

I'm pretty sure you are wrong. In the possibility of unknown mechanics, he

could

have have a special role based on the wording of his claim. Since our main source of setup infos, gandalf, stated that shouldn't be the case I don't want to comment on it anymore. But I am sure that I am town and that he is aligned with

[Otolia]

Yeah.

We can lynch monk and david together for being scum.
"Third Legion Stormtroopers Allied to the true Heir of the Throne." - monk

I see neither loyalist nor House Argelev in your claim. You are scum my friend.

unvote vote monk

That's the proof, you have a personal agenda or that you are a terrible player who didn't read the thread.

VOTE: vezokpiraka

[Otolia]

These votes for monk are just incredibad. Vezok has a certain tendency to be incredibad. Empking does not.

Empking has a tendency to vote hop on D1. Can you confirm and link to games where vezok has been a liability. Because for me it's either him or Empking today.

[Otolia]

Alright, that was bad enough.

VOTE: Empking

[Otolia]

The Factional is IGMEOY but I understand the basically now.

Unvote, Vote: Ot

That was the most suspicious you ever done. Unless you are mixing this game with another one we are both in, you have absolutely no backing in your vote. And RVS is long gone now. So you better explained yourself on that.

[Otolia]

That was the argument of AGar but he dropped it without much explanation. You better have one. I am the leader of the port city and I am loyal to the Argelev beyond doubt. That's why I can assure that the heir I know about (David Xanatos) is aligned with me. You are ready to vote for DX because his flavor quotes are bad but you used that argument against me. Your logic is flawed.

DX gave us his flavor to back up his claims, you are asked to back up your accusations right now.

[Otolia]

EBDP : The above message is adressed to Empking of course.

[Otolia]

Oh yeah. Your flavour matches DX suggesting you're not a Loyalist. You have claimed not be of House Arglelov (or whatever) making you non-town.

Stop BSing me. You are making yourself look dumb right now. Name of House =/= alignment except for the heirs of House Argelev. You are not reading the thread carefully enough to make assumptions based on your supposed intelligence.

Can you answer that question :

Why is the port claim a scum-tell ?

If you can't, then you voted for me in order to blend in and thus you are scum.

[Otolia]

If you can't, then you voted for me in order to blend in and thus you are scum.

That's lolworthy. "You went out on a limb to vote a player no one else was voting to blend in."

You claimed to not be a loyalist.
You claimed not to be of the house of (whatever)
That is a scum claim.

A quick ISO would have informed you that I claimed my name and the city I rule (Port of Mos Fovar) in my third post. I never claimed Loyalist because my actions are town-like that I don't need to claim it.

So why is me claiming to be the ruler of a port is scummy ? How is that ?

PS : Don't use "Wraith said it doesn't matter" to get out of the slump you are in right now.

[Otolia]

Umm...
Mod said flavor doesn't matter.
Stop saying flavor matters.

You don't understand do you ?

Empking said I was scum because I was the ruler of a port. That's downright stupid. It's not on the same scale as DX claim, not even one bit. He made a mistake and I won't give up until he can provide sufficient elements to back up his accusations. Which won't happen because he is scum or not aligned with the Loyalists directly (and both are lynch worthy from my PoV)

@SK : Your RVS questions are not that useful right now. You played your gambit and that's fine, but don't drag us in pseudo-discussions about Mafia techniques, it's not what we need right now. We need to lynch Empking. David Xanatos can wait another day as vezok can.

[Otolia]

Oto is deliberately misrepresenting me.

If Oto isn't a Loyalist and not of the right house then he's scum. Or in other words: He's scum.

You want me to claim I am a Loyalist ? You bet I am. Now and ever, my alignment can't be change. And don't start to whine about misrepresentation you are a better player than that.

[Otolia]

No I already said that I meant the Beran part than the port itself. And you were pretending otherwise, that's complete misrepresentation.

I dare you to prove it. You used an excuse ('sorry can't remember names -derp') to say it was the Delmar part that makes me scummy when you said in your 2nd post that it is the port. Alright then, it's still as far-fetched as before but now, you can say why you thought it made me scum. But I suspect you can't because you lied about that. Or you crumbled for other purposes.

Who claimed the port house? They're prob scum too.

You voted twice for me without any informations (like you always do by the way)

Vote: Oto

The Factional is IGMEOY but I understand the basically now.

Unvote, Vote: Ot

[Otolia]

"Who claimed the port

house

?"

Its the port

city

if you want to play it your way. I specifically said House.

Then what post made you write that, and how is this post (mentioning the '

port house

') made you vote for me ?

[Otolia]

"Who claimed the port

house

?"

Its the port

city

if you want to play it your way. I specifically said House.

Then what post made you write that, and how is this post (mentioning the '

port house

') made you vote for me ?

The post...where you claimed?

Stop playing dumb, Empking. You are just writing BS hoping I will get mad and drop the case. This will not happen.

I claimed : House Delmar, leader of the port city of Mos Forvar. Exactly here

What in this claim is scummy ?

Reminder :

Who claimed the port house? They're prob scum too.

If you don't find this claim scummy, then why did you vote for me

twice

without

any

kind of reasoning behind.

@Everyone

: Empking's wagon needs more vote.

[Otolia]

@MacDougall

: stop being a chicken and vote for someone. What kind of player vote No Lynch the first of a Large Theme ... Hint : Vote for Empking.

[Otolia]

Heuy can people not vote me until we get another vote count. Thanks.

Translation : People don't hammer me before I can fake-claim.

[Otolia]

I am not a member of House Argelev either. I'm town for the moment. You can be a Loyalist without being Argelev(such as the colonists living in America who were still loyal to Britain during the revolution).

Yes but he suggested he wasn't a loyalist either.

You have either to stop lying or to start reading the thread.

You want me to claim I am a Loyalist ? You bet I am. Now and ever, my alignment can't be changed.

By the way, what you did wasn't a softclaim, it was just a maneuver to delay the claim. It's the thing scum are most inclined to do when they feel they will be lynch. You know it and it's a shame I can't prove that you know because it would need me to link an ongoing game.

[Otolia]

Here is all the messages mentionning the Bulletproof. He is clearly lying about something.

I am

The Motherfucking Entire Imperial Skyfleet, Loyalist Macho X-Shot Bulltetproof X-Shot Dayvig.

Flavor stuff:
I'm Macho because nobody can defend better than the Fleet.
I'm Bulletproof cause of armor.
I'm Dayvig cause of weaponnz.
Not revealing number of shots because that would be stupid.
I crumbed it when I "shot" Otolia, because "Death from above" is the Fleet's motto.

The BP was a lie.

How is Macho BP Dayvig a contradiction?

I claimed X-Shot BP. Meaning once I ran out of shots, I couldn't be protected. I'm dumb, but I know how to fake a claim.

Hey gandy, you'll notice I'm not BP if you *gasp* read.

[Otolia]

And the apprehensiveness? Probably that Emp was the big PR on your team.

Care to explain the use of

you

r here ? Since Empking is dead and was town, are you suggesting Mac Dougall is town or are you suggesting you are not aligned with Empking.

I still need to understand how Empking could be town, SK post fury may have blurry his defense but I am still puzzled by what I pushed for. I am still as bad in D1 as ever.

Can someone post a wall in spoiler on MacDougall including citations and arguments ? That'de be nice. I'd rather not lynch another PR though it's unlikely the Loyalists have PR alive now ...

[Otolia]

The color blue did fool me. My bad. ><

[Otolia]

So Shinki wasn't detective then. O.o Well, that's surprising.

No it's not. She perfectly soft-claimed Gunsmith when she said '

tell me about your killing powers, Mr. Scum

'. She was wrong about the scum part since StrangerCoug was a third party but it doesn't matter anymore. He is unlikely to have a ally anymore.

The scum group is likely to be Eastern now. Reasonable estimation has them being at most 2 with killing abilities. The town had a day vig (SleepyKrew) and a a claimed Night Vig, so it's unlikely we have any other killing roles. A protective role was certainly implemented to work with the beloved part of David Xanatos role. After that we certainly have a roleblocker.

One question remains now : Who is doing the second kill ?

Another Third Party or Another Scum Group or both of them are due to an unknown factor (compulsive paranoid gun-owner) ? What are your thoughts on that ?

@kdowns : Any kills tonight ?

For the time being : VOTE: MattP for thinking he can cruise through Day 4 like if it were Day 1.

[Otolia]

I said StrangerCoug was a Third Party (and thus alone) because the name of his faction is the name of his house. It's different that

Eastern

or even

Loyalist

. Maybe it is a scumgroup, but it doesn't matter. I also said there was another scumgroup aside from the

Eastern

and it doesn't matter if this another scumgroup is

Bremburg

or not. Foccusing your attention on that minor point of my speech is a proof that you have low interest in seeing motivations behind actions and thus earns you suspicion - though vezok might just be not making sense.

@PeregrineV

: When someone opens the Day 4 of a game where there have been a lot of NK, it is suspicious to post one-liner commenting on something that is irrelevant now. He didn't make too much of an effort throughout the game. It's time to wake up.

Which brings me to point out kdowns, Nero Cain, SodaSpirit along with manho for blindly following the wagon. If you voted against MattP for my reasons, then you are doing the same thing that you accuse him of, if you have another reason, please tell us.

@EtherealCookie

: You don't know what a Gunsmith do, do you ? It's an investigating role, thus Shinki couldn't have given out any gun. And please, hit preview before posting.

[Otolia]

UNVOTE: MattP

Though this wagon wasn't really supposed to achieve anything except get MattP to post more, it draw out WAY too much people. As a remainder, kdowns, Nero Cain, SodaSpirit, mbstokem voted for MattP without ANY valid reason. manho is the only one so far to have unvoted. I consider everyone else to be somewhat scummy.

As it looks right now, the day will be about lynching either vezok, SodaSpirit or MacDougall. Since the latter is on the frying pan, I am down on voting him.

VOTE: MacDougall

@AGar

: Do you think we could be in a LyLy situation after 2 consecutive days of lynching non town-aligned ? You speculation kinda makes me wonder what time is still available ... And also why Soda instead of MacDougall ? Sure Soda looks scummy like all the people who voted for

@MacDougall

:

• Why do you keep saying you are a Loyalist ?
• Do you have any alignment changing possibility/abilities ?
• Why in SodaSpirit would be a good lynch for today ?

And please don't use the 'I've already replied to that'-trope, if you already did, quote yourself clearly.

[Otolia]

Edit :

@AGar : Do you think we could be in a LyLy situation after 2 consecutive days of lynching non town-aligned ? You speculation kinda makes me wonder what time is still available ... And also why Soda instead of MacDougall ? Sure Soda looks scummy like all the people who voted for MattP, but does he deserve special treatment ?

[Otolia]

What I see from the defense of MacDougall :

• He is trying to deflect the lynch unto vezokpiraka. That means he thinks he is valuable than vezokpiraka. He is either a town PR, or a scum.
  
• He is using the frustration argument, one I know perfectly. Whereas most of the time, it is used by frustrated townies, it is a general appeal to emotion. It is not an argument but a testimony of weakness.
  
• Whereas he seems to like walls, he isn't prone to quote himself. When you speak the truth, you can quote yourself easily. When you are not ...

[Otolia]

@kdowns

: Why did you unvote ?

@Magua

: What was that fake DayKill ? Did you have a particular objective when you did that, was it realized ?

@SodaSpirit

: Posting eye-liners is getting you nowhere, please take the time to show us a little bit more of your play. Of vezok, you and MacDougall, which one is the most scummy to you ?

[Otolia]

Even though I'm not feeling MacDougall, he has the decency to play. Since the wagon on MacDougall is getting nowhere, I'll be willing to vote for someone else.

VOTE: SodaSpirit

[Otolia]

Otolia, on the other hand, says that Empking was third party. This seems pretty obviously false, not only from flavor, but also from Empking being a Rolecop which really only makes sense for a faction as opposed to an individual. Unlike what tclawren did, this doesn't look like it betrays inside information. That's the difference.

I said that StrangerCoug was third party. You should revise your position ><

[Otolia]

I said that StrangerCoug was third party. You should revise your position ><

I should revise my position that you're town?

I don't know if you should describe me as town or scum. I think my D1 actions makes me either a townie or a member of the second scumgroup. But one thing is sure, you were wrong.

[Otolia]

Though I know it's very difficult for scum to win a lynched or be lynched situation, I'm reluctant to use it in this situation. I'm not sure it's really useful against MacDougall. Let's see what Magua and Andrius have to say about it.

Concerning the wake-up of SodaSpirit, I don't think you can get anyone to claim right now. It looks very suspicious to ask for claims when yourself is highly suspected. And please don't try to divert the lynch unto vezok, that's just bad.

@PeregrineV : You better start pushing for my lynch or vote someone else, compared to AGar's case, it's weak.