Mini 413 - Famous CATS - Over! Quit pussyfooting around!

[Primate]

VOTE MASSIVE

whooooo

[Primate]

GAME ON

vote wizardcat

[Primate]

Oh my god, mafiascum is suffering an epidemic of players who can't put a cohesive, clearly stated post together. I'm SO glad I made my return! Yeesh.

Are you just whining, or do you think we should go after someone else instead?

[Primate]

hmm. I had assumed that it was a joke, the first post was hardly a serious thing.

Carbon Copy is fairly obviously an experienced player faking it. The few newbs there are don't post like that. The moods there, but not the words.

And zindie, it can't be someone outside the playerlist. Strange suburbs had a mechanic where a player was added to a normal 12 player setup after a day, and that had to go in the theme park, so I doubt very much that this would be any different.

[Primate]

Personally, Zindie, I think you're more likely to be CC than anybody else.

I figured it was either him, or maybe you.

No-one else really has the experience with battlemage. I looked afterwards, though, and glorks right, that quote thing is an emulation of battlemage.

[Primate]

I'd prefer to kill zindie, then watch CC try and squirm it's way out, still under the facade of 'not zindie'. be hilarious.

[Primate]

Reading back though, I'm unsure. Zindies much more plausible, but I wouldn't be at all surprised if it was glork.

[Primate]

what's your rolename?

[Primate]

Sorry zindie, but that's a complete fabrication.

[Primate]

vote carbon copy

[Primate]

If zindie has anything other than his two-role thing, he should claim it fairly soon, if not now, I reckon.

[Primate]

and zindie?

[Primate]

But we started the game during the day. There was no night. How could you have gotten an extra role?

[Primate]

so, if we were going to lynch either of your two personas, which one would you prefer it to be?

[Primate]

Zilly Primate. Why must we lynch one of the personas? Neither is fiction.

The plausibility of that rolename is the only thing stopping Zindie from being fairly obvious scum. Suggesting that it confirms him is totally naive.

[Primate]

Oh please. You and I both know that this is nothing like a mason group. Mason groups normally contain two people. If in a normal game someone started ranting about being a mason with himself, yes, I would be skeptical.

Stop trying to hide under the veneer of respectability provided by the mason claim you're trying to push.

[Primate]

That's a

real

stretch though isn't it? The entire strength about mason groups, the one thing that makes them worthwhile is the fact that two people can confirm each other. I could confirm myself to myself now, and it wouldn't have any more weight than what you've tried to do there. The fact that you have two accounts is cute, but it still doesn't go beyond 'I am innocent because I say I am innocent'. Leaving the mafia to deal with you is also a complete avoidance of the issue anytime soon, seeing as you've been scummy enough to last quite a way into this game, and the double account factor will get people twitchy earlier than they probably should be, making you a prime mislynch opportunity.

I do agree there has been relatively little discussion today. Problem is, actually doing any other relevant discussion with an elephant in the room like this. Can't do any harm waiting for non contributors though.

[Primate]

Is there a reason for and of this? Barring Zindies utter OMGUS, that is.

[Primate]

I should have just done this from the beginning.

I am Little Nicky, future clone.

I represent two cloned, identical, cats. Because of this, I have two lives. Lynch me and I won't die etc.

My role and Zindies Role are near

identical

. Do you really think that this town has two sets of multiple life townies?

@Zindie: Way to stretch like hell.

[Primate]

I'm not entirely sure what it is, but if there's a scum who pushed for a Zindaras/CC claim or lynch, I definitely think that it's much more likely to be primate than either Thesp or myself.

Thesp is a spanner >=(

[Primate]

often used? I assume you're embellishing the truth there, again. When you say 'often used', you mean, 'is not completely unknown'.

There are very few famous cats, you know. It's funny because I did a bit of research about famous cats for Kitten Mafia, a game I'm hosting elsewhere.

There's what? 9, maybe 8 townies in this game? I'm sure you managed to come up with 9 famous cats. And even if he did, he wouldn't use such similar abilities on such similar roles.

And your idealistic defence of your omgus is noted.

[Primate]

Primate's role claim is ridiculous in the face of a proven similar role, and his role doesn't match his role. Claiming to be a "future clone" (Nicky has already been cloned) and purporting lynch immunity doesn't make sense.

This is bizarre. I counterclaim Zindie, and you use it as a point against

me

that our roles are too similar? Well, no shit sherlock. That's what a counterclaim is. And I don't have lynch immunity. I have two lives. Lynch me, and I won't die. Cause I still have a life left, y'know? Maybe the reason you got speedlynched in that other game was because you were paying as little attention and making such meaningless points as you are in this one, f.y.i.

'PS: Primate's role isn't actually like Zindaras's role, which offers him a second vote as well.

No. His is strictly better, and due to it's composition, is much more likely to be held by scum. And are you genuinely saying that there isn't much similarity between townie with two lives vs townie with two lives + two votes? Saying that the fact I don't have have two votes makes our roles different almost seems like it's purposefully making an attempt to miss the larger issue.

Im very happy with my vote.

Zindiras acted scummy and was forced to claim, then was counterclaimed, and you guys still give him the benefit of the doubt? How stupid is that? Did you miss the earlier post where

in the same post

he tried to get me mislynched on a role basis and at the exact same time tried to convince me that both our roles could exist in the same game? And this is double life townie. It's not like it's a common role. And it's not like two of them will exist in the same game on the same side.

Lynch me and I won't die, but that doesn't stop it being terminally stupid.

[Primate]

#1: It's not mentioned. Common sense and precedent suggests yes. I will ask though.

#2: From what I gather, only I will be informed. I may be wrong. I'll ask.

#3: I'm probably missing the upside to this being public knowledge. Is there one? Surely it's a good idea to convince the mafia that the first is true, even if it isn't?

[Primate]

I see few compelling reasons why we shouldn't get this sorted as soon as possible, really.

[Primate]

I would prefer for this to be sorted by tomorrow than to put it off to lynch someone random.

Unless you genuinely believe there to be two townies with two lives in this town, it seems a much more sensible play to lynch one of us today, deal with the other by vig(failing that, lynch) than it does to run up someone else, risk getting a more valuable role to claim, and putting deciding this off until later in the game.

Not to mention the fact that the the question you're asking about relies on the mafia effectively killing a vanilla townie, which isn't exactly bad.

[Primate]

He's gone again?

Blahgo was the first person I ever lynched. *wistful*

[Primate]

1. As soon as Zindie claimed the flavour of being a cloned cat, I knew he was lying, hence the 'complete fabrication'. I then proceeded to try and drive a lynch on him without having to claim fully. I figured that my hinting of role info and the points I was pointing out against him, alongside the way he conducted himself before, and the simple nature of the role, may be enough to lynch him without the legit counterclaim. A townie would not just say 'That's my role!' if it thought it could get a lynch on the target without saying so, especially a role like mine, that could have been targeted by the mafia, allowing me to soak up a kill, something that will now never happen. Are you saying that if a mafioso claims doc, the real doc should immediately come out and counterclaim, without trying to get the person lynched for being a dirty claim-faker first?

And I can be an ass all I want, it doesn't make me any more likely to be scum. You don't seem to understand the 'lynch immunity' thing. I represent two cats, the original and the clone. If you lynch me, a cat will die. But there's still another cat left, so I am still alive. The same will happen if I am nightkilled.

2. Look. Saying that I 'seem to think' is a little off. From my point of view, it is my role, a multiple lives townie, v.s. Zindie's role, a multiple lives townie with both lives in different accounts, two votes, and one account is mod-confirmed. Games rarely include two roles with one strictly superior to the other (with the exception of restricted townies), so from my point of view, Zindie is a very likely scum. Saying that I should look at all of this objectively is something I can try to do, but it's not my natural train of thought.

Objectively, I'd probly think him scum too. There was the things I pointed out, and also the fact that I've never seen a role like his in the hands of a townie, and I've seen identical and similar roles in the hands of a few scum. It's of a similar nature to a roleblocker, as in, there's no reason it

can't

be more frequently town, it's just it doesn't seem to occur to mods to give it to a townie.

3 just seems an excuse for a cheap shot. You even use 'word in quotation marks to show i dont believe it'. But anyway.

Pm sent now. I didn't do it yesterday. It was, like, 1am when I made that post.

[Primate]

just got the PM back.

The game will go to night, you will be informed if I lose a life.

I'll address zindie when I get back from the shops.

[Primate]

Vote Zindaras

<---not the scum one.

[Primate]

Vote: Primate

at least until he explains himself.

I'm not entirely sure what you want me to explain. I didn't think this setup would include two townies with such similar abilities. It did. there were other reasons why I thought Zindie scummy, but all were secondary to this fact. I'm not trying to divert the suspicion onto my role here, and I understand that I am 100% responsible for my actions, but there isn't really anything else to explain. You yourself said that you didn't think that two townies like us would be in this game. A fine assumption, and one that is completely wrong, apparently.

If the thing you're asking me to explain is why I wasn't vigged last night, then I have absolutely no idea why this was the case. I should have been.

[Primate]

Yeah, just like I was a safe claim provided by the mod, right?

Right

?

*sighs*

There could be a vig. Phoebus was probably a Survivor. I don't understand why Thesp got, well, vigged, apparently.

Phoebus was Bill Clintons Dog. Thesp was sent to Washington. I mean, I guess it's possible the connection is coincidental , but I'm assuming Phoebes was an SK.

[Primate]

Win conditions.

Our goal is to kill the fictional cats, the fictional cats want to kill the actual cats. Therefore, Phoebus, a dog, would not fall under the win conditions put forth.

That's why I thought Phoebus was a Survivor. But you have a point with the Washington thing.

Actually, looking at wiki, you're probably right. Slippers was apparantly a stray cat that hung around the white house during the Clinton Administration. That explains the call.

[Primate]

As to why I'd vote DrippingGoofball ... I don't trust his Z-posting "restriction" and I think the tie to his "claimed role" is incredibly loose at best.

However, I did get to thinking about yesterday and last night, and it dawned on me reading Glork's summation that I do in fact know Primate is lying about his role. Would you like to explain, Primate, or shall we go on the premise of "Lynch All Liars"?

vote Primate

You have a list of words that you can use to prove to me that you are who you say you are. Use one or I explain nothing.

[Primate]

FoS: Primate

If he's the person I think he is, he knows exactly why I left the things I did out of my roleclaim, and if he wants me to tell everyone else in the town his role, like his actions would suggest, then I have no quibble doing so.

If can't prove he is that person (and it would be really easy to) then, I'm not claiming someone uninvolved role for them.

And considering the minor nature of the thing I left out, I would be very surprised if he's anyone other than that person. Because there's nothing else I lied about, and I doubt this is big enough to be picked up by an investigative role.

[Primate]

Sorry for the delay, y'all, I was at a monster truck rally.

And contrary to both your points, Primate, I do not think (a) that your lie is merely something that you can brush off nor (b) that your explanation of said lie, if you are town, necessitates explaining what my role is.

Post #119 should have made you strongly suspicious of the fact that I was lying, and was meant as a direct comment, to you, to make sure that you knew I was lying and were ok with it.

And if you look at the 'lies' I made, they were made to disguise the part that your role had to play. If I had claimed my role as is, simply leaving out your involvement, then people would have asked 'how', and then I would have had to claim a large proportion of your role too. And bearing in mind that you know my full role, do you really think it's that different from what I claimed to make me a full-blown liar?

There was the second thing, but the reason I left that out is so blatantly obvious its degrading to bring it up.

[Primate]

My role isn't playing any part in your lie, at this moment. Nor, I doubt, will it in the future.

I did not pay any attention to post 119, because, in all honesty, you had been argumentative and grumpy up to that point, and I took your post to just be more of your general mean-spiritedness, and I had no idea what you meant by it, so I passed over it.

I have a better idea than most about your role. I have little-to-no idea about your alignment, save for what the thread has provided me. Looking back at it now, I guess I'm wondering why you would have been so aggressive against Zindaras knowing that your counter-claim was based on a lie.

Do you want to just come out with what you think I was lying about? And I do assume you do now see what my intentions were with post #119? Especially with who I directed it at? You know more than 'a better idea than most', you know my full role, every single little detail of it. Are you saying that you wouldn't have been remotely suspicious, if you had my role, if someone else claimed a multiple life townie? And baring that in mind, how exactly would you counterclaim, under the circumstances? And baring

that

in mind, if you were counterclaiming, would you put in the details that would inevitably lead to me having to claim your role? If you say that you wouldn't counterclaim, then fair enough. Posterity proves you right, but I still think it was a mistake.

And my counter-claim was not based on a lie. I am a multiple life townie, Zindie is also one. Call it an overly simplistic view if you want, but I think the obscurity of the two life role made me justified in my view. And there was also the history of the role, and Zindies behaviour, which, I will admit, made me think about it a little less than.

So, then, massive. Feel free to claim my full role for me. I don't think I breadcrumbed the word "Future Clone", but that's a minor point.

[Primate]

And my counter-claim was not based on a lie. I am a multiple life townie, Zindie is also one. Call it an overly simplistic view if you want, but I think the obscurity of the two life role made me justified in my view. And there was also the history of the role, and Zindies behaviour, which, I will admit, made me think about it a little less than I should of, as I thought I was hitting scum anyway, so it's not like everything was hinging on the counterclaim from my point of view anyway.

[Primate]

I'm focusing too hard on Primate now and I know I'm missing something. Probably many things. I need to put it out of my mind for a bit, I think. It's obvious no one cares at this time, so it can be tabled.

Naw, feel free. Claim my role for me, release your point into the open. Unless you're conceding my point about not being able to claim my role without claiming yours, that is?

Zindaras (7, 0): Glork, DrippingGoofball, theopor_COD, Phoebus, Dragon Phoenix, Thesp, Primate

Am unsure. There was a major point I disliked about Glork when he was pushing the Zindiewagon, DGB seems more in her plotting scum mode than her useless town, and Theopr's last post was godawful. DP's probably town though.

[Primate]

why does a cat known for falling asleep give out inventions?

[Primate]

Theo got his double vote off

someone

, too.

[Primate]

I'll reread the thread soon.

ditto.

I actually reread the thread a few days ago, but it annoyed me. I'll do so again shortly.

[Primate]

If massive genuinely doesn't mind me full roleclaiming, then I'm happy to do so.

I think I made the offer a while back, and he didn't take me up on it.

[Primate]

He knows everything I'm about to say.

Either he says it then I confirm it, or I say it then he confirm it.

I guess it's really just the fact that I'd like the opportunity to do my own defense. Massive wants me lynched. I don't think he'll put much effort into explaining.

[Primate]

Primate, what exactly are you saying about Massive? You have to post your posts in preview tohim and he has to approve it or something?

No, massive knows my full role. However, for me to claim, I'd have to claim a large chunk of his role, too. I want to know whether he's ok with that.

Primate's eagerness to claim with so little pressure, and so few people asking for it, makes it look he might be scum eager to carry out a pre-arranged plan. Like he made up a claim, and thinks it's brilliant, and can't wait to get it out.

You may, have noticed, dear DGB, that I have actually already claimed. Saying I'm eager to drop the final things left is misled, especially considering they are being used as covert points against me.

Claiming my full role won't clear me, though. I just think that massive is wrong about my motivations.

I think it's a little odd the mindset of people tying me to Glork, though. I'm not a fan of Glrok this game at all, but considering Glork's gung-ho attitude towards bussing, he would be much more active to lynch me, especially considering I'm a double lifer, if he were scum with me. Glorks not the kind of player to put himself in position like the one he was day 1 then get cold feet about following up day 2.

[Primate]

It's not so much that I can't explain it, more that I don't really see it.

I just don't really see the way that I am tied to Glork. You're just tying him to me.

[Primate]

Can you at least direct me to the posts you see me distancing myself from Glork in?

[Primate]

Glork, are you just basing this off the one in Mythical Monsters?

(Fwiw, I've seen two scum double lifers including the MM one, one was GF, other wasn't)

[Primate]

You're naive if you think anyone other than a vig is going to take away a life, and if we had a vig, it would have happened

last

night.

[Primate]

No insult meant, but I wouldn't be surprised if the mod screwed up. It was a clarification to begin with. He definitely said it should say, though. I'll send the PM's he sent to me back.

[Primate]

Ok. I'm Little Nicky. My role title is Future Clone. My flavour is that I can clone myself, but I haven't actually got the money to do so myself.

Massive happens to have a large amount of money. I know how much he has, but he should say that, if he wants to. Night one, he gave me $50,000 which I used to clone myself, which I did during day one.

If he decided to give me another $50,000, I could do so again, giving me three lives.

Every night, I get to send a begging letter to Massive in order to get money. He replies with a yes or a no in the morning scene.

The 'lie' I made day one was that I said I was a double life townie, when in actuality I was a single life townie who could easily gain extra lives. The reason I claimed in the way I did was because if I had counterclaimed as 'a townie who could easily gain extra lives', then it was fairly obvious that the next question made by the town would have been "well, how can you gain extra lives", meaning that I would have either had to be hugely vague about the whole thing, or out massive (or thesp, as I thought at the time) as the person writing the messages at the beginning of the day, and the person giving out boons to townies. So instead of saying what I was, I claimed double life townie, figuring that it was't a huge problem, Zindie would come up scum, and I could be in a near confirmed position, maybe a position where the mafia might actually waste two kills on me, only to be surprised by the fact I actually had a third life. That was more of a pipedream, though. They were the two things I lied about. One was obfuscating Massives role, the other was the fact that my top is two when it is really three.

Few other things. In my first begging letter, I subliminally claimed Little Nicky in a fairly unambiguous way, a way I clarified in my second. I also said I wanted $50,000 or $100,000, and that if he knew my name, then he could easily divine my real role. In the begging letter, I also gave a list of words that we could use to recognize each other. One of these words was Spanner, which I aimed directly at thesp (who had claimed the letter-leaver, and I thought was my benefactor), figuring that he would be able to put it together and realise what I was doing. I guess I just I just figured that if I was tiptoeing around the truth, it would be nice if someone I was fairly certain was pro-town knew exactly what I was doing.

I'll ask the mod if I can post my begging letters, seeing as I wrote them.

(also, this is why I think massive is pro-town. I don't see any scum giving abilities to pro-town people without having any idea what they do, when they could easily just decide not to, and retain their anonymity. The chance of randomly giving someone a cop investigation could be too much. Aside from the fact that a scum with the role he has would just be really lame.)

Think that's pretty much it.

[Primate]

The big obvious letter saying yes/no, yes/no, yes/no. I'm one of the yes/no's. I've no idea who the other two are.

[Primate]

why?

[Primate]

Oh ok. I don't know for certain that Massive is the person leaving the letters. I was just assuming. It seemed to fit, and there was the thing that the exact same letter dropped in the street contained a similar gimmick to the one I had just sent in a PM to massive. .I figured that there were three people who wanted money, and that was massives approval/disapproval for giving them it. I could be wrong.

[Primate]

I'm hardly tripping over myself as I go along. I claimed Little Nicky in a PM to massive night one, and I wanted $50,000 from him, the exact same amount that the real life little nicky needed to clone himself. If I'm making this up, I would have had to invent this all up night one, had my false claim down pat from the moment I sent that PM to massive. Not saying it's impossible, but it does prove I'm not making this up as I go along, like you suggest.

And you're a dumbass if you're saying "We already know that Zindie and Carbon Copy are the cloned cats." like it some kind of major revelation. That's what the entirety of day one was about.

Keep up, DGB. For someone who's been playing so long, you're awfully slow.

[Primate]

This has nothing to do with my role. You're voting me over the fact that I failed to guess massives role properly.

[Primate]

1. The initial claim of Little Nicky from the first PM is NOT "fairly unambiguous", as it's a string of letters that make zero practical sense without the explanation from the second PM. The second PM claims that the Muse song that the string of letters is from is featured prominently in, I guess, the Adam Sandler movie of the same name ... I've never seen it. But it also appears on one of their other albums ... but I'm not a Muse fan either, so it's all just a matter of pushing the "I Believe" button here.

It appeared on the album Showbiz and the little Nicky Soundtrack. Feel free to try and come up with anything else it could mean. And I was saying that once you know what it is, it is fairly ambiguous, as in it couldn't really be anything else.

2. I can't imagine why Primate would know how much money I have.

I don't think, had I been Primate, that I would have been so gung-ho about lynching Zindaras / Carbon Copy. The two roles aren't just different, they're COMPLETELY different. I mean, we're talking "two bodies" v. "can buy extra lives" -- it's not even close. It just doesn't follow if Primate is a townie. Sure, you can try and pressure to get him lynched, but falsely counterclaiming to do so seems like a real stretch, and while I've not played with Primate before, he doesn't seem like a bad enough player to think (a) we wouldn't eventually notice the dissimilarities and (b) that, if Zindaras / Carbon Copy came up town, that we wouldn't try and lynch him next, thus tying up the town in unfruitful lynches for what would most likely be days.

However, if Primate is Mafia, then Primate knew Day One that he was going to have at least ONE extra life because I paid him $50K ... so he knew, no matter what, that at the end of Day One that no one would have any info on him. He could put his neck out, and if he got lynched, it would be no problem -- he could talk the town into lynching Zindaras / Carbon Copy the next day, and probably get a third life from me, and by then it would be WAY too late for the town to recover.

I do, generally, get more the feeling that THAT is how things were supposed to go down.

Massive, I pretty much flat out disagree with you that the roles are completely different. You could say the same thing about a full rolecop and a normal cop being 'totally different roles' because they do entirely different things, but it doesn't make it any more likely that they will be in the same game together.

And you seem to be pretty much ignoring the flavour aspect. Zindaras claimed two utterly autonomous cats. He also claimed that these two cats had that autonomy because of the fact they were cloned. However, I 'knew' that Zindie was lying out of his ass, because I also happened to represent two identical cloned cats, and

that is

not

what cloning does in this game

. Cloning gives you extra lives.

I'm a little bemused as to how, in your plan, you make sense of me getting a third life from you at a time when it was very unlikely you would give it. Also the way you put forward it as this totally awesome scum plan when it involves me getting myself lynched twice in exchange for one town mislynch.

PS: I love the way people are treating a mafia role that could have three lives day 1 in a mini game like it's plausible.

Also, I got a PM back from the mod. He basically said that if I had lost a life, it would be in there. Seeing as how it's not in there, I guess I didn't lose a life.

[Primate]

PS: I love the way people are treating a mafia role that could have three lives day 1 in a mini game like it's plausible.

What do you mean? That 3 lives on a later day is much more plausible? I tend to believe it impossible that anyone could have more then 2 lives, unless the game had a severe way of balancing that. (extra lynches, lots of NKers, etc.)

Yeah, you're right. Having the lives later is pretty much the same. It's a holdover from an argument I was earlier planning on making. Basically, if the person in massives role gave me all the money n1 and we had 12 people to begin with, then it would put the town in lynch or lose day 1, which is ridiculous. Assuming that Phoebus is a survivor who sided with scum, it could mean that the town would have already lost by day 1, never getting a chance to lynch scum. That said, though, we didn't start with 12, we started with 13. The arguments not entirely moot, as it would still mean that the mafia could numerically match the town day 2, which is a little implausible, but there is obvious a non-mafia killer out there, and considering that the mafia would very likely have to out themselves in order to do it, it's not implausible to suggest that there are mechanisms to deal with that.

So yeah, that's the argument I was touching on with that paragraph, but it fell a little short, so I didn't include it.

@Theo: Does your kill method match up with either of the two people who died?

[Primate]

Why?

[Primate]

I also don't understand why "Theo 'killed' Primate, but since Primate has an extra life, he didn't actually die" isn't what you are tentatively going with, though I probably missed something in the last few pages.
Suppose Theo "killed" Primate who didn't die due to his extra life. Suppose DGB was roleblocked. Suppose somebody can grant double-votes and just doesn't want to claim right now. Is this so far-fetched?

Dun work. Bertrand said that I would recieve a faux death scene if I had lost a life. The kill was prevented by other means doc/roleblock etc.

All of your theories are possible, but it's also possible theo is a mafia thug who gets abilities from people he kills - and if he killed a townie, who's only 'ability' is his vote, than that ALSO Explains his double vote. Why are you *not* curious about that?

Number one is that we know that there are no vanilla townies in this game. I also don't think that a vampiric role of that nature, in the hands of scum, would take the players vote.

Also, no I don't think I have voted yet today.

vote DGB

cause I may as well test it.

Fixed quote tag. The quotes around "Glork" were left open.

[Primate]

It's a little annoying that no-one has actually put forward any reason against me that they could actually be held accountable for tomorrow. Bar massive, the arguments are really vague as to why I'm actually being lynched. there's the whole counterclaim thing, but no-ones really brought that up as a reason. People have just been drawing links between me and other people, talking about consequences of me being scum, etc, without actually backing up why they think I'm scum in the first place.

I would fight more, but I don't really have the time at the minute. If I get time, I'll get myself all fired up, like I probly should be, but I doubt I will have it.

[Primate]

<:(>

I don't like being lynched.

etc, etc with me having little time, though. I'll read again during the night, and put my thoughts about other people into something.

PS: NOT GONNA DIE

[Primate]

EBWODP: Anyone notice, by the way, that Primate could have had up to 9 clones, becoming the cat with

10

lives?

Nah. 3 has always been my limit.

I'll comment sometime later.

FYI, I had no idea I was going to be revealed as town in the way I was, not that it really matters, though it makes me feel a fair bit better.

[Primate]

What was the flavour behind you investigating Glork last night?

[Primate]

I don't think there's any harm in treating today like a lynch or lose. Nobodies rushing anything.

I am debating whether it would be a good idea for the person responsible for the second kill night 1 to step forward. We know it wasn't Theo, so it's either second vig, which is fair enough, or an SK, which we need to know the existence of, even if it isn't prudent to lynch him today,

I can't remember Glorks investigation results. Could he repeat them please?

[Primate]

Look guys

you have to realize

that the mafia

ACTIVELY CHOSE

to not kill carbon or primate

when they are pretty much asconfirmed as they can get

and choose to blow massive's brains out instead.

IF THIS IS NOT THE PICTURE OF A MAFIA ON THE BRINK OF VICTORY I HONESTLY DONT KNOW WHAT IT WOULD BE THEN.

THEY CHOSE TO NOT KILL CONFIRMED INNOCENTS OR GO AFTER THE DOC IN ORDER TO GET A GURANTEED NIGHTKILL ON SOMEONE WHO NOBODY WOULD THINK WOULD GET KILLED!!!

I was pretty much vouching for Massive's innocence, and certainly his role. He was sufficiently confirmed as to be unlynchable. There's no discernable difference between 100% confirmed and 95% confirmed. And He, unlike me and Zindie, can actually

do

something, so I don't think it's that unorthodox a choice at all.

[Primate]

So you're claiming a n1 kill then, Skruffs?

Not an attack, just want clarification.

[Primate]

1. theopor_COD - Vigtype
4. Skruffs - BlindJoat
6. Primate - Lifer
7. Nai
9. Glork - Cop/Daysceneposter/Messegesender
10. Miztef - Masontype lyncher, got investigation
11. PookyTheMagicalBear - Inventor
12. DrippingGoofball- Inventor
13. Carbon Copy - Lifer

Few questions

@Glork: Do you write the post in the dayscene

and

write a letter?

@Skruffs: Isn't Data's cat a fictional cat? It's certainly not a real cat. Also, why did you target yourself with a random ability night 0?

@Pooky: Would you mind giving me the full list of your nightchoices again please?

@Nai/CopyZindie: You the guy I met in an ally?

@Everyone: Correct me if I'm wrong regarding anything here. Also, I would like a list of all night actions everyone has made so far. Given the amount of claims circulating, most at the minute are annoyingly vague.

[Primate]

It's not a case of real vs. animated, though, it's Fictional vs. Non-fictional. And your cat is undisputedly fictional.

Do you know what the permanent ability you gained does? Can you use it in addition to your BlindJoat?

Still don't reckon Phoebes was the SK, btw. I'm not hugely convinced either way, though.

[Primate]

I was under the impression Pooky claimed inventor at some point. If I'm wrong and he hasn't claimed yet, then he should do so immediatly.

[Primate]

ur face is an animated cat >=(



(you're not wrong though)

[Primate]

what have you had the option of replacing? Everyone who's died so far?

[Primate]

Thing is, there's no way in hell I was the only person who needed money from Massive. There

has

to be someone else out there who wanted money from him. This isn't just Massive/Primate, it's Massive/Primate/XXXX, (maybe even two XXXX) with XXXX just not coming forward.

Also, I want pooky to answer my question.

[Primate]

Flavour fits perfectly, iirc. Slippers (Thesp) was adopted by the Clinton family fairly late in the presidency, on by all accounts got on well with their other cat (Miztef's cat, can't recall name right now). The Clintons also mentioned a couple of times that (Miztef's cat) hated Buddy the dog (Phoebus), who they had had for ages when they started adopting the cats.

[Primate]

@Skruffs: Isn't Data's cat a fictional cat? It's certainly not a real cat. Also, why did you target yourself with a random ability night 0?

I believe the enemy is ANIMATED cats, not fictional cats. The first post says as much. REAL cats (which can also mean actors) are safe.

It's not a case of real vs. animated, though, it's Fictional vs. Non-fictional. And your cat is undisputedly fictional.

Wrong, read first post.

Keep up, Nai. I already said I was wrong about that a while back.

I'll chalk the fact you didn't answer my question up to lack of observation, too.

[Primate]

To be a bit more blunt, have you targeted me at any point this game?

[Primate]

hmm.

Ok then.

[Primate]

I'll say later. Or I won't. Depends.

[Primate]

that's what I was looking for, Nai. A cat came up to me in a dark alley n1, asked me my role then ran off.

[Primate]

I targeted Primate that's correct and still to this page have no real idea why he didn't lose one of his lives. It may be possible that I'm completely inept and fire blanks dunno or somehow a load of people targeted the same person or someone is bulletproof is that possible - seems unlikely if Primate's got so many lives. There doesn't seem to be anyone claiming to be a bus driver so in all honesty I've got no idea what happened. Timmy was able to kill and investigate the same time yeh?

I'm just wondering if it's as simple as you being roleblocked.

[Primate]

Pooky, that last argument is BS.

And I refuse to take your arguments at any sort of serious level until you stop calling them masons. So far no masons have claimed in this game yet, and its distorting the truth to say they have. There are townies that can back each other up under certain conditions, like me and Massive, but we don't flat out confirm each other. I confirmed Massives role, not his alignment, and I never said otherwise, and I just think it unlikely that role was scum, and seeing as how it was out in the open other people were perfectly able to argue against me. It was never a masonry, anyway, it was

one role

that was very unlikely to be scum. Seeing as how you're insisting that me and him were masons, how do you respond to the fact that he was actually the person driving for my lynch more than anyone day 2?

And insisting Carbon Copy/Zindaras is masons is stupid. The role has a large history of being scum, makes more sense as scum, and any protestation of innocence just boils down to "Don't lynch me, I'm innocent, honest". It lacks pretty much all the qualities that make a mason a mason except for the fact that it's two roles with a single role, if you get me.

So I don't think anyone this game has claimed mason so far except Miztef/Thesp, and one of those two wasn't town, so I really think your entire argument based on the crushing weight of confirmed innocents is bunkum.

TBH, Pooky, your play here is reminding me a lot of your play in MTGWeatherlight.

[Primate]

If he has a bus-driver ability, the play is obviously for him to switch Theo with someone random and to target all vigs at Nai. That pretty much solves our problems, and there aren't many ways it could be disrupted.

[Primate]

That said, I don't see any reason to assume that is the case.

[Primate]

DGB, you have proof that Freudian Slips can be scumtells?

Cause I have evidence they aren't, and examples of times when following freudian slips have hurt towns. We can compare our evidence, see who has more. I don't have any evidence at all of towns that followed the slips to a good place, though, so you better have a fair bit.

[Primate]

FYI, if you want my standing on this, I am firmly anti-DGB. If she stands with Pooky, then I'm with Glork.

[Primate]

I know it's about you vs Glork. That's the reason I'm not planning to vote DGB anytime soon, regardless of how scummy she acts.

I await your post, but I pretty much just think that Glork's side of all this is much more plausible than yours, and I've looked at this a fair few ways. That said, I'll reread first chance I get, and then I'll have a few questions for the both of you.

[Primate]

My first newbie. I slipped and called another player in the game scum twice. Both of us were town.

[Primate]

Hell, at the time I didn't even think she was scum. It was just because mafia gets you thinking about those words.

[Primate]

Also, in an odd coincidence, whilst I made that slip I was trying to lynch Blahgo, which in a roundabout way is exactly the same thing Nai is trying to do now.

Odd these things.

[Primate]

It's not my opinion. At the minute it's facts, and you're disagreeing with them for no reason, effectively. Until you come up with evidence that helps your side, I'm right.

[Primate]

No, I'm here, sorry

PS: Massive died last night.

Please post something then

[Primate]

vote pooky

[Primate]

GOOOOOOD MOOOOOOORNIIIIIIINGGGGGG VEEEEEEIIIIIIIITTTTTTTTTTTTTTTNNNNNAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAMMMMMMM

[Primate]

Btw, on reading, I pretty much agree with Glork on most things and Zindie on pretty much everything.

[Primate]

I am reading this game by the way.

I would perform Skruffs request, but I think it's 99% likely to be utterly pointless. I'm bouncing around the idea that the gifts actually came from massive, which is why they dissapeared upon his death. I mean, he didn't apparantly have anything else to do with that money.

[Primate]

hmph

Fine, how many is he on?

Primate:
Money can't buy you happiness, Primate, nor can it buy you a double vote (except in Ohio).

You have no idea what massives role was, so just going 'naw thats wrong' makes you look pretty scummy.

[Primate]

The only gifts that have supposedly been given out are doc protects and double votes. IH claimed to be a one shot, but apparently was not - but regardless, the investigations he has was not received from DGB - but, primate has insinuated that they could be from massive (he's hesitated from explaining that any further than the insinuation, though)

I never hesitated at all. I just haven't done it.

I personally believe it's because it takes $50,000 for massive to give me an extra life, I can only get two extra, and massive had $450,000 total. That means that even if he gave me all the money he could, he would still have had $350,000 left. Now, seeing as no-one else has claimed anything remotely to do with money, I'm either the only town role that needs it (I think this unlikely), or he's doing something of his own with it. Factor this into the fact that it's prefectly flavourful for the guy with a shitoon of money to be giving out gifts, and the fact that the gift giving dried out the night after he died, and that's why I believe that.

[Primate]

If I say I'm ready to hammer theo, does anyone have any objections, or will people just yell at me as to why I didn't do it two pages ago?

[Primate]

carbon copy
THREE DIMENSIONAL vs TWO DIMENSIONAL
WE'VE DISCUSSED THIS

I didn't ask you to do something outright, I said, "Are you so sure you are scum that you will do something for me if I am not " You said "MAybe" I said what it is - a harmless prank, and one I have previously done for you, myself, in another game, and you said "Ummm, no".....


Glork - what do you think of CC's refusal to acknowledge your asking for chain of protection?

Please, please protect CC tonight, Skruffs. Don't screw with this and make us lynch you for not doing what we say tomorrow if you're town. For the love of god please.

Also,

vote theo

[Primate]

I was under the impression we had realised that the lists DGB had been submitting to the mod had no relation to who was actually getting the abilities, making her, yes, a quack inventor. Was I mistaken about that?

[Primate]

A surprising nightkill.

Waiting for all to check (mostly IH) in before I do anything.

[Primate]

I'm torn between asking some questions to cover some of the things that could go wrong today, or just voting DGB, seeing as how I'm near certain she's scum. Meh.

@All 3 Cops/roles who get innocent guilty:- do you actually get innocent/guilty, or do you get mafia/non-mafia?

[Primate]

To clarify, I think it's odd we have a normal cop, a role that can frequently investigate, nearly two full rolecops and the scum don't even get a roleblocker or a Godfather. That confuses me.

[Primate]

A -1 to lynch number is acceptable, imho, for a full rolecop. I would have used it more often, especially when you can just knock yourself off during the night if it gets too bad.

I just dislike the fact it was entirely possible, night 1, for Skruffs, Nai, Glork, all to investigate different people, to create 3 confirmed innocents day 1. Add that to the fact I could confirm massive, and that's four on Day 1 alone, with an extra one-shot being able to appear. And I don't see how any remotely sensible mod can include that amount of investigating power without some way for the town to scum screw with it, even in a minor way. Ever since we got the whole double life thing out the way, though, it's just been 'follow the cop, dum day dum'. And there's the coincidence of Skruffs getting 3/4 cop investigations, and the bizarreness of the fact that Wizardcat lied about his claim.

In all honesty, I believe that the scum don't have the tricks I'm speculating about, and the setup was weighted against them, but it's still niggling.

[Primate]

Also, there's still:

• DGB's completely unreasonable defense of Pooky;
  
• The inconsistency in her "What happens if I mess up my post restriction" claims;
  
• Her claimed rolename, which I maintain is not a "famous" cat by any means

Just end the game, Primate. -_-

Vote DrippingGoofBall

.

Now we see what was right. My reads or my paranoia.

[Primate]

whooyar

also, worra pity.

[Primate]

#1: What could massive spend his money on?

#2: What was the neutral role?