Mafia 62: Suspicion in Sicily - Game over!

[Primate]

/barrel roll

[Primate]

vote Panzerjager

twin blaster:Twito

[Primate]

vote kinkster

Rand is also worthy of attention. He reminds me of myself in Vis's game.

[Primate]

vote kinkster

Rand is also worthy of attention. He reminds me of myself in Vis's game.

Were you scum, haha.

Yeah, I was scum.

[Primate]

Well, it's not my fault that whoever decided on the spelling of the word had no base understanding of phonetics.

(Alternate answer: Doh! Sorry)

that's pheonetics

[Primate]

Well, it's not my fault that whoever decided on the spelling of the word had no base understanding of phonetics.

(Alternate answer: Doh! Sorry)

that's pheonetics

ugh, I read that wrong, joke doesn't work.

<-----dumbass

[Primate]

On the whole, I agree with what Raffles just said. In the two games I've played on here, a player gets lynched more often for being an idiot (or just acting like one for a moment) than they do for being scummy. But, I still am staying on ToasterStrudel because she (he?) is making comments that I find unhelpful, and detrimental to our cause, which is to lynch the mafia, obviously. S/he is preventing us from doing that, and is, therefore, not an ally of mine.

It's posts like this that make me think that, for all you talk about who is your ally, and for all you are concerned about the town as whole, you aren't actually in the town, and you aren't actually our ally.

That said, though, I think Kinkster is more deserving of attention (and particuarly, pressure) right now. I want to put a bunch of votes on him and see what he does.

[Primate]

That's not what I'm doing at all. I'm calling you scum for milking the fact that you have the towns best intentions in mind more than it needed to be milked. I also disliked your #153, in which you say that you're trying to lynch someone who you believe to be unhelpful as opposed to someone who is actually scum. I think it's a pragmatic point, and one with an element of truth, but I also think it's wrong the way you seem to be using this argument as a center. In #163 you reiterate the point that she isn't helpful, and continue your attack. #163 also contains a quick, baseless, jab against yosarian, which, again, I disliked. And then, in #206, you pretty much equate unhelpful with scum, something that is not the case. I think your actions make sense as a scum that had what he thought was a good idea during the early stages of the game, a legitimate defensible way to cause mislynches and be partially exempted from the responsibility for those mislynches. You've been riding this idea since.

So, Hollywoody, who do actually think is

scum

?

[Primate]

I probably haven't made a couple of these points as well I as I thought I did when I originally made them. It also started as an attack and got distinctly meandering and sarcastic towards the middle, then just kind of died. meh. I'm still digesting, really.

Is it really trying to look town if you really are town?

No. That's completely against the point though. We have no idea whether you're pro-town or not. If you're making an active attempt to appear pro-town as town, then you're not playing the game right. This isn't a competition to see who can act the most pro-town, then whoever doesn't will get lynched. What you will learn is that the scum you're trying to chase down will act, if anything, more helpful than the town. They will make sure that each of their points is perfectly explained, they will have back-up and contingency plans, they will rarely slip, because

they

are making an effort not to slip. So you have two groups. The scum are trying to appear as pro-town as possible. The Town are trying to weedle out the people trying to act as pro-town as possible. If you decide to screw it up, and actively try and act pro-town to the point where you're hampering you scum-hunting activities, it is possible you will be mistaken for scum and lynched. This is also against the point, though, really, and I put nowhere near this much thought into it when I originally attacked you. The simple truth though, is that if you see someone making comments along the lines of

I am trying very hard to do all I can for this town, make sure that my every waking moment is ruled by the desire to hunt those evil scum, and there is nothing more that I would like to do more in this world than to kill a scum today!

then the person doing it is probably scum.

First, in case anyone has condemned me for calling a fellow townie an ally...what should I call them?

Say for example you had a friend called Billy. Now, you quite like Billy, in fact, you might say that Billy is your best friend. You tell Billy this, and he is pleased. Billy, then, for the next two months follows you around saying to every single person you meet "THIS IS HOLLYWOODY, AND HE IS MY BESTEST FRIEND IN THE WORLD". Now, after a month or so, this is going to get really fucking annoying, amirite? This is effectively what you are doing here. You are saying "I AM HOLLYWOODY, AND THIS IS MY ALLY, PRIMATE. WE ARE ON THE SAME SIDE. YES! ME AND PRIMATE TOGETHER! ALLIES! So then, when I point out to you, this really isn't particularly normal behavior, you respond with a dictionary quote. Which is 100% correct, I grant you, but it just completely and utterly misses the point.

Primate, who seemed to awake out of a multi-page slumber to bring accusations against a person who has the best interests at heart.

Here's another thing I don't think you seem to grasp particularly well. Here you attack me for attacking you, an innocent. However, we have absolutely no idea whether you're innocent or not. This is a legitimate thought to actually

have

, I grant you, however, you don't actually say stuff like this. Why? Because it is completely and utterly useless. No-one in this game knows whether you are an innocent or not, so no-one can base an informed decision on what you are saying. And, regardless, once you're getting into the area where you're attacking people for attacking, you, someone you know to be innocent, you're entering a situation where it is infinitely more productive to just do all you can to actually prove you're innocent, making everyone else in the game think "aaah, he's attacking someone who I think looks innocent, I should probly watch out for him", which, as I say, is better than "aaah, he's attacking someone who keeps insisting that he's innocent. wish I had some idea whether he was innocent or not, like he does"

As for your accusation of lurking. Well, yes. I do lurk. It's to do with a few things, both access-related and mindset-wise. I was never the most verbose person, and I've just been in a funk since the beginning of February. I can't defend it on ethical ground, cause it simply isn't defensible. I can, however, say that it isn't at all indicative of my alignment. 2 week periods of inactivity are, whilst not common, possible, and shorter periods, 5-7 days, common. I can give you links if you want.

Primate- He randomly brought an accusation of me to the table, after I've done nothing that has been anti-town, because that would be anti-me.

"I AM THE AVATAR OF TOWN! ANTI-TOWN = ANTI-ME! I WILL DRIVE THE SCUM BEFORE ME WITH MY COLOSSAL EGO! WATCH AS I SAY I AM COMPLETELY AND UTTERLY WITHOUT FLAW IN ANY WAY, AND ALL ATTACKS AGAINST ME ARE THE FEEBLE MACHINATIONS OF SCUM TRYING TO DESTROY MY GREAT INTELLECT!". You say that I am 80% scum simply because I attacked you? Do you see how plausible it is, from my point of view, that you arbitrarily pulled that number completely out of your ass, and you are simply calling me 80% scum in order to detract from my credibility in order to weaken the wagon against you? Hell, you didn't seem to notice anything else there that might make me assume that that wasn't the case, did you. So, either you're completely talking out of your ass, there was a vital point you completely forgot to mention, or you failed to think things thought properly before you actually posted, and also failed to consider the fact that I addressed above (the 'we dont know youre innocent' thing).

Ok, I'm too tired to do anyone else right now, but I listed the people that have been playing the largest roles, or been posting most consistently. I think DP and Yosarian, and Primate are scum partners, as I implied during my section on the characters.

People who aren't scum agree. There are going to be ties between every single person in this game, strong ties. People are going to agree with things, both things that seem to make sense to you and things that don't make sense to you. If every time someone agrees with someone else you see a scum pairing, then you will overload, brain hemorrhage and die. Also, you're missing the fact that the scum will make an active attempt to not agree with each other. I've seen scum claim guilty cop results on their partners, I've seen scum create huge, multi-post cases against their scumbuddies. Do you really think that just because people agree or disagree it makes them scum? Of course not. There are elements of that, but the vast weight of the evidence has to do with the

way

people agree/disagree, and the things they do it on, not the simple fact they did so.

The only people that will follow a lynch on someone who hasn't shown up yet are people who want to lynch a townie who won't defend himself. So, yes, I become suspicious of you there.

So you say that the only people who will do something are scum? Well, then, is there a bad side to doing it? We may lose a townie if it ever gets near lynch (which I doubt), but we end up with a nice bandwagon to dissect.

Primate, defending one of his partners, creates the kinkster bandwagon.

If you're really this paranoid, and this convinced that your theories are correct, then there really is no helping you. You've started

And, in response to the WIFOM comment, as I stated in my second long post, and as you alluded to, you 'veterans' have much more influence and control than anyone else would be expected to have. This could lead to them being more obvious, and being less subversive than they might normally need to be.

pfft. Even you know you're streching here. You're bending this point around your theory. Go away, take a nap, and think about this all. Then reread the thread, and come back with an opinion that factors in what me, phoebes, and to a lesser extent Yosarian, have said. You can decide you don't want to take our advice if you really want, but if you're that unquestioningly convinced that you have nailed a scum group that has 14 years of mafia experience between them (though 7 of that is DP ), and you're that convinced that you've done it halfway through Day 1, then you should learn to control that ego a bit.

And I see Yos has just made a post.

[Primate]

1.

I got that. I'm saying though, that you pulled the number out of your ass. Why not 60%? Why not 95%? I'm saying that single solitary poin t you have against me is useless. You say that I attacked you, and because of that, you are 80% sure that I am mafia. Does that then mean that because you're attacking DP, DP should be 80% sure

you

are scum? If not, why not?

2.

You miss a really major factor.

D)

"Yes, I have done something legitmately scummy. However, I am not scum, so I will do my best to prove to the accuser that despite the fact that I have done something scummy, he should be focusing on someone who is, y'know, actually scum."

D) is a really major option, and probably the most important, which makes it's omission all the more annoying.

The point is, every single one of the three options you give is a bad one. You make #C out to be legitimate, when it really isn't. If it was, we would lynch someone now, then we would immediately lynch the person who led the wagon because 'they attacked a townie, therefore whatever logic they used was 100% incorrect' that is, though, wrong. Townies do dumb and scummy things, and even if they don't, it's possible that a townie will get overly paranoid and see something in someone elses post that wasn't intended, or whatever. Point is,you are apparantly 80% sure I'm scummy because I pointed out something scummy you did.

As for the fact you just told everyone you aren't the doctor, well I think we can both agree that was stupid of you.

A question. Have you ever played mafia before, on another board? Do you have a link?

[Primate]

Oh, I was exaggerating it in my example. The point was to make him see how it could be considered anti-town, not to accuse him of it. And they jumped out at me, when I read his post *shrug*.

(I'll respond to the other things some other time)

[Primate]

My heart warms a little every time I get included in that list.

[Primate]

Kinkster needs to claim.