Mini 413 - Famous CATS - Over! Quit pussyfooting around!


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Post Post #1125 (ISO) » Sat Aug 11, 2007 12:03 pm

Post by Skruffs »

I never claiemd to have blocked THeo. Theo claimed that I blocked him twice in a row. But he didn't 'vig' two nights ago adn claims to have vigged DGB last night.
You just read through the whole game. But for the record:
Skruffs wrote: I targeted Theo with my random ability last night. Theo, that may have blocked you. There should not have been anything about 'two figures' though - not from me, anyways.

I am going to give DGB the chance to explain her behavior yesterday before I make any conclusions. Her gift worked last night (I think).

Theo - is there any chance you aren't actually able to vig?
As for when I got it:
Skruffs - on June 23rd wrote:
I received an ability last night, but I Wasn't targetted by DGB, last night, so... unless maybe it's a delayed targetting system; I was targetted by her last night.
DGB, did you target Theo n1?.

Here's something though: Perhaps DGB gives Doctor out as a role to townies (since it helps them) and extra votes to scum (since it helps them) ?
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Post Post #1126 (ISO) » Sat Aug 11, 2007 12:06 pm

Post by Carbon Copy »

I do not believe you for one second, Skruffs. I think you've been caught with your hand in the proverbial cookie jar, and now you're trying to get out of it.
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Post Post #1127 (ISO) » Sat Aug 11, 2007 12:12 pm

Post by Glork »

Ah, so you *did* get a protective role. That was my first guess, but then when you said you knew who I targeted and what result I got, that confused me and I thought maybe you had a tracker role instead. Did you eventually end up with two roles/abilities, CC? How did you know who I targeted and what result I got?
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Post Post #1128 (ISO) » Sat Aug 11, 2007 12:19 pm

Post by Skruffs »

I'm sorry that you have decided today to go batshit crazy on me and have suddenly tried to tie me to Theo. If you look, you will see I was suspicious of Theo when hardly anyone else was, in previous days. You don't have to, but if you do look, you will see that.

I am more than happy to target you with my doctor and you target glork tonight. Since I have a confirmed town on me by glork and you doubt I have the roleblocking ability (being a godfather and all that) - Glork should be able to query DGB tonight after a lynch on Theo today. I may be dead in the morning, but you won't be, and Glork won't be.
Are you cool with that?

Glork - why would he have two?
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Post Post #1129 (ISO) » Sat Aug 11, 2007 12:23 pm

Post by Skruffs »

I really can't fight a bias that has no basis, Zindaras.
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Post Post #1130 (ISO) » Sat Aug 11, 2007 12:37 pm

Post by Glork »

I don't really know yet. I know nothing about the nature of DGB's granted abilities, so I don't even know how that's possible. However, CC asked Theo why he lied about being a Vig before I even *hinted* at who my result was on, so I can tell that he knew who I tracked and what result I got. The reason I'm asking CC what's up is precisely
because
I don't know what's going on.
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Post Post #1131 (ISO) » Sat Aug 11, 2007 4:28 pm

Post by Nai »

Carbon Copy wrote:Of course it wasn't. My point is that I spent a lot of time rereading this thread, only to first see someone steal my hammer, then the next day see the guy I was going to push for (and other people hadn't pushed for before) having a guilty investigation on him. I was really looking forward to being awesome again in this game, Glork, and it seems that my chances are kinda...lost.
I think you're taking this way too personally. It's your fault for not saying anything the majority of this game, and not saying anything before Glork gave his investigation. It's not Glork's fault he's being a good cop.
Carbon copy wrote:Which leaves us at you. You, whose claim is completely unconfirmable (seriously, blind JoaT?). You, who seems to have a love for targeting Theoscum, your little scumbuddy, thereby helping him out with his vig-claim and also making sure your role can never be confirmed.
Yes, he's unconfirmable. But a person who targets another person doesn't make him scum. It could mean that he's townie that has been targetting someone he's thought is scum.
Carbon Copy wrote:Theo is scum. Primate is not scum, for obvious reasons. I do not believe Nai is scum, as that would further balance the game against the town. Miztef has confirmed Glork, which means that if Glork is scum, then Miztef also has to be scum. Miztef can be scum on his own, but his one-shot name investigation and the timing of the claim regarding his one-shot investigation came at such a time that I believe that he is town. I do not believe Goofy is scum, and if she would be, my opinion of her will be severely lowered.
What about DGB? She is so absurdly out there I'm amazed she's still alive.
Carbon Copy wrote:Allow me to give a little insight on what I've been doing. While going through the stack of paper, I added little plusses and minuses where my gut said something.
This is an all around crappy way to prove that someone is scum, and shouldn't be considered at all.
Carbon Copy wrote:EBWOP: Nai being scum would further balance the game against the scum, obviously.
I love how you completely ignore half the game. Y'know, my actual play, how I've been vehemetly against Pooky and DGB (one of which is confirmed scum), etc. You've been out of the game pretty much the entire game. Your voice, at least to me, is not worth much.
Skruffs wrote:Now today he seems to be angry that I targetted him twice, saying that I've blocked him twice. but the only way that he would know I had blocked him is if he had tried to do an action - like vigging - both nights, something that he has explicitly said he did NOT do.
This is a very good point.
Carbon Copy wrote:Theo is not a Vig. You are not a roleblocker. You are not some blind JoaT thing. You are nothing but a normal godfather. You claimed your silly JoaT thingy to help Theo.
Prove it. I also want to hear, at the same time, what your mystery role is.
Carbon Copy wrote:Good jorb, I'm sure everyone's proud of you. I'll point out that all my plusses and minuses are based on actual perceived scum- and towntells.
Scumtells and towntells are WIFOM, period. And gut feelings are subjective evidence, not objective, and should be discounted.
Carbon Copy wrote:That would be me, my dear Skruffs.
I love comments like this. Purely egotistical. It's a statement of "I got a role that can do this. But since I got a role that can, there's no way you could possibly have a role that could do a similar action. You know, like a doc and a roleblocker, perhaps?
Carbon Copy wrote:Why did you claim to have blocked Theo?
He DIDN'T. This entire time THEO said he blocked him. The ENTIRE TIME Skruffs was saying he could NOT have done so.
Carbon Copy wrote:I do not believe you for one second, Skruffs. I think you've been caught with your hand in the proverbial cookie jar, and now you're trying to get out of it.
And I think you're an extremely misguided townie who has no idea how to help the town, and has a very bad scumdar.

I think the actions we should follow are simple, and thus: We lynch Theo, who is investigated and found to be scum by Glork. Tonight, Glork investigates either Theo or DGB, his choice. Tomorrow we get the investigation. Whoever is town doesn't get killed. Simple, effective, town wins.
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Post Post #1132 (ISO) » Sat Aug 11, 2007 9:20 pm

Post by Carbon Copy »

Glork wrote:Ah, so you *did* get a protective role. That was my first guess, but then when you said you knew who I targeted and what result I got, that confused me and I thought maybe you had a tracker role instead. Did you eventually end up with two roles/abilities, CC? How did you know who I targeted and what result I got?
You didn't exactly try to hide it, Glork.
bertrand wrote:The following letter has been found:
No
Yes
Yes
Also, everyone who went to sleep is now awake! Woohoo!

IT IS NOW DAY 4.
This is of course the first relevant post. Personally, I think the letter's answers already remove Goofy from the list of possible investigations, since I reckon she'd be a lot sillier in them. Also, I wouldn't have expected you to investigate Goofy. Maybe I'm just saying it because I would've done it, but I think you'd have gone for Theo at that point anyway.
Glork wrote:Have you anything else to say, Theo?
This is the first (large) hint that you investigated Theo. I got the idea you were trying to milk your investigation here. Of course, due to the whole letter thing, Theo knew he was screwed from the start.
Glork wrote:Zindaras: I think that I know exactly who the last two scums are. I'm not going to elaborate until I have heard from everybody.

Pantsman: Same -- I got another guilty last night, but I'm not going to announce who it was on until everyone has weighed in.
This only solidified my ideas.

I by no means
knew
your target and result. I simply figured it out on my own. The fact that, if investigated, I expected Theo to come up scum did help.
Glork wrote:I don't really know yet. I know nothing about the nature of DGB's granted abilities, so I don't even know how that's possible. However, CC asked Theo why he lied about being a Vig before I even *hinted* at who my result was on, so I can tell that he knew who I tracked and what result I got. The reason I'm asking CC what's up is precisely
because
I don't know what's going on.
What, you actually think my Theoscum thoughts are in retrospect now that you've claimed scum on him?
Nai wrote:I think you're taking this way too personally. It's your fault for not saying anything the majority of this game, and not saying anything before Glork gave his investigation. It's not Glork's fault he's being a good cop.
I think you're totally missing the joke. Also, I'm not saying I played awesomely before I went away. I announced I would be away and rereading the thread. I did so. You think I'm quivering with rage or something? Because I'm not. I'm somewhat disappointed that I'm not going to get a whole lot of credit for this game, especially seeing how I'm disappointed with my play up to this point, but that's it. (I did, by the way, say something before Glork's investigation)
Yes, he's unconfirmable. But a person who targets another person doesn't make him scum. It could mean that he's townie that has been targetting someone he's thought is scum.
I'm not saying it makes him scum. There's more to this than just his claim. But the fact that his claim works to validate Theo's claim of Vig does not reflect well upon him.
What about DGB? She is so absurdly out there I'm amazed she's still alive.
Yes, DGB. On DGB, my gut reigns supreme, but, to be honest, I really can't see her playing so awfully as scum (I would say she's been playing worse at this point if she's scum than if she's town). I can't really see her tie herself to Pookscum in such a clear, obvious way.

Yes, I could be wrong about her. Very easily, in fact. But I think she's town.
This is an all around crappy way to prove that someone is scum, and shouldn't be considered at all.
So actual scummy posts are a bad way of proving someone is scum?

Well, I'm sure you have a lot of fun relying purely on Cop claims, then.
I love how you completely ignore half the game. Y'know, my actual play, how I've been vehemetly against Pooky and DGB (one of which is confirmed scum), etc. You've been out of the game pretty much the entire game. Your voice, at least to me, is not worth much.
The fact that it would further unbalance the game is the easiest and quickest (and most definitely the most objective) reason to drop you from the list. If you want a friggin' serenade on how awesome you've played, you can go look somewhere else.
Scumtells and towntells are WIFOM, period. And gut feelings are subjective evidence, not objective, and should be discounted.
Yes, we should catch scum using claims and throwing dice! That's great! That's awesome! Let's do it!

Also, saying tells are WIFOM is hilariously wrong. I'm absolutely astounded at the fact that just a paragraph or two ago, you were whining about how you played so awesomely and went against Pooky and Theo so much, and here you're saying it's all WIFOM.

I don't give a rat's ass about my gut being subjective. My gut feelings are based on actual tells. My gut feelings also have a fairly high success rate. If it works, it works.
I love comments like this. Purely egotistical. It's a statement of "I got a role that can do this. But since I got a role that can, there's no way you could possibly have a role that could do a similar action. You know, like a doc and a roleblocker, perhaps?
No, you see, Nai, Skruffs has been trying to claim responsibility. Responsibility for something he did not cause. It's what, y'know, scum likes to do. They try to claim the responsibility for something they weren't responsible for so they look good.
He DIDN'T. This entire time THEO said he blocked him. The ENTIRE TIME Skruffs was saying he could NOT have done so.
Skruffs wrote:I targeted Theo with my random ability last night. Theo, that may have blocked you.
And I think you're an extremely misguided townie who has no idea how to help the town, and has a very bad scumdar.
This is probably the most insulting thing that has ever been said to me in a Mafia game. It is probably also the most baseless crap that has ever been said to me, so I guess that evens it out a little.

I jumped in today with Theoscum (before Glork had even posted). I correctly predicted Glork's target and result before he even hinted at it, to use his own words. Yes, I am obviously extremely misguided, have no idea what I'm doing, and all-around suck at this game. Post 160, Post 240 and Post 268 are also clear evidence that my scumdar sucks.
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Post Post #1133 (ISO) » Sun Aug 12, 2007 6:34 am

Post by Skruffs »

Carbon Copy - you didn't acknowledge my chain of protections idea. Do you think that it is a bad idea or a good idea? I'm basically offering my throat to you by putting Glork's protection in either you or my's hands tonight. I would really like your opinion.

Here's an idea: I *definitely* have a doctor role. Carbon Copy ALSO apparently has a doctor's role. We both protected Glork, supposedly.
The only other person who seems to have gotten a role is THeo - who had a one-day double vote. I'm willing to bet that is from DGB.
I'm wanting to test a hypothesis that DGB's gifts help whoever receives them. Scum get double votes, townies get doctor abilities. This is based on the assumptions that Theo got his double vote from DGB, that Theo is scum, that I am telling the truth and am Town, and that Carbon Copy is telling hte truth and is town.
I'd like everyone to unvote Theo and then, one at a time, we all try to double vote. Whoever got DGB's gift last night isn't talking - so I'm willing to bet that whoever it is may be scum and doesn't want to be revealed. This may or may not be a way to findotu who the last person was. Alternatively, if it is another townie and they received a doctor role - or a role other than doctor - it would help us figure out what's going on regarding DGB's roles.

I don't *think* That DGB-scum would be forced to be tossing out actual doctor roles every night, but this IS a bastard moddery. In that regards, it is possible. Concurrently, Carbon Copy *could* be mafia, and his 'clone' could be some sort of townie-sibling - a deal where if one lives to the end the other wins. But I doubt that.
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Post Post #1134 (ISO) » Sun Aug 12, 2007 6:40 am

Post by Carbon Copy »

Skruffs wrote:Carbon Copy - you didn't acknowledge my chain of protections idea. Do you think that it is a bad idea or a good idea? I'm basically offering my throat to you by putting Glork's protection in either you or my's hands tonight. I would really like your opinion.
I've already stated my opinion on this. You protect me, I protect Glork. I'm okay with that as plan.

Theo is today's lynch anyway, I've mostly been busy trying to get my say in before I died, which has now pretty much become impossible.
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Post Post #1135 (ISO) » Sun Aug 12, 2007 6:45 am

Post by Carbon Copy »

EBWOP: I figure I should elaborate on that. I do not believe DGB gives out roles based on alignment. I'm very happy with Skruffs-->Zindaras-->Glork as chain of protection.

I also agree with your idea about double-voting. Though I seriously doubt DGB's role works that way, it can't hurt to try.
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Post Post #1136 (ISO) » Sun Aug 12, 2007 6:45 am

Post by Skruffs »

Errr? Why is it impossible to get your say in before you die?
You're not going to die. You're going to be protected. If Glork dies, you will be in trouble, though.
Question - if I am a godfather and I targetted Phoebus two nights in a row and there was no actual role blocking involved (I am considering [based on theo's frustration] that perhaps all of my actions are actually roleblocking) then why were there not more kills on the nights that Phoebus was alive? Zindaras - you did not protect anyone n0, which was the night you received your action.
Who did you protect in later nights?
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Post Post #1137 (ISO) » Sun Aug 12, 2007 6:52 am

Post by Carbon Copy »

Skruffs wrote:Errr? Why is it impossible to get your say in before you die?
You're not going to die. You're going to be protected. If Glork dies, you will be in trouble, though.
Up until your claim and our subsequent plotting of abilities, I was very likely to die, being doc.
Question - if I am a godfather and I targetted Phoebus two nights in a row and there was no actual role blocking involved (I am considering [based on theo's frustration] that perhaps all of my actions are actually roleblocking) then why were there not more kills on the nights that Phoebus was alive? Zindaras - you did not protect anyone n0, which was the night you received your action.
Who did you protect in later nights?
Phoebus was only alive on Night 1, the Night where there were actually two kills. It makes perfect sense.

I'm not sure, but I believe I protected Wizardcat on Night 1 (not 0), then Glork from then on (I'm fairly sure it went that way).

Why Wizardcat? Wizardcat was the only person I felt pretty sure was Town at the end of Day One. In retrospect, it was a bad decision, but that happens more often.
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Post Post #1138 (ISO) » Sun Aug 12, 2007 7:19 am

Post by Skruffs »

Oh that's right, N0 was a kill less night. But we still got to take actions, it's just everyone was protected.
But if Phoebus was a serial killer - than that means that HE killed thesp - something someone else has already claimed responsibility for. Assuming nobody vigged and my action didn't kill Phoebus and mafia killed Phoebus, then the one-shot vigger must have been lying. There's too many assumptions in that theory, though. Maybe the one shot-vig on Thesp worked, maybe Phoebus attempted to kill Wizardcat that night, and maybe mafia killed Phoebus?
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Post Post #1139 (ISO) » Sun Aug 12, 2007 7:22 am

Post by Skruffs »

I'm hoping that eventually one of my actions will do something that can prove me. Not knowing what my actions do - or even if they do anything - is very frustrating, and Carbon Copy made a good point in saying that I am not cleared at all.

VOTE COUNT?
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Post Post #1140 (ISO) » Sun Aug 12, 2007 9:05 am

Post by Carbon Copy »

Skruffs wrote:Oh that's right, N0 was a kill less night. But we still got to take actions, it's just everyone was protected.
But if Phoebus was a serial killer - than that means that HE killed thesp - something someone else has already claimed responsibility for. Assuming nobody vigged and my action didn't kill Phoebus and mafia killed Phoebus, then the one-shot vigger must have been lying. There's too many assumptions in that theory, though. Maybe the one shot-vig on Thesp worked, maybe Phoebus attempted to kill Wizardcat that night, and maybe mafia killed Phoebus?
It is also possible that Phoebus was a Survivor and the one-shot vig guy is talking the truth.

(Though I'll admit I had kinda forgotten about that particular claim...)
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Post Post #1141 (ISO) » Sun Aug 12, 2007 12:22 pm

Post by Nai »

I'll point out that the information given to me by the mob said, specifically, that the guy I replaced (whose name escapes me currently)
vigged
Thesp, not
attempted to vig
, which says to me that he succeeded.

If Phoebus was a vig, he did not vig Thesp. That was my predecessor.
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Post Post #1142 (ISO) » Mon Aug 13, 2007 2:17 am

Post by Skruffs »

Yeah I doubted Phoebus was a vig.. the blue coloring suggests outsider of some sort. SK or Survivor.
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Post Post #1143 (ISO) » Mon Aug 13, 2007 4:37 pm

Post by DrippingGoofball »

Z'I won't have internet access for two weeks beginning on Thursday. Same for Bert.

My choices for the gift was Glork, Miztef and Nai.
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Post Post #1144 (ISO) » Mon Aug 13, 2007 7:46 pm

Post by theopor_COD »

Hi why is DGB not dead yet.

Only got 5 minutes so no re-read from sunny Paphos.

Ciao - I'll attempt to get one done in a day or so if it rains, which it hasn't since April here!!
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Post Post #1145 (ISO) » Mon Aug 13, 2007 8:16 pm

Post by Carbon Copy »

Miztef hasn't posted on-site in over a month.

bertrand
, please replace him. You may find Ether willing to replace in, so I'd start with her.
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Post Post #1146 (ISO) » Tue Aug 14, 2007 1:43 am

Post by Skruffs »

Glork - would you prefer I protect ZIndaras protect you, or vice versa? It's likely that the last person in the chain (me or zindaras) will be killed since they have no protection. The last person should be the more likely scum, because they can't kill the middle person without drawing attention to themselves, and can't kill glork regardless. They also can't kill themselves. If I protect zindaras, would you please inspect him tonight? Just to assauge my suspicions that he may just be fake claiming in order to get me killed because he knows that I protected you last night. You know, standard stuff.

Mistef hasn't posted, so I'm willing to bet he is the one with the gift.
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Post Post #1147 (ISO) » Tue Aug 14, 2007 10:03 am

Post by Nai »

I love how the people on vacation come in, post that they're not going to be here still, and then leave. Neither of the two people we want to lynch can say anything for themselves. And so this game continues to stall, as it has for months.
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Post Post #1148 (ISO) » Tue Aug 14, 2007 1:10 pm

Post by IH »

hey guys I'm going to be replacing... well someone. After I get my role I'll be rereading, expect me to begin actively posting after a giant large one in the next week or so.
Untrod Tripod (7:27:18 PM): you enjoy whoring
xcaykex (7:27:24 PM): yes
xcaykex (7:27:26 PM): i know that
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Post Post #1149 (ISO) » Tue Aug 14, 2007 2:29 pm

Post by bertrand »

IH is replacing Miztef... but I guess he beat me to it.

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