Blitz 7: Hardcore Mafia III (Game Over)

[Ranger]

So I have to admit, I'm not too familiar with optimal play in this game.

As far as I can tell, the best strategy seems to be lynching the scummiest player each day and hoping that they're scum, while assuming the whole time that every lynch is on town.

Is that right? I was hoping someone here with more experience with the setup could tell.

But speaking of voting the scummiest player...
VOTE: MarioManiac4.

[Ranger]

(And by the way: with reasonable confidence, I can say that I am Yakko is town. If I can find one other player worthy of that same honor, I think we've got an auto-win.)

[Ranger]

It's possible that they could be posting with such sparse content (see: that naked vote) to slow down getting us out of rvs which is crucial in a game with such short deadlines

I don't see that at all. I'm not placing Thelhix at unlynchable-tier town, but I'm definitely not scumreading them. Rather the opposite, I've liked everything Thelhix has done.

See also: stuff aside from the naked vote and the willingness TO naked vote.

@Ranger how experienced are you?

More than you, unless you've been playing for five years. (My first game began September 12th, 2010.)

[Ranger]

I was asking because I wanted to know if you were being sarcastic or honest.

Oh, I can be sarcastic along with the finest, but when I'm sarcastic, it will be evident.

I've been serious so far.

[Ranger]

whos up for a mass claim?

Sure thing! I am a one-shot daycop. Surely, if you read 2, you would have seen it among the sample role PMs, it's the first one listed there. You know, the one which reads, "You find scum. You win with town."? That's the one.

I know I've seen it somewhere in the forums.

I can't imagine why. Orange has always been my color, so I got a picture of an orange beaker to fit my signature.

[Ranger]

Who did you check and the results?

Well I was planning on saving the shot, but I figured that I might as well get a town result on you!

[Ranger]

I'm...a little bit concerned about how few posts have cropped up in 12 hours. This game's blitz, and more than that, it's a blitz game just beginning. Why is there so little activity?

[Ranger]

and what, pray tell, be you be doing for these here town?

Having at the time one of the highest post counts, pick and choose.

There's the serious scumread on MarioManiac4. (That was not a joke.)
There was my interaction with Bloodking.
There was my (not actually useless) banter with ika.
There was my serious declaration that Yakko is town.
There was pointing out how in 12 hours, we had exactly

three

posts, in a game just beginning.

Better question: what of this

wasn't

helping town?
Yeah.

I quoted that twice in two different ways because that's how shocked I am

Well, deal with it. Thelhix's posts look good. So do yours. You're probably town, Thelhix is probably town. Yakko remains my strongest townread, though you two are both close behind.

Firebringer's off to a potentially good start, too, though it's nothing strong.

[Ranger]

Lhix what did fire say that convinced you

Ssh, they're secretly masons who don't want to be nightkilled by the scum, possessing daytalk. :P

[Ranger]

As for Ranger, the main account would never refuse to explain a scumread.

I really don't understand this.

[Ranger]

You know, being on the list should make me cringe a little bit more, but actually...that's...not really a bad list. I'd substitute out either myself or Firebringer to put Chaotic Neutrality in (because, ironically enough, CN is a fairly neutral read of mine), but otherwise, I mostly agree with those townreads and those not-so-town-reads.

In fact, I

think

that the scumteam's actually Mario-Bloodking.
So while I don't mind being on the lynch list, I'd request you lynch those two first, since I think we'd have a chance at a perfect game if you did.

[Ranger]

{Hi I'm Yakko}
{Errantparabola, TheLhix}
{Firebringer}
{ika}
{Chaotic Neutrality}
{Bloodking}
{MarioManiac4}
My list.

[Ranger]

Hmm...actually, ika and Firebringer reads are about equal--Firebringer slightly weaker, ika slightly stronger. So,
{Hi I'm Yakko}
{Errantparabola, TheLhix}
{Firebringer, ika}
{Chaotic Neutrality}
{Bloodking}
{MarioManiac4}
More accurate list.

[Ranger]

Lynch blocks on Page Four are terrible and Ranger knows this.

I have a proven (as in, can be found verified in my past games) history to the contrary.
Lynch blocs are never too soon.

[Ranger]

So, Mario is literally the most unproductive atm.

No argument here.

[Ranger]

106 seems uncomfortably opportunistic to me

TheLhix is the second-hardest driver of that wagon.
I wouldn't call that opportunistic.

How is useless=scum?

In this game, it might as well be.

[Ranger]

A reasonless push is not like Ranger's main account at all.

I'm not an alt, though.

Whatever gave you that impression?

I also, most certainly, DO use reasonless pushes.
Like, all the time.
Like, most of the time.

[Ranger]

ika, Errant, Firebringer, Yakko; all of them can confirm as much, even.

[Ranger]

I have no real way of proving or disproving your alt/non-alt status.

No, I meant that you could verify I use reasonless pushes.

[Ranger]

VOTE: Bloodking.
I assume the mod knows about TheLhix. (Shame.)

[Ranger]

Well.
VOTE: hi I'm Yakko.

[Ranger]

This is a scum post. You have permission to die after FB.

Why wait? ;)

[Ranger]

...For some reason, I got Yakko and MarioManiac4 confused in my head.
I have absolutely no clue how that happened.
But, uh.
Oops.

VOTE: MarioManiac4.

This

is what I meant to do.

[Ranger]

Can I just say that I understand literally nothing about fluffing getting people townread.

And this is why you are scum.

[Ranger]

VOTE: Errantparabola
This person isn't scumhunting at all.

I've seen Errant not scumhunt.

I'm pretty sure this is Errant scumhunting.

[Ranger]

VOTE: Firebringer

Firebringer is town I think.

[Ranger]

Firebringer might as well be named Fluffbringer.

It's no scumtell.

[Ranger]

What's wrong with the strategy you mentioned?

As far as I know...nothing?

I mean, I've been playing

using

that strategy, at the very least. (I think Blood was scum, but I'm still treating today as if Blood wasn't.)

Who would have more experience, what would they say?

I don't know, some player who maybe has played the setup before? I don't know people's gaming experience, which is why I made the question general rather than specific in the first place.

[Ranger]

S'okay. I think I understand. (Maybe. You said it alright, not a mindreader. Doesn't stop me from trying, though! :P)

[Ranger]

Marcos prob town after the extange

No, I'm pretty sure that's scum rage.

1) ranger - strongest townread

How'd I go from being "hard to read" to "strongest townread"? :S

2) Chaotic Neutrality - null-scum but not lynchworthy

How is, in this game, a nullscum read

not

lynchworthy?

[Ranger]

Okay. This is literally a really really scum post.

Notice the wording here?
"might be able to lynch this"

It screems so much opportunistic scum

Honestly...Firebringer's concerns mirror my own.

And Firebringer's unvote of Errant, when doing so likely condemns Fire to be lynched, means Fire's town.

[Ranger]

And, rrr. We lynched town. >:I

I think I actually want to try this.
VOTE: Errantparabola.

[Ranger]

In the posts above this where you ran through the whole game, you barely mentioned fire, Ika is nowhere to be seen, and Ranger you have only negative things to say. Yet Ranger is your biggest town read, and Ika/Fire are your "most lynchable" targets.

^Basically, this.

[Ranger]

You're "pretty sure" it's me and then vote for the mislynchable Errant after you see nobody is really scumreading me anymore.

Bluntly...sort-of, yes.

I'm not voting you because I don't think if I voted you, you'd get lynched.

I still think you're scum. Just scum who can't be lynched at this moment.

In contrast, I think Errant is scum...and there

is

interest there.

If I voted you and let my vote go to waste, then there's a very real chance another town player ends up lynched. (Firebringer ended up lynched with

two votes

. Two. TWO.)
If I vote Errant, no such concern.

I don't think Extrapolated Eagle is scum.
I also don't think Yakko is scum.
I'm pretty sure the game's an auto-win as a result...but it should still be done with as few town casualties as possible.
And Firebringer should not have been lynched.
If I was on Errant yesterday (my internet failed so I wasn't around, unfortunately--I'd probably have gotten prodded if the mod had noticed), then Firebringer might have been alive now.
So yes I'm voting Errant.

[Ranger]

I haven't trusted Ranger for years and years.

Funny because unless you come from the same site I do (hint: we started playing werewolf before switching to playing Mafia at around game 14 or so...with a brief period where both were run side-by-side), this is the first game we've had together.

I mean...I suppose you

could

be from that site (there's only so many Rangers who play the game of mafia), but if you're not, we quite literally could not have possibly met each other before. And if so, you certainly don't play by the name of MarioManiac4.

[Ranger]

The game might not be over, but I'd say that's a towntell for Chaotic Neutrality, not a scumtell.

So,
VOTE: MarioManiac4.

[Ranger]

MarioManiac4 has been my strongest scumread the entire game.

[Ranger]

Yakko, however, owes an explanation for how much decreased activity Yakko's had, along with the sudden vote out of nowhere.
Especially since in iso, Yakko's...given a lot less than I remember.

[Ranger]

My mind tells me vote ranger because opening vote is opening and excited about a game that's gone dry for most of the frustrated townies who cannot see any flips.

If you think this is me excited...go do your homework on me.

No, this is me, mostly apathetic, with a side bit of frustration.

Oh. And let me ask you this:

I was the first to suspect your major scumread.
VOTE: Ranger
Eat L-1.

What say your mind to

this

, hmm?

'Cause this is very clearly scum, taking advantage of the situation.

[Ranger]

Alright that L-1 vote was scummy as hell. All my major scum reads are lynched now so I'm kind of a a loss. Chances are we got at least one scum but let's be safe and always assume the worst.

I'm gonna give the game a once over tonight and see if I find anything but with the deadline looming

VOTE: mario

That was crazy opportunistic. I'm not voting my town reads unless it comes right down too it. That'd be Ranger and Eagle. Yakko behind that.

So this post is crazy-town.

All game you've been acting like the leader of the pack. EXACTLY what you like to do as scum. Lead the pack.

I do no such thing? The only time I've led the pack as scum, I was a scum cop in a multiball game with a guilty. That's the closest I've gotten to leading as scum. I only have a sample size of one on this site, being Blitz 1, but that game shows it. Where that game did I lead? I didn't. At all. Even remotely. You're continuing to write onto me things that simply are not true, as if they were fact.

Your major scumcase on me was that I didn't understand your townreading null.

You continue to say this, but I never said that.

You've been my main scumread because you've been acting the way I've thought scum would the entire game.

VOTE: ranger

?

[Ranger]

VOTE: ika

Uhm...

Eagle...

You

do

realize that, worst case scenario, we have two scum alive with five players alive? Meaning, worst case scenario, lylo?

I mean, we can

hope

we got a scum, but...you're throwing a vote out here awfully recklessly.

[Ranger]

VOTE: ika

[Ranger]

So my thoughts on the game: I think there's nothing wrong with the setup in of itself, but I think that the exact rules could use tweaking. Town lost this game primarily through severe apathy--one of the towniest players in the game (Firebringer) got lynched with

two

votes. The two scum players have some of the highest, most consistent activity in this game, which meant that we were free to lynch whoever we pleased.

And I think that had to do with the rules involved in the game. Players had very little incentive to post: the rules

stated

you had to post every 12 hours, but I know I got away with sometimes going 36 hours or more, and other town players may have only posted once (maybe twice) in a day phase. I feel like having activity actually be important would have motivated players to either play, or simply replace out. (Replacements help in a stagnant game!) If the town had more incentive to actually try, then they would have remained active. As it was, though, they had no reason to do anything but blindly play and hope they hit scum.

On myself:

This is not a good example of how I play scum, since in a normal game, there's not this much apathy so consistently. I'm not too happy that there was no effort needed in order to win, but a win's a win. Back when the game was actually engaging, I feel I did a good job at making myself be townread, but then people stopped caring and so did I effort-wise.

Chaotic Neutrality:

Good job on making yourself be town! Early in the game, I was extremely worried; you were drawing a lot of early heat, and when players were trying to POE the game (back when they were invested), you were in their lynch lists. Yet you definitely held your own and bounced back, providing strong content and being a reasonable player.

Bloodking:

Honestly, I don't even remember why you were lynched. Looking at your iso, it wasn't actually that bad. I think it was just a matter of other players at the time looking townier, so maybe just bad luck. I don't think you actually did anything wrong, so I don't think I have any advice on improvement.

Errantparabola:

I think you actually played a good game. You ended up getting lynched for what was effectively bad timing: you voted Firebringer when Firebringer wasn't strongly town, and you correctly identified Firebringer's town posting once it showed up, only it was past deadline by the time you unvoted. This created the appearance of opportunism, which got you roped. So given that, there's not much you can do: scheduling's scheduling, things happen when they happen, life is life, you can only show up when you can show up, but what you

can

do is start your questioning and pressure earlier. If Firebringer had more time to respond, then you would have seen Firebringer as town sooner, giving you the chance to swing a ChaoticNeutrality lynch, which would have made me winning almost impossible. Post-Firebringer, you did well in balancing offense and defense, but I think you could have pushed a "lynch this" and "don't lynch this" list harder and with more clarity.

Speaking of clarity, that reminds me, my reason for opportunistically switching onto you was paranoia from a read switch that I didn't see a reasoning for. If you had shown where and why that read had changed, it would have been harder to justify a wagon on you, so maybe you can work on being a little more open with your thoughts?

Extrapolated Eagle:

While I think your play was good, and not necessarily wrong (if I were town, I'd have lynched either ika or Yakko, too), lylo votes are bad. :P That was the time to review the game and think things over. Your instant vote gave us a quickhammer, and even if it hadn't, me pointing out your mistake gave me town credit I could have used to win had you unvoted before the quickhammer attempt. So, you did fairly decent scumhunting-wise, but you needed to actually use the time we had available.

Firebringer:

Pretty much the only advice I have is for you to be your normal self. This game, you started fairly weakly, and it wasn't until the end where we saw you bring your signature style of town posting, but by then, it was too late and you got deadline-lynched. So, stay active, early and often, and you should be good.

hi im Yakko:

I think that you did a good job of making yourself town early-on, but the lurking you did later-on killed it. Your reasonless voting (and unvoting) cast suspicion on yourself, which killed the early town credit you had built. Furthermore, by not giving anything reasons-wise, you made it so that people wouldn't want to follow you.

ika:

You also did okay being town early-on, but once you got apathetic and started doing nothing, suspicion began to mount, eventually leading to that lylo mislynch. In a Blitz game, especially one like this, if you lose your motivation to play, then you become a huge liability. Basically, what you did this game, you did well, but...there wasn't enough of it.

MarioManiac4:

Your obsession with calling me scum off of meta that simply put isn't mine (we've never played together) ended up severely hindering you. Your basic case against me was, "Ranger does this as scum!" When, no, I have no such history. If you had judged me off of my play this game rather than nonexistent scum meta (my existing scum meta, Blitz 1, would have suggested I was town this game), then your case would have been a bit more easily received. Your case started as "Ranger explains her reads"--I don't, that's provably null, as is me creating a lynch bloc. I also don't normally lead towns as scum. (Granted, I omitted that I don't normally lead as town, either; I don't know why I was a leader this game.) The point you raised that was valid was my switch onto Errant. If you had explained that in greater detail, I would have been in more trouble than I was.

Overall, you also had a lot of hypocrisy, doing the very thing you accused me of: not giving reasons. Most of your push was on me, and while it was correct, your hyperfocus on me was extremely detrimental. In future games, I'd advise for you to branch out; it's okay to have a main scumread you push, but noting behavior elsewhere will mitigate people's concerns on you, as long as you make it clear your focus remains on your target.


So all-in-all, the town started strong, but then fell apart.