Gistou (Over!)

[Wake1]

Good evening everyone. LicketyQuickety, could you please point out what really does matter thus far?

I'm not sure I understand. In relation to what exactly?

With respect, you mentioned that Nosferatu doesn't seem to be actually solving the game, but pointing out stuff that really doesn't matter much.

[Wake1]

Good evening everyone. LicketyQuickety, could you please point out what really does matter thus far?

I'm not sure I understand. In relation to what exactly?

With respect, you mentioned that Nosferatu doesn't seem to be actually solving the game, but pointing out stuff that really doesn't matter much.

I am reconsidering my read on them as I kinda said.

Does this mean you now think he's pointing out stuff that matters?

Unsure. I think it will be more telling with a few flips.

What I'm wanting to understand is how he's supposed to be pointing out stuff that really matters when it's not even Day 1 yet.

I primarily just care about getting reads at this point and am talking about them with Suz right now.

You made it sound like Nosferatu was only pointing out stuff that really doesn't matter, so I'm asking you for examples of things that really do matter.

[Wake1]

every time I look into this game it just gets more exhausting to try and parse.

Exactly. It's a b**** trying to keep track of what's being said.

[Wake1]

Alright everyone, I'm asking for your attention please.

As some of you guessed by now I'm staying in this slot.

I don't do Reads Lists any more, across the board. The best way I get a read on players is through direct engagement.

With respect, please don't ask me for a Reads List, because that's not how I play. Likewise, I'm asking all of you to give me some time to catch up by reading the last few pages, and start getting into the game naturally. In essence, I can better read players through 'hands-on' Scumhunting, rather than just reading what other people post.

This is going to be a challenge, but hopefully a fun one at that.

[Wake1]

Alright, feeling ready to get into this massive game. IF there have been any claims could you share them here for my spreadsheet please?

[Wake1]

So the important thing is that there's a Neighborhood with you, Copper, and Stormblade. Almost50 claimed a PGO-variant.

[Wake1]

At the moment I'm giving more credence to PR claims than flavor claims like race/nation/etc. Is there any benefit to revealing the flavor details in your role PM?

[Wake1]

At the moment I'm giving more credence to PR claims than flavor claims like race/nation/etc. Is there any benefit to revealing the flavor details in your role PM?

Flavor text might help us decipher the various wincons/factions, which were left intentionally vague by mastin.

-Nahdia

Presuming you are Town, I'm assuming there's no reason not to disclose that. What's your take on that?

[Wake1]

Wake - splitting hairs over my scumhunting is all they've done. Zero unique contributions. Likely not human

Titus, I'm playing on this slot now. This is an overwhelming game, so I'm asking you to judge me based on my own actions: my posts in the Hydra were gray.

[Wake1]

At the moment I'm giving more credence to PR claims than flavor claims like race/nation/etc. Is there any benefit to revealing the flavor details in your role PM?

Flavor text might help us decipher the various wincons/factions, which were left intentionally vague by mastin.

-Nahdia

Presuming you are Town, I'm assuming there's no reason not to disclose that. What's your take on that?

Take note:

This is a multi-factional game. Please pay very close attention to your win condition. Some players who you may not think are allies will be fighting for the same thing you are, and some players who you may think are fighting for the same thing you are may not actually be allies. The ambiguity inherent is meant to reflect the moral ambiguity of Gistou.

Scum will of course have fakeclaims and the setup is designed to not be broken by flavor outright, but it might help us figure some things.

However, sharing your flavor PUBLICLY is a bad idea. Keep in mind certain factions have the ability to convert people, but in at least some cases its known to be conditional. We want to be careful with giving too much away.

-Nahdia

OK. So... it's better to not reveal any flavor details.

[Wake1]

What I'm feeling is that there's no real point in revealing flavor if there's already Scum fake flavor-claims, among other things.

[Wake1]

You had none of value, so you'd be in can die region.

Day 1 is never my strongsuit because it's nothing but speculation, but I am moving to engage with players throughout this Day to get a feel for the playerbase.

[Wake1]

For those voting the top two wagons could you give a sentence on why you're willing to lynch your target?

Mainly I'm asking this because I watch wagons to see how much or how little resistance they have.

[Wake1]

For those voting the top two wagons could you give a sentence on why you're willing to lynch your target?

In my case, because Kuroi seems to have completely ignored my existance despite having me as his strongest scumread.

In general if you have someone as a strong Scumread you don't ever ignore that player. Kuroi, I'd like to hear your side please.

[Wake1]

For those voting the top two wagons could you give a sentence on why you're willing to lynch your target?

Mainly I'm asking this because I watch wagons to see how much or how little resistance they have.

Scummy

By all means I want to hear it. Why?

[Wake1]

RAM's posts are extremely awful but I can't explain why, it's frustrating.

Hey, I asked you to explain yourself.

[Wake1]

You said I was Scummy and I asked to to explain yourself.

This isn't going to end well if you think you can take a shot and then be evasive with me.

[Wake1]

u mad?

Nope. I don't get emotional over this game.

Give me time.

[Wake1]

I'm close to revealing my flavor details for the sake of interest. None of it has bearing on alignment, and if anything players will change a bit in revelation of the news.

[Wake1]

Gee, all this chaos warms the cockles of my heart. Actually, no. It's dumb and doesn't help anyone.

I hate Day 1. I like having the 'meat' of evidence like flips on the bone. Otherwise all I have to rely on is speculation and feelings, which sometimes has me foaming at the mouth on someone who plays Scummy but might not actually be Scum. So, fuck that. In lieu of there being no solid evidence I have to work with A) claims, B) direct engagement, C) gauging wagon resistance, and D) knowing who will and won't lynch certain players.

On my hidden PT I've got a spreadsheet for keeping track of claims and solid info. Since I still don't fully understand the complicated nature of this game i.e. factions I'm thinking it's best to wait with revealing flavor, not that flavor means all that much. In general I hate Day 1 because we've got shit: throw me a bone and I'll be able to start solving this puzzle.

From what I cared to read Kuroi was complaining about a phrase and, unless there's a solid pattern of said player doing that as Scum it really means little. Also guy's here's a newsflash: pushing someone at a weak angle doesn't mean you're Scum. Just understand that. Kuroi's weak case doesn't mean he's Scum and I'd be more concerned about anyone who thinks somehow being wrong or ineffective in Mafia means you're Scum. It's NAI.

WT if you don't want to play you can replace out: if the game's not fun give someone else a try. Mafia requires a certain level of mental toughness. If you do want to keep playing tell me the main person you suspect. In hindsight I can relate to how you feel in 3211. If you play better via interaction then don't waste your time slogging through all that crap. If being called a VI even when you don't deserve it is enough to make you go over the edge then I'm not really sure what to tell you. What I can tell you is to not allow it to bother you and simply get into the game.

Not sure how I feel about dramonic's 3230, insofar as he may be taunting WT with that last line (when something seems to go beyond what is necessary, it makes you wonder). Luna Fox, while I agree with you that it's nice to have a nice game, everyone is certainly not your friend, and sometimes games get incredibly intense: if players get personal and the mod doesn't do anything about it there's not much that can be done.

[Wake1]

So wake whatever happened with this:

For those voting the top two wagons could you give a sentence on why you're willing to lynch your target?

In my case, because Kuroi seems to have completely ignored my existance despite having me as his strongest scumread.

In general if you have someone as a strong Scumread you don't ever ignore that player. Kuroi, I'd like to hear your side please.

Can you rephrase the question so I can understand you're asking me?

[Wake1]

Can you rephrase the question so I can understand you're asking me?

I told you why i was scumreading Kuroi and you agreed that it was scummy but needed to hear Kuroi's side of the story.
I also provided relevant quotes from that time.
I still have yet to hear an answer from you about it.

If you were respecting a response, you should have stated you wanted it.

I'm not a gumball machine. You don't put a quarter in and get a Dubble Bubble in return.

Getting feedback is nice, but I don't demand to always have it in response to my posts.

And if you were assuming to get feedback, that's certainly not a question to be answered. If it were a question you still haven't provided one, so if it IS out there lost in the ether I suggest you go get it or you start modifying your approach with me.

[Wake1]

Being wrong is NAI. Picking on something trivial and blowing it out of proportion as your sole attempt at contribution, well...

What if he's like that in general tho?

I mean, his family could be having a Sunday Taco Bash and he flips out because he's ribbed for only bringing the taco shells?

[Wake1]

Can you rephrase the question so I can understand you're asking me?

I told you why i was scumreading Kuroi and you agreed that it was scummy but needed to hear Kuroi's side of the story.
I also provided relevant quotes from that time.
I still have yet to hear an answer from you about it.

If you were respecting a response, you should have stated you wanted it.

I'm not a gumball machine. You don't put a quarter in and get a Dubble Bubble in return.

Getting feedback is nice, but I don't demand to always have it in response to my posts.

And if you were assuming to get feedback, that's certainly not a question to be answered. If it were a question you still haven't provided one, so if it IS out there lost in the ether I suggest you go get it or you start modifying your approach with me.

Yeah yeah yada yada. You could have stopped with just the first sentence, the rest was unnecessary, i wasn't demanding a response, im still waiting for it and was reminding you of that in case you had forgotten.

Yeah well you can't always get what you want. I'm still aware of Expedience being a chicken and sniping with 'Scummy' and then running away when I confronted him on it. Not sure how many Townies take up guerrilla tactics but OK then.

If you absolutely MUST have my feedback I would ask you once again to post it here, and I will respond to it. HOLD ON, STOP! It's on you now. If you want to whine and have me go back and fetch it out there in the wild plains forget it. Your move, bucko.

[Wake1]

Luna and Wake looks like TvT.

This isn't a

v

anything.

It's a

lesson

.

[Wake1]

Why are you pre-emptevely ad homing me like you think im going to be a jerk and not go and fetch it myself?
If i am interested in your reply obviously im going to go grab it, all you need is ask.
2646

I'm usually quite pleasant my dear. Just... not when it comes to murderous individuals who may or may not include you.

HEY. You remember that monster from 2011's The Thing? You try feeling comfortable discoursing with a couple of

those

.

I guess linking the relevant posts would be better:

First off, a three-person Hydra? I just realized this. Fucking what?

Strong Town:
Lean Town: Dramonic, Almost50, Cane and Able, Tim, ASOIAF, RAM, Expedience
Null/Unsorted: Klingoncelt, Titus, Nosferatu, Stormblade, davesaz, Copper, Lady L, RB, Goofball, BBMolla, Toogeloo, Franky
Lean Scum: Heartless, Salt Squad, No Retreat , Cephrir, TWIE
Strong Scum: Wayward Thinker, Luna

BTW, just realized I'm finally playing a game with my old pal, Nero. Hi Nero!

And yes, my list is really undeveloped. I'm aware.

how is luna a strong scum read after all the claims?

~Ice

I haven't seen her claim. I'll reread a bit later on.

Maybe he didnt read them? one of his posts does seem to suggest that he had just woken up at the time.

Maybe he didnt read them? one of his posts does seem to suggest that he had just woken up at the time.

he does that a lot, doesn't he

The claim miss though, that's bad. You'd think he'd have paid attention to the slot that he's most suspicious of. Thanks for giving me the thought here.

Honestly in a game this large i dont find it unlikely to miss a claim.... HOWEVER what has been said as me being one of their biggest scumreads = they should be paying more attention to my posts is true.

Vote: Kuroi

At face value I don't like your vote.

You would know by now that I ASKED people for information on any claims posted thus far.

RAM's insinuation that missing a claim is bad is complete and utter CRAP, especially if you factor in that this is a massive game.

I've missed plenty in this game because it's SO BIG, and I'm fine with that! You'd have to pay me to read through all this speculative shit.

If someone's Town yet ineffective it's completely possible that he suspects you yet misses things as well. I used to do that quite a bit when I was first introduced to Mafia.

[Wake1]

All your reasons suck fwiw.

That is not going to fly.

If you think his reasons suck you

had better

explain

why

you believe so.

[Wake1]

God I am pissed Titus is so obviously scum I need a break from this thread.

(*Is this sincere anger...?*)

[Wake1]

@Everyone

When Titus is Town, is she more calm and passive... or aggressive and stubborn?

[Wake1]

Because I am no better than everyone else. They can be right and I can be wrong. The game is going on long enough. Decisions have to be made.

...

...

...

[Wake1]

Guys, may I please have your input on 3330?

[Wake1]

Forward march!

UNVOTE: Wayward Thinker
VOTE: Kuroi

Sorry Dram but the inevitable is happening

p-edit: Ew

I think it's rather naive to assume his lynch is inevitable, considering we have time.

One thing I notice is, in spite of your vote, I haven't seen a reason as to why you chose to cast it.

Certainly you can understand why that causes a problem.

[Wake1]

I think the point is that we have various groups whose alignment may be one way or another. As Mastin mentioned there would be players who share flavor similarities that may not actually want what you want. Out of curiosity, when all of you were given your Role PMs did any of them include "Town?" What I'm wanting to understand is if there's even a general "Town" in this game, or if it's just multiple competing/aligned groups and subgroups and 1-2 evil groups AMONG them.

[Wake1]

I wonder what would happen if I voted one of these players who know I posted something but seemingly pretend it isn't there...

[Wake1]

I tend to ignore idiots but it doesn't always work.

Snark aside, you know as well as I do that that wasn't role fishing, unless you think 'Town' is somehow now a role rather than a general alignment.

You can go sit down now.

[Wake1]

My theory is that there is no "Town."

As Mastin pointed out there are multiple groups broken down along nation, location, and race. He said you can't base alignment on flavor.

Throw out the notion that being Human = not being Scum. There is no Town: just differing factions that may be aligned or at war with one another.

We shouldn't be thinking of this game in a strictly Town vs Scum mindset, because there is no Town in this game. You can be part of a tribe, a nation, or a location but that doesn't necessarily mean you're aligned. I'm guessing the Scum faction(s) would know who each other are (informed minority), and may be able to communicate in private.

[Wake1]

See, mine doesn't have 'Town' in it either.

[Wake1]

See, mine doesn't have 'Town' in it either.

mastin confirmed its town when I asked her.

~Ice

So as I thought it doesn't have the word 'Town' in the Role PMs, but it's presumed to be Town.

In that case these groups serve as multiple 'Towns,' with different connections.

[Wake1]

If someone claims Doctor, we don't go through with the lynch.

He can be lynched later.

[Wake1]

I'm a doctor from the North. Human for what it's worth.

and it also says I'm a racial checker.

Wait, you can actually be both of these?

Every single player was given the option to flavor-check other players.

[Wake1]

Wouldn't a fake claim be easier to see though?

He could be lying, but if he isn't, a huge game like this, there's no way he won't be sorted out eventually.

A PR claim like Doctor shouldn't be lynched Day 1. We have subsequent Days to lynch him if there's good reason for it.

[Wake1]

I'm a doctor from the North. Human for what it's worth.

and it also says I'm a racial checker.

Wait, you can actually be both of these?

Every single player was given the option to flavor-check other players.

Not for Race.

Right, but each player was given a flavor-checking mechanism to check between Nation and Location.

[Wake1]

Wouldn't a fake claim be easier to see though?

He could be lying, but if he isn't, a huge game like this, there's no way he won't be sorted out eventually.

A PR claim like Doctor shouldn't be lynched Day 1. We have subsequent Days to lynch him if there's good reason for it.

I'd be more inclined to listen when it was someone voting him or outright defending him. You've done neither, and now you're pitching utility to keep him alive. And I was scumreading your slot earlier.

You aren't perturbed at all that he's claiming normal?

I care that he's claiming Doctor. We don't hammer a Doctor claim Day 1.

[Wake1]

VOTE: Kuroky

If this is an official vote for Kuroi, that's a hammer.

[Wake1]

Wouldn't a fake claim be easier to see though?

He could be lying, but if he isn't, a huge game like this, there's no way he won't be sorted out eventually.

A PR claim like Doctor shouldn't be lynched Day 1. We have subsequent Days to lynch him if there's good reason for it.

yes good idea let's run up 10 different players with this policy and make sure they know we won't lynch them if they claim a PR

I'm not going to argue with you why we don't hammer Day 1 Doctor claims.

[Wake1]

KuroiXHF is at L-2.

trivia

There are two rival theories on how the great ridge formed. One suggests that a second mighty river rivaling or even exceeding that of the divitias once flowed from the great lake down to the oceans. This theory would explain why the land is not entirely devoid of life, and why reservoirs of water can still be located in the otherwise-hostile climate.

The second theory posits that the great ridge was formed by a shift in the ground. (On earth, this would be thought of as tectonic shifts.) This event, or possibly events, the theory goes, was a massive, world-changing event that shifted the way the climate of Agnigi works. (This same theory posits that the land pushed upward in the northwest, creating the erimos range.) This theory also supports why life seems to have once been easier in the now-desert lands.

Some even believe the two theories are not mutually exclusive, and that the truth would be somewhere in-between. The world may never know, especially as such scientific pursuits are largely irrelevant in the world of Gistou.

Twenty-sixth Votecount

:

KuroiXHF - 13 (DrippingGoofball, Luna Fox, Titus, A Song of Ice and Fire, No Retreat, Expedience, RAM, Salt Squad, Cephrir, Heartless, Toogeloo, davesaz, Tim)

Wayward Thinker - 5 (rb, Nosferatu, BBMolla, Klingoncelt, dramonic)

Heartless - 2 (Almost50, copper223)
A Song of Ice and Fire - 1 (KuroiXHF)
Klingoncelt - 1 (Wayward Thinker)
Luna Fox - 1 (Lady Lambdadelta)
Titus - 1 (Mathblade)
Salt Squad - 1 (Stormblade)

Not Voting - 3 (RachMarie, Wake88, TheWayItEnds)

With

28

alive, it takes

15

to lynch.

KuroiXHF is at L-2.

Day 1's deadline is Tuesday, August 2nd, @ 9:00 PM PST: (expired on 2016-08-02 21:00:00).
At deadline,

KuroiXHF

would be lynched.

Extras

Spoiler: Changes from Last Votecount (none)

(=0)

KuroiXHF - 13 (DrippingGoofball, Luna Fox, Titus, A Song of Ice and Fire, No Retreat, Expedience, RAM, Salt Squad, Cephrir, Heartless, Toogeloo, davesaz, Tim)

(=0)

Wayward Thinker - 5 (rb, Nosferatu, BBMolla, Klingoncelt, dramonic)

(=0)

Heartless - 2 (Almost50, copper223)

(=0)

Klingoncelt - 1 (Wayward Thinker)

(=0)

Luna Fox - 1 (Lady Lambdadelta)

(=0)

A Song of Ice and Fire - 1 (KuroiXHF)

(=0)

Titus - 1 (Mathblade)

(=0)

Salt Squad - 1 (Stormblade)

(=0)

Not Voting - 3 (RachMarie, Wake88, TheWayItEnds)

Last votecount was post 3790, page 152.

Spoiler: Player Votecount History Day 1

• Heartless:
  Wayward Thinker===>Almost50===>copper223===>Wayward Thinker===>KuroiXHF
  
• KuroiXHF:
  copper223===>TheWayItEnds===>Wayward Thinker===>A Song of Ice and Fire
  
• Klingoncelt:
  Expedience===>Wayward Thinker
  
• Titus:
  Cane + Able/Wake88===>KuroiXHF===>copper223===>KuroiXHF===>Klingoncelt===>KuroiXHF
  
• dramonic:
  Wayward Thinker--->A Song of Ice and Fire-->Unvote--->Wayward Thinker
  
• Salt Squad:
  Expedience===>Wayward Thinker===>Stormblade===>KuroiXHF===>Wayward Thinker===>KuroiXHF
  
• Almost50:
  Heartless
  
• Nosferatu:
  Titus===>Expedience===>Wayward Thinker
  
• Mathblade:
  Expedience===>Wayward Thinker===>Expedience==>Unvote===>Wayward Thinker
  
• Wayward Thinker:
  rb===>KuroiXHF===>Klingoncelt
  
• Stormblade:
  Expedience===>RAM===>Salt Squad
  
• davesaz:
  Expedience==>Unvote===>Wayward Thinker===>KuroiXHF
  
• copper223:
  Heartless===>KuroiXHF===>Heartless
  
• Cane + Able/Wake88:
  Titus==>Unvote
  
• Tim:
  Wayward Thinker===>>>KuroiXHF
  
• No Retreat:
  Expedience--->davesaz--->Heartless--->KuroiXHF-->Unvote--->KuroiXHF--->Klingoncelt--->KuroiXHF
  
• A Song of Ice and Fire:
  Stormblade==>Unvote===>KuroiXHF
  
• RAM:
  copper223===>Wayward Thinker===>Klingoncelt===>KuroiXHF
  
• Lady Lambdadelta:
  Luna Fox
  
• rb:
  Wayward Thinker===>RAM==>Unvote===>rb
  
• Cephrir:
  Nosferatu===>Expedience===>Almost50===>KuroiXHF===>Wayward Thinker===>KuroiXHF===>Wayward Thinker===>KuroiXHF
  
• Luna Fox:
  Expedience-->Unvote--->Almost50--->Stormblade-->Unvote--->KuroiXHF--->RAM--->KuroiXHF
  
• Expedience:
  rb===>Titus===>rb===>Luna Fox===>KuroiXHF==>Unvote===>RAM===>Klingoncelt===>RAM===>Klingoncelt===>KuroiXHF
  
• BBMolla:
  rb===>>Titus===>>Almost50===>>KuroiXHF===>>Wayward Thinker
  
• TheWayItEnds:
  Wayward Thinker-->Unvote
  
• DrippingGoofball:
  Franky===>KuroiXHF
  
• Toogeloo:
  KuroiXHF-->Toogeloo--->KuroiXHF
  
• Franky/RachMarie:

Spoiler: Voting Chronology Day 1

On Mon, Jul 07/11/16 @ 08:09p,

Expedience

Votes

rb

in post 576.
On Mon, Jul 07/11/16 @ 08:10p,

Stormblade

Votes

Expedience

in post 578.
On Mon, Jul 07/11/16 @ 08:14p,

copper223

Votes

Heartless

in post 583.
On Mon, Jul 07/11/16 @ 08:16p,

KuroiXHF

Votes

copper223

in post 586.
On Mon, Jul 07/11/16 @ 08:16p,

Cephrir

Votes

Nosferatu

in post 588.
On Mon, Jul 07/11/16 @ 08:21p,

Cephrir

Votes

Expedience

in post 591.
On Mon, Jul 07/11/16 @ 08:26p,

Nosferatu

Votes

Titus

in post 598.
On Mon, Jul 07/11/16 @ 08:28p,

Nosferatu

Votes

Expedience

in post 601.
On Mon, Jul 07/11/16 @ 08:31p,

Salt Squad

Votes

Expedience

in post 606.
On Mon, Jul 07/11/16 @ 08:35p,

Titus

Votes

Cane + Able/Wake88

in post 615.
On Mon, Jul 07/11/16 @ 08:42p,

Wayward Thinker

Votes

rb

in post 629.
On Mon, Jul 07/11/16 @ 08:44p,

dramonc

votes

Wayward Thinker

in post 639.
On Mon, Jul 07/11/16 @ 08:47p,

Luna Fox

votes

Expedience

in post 649.
On Mon, Jul 07/11/16 @ 08:57p,

Salt Squad

Votes

Wayward Thinker

in post 662.
On Mon, Jul 07/11/16 @ 08:57p,

Klingoncelt

Votes

Expedience

in post 663.
On Mon, Jul 07/11/16 @ 09:25p,

Mathblade

Votes

Expedience

in post 692.
On Mon, Jul 07/11/16 @ 09:25p,

BBMolla

Votes

rb

in post 693.
On Mon, Jul 07/11/16 @ 09:47p,

No Retreat

votes

Expedience

in post 724.
On Mon, Jul 07/11/16 @ 10:02p,

A Song of Ice and Fire

Votes

Stormblade

in post 760.
On Mon, Jul 07/11/16 @ 10:09p,

Expedience

Votes

Titus

in post 780.
On Mon, Jul 07/11/16 @ 10:14p,

Expedience

Votes

rb

in post 793.
On Mon, Jul 07/11/16 @ 10:59p,

No Retreat

votes

davesaz

in post 872.
On Mon, Jul 07/11/16 @ 11:12p,

rb

Votes

Wayward Thinker

in post 885.
On Mon, Jul 07/11/16 @ 11:26p,

BBMolla

Unvotes

(

rb

)

, and Votes

Titus

in post 896.
On Mon, Jul 07/11/16 @ 11:26p,

Heartless

Votes

Wayward Thinker

in post 910.
On Tue, Jul 07/12/16 @ 02:00a,

Expedience

Votes

Luna Fox

in post 932.
On Tue, Jul 07/12/16 @ 08:59a,

TheWayItEnds

votes

Wayward Thinker

in post 1111.
On Tue, Jul 07/12/16 @ 09:51a,

Luna Fox

unvotes

(

Expedience

)

in post 1140.
On Tue, Jul 07/12/16 @ 11:39a,

KuroiXHF

Votes

TheWayItEnds

in post 1161.
On Tue, Jul 07/12/16 @ 11:42a,

davesaz

Votes

Expedience

in post 1164.
On Tue, Jul 07/12/16 @ 01:52p,

Heartless

Votes

Almost50

in post 1220.
On Tue, Jul 07/12/16 @ 02:09p,

Cephrir

Votes

Almost50

in post 1234.
On Tue, Jul 07/12/16 @ 02:31p,

BBMolla

Unvotes

(

Titus

)

, and Votes

Almost50

in post 1246.
On Tue, Jul 07/12/16 @ 02:39p,

Lady Lambdadelta

votes

Luna Fox

in post 1257.
On Tue, Jul 07/12/16 @ 04:29p,

Luna Fox

votes

Almost50

in post 1325.
On Tue, Jul 07/12/16 @ 05:06p,

Almost50

Votes

Heartless

in post 1338.
On Tue, Jul 07/12/16 @ 06:36p,

Tim

votes

Wayward Thinker

in post 1420.
On Tue, Jul 07/12/16 @ 06:42p,

No Retreat

votes

Heartless

in post 1430.
On Tue, Jul 07/12/16 @ 06:51p,

Wayward Thinker

Votes

KuroiXHF

in post 1434.
On Tue, Jul 07/12/16 @ 06:52p,

Titus

Votes

KuroiXHF

in post 1435.
On Tue, Jul 07/12/16 @ 08:40p,

KuroiXHF

Votes

Wayward Thinker

in post 1510.
On Tue, Jul 07/12/16 @ 11:06p,

Salt Squad

Votes

Stormblade

in post 1595.
On Tue, Jul 07/12/16 @ 11:37p,

Cane + Able/Wake88

Votes

Titus

in post 1621.
On Tue, Jul 07/12/16 @ 11:48p,

Luna Fox

votes

Stormblade

in post 1632.
On Wed, Jul 07/13/16 @ 06:05a,

copper223

Votes

KuroiXHF

in post 1699.
On Wed, Jul 07/13/16 @ 06:18a,

Mathblade

Votes

Wayward Thinker

in post 1711.
On Wed, Jul 07/13/16 @ 06:32a,

Expedience

Votes

KuroiXHF

in post 1728.
On Wed, Jul 07/13/16 @ 07:09a,

Expedience

Unvotes

KuroiXHF

in post 1793.
On Wed, Jul 07/13/16 @ 07:19a,

Luna Fox

unvotes

(

Stormblade

)

in post 1801.
On Wed, Jul 07/13/16 @ 09:06a,

Luna Fox

votes

KuroiXHF

in post 1896.
On Wed, Jul 07/13/16 @ 09:48a,

No Retreat

votes

KuroiXHF

in post 1917.
On Wed, Jul 07/13/16 @ 10:00a,

Cephrir

Votes

KuroiXHF

in post 1919.
On Wed, Jul 07/13/16 @ 01:04p,

Cane + Able/Wake88

Unvotes

(

Titus

)

in post 1943.
On Wed, Jul 07/13/16 @ 01:51p,

Salt Squad

Votes

KuroiXHF

in post 1958.
On Wed, Jul 07/13/16 @ 02:58p,

DrippingGoofball

Votes

Franky

in post 2004.
On Wed, Jul 07/13/16 @ 06:46p,

Mathblade

Votes

Expedience

in post 2058.
On Wed, Jul 07/13/16 @ 07:33p,

Toogeloo

votes

KuroiXHF

in post 2088.
On Wed, Jul 07/13/16 @ 07:42p,

Expedience

Votes

RAM

in post 2095.
On Wed, Jul 07/13/16 @ 08:48p,

BBMolla

Unvotes

(

Almost50

)

, and Votes

KuroiXHF

in post 2160.
On Wed, Jul 07/13/16 @ 09:44p,

No Retreat

unvotes

(

KuroiXHF

)

in post 2182.
On Wed, Jul 07/13/16 @ 10:15p,

A Song of Ice and Fire

Unvotes

(

Stormblade

)

in post 2204.
On Wed, Jul 07/13/16 @ 10:57p,

davesaz

Unvotes

(

Expedience

)

in post 2226.
On Thu, Jul 07/14/16 @ 04:50a,

DrippingGoofball

Votes

KuroiXHF

in post 2285.
On Thu, Jul 07/14/16 @ 05:26a,

RAM

Votes

copper223

in post 2291.
On Thu, Jul 07/14/16 @ 07:06a,

Heartless

Votes

copper223

in post 2359.
On Thu, Jul 07/14/16 @ 07:33a,

copper223

Votes

Heartless

in post 2380.
On Thu, Jul 07/14/16 @ 07:56a,

rb

Votes

RAM

in post 2400.
On Thu, Jul 07/14/16 @ 08:08a,

Luna Fox

votes

RAM

in post 2411.
On Thu, Jul 07/14/16 @ 08:16a,

Luna Fox

votes

KuroiXHF

in post 2423.
On Thu, Jul 07/14/16 @ 08:25a,

Titus

Votes

copper223

in post 2433.
On Thu, Jul 07/14/16 @ 08:44a,

rb

Unvotes

(

RAM

)

in post 2446.
On Thu, Jul 07/14/16 @ 09:13a,

rb

Votes

Wayward Thinker

in post 2466.
On Thu, Jul 07/14/16 @ 09:21a,

Titus

Votes

KuroiXHF

in post 2478.
On Thu, Jul 07/14/16 @ 10:43a,

Mathblade

Unvotes

(

Expedience

)

in post 2549.
On Thu, Jul 07/14/16 @ 11:33a,

TheWayItEnds

unvotes

(

Wayward Thinker

)

in post 2555.
On Thu, Jul 07/14/16 @ 05:10p,

Salt Squad

Votes

Wayward Thinker

in post 2599.
On Thu, Jul 07/14/16 @ 05:47p,

davesaz

Votes

Wayward Thinker

in post 2611.
On Thu, Jul 07/14/16 @ 08:50p,

No Retreat

votes

KuroiXHF

in post 2701.
On Thu, Jul 07/14/16 @ 09:35p,

Heartless

Votes

Wayward Thinker

in post 2726.
On Thu, Jul 07/14/16 @ 09:50p,

Mathblade

Votes

Wayward Thinker

in post 2730.
On Fri, Jul 07/15/16 @ 02:40a,

Expedience

Votes

Klingoncelt

in post 2804.
On Fri, Jul 07/15/16 @ 02:42a,

No Retreat

votes

Klingoncelt

in post 2805.
On Fri, Jul 07/15/16 @ 03:54a,

Wayward Thinker

Votes

Klingoncelt

in post 2817.
On Fri, Jul 07/15/16 @ 04:30a,

RAM

Votes

Wayward Thinker

in post 2832.
On Fri, Jul 07/15/16 @ 04:43a,

Nosferatu

Votes

Wayward Thinker

in post 2841.
On Fri, Jul 07/15/16 @ 05:48a,

Cephrir

Votes

Wayward Thinker

in post 2870.
On Fri, Jul 07/15/16 @ 06:24a,

RAM

Votes

Klingoncelt

in post 2883.
On Fri, Jul 07/15/16 @ 06:26a,

Titus

Votes

Klingoncelt

in post 2885.
On Fri, Jul 07/15/16 @ 06:58a,

Expedience

Votes

RAM

in post 2896.
On Fri, Jul 07/15/16 @ 11:43a,

Titus

Votes

KuroiXHF

in post 2980.
On Fri, Jul 07/15/16 @ 12:54p,

KuroiXHF

Votes

A Song of Ice and Fire

in post 3044.
On Fri, Jul 07/15/16 @ 01:30p,

A Song of Ice and Fire

Votes

KuroiXHF

in post 3065.
On Fri, Jul 07/15/16 @ 02:16p,

Cephrir

Votes

KuroiXHF

in post 3083.
On Fri, Jul 07/15/16 @ 06:19p,

BBMolla

Unvotes

(

KuroiXHF

)

, and Votes

Wayward Thinker

in post 3081.
On Fri, Jul 07/15/16 @ 07:32p,

Toogeloo

unvotes

(

KuroiXHF

)

in post 3317.
On Fri, Jul 07/15/16 @ 08:42p,

Expedience

Votes

Klingoncelt

in post 3332.
On Fri, Jul 07/15/16 @ 09:28p,

Cephrir

Votes

Wayward Thinker

in post 3358.
On Fri, Jul 07/15/16 @ 10:15p,

No Retreat

votes

KuroiXHF

in post 3371.
On Fri, Jul 07/15/16 @ 10:28p,

Expedience

Votes

KuroiXHF

in post 3376.
On Sat, Jul 07/16/16 @ 00:33a,

Klingoncelt

Votes

Wayward Thinker

in post 3405.
On Sat, Jul 07/16/16 @ 06:05a,

RAM

Votes

KuroiXHF

in post 3425.
On Sat, Jul 07/16/16 @ 08:45a,

Salt Squad

Votes

KuroiXHF

in post 3467.
On Sat, Jul 07/16/16 @ 09:01a,

Cephrir

Votes

KuroiXHF

in post 3469.
On Sat, Jul 07/16/16 @ 09:33a,

Heartless

Votes

KuroiXHF

in post 3495.
On Sat, Jul 07/16/16 @ 11:54a,

Toogeloo

votes

KuroiXHF

in post 3610.
On Sat, Jul 07/16/16 @ 07:57p,

Tim

Unvotes

Wayward Thinker

, and Votes

KuroiXHF

in post 3640.
On Sat, Jul 07/16/16 @ 10:12p,

dramonic

votes

A Song of Ice and Fire

in post 3673.
On Sat, Jul 07/16/16 @ 10:34p,

dramonic

unvotes

(

A Song of Ice and Fire

)

in post 3687.
On Sat, Jul 07/16/16 @ 10:42p,

dramonic

votes

Wayward Thinker

in post 3694.
On Sun, Jul 07/17/16 @ 12:09p,

Stormblade

Votes

RAM

in post 3774.
On Sun, Jul 07/17/16 @ 12:15p,

Stormblade

Votes

Salt Squad

in post 3776.

Actually, he's at L1. I didn't notice you first unvoted him Luna.

[Wake1]

Fakehammer.^

[Wake1]

LLD never voted him, so he should be at L-1 right now

Luna is correct. The problem I have is that his claim is basically the optimal claim to make as scum to keep town from lynching you on D1, in a game this size at least. It's reasonably safe to assume multiple protectives and investigatives(well, multiple investigatives are guaranteed, basically), so nobody is going to counterclaim you, and you can easily coast on that claim for a good while.

-Cerb

Is it really optimal?

If he's Scum people are gonna wonder why he's surviving through a presumably multi-ball game.

[Wake1]

My first thought was okay, how about we just test his race copping at least, and have him go after someone and get confirmation, but....first of all, that would expose more information to scum for no reason, and second, given the recruit mechanic, I assume all factions capable of recruiting have a race cop, so if he is scum, he might very well be a race cop (or a doctor, actually, cause multi- ball), and if not he should be able to just have his teammate perform the cop for him while he reports the results.

-Cerb

Who claimed Race-Cop?

We were given the option between Nation and Location: we chose Nation.

[Wake1]

Wake, it's ABSOLUTELY optimal for not getting lynched D1. It isn't optimal for late game survival, but I don't really know what claim would be both.

-Cerb

In a game this explosive it certainly isn't optimal for mid-game survival.

Considering we have a Cult I could also see them culting this supposed Doctor, so we would have to pay special attention to any changes in his path.

Bombastic, I know.

[Wake1]

I did not know that.

[Wake1]

I got enough heat, yes?

No.

You haven't.

We haven't even begun.

[Wake1]

OR we could lynch scum WT and stop fucking around.

It depends on whether or not he claims.

If we're going to do this, let's do it right.

Should they be lying it'll come to light eventually.

[Wake1]

If he's a Doctor and not Scum, we shoot ourselves in the foot.

The best play, sans him being Culted, is to leave him for now.

I'm not asking to take him off the table, but to allow him to live past Day 1.

[Wake1]

I've already claimed, though. Surely my claim at least screams town. I'll probably die tonight anyway.

You guys may at least want to check my town meta. I'm more likely to be scum if I appear town.

Not necessarily since there is no one general 'Town.'

If anything I see multiple 'Towns' that may be allied/at war with each other depending on flavor.

[Wake1]

Should we Scumread players who lie in-game about their Race/Nation/Location?

[Wake1]

*Sigh*

[Wake1]

I don't know which flips are Scum and which aren't.

Also why are there redacted parts?

[Wake1]

I don't think being red automatically = Scum in this game.

[Wake1]

If I can't tell which flips are Town and which are Scum, how am I supposed to figure this out?

[Wake1]

How do we know which factions are against/with others?

What useful information do we actually derive from these four flips?

[Wake1]

If it's so ambiguous that I can't even use this information to solve the game i.e. hunt Scum, I may as well replace out.

Not saying I will, but unless we have a lead, SOMETHING, how am I supposed to work with this?

What we know is that there are factions, but there's been nothing that says they are Town or Scum, and anything that can give us clues has been redacted.

[Wake1]

We can't count on the flavor, either. It's not solid.

[Wake1]

I've got my role PM but it doesn't tell me ANYTHING.

It doesn't tell me who is WITH me or AGAINST me.

And no useful info from flips.

So WTH? Do I just float then?

[Wake1]

Toogeloo IS from the Northern Tribes. I verified.

[Wake1]

So basically we're not allowed to copy/paste even sentences of flavor, like this: "...yada yada yada..."

We're left to just paraphrase crap.

Apparently I found a trinket that means he's from the North.

[Wake1]

I'm not revealing anything about PR abilities,

b

ut I can check Nations.

Basically, I'm a

N

o

rthern Tribes Human

.

Northern Tribes

Other

Hu

m

an

[Wake1]

Do we know for a fact that Wulden are Scum?

[Wake1]

Hold on guys.

Checking something.

[Wake1]

Just checked my PM and it says that the Wuldens could encroach at any time, and the risk of undead attacking is, well, possible.

I'm assuming Wuldens are an enemy of the Northern Tribes.

Let's gank that bitch.

VOTE: LLD

[Wake1]

I did receive a cryptic message last Night.

[Wake1]

So, like I said, I received a message last Night.

[Wake1]

*Sigh*

*Lays back in a hammock, grabs a beer, and quietly holds a message about the existence of an SK-sounding entity*

[Wake1]

This game contains an entity called the

Destroyer of Worlds

.

[Wake1]

Is that it or did you find out who has that in their role PM Wake?

All I was told is that there is a singular entity with that name in the game.

If anyone out there receives other important messages during the Night I need you all to share them so I can tell what's going on.

[Wake1]

All I ask is for 1 night and you can flash lynch me.
Literally I can confirm someone wins with the town.

Why do you need one night?

[Wake1]

This game contains an entity called the

Destroyer of Worlds

.

That's nice, but why did you preface with the "I got a message" thing?
What do you think about it?
Pedit: why do people need to share it with you?

Meaning I think we have something like a Serial Killer on the loose.

I don't know why the message was sent to me but I damn well know I'm going to share it with everyone to make sure they know.

This tells me we've got what sounds like a singular entity and a message-sender, so if anyone else gets messages they need to share here what they know.

[Wake1]

All I ask is for 1 night and you can flash lynch me.
Literally I can confirm someone wins with the town.

Why do you need one night?

Because I have an ability that allows me to convert 1 persons win condition to the individual vampire win condition so I can confirm to you all the 1 person wins with town.

But if you're Scum and you make a Scummate couldn't that person just lie as well?

[Wake1]

What i think is he already got culled into this Isowhatever faction and they want more members.
And he's just using his original role as a fake claim.
But ok if you guys want to believe it more than the Faction Cop then go ahead, meanwhile my vote wont move.

But wouldn't an isolationist group not want new members?

[Wake1]

The land now divided between humans, wulden, nosferatu, and undead, a four-way factional war is brewing...

...Yet a fifth faction lurks in the shadows...a faction with an entirely foreign motive, one which sparked the war in the first place.

For some reason this reminds me of Fire Emblem Fates: Revelations.

So we've got an unknown 5th.

We were told the Cult was unknown.

Maybe 5th = game-Cult, NOT flavor-Wulden-Cult.

[Wake1]

So since I don't know who is with me or against me, what does this mean?

It doesn't say I'm individual or isolationist, and I don't have a PT.

All it says is that you win if all threats to the Northern Tribes faction have been eliminated.

Problem is, I don't know who or what they are.

[Wake1]

So since I don't know who is with me or against me, what does this mean?

It doesn't say I'm individual or isolationist, and I don't have a PT.

All it says is that you win if all threats to the Northern Tribes faction have been eliminated.

Problem is, I don't know who or what they are.

You're Town.

Game Mechanics

:

[*]Loosely speaking,

there is at least one town faction

. They win if all threats to them are eliminated. [*]

Loosely speaking,

at least one faction is definitely a scum/mafia faction

. They win if they control 50% of the living.

Role

You are an

Individual Vampire Doctor

.

[REDACTED - FACTIONAL]

In addition, you hold the following

personal abilities

:

1. During the night, target a player. They will be protected from any attempts on their life.
2. Racial checker
   : During the night, in addition to any actions you may take, you may
   check
   a player's
   race
   .

You give the home

Nation

result of

Northern Tribes

.
You give the

Location

result of

Other

.
You give the

Race

result of

Vampire

.

You win when all threats to

the

Individual Vampire

faction

have been eliminated.

[/spoiler]

role

You are the

West Empire Champion

.

HUMANITY'S CHAMPION:

1. Rivalry knowledge:
   You know that there are two other human champions:
   Panther Timon
   of the
   Eastern Kingdom
   , and
   Adrian Burkhard
   , of the
   Northern Tribes
   . There may be other champions in existence as well, however, if so, they would differ from the three human champions' symbiotic relationship.
2. Teeth-clenched teamwork:
   You hold a
   conditional X-shot bulletproof vest
   . This is an
   instantly-applied action
   . X = the number of
   human champions dead
   . You will be informed how many vests you hold. These vests protect against
   one
   nightkill attempt, and are applied
   before any protective role
   .
3. Any attempt to recruit you to a different faction will fail.

In addition to your status as a champion of humanity, you hold the following

personal abilities

:

1. During the night, target a player. If they are
   not a human
   , then you will
   kill
   them.
2. Once in the game, during the night, you may target a player. If
   they do not share your nation
   , they will die. This takes the place of your non-human kill.
3. Once in the game, during the night, you may target a player. If
   they do not share your faction
   , they will die. This takes the place of your non-human kill.
4. Old Grudge:
   If you target
   Panther Timon
   or
   Adrian Burkhard
   , regardless of whether they fit the conditions for your nightkill or not, you will kill them.
5. During pregame, you may select either "location" or "nation". Each night, in addition to any night action you perform, you may investigate a player and learn whichever you selected in pregame.

You give the home

Nation

result of

West Empire

.
You give the

Location

result of

Great Ridge

.
You give the

Race

result of

Human

.

You win when all threats to

the

West Empire

faction

have been eliminated.

dramonic

, who was

Eugine Lysander,

Undead Risen Slave

, has

died N1

.

Role

You are an

Undead Risen Slave

.

[REDACTED - FACTIONAL]

In addition to the above, you hold the following

personal ability

:

Racial Checker

: During the night, in addition to any actions you may take, you may

check

a player's

race

.
You give the home

Nation

result of

East Kingdom

.
You give the

Location

result of

Divitias

.
You give the

Race

result of

Undead

.

You win if all threats to a new humanity treaty are eliminated and at least one player with this wincon is alive.

[/quote]

BBMolla

, who was

Julia Otho,

Individual Human Jailkeeper

, has

died N1

.

Role

You are an

Individual Human Jailkeeper

.
You hold the following

personal abilities

:

1. During the night, target a player. You will protect them from any and all nightkills, while also blocking
   all
   actions they perform.
2. During pregame, you may select either "location" or "nation". Each night, in addition to any night action you perform, you may investigate a player and learn whichever you selected in pregame.

You give the home

Nation

result of

West Empire

.
You give the

Location

result of

Great Ridge

.
You give the

Race

result of

Human

.

You win if all threats to

the

Individual Humans

faction

have been eliminated.

[/quote]

[/quote]

This is the friggin proof FA. Mastins post: They win if all threats to them are eliminated. EVERY SINGLE WIN CON WE'VE SEEN(AND YOU'RE OWN, ASSUMING YOU'RE TOWN): "You win if all threats to <faction name> are eliminated".

-Cerb

pedit: There are people in this thread who are apparently ignoring Nahdia and incapable of understanding the basic mechanics of this game, in spite of overwhelming evidence...and are making cases against people based on that misunderstanding. It has to be corrected copper.[/quote]

Cerb you can add mine, too. Northern Tribes in bold cyan. Northern Tribes/Other/Human. You win if all threats to

the

Northern Tribes

faction

have been eliminated.

Role PM flavor implies that Wulden/nosferatu/undead are the enemy, but it's ambiguous.

[Wake1]

Cerb you can add mine, too. Northern Tribes in bold cyan. Northern Tribes/Other/Human. You win if all threats to

the

Northern Tribes

faction

have been eliminated.

Role PM flavor implies that Wulden/nosferatu/undead are the enemy, but it's ambiguous.

[Wake1]

So, let's change things up.

If anyone knows who the enemy of the Northern Tribes are, I would like to know.

[Wake1]

Considering the Cult faction, it's doubtful anyone has picked up in a difference of direction in one of the players here.

[Wake1]

Frankly, I'm lost in this game.

LA until 7/30/16.

[Wake1]

*Sigh*

*Lays back in a hammock, grabs a beer, and quietly holds a message about the existence of an SK-sounding entity*

I'll have to wade through 30 pages to find out, won't I?

Not unless you use the power of the 3-letter word.

[Wake1]

Unless there are nachos in that wall, I'm not combing through it.

[Wake1]

This game contains an entity called the

Destroyer of Worlds

.

And Salt Squad is an Isolationist...

VOTE: Salt Squad

See, I'm tempted to join you, but could you persuade me just a teensy bit more?

[Wake1]

Oh OK I'll wait patiently for your response.

[Wake1]

Actually, neighborhoods can have 0-100% Scum. It's usually random.

100% scum factions are the best :')

Beware those Wake88 games.

Speaking of those games, I may start working on a massive one.

Hey Wake. Now that you've claimed Northern Tribes, what do you make of these posts?

To be frank, I'm lost in this game. I don't know who's with/against me. IF it's true that the four flips are 'Town,' that would help me tremendously, i.e. having some sort of lead.

[Wake1]

Why would House have thought humans comprised one town faction? I get that you aren't him, but... your role PM clearly indicates there are three, doesn't it?

I can't speak for House.

The flavor mentions 'Pinkskin' tribe, that I originate from it. There's no indication of multiple human factions in my role PM.

It does say the Pinkskin are in severe danger of nosferatu attacks, that Wuldens could encroach at any time, and the risk of undead attacking was not outside the realm of possibility. However, it also says fights erupted, and the tribe (my Pinkskin tribe?)

divided

.

[Wake1]

Why is the fact you separated relevant?

Why exactly do you think it isn't?

[Wake1]

Why is the fact you separated relevant?

Why exactly do you think it isn't?

I do not have an opinion on it yet, I am waiting for you to tell me why you bolded that part.

Because if it weren't obvious it tells me that there are divisions of the Pinkskin tribe in this game, which from my perspective tells me they could be Scum.

[Wake1]

I'd bet my left nut on Eastern Kingdom being the human-scum faction. Especially since we've had zero claims from there whatsoever.

Uhh we've had zero claims whatsoever from any nation faction that i remember, only an Individual human, unless you mean the ppl that claimed Nation? And even then Wake claimed Easter Kingdom Faction, this by default means that it's something safe to claim.

False.

I claimed early.

I'm not classified as 'Individual,' either.

My nation is

Northern Tribes Human

.

[Wake1]

I'd bet my left nut on Eastern Kingdom being the human-scum faction. Especially since we've had zero claims from there whatsoever.

And even then Wake claimed Easter Kingdom Faction, this by default means that it's something safe to claim.

Wait a minute.

Are you even reading my posts?

[Wake1]

I suspect a Scum group could comprise very different players on race, nation, location, and maybe even faction. Faction doesn't mean you can't be a part of Scum. Scum could have a member rooted in each faction.

[Wake1]

Yeah i misrememebred, ops, sorry >.<

'Misremembered.'

[Wake1]

I suspect a Scum group could comprise very different players on race, nation, location, and maybe even faction. Faction doesn't mean you can't be a part of Scum. Scum could have a member rooted in each faction.

Faction is your WinCon though...you mean scum could have members from different nations/locations I take it?

Exactly.

Don't trust people just because they say/you think you're of the same faction, EVEN if you can communicate privately with your factions.

Think about it. If you assume the four factions are separate Towns how much space are you leaving for Scum?

If Factions are like separate Towns, I strongly suspect Scum could be spread among them.

[Wake1]

I suspect a Scum group could comprise very different players on race, nation, location, and maybe even faction. Faction doesn't mean you can't be a part of Scum. Scum could have a member rooted in each faction.

Faction is your WinCon though...you mean scum could have members from different nations/locations I take it?

Exactly.

Don't trust people just because they say/you think you're of the same faction, EVEN if you can communicate privately with your factions.

Think about it. If you assume the four factions are separate Towns how much space are you leaving for Scum?

If Factions are like separate Towns, I strongly suspect Scum could be spread among them.

I think we are talking past each other, or we're not getting something.

Faction is your WinCon and you can't be say, West Empire Faction and be scum. We know that from Titus' flip.

But yes you could have your NATION as West Empire and your Faction as scum, not aligned with West Empire.

I'm also doing the opposite of assuming the four factions are separate Towns, I'm saying it's highly likely based on the flips/claims so far that the unclaimed/unflipped faction (Eastern Kingdom) is scummy.

I don't know.

If Scum are given fakeclaims/totally different fakeclaim role PMs, I don't know the extent.

In my gut I get the feeling that if there are Faction PTs that Scum could be within. I'm not an 'Individual' of the Northern Tribes, but I never received a PT.

Also I'm not as inclined as you are to think a whole major faction could be Scum. If anything, I could see Scum having its members hidden among them.

I mean, come on. In a regular game we have the Town and the Scum. I assume the major Factions are like major Towns, and that Scum can be spread broadly across the 'Towns.'

We also haven't seen a Scum flip yet, so we can't know that Scum couldn't have been given the trappings of a certain Faction, but have it tweaked in whatever way Mastin wants it to look like.

[Wake1]

Luna how is your PT classified?

Is it a Faction PT or just a randomly named Neighborhood?

[Wake1]

Whatever the case, we really need a Scumflip.

I want to know exactly how Scum flips, because I don't trust the notion that 'you have Faction wincon = ergo you can't be Scum.'

Gut tells me Scum either has it modified so they can blend in, or have discrepancies in their role PMs so that it looks and feels like they're part of the faction, and even have Faction PT access.

[Wake1]

Gut tells me Scum either has it modified so they can blend in, or have discrepancies in their role PMs so that it looks and feels like they're part of the faction, and even have Faction PT access.

OR
They have safe fake claims as mastin has stated multiple times.

I'm thinking fakeclaims with Faction PT access.

Meaning, zero Faction PT is safe.

Luna, is your PT a Faction PT or a random Neighborhood?

[Wake1]

OK, now I'm feeling uncomfortable with Luna ignoring my question.

[Wake1]

Luna how is your PT classified?

Is it a Faction PT or just a randomly named Neighborhood?

Luna, is your PT a Faction PT or a random Neighborhood?

PEDIT: So you answered on her behalf because you gave her grief for leaking too much of what was said?

...

Which Faction?

What you said lends credence to not all people being in a Faction PT are actually part of it, and don't necessarily have the same wincon.

[Wake1]

The redirect issue should be resolved Day 2 or it'll continue throughout the game.

[Wake1]

This is dumb.

Assuming the whole Eastern Kingdom is Scum is badthink.

It makes more sense that all major Factions are Town, but Scum is among them WITH fakeclaims and access to PT.

Remember what Mastin said about the game being ambiguous? You really think he'd a whole kingdom Scum. Sorry, that's just stupid.

If we end up with Eastern Kingdom Townflips it's gonna mean... what? What was that? Wake's right again? Oh why thank you everyone. Yes, yes he's right.

[Wake1]

Assuming the Eastern Kingdom = Scum is fallacious. That's my point.

[Wake1]

Is anyone willing to claim being of the Eastern Kingdom? No point being shy since others have claimed.

[Wake1]

Speaking of which FoS Wake for wanting people to say a certain three letter word for a potential cult leader. That seems very odd. Also for not wanting to read it he is borrowing some of those ideas. 4828

LMFAO.

What are you talking about?

I literally didn't read your wall, either.

[Wake1]

OK Mathblade we're gonna play a game. One word at a time.

____
| . .|
O . |
. . .|
. . _|__


_ _ _

[Wake1]

And by word, I mean letter.

[Wake1]

Try again.

[Wake1]

But you wanna know what that word is, right?

Or you don't because it's just something to latch onto because you're Scum.

Come on, you wanted to know, so come out and embrace who you are superstar.

[Wake1]

There's no 'Z.'

You've got a lead.

[Wake1]

I'll let you choose 2 letters at the same at.

Go on, it's OK.

[Wake1]

Mathblades's behaving foolishly over a 3-letter word almost every Scummer knows. There's a reason why I'm poking her over this.

[Wake1]

We're going to help Mathblade because she just isn't up to speed.

The word is 'ISO.'

Get it? Get the context? Get how your crap collapses in on itself?

[Wake1]

And I don't do Reads Lists. Fuck no.

Don't like it? Deal with it.

[Wake1]

Good god. Wake there are twenty players I don't expect a list of every player that would be nuts. Just a overall idea of what you are thinking is good.

And I ISO all the time. I know the word. But granted that is a common way to cult someone in F2F I didn't want to say that word especially since you were talking about an SK/Cult entity.

I need a break for dinner. The insistence of not playing Mafia by many people is just so damn infuriating.

WTF is F2F. I don't know what F2F is.

And NO, I don't post Reads Lists. I keep mine in a personal PT, and I share what I want when I want.

I play the way that works best for me. I'm tired of wasting hours on quality posts only to have it ignored or worse. It's not worth the investment of time and energy. I'll in players if they're A) Town and B) willing to be receptive. My time is fucking precious. No offense: that's just the way it is. It's that way in ALL my games. Prevents game-related stress, too.

[Wake1]

And it is they...Please. I am a they.

Are you a Hydra?

[Wake1]

And it is they...Please. I am a they.

Are you a Hydra?

Bigender. I am one person two genders.

Ah-um, yeah.

See, I could riff with you a bit on this but this place is about as humorous as North Korea in some regards. I mean, just try having a conservative opinion in the Speakeasy. The name itself is a misnomer.

God, where's Milo Yiannopolous when you need him?

Anyways, I'll continue trying to figure this game out as I do.

[Wake1]

Oh, and if you do get that game going, please send me an invite. I like complicated games (as you probably can tell by now).

The game in question would have 30 players and be far more crazy and fun than anything ever played on this site.

Klingon remembers that game with cards. Think that but with so much more, and the cards can be used once each Day.

With nursing school coming up it really depends.

[Wake1]

What's the rationale behind lynching KC?

[Wake1]

Luna, if you're Town the best thing to do is reveal everything.

I've seen this crap before.

Neighborhood gets leaked Day 1, some details get leaked but reservations persist, as Days go by players more and more paranoid and angry, the Neighborhood gets lynched over refusal to transparently share everything.

And this is just from experience.

Do the right thing because... well... if you don't... sooner or later you're not going to be worrying about your Neighbors... but everyone else, including me.

I really...

dislike

... when people withhold information from me.

[Wake1]

In case it isn't clear, I'm obvTown as fuck.

I just don't know who to hunt for because the mechanics of this game are so diiferent from the norm.

If iT were a simple matter of 18:5:5 I'd be happy as a clam, BUT THIS SHIT?

[Wake1]

@A50

I was reading your last page and my role is against some part of that big description thats the much I will claim

~Ice

What's the use in holding back?

People will just come for you later if you goose out now.

[Wake1]

@A50

I was reading your last page and my role is against some part of that big description thats the much I will claim

~Ice

What's the use in holding back?

People will just come for you later if you goose out now.

[Wake1]

<<< I have expressed multiple times that I will attempt to clarify things if asked. If the clarification doesn't help, ask again and I will try to clarify even further. But I feel like I need to make an announcement on this subject all the same:
As a starting point...fuck special mechanics and treat this game like any normal mafia game. What conclusions, off of your and flipped, roles would you then make? Add in the mechanics post only

after

having done this. Not before. It will help like 90% of the questions I get asked. This is still a MAFIA game. It, therefore, follows basic mafia principles present in any mafia game. (I am not reinventing the wheel, here.) The remainder are, of course, why I continue to clarify as much as I can. >>>

Could you please confirm that the four flips we've had so far aren't Scum?

[Wake1]

To the players here, basically we win if all threats to the Northern Tribes are defeated.

If you're part of my faction I'd like you to say so, even if you're repeating yourself.

I also want to understand why I don't have access to my faction's PT, and I'm also curious if there are any other Pinkskins here.

[Wake1]

Could you please confirm that the four flips we've had so far aren't Scum?

<<< No, I cannot. This is where your own role PM, and the mechanics post, comes into play. The informed minority in this game is scum. The uninformed majority in this game is town. This, I can say, because it is universal to any mafia game. How it manifests is given in the mechanics post. >>>

So......

...we don't have confirmation on the flips being Town or Scum.

Do we... How can I trust my role PM when you say it's ambiguous?

I have not one concrete thing to work with. I don't know who my enemies are and I don't know who Town or Scum are.

Throw me a bone here. Please. I don't know how I'm supposed to solve this if I don't have at least a tiny, concrete thing to work with.

[Wake1]

Mastin, does any player know if their objective is to destroy a certain group?

I can't play this game if I'm not given anything to solve it.

[Wake1]

Could you please confirm that the four flips we've had so far aren't Scum?

<<< No, I cannot. This is where your own role PM, and the mechanics post, comes into play. The informed minority in this game is scum. The uninformed majority in this game is town. This, I can say, because it is universal to any mafia game. How it manifests is given in the mechanics post. >>>

So......

...we don't have confirmation on the flips being Town or Scum.

Do we... How can I trust my role PM when you say it's ambiguous?

I have not one concrete thing to work with. I don't know who my enemies are and I don't know who Town or Scum are.

Throw me a bone here. Please. I don't know how I'm supposed to solve this if I don't have at least a tiny, concrete thing to work with.

You just want everything given to you instead of doing the leg work?
Fine i'll do the leg work for you
All 4 flips were town
You're welcome

He hasn't confirmed it, and if he hasn't confirmed it you certainly can't know.

[Wake1]

*She.

[Wake1]

Mastin, when players die and flip will there be anything at all to differentiate between Town and Scum?

[Wake1]

Didn't someone say a fakeclaim would be revealed if a Scum player died?

[Wake1]

I guess I'm just going to play as a Survivor then.

I have no trustworthy information to work with.

[Wake1]

If you really want to replace out because you cant figure out the game go ahead, i dont blame you, this game is pretty hard to figure out, i however am having fun trying to figure it out, and mastin put effort into making this, and im not letting that effort go to waste.
But being here complaining that you dont know what anything means, and not listening to the people actually trying to make sense of the game isnt going to make scum magically pop out of nowhere.
P-Edit: This is directed at the people that feel like replacing out because "it isnt a game of mafia".

I Don't have any problem with a hard game to figuring out

I just want a game that has any kind of way garanteeing you can figure out what the fuck you should do.

and I don't wanna replace out. this is one of the only things I can do during this boring period of my life :/

This is exactly how I feel.

I don't want to replace out either, but this game's so vague I feel like I'm denied even basic information from flips.

If you're playing Mafia but the flips won't tell you who the Mafia are, how are you even supposed to play?

[Wake1]

I'll likely have a lot of questions for you tomorrow Mastin.

I'm confused with this game, but I do appreciate the patience.

[Wake1]

Mastin, when players die and flip will there be anything at all to differentiate between Town and Scum?

All players with different factions will die and flip with the differences noted as they have been: factional abilities will be redacted, and ALL non-factional information--including their wincon--will be displayed.

OK, what does that mean?

Hypothetically if a player within a faction has 'you need to kill this certain faction/all these people' would that show up upon a flip?

[Wake1]

Mastin, since I'm of the Northern Tribes faction does this mean (unless the player is lying) that other players of the Northern Tribe faction are part of my Town and can be trusted? Or is it that Scum can be infiltrated INSIDE my Northern Tribes faction?

[Wake1]

I feel like I'm gonna have to Scumhunt the Mod for answers.

My greatest challenge yet.

[Wake1]

I'm suddenly very aware of how this game works, and what to look for.

Basically if you're Northern Tribes faction with the wincon of eliminating all threats to it, you're basically my Townspeople.

I need you to claim if you're of my Faction, AND your Nation.

IF EVER there was a reason to do a Factional Townbloc, THIS IS IT. I need my fellow Tribesmen. WINTER IS COMING! THE NORTH REMEMBERS! SANSA IS HOT!

JOIN ME, MY TRIBESMEN. WE'LL SORT THE LIARS OUT EVENTUALLY. THE BEAR IS FULLY COOKED.

[Wake1]

Wake, can I be one of your townspeople even if I'm not the same faction? This is entirely hypothetical of course, I may very well be a Northern Tribesperson just like you.

What are you talking about?

I'm suddenly very aware of how this game works, and what to look for.

Basically if you're Northern Tribes faction with the wincon of eliminating all threats to it, you're basically my Townspeople.

I need you to claim if you're of my Faction, AND your Nation.

IF EVER there was a reason to do a Factional Townbloc, THIS IS IT. I need my fellow Tribesmen. WINTER IS COMING! THE NORTH REMEMBERS! SANSA IS HOT!

JOIN ME, MY TRIBESMEN. WE'LL SORT THE LIARS OUT EVENTUALLY. THE BEAR IS FULLY COOKED.

did you not read the entire game, or did you just skip the mechanics post and the titus flip.

And again, what are you talking about?

I PM'd Mastin and he said if a player shares my faction, they share my wincon (and can therefore be trusted).

Basically any player with a Northern Tribes wincon will win with other members of the NT wincon, because they are all members of that faction: a victory for one of them is a victory for all of them.

[Wake1]

Unless players lie, anyone who claims Northern Tribes is Town.

I want all members of my faction to claim and join together.

We'll defend each other, and we'll keep a better eye on one another in case some of them are lying.

I'll be searching the thread tomorrow for anyone else of my Faction to see if they've claimed.

[Wake1]

'Your nation in shambles, your only comfort was in the knowledge the hunters, the paleskins, the bloodsucking nosferatu had damaged the northern tribes'

3909

I wonder if the Western Empire is an enemy of the Northern Tribes...

[Wake1]

From what i gather your faction appears to be human no?
Do you believe having everyone of your faction claim and putting themselves as tasty bait for non human recruit is a good idea?

I don't recall that part.

If there are non-human members of my Faction, perhaps it would be safer for them.

(Keep in mind I haven't read through 200 pages of speculation.)

[Wake1]

Meanwhile im standing here, on the equivalent of a cop guilty.
While you're proposing endangering your faction to potential recruiting.

A)

I have a life.

B)

This game has been huge and confusing for a long while until now.

C)

Have a hug.

[Wake1]

I need a REAL condensed reason as to WHY I should vote SS.

[Wake1]

I'll put it to you into perspective
I have a faction scan on them that heavily points to our possible global scum faction. However there's a chance i got redirected, in which case there's scum in my hood guaranteed.

So lynching SS is at best a scum lynch and at worst, narrows down lynch pool for scum.

To progress the game I'd be willing to vote SS, but I need to know HOW EXACTLY you can guarantee there's Scum in your Hood if you were redirected.

[Wake1]

So you assume there's a Redirector in your Hood?

If Scum's in your Hood and they share a PT, the Redirector may NOT be in there, but that same Scum may be there.

Can you tell me the number of people in your Hood?

[Wake1]

Can you tell me the number of people in your Hood?

Unfortunately i cant give you this info right now, all i can tell you is what i've already told you.
There's a bigger summary somewhere in my ISO that explains the details of the scan and why i believe there's very low chance of redirection regardless, but if it happened the culprit is in the hood.

I never said the redirector was in the hood, but the scum in the hood that did the deed obviously would have a redirector in their faction.

You

do

realize overtly withholding information from me with zero reason will be a bad idea down the road, right?

[Wake1]

May we have an updated VC?

[Wake1]

VOTE: Salt Squad

[Wake1]

UNVOTE: Salt Squad

FFS I thought SS only had 8 votes. LOL.

[Wake1]

VOTE: Salt Squad

[Wake1]

LOL.

[Wake1]

LYNCH IT WITH FIRE!!!1!1!!!

[Wake1]

Five deaths? Wow.

Pretty sure the Wulden are Scum, too.

[Wake1]

Confirming A50 is Northern Tribes nation.

[Wake1]

Did anyone get any messages during the Night?

[Wake1]

Honestly, I'm thinking this '

Destroyer of Worlds

' has some part in all of these deaths. If anyone received a message during the Night no matter how trivial I need you to share it because it's important. Now is not the time to withhold any messages.

[Wake1]

Honestly, I'm thinking this '

Destroyer of Worlds

' has some part in all of these deaths. If anyone received a message during the Night no matter how trivial I need you to share it because it's important. Now is not the time to withhold any messages.

Stop mechanics hunting and start scum hunting seriously.

I'm obvTown. You ain't got shit honcho.

In wayb4 Wake is Destroyer of Worlds.

Now you're just being paranoid. BUT, your fee-fees on this DO seem Townish...

[Wake1]

VOTE: LLD

[Wake1]

LLD is Scum, therefore today's lynch. Those who oppose it are Scum.

[Wake1]

Isolationists are to Red Mafia what Wulden are to Blue Mafia.

This is multiball and only an idiot would think otherwise.

We NEED to lynch LLD today. She's Scum.

FoS

on those shrinking away from her lynch.

[Wake1]

I think the fact that you are more interested in why you were being scumread then trying to hunt for scum says alot.

I'm assuming you're referring to bacde.

[Wake1]

In a 6 person hood, I don't think there'd be 2 wulden scum spying on them. That seems a bit much. Also a50 claimed northern tribes faction, so he's not there.

p-edit: It's possible. That said, since if both were scum, they'd be scum of the same faction (wulden), if he wanted to save Bcade, then that would make LLD town. Which is I think is less likely than not. If I was going to lynch any, I would lynch Bcade first though.

We lynch LLD today, or I will throw a shit-fit.

And by shit-fit, I mean throwing this game into chaos until players come to their senses and lynch the other Scum faction player.

[Wake1]

Wake, if you believe LLD is scum why did you A) not open today with a "hey guys we should lynch LLD" and B.) campaign for her lynch YESTERDAY?

I'm going to give you and answer to think about it and answer it yourself so I don't have to tear your butt-cheeks off and metaphorically stuff them down your gullet.

[Wake1]

Wake, if you believe LLD is scum why did you A) not open today with a "hey guys we should lynch LLD" and B.) campaign for her lynch YESTERDAY?

I'm gonna give you time to think about it and answer it yourself so I don't have to tear your butt-cheeks off and metaphorically stuff them down your gullet.

EBWOP.

[Wake1]

role

You are an

Isolationist

.

You win if all

wulden

are dead, and the

Isolationist Faction

controls 50% of the town, or nothing could prevent this.

=

role

You are

Red Mafia

.

You win if all

Blue Mafia

are dead, and the

Red Mafia

controls 50% of the town, or nothing could prevent this.

[Wake1]

And, with FIVE fucking kills, I'm pretty damned sure we have a Serial Killer, too. MEANING, the Towniest fucking player could be a Serial Killer!

[Wake1]

And, with FIVE fucking kills, I'm pretty damned sure we have a Serial Killer, too. MEANING, the Towniest fucking player could be a Serial Killer!

In way b4 Wake is Destroyer of Worlds again.

I'm not that crafty. If I were Destroyer of Worlds the very last thing I would do is mention its existence.

All I know is that it exists and if anyone has gotten a message during the Night they need to reveal what it says ASAP.

[Wake1]

"It's wise to be... cautious... with Wake."

True, but you should be kissing my butt this game since I'm obvTown.

[Wake1]

When I was Scumhunting Mastin in the PMs he told me to look at the 50% wincon and asked me if it looks like a Scum wincon, and basically said that yes it is one.

[Wake1]

"It's wise to be... cautious... with Wake."

True, but you should be kissing my butt this game since I'm obvTown.

You're obv not-scum. That doesn't make you obv-town.

What you are is an obv-Moron, and you can kiss my obv-Ass.

[Wake1]

But whatever I'm just tin-foil hatting right now.

Honestly though I must just be inexperienced at multi-ball because it seems so fucking weird that I'm being asked by what I'm like 95% sure is a town player to do the thing in a SCUM FACTION WINCON and kill a Wulden. It feels so disgusting but I think I'm starting to accept it's the right play for town...I think?

Because it's MUTLIBALL YOU... YOU....!

I NEED A BETTER WORD THAN MORON.

YOU'VE GONE BEYOND THE MORON LINE.

YOU'VE OFFICIALLY DONE IT IT.

[Wake1]

Also you said, "the towniest player could be 3rd party!" and now you're screaming, "I'm OBV-TOWN!"

I hope I'm not the only one thinking that you'd do this to make us think you're being way too obvious to actually be the 3rd party.

Ain't it amazing, honcho?

Can it, can it really be that an obvTown player could say 'hey everybody, the SK might be the Towniest player here?'

[Wake1]

You're not ACTUALLY obvTown though.

Yes I've been reading the thread. It's mod-confirmed every faction that would need it has a fake-claim. There's literally fucking nothing that makes you obvTown because remember, this is a multi-ball game moron. Not just that, a multi-ball game with MOD-CONFIRMED fake-claims for ANY PLAYER THAT NEEDS IT.

This tin-foil hat's never coming off.

You know what's obvTown?

DEEZ NUTS.

[Wake1]

Think about it.

Wulden and Isolationist are opposing

Mafia

factions.

Cult is another Scum faction.

Lastly, we likely have a Serial Killer.

[Wake1]

Mastin, if a Scum faction is eliminated will it be announced in-thread?

[Wake1]

Why aren't you voting LLD A50...?

[Wake1]

While the Day is still young, we must not forget to lynch confirmed Scum (LLD) today.

[Wake1]

Wake's balls are huge. Which is all the more reason why he's destroyer.

The only thing that's gonna destroy you are

DEEZ NUTS

.

[Wake1]

Oh look everyone, A50's being cute.

Where's my response to 6029 you ungrateful, biscuit-eating son of a bitch?

[Wake1]

[Wake1]

Honestly, I'm thinking this '

Destroyer of Worlds

' has some part in all of these deaths. If anyone received a message during the Night no matter how trivial I need you to share it because it's important. Now is not the time to withhold any messages.

I -for one- did NOT receive anything. It may have been specific to your role, or it may have been someone who strongly town read you that they opted to share it with you with a specific mechanic of their own role.

Either way, I'm confirming I neither sent you a message (bc I can't communicate with people at night) nor did I receive any "special" messages (i.e. nothing except my role specific PMs, which you all get: Investigative checks on either Nation or Location, which do not help much except if someone is caught outright lying, and I don't see why anyone would lie about those either.)

Cool.

Hey, you know what post this doesn't address?

6029.

[Wake1]

Oh, OK.

VOTE: Almost50

[Wake1]

Almost50, why are you ignoring my question?

[Wake1]

but I seriously doubt there'd be a stand-alone SK in a 28-players game.

Kay,

that's

naive.

I always include SKs in games over 21 players, and in a Theme game I'd be salivating over additional 3rd party Scum individuals that may or may not be able to kill, but have far-reaching abilities.

[Wake1]

Oh look everyone, A50's being cute.

Where's my response to 6029 you ungrateful, biscuit-eating son of a bitch?

ALso, everyone who knows me knows I do not appreciate such name calling even if it was for humour. My parents are "sacred" to me, and I don't think they brought me to life for them to be called something or the other bc of me.

Thank you.

OMFG I hope you're being sarcastic. Tell me you have thicker skin than that.

[Wake1]

Why aren't you voting LLD A50...?

I only have one vote, and by the time I voted it looked like Bacde was getting more votes. I could switch to LLD if I see her wagon gaining more momentum.

You could, I don't know, switch your vote to the confirmed Scum that is LLD.

[Wake1]

Looks like I got your attention.

You should

really

put your vote on LLD, since she's confScum.

[Wake1]

...

...interesting.

[Wake1]

Why aren't you voting LLD A50...?

I only have one vote, and by the time I voted it looked like Bacde was getting more votes. I could switch to LLD if I see her wagon gaining more momentum.

You could, I don't know, switch your vote to the confirmed Scum that is LLD.

Why vote for what you believe in when you can vote for something with momentum that you dont believe in?

Because LLD being confScum is not a belief, and you are also a Wulden.

[Wake1]

Could someone be a dear (or deer if you rather be!) and remind me why Wake can't be an isolationist?

Because, well, I have DEEZ NUTS here.

Let's start there.

[Wake1]

Oh, and I'm obvTown and anyone with a nominally-functioning brain can tell I'm a Northern Tribes factional.

If you disagree, I do invite you to engage me directly. You will not enjoy it.

[Wake1]

Could someone be a dear (or deer if you rather be!) and remind me why Wake can't be an isolationist?

Because, well, I have DEEZ NUTS here.

Let's start there.

Can you stop the immaturity and fake bravado? Its not fooling anyone. Well I take that back, its not fooling anyone smart.

-------------------------------------------------------------

All I remember is RB stating that Wake was not Isolationist and I'm not sure why. I also have no desire to slog through this game so someone explain it to me like a 2016 join date.

The idea the LLD gets pegged as Wulden and fakeclaims to be in an independent Wulden faction is not an impossibility. I am not thrilled with the idea of killing LLD when

ONE OF THE SCUM WINCONS IS TO KILL ALL THE WULDENS!

I mean....mmmmaaaayyyybeee the fact that no one else has said "Oh hey I'm an independent Wulden too!" points to her being scum but even if she is scum there are still other scum out there. I kinda feel like the LLD wagon is an isolationist led wagon.

Which idiot am I talking to?

[Wake1]

Well Timmy, Northern Tribes doesn't have a wincon that wants every Town member dead.

What does that make Timmy? It makes him a dumbass.

Anyone with a Northern Tribes factional wincon is not ever going to lynch me.

I bet that must feel like a hot coal trapped within your bosom.

Cheers.

[Wake1]

Also. any NT faction player can check my Nation any time they want to know I'm of the Northern Tribes.