DEFCON Mafia 4.0 - СЛАВА РОССИИ МАТЕРИ

[Spiffeh]

I will be nuking hiplop at the earliest opportunity

No one get in my way

[Spiffeh]

VOTE: For Total War

no one nuke me though I have to beat my record from kuribo in wonderland

[Spiffeh]

oh hey I finally rolled town in a large
but now I have 23 slots to sort...
I'll probably just sheep people who are actually good. (Which is like, everybody. Except me. )

THIS ONE'S MINE

[Spiffeh]

Ceph did your scum team elect you as the honorary "respectable player" to try and stop Total War to save your scumbuddies from complete annihilation?

[Spiffeh]

Yeah ideally we'd make a plan and decide collectively who we'd nuke and who would grab troops etc. and whoever strays from the plan gets turbolynched/nuked

[Spiffeh]

Does that plan mean everyone is taking nukes? if so, every scum that goes down gets to off someone don't they

The idea is that we force scummy players to get the least dangerous troops and only allow largely townread players to get the nukes

But as others have already pointed out people want to "have fun" and do what they want so making a plan that everyone will follow is unrealistic and will just piss me off when people inevitably break it

[Spiffeh]

I think the nuke doctor is way more useful than 3/10

[Spiffeh]

Are we still allowed to discuss stuff during DEFCON 1?

Because if so I see no reason for TOTAL WAR to not happen

[Spiffeh]

I'm tempted to vote against Total War and totally be the spoiler here. I'm not really swayed toward either side, but I'm inclined against it just because I think making the game into Texas Justice too early lets the emotions run high and leads too more drama than necessary. I'll peek at the previous games to see what was said about Total War (if it even was an option previously).

At the very least don't do this until everyone has checked in

[Spiffeh]

I think we'd get a lot more out of flips from nukes and troop selection than we would out of 2 weeks of talking

And it's not like we lose all discussion anyway

Scum are more likely to dislike the random element of TOTAL WAR and oppose it

[Spiffeh]

Are you actually standing behind that stance in practice? Because I would expect scum to be pretending to be cautious in doing something like this, not to actually try to oppose Total War for some mechanical purpose.

I meant that scum would prefer no TOTAL WAR to TOTAL WAR

The façade they put on for the thread is obviously a different story, but I'd expect them to latch onto the insecurities town players have about TOTAL WAR and ultimately try to get it opposed

[Spiffeh]

Cheet which way are you leaning currently?

[Spiffeh]

I am neither

[Spiffeh]

Will nuking all the scum be town enough for you?

[Spiffeh]

Spiff, I'm getting town vibes from you despite our disagreement here. Don't let me forget I said this.

Don't worry I certainly will be shoving my towniness down everyone's throat soon enough

[Spiffeh]

Scared?

[Spiffeh]

Errantparabola is scum

discuss

[Spiffeh]

This is scum Firebringer too btw

[Spiffeh]

spiffeh is probably town here

This isn't saving you from my nuke

[Spiffeh]

FB is doing that thing he does as scum where he acts all cutesy and pretends to not care

[Spiffeh]

Actually fuck nukes I am going for the vig

[Spiffeh]

@Spiff, I can't eat EP scumread here. If you have reasoning can you hit me in the face with it.

Gut

Basically their post calling me out for something and immediately going back on it gave me scumvibes, it seemed like a pretty random comment to make in general and coincided with you calling one of my posts barf (;_;) so it's it looked like they were trying to curry favor with you/take an easy potshot at me while it was safe

I realize they haven't done much yet but what makes you unable to "eat" an EP scum read?

Also what do you think of Nukebringer?

[Spiffeh]

I don't understand why everyone and their mother is scum reading RC

He is one of my like 3 solid town reads atm

[Spiffeh]

There are a lot of people that are doing things that mildly bother me and I have very few town reads because of it and it makes me sad

[Spiffeh]

Probably not

[Spiffeh]

Please never format a post like that again

Why does that seem more likely than them seeing something off with something you said and then realizing that you weren't saying what they thought you were saying?

That's also possible but my gut thinks otherwise

[Spiffeh]

Town: Cephrir, Cheetory, Hiplop, mastina, accountant
Scum: Spiffeh, Nahdia,

Can you explain why you are scumreading me?

[Spiffeh]

6-7?

Their first game they snowed me but afterwards they rolled scum a bunch and I mostly caught on

They do have a habit of making really fake sounding posts as either alignment so that has probably tripped me up a bit in the past

PEdit: @Cheet

[Spiffeh]

mastin nuke is a boring stance PZ I expect better from you

[Spiffeh]

especially since she's town

[Spiffeh]

My current ultra conservative nuke pile is {Something_Smart, Nukebringer}

I could add a few more names if I wanted to go balls to the wall but both of these slots need immediate death

[Spiffeh]

I could also see scum!GIF

He's around enough to make a few fringe comments and have somewhat of a presence but he's not making any "waves" and seems to be escaping everyone's radars

which is a sweet spot I'd expect scum to seek out given the nature of this game

[Spiffeh]

Where are Nahdia, GiF, MOI, Ceph and LLD at on your readscale?

GiF scum lean
Nahdia, MoI, LLD null
Ceph town lean

[Spiffeh]

What's so funny?

[Spiffeh]

This Ceph reminds me of every incarnation of Ceph I have ever seen

Which have all been town

[Spiffeh]

Cheet what do you think of Ser Arthur Dayne?

[Spiffeh]

Town: Cephrir, Cheetory, Hiplop, mastina, accountant
Scum: Spiffeh, Nahdia,

Can you explain why you are scumreading me?

[Spiffeh]

When I run out of scumspects he will get his nuke

Patience is a virtue

[Spiffeh]

Your reads look fake as hell and you usually have no opinion of me till much later yet you claim to scum read me.

First of all, would you like to cite some games where this is the case? Because this is a weird thing to keep track of and take issue with

I have an opinion on you now and using "you don't have a read on me until later" is a bullshit way to discredit a method I've used to catch you as scum in the past.

So thank you for confirming my suspicions

[Spiffeh]

Like I have a decent track record when it comes to reading you and the fact that you try to discredit me right out of the gate instead of allowing me to come to terms with the read myself makes me pretty confident you're not town here

[Spiffeh]

Let me take a closer look before i really push this

[Spiffeh]

is the scumteam really nahdia mcmenno ut????

What happened to Nukebringer and EP?

[Spiffeh]

How anyone can be town reading Nukebringer after Firebringer's bullshittery is beyond me

[Spiffeh]

He performed the harder and more EDGY of the tasks requested (giving reads vs setup analysis)

This is awful

[Spiffeh]

I would expect you to comment on important things more than unimportant things, but sure I'll stop heckling keep on keeping on

Also I'm going to nuke the next person who thinks they can catch a third party specifically on day zero.

Sounds like something a terrorist would say

[Spiffeh]

Accountant can you elaborate on your hiplop scum read because I think he's town atm

[Spiffeh]

For starters he didn't mention anything about mcmenno at ALL and the only time he talked about UT is when he shipped him on the Mastin vote.m

I know it's probably hard to grasp if you're unfamiliar with him but neither of these things are indicative of scum!hiplop imo

The only thing that gave me pause was that fake-sounding "let me go back and check before I keep pushing" shit

town!hiplop is inconsistent and tends to dig himself into a hole so I'm not at all worried about your issues with him

[Spiffeh]

I mean.
He hasn't responded to this [or posted anything else yet].
So I don't really see how you would expect anyone to see this as anything but an unresolved interaction? It's basically him going "i think ur scum because u said im scum" and then you going "now i know ur scum bitchhhhh".
If you want this to be anything more than a petread you should push it better.

Actually I really don't have to because I can just nuke/vig them

But this was in reference to RedCoyote who had Nukebringer pretty high on his reads list

[Spiffeh]

Your reads look fake as hell and you usually have no opinion of me till much later yet you claim to scum read me.
Doesn't add up.

Cheetory look me in the eye and tell me this read is genuine

I don't need to wait for them to respond because I already explained why it's bullshit

[Spiffeh]

Lol did SS actually try to pass off his first post as a reaction test?

[Spiffeh]

That's not as overt as I was expecting but still probably deserves rope

[Spiffeh]

GIF what are your reads that aren't S_S?

[Spiffeh]

you don't have an office

[Spiffeh]

I mean no you don't, but that wasn't my point.
You normally don't have reads on me till much later stages of the game, last time you had a read on me early game you were scum faking a read like you are now.

I mean yes I do

Kids TV was the only game that I have read you horribly wrong

For someone who remembers something as arbitrary as the time at which I usually give a read on you I'm surprised this slipped your mind.

Also you asked me to provide a game where I gave a read on you early as town:
http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.ph ... 2#p7646002
Literally within 24 hours (Post #190) I called you town and maintained that stance until you replaced out. You were town.

I realize this was awhile ago but given that you were so quick to make a such a sweeping accusation that was WRONG after I started pressuring you suggests to me that you were only doing it to discredit my read on you.

I mean even if you weren't blatantly wrong you have enough experience with me to know how I operate and that tossing out early reads isn't unusual at all for me?

[Spiffeh]

If the way you apply pressure feels different, why would that not be something for someone to be wary of?

Because it's a bullshit characterization of our history that he pulled out of his ass?

[Spiffeh]

Give some concrete examples of townplay where he doesn't employ any cutesy shit or something,

Off the top of my head PYP comes to mind where he skipped this trolly shit and actually provided content right off the bat

[Spiffeh]

I literally just proved that he was wrong about the basis he gave for scum reading me

I don't know what's more convincing than that

PEdit: @Cheet

[Spiffeh]

It's not really convincing?
Him being wrong doesn't make him scum. Lol.

The issue isn't that he's wrong, it's that his first instinct was to discredit me with an ultimately bullshit reason

[Spiffeh]

I think MoI is town

[Spiffeh]

okay folks my hitlist is only 4 people long, more scummy posting please

Who are they?

[Spiffeh]

I have no idea what Spiffeh is talking about, and unfortunately the amount of fucks I have for this game does not equal the amount required to dive into the meta of someone I already trust. So. Try again in a few hours?

I mean if you're Equinox (I think you are) it's not really your response I was interested anyway?

[Spiffeh]

Something Smart it's great that you can you defend yourself and all but can you provide some reads/explain the ones you gave before?

tia

[Spiffeh]

I'm having trouble getting reads on like 50% of the playerlist so I look forward to all of you getting nuked and making this easier

[Spiffeh]

I think the play here is to form a group of universally town read players and punish anyone that tries to nuke within that group with death

Cheet and Accountant are my most confident town reads that I'm willing to suggest for this "bloc" atm

[Spiffeh]

Oh yeah I meant to include him too

[Spiffeh]

yes okay let's nuke everyone who wasn't a universal townread on day zero gr8 idea

Why not?

[Spiffeh]

Also not really "universal"

just the majority of people that matter are town reading them

[Spiffeh]

No

I'm not saying we lock it in right this second?

Towards the end of the lynch phase I'm sure at least a few people will be obvtown enough to make this worthwhile

[Spiffeh]

Firebringer that one game example proves your argument invalid

If you're town that should be something to strongly consider and reevaluate?

But you're not so you'll continue to use that as justification

[Spiffeh]

Firebringer not reevaluating his read on me after proving his earlier reason for scum reading me wrong is a scum claim

In case anyone was wondering

[Spiffeh]

i have played with cephrir alot and this is something he only says when he is town.

"Hey someone is defending me let me give them a town read so they keep doing it"

[Spiffeh]

How is he starting to reach OMGUS territory?

Didn't he go after you first?

PEdit: @SAD

[Spiffeh]

Also literally no one is advocating for the town bloc to be compiled and set in stone this instant

It's inevitable that people are going to have town reads going into the nuke phase that they don't want to die

There's no reason we shouldn't group the largely agreed upon town reads together and promise death to anyone that goes after them

This is a game that can easily be PoE'd because of the killing power town has so idk why this is such an issue

[Spiffeh]

"I don't care about this" is a defense? I know logic has suffered many defeats this year but that is perhaps a bridge too far

also i did not get the joke until reck pointed it out gj ceph

It's not

But the beauty of this game is that I don't really need to convince anyone once I have a nuke in my pocket

[Spiffeh]

Funny how your opinion shifted on the concept of early Townblocks.

[Spiffeh]

The only correct application of OMGUS itg so far is what Nukebringer did to me

[Spiffeh]

not really

ask me again later

You were so quick to provide reads within the first like within your first few posts of the game but you can't be bothered with it right now?

[Spiffeh]

"I don't care about this" is a defense? I know logic has suffered many defeats this year but that is perhaps a bridge too far

also i did not get the joke until reck pointed it out gj ceph

It's not

But the beauty of this game is that I don't really need to convince anyone once I have a nuke in my pocket

you're the one who said it was like 4 seconds ago.

Said what was?

[Spiffeh]

Oh sorry the "It's not" was in response to you saying "that is perhaps a bridge too far"

[Spiffeh]

He goes after me because I'm scum reading him

He praises you based on flimsy reasoning because you attack my read

I don't think that's such a terrible conclusion to make?

[Spiffeh]

MoI do you have any strong reads other than SAD?

[Spiffeh]

hippy can you do things please

[Spiffeh]

MoI you are so sassy this game

[Spiffeh]

you went at least 1 for 6 there so not bad

[Spiffeh]

Equinox head of Nukebringer: Do you have anything substantial to contribute?

[Spiffeh]

Tbh a lot of them are question marks for me so idrc if any of them die

Except for like Reck?

[Spiffeh]

I guess SAD seems pretty town even though lots of his opinions are bad?

[Spiffeh]

No you are the one I'd want to NOT die out of that group

[Spiffeh]

Cheetory, Something Special, Reck
Accountant, Mastina, Zito, Greyice, Nahdia
Mcmenno, EP, Vax, UT, Fate, Cephrir, hiplop, Nukebringer, RC, lrcher
Spyrex, MoI, LLD, GIF, Spiffeh

I think you mixed up my and Something Smart's places on this list

[Spiffeh]

I'm just gonna assume Ircher is getting nuked and skip all his posts

[Spiffeh]

how do you decide on nukes tho.
i have too many people i want to launch on

Like who?

[Spiffeh]

Something_Smart (-89%) - Post #26 really pinged as the scum thing to do. Yes, it's a self-meta statement, but also the fact that he justs plans to sheep whoever and not try to solve the game is even more indicative of scum. His posts in pages 16-20 continue to be bad and indicative of scum. Needs rope. Considering the possibility that this is a weaker player, but Smart seems to be above the "Newbie-feel" and more on par with prob. my own skill in mafia.

He is saying you are just going the sheep all your votes. SO it was a bit of a mis-rep from you.

That said he doesn't list anything about the rest of your activity, which is pretty good in my opinion (just read your iso)

You are both a little suspicious.

Wow this rivals S_S's first post for the title of worst post in the game

[Spiffeh]

This kind of attitude might be ok in standard mafia (we could have that funtimes discussion some other time) but it doesn't work in a game full of trigger-happy dayvigs. I'm sure I don't have to explain why.

I'd argue that her strategy is actually much more appropriate in a game like this where you don't need over half the playerlist to agree on a scumread of yours to make them dead.

[Spiffeh]

People I don't want nuked this phase under any circumstance: {Accountant, Cheetory6, MoI, Papa Zito, Cephrir, Reck, SpyreX}
People I think are town but not enough to warrant being in the first group: {LLD, hiplop, mastina, SAD, McMenno, RedCoyote}
People I wouldn't mind seeing get nuked: {Untrod Tripod, Fate, GreyICE, Nahdia, Something_Smart, ErrantParabola, Ircher}
People that need to be lynched/nuked at the earliest opportunity: {GIF, Vaxkiller, Nukebringer}

This is where I'm at rn

I'm hoping the lynch phase will help me sort people in the third pile

Especially EP because I feel like I can actually get a definitive read there if they would actually post

[Spiffeh]

Why are you certain UT is scum?

[Spiffeh]

Because he's town

[Spiffeh]

Do you want to explain why you're scum reading him?

PEdit: @Nukebringer

[Spiffeh]

Firebringer you realize that when you roll scum the goal is to act like you're town

Did you not get the memo?

[Spiffeh]

mastin why is Nukebringer so high on your list?

[Spiffeh]

Relax he's in the "immediate death" category anyway

[Spiffeh]

ok go

[Spiffeh]

ok go

[Spiffeh]

I didn't see anything particularly town about EP's posts

[Spiffeh]

Or Nahdia for that matter?

[Spiffeh]

Anyone who thought something smart's triple emoji post was scumtastic is disappointing especially you spiffeh, you are especially disappointing to me.

Why am I especially disappointing to you for feeling this way over someone like Cheetory who you seem to also have a lot of respect for and also indicated he felt the same way about the post?

[Spiffeh]

12 of the slots in this game are town out of 18.
2/3 odds.

Oh Cheet did you ever figure out this was wrong?

Because it is

[Spiffeh]

hippy can you do things please

[Spiffeh]

Why do you think so?

[Spiffeh]

I totally had this impression that you were the lynchbait whisperer

Where did you get this impression?

[Spiffeh]

Like I wouldn't call that one of my identifiers or anything

PEdit: @EP

[Spiffeh]

UT are you town reading EP?

[Spiffeh]

Reads lists that have me lower than Nukebringer are invalid

[Spiffeh]

- Spiffeh's latter posts have been much better, but he had some redflags early on in his posts (calling for townbloc early whiteknighting, weird early town read on RC)

Uh where do you think I'm white knighting someone?

Also I stand by the fact that creating a town bloc is the best way to have at least SOME control of the nuke phase and box scum out and I still don't get why you're vehemently against it. Can you explain?

[Spiffeh]

Holy shit this second line deserves to get you nuked. Half of those players haven't posted basically anything and then there's Mastin.

mastin is town though

[Spiffeh]

Accountant can you elaborate on your hiplop scum read because I think he's town atm

Lol?

Have you read his posts? Particularly:

ya nahdia is scum

is the scumteam really nahdia mcmenno ut????

is the scumteam really nahdia mcmenno ut????

What happened to Nukebringer and EP?

oh wow that is the 5

For starters he didn't mention anything about mcmenno at ALL and the only time he talked about UT is when he shipped him on the Mastin vote.m

SAD what changed in hiplop that makes you town read him now?

He hasn't done anything differently since this post so I'm curious how your read on him took a 180

[Spiffeh]

That, in addition with the post of "fuck you" to you proposing a townbloc, made me feel good about the slot.

Oh I can guarantee that the "fuck you" was to the fact that I didn't include him in the town shortlist.

[Spiffeh]

+ The thing I had a problem with wasn't the townbloc itself, it was the fact you wanted a townbloc that gives everyone in it a safety net from being nuked or otherwise "being punished".

Giving ANYONE no matter how strong of a townread that isn't conftown an early safety net like that is p bad. Especially since it is still pregame AND we still have 2 days to go till nukes. You're basically saying that you don't plan on reevaluating those slots at all in the upcoming 2 days by placing them early on in a townbloc.

Also literally no one is advocating for the town bloc to be compiled and set in stone this instant

It's inevitable that people are going to have town reads going into the nuke phase that they don't want to die

There's no reason we shouldn't group the largely agreed upon town reads together and promise death to anyone that goes after them

This is a game that can easily be PoE'd because of the killing power town has so idk why this is such an issue

I never implied that I wouldn't be open to reevaluating or that a "bloc" wasn't fluid as the game progressed.

I feel like you keep harping on the same points that no longer apply? I don't understand how you're missing the benefit there is in setting aside universally town read players and promising consequences to anyone that nukes them. It forces scum to nuke within a smaller group (which is harder to justify when your options are limited) that would hopefully contain their buddies and allows for easier PoE in the late game.

[Spiffeh]

This setup is way more about identifying town than scum and a town bloc is the best way to play it

[Spiffeh]

Btw Nahdia I care about your reads

You're one of my blank slates and I'd definitely like some more elaboration when you get the chance so I can get something more conrete

[Spiffeh]

Why would you propose a town bloc for a "no nuke list" TWO days before nukes become available and used?

Because I recognized that that was the best way to play the game for reasons I've already explained

And I felt that an easier way to win should be conveyed to everyone?

I mean doing it earlier on gave more people time to come to terms with the CORRECT way to play the game (as evidenced by people giving their revisions and thoughts on my earlier list)

I still don't understand why the time I proposed it is relevant

[Spiffeh]

It gives a safety net for people TWO days before any nukes start happening.

NO IT DOESN'T

No one should have gotten the impression that any proposals for the town bloc get a free ride for the rest of the game

If I think someone is worthy of a town bloc early on and their play takes a nosedive then they're kicked out and available for nuking again

[Spiffeh]

Can you at least explain the scum motivation in proposing a town bloc ~2 days early~

Why am I more likely to do that as scum than town?

[Spiffeh]

This "available" and "not available" for nuking ideology. As I literally said above, I think part of the setup is to reward players who have gut scumreads or for other reasons but they are not being listened to.

If a person can explain their reasons for a nuke genuinely, etc. Obviously you can still run them up for a lynch if the majority disagree. But this "You nuke X, you will get lynched" basically kills the whole idea of the setup, which is to reward underdogs with a good reads that others aren't seeing, etc.

I think it's pretty shit play to nuke a gut scum read when the majority of players are town reading them. I welcome buy shooting gut scumreads later on when the game has thinned out and the universal scum reads are gone.

And the purpose of the town bloc as I see it is to dissuade scum from shooting universally town read players. I agree that any nuke at the town bloc should be evaluated case by case but scum need to know that they'll be held under heavy scrutiny if they try to fracture it.

If you still don't get where I'm coming from then let's just agree to disagree because I don't want to keep clogging the thread with the same back-and-forth

[Spiffeh]

I really don't think it's a good idea to reveal draft selections

[Spiffeh]

VOTE: Vaxkiller

[Spiffeh]

GiF dies regardless of his flip actually

[Spiffeh]

Let's try and make me pissy this game.

if you insist

[Spiffeh]

Ugh don't say that now I have to go reevaluate

[Spiffeh]

@mod V/LA til Sunday the 27th

I should be active sporadically (especially these first 2 days) but no promises beyond that

[Spiffeh]

Nukebringer maybe town? Starting to like how nice my PoE pile feels.

no

[Spiffeh]

You're being SAD right now.

No I'm not

You can't write off everything Firebringer did because Equinox makes one decent post

What is your PoE looking like now anyway?

[Spiffeh]

It being self centered doesn't make a difference lmao

[Spiffeh]

You don't have to be entirely convinced by my argument but at the very least you were way too quick to take them out of your for you to take them out of your PoE list based on what they've provided thus far

[Spiffeh]

You don't have to be entirely convinced by my argument but at the very least you were way too quick to take them out of your PoE list based on what they've provided thus far

EBWOP

[Spiffeh]

yeah bitch that's what I thought

[Spiffeh]

The foe list doesn't work on the Mafia forum, only discussion forums

Because you wouldn't be playing the game correctly if you had someone on ignore

[Spiffeh]

Also the fact that you aren't using that abhorrent site skin invalidates yours thoughts and feelings for the rest of the game

[Spiffeh]

I meant "are" instead of "aren't" btw

I can't type

Basically mafblack is the only correct skin

[Spiffeh]

mastin if you want you can give me your nuke and I can direct you to shooting whoever I want dead?

[Spiffeh]

Spiffeh ftr when I say you have a bunch of townie motivated posts that make me want to townread you but a few red-flags it's shit like this.

If THAT'S one of the red flags you come up with than I don't see why you're worried

[Spiffeh]

MoI I get you're scum reading him but you can't really think every little thing he does is scummy?

I'm still town reading him pretty hard despite my dislike of many of his opinions

[Spiffeh]

Also I haven't read most of the day so now that I'm at a computer I'll stop shitposting and get to doing that

[Spiffeh]

Maybe you'll feel better when I nuke Nukebringer and they flip scum?

[Spiffeh]

VOTE: mcmenno

Is McMenno really your biggest scum read?

I expect better from you

[Spiffeh]

Because newbies are lynch-bait. Veteran players think they know exactly when another vet is scum and think they always have them pegged. So when wagon gets started on a newbie player no one can be blamed for not knowing they were not scum because of this crappy play style.

Hence why I think SAD is scum trying to get me lynched for crappy reasoning.

What do you think about the 9ish others that piled on with no justification?

And what are your reads beyond SAD in general?

[Spiffeh]

I agree with Cheet that GIF's recent posts look town

[Spiffeh]

VOTE: UT
let's see where this goes

It is very concerning that this is ALL S_S has to contribute ever since he's been off the chopping block

Especially since he promised to give reads and reasoning "later".

How long do I have to wait?

[Spiffeh]

Yeah I definitely town read RC way too early

[Spiffeh]

McMenno and ErrantParabola are still voting for Ircher. Would be willing to bet I could get minimum one scum flip by nuking both.

I can ride with this.

Earlier Ircher was in your scum pile so this doesn't really jive with me

Also in that post you threw shade on all of mastina, McMenno, Ircher, Vaxkiller,

While I think all of these players have a nonzero percent chance of flipping scum (except maybe mastina) I think you're casting a really broad stroke over all the universal nuke targets which seems like a really easy stance to hold

[Spiffeh]

Also RC what do you think of S_S?

[Spiffeh]

@Ceph can you give me a list of your scum reads?

[Spiffeh]

Yeah, I deliberately classified it as anti-town rather than scummy for that reason. I also deliberately asked for a nuke rather than a lynch for that reason. There's a fair shot Mastina is town; there's a 100% shot that Mastina is hurting the town.

yuck

[Spiffeh]

RC is probably scum too for calling SAD/LLD town v town.

I think SAD/LLD is town v town

[Spiffeh]

This is a very questionable wagon and I agree with UT that Reck is the terrorist anyway

Why do you think he's specifically the terrorist and not just scum in general?

[Spiffeh]

K I'm caught up

I feel no type of way about UT and he should just get nuked just like the rest of the non contributors

Not much has changed in my reads except GIF is probably town and I'm much less sure about RC being town

[Spiffeh]

I'm not outright scum reading him but I made a post about it last page

[Spiffeh]

Also of note I've started townreading Fate more lately. Though his attack on GiF awhile back still felt odd which is why I threw his name into my 6 earlier.

What makes you think he's town?

[Spiffeh]

Also of note I've started townreading Fate more lately. Though his attack on GiF awhile back still felt odd which is why I threw his name into my 6 earlier.

It's a large, there are already going to be lots of voices and hence lots of posts. I didn't want to flood the game.

Just do what I do and flood the game anyway!

[Spiffeh]

Also of note I've started townreading Fate more lately. Though his attack on GiF awhile back still felt odd which is why I threw his name into my 6 earlier.

It's a large, there are already going to be lots of voices and hence lots of posts. I didn't want to flood the game.

Just do what I do and flood the game anyway!

Ignore the second quote

[Spiffeh]

Actually fuck I meant ignore the first quote

[Spiffeh]

S_S has been moved to the immediate nuke-age pile

[Spiffeh]

Because there's no reason you shouldn't be able to actively share your thoughts on the game instead of deflecting to "well no one asked" when called out on your lack of contribution

Regardless of your alignment (which I think is scum anyway), anyone who refuses to do anything should be nuked so we can actually have a chance at PoEing

[Spiffeh]

Other than UT who do you think is scum and why?

[Spiffeh]

discrediting of my UT read noted.

lmao

[Spiffeh]

Because newbies are lynch-bait. Veteran players think they know exactly when another vet is scum and think they always have them pegged. So when wagon gets started on a newbie player no one can be blamed for not knowing they were not scum because of this crappy play style.

Hence why I think SAD is scum trying to get me lynched for crappy reasoning.

What do you think about the 9ish others that piled on with no justification?

And what are your reads beyond SAD in general?

[Spiffeh]

My answer to "why would scum go for X role":

"To seem town"

[Spiffeh]

It's really risky to let a scum read go because of the role they chose except for maybe cop?

It's perfectly plausible that Vax is scum with that role and his buddies are making nonsense posts so his claim separates him from being scum

I think the claim should be treated as null

[Spiffeh]

SAD/Spiff, is Missle Silo more valuable to scum than Eavesdrop?

I would think so but I'm not getting into this WIFOM game

[Spiffeh]

Oh yeah he didn't even put Eavesdropper first

Now I care even less about role arguments!

[Spiffeh]

hiplop you blew me away with that catch up

[Spiffeh]

I don't really think UT is more likely to flip scum over the other options

I assume Vax did something really town in the pages I haven't read to warrant so many people hopping off that wagon?

[Spiffeh]

And don't get me wrong all of these slots need to die I'd just like to hit actual scum so they don't get a chance to fire off nukes if they have them

[Spiffeh]

S_S is better than UT imo

[Spiffeh]

Also Reck Accountant is v. town

[Spiffeh]

RC what is your read on mastin?

Because earlier I thought you were saying she was scum but then I saw this:

But thanks for giving the scumteam extra information. I'm sure it's appreciated.

which implies you don't think she's scum?

And in that same post I feel like you're being really hard on her and overly frustrated for little reason and I can't figure out what your goal is with her

[Spiffeh]

As to your second point, you really consider McMenno and Ircher to be "universal nuke targets"? I think I'm one of, like, three people that has even batted an eye at McMenno. As for Ircher, I think he's caught more flak, but nothing major. I don't even think Vax is really a nuke target because I think people are more anxious to see him eat rope than wait to nuke him.

I guess "lynchbaity" would have been a better term

I was just curious as to why you were vocally bashing all those players when I feel like S_S was guilty of a lot of the same stuff and you didn't mention him

[Spiffeh]

If you can explain to me how Mastina is helping the town, I'll concede the point. Nukes are to be used like vig shots as far as I'm concerned.

this is fair

I guess I'm just biased because mastina looks pretty transparently town to me and I really don't get why so many people are scum reading her beyond "you're being bad and useless"

[Spiffeh]

Ircher is probably town after all

[Spiffeh]

[basically a scumclaim]

I mean.
I could say "nuke this shit".

But what I really want is for us to just lynch Ircher.

I'm on UT because the wagon's larger.
(I also don't really support the Vaxkiller wagon right now.)

That was literally one of the towniest posts itg from anyone

What in that post makes you think he's scum?

[Spiffeh]

2023 looks rly town to me

[Spiffeh]

Has no one considered Vax fakeclaiming to draw out a disruptive role to scum?

Proceed with rope

If he's fakeclaiming someone would have counter claimed by now?

Why would we proceed with rope before this happens

Fate why are you being bad

[Spiffeh]

LLD what did we learn from PYP?

I think he's scum.

In a giant game when the big wagon starts to disform, it's because town are apathetic about the result and scum are fighting to kill it.

Yeah I'm down.

Vote: Vaxkiller

lol how did you know this was what he was talking about

because I was scum with both of you there and had no idea

[Spiffeh]

Yeah but I played mafia with him a few times

we're on a pretty level playing field

[Spiffeh]

I assume Vax did something really town in the pages I haven't read to warrant so many people hopping off that wagon?

I can confirm that this did NOT happen

[Spiffeh]

2023 looks rly town to me

Spiffeh read 2193 and then look at the Vote Count and get back to me ...

ok I did it and still think he's town

[Spiffeh]

VOTE: Something_Smart

Not because Vax has done anything town

But because S_S is a scumfuck

[Spiffeh]

I mean it's a stupid thing to say but not really indicative of scum?

[Spiffeh]

On the bright side for you he'll probably be nuked anyway?

I'm just not seeing it

[Spiffeh]

If that's supposed to be a CC I suggest you make it a lot clearer

[Spiffeh]

Can't we lynch Nukebringer today?

[Spiffeh]

Firebringer continues to claim scum

[Spiffeh]

Hey Cheetypie

[Spiffeh]

I told you

[Spiffeh]

Tell me what you think about UT/Nukebringer being scum together.

They are both worthy of death (UT less so) but I have seen no indication of either of their scum flips implying the other flipping scum

[Spiffeh]

I hate that Nukebringer doesn't feel any certain way about either of the two leading wagons

it gives me the heeby jeebies

[Spiffeh]

hi

[Spiffeh]

How does it feel to be a member of an inferior wagon?

I'm on the wagon that's more likely to result in a scum flip tho

[Spiffeh]

@Spiffeh, Cheetory, Reck: What are your thoughts on mastina?

town

[Spiffeh]

omg someone nuke EP's brains out please

[Spiffeh]

I would do it myself but my nuke priorities are elsewhere