The Hobbit Mafia - GAME OVER

[Tigris]

/confirm

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IS is always quite difficult to read properly as he does not change his play style based on his alignment. Of course, to my recollection I have yet to play a game with him, so I'm only basing this on games I have read with him in them.

My take on the whole lightning thing, whoever did it was/is new. Killing first night if you're a serial killer of vigi is completely moronic, as it either kills any chance of claiming vigi and being believed or alternatively you have an incredibly high chance of killing a teammate, great either way. The only exception imo, is if you have a role whose killing method cannot be used by a pro-town player, i.e. Smaug and roasting someone, lightning doesn't count as one of those in my book though.

Additionally, the idea of a cop/vig combination role that can investigate and then kill depending on the investigation is at best unadvised. In order to balance the game properly you would have to increase the strength of the evil groups and then what happens if that role dies, well then the game is unbalanced. For further reference read what antrax has to say in . . . well that's unexpected, meh, here's the link as no one would be able to find it without knowing exactly what I'm talking about (and looking at the player's list only a few have likely read it). For some reason it isn't in the theory link unless you type it in
http://www.mafiascum.net/theory/006ant.html

vote: koraiss

, pot kettle anyone? ^_~

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Yaw: Thanks ^_^. Actually, my point was more along the lines of the Raistlin character mentioned. The idea of a character that can both investigate and kill on the same night would require something to balance it out as it would be an incredibly powerful role. Additionally, it would be putting too much on one person, what if that person was a lurker? The town is weakened considerably. Additionally, if it is a cop/vig that can only target one group and that group happened to be a sk, I would be insanely irritated at end of game if I was that sk, sk is difficult enough without that death sentence.

Further evidence (in my mind) that both the vig/sk (as I think it's 50/50 chance for either) and docs are relatively new is Jeep died. Looking over the player's list, there are 5 people I wouldn't chance trying to kill if I was evil (as it seems reasonable to have threeish docs in a 29 person game), Jeep is on the top of that list.

I see no reason to shift my vote yet. I was looking up info on the Hobbit and there should be two more trolls, so either we have a quite large contigent of orcs/goblins, there is another evil group, or the game is unbalanced ^_^ imo, so I think there is a fourth and that it is likely behind the lightning.

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Quite true about it being unbalanced should there be three trolls and a fistful of goblins. Hence why I think there is a fourth evil.
1 evil=sk the dragon
3 evil=trolls Will, Bert, and Tom
(?) gobbies-Great goblin, Bolg, and miscellaneous
Which if we ony go by named evil, 6 out of 29, hardly a game that is balanced imo. Macros' had somwhere around 10-11 evil in 22 and Leo barely won that one (granted evil was killing evil with a fair amount of accuracy, but that's to be expected). I would expect wargs to be another evil group and possibly another sk.

possible others (perhaps blocked yesterday)
wargs-they were the allies of the goblins after all, (battle of Five armies Goblins and Wargs against elves, dwarves, and men (and eagles))
The Necromancer (i.e. Sauron)
gollum
perhaps the spiders as well, but they are fairly minor (as is the necromancer and gollum imo in this book)

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Hey I resemble that remark Gaspode! ^_~, true I've never played with IS; however, I tend to browse the archives with semi-regularity, I don't know why they just enthrall me *purrs*. More amusing I guess.

Anyhows, claiming would likely be advised, of course I also tell people that they can stick forks into electrical outlets (with a demonstration), so my advice might not be the best in the world (please do not stick a fork into an electrical outlet without properly testing it first, k, I don't need lawsuits ^_^)

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I believe that I know what role he is referring to. And thus

unvote: koraiss, vote: jedi

. One of the trolls was hesitant to kill Bilbo; however, that would further weaken a less then strong mafia group, so I see no reason to believe it.

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*agrees with IS* let's end the day and get replacements for anyone that doesn't respond to a pm

Btw, can I use my extra vote on koraiss on jedi as well ^_^ *feels special for the ability to have two votes for some reason ^_~*

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Been insanely busy and the mini I'm modding takes first presidence for me.

Okay, so 5-6ish methods of night killing
2ish sks (smaug and wizzie)
3-4 mafia groups?
Trolls, gobbies, spiders, I still think the wargs might be in this but maybe not.

I could see how killing without a mark and lightning would be combined in a sorceror, which further confirms my believe that any sorceror claiming these kills is evil. The koraiss bandwagon will at least give us some more info to go off of if nothing else, so no preblems there. IS is IS, sooner of later he will be investigated/killed, so I'm not concerned with him (just as I would not be concerned with Jeep, being experienced is most definitely a double-edged sword). Beyond that, I guess I'll just wait for koraiss for now.

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*shrug* Not like it really matters to me. I still prefer discussion over the various intricacies of the game over a quick-lynch any day, I just don't havethe time, effort, or fellow scummers to do it properly, meh ~_^.

So, likely 3-4 evil groups going into night with two dead. Five scum deadand a likely max of 11-14, so we still have more then a fair ways left to go despite our good luck with lynches and night killings. Time for bed, night.

vote: koraiss

hopefully you don't have the role ye gave me in Bonus ~_^[

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Okay, been slammed with work 10 hour days and it's only going to get more hectic in the next couple of weeks. So between that and the mini, I've been quieter then I should, my apologies.

Good things: 2 scum groups dead, no kills last night.

Bad things: Far too many people are inactive, so that there were no kills last night isn't really conclusive of anything.

Also, for those who are trying to claim the koraiss lynch for themselves *applauds and *, still doesn't mean you're not scum =^-^=, as he was the last of his group.

Oh and pet peeve time, I despise one line posts. So, while I might not have the sheer quantity of posts that many of the other players have, mine actually have content the vast majority of the time.

Personally, I see between 4-7 scum remaining (1-2 gobbies, 1 snapper, 2-3 spiders, and 1 wizard). The problem is that the trolls had a somewhat complicated kill method, so the other groups could have lesser numbers due to easier killing; however, at the same time there are two named Goblins in The Hobbit, so having a misc. one would likely indicate a group of 3+. Yes, I am beating a somewhat dead horse, but if it helps to understand the mechanics behind the game, it is well-worth it, imo.

Going along with my hatred of one line posts and a decided lack of choices submitted last night

fos: lord gurgi

I would vote for him, but he is on vacation. One of the problems I have with one-line posts is it allows mafia to seem active while contributing nothing. I would wager that at least 2 groups did not submit their kills, either that or multiple groups targeted the same person who was then doc saved, although in such a case it is normal for said person to still die, but it depends heavily on the mod.

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Personally, I would much rather lynch inactive anything over active people. This is merely because I'm getting somewhat frustrated with how slow many of the games are moving. Easiest way to solve that is have fewer games so people focus more, but failing that killing anyone that isn't active works as well. They aren't helping the town by their lack of participation, so in some ways they are just as bad as any scum.

So, that's why I'm willing to follow Yaw for the moment and give my first target a small break.

vote: id

, to borrow (read: steal) from others 'post or perish'.

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If the mod replaces ID, I'll switch to the next lurker, but at this point I want to send a message. You either participate in a game or you get lynched. I am more then fed up with games dragging because people don't take their responsibilities (which they agreed to) seriously.

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, because my personal preference is to have every single lurker replaced if possible, lynching them is an acceptable alternative, especially for meta-game purposes. We can lynch the ones that don't respond enough (if they post once or twice, that isn't enough and I want content, not just one line bs about being busy) or aren't replaced. And I still have my vote on ID as until he is replaced, I see no reason to move it.

*agrees with Yaw* If it was one or two, lynch one and tell a vig to kill the other and don't worry about the role as there are more then enough players left. Heck I'd even work alongside the mafia in this case as it helps meta-game purposes, all the lurkers die and the people who actually want to play don't have a ball and chain attached to their legs.

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I apologize for missing a few days, my 'days off' right now are 6-8 hours long let alone the days I'm supposed to work (including weekends), so my posting might be slightly more erattic, plus I'm trying to force a town to post in another game *sigh*.

While I agree whole-heartedly with the blood-thirsty attitude of lynch them and worry about things later, I don't lynch replacements on their first day, it's horrible for metagame purposes. Of course, there is another lurker, so since I want a lurker lynched.

unvote: lulu, vote: shivan

partly for the lurking, partly for not voting a single time in this game.

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Okay, so a quick look at MoL's posts makes me inclined to disregard any vote he made as possible scum; however, he likely did not vote for anyone that he knew was not scum, but that does not help much.

Good News: no doc and only one cop who was likely to be keyed into SKs dead so far.
7 dead scum and hopefully no more then 5 remaining (3 spiders, 1 gobbie, and 1 sk), more likely 3 left, but who knows.
No gobbie kill since the second goblin was killed and no warg kill.

Bad news: Lurkers are still alive *glares at killers*, get it right, kill lurkers, stupid evil &*!^@&#@ =^-^=

Anywho, waiting for Argoti seems like an okay idea, but then again I'm discounting the possibility that Murk did not block someone on the first night (roleblockers hurt towns as much as help imo), but then again there was no spider kill on the first night for some reason, so . . .

My own personal goal is to get a couple of posts with content out of Lord Gurgi, so

vote: lord gurgi

, which might shift very rapidly to argoti if the mood strikes me.

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Interesting, for some reason I thought two goblins had died o_o, not sure why though. This switches some of my numbers above obviously, sorry

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Argoti hasn't posted anywhere in a couple of days, so I'm willing to wait for a bit, besides, half the fun of mafia to me is thinking of possibilities within the game, which waiting like this allows.

I've been a fan of reading all of a single person's post in one go via the bottom choice. I've never been a fan of 1-2 line posts (as is likely obvious to anyone familiar with my style of play =^-^=.) Hence my vote, a couple posts with paragraphs is enough to keep me at bay for a bit ^_^

There is more to go on in this game, I just can't completely put my finger on it right now, meh maybe later.

So,
Night 1: Wizard (jeep), gobbie (nanook), Smaug(mr flay), and snapper (phoebus)
Night 2: Spider (rick), gobbie (argoti), and no marks (william)
Night 3: Evil slept in or something *shrug*
Night 4: Wizard (mol) and spider (corsato)

We already know that the trolls had a limitation, so I wouldn't be too surprised to find the spiders can only kill on even nights, but then again it would weaken them, so I wouldn't think it would be included. The wizard still strikes me as a newer player due to kill patterns and choices, although there is one possible strategy that could go along with attacking Jeep night onw, but at the same time I doubt many people would come up with/try it, it's too risky imo. The gobbie kills seem more informed (which I do not attribute to jedi for simplicities sake; however, the lack of kill two nights in a row is interesting to note. The spiders seem random for now and the other two methods leave much to be desired, but perhaps both were via Gollum, hopefully. I can feel I'm missing something to tie all my thoughts together, but (obviously) I can't discern what. Perhaps someone else can.

It's somewhat strange, there are a lot of mid-level players remaining, imo, whereas many of the newer players are dead as are some of the older. Oh and Yaw, I'm this close to trusting you, except for that tendency you are showing to agree with me/pat me on the back, those tend to make me suspicious of someone ever since Mountain Mafia. =^-^=, evil discer I have a few theories, but need a bit more to munch on to flesh them out (i.e. need people to post), so . . .

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I'm tired, so brief (for me). My list yesterday gave who killed said person if it was obvious, and if not then the kill method. That's why Corsato (spider), sorry for any confusion. That said, I am fairly sure that IS was innocent and so I don't really expect any fewer kills due to his death.

Seconds the desire for replacements ^_^

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Any post I make at this point will likely be seen as either defensive or trying to skip the issue. One thing I will note though is I thought that wargs would have been much more likely than spiders to be in this game (if for no other reason then the Battle of 5 Races), but meh ^_^

At this point I can share some information I have. I am a dwarf and IS was innocent, the manner in which I know that comes from my still being alive, so I am not making a cop claim, my role is considerably different.

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Quick question for Coolbot, what is the name of your dwarf? Yes this has a small point and right now it's the only thing I can think of to go off of, but it might help the town.

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Meh, I thought that Coolbot had claimed dwarf without a name and thought to better understand how a few things stood with said name, which now I do.

For now, I'm willing to follow Yaw, as I was suspicious of Gurgi, so

vote: quagmire