PIRATES v. NINJAS! Game Over!

[Skruffs]

/confirm
I WANTED SLOT 17 YOU BITCHES

[Skruffs]

Holy crap, I heard about the SAME Thing happening with a bunch of people in Fresno, California as what happened to us.

The way I see it, there are three 'teams'- pirates, ninjas, and town, with a few possible people with alternate win conditions. There's probably a pirate cop and doc, as well as a ninja cop and doc- a fact supported by DGB's role. I'd also expect some kind of weapons dealer. Also, Thok, Guardian typically writes Haiku in early days- it's not a PR.

I will agree about the cops, but not necessarily on the docs. Otherwise the vig would be unstoppable, and it appears that the vig chose not to act last night, if that is the case?

[Skruffs]

Actually, Luke Skywalker was attacked twice, it seems.. throat slit - probably ninja death, and beaten to death, which isn't ninja OR pirate (I'm guessing the pirates do the walk the plank thing... don't ask me why, it's just a hunch).

[Skruffs]

Lots to respond to, but it seems that people have already pointed all of those things out.

Speculating on the setup is not intrinsically bad - if someone says there is likely to be a role (like scum-specific doctor roles), that doesn't make a lot of sense, they should be called out on it.

I'm glad that claus pointed out the 'neck cut' as the pirate death... Looking at it, I have to say that it's just as possible that ninjas would slice someone as that they would beat someone up. I guess that it depends on the ninja.

Thesp- I guess I'm using 'burden of proficiency' here, but I doubt that someone as amazing as strategy as you would make such a slip and 'not realize' that everyone wasn't pirate or ninja. Even less likely is that you would think, as town, that intentionally doing that would *work* though.

I'm boggled, and that upsets me, because you're usually a beacon of sense... Just odd, though.

haikus:

Guardian: you were scum in open 19 and a miller in ork mafia, both games in which you used haikus: correct? Haikus don't seem to work for you very well.

Secondly: I was in haiku mafia, a game run by glork, and it was very easy to win because of the extreme limitations being forced to post in 34 syllables, at once, imposed. inasmuch, I am not sure why someone would intentionally limit themselves.


Lastly:
Welcome to the game MGM, why did you put a sixth vote on gorrad?

[Skruffs]

Thesp:
Yes, I'm aware of that.
However, for town to play along, they would have had to have fake claimed scum.

Right?

And then, after town fake claims scum, to 'play along', even if regular scum 'slips', how would you be able to distinguish between the two?

It would add confusion, not remove it.


Guardian:
If you want haikus
Go ahead and haikus use
I could care less what you do to hunt scum, as long as it 'works' for you.
It *is* odd that you think using haikus is a scum tell with other people, if they are so effective for you, though.

[Skruffs]

Postulation:
Due to the subconcious prototypes of both Pirates and Ninjas, the only way someone could actually say any 'flavorish' type of greetings, for a first post, would be to say "Yarr" or "Arr" or "Shiver me timbers, rumbydumbledoo", etc...

Ninjas don't make ANY noise, ever, so there's no real way to start a game off by saying something along those lines.

Thesp is giving the taste you get in your mouth when you bite into a piece of bread and then realize it's fuzzy.

Also: Fonz's post at the top of page 7 smells to me like someone tryign to communicate with their scum buddies.

[Skruffs]

Let me put it this way: if you'd received a PM saying "you are a ninja", would

you

immediately assume that the pirates were the good guys? Even if you made that assumption, would you stake your life in the game on it by playing the role in your confirmation post? I doubt you could truthfully answer yes to both of those questions, so your case rests on the assumption that Mars is much,

much

dumber than you.

So are you "confirming" that the ninjas are bad guys?

[Skruffs]

Good. Maybe it disconcerts the rest. Of the scum,, an game play.

fos : guardian and thesp

Consider this the 'beginning' of the shit you are going to get.

Thesp, you covered your 'slip' by saying you were trying to encourage scum to claim ninja or pirate.

Guardian, you explained the reason behind the case on iammars by encouraging people to make the assumption that ninja scum would think the opposing team was town.

However:

Players

(dead):

1. MrBuddyLee - Luke Skywalker (Vig) - throat slit and beaten to death Night 1
   
2. DrippingGoofball - Jack Aubrey (Pirate Finder) - forced to walk the plank Night 1

NOTE: In the above list, pro-town roles appear in black text; anti-town roles appear in coloured text.

Both of these roles are protown.
Thesp: asking for a vig to kill someone, when one vig is already dead?

Guardian: Pirate finder: suggests they find pirates. Since it's a protown role, that suggests pirates are scum.

Thesp: neither role is a pirate or a ninja.

Both: both of your suggestions make the assumption that scum would post without any foresight or consideration whatsoever.

[Skruffs]

Huh. I guess I was to busy BEING AWARE OF MOD REVEALED ROLES (apparently this is fos worthy) to notice that the argument on iammars. Is based on his confirmation post.

Thesp:
Why is looking at the roles of dead players "scummy", but directing power roles isn't?
And you bypassed the meat of my thrust: that you 'tried to get scum to claim' as one of the two titular groups *after* it became 'public knowledge' that a vig and cop (both town) were not either.

Based on you fossing me, and talking about the vig that is already dead, I am guessing that you are setting yourself up to claim that you hadn't looked at the day scene, and thus didn't know any of that..

Not checking out the facts about iammars's "arr" is my fault: my post was with the thought that iammars had started off the day with that post.

If we want to use confirmation posts as scumtells, why hasn't anyone brought up mbf's post where he said he would enjoy playing with mbl?
A) communication
B) I'm not saying that mbf is scum, but him saying it opened up the possibility of wifom by giving scum a target that most likely would not lead back to them (which, if mbl was cut AND beat up, infers that at least two parties did just that)

Anyways, ignorance doesn't win games.

[Skruffs]

Wait a second...
Dgb... Rosso... Shea... Flameaxe... Me... Guardian... Mbf, fritzler, ksc0pe....


DX

Piratey reference aside, I think stoofer haas invented a ship of fools. The only person here who's hunting skills I personally respect is Thesp, and he's playing horribly.


I mean....um.... <3 u all?

[Skruffs]

I hope that didn't come across as abusive. I enjoy all of you, honestly. I just noticed that here are no 'paragons', etc.

[Skruffs]

I'm not dismissing anyone's opinions. If you haven't noticed, I'm engaging people when I do not understand their opinions.

It was a light hearted jab. I expect some backlash from it, but the point was that it's interesting that none of the site's most notoriously GOOD players are in this game. I was requested by pm to join in; I think it will be very interesng because it will be up to US to figure it all out. We have to step up and do the dirty work and hunt the scum; none of us are going to be able to just assume others will do the work for us, and that is great.

Guardian: I like your playstyle a lot but you have replaced out of how many games so far the last couple months? sorry if that seems critical.

[Skruffs]

Samruc:
Who's opinions did I dismiss?
you sound honestly disappointed in your post. Did I ignore something you had said that I should have responded to?

[Skruffs]

I agree with you Thok mabout MBF and TSQ. The reason I brought up MB's thing (I had forgotten abuot TSQ's but it's just as 'valid') is because saying those things in the first place are anti-town. MB, even by saying he wanted to play wtih MBL, put a target on himself AND Mbl for scum to try adn take advantage of. TSQ did the same thing with DGB. Oh, and look, they are both dead.

I did not infer, or even mean to infer, that MBF was a scum who said that just to 'have an excuse' to kill MBL last night: I said it because it was just a not-very town thing to do oin the confirmation stage. Same with TSQ, and Same with Iammar's YARR post. I wanted to say it was interesting that MGM pointed out TSQ after I pointed out MBF and the discussion skipped right over MBF to TSQ, but, TSQ also took the bait and started responding to it.

THERE I CHANGED IT ARE YOU HAPPY NOW??!
Gee whiz

[Skruffs]

After a headache of a reread,

Vote: Thesp

. His being scum could explain quite a bit of his behavior.

How do you mean?

[Skruffs]

I missd like six pages... stupid tooth.

I'm heavily sedated,and ready to rumbmle. Why does the title say "He's Alive!" ? I have about 6 pages to read up on.

[Skruffs]

Ok, welcome back to the game MBL...

Do you think it's prudent to ask the doctor to protect you over Fritzler? After all, couldn't Fritzler continue to resurrect you, if you are killed again? Therefore, doesn't it make more sense to *not* direct the doc away from the resurrector?

Secondly:
Why did you fakedayvig Gorrad, instead of Thesp? You seemed to be equally magnanimous towards both of them.


I was at first worried that Fritz might be some sort of zombie-cultist type thing, or whatnot, but if MBL's role has changed, he can't kill anyone tonight. So hopefully you will successfully vig someone ASAP, MBL, so that we can be sure that you are stil a good guy. I don't imagine a scum resurrector cultist would be forced to publicly ressurrect, but, who knows.

[Skruffs]

Well, at least in the beginning of the game, may I point out something?

The scum can't crosskill, the first time they try. I'm presuming that MBL's target last night SHOULD have died, since he is a vig, and thus isn't subject to the cross killing rules.

However, knowing that, I just dfon't like Erg0's statement up above, that potential scum doesn't need to be lynched because they are 'likely to die' anyways. It just... strikes me as funny.

I'm nto saying that I disbelieve the mason claim, it's just a little twinge. I react to twinges.

[Skruffs]

My recent experience in Big Brother Mafia suggests that the theory that one scum group will "hunt" the other is posited by scum and NOT true. I'm still very bitter about that game, though. I was town and I played horribly, but scum did not have to hunt each other to win.

Fos : Erg0

[Skruffs]

Umm...
Hmm.
If you really think Stoofer would make a game that would be breakable by mass claiming, I'm sorry for you.

I appreciate the thought, but not mass claiming because it would ruin the mystery is very short sighted. Or.. do you think that the scum would claim pirates nad ninjas and thus be exposed immediately? Explain your reasoning there.

[Skruffs]

Thesp:
What about me makes you uncomfortable?

[Skruffs]

Why does thesp town make you uncomfortable guardian?

Thesp asscum should be what you are uncomfortable with.

[Skruffs]

As scum, obv.
sorry thesp. >.>

So Cicero you KNOW that scum get to talk to each other? HOW DO YOU KNOW THAT MISTER CICERO??

[Skruffs]

Re: Guardian beign town or scum and Thok's insistence withwhereal.

I do not want to have to deal with a Thok and Guardian end game situation like in Open 19, where Guardian was scum, and somehow made it to the end.

Guardian as scum:

-Pushed one mislynch (IH) the first 60% of the game and then retracted for the remainder, finding his voice only to help lynch anyone he possibly could.

-Tended to be sloppily accusative: some of the things he accused others of, especially near end game, were things he was doing himself.

-There was other things, too. Thok caught him, more than me. I actually defended him because he replaced Battle Mage and at that point I thought that when Battle Mage made sense, it meant he was town. (I've sense learned differently)

[Skruffs]

Lol...
Ksc0pe, if you intentionally play in a way "the majority" of players don't like, why am I vote-worthy for saying I don't like how the majority of players scumhunt? It sounds contrived to me.

I think I'm sll waiting on thesp to explain something: I may have missed it though.

[Skruffs]

Guardian:
I think I already got in a discussion re: the whole confirmation before death scene stuff... I guess we are getting senile in our old age.

Twomz:
I've pushed lines of inquiry into one or two people, without voting them. Why is this something you think should be looked at?

Everyone:
Remember to have fun, and remember everyone else is having fun in their own, special way. There's no reason to get snappy in more than a joking manner, especially day one. If we all have a big burnout, interest will wane, the game will die. Nobody wants that.

[Skruffs]

Thesp:
You've again mentioned you thinking I might be scum, so I will again ask you why. You are still pinging hard on my scumdar, and you now appear to be scuttlling about like a cockroach. Speak up or I shall stamp on thee.

Trying to think of games with ksc0pe in them: bb mafia (scum) and meadows of sorrow (town?) are the two that come to mind, and ksc0pe died early in both of them...
Ksc0pe do you ever maake it to endgame?

Guardian, as scum, has much better staying power, and is more of a threat, in the hypothetical world of both being scum.

Tsq- I'm not buying the "we might lynch a townie, onoez" deal.

fos

the tsq I know claims having a post-restriction as a townie in a normal mini.

In a huge game, on day 1, there's no reason to ever lynch a claimed power role, that I can think of.

[Skruffs]

This is bizarre. I'm not sure how I'm supposed to respond to, because Thesp is intentionally trying to not give me anything to respond to.

Just to confirm, this is what you have said in your last couple of posts, Thesp:

I find myself uncomfortable with Skruffs, as I read through.

Vote: Kaleidoscope

, though my vote would be just as happy on Sir Tornado or Skruffs.

I'm growing increasingly concerned with Skruffs, and I think he's highly likely to be scum.

Thesp:
You've again mentioned you thinking I might be scum, so I will again ask you why. You are still pinging hard on my scumdar, and you now appear to be scuttlling about like a cockroach. Speak up or I shall stamp on thee.

No.

Unvote: Kaleidoscope, Vote: Skruffs.

I will move/remove it in a heartbeat to ensure a lynch.

Is this really an attempt at an Argument Through Repitition, Thesp?

I am guessing it is because of this? That's the only time you've explained suspicion of me for any reason, and I'm really disappointed if you are actually using that as your basis. I'm gonna have to permanently remove you from my list, if so.

Thesp: asking for a vig to kill someone, when one vig is already dead?

I do find it noteworthy that you are acutely aware of who has died.

FOS: Skruffs.

Small, but notable.

I think in that little discussion, it was much more likely you were scum, trying to tell other scums who to kill. The only thing is, you were at least continuing your earlier 'game style' of pretending not to have a clue of what was going on in the game. Fossing me after directing a vig, right after earlier trying to force townies to claim pirate or ninja, which, again, suggests cross scum-group communication. Then lay low for a while, then pek back up to try and do stuff without being seen.

SO which are ya, ninja or pirate?

[Skruffs]

Agreed : but then again, we know MBL's role, we know that as a jedi he'd probably use his light sabre to hack someone to death. The only way Guardian can be disproven is if MBL claims a kill and then a doctor outs himself to confirm a protection, as far as i can see. Even if MBL claims akill, it is theoretical that MBL was also roleblocked.


Thesp:
I'm as interested in finding scum as you are. It's very odd to say "I'm not going to say why I'm suspicious of you because you'll become self conscious" - the whole intent of that sentence, it would seem, would be designed to make someone feel self conscious. It sounds, the way you phrased it, like you are hoping someone ELSE will find a reason for you to latch onto, which you can then say "Yeah, that's it, there. *cough*" ... which isns't very fair for me; you appear to be tryign to find collaboration without allowing defense. If you really want to do that, to me, thene fine... I attacked you first so you are allowed to be as tricky as you want towards me. I just hope ou will *Eventually* sit up straight enough to be responsible for what you are trying to do. You're giving me a very oil, car-salesman like vibe right now, I *really* don't like it.

[Skruffs]

Twomz : Why does it matter to you?

[Skruffs]

Well, you seem to have just implied you are in a grouping of some sort.

[Skruffs]

Thing is, Samwise was ... someone... not Bilbo... anyways, he was a hobbitt's best bud; the hobbitt was the main character, not Samwise.

Victor Frankenstien : Main character of the story Frankenstein.
Luke Skywalker : Main character of the 70s trilogy of Star Wars.
Jack Aubrey : Main character of Aubrey–Maturin series of novels by Patrick O'Brian ((Had to wiki this one))
And, if KSc0pe's claim is true: Bill Clinton; Main character of the United States, 1992-2000

Unfortunately, your claim is NOT that of a main character. I'm not saying it's a fake claim, because it's possible that your main bud is also a character in this game; but if there isn't, it seems much more likely that you would pick samwise as a fake claim, just in case the real bilbo baggins or whatever his name was IS in the game.

To quote the great Flameaxe: "Discuss."

[Skruffs]

Distraction. NEXT!

[Skruffs]

Fake Names:
I don't know. In "Dante's In Fresno", the scum had a "Rolename Finder", which they could use to find if a role name was used or not. They would try to find names that weren't in the game so they could claim them.

In C&H everyone had a Role Name but it had no bearing on their role, since it was a mountainous set up.

In the Werewolves game, which was I guess a themed mod, the werewolves had no help in terms of what to claim. No power roles, and one kill per night. It was ridiculously over powered for town, who had something like three doctors, a vig, two cops, a roleblocker, unkillable townies, etc.

Meadows of Sorrow, scum were allowed to change other player's role names around, or their own, which made fake claiming almost unnecessary.

I don't think scum got fake claims in PS2SUX; we actually caught at least one scum (Romanus) because he claimed the same video game as another player.

So generally speaking, I don't think scum get fake claims in large themed mafia games, but it seems that there is usually, possibly, an advantage they have to get around it.

[Skruffs]

GOD that game pissed me off
One NK per night vs Super Doc, Cop w/ Guardian, 2xMason, 3x Townie (With unique role names), BP Vest (2-shot), Vigilante, REgular Doc, and Tooth Fairy. We had a mafia cop who we didn't know about on our side, and a miller, and nothing else. Adn it turned out the role names were all from a game that the mod didn't even tell us about, so when we fake claimed, the town could see we were lying. I didn't like that game.

[Skruffs]

There are 26 roles in the game.
Presumably a pirate finder only finds pirates.
Presumably a ninja finder would only find ninjas.
Two halves = 1 whole cop.
The tracker is useful to town, he confirms roles, actions, and reveals lies and stuff.

[Skruffs]

Thesp - an active player who I've talked about already. Most recently,I've found his 11th hour Skruffs push without reasons to be, as I said, a highly scummy attempt to distance from whatever lynch finally occurs on the chance that it comes up town.

I thought I'd expressed my discomfort with Skruffs on a number of occasions prior. Am I wrong?

I think he's calling out that you bread-crumbed discomfort without actually backing it up. So just saying you expressed it doesn't mean anything; again, it's just an argument through repetition. That you planned it ahead of time makes it less respectable, not more, considering the emptiness of it.

[Skruffs]

I don't like The Fonz. (I mean, I like you as a person, just not in game ^.^)
I see possible Cicero/Thesp connection.

We definitely need more unvotes on non-large wagons and consolidation of those votes into one wagon.

Guardian claimed and seems to still be at as many votes as Thesp is, who didn't claim. Why?

[Skruffs]

Guardian sounds sincere, and by the sounds of it scope is being unco-operative, so

vote kscope

.
******
I can see Samwise Gangee being a tracker (for those that stated uncertainty about this role, he's a character from LOTR, tracker makes sense).
******
I don't like the way he's trying to get Guardian lynched despite the claim I think his roleclaim fits and guardian looks town and now he's accused me too.
******

Xtomx - you understand that your current vote on Thok contributes to a "no lynch" right?

Fine. I don't wanna lynch Guardian, and I think the RC wagon is better than the Thesp, so

unvote vote Rosso Carne

.

*******

I know where my suspicions lay, for now.
Guardian? Can you prove yourself today?

[Skruffs]

It's (kind of ) sad watching Thesp's descent into dementia...

[Skruffs]

I'm curious as to what the night scene means. Did Rosso survive being lynched or did the lynching machine break, or was he immune to being lynched, or was a mayor involved? IF someone intentionally prevented a lynch, day one, they are kind-of-likely to be scum.

Mod : Would 'lynching' be considered a 'faction' that scum have a one-shot immunity against?

Sorry for the misunderstanding re: the ninja protector, I didn't look at the front page before assaulting guardian. Agreed though re: shanba; Guardian needs to make that decision himself. If someone targetted a still-living player, they are most likely a PR (unless the scum have other power roles).

[Skruffs]

side note: no walking the planks, no beating uppages, no throat slittings, and two new deaethstyles; light sabreing and cutlassing. Cutlas is a pirate sword, I think, and light sabre is obv mbl.

[Skruffs]

Also:
This wasn't adressed yesterday, but is there anyone else who would like to 'vouch' for Guardian's Samwise claim? Perhaps Frodo, Bilbo, Gandalf, Sauron, etc?
Anyone from that universe at all?

Stan Laurel - Partner of "Oliver Hardy", Hale and HARDY person, etc...two person team who had a series of moveies involving their encounters with various people n monstes.. i remember the one with a werewolf and the invisible man... anyways...

Bruce Lee - had his own chain of ninja movies, though I doubt that he was ever a secondary character.

Luke Skywalkeer could 'theoretically' be considered a ninja, (I'm not saying he is scum, merely that he fits the theme), but on that line of thought, Han Solo could be considered a Pirate... Guardian's claim suggests that MBL's should have been obi-wan or han solo, etc.

hum.

Fonz : Seems to be acting generaly more helpful than he was as scum in Open 35.
Thesp : Broken.
TheStatusQuo : Useless, but that's standard. He fake claimed a post restriction in my normal mini game once, just for fun, and as an experienced player that kind of broke my 'treat this guy as earnest' meter on him.
Thok : Ambivalent, however, he just called out a HUGE guardian scum tell from Open 19 - remember in Open 19 when you let Aimee get lynched because you were 'too busy' thinking IH was scum to move your vote to Romanus? Yeah, thok just called you out on doing that again.
Erg0 : His mindset, as he displays it anyways, is pretty similar to mine.

Guardian, my comment on thok holds true- that may be a meta on you that you haven't shaken yet.

[Skruffs]

Does it hurt to ask?

[Skruffs]

EH.. I mixed 'martial artist' with 'ninja'...
and if chuck norris is not in this game, I will be VERY disappointed...

UA: You're being amazingly unhelpful.. why are you shutting down that line of thought - you seem to think it's more likely guardian really is a power role than that he isn't, and yet you insist that you are probably 'trying' to make him llook like scum... which is it.. .are you suspicious of him or are you confident in him...

[Skruffs]

Remember how you were all anti-IH somewhere around day three or four... Romanus (your scum buddy) was the second leading wagon behind Aimee.

You continud voting IH (A non wagon), allowing Aimee to be lynched instead of Romanus, even though you said Aimee was most likely town AND that romanus was your second place scum.

Your reasoning was because IH was 'more scummy' to you, or some such.

[Skruffs]

simulpost..

see, UA? SEE?

[Skruffs]

MGM - read me and Guardian's last several posts before making assumptions.

Guardian already made the point I was intending to make; We don't know what a "goblin" is. For all we know, "goblin" might be hobbittese for "power role". On the other hand, it DOES explain Guardian's secondary name claim.

Twomz, actually, I just did some googling for you:
Samwise may be a "Goblin Miller".

[Skruffs]

I'm trying to wrap my head around Twomz's reasoning for claiming; presumably, if goblins ARE real, AND are *scum*, then there's a THIRD group. This is hurting my brain to think about. >.< MBL didn't kill n1, and he wouldn't have hit himself anyways, so it is possible that, if he was killed twice (and I think he was) that the 'goblins' are the third scum group?

I find it interesting how Ooba has Erg0 painted as scum in any of Guardian's possible situations.

[Skruffs]

Then Where's Frodo?

[Skruffs]

This is a lot to process, but it looks like the scum are starting to lose their immunities to each other (yay).

I think mbl was in error to think that the goblin(s), or any scum, would target erg0; erg0 is the 'obvious' lynch choice today.

Big finger of suspicion on gorrad there: guardian had no reason to lie about erg0, and it seems the 'thok hate' was 'justified', thok must have indicated he knew goblins were scum in some way.

Posting from my phone, my next post will have quotes and research. Hooray for lynching scum!

[Skruffs]

hey gorrad, did you notice that Thok was also bludgeoned? Which is indicative (since the other three styles of death are all flavor based on ninja, jedi, and pirates) that he was killed by goblins?

Which suggests that maybe Guardian was trying to get his partner (who presumably knew erg0 was targetted and was likely to be lynched) to target Thok?

[Skruffs]

Also note: Anyone who wants to answer this, feel free:
Both the dead goblin and the dead pirate are in the 'dead list' by name only. The name infers the alignment, but there's nothing indicating role. All of the dead black players have roles behind their name, though. Is there some reason why the scum's roles aren't being revealed?

[Skruffs]

shouldn't hasdgfas be colored orange, then?

[Skruffs]

We interrupt this program for a brief message for our sponsors:

AWESOME GAME MR STOOFER

and now back to your regularly scheduled program.

[Skruffs]

I can think of at least one reason why scum would know who else is scum though...

Beautiful house of cards element to this game.

I'm pretty sure that Erg0 is a good lynch.
I also am down on a Thesp lynch; even more so than Erg0; the quiet cop fingering is enough to justify it to me. IE I don't have to feel like I'm just saying he's scum just because he's been voting me since the beginning of day one.

[Skruffs]

THe reason for Guardian's hate on you vs his hate on Thok is completely different - He hadn't claimed to have targetted Thok. His reveal on you could very well, and most likely WAS (Knowing guardian) a "I'm taking you down with me" gambit - for one thing it puts attention on you and less on his partner(s).

With Thok, it's not nearly as much a case. Maybe he saw you as scum and so thoguht thok was your partner.

[Skruffs]

Oh, well in that case... excuse my blitheness.

[Skruffs]

Something seems odd. Why did Gandalf have his own paragraph, and Bruce Lee just a byline?

[Skruffs]

If you're not scum, please pull your head out of your ass and stop giving scum information it's better they lack.

This sentence works if you replace all instances of "Scum" with "Town", too.

FOS

It says Townie. Not Vanilla Townie.

UA to the rescue!

FOS

We're wasting time with this. Erg0 is trying to distract us. Let's go ahead and lynch Thesp, the last Goblin will off Erg0, and,

with luck, Skruffs will die some way or another soon.

Double play! Distract from Erg0's 'slip' and try to direct competing scum groups as well!

DOUBLE fos!

[Skruffs]

I can fos anyone I want, Claus.

I realize

that in the heat of the moment, I forgot that he was the other mason. My fos wasn't based on that.
However.
Regardless of if he is confirmed, It's really scummy to be trying to tell people to kill me, considering I don't remember him actually saying he thought I was scum earlier in the game.

Gorrad: Why would I vote you? I am happy with my fingers.

FlameAxe: Fos's noted.

[Skruffs]

You mean the whole 'suspicion of Guardian' and the speculation about what a 'goblin' was, Gorrad?

Seriously, throw me a frickin' bone here.

Guardian *believed* that Erg0 was scum; wether Thok protected Erg0 or not (It seems likely he might have) shouldn't factor into Guardian's belief that Erg0, and thok by extension, are scum in his eyes.

[Skruffs]

oh.

Well now it all makes so much more sense, now, then, doesn't it?
Thanks.

[Skruffs]

It's a pretty unique game for me.
*sniffs himself* I smell fine.
I'm doing everything in my power to stimulate discussion and keep the game moving .

There are several reasons I can see why Thesp is full of anti-skruffiness.

1) He is a pirate, a ninja, or a goblin. Motive: Get all players other than his team killed, and realizes that Skruffs is a pretty easy lynch, all things considering.

2) Day one, I called him out on a series of very bad suggestions; remember when he suggested everyone claim pirate or ninja? I chastized him, and he's been voting and basically saying 'kill skruffs' ever since. Speculative motive: Resentment of my wit and mental accuity in poking him at a time when his game was off; his wanting to lynch me is purely spiteful in nature.

3) He's a lyncher on me. I find this to be a possible, feasible role, based on my role, but I don't see anyone being so blatantly obvious about it. Speculative Motive: He wins if I get lynched.

4) He really doesn't care about the game, and has no idea what is going on, so is just attempting to be 'constant' if he can't be constructive. Perhaps, if scum, he's hoping i will come up scum so that he can say he was bread-crumbing cop from day 1.

That's my reasonings as to why Thesp has been voting me constantly since day 1.

Other than that, please, why not *say* what I've said that's fishy rather than just building anti-Skruffs sentiment in the community first? I can't argue against 'skruffs smells bad', especially if it's from the two most confirmed players in the game. The two most confirmed players have to remember to think for themselves; someone being confirmed doesn't make them correct.

[Skruffs]

I think twomz is the third most cleared in here: We know there are goblins; we know there was a goblin protector (just like the other scum groups have) and it makes sense to think there would therefore be a goblin finder as well. Nobody counterclaimed Twomz yesterday, there is no reason therefore to think he is fakeclaiming. Considering there was NO evidence of goblins AND that guardian was one of them, even, before he said something... yeah.

this is what i meant about confirmed not equalling correct.

[Skruffs]

BooKitty was confirmed town in Open 35. She had a horrible track record of voting town and defending scum, but because she was confirmed, people were more likely to believe her.

Mister Buddy Lee, you have been killing doctors ever since you were resurrected. I think anyone in their right mind would be a little WARY of your choice of judgement.

Gorrad outed his confirmed mason buddy day one. Again, he decides to do stuff before really considering the results of those actions.

Now both of you are repeating Thesp's sentiments; his argument has basically been one of repetition.

You can call if defensive if you want, I think that if you saw someone with a lightsabre being led by the nose by someone who doesn't seem to be able to post his way out of a paper bag, YOU would get a little wide-eyed, too.

[Skruffs]

The reference to BooKitty is why I am making a point about the confirmed not being correct.

[Skruffs]

Hey Thesp.

If I were to walk up to you, when you and a bunch of other people were discussing, ACTUALLY discussing, a situation that was actually important.
Let's say I did that.

And while you were discussing, let's say I... oh... pushed my elbow into your ribs. I'd do it enough to be a bother, and I Would do it publicly. You would probably say something along the lines of, "Skruffs, stop, that's annoying."

Let's say you said that, and I kept my elbow there, and just kept waiting. Eventually you would ask, "Say, Skruffs? Would you mind explaining why you are jabbing me in the side? You're not doing much else, and it's annoying."

If I then said, "Aha! I jabbed you in the side to SEE if you would ask me to stop... a real town person wouldn't CARE if I was jabbing him in the side... obviously, you must be scum..."

You would probably look at me, the exact same way that I am looking at my computer screen right now. You just reinforced your 'argument through repitition', and added on the fallacy which involves drawing a target around the bullet hole.

[Skruffs]

This made me laugh, calling someone's actions scummy whilst simultaneously acknowledging they are confirmed town.

You're being ignorant, Thesp. Just because someone is TOWN does not mean that their play is smart. You said something almost exactly along the same lines regarding Fritz's ressurection of the doc-killing Vig. Gorrad directed scum to kill me. Wether he is town or scum, how is that pro town? Or helpful? Or stimulating to the discussion?

Secondly, why did you decide to use the same playstyle on me as you did on Twito?

I do find it interesting that you are discounting the fact that I might genuinely be wrong. (I understand why you are discounting that I might be right, though it's not something I can ignore.)

I don't see me as discounting anything; that whole list of options was saying what you COULD be, not what you COULDN'T be. I've noted during the game that you are acting funny; it's not 'discounting' someone to be aware of their actions. Unlike some people *cough MBL GORRAD cough cough* I think I've been pretty explicit in my suspicions. You can call them 'pot shots' from the side, if you wan, but they are my two cents. I just happen to have a LOT of pennies, so I distribute handfulls of them at a time.

Why does it bother you that I am 'down' for your lynch? You've been acting scummily all game; apparently intentionally, by your own admission. It's like I'm suspicious for not playing along with your 'trust thesp' gambit. You started off squirrelly and only later built up a case to defend that squirreliness.


As for shared, genuine concern... *shakes his head* If you say someone is scum enough, people will believe it. You have kept your opinions on other people restricted almost entirely to me THE ENTIRE GAME.

That makes it even more ironic when you say

,

"I think the spotlight is too narrow - there are a lot of sideline players that need to be involved."

. This of course directly after repeating the same "Skruffs is scum" that you have been saying all game long, in a post that only talks directly about ONE LIVING PLAYER.

Of course people are going to start following you - if only to get you to shut up. (See Guardian re: IH in Open 19)


MBF:
For the record, if he is true-claiming, then he most likely IS town. There's no way that a scum would have a day-ending ability like that, even if it resulted in suicide if he killed town. If it is one-shot, then it's possible he's scum, still.

Cicero : You are not acting anything like the doctor from 499. I'm very happy to read your posts. THey do not fill me with anger. Just a side note, I guess. Also: Stop fishing.

Kison: Nice double post.



Who is scum... let's see. Thesp has been way up there, but I haven't been focusing on him, because I figured that the way he was acting he would probably wind up doing something like a claim like this. He has kind of *had* to do something drastic, ever since he tried to get everyone to claim pirate or ninja (and when I called him out on that is precisely the moment he started voting me I think). However, a power role that doesn't necessarily benefit town seems to be par for the course for this game.

I'm tired and just got back from restealing my car, so I am a bit frazzled, so this list will be based on my opinion and not on facts. Therefore: There are discrepancies. But here's the list:

MBL is most likely town; the only way he wouldn't be would be if Dr. Fritzlerstein ressed a player as an SK or 'monster' version of themselves.

Gorrad is confirmed town.

Ooooooobalooba was lynched but nto lynched. He's never explained why this happened. The only instance I have seen of this happening was in Post Restriction 3; Glork was "The Mayor's Assistant" and got pardoned automatically the first time he was lynched. If someone else pardoned him, they haven't said why; I don't see there beign any reason to waste a one-shot lynch-prevention day 1. If it's not one-shot, I can understand why they'd keep quiet. So Ooba is up there.

MBF has been sideskirting the game ever since MBL first showed up dead; I remember that when Iammars was being attacked for /yarr confirming, I brought up that MBF mentioned enjoying the chance to be called MBL in the game and MBL died (not by one hit but by two), so it was suspicious that MBF brought that up because it may have directed kills.

Similarly, TSQ also tried to get DGB killed pregame, and she was, though only by one scum team. So I still think MBF and TSQ should be up there.



I think Erg0 is up there, too. I say this because there is no evidence yet that there are role blockers, and MBL pretty clearly demanded on his ressurrection that he would be taking all of the doctor protections. So even if Thok thought Erg0 *was* town, he probably would still have been focusing on protecting MBL. So Yes, Erg0 is still up there. I think that Guardian (And I said this before) would want to keep attention on other scum groups, and not his own; so getting another scum group revealed as fast as possible, especially if it is one of the title groups, probably was his goal. The alternative is that he tried to kill MBL the night that the goblins didn't kill.

My guess as to Guardian's partner, right now, is Claus. He may have two partners, but regardless, I think Claus is likely to be one of them. His interactions with Guardian strike me as one scumbuddy coaching/guiding another.

samruc has been laying REAL low.

there's more but that's my leads at the moment,

[Skruffs]

simulpost for everyone but Kison's last post, but can't catch up now

[Skruffs]

Hmmm.
On my cellphone and fresh from the docttors. Very numb feeling
I would like to formally rebut thesp, but I want to

fos

everyone who is trying to coerce thesp into dayvigging; especially with those that were anti-mbl dayvigging iammars earlier in the game. I think comparisons need to be made.

Thesp- there's no upside to the possibility of deciding to suicide bomb a townie. I don't think you thought that through when you wrote it. I think people who are pressuring you to vig someone to avoid you being lynched are acting scummy.

The scummy thing is semantics. Scummy to me means things that are helpful to scum. I didn't use it in a way to suggest gorrad was scum, I used it to infer that he's playing in a way that helps scum more than town. I guess he's bored with the game, since he's confirmed, and that's led to a sedentary, armchair-coaching style of play. No real personal investment.


I seem to recall guardian saying he was post restricted, but don't remember seeing his posting as having been post restricted. Anyone elsse confirm this?

[Skruffs]

They are exploiting a role which would not incriminate them wether he is lying or not, or wether he hit scum or not.

There isn't any foresight in asking him to use it today, especially if it is a one shot deal.

[Skruffs]

There are 18 players left.
4 of them (at least) are clearable; Gorrad, MBL, Twomz, and the pirate protector.
That leaves 14 players.

There are (at least) three scum teams, at least one of each team left.
At minimum, there are 4 scum left, there could be 10 scum left (depending on if they all started with 2, and ending with if they had 4, which is the most IT hink a sane mod would put in a game with three scum groups).

Maybe we should all claim, now?If nothing else, it will hopefully get scum to try to hunt each other instead of decimating the town. (They can rely on MBL to do that). The goblins may have hit a scum group already, and the ninjas have already obviously hit the pirates twice, so there may be growing (read: exploitable) anxieties between the scum groups to try and hit each other now.

Thoughts?

[Skruffs]

[quote="Mr Stoofer"]
[*]

KaleiÐoscøpe - Dread Pirate Roberts - killed silently Night 3

[/quote]


Two hit rule?

[Skruffs]

Okay:
Presuming that thesp is telling the truth:
If thesp is town, then whoever he day vigs will die, town or not, but he may die as well.

If he's scum, then there are at least three options here:
If he's a pirate, (who have killed every night so far and so have not yet hit scum) then the only people he can kill today are townies (and die) or a fellow pirate; I am assuming scum groups do not have immunity against themselves, I think the 1st post refers to other scum groups.

If he's a ninja. He can kill pirates or ninjas or townies, which definitely ups the non-lethal usability of his role.

If he's a goblin, pretty much the only person he can vig is erg0, if erg0 is the person goblins tried to kill before.

With that in mind, it offers a duel reason for thesp to hold onto his power, wether scum or town; if scum, it's more likely his attack will go through, and if town, later on in the game will most likely have a smaller ratio of town to scum and thus it's more likely he can kill without dying himself.

I am wary of asking thesp to use his attack on erg0, I am getting the impression that the people who are blarghing for erg0 vigging don't care wether thesp or erg0 is town or not. What I mean is, there's not forethought here, there is just people calling for blood.

Hi CES, you're looking healthy.

[Skruffs]

See, CES? That lack of drive to do the research - or even think about it further than what it takes to try and get Thesp to use his ability is exactly what i am talking about.

Special Rules for Pirates v. Ninjas!

[17] All bad guys (scum) have one-shot immunity against any scum group. In other words, for a scum cross-kill to occur, a bad guy must be targeted twice by the same scum group. If a kill fails for that reason, the targeting scum group will be told that that was why their kill failed.

Erg0's claim is not really believable in my eyes; nobody has claimed any partial or hidden roles, and every role that has a special ability is also restricted or neutral/harmful to town (possibly) in some way. (MBL's restriction of course is that he can only kill doctors, har har)

On the other hand, though
The only thing that gives it credence is Ooba's role, who wasn't killed when he was lynched.

Ooba, you may be able to shine light on erg0's claim: Do you know why you weren't lynched day 1?

[Skruffs]

Well, no, that's wrong Erg0.
If you are immune to being killed, then it doesn't matter if you are tergetted in the day or at night.

[Skruffs]

Ooba:
Can you explain your role better?

[Skruffs]

twomz- I hate to be a pain in your patooka, but the goblins will probably go after you over erg0 tonight, if you aren't a goblin yourself.

Cicero's 1351:
Well it depends on how big the scum group sizes are. There are definitely at lest one goblin and at least one pirate and at least two ninjas left.
(I know this because I read the flavor at the beginning of the game.)

I personally think four scum groups, including one that can grow each night, is excessive, even if they were minimally sized. The interesting aspect of that, would be that the cult would have one-shot immunity as well; so previously town players like gorrad could be 'converted' into scum, and have NK immunity. Also, the cult would presumably be able to 'fail' at attempts to recruit scum, without being killed itself, because of the immunity rule. While I think that the possibilities of it are intriguing, I really don't think Stoofer would do that. Gorrad being in a cult does kind of make the way he's playing make more sense, though.
But if there's vampires, then there's probably zombies, too, and a werewolf, and maybe even a mummy.

Way too complicated.


I don't believe Erg0's claim, it just doesn't jibe. Bye bye, Erg0.

[Skruffs]

2. Mars- REALLY bad vibes from his last few posts. A vampire cult? Really? I frankly can't believe he's suggesting this. If we find a cultist, THEN we worry.

If erg0 shows up as buffy, will you still hold this opinion?

. UA- Wow. Scum much? I can see no downsides to Thesp killing that outweigh the considerable benefits.

Unless it's a one-shot, or used on a townie. Right?

4. Cicero- Pretty sure he's town.

Why does this help the town when there are three scum kills per night as well as the badly directed vig?

6. Skruffs- Notice how he specifically targets the confirmed guy as a possible cult member? Skruffs, I don't know what your beef is with me, but snap out of it.

Umm... relax? did you not notice that i discredited the idea that there is a cult in the same post? Why so defensive about the idea?

[Skruffs]

Yes Skruffs, I'm a Goblin. I not only hardcore bussed my scumbuddy (who had a strong roleclaim and was revealing information that would have lead to the lynching of a possible rival scum), but I revealed our 3rd scum group to the town, because I didn't think it was fair that all the townies didn't know about it.[/sarcasm]

I'm not acussing you of being a goblin, twomz. I believe you are a cop, it fits the so far established pattern of the game. My post was merely inferring that unless you are a goblin, you are probably their target tonight.

[Skruffs]

scumhood... that just dounds dirty.

[Skruffs]

To some real extent, if I listen to "the will of the people" and let that determine my actions, it could be anywhere from 0%-50+% scum-influenced. If I make the choice myself, I know my actions are 100% non-scum influenced (except to the extent conversation in the thread goes, etc.).

You

"know" your actions are 100% non-scum influenced, but how do you expect the rest of us to come to that conclusion? That's why the idea of testing the claim came up in the first place.

Him choosing who he targets results in him being 100% responsible for his actions, town or not. Letting other people tell him what do to, esp if there are scum who want him to kill either vying scum or a townoie to result in his death, results in him not being 100% sure of himself. If he feels erg0 is town, and he is town, there is no way to force him to try and kill two townies. I would say he should not be tested, we know what he claims to be able to do, so let's just let him do it. Erg0's scum buddy(ies) are probably hoping he can't day vig, which is probablay the basis of the 'pressuring' on him.

*rambleramble ramble*

And i'm defending giving him the right to choose even though thesp has been wanting to kill me since basically day 1. stuff THAT in your pipes and smoke it.

[Skruffs]

You have to realize that Stoofer is an intellectual;
I think for him the point of the game is the discussion and the speculation, etc, NOT so much loading up town and scum with power roles that help them win. So putting a role in that by it';s definition will cause controversy is par for the course.

That doesn't mean it's a real role though; it may mean that Thesp has a good read on Stoofer's mindwaves.

Mod: Are there Cooties Mafia in this game?

[Skruffs]

disregard that last post, its just being silly. I probably shouldn't post so much while on duty.

[Skruffs]

Would you ask a suicide bomber to prove his ability?
Who's going to put the bell on the cat?

[Skruffs]

wow. Hmm.
Well, if there ARE vampires, and they ARE scum, and they are a scum group and not (say) a cult, then they've managed to , I am guessing, hit all three other cum groups on consecutive nights, or something, or haven't been targetting.

EVery other scum group, it appears, seems to have a finder AND a protector. Of course, a cult wouldn't need a protector.

Of course, fake claiming to be a power role for a scum group that doesn't exist WOULD be exceptionally genius.

[Skruffs]

well
hopefully, if there is, the scum are recruitable, and they can bus their buddies and start an inner-scum gang war.

That's my hope, anyways.

[Skruffs]

I hope that we kill all the bad guys and only the good survive!

Can I get an amen?

If there *IS* a cult leader, I imagine it would be this fella right here. *points to MikeBurnFire*

[Skruffs]

Is there a reason you don't have vampires in your list of scum groups to kill, MBF?
I would assume that if your text is some sort of game mechanic thing, than you are basically confirming via your role that there are no vampires, right?
Alternatively, if the text isn't a set thing, why wouldn't you just add "Non-town friendly parties", or at least add Vampires, and for that matter, "cults", even though there is not yet evidence of such?

Change it to include all scum parties and you have my pledge.

[Skruffs]

Heppeh Heppeh scumday, Mr Stoofer!

Gorrad:
You are confirmed, right? You are also helping scum out immensely.
You are saying you don't want Thesp or Erg0 to be quicklynched, you want it to be done by some sort of beauracratic 'measure pasing' session whereas ANYONE can hop on until -2 (hmm) and then three people say "I am through with discussion for the day" and finalize the vote.

Which is basically the exact same thing as a quicklynch,except it's preplanned and thus any scum who are on it are LESS likely to be responsible if it's a mislyndch, not that I think it will be, but still.

Now you sound exactly like Thesp did in the first part of the days; mindlessly chanting "Kill Skruffs" without giving any sort of reason. It's agravating.

The only thing that I am glad for is that you are a confirmed, nonprotected townie role, which means you probably won't get to endgame, and most likely will not lose the game for town.


Something about Claus and The Fonz reactions to the cult claims are fishy. I can;'t remember what.

I, Lord Skruffs Pantaloones, want

all

scum parties to lose and for town to win the game.

[Skruffs]

Primate, I thought you only replaced into endgames.. Do you know something we don't?

[Skruffs]

Just thought of something:

Thesp's role, if accurate, CAN win the game if we get to end game, potentially:
Thesp could day vig as soon as a day starts in a situation where scum would automatically win just by having a higher number of players; it would prevent scum from quicklynching him for an ultimate scum win, though I can't believe that thesp would be allowed to get that far by scum, unless they are reasonably sure they could get him lynched at end game or whatnot.

Kison: Is the order you have claimed players listed from most confirmed to least or first clalimed to last? I would assume that is most confirmed to leaast.

[Skruffs]

If the kill doesn't go through, it could be because both Erg0 and Thesp are scum, and Erg0 has 1-shot immunity against Thesp's group. Just something to be aware of.

[Skruffs]

Well, I'm glad ninjas lost too.

My fake claim was going to be captain kirk of the uss enterprise, a survivor who was nk immune as long as he didn't interfere with the natives (like by voting, hee hee)

I thought mbl was maybe a 'pgo vig', he could kill only from a group of people who targetted hiim. How else can you explain him killing so many docs? I was fishing, not baiting.

Also: tsq announcing his nk choice in confirmation=bad. Ksc0pe claiming lover in. Game w/ multiple groups=bad. Me being scum=bad. Why does stoofer hate pirates???

[Skruffs]

I still think Stoofer just hates pirates.