Newbie 1136: DarthYoshi's Dystopia of Death (Fin--who won?!)

[theamatuer]

vote: stels

to reset the L-2 status.

Major FOS: Soulblade
And so, nobody cared about the lurker anymore

Why vote Stels, when you are suspicious of Soul.

That. Also, since Soulblade seems to be defending stels, I am feeling a stels-SoulBlade scumteam

[Morthas]

vote: stels

to reset the L-2 status.

Major FOS: Soulblade
And so, nobody cared about the lurker anymore

Why vote Stels, when you are suspicious of Soul.

That. Also, since Soulblade seems to be defending stels, I am feeling a stels-SoulBlade scumteam

Putting Stels to L-2 when he isn't under any pressure accomplishes nothing, a vote on Soul might start a wagon and/or discussion about Soul. Are you distancing?

[theamatuer]

No because stels was at l-3 already, so its easier. And if stels is scum, then SoulBlade is 99%scum. Conversely, if stels is scum, SoulBlade has a lowever precentage.

[theamatuer]

EBWOP: I meant the other way around.

[Morthas]

Why is Stels scum again? (Other than my own reasoning)

[theamatuer]

stels might not be scum, however, SoulBlade protecting him gives reason enough, and I want to get defenses off Stels first, which was what we planned to do from the very beginning.
We being everyboy that voted for BWKM initially.

[Stels]

@Everyone: Sorry, miscounted the votes on theamatuer. Disregarded his self-unvote. L-2.

Dude, I wanted people to stop argueing about him/you was because that arguing earlier can lead to an early lynch. The only reason I brought him to L-2 was to listen to what he/you was going to say. You can't say anything if you were lynched before you logged on right?
And besides, attracting attention to myself is a truth to what you say, but if you assume that I am scum, then making myself L-2 would be useless. A suicidal Scum would vote himself at L-2 or L-1, since a L-1 can cause an accidental lynch, but being at L-2 simply gives pressure, and although there is the threat of a lynch, the actual lynch from there will still take a lot of time, and therefore would deviate from a Suicidal Scum's base purpose of quickening a day. Although an SS's other purpose is to make as few links as possible to the other scum, the entire game will be extended after the scum's death by at least a day, assuming that the 2nd scum evades lynch for that long. This gives the scum more chance to slip up.


Also, Soulblades actions are far too suspicious.

You said we have been bashing BKWM for too long already. However, our original purpose was to pry his defenses out of him from an L-2. After we did this, BWKM refused to answer at all, and to prevent people from either losing interest and unvoting him or getting too angry in his absence and lynching him, I temporalily drew off attention to me. however, once BKWM got a replacement, you immeadiately unvoted without even hearing a defense. I ask

why?

Unless you give me a perfectly good reason, I'm not going to let this go easily.

unvote: paradox

vote: stels

to reset the L-2 status.

Major FOS: Soulblade

And so, nobody cared about the lurker anymore

I love your reasoning so much, it makes me want to puke. That whole paragraph stinks of WIFOM. 'Scum wouldn't do this'. You don't even know that. I can think of a good number of reasons why scum would act suicidal. Your self-vote, is no exception.
So L-2 for you is listening to what a person has to say? So I should take it, it doesn't mean that you want that person lynched/are prepared to lynch them. You just contradict yourself there. You've done this not only to BKWM, but to Conspiracy as well.
Now you do the same thing again, you notify me that you are voting me just to put me to L-2. You saying that, again, defeats the whole purpose of you voting.
Don't just "U L-2 NAO TALK" everyone. Why lightning-rod all the attention to yourself if your original purpose was extorting information out of BKWM. You wanted to hear from BKWM. I'm not him, I'm an entirely different entity. Deal with it. Want to abuse your voting power against someone, build a case.
Plus, what do you mean by "And so, nobody cared about the lurker anymore"?

No because stels was at l-3 already, so its easier. And if stels is scum, then SoulBlade is 99%scum. Conversely, if stels is scum, SoulBlade has a lowever precentage.

So basically, you just take advantage of built up wagons instead of following your own reasoning and suspicions? Talk about scummy.

[ConSpiracy]

ConSpiracy - Same as Ghostlin - a helpful and analysing poster. I need more information about you. What would you say...

Information. Information Information.
No seriously, I can't just give information on command, what do you want me to give information about?

And your vote is solely because I can be scum decieving everyone? You really need to find better reasons to vote someone.

That. Also, since Soulblade seems to be defending stels, I am feeling a stels-SoulBlade scumteam

Just my experience coming up (inb4 Ghostlin):

At this stage, nobody should worry about finding connections between players. Most of the times they are wrong. Connections are helpful when one of the scum is dead or when it is LyLo to find the scum-team.

And stels worded it correctly. I personally thought your suspicions on SoulBlade were good, but your vote on Stels was just awful.

[theamatuer]

K then.

unvote
vote: Soulblade

To stels: Give me every single reason a suicidal mafia is a good mafia and I'll give you a reason why it doesn't work in this time and on me. Just try it.
And it isn't scum shouldn't do this. It is if scum does this, then he is a stupid scum.
U NOT L-2 NAO TALK

[DarthYoshi]

Day One, Vote Count the Sixth

Stels (2): Morthas, AeRyung
theamatuer (3): ConSpiracy, Ghostlin, Stels
Ghostlin (1): hiplop
ConSpiracy (1): SoulBlade
SoulBlade (1): theamatuer
Not Voting (1): paradox

With 9 alive, it takes 5 to lynch, and 5 to no-lynch.

The deadline is currently set for: 12:00 noon, Pacific Daylight Time (GMT - 7), Saturday, August 13.

As ever, any questions or concerns, please let me know.

[Morthas]

K then.

unvote
vote: Soulblade

To stels: Give me every single reason a suicidal mafia is a good mafia and I'll give you a reason why it doesn't work in this time and on me. Just try it.

And it isn't scum shouldn't do this. It is if scum does this, then he is a stupid scum.

U NOT L-2 NAO TALK

Bolded part is why good scum could do it.

[hiplop]

Scum-team is Ghostlin/Soul Blade, calling it now for brownie points later on.

Seriously, doesn't anyone find it suspicious that Ghostlin hasn't done anything useful all game? He's misinterpreted a few posts, something townies don't need to do. And posted some game mechanic fluff, hes like the epitome of scum-IC. All of his posts are just...awkward as well, theres no way this guy is town.

At this point; I think theamateur is just misunderstanding, he reads as genuine. Conspiracy is also likely-town.

[Ghostlin]

Scum-team is Ghostlin/Soul Blade, calling it now for brownie points later on.

Seriously, doesn't anyone find it suspicious that Ghostlin hasn't done anything useful all game? He's misinterpreted a few posts, something townies don't need to do. And posted some game mechanic fluff, hes like the epitome of scum-IC. All of his posts are just...awkward as well, theres no way this guy is town.

At this point; I think theamateur is just misunderstanding, he reads as genuine. Conspiracy is also likely-town.

The reasons I'm voting Theam at the moment.

1) The guy began the day essentally 'please don't lynch me day 1'.
2) He's jammering about connections that don't make sense. (#152 is a good example--also, guys, calling scumteams is a waste of time at this stage of the game.)
3) He self voted, which is about as far from pro-town as one gets. He did this after at least two posts telling him to never, ever do this as town.
4) He voted someone solely to reapply pressure to L-2.

So I have to ask...how is he genuine?

Also, what's your case on ME? How I am NOT acting in town's best interests? You called it on a post when you pointed out something I acutally did that was helpful. so context would be nice.

[hiplop]

Since when does having genuine intentions, mean being right? He's a newbie, and hes just misinformed. How is he supposed to know that "self voting is about as far from pro-town as one can get"? You're clearing going for an easy lynch.

There's a definitive difference in when you talk about the game theory, to when you are speaking about this game. Pretty much all of your post's are fluff, or tunneling on Theamateur, how is that pro-town, exactly? (the game mechanic stuff is tho)

[Ghostlin]

Since when does having genuine intentions, mean being right? He's a newbie, and hes just misinformed. How is he supposed to know that "self voting is about as far from pro-town as one can get"? You're clearing going for an easy lynch.

There's a definitive difference in when you talk about the game theory, to when you are speaking about this game. Pretty much all of your post's are fluff, or tunneling on Theamateur, how is that pro-town, exactly? (the game mechanic stuff is tho)

Since there's a post by myself and one of the SEs about this entire topic? I mean it's not like anyone didn't warn him self voting was a bad idea.

Bluntly, your entire reasoning is based on the feeling that

you

feel he's town, (there's at least three or four people that disagree with you) even in the face of other proof that he's not. If we seriously,

entirely

base all scummy behavior on 's/he's just new' we'd only lynch ICs and SEs and scum would win these games more often than not.

Also, explain to me the idea of voting someone to L-2 in the same post they accuse another person is 'genuine.'

It's even more scummy than not voting for someone you suspect. (AeR did this, and yes, I called her on it.)

[hiplop]

I'm talking about this case. He seems like he thinks he knows what hes doing, and that its protown. Not all townies will be right, and not all scum will be wrong.

Genuine comes with the tone of the text, yours seems to be snarky, which i find comes from scum a lot. More points to you etc etc

[Morthas]

If we seriously,

entirely

base all scummy behavior on 's/he's just new' we'd only lynch ICs and SEs and scum would win these games more often than not.

In this part it just seems for me like a desperate attempt to convince hiplop to push for amateur's lynch.
You obviously know that you can always try and distinguish between scum-newb and scum-town.
I don't think you'd have said that (especially as an IC) if you had town motivation for pushing for Amateur's lynch.

[Morthas]

VOTE: Ghosty

[AeRyung]

[quote="ConSpiracy]You must stop pulling the newb card, it is getting rather scummy.[/quote]
I say noob because that is what we are. But since it is clouding your judgement, I will stop callin myself a noob.

Seriously, doesn't anyone find it suspicious that Ghostlin hasn't done anything useful all game? He's misinterpreted a few posts, something townies don't need to do. And posted some game mechanic fluff, hes like the epitome of scum-IC. All of his posts are just...awkward as well, theres no way this guy is town.

Honestly, I can't say I dont agree with you, Ghostlin does seem a bit weird for town IC.

@Ghostlin: There are little things here and there that you can explain as an IC for the people who don't know the game(btw, very much appreciated).. But besides the game rules and such, when I see you vote or suspect someone, it is not from your own analytical thinking, but ONLY from your previous experiences with scums and what is "usually" a scummy act in the rule book of scums, such as self-voting and not voting when you suspect someone, when in most cases, each person handles certain situations differently for different reasons, but it seems you only judge a book by its' cover. And also, you state that not voting for someone when you suspect them, is scummy. but my reasons for not doing so were absolutely valid for it was the truth ^^ but I do see why it wouldn't be helpful to town, so I will vote from now on. Or did you say that so that we could get a quick lynch on BKWM??? From your posts, I feel like you really want to get this lynch on TheAmatuer, would you say it's a good time to lynch someone now? or is it still too early?

Unvote. Vote:Ghostlin

[AeRyung]

SORRY AGAIN I AM SO BAD AT THIS QUOTING STUFF!
Here is new and improved. I shall Preview my msg before I even think about sending it out from now on.

You must stop pulling the newb card, it is getting rather scummy.

I say noob because that is what we are. But since it is clouding your judgement, I will stop callin myself a noob.

Seriously, doesn't anyone find it suspicious that Ghostlin hasn't done anything useful all game? He's misinterpreted a few posts, something townies don't need to do. And posted some game mechanic fluff, hes like the epitome of scum-IC. All of his posts are just...awkward as well, theres no way this guy is town.

Honestly, I can't say I dont agree with you, Ghostlin does seem a bit weird for town IC.

@Ghostlin: There are little things here and there that you can explain as an IC for the people who don't know the game(btw, very much appreciated).. But besides the game rules and such, when I see you vote or suspect someone, it is not from your own analytical thinking, but ONLY from your previous experiences with scums and what is "supposedly" a scummy act in the book of scums, such as self-voting and not voting when you suspect someone, when in most cases, each person handles certain situations differently. And also, you state that not voting for someone when you suspect them, is scummy. but my reasons for not doing so were absolutely valid for it was the truth ^^ but I do see why it wouldn't be helpful to town, so I will vote from now on. Or did you say that so that we could get a quick lynch on BKWM??? From your posts, I feel like you really want to get this lynch on TheAmatuer, would you say it's a good time to lynch someone now? or is it still too early?

I think I need to read these posts all over again, I'm getting confused with all the replacements and the gameplay change.

[bold]Unvote. Vote:Ghostlin[/bold]

[AeRyung]

I'm getting reeeeeeeeally irritated at myself.

Unvote. Vote: Ghostlin

[Ghostlin]

If we seriously,

entirely

base all scummy behavior on 's/he's just new' we'd only lynch ICs and SEs and scum would win these games more often than not.

In this part it just seems for me like a desperate attempt to convince hiplop to push for amateur's lynch.
You obviously know that you can always try and distinguish between scum-newb and scum-town.
I don't think you'd have said that (especially as an IC) if you had town motivation for pushing for Amateur's lynch.

No, this is me pointing out crap logic. I do not think ignoring IC/SE advice and doing the opposite (delibrately doing something scummy) is protown. I do not think any attitude that involves self preservationary thinking is protown. I do not think voting someone else than what you accused is protown.

I don't think there's anything "genuine" about anything said. I do not like the excuse for scummy behavior being 'he's just new, this is newbtown.' None of the above matches any experience I have for newbtown.

AeR:

I don't think with a week in, we should lynch anyone.

Honestly: scum tend towards certain behaviors and motivations that town does not. When I scum hunt, I tend to go 'is this behavior protown (or likely meant with protown intentions)?' Self voting isn't. Going roughly 'please don't lynch me' at the beginning of the game when you should be latching on to things to start the scum hunt is not protown.

[hiplop]

Cool. You talk, but your actions aren't speaking what you say. Your town game theory talk, doesn't match up with your behavior.

[Ghostlin]

Cool. You talk, but your actions aren't speaking what you say. Your town game theory talk, doesn't match up with your behavior.

How? You've posted little vignettes about this the entire game, but you've not backed up any of your talk.

[theamatuer]

I think that Ghostlin isn't scum, although I could be wrong. SoulBlades recent action is far more scummy, and I suggest we all get him to talk first.
I personally think that Ghostlin is like an extremist, where he thinks that anyone that goes against his rulebook is scum. The fact is that everyone has his or her own playstyle, and most people's styles have their flaws that can be read as antitown. I think that it is the one that looks like the most protown and whose style is perfect is most likely to be scum.
Ghostlin may be an extremist, but that doesn't mean he's scum, since he play's that way. Unless someone shows Meta that disproves that fact, then it's cool.