Newbie 621 (Game Over!)

For Newbie Games, which have a set format and experienced moderators. Archived during the 2023 queue overhaul.
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Post Post #50 (ISO) » Sun Jun 01, 2008 6:05 pm

Post by Malex McJokeus »

Thestatusquo wrote:Specious, aka, you're arguing something that is expedient. You're arguing that me and mirth are scum because we're playing the game, essentially. There's no reason to think that your argument is incorrect, aka there are no facts that falsify your theory, but there are also no facts that support it anyway.

It's like me saying "Zeal is scum buddies with Kristopf because he hasn't voted him."

Or, to use an example from the simpsons:

Homer: Not a bear in site, that bear patrol must be working.
Lisa: Thats very specious reasoning dad.
Homer: What?
Lisa: Well, I could claim that this rock repelled tigers, simply because there were no tigers around.
Homer: How does it work?
Lisa: It doesn't, thats the point...But you don't see any tigers?
Homer: Lisa, I'd like to buy your rock.
FOS Zeal and Kristopf!!!
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Post Post #51 (ISO) » Sun Jun 01, 2008 7:50 pm

Post by zeal »

OMGUS
FOS: Malex McJokeus
=p

Thanks for explaining that TSQ, but I still can't see how your vote for Mirth wasn't random, unless we have some special game mechanic where our cop can investigate pre-game (Which I doubt, considering this is a newbie game)
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Post Post #52 (ISO) » Sun Jun 01, 2008 9:45 pm

Post by Thestatusquo »

You are not thinking outside the box enough. It is possible that my vote for Mirth was for a different purpose than lynching scum, and is thus not random.

Can you think of any such purposes which are pro town?

Can you think of any such purposes which are anti-town?
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Post Post #53 (ISO) » Sun Jun 01, 2008 10:48 pm

Post by mith »

Vote Count:
5 to lynch.

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Post Post #54 (ISO) » Mon Jun 02, 2008 12:38 am

Post by Mirth »

Malex McJokeus wrote:
Mirth wrote:Kristopf, why do you think he has any reason to believe I'm scum yet? Also all *she's* done is cast an "OMGUS" vote *after* TSQ's vote and harassed some of the newbies a little. Why so eager to start a wagon on TSQ? Like you said, it's page 2m and yet you're already casting a second vote.

Malex, what do you mean by accusation?Why do you think we'd react badly to your "random" vote? You're the only one who brings it up.
Mirth, you seem to be quite the provocateur. I am thinking that you are just rousing rabbles, but it is leading to a general suspicion. You take innocuous statements that I make and try to distort them. If you are doing just to as you say "harass a newbie" then that is fine, but it is possible that you could be up to more.
QFT

Yes. I am trying to get y'all to talk since I kind of have RVS (random voting stage)
zeal wrote: Is it just me, or does it seem like TSQ is telling everyone to vote Mirth without any *known* reason, while Mirth is trying to stop us from voting TSQ...

Let's say that they're both mafia, then maybe they decided to move suspicion away from each other by voting for themselves, but it went slightly wrong and now Mirth is trying to stop TSQ getting lynched?
Wrong. TSQ is obviously voting me because he's played with me before. (Which is the real reason I'm voting him. I would still be voting him regardless of whether or not he was voting me) But you seem to be suggesting it's okay to be all gung ho about lynching someone on page 2, regardless if it is TSQ. Do you this it is okay? Or do you agree with me that it is absolutely vital to avoid early pointless lynches coming out of RVS and TSQ being his usual annoying self?

Kristopf, why are you backing down? It's only a second vote, the world isn't going to end if you had kept your second vote on TSQ. Heck, you might have even gotten him to talk some sense.

Zeal, why your unvote?
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Post Post #55 (ISO) » Mon Jun 02, 2008 12:39 am

Post by Mirth »

EBWOP: hate^ hate RVS.
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Post Post #56 (ISO) » Mon Jun 02, 2008 3:06 am

Post by Nahraza »

Always on time.
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Post Post #57 (ISO) » Mon Jun 02, 2008 3:23 am

Post by Mirth »

Nahraza wrote:Always on time.
what is the purpose of this comment.
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Post Post #58 (ISO) » Mon Jun 02, 2008 4:00 am

Post by Nahraza »

What's the purpose in voting in the first message in the game?

The purpose is obliviously that it doesn't have purpose. I just feel like it. You have posted three pages of text so I think I missed the start. I'm new one in here so I don't know what's the ordinary way of doing things here. But I guess it's far away from what I have been used to. And today was a bad day, the first of the holiday x). I hate holidays, too much time to do nothing.
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Post Post #59 (ISO) » Mon Jun 02, 2008 4:18 am

Post by Mirth »

Nahraza wrote:What's the purpose in voting in the first message in the game?

The purpose is obliviously that it doesn't have purpose. I just feel like it. You have posted three pages of text so I think I missed the start. I'm new one in here so I don't know what's the ordinary way of doing things here. But I guess it's far away from what I have been used to. And today was a bad day, the first of the holiday x). I hate holidays, too much time to do nothing.
Why are you getting defensive?

and the purpose of voting in the first message is to get people active and responding and talking about something. not everyone likes RVS, or engages in it, but it is useful as a springboard


You however have 2 and a bit of a third page of us talking. Why not respond to that instead of posting something that is honestly kind of useless.

And why are you bringing up that you're new? 6 out of 9 players here are new. No need to point it out. I don't like it when the newbie card is played needlessly (see newbie 606 for an explanation of the newbie card. its been beaten to death in there with a stick)

Soooo...I'll tell you what I'm going to do.

I'm going to
unvote:TSQ
, and
vote:Nahraza


can anybody tell me why I just did that?
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Post Post #60 (ISO) » Mon Jun 02, 2008 4:51 am

Post by Battousai »

Because your mean?

Anyways, just got done graduating/partying this weekend so I had to read the thread. To catch up:

Random stage

vote: zeal
because the name sounds too much like seal.
unvote



vote: Nahraza
, for the same real reason mirth voted nahraza.
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Post Post #61 (ISO) » Mon Jun 02, 2008 5:06 am

Post by Nahraza »

... sshhhhhhhhhhhhtttt... :D
And why are you bringing up that you're new? 6 out of 9 players here are new. No need to point it out. I don't like it when the newbie card is played needlessly (see newbie 606 for an explanation of the newbie card. its been beaten to death in there with a stick)
Sorry, I forgot what I was playing :). But I was saying that because I'm new _here_ and lazy that I haven't been reading much games in here so I don't know what is the way of doing things here. I have played this kind of games before but where I have played the whole system is totally different. Thinking things over and over is not the best part of me x).
You however have 2 and a bit of a third page of us talking. Why not respond to that instead of posting something that is honestly kind of useless.
Mmm... I don't know. But it isn't useless, I think. It made you to vote me ;). *naurs* And now you know that I'm awake.
and the purpose of voting in the first message is to get people active and responding and talking about something. not everyone likes RVS, or engages in it, but it is useful as a springboard
Ooooo, but it's kind of useless..? If my "useless" posts are useless why isn't that too :P. And now you can talk about me, yea ;).
can anybody tell me why I just did that?
Would you yourself tell that, maybe?
vote: Nahraza, for the same real reason mirth voted nahraza.
Battoo, _N_ahraza, please. I'm asking only you: what was the mirths reason to vote me? Am I some kind of blind?
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Post Post #62 (ISO) » Mon Jun 02, 2008 6:15 am

Post by Mirth »

Battousai wrote:
vote: Nahraza
, for the same real reason mirth voted nahraza.
And what was that? Why do you feel the need to borrow my reason. Why not provide your own.
Nahraza wrote: Sorry, I forgot what I was playing :). But I was saying that because I'm new _here_ and lazy that I haven't been reading much games in here so I don't know what is the way of doing things here. I have played this kind of games before but where I have played the whole system is totally different. Thinking things over and over is not the best part of me x).
You *forgot* what you were playing. You're only in one game (i.e. this one). Kind of hard to forget what kind of game this is after going through the newbie queue.
Mmm... I don't know. But it isn't useless, I think. It made you to vote me ;). *naurs* And now you know that I'm awake.
And what you've said in this post so far is going to make me keep my vote on you. Post was still useless in that it did not contribute any to the game in a stand alone sense. It did not comment on action or discussion previously held and it did not participate. It wasn't even a "hi, I don't have time right this second but I'll read/respond" later post.
Ooooo, but it's kind of useless..? If my "useless" posts are useless why isn't that too :P. And now you can talk about me, yea ;).
I'd rather talk with you than about you, frankly. RVS isn't useless. It has a use to get conversation started. Your post did not have this use when you made it. You are trying to retroactively give it a use. Why? Why not just admit that it was useless? Why defend yourself on something that needs no defense?
Would you yourself tell that, maybe?
Maybe later. I'd like to hear what the peanut gallery thinks before I explain myself. Battousai got it, though, I think.
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Post Post #63 (ISO) » Mon Jun 02, 2008 6:24 am

Post by Battousai »

Ya I got it, I didn't want to answer your question as I thought it was directed more to the newbies in the game.
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Post Post #64 (ISO) » Mon Jun 02, 2008 6:39 am

Post by Nahraza »

I'll explain once more. I said that I'm new here because I'm new _here_. I have played multiple games at another forum, and there the way we play is a bit different. The point is, I might use some of the customs we use there. Most of the "newbies" here haven't played this game on a forum. It was one sentence, and you turned it into a battle. Great.
It did not comment on action or discussion previously held and it did not participate. It wasn't even a "hi, I don't have time right this second but I'll read/respond" later post.
Okay, I know, it is easy to say now, but still. Would you have commented anything to a "hi, I don't have time right this second but I'll read/respond later" post? I don't think so.

And I can give my post a use retroactively (what a great word, by the way :D) if I like. What is so horrible about that? I'm sure that RVS didn't originally have that kind of use. Originally it was just random voting and then someone thought "hey, this is a good way to get conversation started".
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Post Post #65 (ISO) » Mon Jun 02, 2008 6:57 am

Post by Mirth »

Battousai wrote:Ya I got it, I didn't want to answer your question as I thought it was directed more to the newbies in the game.
No. This was direct to everyone. Being an IC doesnt get you off the hook. And you didn't respond to the rest of my comment to you. Why? (Note: fear not, newbies, I'm equal opportunity in my harassment ^_^)
Nahraza wrote:I'll explain once more. I said that I'm new here because I'm new _here_. I have played multiple games at another forum, and there the way we play is a bit different. The point is, I might use some of the customs we use there. Most of the "newbies" here haven't played this game on a forum. It was one sentence, and you turned it into a battle. Great.
And I'll say it once more. Most of the people here are new. We (the ICs) will take it for granted that you may not have the best of clues of what is going on. Pointing it out when it is not necessary, however, makes me, at least (Batto, TSQ, you can feel free to disagree with me on this), think that you're trying to take advantage of newbie status. As for battle, why do you say battle? I'm just asking you questions and you're getting defensive. I repeat, why?
Okay, I know, it is easy to say now, but still. Would you have commented anything to a "hi, I don't have time right this second but I'll read/respond later" post? I don't think so.
No because that would not be as useless. That would indicate the player was paying attention to the fact that there are previous posts that might be worth reading.
And I can give my post a use retroactively (what a great word, by the way Very Happy) if I like. What is so horrible about that? I'm sure that RVS didn't originally have that kind of use. Originally it was just random voting and then someone thought "hey, this is a good way to get conversation started".
The point is that you're inserting intention that was not there and thus attempting to skew context. If you do it with something as insignificant as one useless post, what are you going to do when someone attacks you for something else? Town usually has no need to skew context. And scum, if skewing context, cant make it so obvious as to get caught.
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Post Post #66 (ISO) » Mon Jun 02, 2008 7:14 am

Post by Nahraza »

I'm just asking you questions and you're getting defensive. I repeat, why?
Because I have two votes now. That's why I'm defensive.
As for battle, why do you say battle?
Because I couldn't find better word. ^^; Show would be better.

That should be enough for today, now I'll go sleeping. See you in the morning. :>
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Post Post #67 (ISO) » Mon Jun 02, 2008 7:17 am

Post by Mirth »

Nahraza wrote:
I'm just asking you questions and you're getting defensive. I repeat, why?
Because I have two votes now. That's why I'm defensive.
You got defensive before I voted you. And you need 5 for a lynch. You think we'd go for a quick lynch on you? Why? Are 2 votes really all that scary?
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Post Post #68 (ISO) » Mon Jun 02, 2008 8:27 am

Post by Thestatusquo »

Why is Mirth not dead yet?
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Post Post #69 (ISO) » Mon Jun 02, 2008 8:29 am

Post by Mirth »

Thestatusquo wrote:Why is Mirth not dead yet?
Because
god
Darwin hates you.
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Post Post #70 (ISO) » Mon Jun 02, 2008 10:04 am

Post by Malex McJokeus »

Mirth wrote: Are 2 votes really all that scary? (Post 67)
If two votes are not all that scary to you, then
Vote: Mirth.
Although it really is just one reasoned vote and TSQ's "we know each other so it is not a random vote," random vote. I actually feel that TSQ is doing a disservice to the voting on Mirth, so I am going to take a crack at it. If I may direct your attention to a comment that I made on page two but was answered on page three. In her answer, you will see that she agrees with me that she seems shady and then goes on harassing more of the Newbies.
Mirth wrote:
Malex McJokeus wrote:
Mirth wrote:Kristopf, why do you think he has any reason to believe I'm scum yet? Also all *she's* done is cast an "OMGUS" vote *after* TSQ's vote and harassed some of the newbies a little. Why so eager to start a wagon on TSQ? Like you said, it's page 2m and yet you're already casting a second vote.

Malex, what do you mean by accusation?Why do you think we'd react badly to your "random" vote? You're the only one who brings it up.
Mirth, you seem to be quite the provocateur. I am thinking that you are just rousing rabbles, but it is leading to a general suspicion. You take innocuous statements that I make and try to distort them. If you are doing just to as you say "harass a newbie" then that is fine, but it is possible that you could be up to more.
QFT

Yes. I am trying to get y'all to talk since I kind of hate RVS (random voting stage)
zeal wrote: Is it just me, or does it seem like TSQ is telling everyone to vote Mirth without any *known* reason, while Mirth is trying to stop us from voting TSQ...

Let's say that they're both mafia, then maybe they decided to move suspicion away from each other by voting for themselves, but it went slightly wrong and now Mirth is trying to stop TSQ getting lynched?
Wrong. TSQ is obviously voting me because he's played with me before. (Which is the real reason I'm voting him. I would still be voting him regardless of whether or not he was voting me) But you seem to be suggesting it's okay to be all gung ho about lynching someone on page 2, regardless if it is TSQ. Do you this it is okay? Or do you agree with me that it is absolutely vital to avoid early pointless lynches coming out of RVS and TSQ being his usual annoying self?

Kristopf, why are you backing down? It's only a second vote, the world isn't going to end if you had kept your second vote on TSQ. Heck, you might have even gotten him to talk some sense.

Zeal, why your unvote?
First of all, agreeing that I should be suspicious of you does not make me any less suspicious of you. Secondly you once again stated that having two votes on someone may not make the world end and maybe it will make them talk sense. I don't think you need to talk sense as most of the things you said are logical, but I would like a few answers.

One answer I am looking for is why immediately after that post your next post was to jump all over the first thing Nahraza says and change your vote to him (or her)?
Mirth wrote:
Nahraza wrote:What's the purpose in voting in the first message in the game?

The purpose is obliviously that it doesn't have purpose. I just feel like it. You have posted three pages of text so I think I missed the start. I'm new one in here so I don't know what's the ordinary way of doing things here. But I guess it's far away from what I have been used to. And today was a bad day, the first of the holiday x). I hate holidays, too much time to do nothing.
Why are you getting defensive?

and the purpose of voting in the first message is to get people active and responding and talking about something. not everyone likes RVS, or engages in it, but it is useful as a springboard


You however have 2 and a bit of a third page of us talking. Why not respond to that instead of posting something that is honestly kind of useless.

And why are you bringing up that you're new? 6 out of 9 players here are new. No need to point it out. I don't like it when the newbie card is played needlessly (see newbie 606 for an explanation of the newbie card. its been beaten to death in there with a stick)

Soooo...I'll tell you what I'm going to do.

I'm going to
unvote:TSQ
, and
vote:Nahraza


can anybody tell me why I just did that?
I for one can not tell you why you did that. While we can agree that Nahraza did not enter the game as gracefully as everyone else that made a random vote on page 1, does that really warrant you deciding that he should be the man to die at the end of Day 1? I would like an answer from you, as well as Battousai, as he voted for Nahraza as well.

Overall I find that while your tactics are getting people to speak up, it is as if you are trying to bully people into a mob mentality using your IC status as Newbie would use their's. Furthermore, you attack everything that is said in the hopes that it will stick. Why are you being so aggressive? It is coming across incredibly scummy in my opinion. It is still early on, we all have our suspicions of others, but I am most suspicious of you.
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Post Post #71 (ISO) » Mon Jun 02, 2008 10:31 am

Post by Mirth »

Malex McJokeus wrote: If two votes are not all that scary to you, then
Vote: Mirth.
Although it really is just one reasoned vote and TSQ's "we know each other so it is not a random vote," random vote.
Nah, I'm betting its because before this game is out TSQ and I will end up having given each other huge headaches (if 509 is any indication). And nope, not spooked by the second vote.
I actually feel that TSQ is doing a disservice to the voting on Mirth, so I am going to take a crack at it. If I may direct your attention to a comment that I made on page two but was answered on page three. In her answer, you will see that she agrees with me that she seems shady and then goes on harassing more of the Newbies.
It does bother me, however, that you're so quick to find "shadiness" in my provocation. Think what you will, but I do ask you to think.

First of all, agreeing that I should be suspicious of you does not make me any less suspicious of you.
Who said I want to make you less suspicious of me? Maybe I want you to use your head and decide on your own if you want to be suspicious of me?
Secondly you once again stated that having two votes on someone may not make the world end and maybe it will make them talk sense. I don't think you need to talk sense as most of the things you said are logical, but I would like a few answers.

One answer I am looking for is why immediately after that post your next post was to jump all over the first thing Nahraza says and change your vote to him (or her)?
I think you're trying to find my honest opinion on game theory in what I've said so far. That should become obvious once I'm done provoking all of you.

As to why I jumped on Nahraza, I want you to think about that for a second. I mean truly think what in Nahraza's post really bothered me. (And I will give you a hint: that is an honest vote that I will stick by until Nahraza stops whatever it is that made me suspicious, or someone does something worse. I'll also give you another hint. Nahraza's subsequent posts only made it worse.) I'm not going to give you a straight answer to this yet because I want to see if anyone can figure it out on their own.

I for one can not tell you why you did that. While we can agree that Nahraza did not enter the game as gracefully as everyone else that made a random vote on page 1, does that really warrant you deciding that he should be the man to die at the end of Day 1? I would like an answer from you, as well as Battousai, as he voted for Nahraza as well.
Woah, hold on, what? Can you please show me where I decided that Nahraza has to die at the end of day 1? We're on page 3. The fact that you're suggesting this makes me think you're in a hurry. Why are you in a hurry?
Overall I find that while your tactics are getting people to speak up, it is as if you are trying to bully people into a mob mentality using your IC status as Newbie would use their's.
Am I really? And what am I trying to get them to be a mob about? I have obviously been treating all newbie players here like soulless entities sharing a hive brain and incapable of independent thought, since you can clearly see from my posts so far how I make no effort to differentiate among them and ask them questions relating to their individual posts.
Furthermore, you attack everything that is said in the hopes that it will stick.
Is this logical, I ask you? Wouldn't it be so much easier for scum-Mirth to only find one or two players to harass and do it well instead of spreading herself thin and harassing everyone? And am I actually attacking or just asking? You find hostility in my posts, is it actually there or do you assume it is and read my posts as such? And what am I trying to stick where, exactly? I'd like to know. Really.
Why are you being so aggressive? It is coming across incredibly scummy in my opinion. It is still early on, we all have our suspicions of others, but I am most suspicious of you.
You are accusing me of something that you could be accused of of doing yourself (i.e. playing aggressively) why is it an aparrant scum tell for me but not for you?


To everyone else: I'd really like to hear you talk, pretty please with sugar on top? I don't bite. Much.
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Battousai
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Post Post #72 (ISO) » Mon Jun 02, 2008 12:10 pm

Post by Battousai »

The reason I voted Nahraza is the way he came in. First post was completely useless, after post was defensive and used his newness to explain his first post as "not knowing what's the ordinary way of doing things here". Another reason was to get him to talk more (2 votes have seemed to get him pretty defensive). Now his other posts are kind of defensive, but have no questions or comments that would help search for scum.

The reason I borrowed your reasons, Mirth, was because they were the same (I think), and I thought your question was for the newbies to get them to think of why someone would vote someone other than trying to get them lynched and what not.
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Post Post #73 (ISO) » Mon Jun 02, 2008 1:49 pm

Post by Mirth »

I won't confirm or deny. I want to see who else thinks I'm scum first.
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Post Post #74 (ISO) » Mon Jun 02, 2008 1:59 pm

Post by kristopf »

Mirth wrote:
vote:Nahraza


can anybody tell me why I just did that?
I'll take a stab at this question,

All Nahraza has posted so far has been noise. In our 3 pages so far we've had plenty of discussion, open questions, and a few early suspects, and yet Nahraza ignores all of this and doesn't even random vote. It gets worse when he starts getting overly defensive and playing the newbie card in every post.

Two votes for him is enough right now, this town seems a bit bloodthirsty for this early in the day, but if his next few posts don't have way more content I'd feel comfortable voting him.

@Nahraza
Since nobody else said this plainly, I'd like you contribute to the
discussion
. I don't have a specific question for you since you haven't posted anything really game relevant, so how's this:
Ask a specific question about someone's reasoning, logic or vote in the game so far, and don't give up till you get a satisfactory answer.

@TSQ:
I still see no way in which your actions so far in this game benefit the town. No one else seems willing or able to explain. You and Mirth have played together before, but YOU are the one who seems to be the troublemaker here.

@Mirth I don't see what everyone has against you, you're quick to ask questions and demand answers but that's a good thing and helps to generate discussion, no matter if you're scum or not. (I'm thinking you're town, but it's obviously too early to be sure)

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