The worst thing in the game is that I couldn't have done shit to win from the start. At least that's how it feels.
I'm going to make a game with a third party who have an unwinnable wincon (that they think is winnable) and specifically invite all the Asari players and specifically put all the Asari players on this team and then tell everyone else that the Asari-shits can only win if EVERYONE ELSE IN THE GAME DECIDES THEY DO.
<3 Nahdia
I had fun despite my shitting a lot here, lol
In post 5631, Varsoon wrote:The worst thing in the game is that I couldn't have done shit to win from the start. At least that's how it feels.
I'm going to make a game with a third party who have an unwinnable wincon (that they think is winnable) and specifically invite all the Asari players and specifically put all the Asari players on this team and then tell everyone else that the Asari-shits can only win if EVERYONE ELSE IN THE GAME DECIDES THEY DO.
http://wiki.mafiascum.net/index.php?title=Mhsmith0
Conq: you, sir, are great at being town.
BATMAN: Only jugg was the only one we didn’t scum read at least not me
Quick: There is little to no chance this slot is Power-Wolfing.
SR: I want to give him a day
Life is simply unfair, don't you think?
Zakk I think had solid night actions. Not sure anyone else really did and that includes me, who tried to give a journal to freaking FAQ2 my first day (and couldn't because I misread my role pm lol)
http://wiki.mafiascum.net/index.php?title=Mhsmith0
Conq: you, sir, are great at being town.
BATMAN: Only jugg was the only one we didn’t scum read at least not me
Quick: There is little to no chance this slot is Power-Wolfing.
SR: I want to give him a day
Life is simply unfair, don't you think?
In post 5631, Varsoon wrote:The worst thing in the game is that I couldn't have done shit to win from the start. At least that's how it feels.
I'm going to make a game with a third party who have an unwinnable wincon (that they think is winnable) and specifically invite all the Asari players and specifically put all the Asari players on this team and then tell everyone else that the Asari-shits can only win if EVERYONE ELSE IN THE GAME DECIDES THEY DO.
In post 5640, mhsmith0 wrote:Zakk I think had solid night actions. Not sure anyone else really did and that includes me, who tried to give a journal to freaking FAQ2 my first day (and couldn't because I misread my role pm lol)
Well thank you! this means a lot to be singled out in a good way by someone I barely know
For the curious, here's a gm post game comment on a similar issue (except in this case it was a scum leaning neutral who was SUPPOSED to be held in check by a town lyncher role)
Spoiler: .
Colonel Thomas Rainsborough wrote:
Lyncher Role - Bromley and the d2 town suicide
With the very best of intentions this game was unbalanced when Zoomzip ignored his VC and did not vote to lynch Niakan on d2. Niakan was convinced that Constantine was the lyncher role given his dogged pursuit on Niakan.
Constantine made one of the biggest blunders to sabotage this town when he outed himself and ATE's roles unnecessarily in response to Niakan's d2 lie about finding ATE guilty. However, he was absolutely right about Niakan d2 and the need to lynch him based on Niakan's behaviours. Instead he was patronised and marginalised in thread. And pointing out to him that Niakan was independent is more of the same. If one examines what Niakan was doing you will see that he was the best scum hunter in the game - problem was he was hunting them so he could 'negotiate' in thread with them and protect them at all costs since they were his 'flock' (more on this later)
The following is what I wrote to ZZ after he exploded n2:
*sighs* Oh well, what can I say...there were a couple of infamous incidents of players (allegedly) not playing to their win conditions in Rolan's games I think and so rules at that time began to include a rule of "play to your win conditions" or I will Mod-kill you. These incidents caused some anger amongst GMs and players alike as the games were unbalanced/subverted as a result.
Play to your win conditions is so basic, so fundamental - it is essential to the balance of any game design
Fortunately, these incidents passed and this rule had gone back to the redundancy I always imagined it to be. I thought it redundant here. Seemingly not.
By giving you that win condition I have tried to give you the hard-wired motive to prioritise something potentially town essential to keep Niakan in check.
What follows is essentially my GM AAR as the town is surely doomed.
Niakan is certainly playing to his win conditions and is self-evidently trying to destroy the town as quickly as possible by outing every role he can manage to help the mafia kill royalty. While also outing his role to make sure they don't kill him. Even not prioritsing your 'personal' VC I don't see how it turned into doing the opposite of the other half. How is lynching a double voting townie or Robert Cecil better than killing a confirmed no-town multiple-liar destructive behaviour Jesuit priest? Niakan is pulling exactly the same trick he tried in Crunkus's recent game when he comes in at day end to try and make the town his bitch. Creating an environment of panic and confusion after lurking for the rest of the game day. How is that trick still working? Lynch the bastard.
The town knows Niakan is not town. Jesuit priests may not have been directly involved in this plot but they are enemies of the state. How likely are his claims that his non-town VCs are actually aligned with town VCs as he claims? If they were town aligned he'd be...town aligned and not be an enemy of the state. You personally know he is lying as he claims more than one priest in the game. Your PM tells you there is only 1. Why is he lying? Not to help the town clearly. How is his previous lie about his cop result therefore a pro-town scum trap? It cannot be. He isn't town and his claimed VCs have nothing to do with such a trick. In fact, quite the contrary since he needs to survive and he has totally exposed himself. So why is he lying?
So irrespective of all this I cannot understand how the town imagines the combination of Niakan not being town and his behaviour means he should not be lynched? Incredibly not a single person comments on him not being town and it is my belief that most if not all those living still think he has claimed town. He certainly went back to calling himself loyal when no one noticed. You still put him in Blue for example when he admits to being green.
He claims his VC is for a loyal Catholic to live? What are the odds that a Catholic priest distinguishes between loyal and disloyal Catholics? His job is to look after Catholics. That's why he is hiding underground and risking his life literally every day he remains in England. He can therefore win with town or scum, but he needs catholics to live. The mafia killed a loyal catholic n1. He knows that the faction 'richest' in Catholics are the scum so if he can help them win quickly he can win. He tells a lie and disappears for 48 hours (or whatever) which is incredibly anti-town and what does the town do in a protect the King game?
Constantine outs himself and ATE! WTF? He can call Niakan a liar without doing any of that. You out to validate Niakan (is this absentee somehow more important than the King that you make the King less safe to protect him?). WTF? This allows him to out himself to narrow the search further and keep him safe from the night kill. He then looks around and makes sure he goes after Kian who is not outed. kian is outed and lynched. What Kian is doing voting on anyone but Niakan is beyond me. We have an uncounter-claimed Cecil - how can he possibly be scum? Kian goes on about N0 messages when I have repeatedly confirmed no N0 actions.
Everyone's role is historically accurate. If everyone claimed the mafia are screwed unless they can fake a good claim, but of course that is why this is a protect the King game to stop the town doing that. What we have instead is the town partially outing as much as it can without making any reciprocal demands on the mafia. I have literally no idea what the town is doing. It has committed suicide on d2 and I am in despair of them. The inhibitor to Niakan playing this way was that he knows someone wants him dead. Someone who is hard-wired to want him dead if he takes liberties.
The mafia now know who the King is. They had 50:50 odds to kill him N2 but missed.
Incredibly to me no one on d2 even mentioned that Niakan had admitted to not being town. People kept talking about him being loyalist sided and relating that to ZZ's cop result. Constantine pointed out he could be Godfather, but the thing was you already knew he was! He got a loyal subject result when he isn't a loyal subject. He admits that - ergo the cop result must be false.
More in a bit
In this game, neutrals running amok benefited TOWN because they could freely hunt the opposing scum (which I was pretty much openly doing in thread even if I was doing a crap job of it) and were basically unlynchable. The check in this ability was the fact that opposing scum had a hard-wired incentive to NK them. Once the continued survival of varsoon and bee boy made it clear that the scum wouldn't bother to do this, the game became drastically town sided (before people decided that lynching confirmed town late was a good plan for some reason)
I'd also say this is why lurking was NOT incentivized by the game design. As long as salarians were trying to kill Asari, and krogans trying to kill turians, looking townie shouldn't have been particularly dangerous. But instead both scum factions chose to try and target humans, with the somewhat predictable consequence that they would sometimes miss and sometimes miss badly and accidentally shoot friendlies.
PS varsoon, you PROBABLY needed to find a way to convince the salarians in thread to eliminate the Asari. That's a hard line to toe though. But I think that was your only path, to get your kinda teammates to balance the scales. Then again, the downside was that pointing this out might have gotten the krogans on you. Once e&a and two turians died, though, it was nearly un winnable for you, due to circumstances outside your control.
http://wiki.mafiascum.net/index.php?title=Mhsmith0
Conq: you, sir, are great at being town.
BATMAN: Only jugg was the only one we didn’t scum read at least not me
Quick: There is little to no chance this slot is Power-Wolfing.
SR: I want to give him a day
Life is simply unfair, don't you think?
It kinda was. CTR gmd my first ever game, earlier this year(based on lambert simnel), this was one he did a couple years ago based on the gunpowder plot
Post game was at http://www.playdiplomacy.com/forum/view ... 16&t=29748
http://wiki.mafiascum.net/index.php?title=Mhsmith0
Conq: you, sir, are great at being town.
BATMAN: Only jugg was the only one we didn’t scum read at least not me
Quick: There is little to no chance this slot is Power-Wolfing.
SR: I want to give him a day
Life is simply unfair, don't you think?
http://wiki.mafiascum.net/index.php?title=Mhsmith0
Conq: you, sir, are great at being town.
BATMAN: Only jugg was the only one we didn’t scum read at least not me
Quick: There is little to no chance this slot is Power-Wolfing.
SR: I want to give him a day
Life is simply unfair, don't you think?
In post 5639, Varsoon wrote:It's all good. As much as I bellyache, I enjoyed playing with you all.
Cakez saving me from Beeboy's rubbish kill was 10/10
If I'd lost this game I might be salty for cakey for that but fortunately it worked out
I was also getting worried about math needlessly antagonizing town by proposing to intentional lynch humans. I think Beeboy dying would have made this game hard mode for asari lol.
http://wiki.mafiascum.net/index.php?title=Mhsmith0
Conq: you, sir, are great at being town.
BATMAN: Only jugg was the only one we didn’t scum read at least not me
Quick: There is little to no chance this slot is Power-Wolfing.
SR: I want to give him a day
Life is simply unfair, don't you think?
Showhttp://wiki.mafiascum.net/index.php?title=Mhsmith0
this means a lot to be singled out in a good way by someone I barely know 
