Newbie 1046: Game Over

[Zachrulez]

Oh hi.

[Nobody Special]

Hi.

[Zachrulez]

Not that I don't have any reason to doubt you might actually finally post something tonight (wonder why I might possibly be skeptical of that.), but I think it should be pointed out that the deadline is in 4 days.

[Nocmen]

I'm still waiting for something of content from NS before I post any more opinions. It's time that we force him to give his own unique opinion

[Haylen]

FYI, I'm doing a PBPA that should be done soon. You all post so much -_-

[hurristat]

I'm not sure if that's sarcasm or not.

[GLaDOS]

Day Four Vote Count #4

1 Nobody Special (Zachrulez)
1 Zachrulez (Nobody Special)

With

5

alive it takes

3

to lynch. Deadline is March 20 at 2:30 PM CST.

Not Voting - 3 - Haylen, hurristat, Nocmen

[Nobody Special]

I'm starting with Haylen because -- well, because she's the one I iso'd first. Forthwith:

More often than not, I do make it to endgame - sometimes because I'm scum, more recently because I've started replacing into games that are almost over.

There doesn't seem to be an option for Haylen living until endgame because she's town. To be honest, I've played with her in a few Newbies but I can't recall her alignment. Let's just say this does not look good for her.

Add to this that the scumteam hasn't quickhammered either me or zach -- that proves that either myself or zach is scum. But I'm working on Haylen's case right now -- zach's case will wait for my next post.

Vote Haylen just because nobody voted for her and I have heard she is good at staying under the radar

Stefan: How did you know I'm difficult to catch as scum?

Hmmm. Freudian slip?

Let's also look at this: four days, two lynches (nolynch on D3 and we haven't yet lynched today). Haylen's a better scumhunter than that. All of her cases have not led to a single scumlynch. Why? Because she's scum, and she wouldn't push for lynching herself or her scumpal, zach.

Let's look at some voting:

Here Haylen votes zach with absolutely no explanation AT ALL. According to the previous votecount there were no votes on zach. No one between the votecount and Haylen's vote voted for zach. Why begin a wagon with absolutely no explanation? (Coincidentally [or not], zach posts

two minutes

after Haylen's vote to say "hi." Not too incriminating, as he did the same thing to me today. But.) This was January 31.

In her next post she does analyze zach. But let's see how many votes zach accumulates? By February 8, he had two more votes. Haylen was still the wagon leader. By February 9 there were only two people (Haylen and AwesomePoe). Then, by February 12 (the final votecount of Day Two), Haylen has switched to the AwesomePoe wagon to successfully scumlynch a townie. Note, please, that zach is also on this wagon. Note, as well, that Haylen hammered. What did she say about this? Hmmm. First, she's

not willing

to hammer AwesomePoe. A full

minute

later, she says she would deadline-hammer. Then, she did in fact, hammer near the deadline. Except, wait -- even though she said the deadline was three hours away, she conveniently 'forgot' that GLaDOS had granted an extension. How convenient. Hammering a townie and stifling discussion in one short post. Hmmm.

Early on Day Three, Haylen points to her perfect scum record while also pointing out her abysmal town record. (We can safely ignore her SK record, as there are no SKs in Newbie Games.) She also tries to explain away her not-really-deadline-but-let's-call-it-that-anyway hammer.

And

she mentions again that zach

must

be scum. Distancing much?

Oh, let me quote this one. You really have to see this one to believe it:

If I was scum and wanted to end day early to stop Nobody Special from giving his views, I would have killed him during the night. Thus the only explanation is that I was telling the truth when I said I forgot we had an extension.

Who died Night Two? Ghostlin. Very townie, by anyone's standards. That's what scum do -- they kill the Towniest players so they have someone else to cast suspicion on in the remaining days. And no, scumHaylen wouldn't kill me, because, even on Day Three, I looked, if not scummy, at least anti-Town. I admit it. I lurked badly through this game, and for that I'm sorry. I had a combination of RL strangling me and a couple other unforeseen things. Perfect for Haylen and zach to leave me alive, and point their fingers.

Another:

Haylen: Somethink doesn't add up. You said that learning if you have scum-Haylen or town-Haylen is easy, so why do you win so often as scum?

To be honest, I haven't got a clue

She wins so often as scum BECAUSE SHE'S VERY GOOD AT IT.

Is Zach a player in this game or the mod? If he's a player ask him about my meta, he knows it well enough. I presume it's something to do with being able to talk yourself out of 99% of situations as scum and barely any as town.

I called her out on this. In hindsight, I think it was merely a clever ruse to try and deflect attention from the Haylen/zach team.

I'm pretty sure me and Zach aren't scum together. Zach probably is, I'm not.

I'm coming round to seeing a NS scum at the moment. Purely because he's telling me I should post content, when he hasn't really posted much himself.

Going to re-read Nikitakit and Hurristat.

Why did you say "pretty sure"? Either zach IS your scumpartner, or you're Town (which you had already fakeclaimed) -- in which case you have no scumpartner. I posit that this is half scumslip/half an attempt to deflect.

Finally, since we know there was a cop, and there's no Doc claim, there's two possibilities: We have a Doc who is alive and NOT CLAIMING, or there's no Doc, thus no roleblocker, and therefore the scumteam forgot to send in a kill Night One.

Well, that took two hours.

zach next. I'll try to do it before falling asleep (it's 3am now) but if not, look for it in the morning.

[Haylen]

No really. I've been getting confused between games because Zach was modding the other game I was ICing and was then participating in this one.

Haylen's a better scumhunter than that.

Are you sure you've been playing with me?

I'd like to contest the rest of that sentence by saying, In all of my town games on site, I've only been successful in leading a lynch on two people: camn in Ladies Mafia and Zach ages ago in that game he really wants to forget xD I almost caused scum lynches on VRK and Flay in two other games but they didn't work out very well.

Haylen votes zach with absolutely no explanation AT ALL. According to the previous votecount there were no votes on zach. No one between the votecount and Haylen's vote voted for zach. Why begin a wagon with absolutely no explanation?

A little thing called reaction hunting. And because I would have thought by now that Zach would know me well enough as a player to recognise that I'm town.

There doesn't seem to be an option for Haylen living until endgame because she's town. To be honest, I've played with her in a few Newbies but I can't recall her alignment.

I'm a Lurkie McLurker and an easy get out clause in lylo. Tbf, all of my absenses can be proven by going at looking at my other games, the v/la and lurking times correspond with each other.

Hmmm. Freudian slip?

No. General question. I find players who research their possible future opponants to be quite resourceful and interesting. It told me a lot about him, even better if he explained where he got the information.

Why? Because she's scum, and she wouldn't push for lynching herself or her scumpal, zach.

You've just made your whole two cases redundant.
You say that me and Zach are scum, but in the quote above you say I wouldn't push for a lynch on my scumbuddy and yet I've been pushing for his lynch for 2 days. Showing that you don't really believe we're scum together.

That's what scum do -- they kill the Towniest players so they have someone else to cast suspicion on in the remaining days. And no, scumHaylen wouldn't kill me, because, even on Day Three, I looked, if not scummy, at least anti-Town.

No NS. If I was scum, random people would have died as part of my perfectly laid plans. Recently finished newbie game Read that, Zach modded the game so he'll probably remember exactly what happened there. A summary of what happened:
1) I spotted the Cop's breadcrumb on Day One.
2) My scumbuddy got lynched Day One.
3) Killed the scummiest looking player to waste a cop investigation Night One.
4) Killed the cop night two to make it look like a newbie had been using their gut.
5) My plan worked out, that newbie got lynched.
6) Hayl-scum wins.

What did she say about this? Hmmm. First, she's not willing to hammer AwesomePoe. A full minute later, she says she would deadline-hammer.

Your point being? Deadline hammers are forced hammers, the player doesn't necessarily need to want the lynchee to be lynched.

Except, wait -- even though she said the deadline was three hours away, she conveniently 'forgot' that GLaDOS had granted an extension.

Again, your point? Any player could make that mistake. I don't notice deadline extensions unless the exact new date and time is posted.

She wins so often as scum BECAUSE SHE'S VERY GOOD AT IT.

*shrugs* think what you will. Personally, I think it's down to the skill of my partner rather than my own.

How do you rate your town skills, NS?

Why did you say "pretty sure"?

That is the point when I began doubting myself. I've had a logic scum read on Zach for a while, but then I started getting a gut scum read on you. And I tend to listen to my gut more in lylo than at any other time in the game.

I'm going to go and look at who was inactive night one.

[Haylen]

Vote Zach

Chkflip disappeared on page 6 Day One and wasnt replaced until after Day Two began. Pretty much confirmed scum there. I know Chkflip wasn't around because he needed replacing in my game aswell.

[Haylen]

Nikitakit was the most likely scum after that as she requested replacement right after night. However, it was enough after night that she could have missed it. Deer posted night two and was prodded later thus showing he was around and could have sent in the kill if he was scum. Scum wouldn't have risked not killing that night to try and frame it on somebody else, thus they must be people who WERENT ACTUALLY HERE.

[Haylen]

Yeah, I change my mind. Logic over rules gut. NS isn't scum.

[Nocmen]

More often than not, I do make it to endgame - sometimes because I'm scum, more recently because I've started replacing into games that are almost over.

There doesn't seem to be an option for Haylen living until endgame because she's town. To be honest, I've played with her in a few Newbies but I can't recall her alignment. Let's just say this does not look good for her.

I don't see how this works as a case against her at all.

Add to this that the scumteam hasn't quickhammered either me or zach -- that proves that either myself or zach is scum. But I'm working on Haylen's case right now -- zach's case will wait for my next post.

This sounds pro-town.

Let's also look at this: four days, two lynches (nolynch on D3 and we haven't yet lynched today). Haylen's a better scumhunter than that. All of her cases have not led to a single scumlynch. Why? Because she's scum, and she wouldn't push for lynching herself or her scumpal, zach.

Let's look at some voting:

Here Haylen votes zach with absolutely no explanation AT ALL. According to the previous votecount there were no votes on zach. No one between the votecount and Haylen's vote voted for zach. Why begin a wagon with absolutely no explanation? (Coincidentally [or not], zach posts

two minutes

after Haylen's vote to say "hi." Not too incriminating, as he did the same thing to me today. But.) This was January 31.

I think if anything this is more of just a playstyle reaction between the two of them, at least regarding zach's response.

In her next post she does analyze zach. But let's see how many votes zach accumulates? By February 8, he had two more votes. Haylen was still the wagon leader. By February 9 there were only two people (Haylen and AwesomePoe). Then, by February 12 (the final votecount of Day Two), Haylen has switched to the AwesomePoe wagon to successfully scumlynch a townie. Note, please, that zach is also on this wagon. Note, as well, that Haylen hammered. What did she say about this? Hmmm. First, she's

not willing

to hammer AwesomePoe. A full

minute

later, she says she would deadline-hammer. Then, she did in fact, hammer near the deadline. Except, wait -- even though she said the deadline was three hours away, she conveniently 'forgot' that GLaDOS had granted an extension. How convenient. Hammering a townie and stifling discussion in one short post. Hmmm.

This is interesting.

Oh, let me quote this one. You really have to see this one to believe it:

If I was scum and wanted to end day early to stop Nobody Special from giving his views, I would have killed him during the night. Thus the only explanation is that I was telling the truth when I said I forgot we had an extension.

Who died Night Two? Ghostlin. Very townie, by anyone's standards. That's what scum do -- they kill the Towniest players so they have someone else to cast suspicion on in the remaining days. And no, scumHaylen wouldn't kill me, because, even on Day Three, I looked, if not scummy, at least anti-Town. I admit it. I lurked badly through this game, and for that I'm sorry. I had a combination of RL strangling me and a couple other unforeseen things. Perfect for Haylen and zach to leave me alive, and point their fingers.

This is extremely WIFOM, but I do see the point. But that's still not a case that you're town.

I'm pretty sure me and Zach aren't scum together. Zach probably is, I'm not.

I'm coming round to seeing a NS scum at the moment. Purely because he's telling me I should post content, when he hasn't really posted much himself.

Going to re-read Nikitakit and Hurristat.

Why did you say "pretty sure"? Either zach IS your scumpartner, or you're Town (which you had already fakeclaimed) -- in which case you have no scumpartner. I posit that this is half scumslip/half an attempt to deflect.

Finally, since we know there was a cop, and there's no Doc claim, there's two possibilities: We have a Doc who is alive and NOT CLAIMING, or there's no Doc, thus no roleblocker, and therefore the scumteam forgot to send in a kill Night One.

[/quote]
Wait....I'm pretty sure Ghost was a doctor. So this whole thing is moot.

As Haylen's counter response:

No NS. If I was scum, random people would have died as part of my perfectly laid plans. Recently finished newbie game Read that, Zach modded the game so he'll probably remember exactly what happened there. A summary of what happened:
1) I spotted the Cop's breadcrumb on Day One.
2) My scumbuddy got lynched Day One.
3) Killed the scummiest looking player to waste a cop investigation Night One.
4) Killed the cop night two to make it look like a newbie had been using their gut.
5) My plan worked out, that newbie got lynched.
6) Hayl-scum wins.

Again, extreme WIFOM here.

Nikitakit was the most likely scum after that as she requested replacement right after night. However, it was enough after night that she could have missed it. Deer posted night two and was prodded later thus showing he was around and could have sent in the kill if he was scum. Scum wouldn't have risked not killing that night to try and frame it on somebody else, thus they must be people who WERENT ACTUALLY HERE.

As mentioned in response to NS, failure to account for the doctor.

I'm not liking both of these cases, and what was a town-read on haylen is fading a bit.

[Nocmen]

In summary with the two, I want to see more from NS. I'm torn with the case on Haylen, and what matters most to me right now is NS's post on Zach.

[Haylen]

ooooops. I thought we had a Cop, not a Doc.

Unvote

[Haylen]

Um. Wait. I've been going on about a doc not claiming since we massclaimed and nobodies corrected me? ~.~ You're all scum just for that!

[Nocmen]

that was a fail of a mass claim:
Okay, cop, you really should claim, so that way we can clear people. at this point we need to get a mafia, and if we don't lynch one the game's over. so losing the cop next night or losing the game.... i think I'd rather lose the cop, no offense to the cop.

Hurristat, only scum would know if we have a cop right now. Since they have prior information about the setup. I personally believe that we don't since anybody would have claimed cop by name.

The order is important as it stops the scummy people coming up with a fakeclaim when everyone else has claimed. The person who has been counterclaimed is always lynched, hence why a scum who claimed early couldn't come up with a fakeclaim. Thus why it Nobody Special is pretty much confirmed town to be atm.

Last post that you mentioned the setup, which then mentions accounting for all possible setups.

[Haylen]

Ah. K. I was expecting something Doc related rather than Cop related if something power role like did come up. Cause I thought Ghostlin was cop, fair play. Doc and Cop are easy words to confuse.

[Nobody Special]

(The audience watches in rapt fascination as Nobody Special prepares to make Haylen look bad for not remembering who the Doc was. Or the Cop. Or whatever. Especially since Nobody Special didn't remember the Doc was

already dead.

The audience watches as NS's head explode in frustration.)

I know I promised the zach case this morning, but I got waylaid, and now I'm at work. Before I go to bed tonight.

[Nocmen]

And time's a ticking

[Zachrulez]

What a stall job.

Really masterful with the timing.

[Nobody Special]

As much as zach thinks I was stalling, I really wasn't.

Actually Haylen, the only thing that really bugged me about you post wise was that bit following your lynch -1 vote of WIR. Also you have been lurking, and while lurking you have been paying attention to other games while ignoring this one... so yeah,

there's some nagging things, but you aren't at the top of my suspicions.

I think AwesomePoe is actually the most likely scum. Hurristat's recent posts have give me pause, but he would be my next suspect. Then it would probably be Deer, Haylen and Nocmen

in no paticular order.

(Nocmen's attack of me 271 in particular was just odd. Twitches me with a thought of possible buddying to Haylen.)

That leaves StefanB and Ghostlin, who strike me as town.

Vote: AwesomePoe (L-1)

Here we start. Mentions almost every player in the game: common scum tactic; also includes some town reads just to look normal. Also, the scumlist includes his buddy, just for additional realism.

He also accuses Haylen again in his iso 16 and iso 19.

In his iso 27, he tries defending himself against Ghostlin's PBPA. He isn't flailing, no, he's too good for that, but he does some interesting tap-dancing.

In his iso 37, he

again

defends Haylen.

We can either do Haylen today, or zach today. I don't care which, really.

If, however, town lynches me, that's it. Game OVER. With a scum win. We don't want that, so I would really prefer we lynch either Haylen OR zach today. I'm not even pushing for one over the other. EITHER ONE IS FINE BY ME.

Nocmen, hurristat, I don't care. You guys decide on one, and I'll vote them.

[Nocmen]

So is that it? Those 5 posts are the basis of your opinion on Zach?

[Nobody Special]

Yes. I admit it's not the very best case, but most of his interaction is alternately accusing, and then defending, Haylen. He does spend some token time on other players, but the bulk of his activity is Haylen-focused. I think he's trying madly to distance himself so far from her, for obvious reasons.

[hurristat]

NS, wait, your argument on Haylen was really long and protracted, but your argument on Zach is short, and that's the one that needs more attention? Something's missing there.

Pot, kettle, etc., but Zachrulez hasn't posted any meaningful content in a while.