Mini 779 - Killer in Smalltown Y - Over

[imaginality]

Apologies for jumping the gun earlier. Vicki's suggestion makes sense.

Top of the page vote count:

Tina

has 2 votes (Richard, Charles)
Nobody else is voting.
9 alive, eh, 5 to lynch.

[Tarhalindur]

Here, let's just run the randomization, it shouldn't take any more time than randomizing roles for my games from. (Speaking of that, what I'm about to do is how I randomize my roles in my modded games, except that I'm using dice tags instead of random.org for transparency.)

Random position:
1) armlx - Misty the Librarian
2) Grimmy (replacing Shinnen_no_Me) - Bruce the Martial Artist
3) Debonair Danny DiPietro - John the Advertiser
4) Hypatia - Mary Rose the Split Personality
5) imaginality - Charles the Kidnapper
6) Y - Tina the Stripper

Fixed position:
7) malthusis - Richard the Stalker
8) AshMC1984 - Tom the Peeper
9) Tarhalindur - Vicki the Model

(Note: I'm not completely sure on optimal placement of the last three - if anyone has an alternate suggestion for how {tracker, watcher, selfwatcher} should claim, let me know - but I AM sure these three roles need to claim after the others.)

Original Roll String: 1d6

1 6-Sided Dice: (3) = 3

Original Roll String: 1d5

1 5-Sided Dice: (2) = 2

Original Roll String: 1d4

1 4-Sided Dice: (1) = 1

Original Roll String: 1d3

1 3-Sided Dice: (2) = 2

Original Roll String: 1d2

1 2-Sided Dice: (1) = 1

[Tarhalindur]

1) armlx - Misty the Librarian

2) Grimmy (replacing Shinnen_no_Me) - Bruce the Martial Artist
3) Debonair Danny DiPietro - John the Advertiser
4) Hypatia - Mary Rose the Split Personality
5) imaginality - Charles the Kidnapper
6) Y - Tina the Stripper

First dice roll is 1, hence armlx claims first. Remove armlx from the pool and we get this list for the second dice roll:

1) Grimmy (replacing Shinnen_no_Me) - Bruce the Martial Artist

2) Debonair Danny DiPietro - John the Advertiser

3) Hypatia - Mary Rose the Split Personality
4) imaginality - Charles the Kidnapper
5) Y - Tina the Stripper

Second dice roll is 2, so DDDP goes second.

Iterate:

1) Grimmy

2) Hypatia

3) Imaginality
4) Y

Dice roll is 2.

1) Grimmy
2) Imaginality

3) Y

Dice roll is 3.

1) Grimmy

2) Imaginality

Dice roll is 1.

1) Imaginality

Dice roll has a 100% probability of being 1, so no need to roll the dice.

If we use these dice rolls for random order, our claim order for non-tracking players is: Armlx, Debonair Danny DiPietro, Hypatia, Y, Grimmy, Imaginality.

If everybody is satisfied that this order is determined randomly, then we'll begin with an Armlx target claim. (I have comments to make on players, but I intend to wait until after target claiming is done to do so.)

[Y]

I agree that a mis-lynch is bad for us right now, and I'm fairly certain that Tina(Y) is scum from the fact that she blocked me last night, and only scum would block the closest thing we have to a cop here.

Vote Tina

You're not the only investigative role. We have Tom (Ash), whose chance of finding scum is the same as yours (Or greater, since he knows who is more likely to be killed while you have to guess who will kill). Two investigative roles in one town seems too much, so I think one of them is scum (very probable, at this point, since almost half the remaining players are scum. in onew way or another).
I'd be very careful with the investigative roles. A known investigative role used by scum is very dangerous to the town.

Think about this one too: Why did no one protect the doc nor the herbalist?

[armlx]

Tar, this was discussed before, but unless you believe the Track/Watcher to be pro-town, its best to random them as well.

[armlx]

EBWODP: And by before, in the last small town game.

[malthusis]

malthusis wrote:
I agree that a mis-lynch is bad for us right now, and I'm fairly certain that Tina(Y) is scum from the fact that she blocked me last night, and only scum would block the closest thing we have to a cop here. Vote Tina

You're not the only investigative role. We have Tom (Ash), whose chance of finding scum is the same as yours (Or greater, since he knows who is more likely to be killed while you have to guess who will kill). Two investigative roles in one town seems too much, so I think one of them is scum (very probable, at this point, since almost half the remaining players are scum. in onew way or another).
I'd be very careful with the investigative roles. A known investigative role used by scum is very dangerous to the town.

Think about this one too: Why did no one protect the doc nor the herbalist?

The point I'm making is that Tom has to be lucky enough or have enough facts to know who the mafia is killing to find any evidence, while I practically have a guilty if someone is killing (I may have some false innocents, but when you (aka. scum) is gone, that will be a lot easier). The rest of the case of yours is utter crap logic to get the case off of you (Obviously no one could have protected the nurse because the only person who could have protected her is herself, which is illegal, ditto for the herbalist). Even if I am scum (or Tom) we would be fairly useless to the mafia (and maybe even helpful to the town, because we would still help find the SK). I'm deadly confident that you're scum, and you've done little to prove otherwise.

[imaginality]

First of all,

Unvote

- want to see what the claims reveal.

A couple of Richard's latest comments are on the crappy side of dubious:

Obviously no one could have protected the nurse because the only person who could have protected her is herself, which is illegal, ditto for the herbalist).

Not true. You're right that Jennifer couldn't have protected Amy from the scum kill. But Bruce could have defended her, Mary Rose could have too (admittedly with a risk of killing her), and I could have kidnapped her. So Tina's question is not craplogic.

Even if I am scum (or Tom) we would be fairly useless to the mafia (and maybe even helpful to the town, because we would still help find the SK).

Very not true. The mod specifically said the SK's kill is invisible to investigative roles and that the SK has their normal night action as well as their kill. That makes Richard the Stalker and Tom the Peeper both useless for catching the SK.


However I also disagree with this from Tina:

Two investigative roles in one town seems too much, so I think one of them is scum (very probable, at this point, since almost half the remaining players are scum. in one way or another).

Wouldn't the alignments have been distributed randomly amongst the roles? In which case there was 4/12 * 3/11 = 12/132 = 1/11 chance of them both being scum, 8/12 * 3/11 + 4/12 * 8/11 = ~5/11 chance of one of them being scum, and 8/12 * 8/11 = ~5/11 chance of neither of them being scum.

So the chance of one or both of them being scum is only slightly higher than the chance of neither being scum.

[Y]

Two investigative roles in one town seems too much, so I think one of them is scum (very probable, at this point, since almost half the remaining players are scum. in one way or another).

Wouldn't the alignments have been distributed randomly amongst the roles? In which case there was 4/12 * 3/11 = 12/132 = 1/11 chance of them both being scum, 8/12 * 3/11 + 4/12 * 8/11 = ~5/11 chance of one of them being scum, and 8/12 * 8/11 = ~5/11 chance of neither of them being scum.

So the chance of one or both of them being scum is only slightly higher than the chance of neither being scum.

I thought that the roles were fixed and only the player distribution was random. If you're right and the abilities are not connected to the roles, my logic isn't as good (While statistically still true, even if by a slim difference).

For the record, I did assign roles and alignments randomly, and seperately

The point I'm making is that Tom has to be lucky enough or have enough facts to know who the mafia is killing to find any evidence, while I practically have a guilty if someone is killing

But how whould he get facts? It's not like the doc or the investigative roles have a higher chance of being targeted. Right?

The rest of the case of yours is utter crap logic to get the case off of you (Obviously no one could have protected the nurse because the only person who could have protected her is herself, which is illegal, ditto for the herbalist).

As stated by imaginality - Not true.

Even if I am scum (or Tom) we would be fairly useless to the mafia (and maybe even helpful to the town, because we would still help find the SK).

1. You can't find the killer, and if you could, the mafia wants him dead too, so that's a null point.
2. You could claim to get an innocent on a mafioso (malthusis: "I may have some false innocents" - Thanks for letting us know), or to have been blocked when the town needs a desperate scum lynch (Framing a role blocker at the same time). And I actually thought an investigative role could help the scum. Silly me...

I'm deadly confident that you're scum, and you've done little to prove otherwise.

I have no real accusations to defend from, so proving my innocense is hard. I guess you were the right choice. While you weren't the killer this time, I at least outed you.

Vote Richard.

[Debonair Danny DiPietro]

Just a couple quick things. I currently side with Richard (mathusis) in this current dispute with Tina (Y). Given the claims are accurate I have a hard time believing it would be good town strategy to block a watcher/tracker.

I'm not voting until everyone in the town shows up and have we have a mass target/info claim though. Personally, I'm willing to claim at any time once we can agree on a rough order.

[AshMC1984]

I'm deadly confident that you're scum, and you've done little to prove otherwise.

I have no real accusations to defend from, so proving my innocense is hard. I guess you were the right choice. While you weren't the killer this time, I at least outed you.

Tina I keep reading your last post to see if I've missed something. Where did you out Richard?

[Y]

Tina I keep reading your last post to see if I've missed something. Where did you out Richard?

It seems to me that Richard is already preparing the ground for "misplays" (i.e. "I may have some false innocents") and is trying to cover the posibilities of an investigative role to help the scum. It feels to me like he's already preparing himself to the time when he'll have to face dificult questions in the future.

I have my logic, which doesn't always fit with every one else's, but I do believe I did the right thing.

[Hypatia]

I didn't kidnap Richard (like he says, his is the best investigative role we've got going for us). I kidnapped Mary Rose - because I didn't want to risk us waking up with another townie dead if she went psycho in the night. Just as well really, three dead makes it tricky enough as it is.

Your kidnapping was wasted; Mary and Rose chose not to target anyone.

[armlx]

How about we actually just claim like it says above then get back to this?

I no targeted, as evidenced by everyone talking.

[Y]

For the record, I did assign roles and alignments randomly, and seperately

That settles it. imaginality was right. I stand corrected.

[Debonair Danny DiPietro]

Claim: I targeted Kevin the Home Invader since I figured the Home Invader/Hider would have one of the better chances to be alive on D1, seemingly I was wrong.

[armlx]

Claim: I targeted Kevin the Home Invader since I figured the Home Invader/Hider would have one of the better chances to be alive on D1, seemingly I was wrong.

Just wondering, why did you target anyone?

[imaginality]

Summary of the claims so far:

Misty the Librarian -

chose not to target anyone

John the Advertiser -

targeted Kevin the Home Invader

Mary Rose the Split Personality -

chose not to target anyone

Tina the Stripper -

targeted Richard the Stalker

Bruce the Martial Artist -
Charles the Kidnapper -

targeted Mary Rose the Split Personality

Richard the Stalker -
Tom the Peeper -
Vicki the Model -

[Y]

So Mary/Rose didn't target and I claimed already and added my reasons. Grimmy is next, followed by imaginality, who claimed already as well.

[Debonair Danny DiPietro]

Claim: I targeted Kevin the Home Invader since I figured the Home Invader/Hider would have one of the better chances to be alive on D1, seemingly I was wrong.

Just wondering, why did you target anyone?

Worst case I move a vote from townie to townie for basically no net benefit or loss (I guess it could possibly create more noise to cut through but I figured no one would target Kevin because of his role so this wouldn't be an issue). Best case I take the vote of an anti-town player and give it to a pro-town player dramatically weakening their strength during the day phase.

[malthusis]

I guess I'll claim my target since Charles went ahead anyways....

I think I drank too much that night and targeted Bruce (I somehow thought he was a vig?).

[AshMC1984]

Claim: I was peeping at Bruce last night. I saw Richard pay a visit.

[imaginality]

Claimed actions and results:

Misty the Librarian -

chose not to target anyone

John the Advertiser -

targeted Kevin the Home Invader

Mary/Rose the Split Personality -

chose not to target anyone

Tina the Stripper -

targeted Richard the Stalker

Bruce the Martial Artist -
Charles the Kidnapper -

targeted Mary Rose the Split Personality

Richard the Stalker -

targeted Bruce the Martial Artist; no result (claims roleblocked)

Tom the Peeper -

targeted Bruce the Martial Artist; saw Richard visit Bruce

Vicki the Model -

[Grimmy]

Claimed actions and results:

Misty the Librarian -

chose not to target anyone

John the Advertiser -

targeted Kevin the Home Invader

Mary/Rose the Split Personality -

chose not to target anyone

Tina the Stripper -

targeted Richard the Stalker

Bruce the Martial Artist -

targeted Charles the Kidnapper

Charles the Kidnapper -

targeted Mary Rose the Split Personality

Richard the Stalker -

targeted Bruce the Martial Artist; no result (claims roleblocked)

Tom the Peeper -

targeted Bruce the Martial Artist; saw Richard visit Bruce

Vicki the Model -

I added mine to the list.
I chose to protect Charles the Kidnapper. The jailkeeper role can help us in alot of ways.

Grimmy
more tomorrow or wednesday

[armlx]

Something is up with the Tracker + Watcher I think.