Newbie 843 (Game Over)

[yernab]

Ah yes, sorry about not posting yet - things have been rather busy for me over the weekend, but it should be smooth sailing from here.

I'm admittedly new to this game, save for a few games IRL a loooooong ago and more recently in IRC, but I still haven't quite gotten the hang of the first day of play. I mean, really, am I supposed to make a sound judgement on who's scum from a page of one-line replies? The thing to do on the first day, at least judging from the other games on this fine forum that I've been reading, is to stimulate discussion, try and get a good conversation going, and see if we can't get the scum to at least drop a small tell. Obviously randomly lynching someone is sub-optimal, and as david-villa-7 noted above me, the time for random voting is over.

So, in the interest of stimulating discussion, I'd like to ask a question that I'd always wanted to ask on the first day, but I never see it done.

If you were scum, who would you vote for?

I think it's a decent question because it adds an additional layer of subtext, and for scum it may prove somewhat more difficult to navigate. Now, if I were scum, with the limited information I currently have, I'd most likely vote for the most vocal person, so long as it doesn't put them at L-2 or higher - got to avoid suspicion, you know. The fact that the most vocal person has already voted for me cements it: I would probably vote for Soyasushi.

Now in reality, I would probably vote for one of the guys that haven't posted yet. People who don't post are generally below the radar of the lynching mob, at least on day one, and they may be trying to lay low until someone calls them out on their lurking. WrathofShadows, for instance, is someone I would conceivably vote for. However, I'm going to withhold my vote for now, as it's entirely possible he's just had a busy weekend, not unlike myself. =P

Anyway, c'mon - let's get talking and see if we can't dig up something.

[Meji Fan]

Whoa, have you never heard of WIFOM? Scum doesnt want to do stuff scum would do, but then since scum wouldnt want to do it, people wont expect it of scum, so scum should do it, round and round the merry go round goes etc

But anyway, the one line replies and whimsy are just the starting point, youll then notice in most games they gradually build up into proper cases, day 1 is in fact quite good for catching scum before they get their groove going (admittedly anecdotal, but Ive generally seen more luck on day 1 than any other day . . . Im not going to do a comphrehensive analysis of 800 odd newbie games to check)

If I was scum I would do the exact same thing I would do if I was town, find and vote for the person I found most interesting/suspicious

Unvote Tubby

Now, the person who interests me most would be Tubby . . . mainly because his complaints about lack of discussion, without well, actually discussing. Two of his three posts are pretty much 'need more posts!', and the other one is his random vote

Kinda makes one think of Active Lurking, how to look like your involved without well, being to involved

Vote Tubby

Soyasushi - lots of posts, but thats early RVS silliness (I like early RVS silliness to), I cant say I find anything yet there

WrathofShadows - I could be suspicious there, lurking can be a scumtell, and WrathofShadows posted twice to discuss replacements in confirmations, however, it hasnt been nearly long enough by far to get that suspicious, the game started Sunday and its Monday morning

[manho]

unvote, vote: tubby

for asking for more post and more talk without actually giving them.

and to the question by yernab, i will do the exact same thing i would do as town. is the answer the same as meji? great mind think alike, or i'm just copying from meji. [serious]it is optimistic for all scum to act exactly the same as they will as town. and i don't think scum should do stuff that scum would do. i would go for the scumtell and lynch the scum but not thinking in the WIFOM cycle.[/serious]

[tubby216]

see now we have a disscusion going, and thank you to meji who was paying attention you get a cookie.

vote: yernab

for trying to make us all swim in the deep end of the WIFOM pool.

[yernab]

Alright, alright - if my methods aren't productive, just let me know or propose a different topic of discussion. I was just trying to get some posting going, and as I've said this is my first game here - you'll have to bear with me if my posts seem a bit ham-handed. =P

However, Tubby: the last two votes for you are because of your lack of discussion while calling for discussion. Your latest post seems nothing more than a "oh, good job guys, I'll just vote based off of Meji's post without really saying anything".

Now, you could just be a concise writer, but you really haven't brought anything to the table yet. For instance, you obviously disagree with my post, but tell us why, or what parts strike you as scummy.

Still withholding my vote for now.

[WrathofShadows]

i apologize for not posting as of yet, my internet went down unexpectedly last night and this is the first i've been able to sign back on at all. Going to dinner right now, and i'll check these posts after

[tubby216]

Alright, alright - if my methods aren't productive, just let me know or propose a different topic of discussion. I was just trying to get some posting going, and as I've said this is my first game here - you'll have to bear with me if my posts seem a bit ham-handed. =P

However, Tubby: the last two votes for you are because of your lack of discussion while calling for discussion. Your latest post seems nothing more than a "oh, good job guys, I'll just vote based off of Meji's post without really saying anything".

Now, you could just be a concise writer, but you really haven't brought anything to the table yet. For instance, you obviously disagree with my post, but tell us why, or what parts strike you as scummy.

Still withholding my vote for now.

because thats how i roll. you will not see from me large posts full of texts, i my quote people but sooner or later you'll see what i am getting out. Its like making soup right now you all you see is the ingrediants and your like WFT? but soon you'll see it.

[yernab]

Pretty confident, then? =P

[tubby216]

confident, yes, cocky no.

i have about a 56% sucess rate with this method wich isn't the greatest but it will do.

[WrathofShadows]

so, then so far we have a discussion based upon the lack of a discussion.. interesting depending on the particular responses people give as this gets going.
I did put up two posts on the replacements issue, yes, though i found them to be passing comments on my part. But people will see things others may not in any given situation, so I'm leaving that alone from here on.

I'm not one of those people with a penchant for random voting on some poor fool just to get a rise out of someone and hope for a slip, so i'll abstain from placing my vote for the time being.

As a final note, trust me Meji, i'm fully aware of the scum-lurk scenario and am not pleased with having been put in that position like i was yesterday. But as long as my connection holds out i'll be checking/posting daily so i'm not really that worried at the moment

[Soyasushi]

So far, I have to say yernab continues to strike me as suspicious. He posts a long post about what he would do as scum but does the exact opposite, perhaps in hopes that it would throw suspicion off himself. After all, if someone were scum, he would be trying hard to do what his townie self would do. Your scum self and town self should have some sort of difference, but in yernab's case he showed them to be complete opposites, which strikes me as trying too hard to look town.

Then when attack, he got on the defensive, started using the "=P" smiley and went a bit omgus. Also, he's withholding his vote - because he's trying to see who he should vote for so as to not seem as suspicious?

I'm struggling between whether that's a newb town tell or a newb scum tell.

Doing a reread soon, then comparing the behaviours of everyone.

RVS looks over, then.

[Meji Fan]

Ill admit, your still not convincing me tubby, it doesnt feel very helpful. I am still thinking tubby here

As for yernab, I was okay with his whacky WIFOM scenario to stir up discussion (look, theres discussion). The game I was in that just finished the (in this instance town) IC started off with 'Okay everyone, make a case on me' (which I found very suspicious and am dubious about . . . but basically, Im not quite going to say weird quasi icebreaker gimmicks to get things rolling are a true scumtell)

I like Soyasushi's posts, seem pretty pro town scum hunting, are smilies really a scumtell though?

WrathofShadows - Its not a huge deal to me, but it is something I noted upon reading yernab's comments

And now we definitely need to hear something from david and Zach

[Zachrulez]

Ah yes, sorry about not posting yet - things have been rather busy for me over the weekend, but it should be smooth sailing from here.

I'm admittedly new to this game, save for a few games IRL a loooooong ago and more recently in IRC, but I still haven't quite gotten the hang of the first day of play. I mean, really, am I supposed to make a sound judgement on who's scum from a page of one-line replies? The thing to do on the first day, at least judging from the other games on this fine forum that I've been reading, is to stimulate discussion, try and get a good conversation going, and see if we can't get the scum to at least drop a small tell. Obviously randomly lynching someone is sub-optimal, and as david-villa-7 noted above me, the time for random voting is over.

So, in the interest of stimulating discussion, I'd like to ask a question that I'd always wanted to ask on the first day, but I never see it done.

If you were scum, who would you vote for?

I think it's a decent question because it adds an additional layer of subtext, and for scum it may prove somewhat more difficult to navigate. Now, if I were scum, with the limited information I currently have, I'd most likely vote for the most vocal person, so long as it doesn't put them at L-2 or higher - got to avoid suspicion, you know. The fact that the most vocal person has already voted for me cements it: I would probably vote for Soyasushi.

Now in reality, I would probably vote for one of the guys that haven't posted yet. People who don't post are generally below the radar of the lynching mob, at least on day one, and they may be trying to lay low until someone calls them out on their lurking. WrathofShadows, for instance, is someone I would conceivably vote for. However, I'm going to withhold my vote for now, as it's entirely possible he's just had a busy weekend, not unlike myself. =P

Anyway, c'mon - let's get talking and see if we can't dig up something.

Well this post is just odd. It's going to be interesting analyzing your voting patterns as the day goes forward I reckon.

[Soyasushi]

@Meji: Smileys to me often appear to be some form of appeared friendliness. The fact that he only put those smileys after being attacked seemed to be "I'll be friendly so you'll stop voting for me please".

[manho]

starting the discussion is always pro-town. the smileys thing is really interesting and need more reseach.

[WrathofShadows]

i have to agree with soyasushi in that a person's behavior will alter between being a town and being mafia, though the separation would be different between people.
The "If i were mafia" comment always seems bad to me since that will ALWAYS catch someone's attention in the worst way possible.

As for manho's comment, starting a discussion tends to be pro-town whether or not the person doing so is, but that's skirting on WIFOM so there really isn't much point elaborating on that subject.

Meji-I realize it did make me look kinda bad that i'd not posted up to that point (explained in my previous), and i do aplogize for the way i responded, i could have been more diplomatic than i was and i'm sure you aren't the only one to take a closer look after it was brought up.

[WrathofShadows]

I also want to mention that i only have time for one, MAYBE two posts per day as i do have classes to attend apart from this

[Soyasushi]

@WrathofShadows: I have them, too. In fact, I am currently posting this during the break time between classes.

[hohum]

crazypianist1116 replaces lrd

[crazypianist1116]

Confirm, reading.

[Meji Fan]

Okay, this is the first time Ive seen smilies be the topic of discussion. Looking back through (and at the aforementioned smilies), I note that yernab's 'alright, alright, I back down' post came after 3 posts. Mine, manho's and tubby's. Right after tubby in fact

My post and manho's werent particularly critical of his approach at all, tubby's was (and tubby voted for him), this was only the 2nd vote on him (and I cant credit Soyasuhi's 'post already' vote as that scary), so, it does seem he abandoned his idea pretty quick

And most importantly, hiya crazypianist1116, nice to see you again

[Zachrulez]

Welcome to the game Crazypianist!

[crazypianist1116]

Hi Meji. Nice to see you too. Too bad you died so soon in 807. I was disappointed by the end of it.

FoS: Zachrulez

Putting Meji at L-2 was suspicious specifically

Bandwagoning for the sake of bandwagoning.

His next post also just seems like he is jumping on other people's ideas.

I'll post more tomorrow. Night.

[Zachrulez]

Any better ideas for what to do that early in day 1?

What's suspicious about an early bandwagon in RVS? I have found it can be a good way to trigger discussion as it tends to get exactly the kind of reaction you gave to it.

Yernab's post 50 is basically him trying to say what he would and wouldn't do as town vs scum. Those kind of posts aren't good for discussion cause of all the WIFOM involved.

Besides, you can't really know what you would do as scum until you are scum, and if you are scum, there's no way you're going to answer that question without trying to mislead the town anyway.

[Soyasushi]

Any idea whether creating scumlists are good for discussion or not?