Mini 954 ~ Mafia at the 11th Hour (Game Over!)

[Jahudo]

I think Nikanor is making too big of an issue over Percy taking ~10 hours to make his second post. Percy didn't have to be prodded again, and he gave a reason that sounded reasonable. Besides, the pace and content-level of this game should not be daunting to scum. Nikanor, do your examples include games under similar circumstances to this?

I don't see how Seraphim came to the conclusion that Tony has a power that unlocks at L-1, or that Porkens would want the wagon to stop at L-1. Why was that the only theory about Porkens' vote?

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@Pomegranate:

But maybe this is just me being particular about things.

Particular about what?
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@dramonic:

I find it silly I'm gaining votes for that pair of comment. 'Twas just intended in good humour

Was it just about humor? Was post 80 responding to a specific sentence in Tony's post? Were you only speaking for yourself?

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d3x has stayed pretty active, but has made next to no content besides unassuming questions that try to get reads out of other people. Pair that with him not giving any reads on other players, and he looks like scum playing to the pace of the game rather than town trying to get the scumhunting started. He's my top suspect.

unvote;
Vote: d3x

[Pomegranate]

I mainly don't like this because generally, one views everyone as town, then suspects as scum, not everyone as scum, and those who redeem themselves as town.

Going to have to disagree with you here. Everyone else has a better chance of being scum than I do, so I try to see everyone as scum unless I have been given reason not to. Guilty until proven innocent.

But the way I see it is that everyone specifically has a larger chance of being town than scum.

@Pomegranate:

But maybe this is just me being particular about things.

Particular about what?

Insignificant things. What dramonic did was suspicious to me, but I see how how it wasn't really meant to be serious. But I still get bad vibes from it.

[VP Baltar]

While I don't agree with Pom's methods, I am bothered by dramonic so I don't have too much of a problem with her vote. I do think dram could have been trying to test the bouyancy of the TM wagon without serious committment.

Yes. What Percy did is exactly what I have a tendency toward doing as scum: posting "Oh, I'll catch up!" and then not actually catching up until I get prodded again. If you want, I could give about five or six examples where I do this as scum.

What is your experience with Percy? Have you played with him as town before?

I think DDD's "vote for TM, maybe he'll get abilities!" took all the pressure out of the wagon, and Porkens jumped on for no other reason than the one DDD proposed. I think it was a scummy move (and a poor reason to put anyone at L-1).

So do you prescribe to the school that Porkens was trying to give TM a power and then take him out?

DDD, how serious IS your TM vote? Still like him now that the wagon's been deflated?

I think Nikanor is making too big of an issue over Percy taking ~10 hours to make his second post.

Agreed.

[Vi]

Vote Count Vi:

- A Vote Count For The Mod
:arrow: TonyMontana (L-5) ~ Debonair Danny DiPietro,

Jahudo,

VP Baltar
:arrow: Nikanor (L-5) ~ dramonic, d3x
:arrow: dramonic (L-5) ~ Porkens, Pomegranate
:arrow: Porkens (L-5) ~ Seraphim, Percy
Debonair Danny DiPietro (L-6) ~ TonyMontana
Jahudo (L-6) ~ Maemuki
Seraphim (L-6) ~ Nikanor
d3x (L-6) ~ Jahudo

Percy (L-7) ~

Nikanor

VP Baltar (L-7) ~

Percy

Minimum (L-7)

[size=0]Mae 1[/size]

-Maemuki was prodded earlier today...

---Do you like the arrows for the leading wagons? Or the red text?

Battery Power:

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(57%)

[Debonair Danny DiPietro]

DDD, how serious IS your TM vote? Still like him now that the wagon's been deflated?

Tony's done nothing other than whine about being the wagon of choice instead of doing anything productive. And frankly I'm surprised how quick that wagon seemed to deflate, I know it wasn't particularly pushed for any real reason, but I'm not seeing these other votes being for fantastic reasons or any reason not to pressure Tony. I'm not going to pretend like Tony is caught scum, but given everything so far I'm comfortable with my vote.

[VP Baltar]

I prefer red text for leading wagon.

[d3x]

d3x has stayed pretty active

Meh. I'm actually not very happy with my activity levels as of late. I blame work and RL. Over 1/2 of my posts were in a single bout of me being online.

has made next to no content besides unassuming questions that try to get reads out of other people

Fair. Most of my activity has been in the waning RVS. The next part I take exception to, though.

Pair that with him not giving any reads on other players

If I'm asking questions in order to get reads, how exactly would I be expected to have the reads I'm looking for? This doesn't make much sense to me.

he looks like scum playing to the pace of the game rather than town trying to get the scumhunting started

I can definitely see where you're coming from here, though. I'll be getting you those reads+content in short order...

Nik

I like Nik for early Scum in this game. I find it funny that my Random Vote has been sitting on him and I'm reading him in this light. It may be that I'm just predisposed to him coming off scummy to me, but who knows.

To start with, he's come after VP {p26} and Percy {p60} for activity issues which I find ridiculous. Nik overlooked multiple people {myself included} when he went after VP at the top of page 2 for what I'm assuming would be active lurking. Ironic, eh VP?

VP Baltar, why are you posting in other games but not posting in this one?

This does not feel like RVS joking to me, it feels legit. Couple that with the fact that he backs up the position in p48 {he calls it both evidence and a lead} and we're heading down to UnHappy town. He also skips past his reasoning for ignoring the other lurkers {not so subtley from you in p29 and again in p41 just in case he missed it the first time around}.

Then there's the 'serious' Vote on Percy in p60. I don't like this one bit. Percy said that he was reading. Length of the thread not-withstanding, I don't see why this behavior would warrant a Vote. The explanation doesn't sit right with me.

The next thing that raises my hackles is in p97. I noticed a question or two about this, but I think it demands much more attention.

What Percy did is exactly what I have a tendency toward doing as scum: posting "Oh, I'll catch up!" and then not actually catching up until I get prodded again. If you want, I could give about five or six examples where I do this as scum.

He's not saying that these are things ScumPercy does, he's saying that these are things that

ScumNik

does. He is using his own meta to come after another player for really shaky reasons. Afterall, I could provide the same amount of examples of TownNik doing this behavior {saying "i'll catch up" and then dissappearing until a prod is sent}.

With the slightest bit of pressure, he backs down from this lurker hunt just like he did before. He then goes after Seraphim for meh reasons, imo.

tl;dr?
I still like Awesome Wagon.

I'm going to spare you guys any more wall posting by saying that I'll be giving my other reads soon. I promise they won't be as massive, but in short; DDD, dram, and pork are currently on my radar.

[Pomegranate]

I do think dram could have been trying to test the bouyancy of the TM wagon without serious committment.

I hate it when it takes me a whole paragraph to explain a thought and I'm still unsatisfied with it, and then someone else nails it in one concise sentence.

[d3x]

@DDD- What don't you like/not buy into about the other Votes?

@dram- Why is your Nik Vote serious? At what point did it become serious?

[Percy]

Yes. What Percy did is exactly what I have a tendency toward doing as scum: posting "Oh, I'll catch up!" and then not actually catching up until I get prodded again. If you want, I could give about five or six examples where I do this as scum.

I welcome you to search my meta for a single example of this kind of behaviour from me (hint: there isn't one). My activity is pretty constant in every game I play; one post every one (or at worst two) days, or I announce my V/LA.

I don't see how Seraphim came to the conclusion that Tony has a power that unlocks at L-1, or that Porkens would want the wagon to stop at L-1.

I presume speculation along these lines comes from reading the mod notes from the sample PM in the OP.

But the way I see it is that everyone specifically has a larger chance of being town than scum.

Sure, you're

mathematically

correct, but I play best when I assume the worst in everyone

So do you prescribe to the school that Porkens was trying to give TM a power and then take him out?

I'll let Porkens answer that first (to avoid the "oh I wasn't doing [what Percy said], I was doing [some other excuse]!" crap), but that is a possible scum angle I'm working with.

DDD, how serious IS your TM vote? Still like him now that the wagon's been deflated?

I'd like to emphasize that I think DDD himself (intentionally or otherwise) deflated the wagon by making it about mechanics rather than scumhunting.

Good points from d3x on Nikanor. I think it boils down to "more concerned about posting rather than posts", and his case on Seraphim is all spin.

@Mod

: Red text ftw.

[VP Baltar]

Hey Percy, let's go back to the Awesome Wagon.

Unvote, Vote: Nikanor

[Percy]

I will probably join you on your Awesome Wagon, but I want Porkens to account for his vote first.

[TonyMontana]

Tony's done nothing other than whine about being the wagon of choice instead of doing anything productive.

To characterize my comments on my wagon as "whining" is just vilifying me needlessly. What, I wasn't gonna comment on the fact that I were put at L-3 before even joining the game? Or that I'm pushed to L-2 with a majority of the votes being RVS, and two votes having "give tony powers" as reasoning.

I'd say there is much information to gain from my wagon, the most crucial of which is how you blatantly try to ride your "diceroll" to my grave.

And frankly I'm surprised how quick that wagon seemed to deflate, I know it wasn't particularly pushed for any real reason, but I'm not seeing these other votes being for fantastic reasons or any reason not to pressure Tony.

I'm rather surprised of how quick it inflated. It deflated cause a majority of the votes were baseless. And unlike you, they didn't insist on trying to justify their vote.

I'm not going to pretend like Tony is caught scum, but given everything so far I'm comfortable with my vote.

The feeling's mutual. Except I actually believe I'm voting for scum.

---Do you like the arrows for the leading wagons? Or the red text?

I'd like both -.-

[Jahudo]

My Tony vote was random the whole time, so the deflation of the wagon made sense to me.

Pair that with him not giving any reads on other players

If I'm asking questions in order to get reads, how exactly would I be expected to have the reads I'm looking for? This doesn't make much sense to me.

Your questions to Nik and Seraphim were fine, it was most of your questions to TonyMontana that I found questionable. You ask him how he feels about dramonic, and if anyone looks like scum on Tony's wagon, before you say how you feel about dramonic, or if you think anyone on Tony's wagon look scummy. This kind of questioning could allow you to hold back your own suspicions until you know what is the popular choice, rather than what is the choice you believe in.

But you are explaining your Nik suspicion now, so that's good. Do you really have examples of Nikanor needs prods as town?

[Porkens]

Which one?

[dramonic]

My vote became serious when he became opportunistic scum
post 80 was in response to the last line of 79, although I didnt mean it in a "Not X, therefore Y" way, hence the followup later. Why so serious?

[d3x]

Nik and I have played 3 previous games together.

As Town, he netted a prod in our first game together here.

In the 2nd, due in large part to Mod fail he didn't receive any prods, but his attendance/contributions as our only confirmed Townie was very detrimental starting D3

...and in the most recent, he was prodded until replaced as Scum starting here.

Given the third is ScumNik, but the point stands. If you'd like a full pic, read the 2nd link. It seriously hurt the Town, but we managed on pulling out the W {disclaimer- not my finest ScumHunting hour }.

Also of note in that 2nd link is the fact that this exact situation played out. There were multiple promises of posts and then days would slip by before we heard from him again. Had the Mod been in attendance, prods would've been sent.

[Debonair Danny DiPietro]

@DDD- What don't you like/not buy into about the other Votes?

The other votes were on Porkens who was doing exactly what I was agitating for and dramonic who I generally think uncomplimentary things about and am not sure he's operating outside his usual MO.

[Jahudo]

Also of note in that 2nd link is the fact that this exact situation played out. There were multiple promises of posts and then days would slip by before we heard from him again. Had the Mod been in attendance, prods would've been sent.

Interesting. It looks like Nikanor is misleading the town here:

What Percy did is exactly what I have a tendency toward doing as scum: posting "Oh, I'll catch up!" and then not actually catching up until I get prodded again. If you want, I could give about five or six examples where I do this as scum.

Make room on the awesome wagon!

unvote;
Vote: Nikanor

[Vi]

Vote Count VII:

- Paint It Red

Nikanor (L-3) ~ dramonic, d3x, VP Baltar, Jahudo

dramonic (L-5) ~ Porkens, Pomegranate
Porkens (L-5) ~ Seraphim, Percy
TonyMontana (L-6) ~ Debonair Danny DiPietro,

VP Baltar

Debonair Danny DiPietro (L-6) ~ TonyMontana
Jahudo (L-6) ~ Maemuki
Seraphim (L-6) ~ Nikanor

d3x (L-7) ~

Jahudo

Minimum (L-7)

[size=0]Mae 2[/size]

-Maemuki is being replaced. Please hold...

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(51%)

[Porkens]

I really did want to give Tony his power, but that was before dramonic danced on the fence and thereby put his neck out.

[Pomegranate]

I really did want to give Tony his power, but that was before dramonic danced on the fence and thereby put his neck out.

Why did you assume that he'd get it at L-1? It was an example given by Vi, but it's unlikey that everyonegets it at L-1.

[Pomegranate]

One more thing: Didn't Vi say that it's possible to receive after death? Why did you assume that he'd hget it at L-1?

[d3x]

@Pom and Pork- Thoughts on AwesomeWagon?

@All-

2. One Last Shot. Each player has an ability related to a desperate attempt to change their fortune. They are not necessarily unique. At least some of them were assigned independently of alignments.

Giving people last ditch effort abilities =/= giving Townies last ditch effort abilities. Considering

everyone

has one, I don't think we should be focusing on them, nor should we be seeking them out specifically.

[Vi]

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Gammagooey replaces Maemuki. Welcome him!

(or else)

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