Open 241: Emotional Breakdown! (Over)

[Kaiveran]

1) Or masons could be doing the smart thing and waiting to CC. Just sayin

Not if Myst is lying. I hate repeating myself, but since you seem to have trouble understanding me, let me go into detail. If Myst is scum, and Masons counterclaim now,

we have a 100% sure scum lynch on the first freakin' day!

That's an impressive statistic if I ever saw one. Of course, if Myst is vanilla, that's an assured

town

lynch, but I doubt Myst is that stupid, and even if he is, the three-mason advantage is maintained as long there are no more masons killed. As far as I'm concerned, it's now or never for a Mason claim. There's three masons and the teams of scum only number two. Translation: Any scum team that stood against the real Masons at this point would be summarily disposed of. Therefore, Myst is likely a Mason. This is where the folly of your idea comes in. In light of the aforementioned, scum are likely to kill Myst at night, leaving only two masons the next day. If masons claim then, their numbers will match any scum counterclaim, resulting in a 1-vs.-1 stalemate. You might find comfort in the fact that we get at least

some

good suspects out of this and can improve our odds with the regular discussions, but the scum can alternatively pull the rug out from under us, and leave the mason claim alone. These two standout claimers would have no counter evidence, and now that their numbers match neatly with the scum, could be any one of Masons, Scum A, or Scum B. Since it is more likely that these two are scum of some sort, the town might be inclined to lynch the masons, resulting in a situation many Mafia players term as "very bad." If two masons are killed tonight, then we have only one lone mason, who subsequently becomes useless. Same thing if it's mason and scum kill tonight: we don't gain any advantages. IDo you understand now?

I can't see how your idea could be better, so please elaborate.

2) Funny. I do recall changing my vote before he said anything about tunneling.

But if I'm wrong, you can always let me know

. Also, yeah, it was scummy because you used the same terms, made the same basic reasons for eventually voting, and then voted for the same person.

Gladly. Just because nobody

said

that you were tunneling on Myst until recently doesn't change the fact that you

were

tunneling. You exhibited the behavior then, he points it out now; a rather simple relationship, really. And about my reasoning being similar to Myst's and voting for the same person; people

can

do that, you know. It's called "agreeing". This game wouldn't get very far without agreement...

don't you agree?

*rimshot*

3) That whole thing is a steaming pile of WIFOM.

And now

you're

repeating yourself in order to evade my question. You already said that my idea was WIFOM-y. I went over it and asked

how

it was WIFOM-y. So far, you haven't answered my question.

4) Uhm... ok?

I knew you'd understand ^_^

5) Starting with that first actual sentence, the answer is yes thank you, very well. But I think you have your idea of time screwed, because again you are going crazy about something that happened later in the game. In this case the post I'm responding to right now. Look at point one my quoting of your post. Interesting, isn't it?

Huh? Me going crazy? Time screw? Either this has some really profound, deeper meaning that my internet-addled mind is missing, or you're just padding your post with pseudo-sensical fluff to make your case look stronger. In any case, what time suspicious behavior occurs doesn't matter; what matters is that it's

suspicious!

Crazy eh?

6) Ironically, very little of my case on you had anything to do with you voting me. It was partly buddying up and partly blowing out of proportion and now even misreping things (although you could have done that before, I'd have to go check) I just don't like how you seem to be trying to ride on the tail of someone else's case.

Uh, you might want to read that sentence again, buddy:

"This is one of the few times where

I

can employ the term "OMGUS" literally."

I. As in

I

am the one invoking OMGUS as

I

voted for you after you voted me.

I

am of the opinion that "Oh my God, you suck!" and

I

geniunely think you are worthy of a vote.

So yeah, i'm pretty sure my vote is in a good spot right now

I DON'T THINK SO.

[Xite91]

1) I can't see how your idea could be better, so please elaborate.

2) Gladly. Just because nobody

said

that you were tunneling on Myst until recently doesn't change the fact that you

were

tunneling. You exhibited the behavior then, he points it out now; a rather simple relationship, really. And about my reasoning being similar to Myst's and voting for the same person; people

can

do that, you know. It's called "agreeing". This game wouldn't get very far without agreement...

don't you agree?

*rimshot*

3) That whole thing is a steaming pile of WIFOM.

And now

you're

repeating yourself in order to evade my question. You already said that my idea was WIFOM-y. I went over it and asked

how

it was WIFOM-y. So far, you haven't answered my question.

5) Starting with that first actual sentence, the answer is yes thank you, very well. But I think you have your idea of time screwed, because again you are going crazy about something that happened later in the game. In this case the post I'm responding to right now. Look at point one my quoting of your post. Interesting, isn't it?

Huh? Me going crazy? Time screw? Either this has some really profound, deeper meaning that my internet-addled mind is missing, or you're just padding your post with pseudo-sensical fluff to make your case look stronger. In any case, what time suspicious behavior occurs doesn't matter; what matters is that it's

suspicious!

Crazy eh?

1) Simple, if they wait until tomorrow, If he's not actually a mason, masons should wait to CC because
He runs the possibility of being NK'd tonight, so if he's VT or scum, it's better than loosing a PR whoohoo cross-kills
Tomorrow an actual mason could claim, whether myst is NK'd or not, one of them will prolly get lynched, if they're not the scum, then we lynch the other one the next day which will more likely be scum, a pretty good trade off, especially considering we have a chance of scum cross-killing at night.
As long as there's one mason left, we still have a chance of catching scum with CC's.
Satisfied?

2) But I really wasn't tunneling before then either. Besides, since when did tunneling become a scumtrait?

3) I don't know how to explain it? Its a big guess on how scum/town would act. That's what I consider WIFOM. I know there's a more literal term for it, but I really can't be bothered to remember it, especially when WIFOM is so close to it anyways.

5) But, and correct me if I'm wrong on this, you were calling it out because you had "already resolved it," right? But you didn't actually resolve it until

after

I made that post, so it's invalid.

6) Oh, ok makes sense

[andrew94]

we should start looking at the people on the wagon now, esp those that jumped on with NOT good reasoning

[drmyshottyizsik]

Unvote
Vote: Xite

[dramonic]

Votecount 4: Can't you feel the loooove tonight?

Xite (5): Mysterio, nopointinactingup, AGar, Kaiveran, drmyshottyizsik
andrew94 (1): bv310
Kaiveran (1): Xite
bv310 (1): SotSSS

Not voting (4): a2rudeboy, andrew94, don_johnson, ConfidAnon

With 12 alive it takes 7 to lynch!

Deadline is the 27th

[Mysterio]

Xite is imploding. The fact is scum will not try to counterclaim because neither scum team has the numbers, period. If they did try to counterclaim, my real partners will chime in and we would have two scum handed to us on a silver platter. If instead scum stay quiet and I am night killed, you will still have two Masons collaborating and possibly dead scum if Xite gets lynched. That's a 1-to-1 trade off which is always bad for scum.

However, I disagree with Kai in that my partners should NOT claim unless I'm counterclaimed, even if I'm about to be lynched. Although, with Xite making himself look scummier by the day, that seems unlikely. Having all three of us claim would certainly clear three players and make us more likely to be town than anyone else, it would also give both scum teams clear targets. With two killing parties, two Masons could get wiped out in a single night. Hence why I've only been pushing for Xite to be lynched because of him incredibly scummy reaction to my claim. Anyone pushing for my partners to claim without me being counterclaimed either isn't thinking things through or is rolefishing.

[Xite91]

Xite is imploding. The fact is scum will not try to counterclaim because neither scum team has the numbers, period. If they did try to counterclaim, my real partners will chime in and we would have two scum handed to us on a silver platter. If instead scum stay quiet and I am night killed, you will still have two Masons collaborating and possibly dead scum if Xite gets lynched. That's a 1-to-1 trade off which is always bad for scum.

However, I disagree with Kai in that my partners should NOT claim unless I'm counterclaimed, even if I'm about to be lynched. Although, with Xite making himself look scummier by the day, that seems unlikely. Having all three of us claim would certainly clear three players and make us more likely to be town than anyone else, it would also give both scum teams clear targets. With two killing parties, two Masons could get wiped out in a single night. Hence why I've only been pushing for Xite to be lynched because of him incredibly scummy reaction to my claim. Anyone pushing for my partners to claim without me being counterclaimed either isn't thinking things through or is rolefishing.

Funny thing is I'm still unsure about how my reaction was scummy. You pointed out "what" was and beat around the bush plenty, but what about it IS scummy?

@Everyone else voting for me ESPECIALLY Shotty

Where's the case that comes with it? Kai kind of gave one, but what about everyone else? It looks like reasonless voting to me. And if you look at nopoint, he even says it was partly an OMGUS reason based on a joke I made about modkills.

[andrew94]

who else do you think slipped mysteriou?

[nopointinactingup]

Ok, first point has no real reason, just an easy to jump on a wagon.
Second, wow. Just wow. Lets just forget for a second that that was a joke and think... If I was really pushing for a modkill there, what would be my reasoning? Did you break any rules that would result in a MK? Did you break any rules in general?

No it's real alright. I'm coming for you >:). But the 2nd reason was obviously a joke

Myst is obviously mason. Anyone trying to explain why he's likely a mason are scummy.
Andrew is likely Xite's buddy though.

[Xite91]

Ok, first point has no real reason, just an easy to jump on a wagon.
Second, wow. Just wow. Lets just forget for a second that that was a joke and think... If I was really pushing for a modkill there, what would be my reasoning? Did you break any rules that would result in a MK? Did you break any rules in general?

No it's real alright. I'm coming for you >:). But the 2nd reason was obviously a joke

Myst is obviously mason. Anyone trying to explain why he's likely a mason are scummy.
Andrew is likely Xite's buddy though.

Wait what?
First off I'm pretty sure I didn't try to explain why he was a mason (and if that's your reason, what about the people that did?)
Second, how is that scummy anyways?

[andrew94]

im his buddy? ur more likely the scum sucking up the the claiemd mason trying to make urself look good

[Xite91]

im his buddy? ur more likely the scum sucking up the the claiemd mason trying to make urself look good

Sorry, this has nothing to do with the game, but PLEASE do me a favor and look up grammar. Spelling might help too.

[Mysterio]

Funny thing is I'm still unsure about how my reaction was scummy. You pointed out "what" was and beat around the bush plenty, but what about it IS scummy?

I'm not going to rehash all of this discussion. I will note that you have really backed off now that you've got a few votes on you. Why? Earlier you were quick to break apart posts and overreact, but your "demeanor" has very quickly changed to a more quiet defensive state. This looks to me like you know exactly what makes you look scummy, and so you're changing your playstyle in order to not stand out as much.

who else do you think slipped mysteriou?

At this point, the only one who looks suspicious enough to warrant a vote is Xite. I would put some of the spotlight on Kai, who was very quick to defend me, and his reasoning about my partners claiming is way off. Also, smashbro has posted in other games, but hasn't posted in this game since voting for bv310 in post #101. I'd like to know what he thinks about Xite's play.

[Xite91]

Funny thing is I'm still unsure about how my reaction was scummy. You pointed out "what" was and beat around the bush plenty, but what about it IS scummy?

I'm not going to rehash all of this discussion. I will note that you have really backed off now that you've got a few votes on you. Why? Earlier you were quick to break apart posts and overreact, but your "demeanor" has very quickly changed to a more quiet defensive state. This looks to me like you know exactly what makes you look scummy, and so you're changing your playstyle in order to not stand out as much.

who else do you think slipped mysteriou?

At this point, the only one who looks suspicious enough to warrant a vote is Xite. I would put some of the spotlight on Kai, who was very quick to defend me, and his reasoning about my partners claiming is way off. Also, smashbro has posted in other games, but hasn't posted in this game since voting for bv310 in post #101. I'd like to know what he thinks

about Xite's play.

Or, I could have lost a lot of my extra time by getting some terrible news and trying to cope with it as well as trying to get a job, looking for a new apartment, hospital visits, and trying to sort things out with a bunch of stupid people? Maybe I haven't been doing so much because of that, just maybe.

Bolded. I love isolation like this, why didn't you say about the game in general, or do you prefer everyone tunneling me and forgetting about the rest of the game?

[andrew94]

how is my grammer bad?
im just saying nocuptin is just buddying up to mysteriou

[Mysterio]

Or, I could have lost a lot of my extra time by getting some terrible news and trying to cope with it as well as trying to get a job, looking for a new apartment, hospital visits, and trying to sort things out with a bunch of stupid people? Maybe I haven't been doing so much because of that, just maybe.

Appeal to emotion. You act as if my question about your changing playstyle was unwarranted, and then you go off on some personal note that really has no place in this game. I also have to wonder why you're still here if all of this is true. Real life issues should come way before some silly forum game. I don't know if you're taking this personally, or if you're just using an appeal to emotion to try and get everyone off your back. I'm leaning toward the latter.

Bolded. I love isolation like this, why didn't you say about the game in general

Because the game in general is about you. You're at L-2 and have acted the scummiest by far. I'm interested in what Smashbro's read on you is since his last post.

@andrew What is your read on Xite? Do you or do you not find him scummy?

@nopoint What makes you think andrew is Xite's scumbuddy?

[Xite91]

1) Appeal to emotion. You act as if my question about your changing playstyle was unwarranted, and then you go off on some personal note that really has no place in this game. I also have to wonder why you're still here if all of this is true. Real life issues should come way before some silly forum game. I don't know if you're taking this personally, or if you're just using an appeal to emotion to try and get everyone off your back. I'm leaning toward the latter.

Bolded. I love isolation like this, why didn't you say about the game in general

2) Because the game in general is about you. You're at L-2 and have acted the scummiest by far. I'm interested in what Smashbro's read on you is since his last post.

3) @andrew What is your read on Xite? Do you or do you not find him scummy?

1) Nope, just thoroughly pissed off. I was giving you my reason for the random change in personality. Maybe this game is my release and therefore giving up on it at the very moment that it gets bad is kind of moot?

2) Orly? I thought it was about finding scum, winning, things like that? Since when did it become about me?
Also, still waiting on that reason for why it's scummy, not just from you but from everyone voting me.

3) The isolation like this that you're pulling is actually usually a scumtell because it makes you have to make a case less, but makes it easier for you to jump on those people if they dont make a case/make a poor case. That's the reason I said something about it before, and that's why I'm getting even more suspicious of you now.

[andrew94]

ur suspocious of an un cc-ed mason>?

[ConfidAnon]

Honestly, I think Myst and Xite are both Town. I don't know how much experience Mysterio has, but I think things went down a little like this: Mysterio wanted to get discussion moving in the game, so he claimed Mason. I don't see why he would claim Mason as anything other than Mason in this setup. He also wanted to gauge reactions. However . . . he didn't really know what he was looking for. I could see scum buddying up to the claim, fighting against the claim, ignoring the claim,

possibly

counterclaiming if they didn't think things through, or anything in between these actions. Mysterio was ready to find scum with reactions to the claim, so he took the first post saying anything remotely about it. Personally, I don't see anything particularly scumlike or townlike from Xite's response. When Mysterio pressured it, Xite got frustrated due to the fairly baseless attack on him, hence the exasperated, kind of flailing posts. The fact that a lot of people are jumping on Xite for barely anything makes me think there are scum on the wagon.

The wagon currently consists of: Mysterio, nopointinactingup, AGar, Kaiveran, drmyshottyizsik.

Mysterio I have no reason to believe is not the Mason he claims to be, so I don't think he is scum on the wagon.

drmyshottyizsik plays like a VI consistantly, so I'm not sure if this is scummy for him or not.

nopointinactingup strikes me as scummy, but not as much as the two players we have left.

Kaiveran's assault on Xite rubs me the wrong way. It is full of unwarranted AtE, and feels like scum overzealously jumping on the bandwagon. However, this could be reflective of personality/playstyle more so than alignment in this particular game.

Here, AGar earns my vote. Having played with AGar before (and been on the brunt of his attacks), his vote on Xite smells of a bandwagon. The reasoning for the vote is not as thought-out as I have seen his votes before, and the fact that he's now kind of lying low in this game (I know I have been too, haven't been able to bring myself to read the thread and make a post) after placing his vote on Xite bothers me.

Vote: AGar

[Kaiveran]

Yo, is anyone here? Seems like there's been a slump in activity. Well, here are my impressions on the rest of the cast:

bv310:

Displays some independent thought and commented on the strategy, but not very active. Probably due for a prod.

don_johnson

: A virtual non_entity (lurker?) with only 2 posts in the entire game. You shy or something?

a2rudeboy:

seemingly under attack by computer viruses, but should catch up soon as per his last post.

ConfidAnon:

Now to the good stuff. So far, you're in my good graces. You're not the most active, but you display a healthy amount of critical thinking, field an interesting viewpoint on the current conflict, and seem to really think through your analyses. Tell me something though; how do you feel my arguments against Xite use AtE excessively? I generally bring a lighthearted attitude and sense of humor to my playing, but try not to let that get in the way of relevant information. Sure, I made a few wisecracks, but apart from the "mistake forgiveness" bit, I don't see how I'm playing the AtE card.

AGar:

I don't know about you. I've been leaning towards the townie side, but ConfidAnon seems to have real problems with you based on your meta. Of course, I've been away for months and am playing with all new faces, so I don't have anything by the way of player data, and frankly, I'm too lazy right now to go looking anyone up. Metagaming never factored much into my playing anyway, but considering ConfidAnon's case and our earlier misunderstanding, it

miiiight

pay to keep an eye on you. Low suspicion.

drmyshottyissik(SP):

Strong lurker read on you. You should try actually contributing to the game. I know I'm stating the obvious, but a player that has little to contribute but bandwagon voting always rubs me the wrong way. Moderate suspicion.

nopointinactingup:

You're also striking me as a lurker. Even more so in that you only came out of your shell after you were threatened with a prod, indicating that you didn't have any problem keeping track of the game. Of course, you actually gave reasoning behind your vote for Xite (although not completely original), and explained your inactivity. Low suspicion.

andrew94:

Not very active, but you stand out from the lurker collection for posting actual content: you didn't follow any one person, and looked ahead of the current conflict. Minimal suspicion; you look like an average townie.

Anyways, my vote is cast and no more discussion threads have popped up. Maybe this will give you something to mull over.

[bv310]

Sorry about the falling off the grid. I've been concentrating on my modding game.

Anyway, I've caught up now, and I'd like to

Vote: xite91

His reactions to Mysterio's claim seem to alternate between disbelief and fervent protection of other masons. His reaction feels forced.

[Xite91]

Of course it does
I would really like people to look at the people on this wagon, either now or when I'm dead, whatever (preferably now). There is definitely scum on it.
I still have yet to get a post on What is scummy about my posts and How they are, just that they are and the reaction feels forced. Which could easily be attributed to the fact that my initial reaction was genuine concern for outing PR's and the rest was frustration for having a terrible case that has barely been described pushed against me, and then everyone tunneling me excessively (seriously, has there even been any other cases made on ANYONE?). Just sayin.

[andrew94]

Sorry about the falling off the grid. I've been concentrating on my modding game.

Anyway, I've caught up now, and I'd like to

Vote: xite91

His reactions to Mysterio's claim seem to alternate between disbelief and fervent protection of other masons. His reaction feels forced.

pro reasoning

[Xite91]

I really hope that's sarcasm andrew.

[andrew94]

it is how did you know