Mini 1046 - Murder in the Desert (Game Over!)

[Cogito Ergo Sum]

Nothing else to say CES?

Not at this point in time, no.

[Nicodemus]

Vote Count 1.02

Parama

(2): Slaxx, Cogito Ergo Sum

boberz

(2): xvart, DemonHybrid

Xine

(1): WeaponsofMassConstruction

Slaxx

(1): boberz

xvart

(1): Oso

Not Voting:

Bub Bidderskins, charter, Lowell, Parama, Xine

7

to lynch.

Deadline for D1 can be found here

[DemonHybrid]

I see it as asking you for a vote so that he could comment on it and try to end RVS faster. Which he did.

He ended RVS? I am taking credit for it.

A vote was always coming in my next post. You really do need to look at one of my past games.

I see it as asking you for a vote so that he could comment on it and try to end RVS faster. Which he did.

No, he tried to end RVS faster. Like I said: RVS ends at different times for different people.

[Lowell]

vote parama

[boberz]

No, he tried to end RVS faster. Like I said: RVS ends at different times for different people

We interpreted it differently clearly.

[boberz]

Nothing more to say Lowell, you are not short of content.

[Parama]

CES and Lowell are both bitter over the last games I played with them, hehe.
I'm still trying to figure out if Demon realizes that he's turning even the minutest of details into scumtells. You start out with decent points but inevitably you're just making stuff up.
SLAXX I HOPE WE'RE ON THE SAME TEAM THIS TIME, LAST TWO GAMES WE HAVEN'T BEEN :<
Ooooh but boberz is definitely scum,

vote: boberz

[Parama]

But also because he had second thoughts and doubted himself. It is like he was too scared to ask me to vote in his first post, but then plucked up the courage. Scum have more reasons to be scared than town so I reckon Slaxx is the nearest we have to scum so far.

A nice proper serious vote for you slaxx.

This is something I'd only buy as RVS logic. And you're anti-RVS, as you said yourself.

RVS ends for different people at different times. I'm not ready to leave it yet. Things are starting to change.
Your vote: I'm not sure. It has a twist of randomness in it. Why do you think that Slaxx asking you to vote is encouraging RVS, however?
RVS wagons are the fastest way to leave RVS, not to find scum.

Unvote, Vote: boberz

This is not solid logic by any means.

Nothing else to say CES?

Hey, at least he isn't contradicting himself!

RVS ends for different people at different times.

It just shouldnt exist full stop. So I am not even having this discussion.

^this isn't a scumtell, it's just boberz being a boring person

Why do you think that Slaxx asking you to vote is encouraging RVS, however?

Becasue two random votes had just been laid down (including one from himself) so I just assumed he was encouraging a random vote.

You don't vote someone just because they like RVS and you don't. Otherwise your vote is an RVS vote and thus you are contradicting yourself. Oh look, there's that word again.

RVS wagons are the fastest way to leave RVS, not to find scum.

How about we just never enter it, shocking idea. And everything should be geared to finding scum. I have no objections to RVS wagons though.

"I am Anti-RVS"
"I am Pro-RVS"

This is what you just said, btw.

It just shouldnt exist full stop. So I am not even having this discussion.

But...it does.

??

You're trying too hard to look town. I like my vote and RVS is over for me.

No, this is a pointless preference discussion.

Becasue two random votes had just been laid down (including one from himself) so I just assumed he was encouraging a random vote.

Assuming makes an ass out of u and me.

So you're not saying it's scummy.

How about we just never enter it, shocking idea. And everything should be geared to finding scum. I have no objections to RVS wagons though.

You're contradicting yourself a bit. You want to never enter RVS, but have no objections to RVS wagons?

^this is good logic

Also, again, trying too hard to look town. I'm really liking my vote, so it stays.

*headdesk*
And you lost it again. Being anti-RVS does not make you look pro-town. It is not a tell at all.

Assuming makes an ass out of u and me

Perhaps, what do you think he meant?

Is that relevant, though?

You're contradicting yourself a bit. You want to never enter RVS, but have no objections to RVS wagons?

If there is RVS, then RVS wagons are good. I prefer not having RVS and having nice big juicy proper wagons.

So you'd gladly jump on an RVS wagon with no logic behind it, voting for no reason, even if you're against the RVS itself?

trying too hard to look town

No such thing.[/quote]
Yes, there is, but this is theory discussion plus the original accusation is BS.

But it doesnt have to.

Like 90% of the time, there is some form of RVS. You saying that you hate it that much that you'd rather see it completely gone instead of having a realistic view on RVS tells me that you're trying too hard to look town.

*headdesk* *headdesk*
Dear god this is going to be a long game.

Perhaps, what do you think he meant?

The opposite. Asking you to vote is actually promoting the

END

of RVS. Why did you think the opposite?

The only one who can confirm or deny this is Slaxx himself. You are also assuming here. Hypocrisy, anyone?

If there is RVS, then RVS wagons are good. I prefer not having RVS and having nice big juicy proper wagons.

I'm thinking you're trying to cover yourself. I will give you the benefit of the doubt here, however. Word things more carefully.

This is actually a contradiction from boberz, and you pass it off as nothing?

No such thing.

What?

Looking like town and -trying too hard- to look like town are two different things. And yes, you can try too hard to look town. That's why people say that certain statements or arguments seem forced.

^agree

Looking like town and -trying too hard- to look like town are two different things. And yes, you can try too hard to look town. That's why people say that certain statements or arguments seem forced.

Maybe... (enter a theory discussion here).... But there is no point in us discussing it. Needless to say I kind of disagree but not enough for it to matter.

This is not a theory discussion. Townies to do have to TRY to look town - if they play a good town game, they will be seen as town. Scum have to TRY to look town because they AREN'T town but need to be SEEN as town.

But essentially we should all be trying to look town. And being forced and trying too hard mean slightly different things to me, but if you are using them as synonyms then carry on I can deal with that.

No, we should all be trying to catch scum instead of focusing on looking town.

The opposite. Asking you to vote is actually promoting the END of RVS. Why did you think the opposite?

I still think he was asking me for a random vote, if you truly believe random votes are the way to stop RVS then we really need to go to MD. I do not believe he was asking me for a stretched forced real vote (what he got).

LET SLAXX ANSWER THIS FFS

I still think he was asking me for a random vote, if you truly believe random votes are the way to stop RVS then we really need to go to MD. I do not believe he was asking me for a stretched forced real vote (what he got).

I see it as asking you for a vote so that he could comment on it and try to end RVS faster. Which he did.

MY GOD.
Welcome to Assumefest 2010, where we both make different assumptions and then call each other out for having conflicting assumptions without knowing who is right!
And, *gasp*, it's irrelevant either way!

I see it as asking you for a vote so that he could comment on it and try to end RVS faster. Which he did.

He ended RVS? I am taking credit for it.

A vote was always coming in my next post. You really do need to look at one of my past games.

You didn't end RVS since your vote on Slaxx was an RVS vote with a bad excuse to try and make it not look like one.
Also, LOL META. That is all.

No, he tried to end RVS faster. Like I said: RVS ends at different times for different people

We interpreted it differently clearly.

This is why you let Slaxx answer it. He is, in fact, the manifestation of pure awesome, so...

Nothing more to say Lowell, you are not short of content.

It's his first post. You're expecting an essay? I mean, this is Lowell we're talking about!

Yeah scum you better watch out for me, I'mma own you good this game. No more Mini 984s where the scum dominate for 3 days and then get massacred the next 3 - this time you're all going down before Night 3 falls.

[Bub Bidderskins]

Hello all.

@Boberz: Was your vote on Slaxx random? If not, how could you make a serious vote after the person you voted for only posted twice?

Hmph, seems that RVS might be getting over with rather quickly. No matter.

VOTE: xvart

If his performance in our last game is any indication, RVS might be my only opportunity to vote him the entire game.

@Oso: Why would you want to get an opportunity to vote for him?

@DemonHybrid: You changed your vote within half an hour. I'm assuming that your first vote was a random vote. Was your second random? If not, what was it about the one post Boberz made between your two votes that convinced you to change your mind?

[boberz]

My vote on Slaxx wasnt random it was thought through, although granted he may not be scum.

I am aware that we were going in circles between me and demon that was the point I was making. That it was a difference of opinion rather than something scummy, from either side.

I did not contradict myself. i dont like the RVS, but when it exists RVS wagons exist. I am happy to jump on RVS wagons if I think it will stop the RVS. I will do anything to stop the RVS. It is the most senseless part of the whole of RVS. It is not exactly a position I just invented for this game, I have thought through it quite a lot, I am hardly likely to contradict myself in the same sentence. Come on. Wake up. Turn your brains on people.

Parama you complain at us for discussing theory, but I actually stopped talking about theory in a post you quoted then put your tuppenceworth in. Hypocrite.

I actually agreed with a lot of what you said however Parama.

It's his first post. You're expecting an essay? I mean, this is Lowell we're talking about!

Worth asking

---

No, we should all be trying to catch scum instead of focusing on looking town.

Yes sort of but this is theory that you told me not to talk about. You then used it to sling mud at me.

---

You don't vote someone just because they like RVS and you don't. Otherwise your vote is an RVS vote and thus you are contradicting yourself. Oh look, there's that word again.

But I like voting remorselessly thoughtfully during RVS it screws with people's conventions. It wasnt a whim it was always gonna happen.

---

@Boberz: Was your vote on Slaxx random? If not, how could you make a serious vote after the person you voted for only posted twice?

It was not random (nobody's vote was random but that is beside the point) and IO can easily make a seious vote for somebody after two posts. That is double the number I normally require.

[Parama]

My vote on Slaxx wasnt random it was thought through, although granted he may not be scum.

Well, if you honestly believe your vote was serious...
It is founded in terrible logic. Please remove it.

I did not contradict myself. i dont like the RVS, but when it exists RVS wagons exist. I am happy to jump on RVS wagons if I think it will stop the RVS.

So you believe a bandwagon vote for the sake of bandwagoning is better than an RVS vote?

I will do anything to stop the RVS. It is the most senseless part of the whole of RVS. It is not exactly a position I just invented for this game, I have thought through it quite a lot, I am hardly likely to contradict myself in the same sentence. Come on. Wake up. Turn your brains on people.

Parama you complain at us for discussing theory, but I actually stopped talking about theory in a post you quoted then put your tuppenceworth in. Hypocrite.

Um, I have no clue what you're trying to say here or what you're referencing.

It's his first post. You're expecting an essay? I mean, this is Lowell we're talking about!

Worth asking

Not really.

No, we should all be trying to catch scum instead of focusing on looking town.

Yes sort of but this is theory that you told me not to talk about. You then used it to sling mud at me.

Uh, no. It's not theory. It's basic scumhunting. Scum have no motive to scumhunt. Townies have no motive to put effort into looking town.

You don't vote someone just because they like RVS and you don't. Otherwise your vote is an RVS vote and thus you are contradicting yourself. Oh look, there's that word again.

But I like voting remorselessly thoughtfully during RVS it screws with people's conventions. It wasnt a whim it was always gonna happen.

Your vote is either an RVS vote or you disagreeing with Slaxx about game theory. RVS happens, deal with it. If other people like RVS, there is no logical reason to attack them for it.

[boberz]

Parama wake up, I dont have time to post again, but think it through quickly.

[Bub Bidderskins]

@ Parama: In your massive post you agreed with some things DemonHybrid said and dismissed others as irrelevant. At this point, what do you think of Demon?

@Lowell: Was that a random vote, or you insulting our intelligence?

It's his first post. You're expecting an essay? I mean, this is Lowell we're talking about!

I LOLed at that for totally metagame reasons; I've got a friend in real life whose name is Lowell, and he is an aspiring writer who has actually won many essay contests .

[Bub Bidderskins]

It was not random (nobody's vote was random but that is beside the point) and IO can easily make a seious vote for somebody after two posts. That is double the number I normally require

So if it wasn't random, then what was your reason for voting Slaxx?

[Parama]

@ Parama: In your massive post you agreed with some things DemonHybrid said and dismissed others as irrelevant. At this point, what do you think of Demon?

I cannot read him. Hate to dismiss the issue completely but he ALWAYS turns everything into a scumtell, whether town or scum. He's null for now, as are most players in the game at this point.

[Bub Bidderskins]

@ Parama: In your massive post you agreed with some things DemonHybrid said and dismissed others as irrelevant. At this point, what do you think of Demon?

I cannot read him. Hate to dismiss the issue completely but he ALWAYS turns everything into a scumtell, whether town or scum. He's null for now, as are most players in the game at this point.

Yeah, It is kind of early to read anyone as scum or town yet, but from your post I couldn't tell if you thought he was scum or town.

[Cogito Ergo Sum]

I'm not bitter, Parama, and I will not stand for such calumny.

[Slaxx]

Slaxx gut says Budderskins is diplomatic mafia.

unvote

for now. Will follow up later.

[Slaxx]

Oh and it has nothing to do with my meta silly boberz, its just the way I talk. Its not how I play, just how I write.

[Oso]

..

Hmph, seems that RVS might be getting over with rather quickly. No matter.

VOTE: xvart

If his performance in our last game is any indication, RVS might be my only opportunity to vote him the entire game.

@Oso: Why would you want to get an opportunity to vote for him?
..

A bit of joking really. Last game we played together he managed to live until endgame as a claimed Doc in another Mini with another protective role already confirmed on the dead list. Actually pretty impressive in how town his play was (he was town as it turns out) and how he remained unlynched simply because of that, when anyone else in that game (me included) would have been lynched out of hand in his position as probably lying scum.

[Slaxx]

I RVS on people I can't read. Its kind of the point IMO.

I can never read Parama, he is a good player.

[Slaxx]

Also as I suspected Bibber has done a lot of prodding at other players but offered little of his own input and has yet to vote. So lets get this moving, then.

vote: bud bidderskins

[DemonHybrid]

This is not solid logic by any means.

My logic wasn't to support my vote. My vote was still random at that point.

No, this is a pointless preference discussion.

We'll agree to disagree here. I didn't like his specific assertion that he wants RVS completely gone; that's a given and stating the obvious doesn't look right to me.

So you're not saying it's scummy.

Well, I'd say it depends on the context. I wouldn't say it's a scumtell here, even though he's jumping the gun a bit, but his point is a bit misguided.

*headdesk*
And you lost it again. Being anti-RVS does not make you look pro-town. It is not a tell at all.

Being anti-RVS shows that you have a thirst for info. It isn't TOO big of a town tell, but to me, it reads as town. I just don't like it when it's stated so obviously.

The only one who can confirm or deny this is Slaxx himself. You are also assuming here. Hypocrisy, anyone?

I suppose this is a good point, however, probabilities point to my statement, especially with the way Slaxx responded to bob's vote.

This is actually a contradiction from boberz, and you pass it off as nothing?

Well...it's impossible to tell at this stage. It's too early to be calling definite contradictions, so PERHAPS he could have worded his post wrong and since it IS so early, I'm going to keep an eye on it but let it go for right now. I haven't forgotten and won't forget, but it's really not a big factor right now.

MY GOD.
Welcome to Assumefest 2010, where we both make different assumptions and then call each other out for having conflicting assumptions without knowing who is right!
And, *gasp*, it's irrelevant either way!

See bolded. I apologize.

@DemonHybrid: You changed your vote within half an hour. I'm assuming that your first vote was a random vote. Was your second random? If not, what was it about the one post Boberz made between your two votes that convinced you to change your mind?

Yes, my first vote was random. My second vote was random too, but decided to stick with it after his reply to my vote post.

I cannot read him. Hate to dismiss the issue completely but he ALWAYS turns everything into a scumtell, whether town or scum. He's null for now, as are most players in the game at this point.

You know, I've only finished four games. I'm currently in 6 and still trying to find my scumhunting niche. For those games that I've finished, in one, I was completely right. One, somewhat right, but at different times, but wrong in the end. And the other two, I was scum, so it doesn't apply.

We'll see after all of my current games are finished to see how I'm doing, but I'm quite comfortable with my style as of right now.

[charter]

Lol.
Parama, you need to take a chill pill. I'm not going to read any posts near as long as that, and it's only page two....

On the scum side, I'd be shocked if at least one of Boberz and Slaxx isn't scum. At this point, I'm leaning towards this being a poorly executed distancing attempt and they're both scum.

I get to post 34. Boberz is definitely scum.

Vote Boberz

Slaxx, you unvoted Boberz, what do you think of him now?


OH MY GOD, ENOUGH WITH THE MASSIVE POINTLESS POSTS.

[Slaxx]

I don't think I ever voted him. I can't tell if he is "false sense of superiority talk smack about yo mom" townie or just tryhard mafia. Plus I have always been kind of bad about FoSing people who vote me (as town moreso than mafia, ironically enough) so I am trying to let my bias just kind of die down before I evaluate him.