Newbie 1104 -- Game over

[forest_air]

^Argh, I forgot to edit some of that...hopefully it still makes sense?

[noragar]

Just echoing FOS: on CaptainCuddles. While taking someone to L-1 early on isn't too clear an indicator (I made the same move as a townie in my first game before later thinking through all of the ramifications and deciding it wasn't a smart thing to do), his explanation of it seems really convoluted. Whether or not there's a cop/doctor in the game, it's certainly better for town to lynch a scum on Day One than it is to lynch a random townie. He seemed to be trying to argue that lynching a townie was fine since it increased the odds of hitting scum later on and narrowed down the suspects that the cop would need to investigate.

While it's not "GAME OVER" if the town lynches a townie first, I'd certainly take my chances trying to lynch a scum on Day 1 instead.

Still plenty of time to see what develops. No need to rush into a decision in the first few days.

[gbevilchaos]

I'm aware you did vote for him before that, but I was just questioning your reason for copying someone who was voting for him during RVS instead of voting for someone else to avoid bandwagoning so early. I just find that a little odd. Espeonage and Lord of Graves were already voting for him before you decided to. You put him at L-2. And I wasn't accusing you of copying Twisted, I was just wondering if you have any other reason to vote for him than what was said by other people after you voted and decided to keep your vote as people continued to give their input.

Although I do think it's a little weird for CC to already be voting someone to L-1, I don't really suspect him. He was acting a little rash, but other than that, it's not much of a reason to lynch him. I think he's just new to this game, and wants the next day to go by. He could just be a PR waiting for the night to come so he can use his ability.

In one game I played, this happened to one person, where he said we should vote fast on day 1, and he ended up being lynched for his eagerness for the day to pass, and we lost a tracker. Just because CC is doing something hasty isn't a reason for me to vote for him because again, I don't want to lynch someone too early. Although actions like that do make him more suspicious.

And clearly I didn't explain myself well enough? I voted for Twisted because voting to put CC at L-2. I could have easily done the same for you, you want me to change my vote? Twisted voting L-2 because he is giving someone the opportunity to do the same thing he was doing by voting for CC, backfiring trying to protect you. I would recommend for CC to unvote, as he seems to be just confused and I want this day to last for longer before a final decision is made. So, if I instead voted for CC, and someone else decided to do the same, we could be lynching a newbie townie, and that is why I choose not to vote for CC or anyone with a lot of votes for the time being.

And I didn't vote for Twisted because I have the intention of him getting lynched, FYI. I mostly voted for him because I want people to remember that he has the possibilty to be scum, no matter how "reasonable" his logic appears to be. Voting isn't the only means of questioning someone's vote. He could have easily just compiled a list of suspicious things about CC and left it at that, encouraging others to ponder his reasoning.


And voting for someone after they vote for you, usually makes you look scummy, just so you know. Other people may not care your reasoning why, and may accuse you of trying to defend yourself and turn suspion on another person.

OMGUS votes do look scummy, but I never did one. I haven't changed my vote the entire game (unless it was at the very beginning when I can't remember). I just stated that my joke vote was now being considered to remain, as what he did looked awfully suspicious.

I misunderstood your question earlier about me. I voted for CC as a joke. I didn't realize he had two votes on him already, I thought he only had the one. As I said at the time, I only voted for him based on the avatar of the other person voting for him. There was nothing more to it, and I certainly would not have voted if I realized I was putting him on L-2. I probably should have checked the votes preceding mine, but I'm used to larger games (normally 10 to 20 players) in the games I've played on another site. In such games, I don't have to worry about pushing someone anywhere close to a lynch during RVS.

I still don't entirely understand why you find Twisted pushing someone to L-2 is more suspicious than CC pushing someone to L-1. You claim that CC pushing me to L-1 isn't suspicious because he was just eager, but you also claim that Twisted pushing someone to L-2 was presenting an opportunity for a quick lynch. Is it based on their different levels of experience?

[Espeonage]

*facepalm*

OK, this game needs some experience. I'm here. /ego

@ f_a: Goodposting but TS isn't scum. Not at this stage. Bandwagoning to L-1 is a good tactic to get information. CC's vote looks bad but I don't read him as scum either.

@ NEWBIES: It isn't a bad thing to BW someone to L-1. It is bad if you are inviting the lynch or if you hammer out of place. Pressure is what makes information come out. Remember that.

More when I go back and do more than skim the posts.

@ TS: CC has said enough, get back on the oter wagon we can build pressure. Come back to CC later when we have sqeezed as much out of day one as we can before we decide a lynch. K?

Top scum read other than vote is CC. Just so everyone knows where I stand. And it's not because of that vote. I'm not going to give reasoning yet. Want to see if the scummy actions are a trend or early game nerves.

[Nobody Special]

Votecount 1.03

gbevilchaos - 3 - noragar, Espeonage, CaptainCuddles
CaptainCuddles - 2 - Lord of Graves, Twistedspoon
Twistedspoon - 1 - forest_air

Not Voting: 198Frosbite, Razgriz, gbevilchaos

With 9 alive, it takes 5 to lynch.

Deadline: June 3.

V/LA: ...

[Twistedspoon]

forest is town
anti-IC is often a newb town tell. At least that's what faraday told me

also, the middle of the wagon tell doesn't apply in RVS, by the way. We use Random votes in the Random voting stage, so that doesn't really apply
besides, most of the wiki tells are getting outdated as the metagame constantly changes to adapt around them.

CC might be scum...
Forest is showing exactly what a townie would think, especially in a newbie game
gb is probably town too for similar reasons. His unvote wouldn't be scum driven either
noragar i'm unsure on, but probably town if I had to choose

need more from Razgriz & Co.

[Twistedspoon]

@ TS: CC has said enough, get back on the oter wagon we can build pressure.

just thought I'll point out that saying a wagon is for pressure completely defeats the point of it

"hey, we're going to pressure you. Feel pressured yet?"

[198Frostbite]

vote gbevilchaos

This is just my noobiness showing but bandwagoning possibly wil keep me from dying day 1

[Twistedspoon]

...

now do you see why I didn't vote gbevil espe?

nearly had a lynch already.

[Twistedspoon]

is this your first game frosty?

I strongly reccomend that we don't lynch unless we think someone is scum. Keeping yourself alive should be done through helping lynch scum, not random players

[Twistedspoon]

also, I strongly reccomend you unvote. We don't want to lynch gbevil, at least not now, and you'll look awful if he flips town

[Nobody Special]

Razgriz has been prodded.

[CaptainCuddles]

CC plays the VI card -.- Scummies are probably looking at me as their new alibi and getting pressure away from them. Can I suggest that we do a sort of a quick sweep on everyone? An RQS perhaps?

[CaptainCuddles]

Unvote, Vote: 198Frostbite

Reasons? Seems too pro and is playing the VI card like me.

[Twistedspoon]

quick sweep?

and imo, RQS would totally destroy any momentum we have

[gbevilchaos]

We're already past the RVS for the most part, so a RQS wouldn't really help. We should chase the leads we already have in front of us, and keep vigilant for new leads that pop up while we're doing so.

[Twistedspoon]

and right now that is CC and frosty for 2 L-1ings

2!!!

you'd think after the first one you'd learn that a lynch this early is awful

[CaptainCuddles]

I'm not understanding what's going on.... So are we opting to not lynch? Definitely frost and I are under suspicion but I don't understand why we wouldn't lynch since you guys seem to have a good lead.

[Twistedspoon]

we're 4 pages in

we're nowhere near ready for a lynch

we will lynch, for sure, but not now

https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=11&t=17140

my last newbie game

35 pages until our first lynch. Granted, that one did set a record, but we're not quite there yet Mr.Eager beaver

[gbevilchaos]

we're 4 pages in

we're nowhere near ready for a lynch

we will lynch, for sure, but not now

https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=11&t=17140

my last newbie game

35 pages until our first lynch. Granted, that one did set a record, but we're not quite there yet Mr.Eager beaver

QFT

Day 1 is the most difficult to find scum because you have very little to go on. We have weeks to discuss it and we shouldn't rush to lynch someone if we aren't 100% sure they're scum. Even if we are 100% sure, we might still want to draw it out to gather more info about everyone else. Town can't win a game without gathering enough info to make an educated guess on who is scum. Random guesses without even trying to find real scum from the beginning will lead to a loss every time.

[CaptainCuddles]

How long are games usually? Obviously we're gonna finish by June 3

[Twistedspoon]

How long are games usually? Obviously we're gonna finish by June 3

June 3 is the deadline for day 1

then we have another maximum of 3 weeks for D2 etc.

[gbevilchaos]

The length of games can vary greatly. It depends on number of players, deadlines, level of activity, and plenty of other things as well. They can last anywhere from a few weeks (if there are quick lynches and few players) to several months (if there are longer days and more players).

[gbevilchaos]

I had meant to add to my last post that I would guess a newbie game typically lasts somewhere around a month to a month and a half. A more experienced player can correct me if I'm wrong.

[CaptainCuddles]

Oh wow.... I thought June 3 was the day we finish. Didn't realize it would go on this long.