Newbie 1117(Town Wins)

[Does Bo Know]

*considers reasoning*

Well, I'm still keeping my vote on you. My reason is that you have a valid case against your only suspect, yet you refuse to follow up with it, and instead try to shift focus on someone for a worse reason. We have weeks until deadline. We can spend time pressuring BBmolla and still have time to have discussion about other things.

You're not as scummy as I thought you were, Random, because you have confidence in what you have done, and you don't take back what you did. You felt it was the right decision, and if you feel you have nothing to hide...I don't know, it's in my gut you're not that scummy. But I still feel you're the most anti-town here.

[BBmolla]

The fact that he stated he answered them so no one would call him scum is a little...selfish. Don't know if that's the right word, but saying that instead of agreeing that it brings on more discussion isn't pro-town to me.

I'm not going to sheep and say that something is a great idea if I have issues with it.

Also, I personally do not FoS Random at this point in time, I think his arguement is pretty logical tbh. Seeing how people react under pressure is a good idea because I know for a fact people will react differently, whether intentionally or not, when they're scum under pressure and town under pressure.

I mentioned the not hammeran because I didn't want to die with my song unsung.

[Does Bo Know]

I'm not going to sheep and say that something is a great idea if I have issues with it.

Also, I personally do not FoS Random at this point in time, I think his arguement is pretty logical tbh. Seeing how people react under pressure is a good idea because I know for a fact people will react differently, whether intentionally or not, when they're scum under pressure and town under pressure.

I mentioned the not hammeran because I didn't want to die with my song unsung.

- So you resent RVS because you think it's pointless (as I implied in post #31, if you need me to explain I will), but you answer it to keep from being accused of Mafia in that same post. You don't see

anything

good out of RVS? If you don't see anything good, why do you think every game starts with it and that a usual player follows along with it?

- Yes, pressuring people is good to get nice information. However, do you think Random

had

to switch his vote to Quackerz to pressure him, or do you think it was unnecessary?

- You shouldn't have told people not to hammer you so early, unless you would be gone for a

while

. No one in their right mind would collaborate a wagon and hammer you this early in the game with so little information. (Of course, this is a newbie game, so I should be more lenient if people make stupid mistakes.)

Also, I have a question for registered newbies here: what is your experience in Mafia?

[BBmolla]

@Bo
I resent RVS because in EM you would normally NL d1, or if you were crazy you were bandwagon and rl. EM is different though because most games start in the night phase, so the first day something has already happened.
However, because every game does use RVS here, it must be proven to work better. I'm not too happy with it, the thought of lynching a PR or outing one d1 is not a pleasant idea for me. But I'm not going to force an NL if people don't agree with me.

I don't think any random voting is neccessary tbh, I'd rather just say who one FoSes and then when you're 90% sure they are mafia, you vote. Random voting is a sign of a Fool(Jester) in EM because why would you vote someone unless you believe me them to be mafia and have a solid reason for your FoS.

A wagon was forming so I figured I'd throw it out there. I don't see why that's such a big deal. If I don't get the hammer there is always the chance I can't make it one day and then bam I come home and I'm lynched.

Was linked to EpicMafia while browsing /v/. Started by playing it with enormous 20 men setups that were all ridiculous roles. Eventually found out the game is really fun with just a few people and found out the importance of blues. Kept playing. Got into Silver Lobby when it existed. Still pretty bad at scum hunting and it's something I need to work on. I've also played it in real life at a party once, but realized it's hard with normal people because they just don't care enough.

Also, irrelevent, but I made a few videos based on "Meet The ____" for epicmafia.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ecscNq1N ... ture=inbox

Gonna throw this out there real quick, that I think some of the scumtells you guys are getting on me is pretty bogus. I might as well lurk because every time I talk it's a scum tell in some way or another.

[SomeRandomGuy]

*considers reasoning*

Well, I'm still keeping my vote on you. My reason is that you have a valid case against your only suspect,

yet you refuse to follow up with it, and instead try to shift focus on someone for a worse reason.

We have weeks until deadline. We can spend time pressuring BBmolla and still have time to have discussion about other things.

You're not as scummy as I thought you were, Random, because you have confidence in what you have done, and you don't take back what you did. You felt it was the right decision, and if you feel you have nothing to hide...I don't know, it's in my gut you're not that scummy.

But I still feel you're the most anti-town here

.

firstly, let me just echo again that I understand your vote on me and that i'm happy it's likely there for the right reasons.

onto the bolded points:

1) I don't refuse to follow up with it and whereas i can see why you might think that is the case let me assure you it isn't. My vote on Quackerz followed a large post about my suspicions on BBmolla I had made my suspicions clear, laid them out and hadn't back tracked on that at all. I think i've also pretty well laid out my reasoning for the switch of the vote, not only to give BBMolla some breathing space which i think may encourage better responses from him than if he's under continued pressure at this point (I don't know his playstyle, I'd like to see as much of it as i can) but also to encourage others into the game in a way that hopefully they wont just /agree with the case already presented and hide in a wagon.

2) I can even see your argument for this point, I don't subscribe to that idea but i do subscribe to the fact that if i get myself lynched in this D1 it's completely VI play that led to it.

What I would say however is that your post is almost exactly what i am being accused of (non-commitance) you've left yourself plenty of room here that if I am left swinging from the gallows you can say 'Hey, i said my gut didn't think he was scummy but i think he played anti-town'. Don't get me wrong here, i'm not calling you out as scummy or even suggesting that you are but it does leave that room. You're also choosing to leave your vote on someone you don't feel is 'that scummy' due to what you believe to be an anti-town play over someone you had voted and believe a case was good on - In essence you're doing exactly what I did, albeit you have a reason to place your vote on me.

Also, I personally do not FoS Random at this point in time, I think his arguement is pretty logical tbh. Seeing how people react under pressure is a good idea because I know for a fact people will react differently, whether intentionally or not, when they're scum under pressure and town under pressure

It works both ways and BBmolla is actually making a point i've tried to make - people do react differently under pressure, that's not to say that knowing how they act when not under pressure isn't important, i believe it is.

I'm not going to sheep and say that something is a great idea if I have issues with it.

I wouldn't ask you to, what I would ask is that you're open to pushing something you see as scummy, that if you do see a case, you're willing to lead it to the lynch - I'd certainly be willing to do so with yourself.

What are your current reads BBMolla? Who strikes you as scummy and why? I see you didn't FoS me and find my argument to be logical, what then are your thoughts on my case about you? Is that logical enough that you don't find my pushing of it to be scummy? Are there any responses to any points raised you'd like to bring up?

[BBmolla]

What are your current reads BBMolla? Who strikes you as scummy and why? I see you didn't FoS me and find my argument to be logical, what then are your thoughts on my case about you? Is that logical enough that you don't find my pushing of it to be scummy? Are there any responses to any points raised you'd like to bring up?

I got nothing concrete so far. Nothing I'd be willing to vote on at least. You're case on me is a little ridiculous and is the same reason I'm not pointing any fingers yet. You're FoSing me on the tiniest details, and while it is the tiny details that show who is truly town and truly maf, I think your jumping on it too fast. At this point in the game, it's even possible that there are no mafia. That the host decided to screw with us by making absolutely no mafia. Why? Because nobody has died. A blue and a mafia are no different at this point in time except for the fact that a mafia would like to lynch anyone except themselves and their partner while a blue wants to lynch only the mafia. If there were no mafia, I'm pretty sure this D1 would still go exactly the same with people pointing fingers at each other and ending up with a blue getting lynched because he didn't like the idea of something or he "scumtelled."

I'm just rambling now. There's nothing really to discuss, the host "died" but that's irrelevent because the choice was not possible for the mafia to make. Nothing has happened.

So, give me a few pages and I'll get back to you. I'll wait for some more people to randomly point fingers.

[SomeRandomGuy]

I don't even know how to respond to that BB.

There are 100% 2 mafia in the game - 1 rolecop and 1 goon.

The idea that they haven't even posted yet it possible, they could be laughing at us all right now but we go on what we have. The thing is, by creating cases we get reactions, we start to see interactions between scum and other players and scum member 1 and scum member 2 - meaningless interactions now may mean a lot later in the game.

[Does Bo Know]

What I would say however is that your post is almost exactly what i am being accused of (non-commitance) you've left yourself plenty of room here that if I am left swinging from the gallows you can say 'Hey, i said my gut didn't think he was scummy but i think he played anti-town'. Don't get me wrong here, i'm not calling you out as scummy or even suggesting that you are but it does leave that room. You're also choosing to leave your vote on someone you don't feel is 'that scummy' due to what you believe to be an anti-town play over someone you had voted and believe a case was good on - In essence you're doing exactly what I did, albeit you have a reason to place your vote on me.

Let me make this clear. I believe that you are the most suspicious player here, and therefore, my vote is on you. That's how I usually play the game. Exceptions come in if deadline is close or if roles are weird or something. I said that I don't feel you're as scummy as you were because of your confidence with your actions. That's it. I don't plan on retreating to the "my gut said he wasn't that scummy" if you do end up getting lynched, even if I may be directing it. And if I do retreat to that, I encourage everyone to use it against me.

To Random's points:

1) You have a full case on BBmolla. It's enough to warrant a vote. Yet you don't. BBmolla still had plenty of breathing space, actually; only, what, 2 votes on him? And, yes, I agree that changing topic is something that we should do at some point. But there's time for that, and we don't need a sudden change after a case was starting on BBmolla.

2) Are you saying that it would be your VI play that could lead to your lynch, or the people on your wagon? This isn't really anything suspicious. I'm just curious, really.

To BB's points:

Just saying, that RVS is good here because it creates discussion, and RQS does the same thing. Nothing to be afraid of here. And by the end of Day 1, Lynches most likely aren't random; that's only if inactivity is a huge problem with the game.

Also, BB, because you said that random votes are unnecessary, would you agree that Random changing his vote to Quackerz was unnecessary as well?

Finally, you're not so scummy to me anymore, BB. The only problem I really had was that you thought RVS was a hindrance or simply nothing helpful to the town, but now that I see where you came from and what they expected earlier, and that you were accustomed to not doing anything like RVS, you don't strike me as very scummy anymore.

Ninja'd: AGH! I need to quit taking forever to post! Let me read the recent two posts and comment on those if needed.

[Does Bo Know]

Not much to say, except that BBmolla really needs to read the rules at the beginning of this game; Random pretty much pointed out the possibilities of scum factor, so if BBmolla didn't see that in the rules, I suggest he read them again.

[BBmolla]

I'm too hardcore for rules bro.

[SomeRandomGuy]

1) I think the issue here is that I can't prove to you i would have continued my case on BB - i wouldn't have just dropped it like it never happened, i was just hoping that if we moved away from the topic a wee bit, that interactions between him and other people would be good to see, not necessarily from the point of view of him defending himself but from the view of him in active discussion about other things.

2) It would be my VI play - it's quite obvious that my changing vote was not the best course of action, no matter how much i stand by my reasons, the effects it has had were not what was desired. That said, I don't see what possible gain my changing of vote (in the way i did it) would help me as scum, as i've already said, my case was blatently laid out for all to see i couldn't hide from that after the fact.

Your answers to my prodding of you are more than satisfactory for me at this point Bo.

I'm not sure whether BB's lack of FoS / OMGUS reaction on me is something i should trust him more for, or less. but i do dislike the 'youre jumping on this too fast' line. If anything that's exactly what i've got myself suspected for, not wanting to tunnel.

[ToastyToast]

I'm too hardcore for rules bro.

Be lucky these rules are standard. One day you'll be in a large theme and wind up modkilled for breaking a post restriction

All these long posts....mafiascum was completely shut down for me for a while so I apologize if I don't have much to say regarding the last page. People other than the 4 of us need to talk.

Newbies: Lurking may seem like a great strategy when you first start playing (both as town or mafia). Perhaps if town you are worried about putting your opinions out there, but we need your voice to get a read on you.

Mafia and PR's may lurk because they want to avoid attention. This only directs suspicion towards you.

[Haze]

1. This is my first game; am I supposed to make a judgement based off what I Imagine the roles to be like?
2. Take the treats. All in good time, when it comes to the money, I guess. And plus, nothing feels like it's worth it when it comes to easily.

[Haze]

Aanyways, I've gone through the 3 pages.
Answers to whatever questions I remember seeing:
This isn't the first time I've ever played mafia, though this is the first time I've played at a dedicated mafia site. So I have some idea as to what I should be doing, but all those crappy abbreviations or whatnot are causing some annoyance.

By the way, what the hell is a 'Blue'?

Obviously, Random and BB are attracting the most attention here.

Random for making a pretty solid case, then dropping it. This is really, really weird, and though I can accept your explanation of wanting to relive some pressure, it feels off. Switching is quite scummy as you created a convincing image as a townie and then threw in a random vote into the mix to confuse everyone mroe. As for pushing hard, I see no problems with that because I'm pretty prone to jumping the gun myself if I think I've gotten onto something; and then the submit button's already been hit and then I realise the lack of thinking that went into my posts or whatnot.

BB's stance (as I see it) on lynches seems to be on a defensive position, and prefers to take safer and more conservative routes of choice. However, wheter or not he is mafia this is definitely not helpful for townie, as all Mafia needs to win is for townie to do nothing with their votes. Still, I guess this could kinda be attributed to not reading the rules.

As for the other guys posting, I have no idea. They aren't showing very much of themselves.

[SomeRandomGuy]

Random for making a pretty solid case, then dropping it. .

Again, i can't stress enough that i didn't just drop it and yes the case was pretty solid for day 1, then again you look around a bit and you'll find another equally as good for day 1 anywhere.

Anyway it was a silly idea moving my vote, i just hope that through continuing to actively scum hunt people will see i only have town motives here.

Haze: Using simply a gut feeling from their posts, how do you feel about the other players we've seen post, do you trust them? Is there anything you see which strikes you as odd? do you have questions for anybody?

[kad2361]

I confirmed, so can you please mark me off the list.

Also,

Vote: BBmolla

[SomeRandomGuy]

I confirmed, so can you please mark me off the list.

Also,

Vote: BBmolla

Any thoughts to go along with this?

[kad2361]

trying to see if mafia will hammer. If they dont, very high FoS on BBmolla

[SomeRandomGuy]

I believe he's at least 2 votes away from lynch, even with your vote, unless i've miscounted? That would mean both mafia would have to jump on (assuming there's no mafia vote on him currently) it would be a silly move, hammering a lynch this early into the day would raise massive suspicion, they'd get themselves killed.

I don't think it's fair to automatically put a big FoS on BBmolla just if he doesn't get hammered (which isn't going to happen anyway i expect).

[Does Bo Know]

I believe he's at least 2 votes away from lynch, even with your vote, unless i've miscounted?

You miscounted. Kad is the only one with a vote on BBmolla currently.

Kad, could you please give a better case than that on BBmolla? Quite frankly, I don't understand any of your logic at this point, considering BBmolla is nowhere close to a lynch.

[Does Bo Know]

Also, Kad, get an avatar. It makes for easier identification.

[kad2361]

Um, you and SomeRandomGuy both have votes on BBmolla as far as I know...

[SomeRandomGuy]

I believe he's at least 2 votes away from lynch, even with your vote, unless i've miscounted?

You miscounted. Kad is the only one with a vote on BBmolla currently.

Kad, could you please give a better case than that on BBmolla? Quite frankly, I don't understand any of your logic at this point, considering BBmolla is nowhere close to a lynch.

Fair enough, i hadn't actually counted through the game, just tried to do it off of memory of who voted and changed votes.

Thing is logically speaking 'If he's not hammered - he must be scum or a big suspect' is a stitch up.

By the way guys, i'll be around for a couple more hours but will then be

V/LA

over the weekend, i'll still be posting a fair amount no doubt but at random times.

[Does Bo Know]

Um, you and SomeRandomGuy both have votes on BBmolla as far as I know...

My vote is currently on SomeRandomGuy.
SomeRandomGuy's vote is currently on Quackerz.

That's why I'm confused about your theory.

[kad2361]

Oh, i didnt see the new votes.
Can you guys unvote before doing a new vote.
It would be helpful.
Then,

Unvote