Mini 482: Shrek Mafia - Game Over

[Adam The Amazing]

Mirth and Grek: either the best early distancing I've ever seen in my life, or at least one of you are townies, very possibly both. I'm going to discount the first as even being plausible, because that was ridiculous to read. I wasn't even gone a whole day, and that's more discussion than is needed to make me happy; sure, it was arguing whether or not that was a trap to catch mafia, and if so, if it had any potential to be successful, but at least it was intense posting.

I agree with the post above me, referring to what I understood when I read "third vote = good enough." That's exactly what I took from it, because the third vote is a cursed one in lots of people's eyes.

[Jex]

This quote from Grek came right after making him the 5th vote on Nox. He had no given reasoning until someone called him out on the 5th vote.

If I posted that I was voting to try to trap the scum, it wouldn't be a very good trap, would it?

No, but I don't think your trap was very liable to begin with.

[Jex]

Mirth and Grek: either the best early distancing I've ever seen in my life, or at least one of you are townies, very possibly both. I'm going to discount the first as even being plausible, because that was ridiculous to read. I wasn't even gone a whole day, and that's more discussion than is needed to make me happy; sure, it was arguing whether or not that was a trap to catch mafia, and if so, if it had any potential to be successful, but at least it was intense posting.

I agree with the post above me, referring to what I understood when I read "third vote = good enough." That's exactly what I took from it, because the third vote is a cursed one in lots of people's eyes.

I disagree with your distancing theory. I just finished a game (Kingdom Hearts Mafia) where the first day two mafia went at it therefore leaving one of them deemed innocent in the town's eyes for a long time afterwards. Don't trust that one is town simply because they are arguing.

[Adam The Amazing]

But if that's the case, then they're distancing so hard...

[Mirth]

Wasn't distancing, I just really don't buy Grek's "it was a trap" argument, and felt that it needed to be thoroughly demolished.

As for InHim, I don't find his vote any more suspicious than Jex's third vote or Nox's third vote. It sort of seems like he voted for Nox because Nox placed a non-random early third vote on Jex, and the "third vote=good enough" was more along the lines of a pressure to get more information vote than a bandwagon vote.

I find Nox's vote, even if it was just a joke, to be just as worthy of inquiry as InHim's, because an adorable emo CareBear doesn't strike me as a particularly valid reason to throw a third vote on someone about halfway down page one. Same for Jex's vote, even if that also was a joke, it pointed out the lack of validity Nox's vote had, and presented Nox as someone to move votes onto.

Overall, I find Grek's vote and unvote to be the most suspicious out of all of them, as the vote was only given a very flimsy reason after he was called on it, and the unvote was a "just leave me alone" unvote by his own admission. I also don't particularly like he he has written off gathering information day 1 as not particularly important.

Mod: can we please get a vote count?

Thank you.


And on a totally unrelated note: Adam, Francisco d'Anconia and Hank Rearden were totally more awesome characters.

[camisade]

GOOD points.

VOTE: Mirth

What about his post makes you think Mirth is scum?

This quote from Grek came right after making him the 5th vote on Nox. He had no given reasoning until someone called him out on the 5th vote.

If I posted that I was voting to try to trap the scum, it wouldn't be a very good trap, would it?

It wasn't a good trap either way. Only idiot scum would fall for it.

[KaleiÐoscøpe]

Vote Count

Grek (2): Mirth, Pug89
Nox (2): DeliciousGoldfish, InHimshallibe
Jex (2): Adam the Amazing, Nox
InHimshallibe (2): Haschel Cedricson, Jex

Mirth (1): benhalkum

Not Voting (3): 007flash, Grek, camisade

7 to lynch

[Haschel Cedricson]

I would like to hear more from DeliciousGoldfish and benhalkum.

Also, Francisco D'Anconia was my favorite. His money speech is a thing of beauty.

[inHimshallibe]

Sorry, but this is something you'll need to know about me: I rarely post during the weekend.

Nox was the game's first "third vote" on somebody, which was what prompted my "Good enough!" However, I miscounted the votes before that, not realizing I would be the 4th. I just made a cursory read of the posts, and I'm pretty sure I confused a couple of "Nox"es for "Jex"es. With the current response to the vote, I'm going to keep mine as it is, and will post later on anything I haven't covered right now.

[benhalkum]

I've been offline for 2 days, you'll see more from me.

[Nox]

I don't know, but her alignment doesn't matter. If she is scum and get's lynched, that's good. If she's scum and isn't, we lose nothing. If she is town and nobody quicklynchs, she is safe. If she is town and gets quicklynched we found some scummy people.

The only way she is going to get lynched is if 2 more people voted before anyone can unvote. Which would be realy scummy. I was offering the scum enough rope to hang themselves, both figuratively and literaly. Seeing as they did not take the bait, I

Unvote.

Wow. I'm officially astounded.
On one hand, you profess your "scum trap" to be fool-proof and a win/win situation. In the same post, you retract your vote with a flimsy defence reeking of Crap!Logic. There are several loopholes to your theory, yet you affirm it to be failproof.

I am unvoting because the scum didn't try to lynch Nox. Leaving my vote on her would be useless.

How do you know the scum didn't try to lynch me?

I honestly doubt that there are 2 townies that would be dumb enough to vote for her.

I don't know, it seems alledged townspeople are dumb enough to give them the opportunity to do so. :/

You can't propose something, and then call dumb the townie who followed you. That's just hypocritical.

In what situation would losing 2 scum be a bad thing for the town?

Are we in a sitiation that we can be confirmed that we are in fact losing two scums?

If she is town and gets quicklynched we found some scummy people.

Newsflash; That includes you if you're on the bandwagon.

While finding two scum could be more helpful than a lot of discussion day 1 it doesn't seem likely that your plan would result in such. This is why I think you are scum who came up with your plan only after being questioned about your vote to cover your behavior.

I agree.

Sigh. My point is that quicklynching Nox, regardless of whether or not she is scum or town, is bad, even for scum. The scum have no good reason to quicklynch her even if she is town, because it would give them away. Thus there is no good reason to quicklynch Nox for the scum. The end.

Thank you. That just about sums it up.


Sorry for my lack of posting; I have just moved and my internet won't be reconnected until the 13th.

As a sidenote;

Unvote

. I can steal the carebear without the imminent murder of its possessor. (In other words, it was a random/joke/pointless vote. I also had not realized that there was already two votes on Jex, even though three votes this early on is not necessarily worrysome.)

[KaleiÐoscøpe]

007flash has requested replacery. Zindaras will take his place. Continue

[Zindaras]

The scum might have a good reason to vote for Nox, the town doesn't. That's why the scum might have voted for her when she is at lynch-2. It only makes sense to vote for her if the person voting is scum.

It's far more likely that the town might have a good reason for voting than that scum might have a good reason for voting. Why would two scumbags sacrifice themselves to kill one townie?

I was wondering why nobody noted inHim's fourth vote and I was happy to see Haschel do so in 44, amusingly enough immediately followed by Jex.

I think random-voting wagons (in Minis) start being serious at the fourth vote. If I saw the fun of it, I'd joke vote a third vote. I'd be a lot more careful about the fourth vote.

I am most definitely on the Mirth side in this particular discussion. She's right. However, I do not believe that this necessarily makes Grek scum. I'd like to see this game move onto other subjects as well.

Personally, the thing that really caught my eye was ben's vote in 37. Just saying "Good points, Vote". I think that was quite the scummy move. For me, I think I want to start there.

Vote: benhalkum

[Mirth]

I am most definitely on the Mirth side in this particular discussion. She's right. However, I do not believe that this necessarily makes Grek scum. I'd like to see this game move onto other subjects as well.

Personally, the thing that really caught my eye was ben's vote in 37. Just saying "Good points, Vote". I think that was quite the scummy move. For me, I think I want to start there.

Vote: benhalkum

Eh, I don't know whether or not Grek's crap!logic makes him scum, but for now it seems like the best place to keep my vote.

I have a feeling that Ben's vote might be somewhat influenced by the fact that both of us are in Newbie 431, so I'm not paying much attention to the vote itself. What I don't like, however, is how he has obviously checked in to say that he's been on and hasn't answered the questions thrown at him about it. (After both Pug and Camisade asked.)

[Zindaras]

Newbie 431 is ongoing, it is Day One, and you are both alive. To cast a serious vote based on something as completely irrelevant as that is not just plain silly, it's scummy.

[Mirth]

As I've said, I just have a feeling, (as in I DON'T KNOW if that might have anything to do with it, it's just a thought, and when I say influenced, I didn't particularly mean consciously influenced, but maybe, subconsciously, Grek's arguments just seem better to him).

Why are you so quick to assume scumminess?

[camisade]

The scum might have a good reason to vote for Nox, the town doesn't. That's why the scum might have voted for her when she is at lynch-2. It only makes sense to vote for her if the person voting is scum.

Personally, the thing that really caught my eye was ben's vote in 37. Just saying "Good points, Vote". I think that was quite the scummy move. For me, I think I want to start there.

Vote: benhalkum

I agreee, and thing was the points in Grek's post weren't good at all to prove Mirth's scuminess.

[Zindaras]

As I've said, I just have a feeling, (as in I DON'T KNOW if that might have anything to do with it, it's just a thought, and when I say influenced, I didn't particularly mean consciously influenced, but maybe, subconsciously, Grek's arguments just seem better to him).

Why are you so quick to assume scumminess?

Well, we do kinda have to start the game, you know. I don't

know

if ben's scum, but I think his move was scummy (and I think my beliefs are well-founded). So I don't really see your point here.

[Mirth]

Well, we do kinda have to start the game, you know.

I was under the impression we already started it.

I'm more interested in Ben's reasoning behind the vote and his failure to answer questions about it, though.

[benhalkum]

Wrong. At this point in time, we lose a whole day of potential information.

I think that finding 2 scum day one is better than having alot of discussion day one. We can discuss the next day as well. The only special thing that happens day one is the random voting, and we are done with that part.

Again, the theory of two scum just jumping right on is flawed. It also looks even more suspicious that you're unvoting right now, especially after we called you out on the initial vote.

I am unvoting because the scum didn't try to lynch Nox. Leaving my vote on her would be useless.

Not necessarily. Trigger happy townies exist too. Could have been perfectly possible for two townies to pile right on. Also your lines of reasoning here don't really reconcile, like it doesn't matter if we get a myslynch or not.

I honestly doubt that there are 2 townies that would be dumb enough to vote for her. It would be two scum acting like 2 dumb townies in an attempt to get rid of a townie without geting lynched. I said that if she gets lynched the people that did it are most almost sure to be scum and only the scum would hammer her. Someone would unvote if she got to lynch-1 and the two voting didn't work together.

"If the scum don't want to give themselbes away"? What kind of statement is that? Why would the scum want to give themselves away? Sure, they might decide to sacrifice one or two of themselves at some point in a game, but right now its not particularly advantageous. This group of players has barely had time to get acquainted with each other. If a scum player were to sacrifice himself now, it doesn't do anything for the scum. They just lose a member. Scum sacrifice is, if played well, about redirecting suspicion. Deciding to get yourself lynched this early on day one, with most of the players not even contributing yet, doesn't do anything of this sort. You don't throw suspicion on or off anybody, because right now, most players have barely had time to greet each other, let alone do something either pro or antitown.

It is a figure of speech. Another way of saying "If the scum aren't going to try to lynch Nox and inadvertently make the town think they are scum." Not actualy deciding to give themselves away.

Also, we don't know how many scum there are (and also whether or not we have a Serial Killer). So even if one or two scum decides to sacrifice himself, the town still might not be in a particularly good situation, as the chance to gather information is lost.

In what situation would losing 2 scum be a bad thing for the town?

THIS is why I voted you Mirth.

[Nox]

I fail to see the reasoning. After being specifically asked a few times, you merely re-quote a huge post with no further explanation.

Vote Benkhalum

[Pug89]

THIS is why I voted you Mirth.

FOS Benhalkum

That doesn't really explain anything. Merely quoting a post that doesn't seem to indicate Mirth as scum without an explanation for why that made you think she's scummy is not satisfactory. I'm happy with my vote were it is now but if there is no real explanation for your vote soon I may change it.

[camisade]

not gonna beat a dead horse but yeah, what those two said. ^

[benhalkum]

Well, with being just a good guy I am only having to go off of suspecions and randomness like you guys.

You think without a shadow of a doubt Mirth is Town, then tell me. I'll go with my fellow good guys

[Mirth]

Well, with being just a good guy I am only having to go off of suspecions and randomness like you guys.

You think without a shadow of a doubt Mirth is Town, then tell me. I'll go with my fellow good guys

Actually they don't, as it isn't very prudent to think, "without a shadow of a doubt" that anybody is town. Especially not on page three.

The question, which you still have not actually answered, is *why* you voted for me. It doesn't matter that you voted for me, it matters that you did not give a reason for doing so. What exactly is suspicious? Please point it out.

Also, I don't like the part where you basically claim town-alignment. What prompted this?