In post 66, Vanderscamp wrote:
This is not the solution.
If I get there I will refuse to claim at E-2, I'm not going to be part of an
obviously worse strategy
just to accommodate for town (not that we even know that that is the case) who are intentionally playing poorly.
Explain why this strategy is worse or you getting my vote for this day.
Because forcing more claims from people is generally not helpful.
If this isn't the case, if more claims are fine or we are at least indifferent to them, then we should (or be at least indifferent to an) all claim today.
But I think that's pretty clearly not true.
Forcing claims at E-2 instead of E-1 forces more people to claim, assuming that we do not eventually put every person who gets to E-2 at E-1.
... Oh. That's what you meant.
E-2 doesh't means you should claim immediatly. And it's not like anyone does, even if they are on E-1, otherwise it would be chaotic. There's mostly warning and ask to claim if it needed, and it happens after decision made, so you kinda forced to claim.
Most common practice at end of days is placing someone on E-1 and asking them to claim. Nothing changes if you put people on E-2 and ask to claim... I already told why E-1 is dangerous.
Massclaim doesh't benefit us, less claims is better.
I stand by my primary reason for townreading Enchant, I townread him for consistent contributions that are not just quantitative but qualititative high-scores.
Enchant has helped us even if they are scum, more than almost anyone else except I would say myself.
This is impossible to scumread to be perfectly honest. He hasn't fluff-posted much at all, has continually pressured and questioned. I will not read Enchant as scum unless extreme circumstances change and if I am somehow alive alongside them at a later stage in this game.
I can tunnel a scumread hard and do the same with townreads too and see no issue with it. I hard-townread, whether or not you agree with my reason for doing so.
Everyone's a fool in some ways, we all can only try.
I don't support the bandwagoning of AoC based solely on the trolling, I will only join such a bandwagon if AoC flat-out refuses to change this day's vote dynamic from being AoC vs myself.
AoC would troll as either alignment and has been so active in the thread quanty-wise that I feel it is becoming a townsided thing. Why would fae post again and again and again as scum? AoC would probably back off or ramp up the trolling if scumsided in this scenario.
Everyone's a fool in some ways, we all can only try.
In post 78, Enchant wrote:Just. Don't claim if you realised you are on E-2 or even E-1. Claim when town hate you and want cut your head off, unless you claim.
If one doesn't claim when E-1, that is just stupid especially in this situation/setup where claims are essential to de-escalating if on a PR.
Everyone's a fool in some ways, we all can only try.
In post 59, Vanderscamp wrote:It wouldn't mean absolutely nothing, if they have a "clear" on someone their chance of being scum gets cut in half.
That's not really how odds work but I do kind of understand what you mean as it's 1/2 chance the setup is that setup.
Yeah, it's not exactly a half most of the time.
If it's a D1 VT kill without any other claims, and one of the roles dies in the night, a clear from the other role the next day makes chances of the clear being scum 1/3, with the other players being scum 5/9 each. If it was a scum kill D1 with no claims, a clear becomes 1/7 scum vs 2/7 scum for the other players, but most of the time it's not going to be as clear cut.
Even still I think if someone is cleared tomorrow by an investigative role that may or may not be useless, we shouldn't treat it as an actual clear, but I think it should definitely be enough to give them immunity from the kill for that day unless they're acting extraordinarily scummy.
In post 78, Enchant wrote:Just. Don't claim if you realised you are on E-2 or even E-1. Claim when town hate you and want cut your head off, unless you claim.
If one doesn't claim when E-1, that is just stupid especially in this situation/setup where claims are essential to de-escalating if on a PR.
Yeah. Especially because of hammers and immediatly danger. Honestly, i believe you all have head and can use common sense, when you should claim and when not. I take it simple, don't put people on E-1, unless you for sure want them dead. Now probably we can close this, because i found i repeading same thing, which is not what i want.
In post 66, Vanderscamp wrote:
This is not the solution.
If I get there I will refuse to claim at E-2, I'm not going to be part of an
obviously worse strategy
just to accommodate for town (not that we even know that that is the case) who are intentionally playing poorly.
Explain why this strategy is worse or you getting my vote for this day.
Because forcing more claims from people is generally not helpful.
If this isn't the case, if more claims are fine or we are at least indifferent to them, then we should (or be at least indifferent to an) all claim today.
But I think that's pretty clearly not true.
Forcing claims at E-2 instead of E-1 forces more people to claim, assuming that we do not eventually put every person who gets to E-2 at E-1.
... Oh. That's what you meant.
E-2 doesh't means you should claim immediatly. And it's not like anyone does, even if they are on E-1, otherwise it would be chaotic. There's mostly warning and ask to claim if it needed, and it happens after decision made, so you kinda forced to claim.
Most common practice at end of days is placing someone on E-1 and asking them to claim. Nothing changes if you put people on E-2 and ask to claim... I already told why E-1 is dangerous.
Massclaim doesh't benefit us, less claims is better.
Sure, what I'm saying is that I won't be claiming unless someone gives intent to hammer me.
If I get hammered without warning by some rogue agent the onus is on the rogue agent to justify why we shouldn't kill them for it, not on me (or anyone else) for not wanting to claim unnecessarily early.
In post 77, RationalMadman wrote:I stand by my primary reason for townreading Enchant, I townread him for consistent contributions that are not just quantitative but qualititative high-scores.
Enchant has helped us even if they are scum, more than almost anyone else except I would say myself.
This is impossible to scumread to be perfectly honest. He hasn't fluff-posted much at all, has continually pressured and questioned. I will not read Enchant as scum unless extreme circumstances change and if I am somehow alive alongside them at a later stage in this game.
I can tunnel a scumread hard and do the same with townreads too and see no issue with it. I hard-townread, whether or not you agree with my reason for doing so.
I don't disagree at all with your reasoning about Enchant for coming to the conclusion that he's pro-town, or even impossible to scum read, I just think it's not hard at all for a helpful scum to post what he's said so far.
2/6 to vote Anti-Town faction (I am Town for sure, so only 6 people remains).
If VT pushed, he probably going die.
If Mafia/Dog pushed, they probably claim PR for 1-1 trade as last breath.
If PR pushed, they claim and roulete continue, but chance will be 2/5. If hit PR again and he claim, then 2/4, which makes 50% probality of lynch Mafia/Dog.
In post 79, RationalMadman wrote:I don't support the bandwagoning of AoC based solely on the trolling, I will only join such a bandwagon if AoC flat-out refuses to change this day's vote dynamic from being AoC vs myself.
AoC would troll as either alignment and has been so active in the thread quanty-wise that I feel it is becoming a townsided thing. Why would fae post again and again and again as scum? AoC would probably back off or ramp up the trolling if scumsided in this scenario.
Do we know that AoC would give this level of contribution as either alignment?...
And it's not just the trolling, I read the comment about you talking about mafia specifically (when you didn't) as weird and forced.
You can keep your read on enchant but I emphatically disagree with thinking AoC is townsided for consistently being here but declining to do anything useful.
Vanders, you just need to know. If you on E-2 and ASKED to claim, then you probably should claim. Simple because placing you on E-1 would be dangerous.
We not in situation to punish anti-town behavior. As i said, he doing that regardless of alignment, and last thing i want to see is him getting lynched after hammering town and flip town as well and instaloss.
Well. There's possibility he will hammer mafia, but still not worth it.
... Not_Mafia most hot discusion here, and even didn't posted once. Which is hilarous.
Even in the queue thread, AoC was trolling with their first 2 posts on the site, one actually personally trolled myself.
After I in'd, AoC said 'I see I will be in good company' sarcastically or something.
I won't mention more than that, you can see the post history (it was only 2 posts anyway and the other didn't apply to me). This isn't me discussing other games in this thread as it isn't even ongoing and was the queue thread.
AoC is very clearly not concerned whatsoever with how annoyed other users get towards faem.
Everyone's a fool in some ways, we all can only try.
In post 90, Enchant wrote:Vanders, you just need to know. If you on E-2 and ASKED to claim, then you probably should claim. Simple because placing you on E-1 would be dangerous.
We not in situation to punish anti-town behavior. As i said, he doing that regardless of alignment, and last thing i want to see is him getting lynched after hammering town and flip town as well and instaloss.
Well. There's possibility he will hammer mafia, but still not worth it.
... Not_Mafia most hot discusion here, and even didn't posted once. Which is hilarous.
If it's obvious not_mafia is happy to kill me and he's not voting me, sure.
If not_mafia randomly hammers me or anyone else for no reason, be very inclined to kill him tomorrow despite what you say about his style.
The response to pro-scum play should not be to accept it and accommodate it.
In post 91, RationalMadman wrote:Even in the queue thread, AoC was trolling with their first 2 posts on the site, one actually personally trolled myself.
After I in'd, AoC said 'I see I will be in good company' sarcastically or something.
I won't mention more than that, you can see the post history (it was only 2 posts anyway and the other didn't apply to me). This isn't me discussing other games in this thread as it isn't even ongoing and was the queue thread.
AoC is very clearly not concerned whatsoever with how annoyed other users get towards faem.
I accept that last line, so why do you think they would be inclined to troll less as scum?
In post 94, Vanderscamp wrote:
I accept that last line, so why do you think they would be inclined to troll less as scum?
The stream of trolling has remained consistent, which is something I didn't mention and is a tell I noticed that is fairly top secret until I said it now but even though I say it, it will still be true. Something I noticed with troll-happy players is that as town, they keep trolling to the same level throughout the game. As scum, they tend to burst into further trolling or to sit back and let others fight.
This may not be true in longer forum mafia but in smaller games like this I think it's similar to the casual shorter formats I've gotten used to.
AoC's kept it to the same intensity and actually voted me to reaction-test me I think, though I don't see much done with reactions.
I don't know how to read this player but what I do know is that the habit of trolls as town is to keep it to the same level of quantity regardless of how the game is going.
Everyone's a fool in some ways, we all can only try.
I also notice that when trolls are town, they love to vote anyone who suspects them, with a burning passion. On the other hand, as scum, they tend to try much harder to make it appear like at least their reason for doing so is more valid than just 'OMG you suck!'
Everyone's a fool in some ways, we all can only try.
Hello all I am the other member in this hydra account. I used to play some foreign version of werewolf kills on app thats more like a video chat. I never played in a format like this but my friend recommended me trying LOL.
