Newbie 2048 | Game Over

[RLotus]

Hello everyone, the first I was going to say was to not let enchant slide under the radar this game. It looks like you’ve all got that covered haha

[RLotus]

BM- I'm pretty sure his conviction on Emperor is town, even though I don't think his conclusion is solid whatsoever. Strongest town read

Rockhopper- Slight town read, I think his direction his townie. It seems he is evaluating what has happened thus far as if he is trying to sort.

Enchant- Slight town read for not being afraid to put himself directly opposed to BM.

Emperor- I can't find anything explicity scummy from him. It was a bit awkward how he snap voted BM when BM called him out. Could be a town reaction too, idk, null for now.

Maduisha- This slot feels weird to me. She keeps jumping in and helping people out and being explainy. It feels like she is trying to endear herself to town as opposed to making hard stances. This is my best scum read thus far.

VOTE: Maduisha

[RLotus]

that passive aggressive defense is mad weird

[RLotus]

Actually I'm gonna place this here:

VOTE: RLotus

Because that readlist looked a tiny bit panicky to post "content" and I found it amusing.

OMGUS very nice

[RLotus]

I'm never passive aggressive!!! I'm not a native speaker and I pick up speech patterns from others, and end up speaking like a movie character. Never mind my silliness.

oh, my misunderstanding then

[RLotus]

Maduisha seems way too uncomfortable with the one vote on her.

I don't agree with your reason for townreading Enchant - why would that slot be afraid of directly opposing me?

The way I am currently seeing the game is a town(you) pushing on a town/potential scum (emperor). Now, it wouldn't make much sense to go against the grain like that and put yourself opposed to the supposed town as mafia, because you are just putting a target on yourself.

I could very well be wrong on how I am seeing the game, but like I said, it's a town lean for enchant.

[RLotus]

And scumreading someone for posting reads feels forced, as if you are coming up with a reason to OMGUS me and relieve the pressure from yourself.

[RLotus]

Not gonna say I 100% caught a scum rn, but it feels very fishy.

[RLotus]

this doesnt feel at all dissimilar to how Emp responded to me...and you don't think he did anything scummy. definitely an inconsistency in your approach here.

Well I did mention it as awkward in my read of him. It's different because he didn't come up with a reason to do so. He just voted you and then said I'm not sure if this is town or scum BM. Maybe that makes it worse, Idk, just not confident on the vibe I get from him.

[RLotus]

I actually wouldn't mind being the policy elimination in a case of having 0 leads

I hate that you said this lol

[RLotus]

Seems pointless to reevaluate someone who just goes and claims VT

[RLotus]

I figure others would notice it if I did. To me that cements her as the best elim for today.

[RLotus]

I don't agree even slightly that it makes her "the best elim for today" when we are a few pages and 1-2 rl days in. I still don't understand why you would draw attention to this, especially as town.

Unless either you have a very strong mafia read elsewhere or are willing to lock her town, I think elimming the VT claim is just mechanically best. Especially since I think there's a decent chance that this is mafia.

[RLotus]

meh

admittedly I am still learning how to play this game correctly

But with Maduisha we either elim scum or someone who mafia know is VT. Win-win, in a sense. I don't exactly believe in town's ability to find scum day 1. That's my line of reasoning anyway.

[RLotus]

Then, he writes Maduisha's vote as OMGUS, and then goes and says Maduisha's SR on Lotus is forced, and then goes to say that Maduisha claimed VT.

Also I'm very concerned that Maduisha's apparent "VT claim" changed RLotus' stance from "very fishy" to "decent chance this is maf". I'm not familiar with RLotus' playstyle, before I connect the dots I'd like BM to say what RLotus 2042 looked like.

"very fishy" and "decent chance this is maf" are essentially the same read. I'm having trouble understanding your rationale for finding these things scummy. Do you think there is a contradiction somewhere?

Also, Ben, I'm curious how you read Maduisha and how you read her read on me here:

Actually I'm gonna place this here:

VOTE: RLotus

Because that readlist looked a tiny bit panicky to post "content" and I found it amusing.

[RLotus]

Although the best question for RLotus is, did the apparent claim increase or diminish your scumread on Maduisha? excluding the idea of a policy elim.

My read on her hasnt progressed whatsoever after her reactioon to me.

[RLotus]

tbh I feel like I can see how you view that vote as OMGUS but that's kind of stretchy. I think Maduisha might actually think that way, even if it is blatantly wrong.

I could see her actually thinking this if she said something like this or that part of your read doesnt make sense to me/I don't understand how you have that read. But like, she said in general having a readslist this early is scummy. It just feels contrived to me.

[RLotus]

What about Binatog?

Wouldn't be opposed if that is where we want to go for today. I'd like see him respond to the rest of the stuff about him, no definitive read yet.

I really think Maduisha is the better option tho.

[RLotus]

I believe what Enchant was saying is "I believe the wagon was started by town, but maybe scum jumped in", so that means he thinks scum might be on his wagon even if a town player started it, and Emperor agrees. So, do they really not match in impressions?

Here's you helping clear up confusion about enchant's post

About eliminating someone through votes: I prefer that to be the case instead of voting not to eliminate anyone. I'm on the side that thinks eliminating a player can bring information both if they're town or scum, based on the interactions of that player with the people that accused them/defended them.

Here's you talking about elim policy

Mason is PR because if both are alive, they can clear each other. Alternatively, if one of them is dead, the living one can be cleared if the dead partner bread crumbed who is their mason in their previous posts. So, they are powerful in the sense that they can clear each other. And mafia can't know for sure if there are or aren't any masons during D1. They have a bracket of "possible PR" thanks to their own roles, until players die and they can narrow down the setup.

and you explaining masons

3 times you jumped in and helped and were being explainy. I really don't believe you believe in your scum read of me.

[RLotus]

Friend, did you read the page where you got the elimination post from? Because people were talking about no-elimination and such and I was just giving my opinion on the matter.

And the Enchant stuff was just that I thought he misread the stance. Really? Lol.

It's not those things you said that are scummy, you said I lied about the way you acted and there you go counter evidence.

Your panicked reaction and being overly defensive is why you are scummy.

[RLotus]

i'm really torn on Maduisha. I think there are scummier slots ultimately. Yes, they are overly defensive, but is it scum indicative? or are they just disgruntled town with a low tolerance for things not going their way?

They acted this way when I was the only one reading her scum and voting her. I understand your argument about disgruntled town, but when does a town start to get defensive after a single vote without much threat to it anyway.

[RLotus]

My apologies if I am making the game unfun for you. This is how I read the game atm nothing personal or anything.

[RLotus]

It's not about that it is innappropriate what you said in the context, but that you kept jumping in to help instead of taking your own stances. Whatever I've explained it already.

[RLotus]

Like you are coming in and resolve the argument

[RLotus]

Vote Count
Maduisha: RLotus, enchant, binatoga
Binatoga: Rockhopper
RLotus: Maduisha
Emperor: BM
Enchant: Mini
Not Voting: ben, Emperor

[RLotus]

He fooled town hard in the last game I played with him, BM and Mini were in it too

[RLotus]

Here is a bit of a state of the game read I've been thinking about.

I find it weird how the game seamlessly goes in the direction that BM takes it in. What I mean by this is that there is a pattern where BM states that he has some suspicion on someone/want to elim someone and several others chime in giving reads on that person analyzing them with little resistance. I'm almost certain that he is being spewed at this point, but it also seems that his reads are being sheeped by the scum.

I guess essentially what I'm saying is it is suspicious how easily BM's reads are gaining traction.

[RLotus]

So, imo emperor and enchant are the wrong place to look. It seems like most are happy with these kills. No one has stepped up to defend enchant, and only enchant has stepped up to defend emperor. I guess it is possible they are just the team. But, it doesn't feel right to me how easily they are being served up, I would expect more friction.

[RLotus]

I think the mafia is in Ben, Maduisha, Rock, Bina, Rock least likely to me atm.

We are tunneling two towns, I wish I could have swayed you guys, but whatever. I'd much rather go for ben rn.

VOTE: ben dover

[RLotus]

He was a light town read to begin with and I just think enchant, emp, BM , and mini are town so yeah

Funny you say that you can be swayed since youre literally not thinking for youself this game lol

[RLotus]

I've actually lost confidence in my scum read on you, mainly because it is unliikely that a scum so blatantly gives their vote up. Still possible, and your outside of my auto circle.

But damn that passive aggressiveness is really annoying

[RLotus]

I'm just gonna be real with you Im not gonna interact with you much because i cant stand that shit

[RLotus]

Honestly you are just outside my town reads

[RLotus]

I think it's better not to talk about night meta, just gives mafia more information

[RLotus]

pretty sure thats e-1 for ben

[RLotus]

Vote Count
Ben: Rlotus, BM, Maduisha, Rock
Emperor: Enchant, Mini, Binatog
Not Voting: Emperor, Ben

[RLotus]

out of everyone in this thread you think i was sheeping bm...

[RLotus]

yeah fair enough thats why i put a vc so there is no excuse

[RLotus]

out of everyone in this thread you think i was sheeping bm...

everyone is basically sheeping bm to some extent but I feel like you are the one that is doing it the most, no offense.

I called his top 2 scum town I feel like Im one of the only ones not sheeping him haha

[RLotus]

BM, do you not find it strange how youve got an army of voters?

I really hope you can reevaluate your town reads from today, because I'm pretty sure you are town, and I feel we are going in the wrong direction harping on the same scum reads.

[RLotus]

I mean I'm pretty sure it was going to be emp until you put your vote on ben

[RLotus]

I mean I'm pretty sure it was going to be emp until you put your vote on ben

have you not read or something

what?

[RLotus]

Just kicking me when I'm down.... -.-

no no i thought it could be ben too

I guess what Im saying is i think the scum is outside of enchant and emp, and in the people who seem to be sheeping you

[RLotus]

bm has literally tried to wagon emp all game and the only person that has more or less listened is mini

Pedit: no I'm a activity demon

Emp was at e-1 and matduisha said she was going to hammer until BM changed his vote. It was going to be emp until bm decided other wise.

[RLotus]

like god damn i will say besides the towncore everyone else is in pieces

town is certainly in pieces i agree

[RLotus]

wait how are you so certain on rock he hasnt said a whole lot since earlier in the day

[RLotus]

if Emp is mafia PR, I'm gonna be so annoyed.

if emp ends up being mafia i will apologize

[RLotus]

did he do something so far out of his mafia range or something? I dont see what you see then

[RLotus]

No really, you don't know how i'm furious now, because of BM words.

bruh relax

[RLotus]

am i missing something about rockhopper or what

[RLotus]

I'm going to give my full reads, because I am pretty happy with my conclusion.

BM- pretty obvious town, I don't think I need to go into detail

Rockhopper- I believe I see what BM and ben saw, I don't know if I would say I "know" he is town, but I will have faith in their read.

Emperor - I know this will be my most controversial read, but I strongly believe he is town at this point. My main argument as to why is the wagon that formed on him. BM, Binatog, Mini, and Enchant voted on him, and then Maduisha claimed intent to hammer. The people not on the wagon were me (who I know is town, Ben (who flipped town), and Rock(who BM "knows" is town. So, from my perspective, either his partner must have voted on him or both of the mafia voted on him. Or, we are wrong about rock. Now, I understand how you can put me and him as the team, but obviously I know this isn't true. To me, the most likely conclusion is both mafia voted on him.

Maduisha- I've unfortunately come around to her being town. Firstly, the way she openly is admitting to sheeping BM seems too blunt for a mafia to do. And, even though she is voting with BM, she does have opposing opinions to him at times, which shows she is still trying to solve the game and it implies that she isn't trying to push an agenda. Furthermore, she has stated the same read on me for same/similar reasons, which is something I do when I really believe in my read, so I am inclined to believe her read on me is genuine.

Mini- I strongly believe this slot is mafia. The way she has formed her reads are directly in reaction to the opinion's of BM. I had a hunch somoething like this was going on yesterday, but after looking through the thread Mini seems the most obviously doing it to me. When BM tunneled Emperor, Mini jumped on him as well. When BM tunneled enchant, Mini jumped along. When BM put suspicion on Binatog and then reverted it into believing he is town, Mini suspiciously also came to the conclusion that he is town.

Binatog- I believe this is Mini's most likely partner. I read through Binatog's last game and it is strikingly familiar the way he acts around Mini as he did to his mason partner that game. On post 272 (not sure how to link sorry) he implies in a round about way that Mini is town by asking about Mini's reads on myself and Maduisha. He then goes on to sheep Mini's supposed reads on post 301. I think he misunderstood what Mini's reads actually were, because he puts both myself and Maduisha scum. This is strange in it of itself because I don't understand how from a town perspective you don't see the dichotomy between myself and Maduisha.

TLDR: I think the team is Mini and Binatog

[RLotus]

VOTE: mini

I am glad you came to the same conclusion

VOTE: Mini

[RLotus]

Emp

[RLotus]

but honestly I can only really see Rock as emp's partner if emp is scum

[RLotus]

It's either {Maduisha, Ben} or {RLotus, Binatog} if Emp flips town I guess.

Care to elaborate about the associations you drew to make these pairings? I want to understand the logic behind them.

Unless I'm underestimating your scum game, {you, RLotus} or {you, Binatog} seem relatively unlikely based on your interactions.
I had {Enchant, me, BM, Emp, Mini} for my town pool leaving {ben, Maduisha, RLotus, Binatog} for scum, so those were the most likely combinations based on the previous inference.

With ben's flip, my pool is now {Maduisha, RLotus, Binatog, Emp}, where {Binatog, Emp}, {Maduisha, RLotus}, {Maduisha, Emp}, {Maduisha, Binatog} are decreasingly unlikely teams.
Meaning it's either {RLotus, Emp} or {RLotus, Binatog} from my perspective and I'm willing to bet on the former. VOTE: RLotus

Can you explain why you read Mini town?

[RLotus]

What does this mean?

There were four votes on Emp and Maduisha had claimed intent to hammer, so if BM hadnt switched his vote to ben, Emperor was going to be the elim for the day.

[RLotus]

If your suspicion arises from the fact that she sheeped BM the whole time, how is it different from me? What did you find towny in me?

Ben and BM both say they "know" you are town. I believe this was based on your VT slip when you said you think Emperor could be PR. Whatever Im just going to be transparent about it sense I think it's pretty obvious at this point.

I'm kind of just having faith in their read of you for today but honetly I'm not entirely confident in reading you one way or the other. I will say though, that you are different from Mini in that you went on ben instead of piling on the emp wagon.

[RLotus]

I've played with Mini twice before and she was lurky/reserved both times. I think these are qualities of scum!Mini and a larger dataset supports the same.

So, essentially you are saying she is different from her typical scum game?

[RLotus]

Yeah. I'll change my mind if I'm proven wrong though.

Well, she hasn't exactly "lurked", but she hasn't pushed a single independent opinion, so she was reserved in that sense. I'll try to illustrate to you what I mean.

I'm not even gonna get into the inconsistency between this stance of "wagons are great, let's use them to town hunt" to suddenly "oh no, a wagon, it's a tragedy". Like, can you explain how the 3-vote wagon on Enchant would 'help us town hunt', but when it became a 4-vote wagon suddenly it was time to panic and abandon ship? How did you see that playing out when you made post 21?

I have the same question to be honest because iirc I don’t believe we had a chance to see Enchant’s reaction to the E-1 vote being placed on them. Even though that’s part of day one is collecting info based on reactions

Jumps on BM's read of Emperor.

Enchant and Emp making exactly the same defence on behalf of Emp, but not acknowledging each other, and of course the defence doesn't hold water as I noted above.

That is not something I noticed to be honest it does seem too coordinated to be a coincidence

Jumps on the suspicion that BM had of enchant.

So my thoughts on that discussion/interaction between RLotus and Maduisha is as follows

Maduisha wants rlotus to talk more
Rlotus posts readlist
all of a sudden a readlist is paniky and forced. Well they asked for them to talk more and to me this just seems opportunistic to jump onto something that hasn't happened yet and saying its too early.
Then they jump to another argument with no further discussion on the read llist.

I dunno but something doesnt sit right with that

The only real independent direction that she pushed.

yeah ok so I don't think that was Maduisha's choice, so I don't hold them accountable for that. They responded to the topic of conversation at the time.

Yeah alright maybe im just reading too much into it

Quickly shut down after BM has a differing opinion.

@Battle Mage I have read Binatogs last game and can see what you mean with the change of tone and play not sure at this point if it’s scum or not though but it’s definitely something to watch

Jumps on BM's suspicion of binatog (notice as opposed to enchant and emp, she acts as if she is unsure on binatog, while enchant and emp she straight up agreed with BM's suspicions)

yeah i really like post 356 by Binatog. good post. if anyone is genuinely thinking about flipping Binatog today, we can talk about it.

(Post 402) Mini says the analysis of Bina looks good for him, after papa BM says it is ok of course

[RLotus]

So, in short, while she has been fairly vocal, she has been reserved in a sense that she is not really pushing her own opinions.

Thoughts, rock?

[RLotus]

Looking back at the last game I played with her (newbie 2042) she wasnt afraid whatsoever to give her reads.

[RLotus]

In her defence, she was part of a

townblock

and BM kept saying agreeable stuff.

How about we eliminate Emp today. If he flips scum, we give ourselves up to be elimmed the following days, and if he flips town we go for {Mini, Binatog}.

That's a very logical proposition. I'm not sure I have to think that over

[RLotus]

Doesn't exactly feel right to elim someone who I think is town in favor of someone I'm fairly confident is mafia, dunno

[RLotus]

Eh idk. That plan loses to you + mini and you + bina, which both are perfectly reasonable

Also to me + bina which you yourself said is a possibility

The fact that we seem to be on the same page with possible worlds does make me just want to call you town tho.

[RLotus]

So I cant agree and go along with the player I trust most in the game? Okay gotcha ill just go along by myself and disagree with everything everyone says

Well I'd expect some disagreements somewhere, some of your own conviction. May I ask who you think the scum are/ a read list?

[RLotus]

If I understand correctly you are saying that you town read Rock here? Which I completely agree with just trying to understand

Eh no but moreso I'm having faith in BM's and ben's read of him for now. He is the biggest question mark for me atm.

Why do you find this the most likely conclusion?

I think it is most likely the case that both scum voted on emp, because of how easily the push on him got traction. He just kept getting piled on and piled on, even before the votes were happening. When a push is town pushing on scum, I expect there to be friction due to differences of opinion amongst the town. But the way votes easily piled up on him, it seemed scum were just riding BM's wave, if you will.

Why is it unfortunate that you come around to them being town?

I don't where her head is now, but before she was pretty keen on tunneling me. It would be much easier if she was scum and I could fight her back rather than trying to sway her opinion.

[RLotus]

I’ll do this when I can I will also continue catching up when I can having a bit of a rl issue atm will be back later

alright no worries

[RLotus]

Why do you find this the most likely conclusion?

I think it is most likely the case that both scum voted on emp, because of how easily the push on him got traction. He just kept getting piled on and piled on, even before the votes were happening. When a push is town pushing on scum, I expect there to be friction due to differences of opinion amongst the town. But the way votes easily piled up on him, it seemed scum were just riding BM's wave, if you will.

How would you compare this with ben's wagon?

Ben's wagon started with you and I voting him in defiance of the emp wagon. BM changed his mind on the emp wagon and jumped on the ben wagon, and Maduisha his double vote followed suit. Enchant then prematurely hammered seemingly out of frustration/impatience.

Emp and ben's wagons are similar in that they didn't get a whole lot of pushback.

Ben's is different in that wagon on him was impulsive. There wasn't much discussion beforehand. Emperor was being pushed on all day.

[RLotus]

You were more helpful to town as a double vote

[RLotus]

I wonder why. Are you trying to distract people from the fact that Emperor's wagon crashed because of you on D1 with this kind of petty drama?

Um no, I've been very clearly vocal about emperor being town

[RLotus]

Ive even stated how from other's prespectives that me + emp makes sense, no idea how you even came to this conclusion

[RLotus]

There is a lot there, I will respond to it piece by piece

[RLotus]

yet it was only BM pointing fingers at him for most of D1 with no one following

this is just false

I'm not even gonna get into the inconsistency between this stance of "wagons are great, let's use them to town hunt" to suddenly "oh no, a wagon, it's a tragedy". Like, can you explain how the 3-vote wagon on Enchant would 'help us town hunt', but when it became a 4-vote wagon suddenly it was time to panic and abandon ship? How did you see that playing out when you made post 21?

I have the same question to be honest because iirc I don’t believe we had a chance to see Enchant’s reaction to the E-1 vote being placed on them. Even though that’s part of day one is collecting info based on reactions

Mini piling on to emperor

I'm scumreading this regardless of whether it's a lie or not.

and rock piling on

[RLotus]

Furthermore, I don't understand why you said Emp is town because of the wagon that formed on him. You think they both voted him because he was "free",

Alright I'm just going to explain why I think Emp is town

Starting with the basis of my initial hypothesis on day one, centered around the way BM was able to get traction with his reads. The logic being that it was strange that he was able to unite town into pushing on one person, when typically there will be disagreements amongst town on the person they are pushing on. So therefore, there must be scum backing his pushes. And therefore, the people he is pushing on must be town (enchant/emp). This was a hunch or gut feeling if you will, and I didn't have solid scumreads at this point.

After analyzing the wagon that formed on Emperor, my suspicion was seemingly supported. The 4 people voting on emp were bina, mini, enchant, and BM, with you claiming the hammer. Now, if we look at the people off of the wagon, me(who I know is town), ben(who flipped town), and rock.

I did and will again say that it is entirely possible that the team is rock + emp, given that rock was off of his wagon. Both ben and BM say that they 'know' rock is town, and if I am to trust them (I still have my suspicion), it would lead me to believe that everyone off of the emp wagon is town. And if everyone off of the wagon is town, there must be either 2 scum on the wagon or emp is scum and his partner voted on him.

I'm more inclined to think that 2 scum were on the wagon than a scum voting on his partner there. So, to me it seems emp is just most likely town.

[RLotus]

^Maduisha is correct. Mini and Rock did not have a strong view on Emp. Mini above reflected a small concern, and Rock ultimately defended Emp.

ok but mini kept poking suspicion on emp, I can put more quotes but its a bit of a chore

and Rock yeah did change his mind but nonetheless your push on emp had traction

[RLotus]

And now let's see who voted Emp, who you argue is town because of the quick traction of the wagon indicating 1-2 scum on it:

It wasn't solely the fact that emp's wagon got traction. It was a larger hypothesis about the way people are playing around BM, his pushes, and ultimately the wagon that he led.

[RLotus]

According to you, a wagon on town builds quickly while a wagon on scum has more issue to happen. We know Ben was town, so I wonder why are you not reconsidering BM, or me (Rock I know you're not sure yet) as opposed as blaming it on Binatog and Mini so quickly, both who would benefit from either wagon if your claim were to be true.

This is simplifying my reasoning a lot, perhaps I didn't explain it well enough initially. It isn't solely the fact that how easily a wagon gets traction. It is a read on how people were bunching up on BM's pushes. This should make it pretty clear why I don't reconsider BM, because he is the reliable town read to form other reads on.

And the logic doesn't really apply to Ben's wagon, because BM wasn't the one leading it. Nor was he similar to emp in the fact that BM pushed him and he easily got support. Ben's wagon formed very impulsively seemingly.

[RLotus]

We know Ben was town, so I wonder why are you not reconsidering BM, or me (Rock I know you're not sure yet) as opposed as blaming it on Binatog and Mini so quickly

And I would like to clarify that reading Mini and Bina isn't solely from the wagon traction thing, but I have strong reads independent from the emp wagon on everyone in the game (aside from rock). I've explained them all to some extent in my reads list.

Mini especially I find extremely scummy and I put together what I believe to be a compelling case on her. And bina fits really well as her partner.

The pieces just kind of fell together.

[RLotus]

To me it looks like you're trying to protect Emp

Yeah, clearly I've been trying to protect emp because I think he is town and I have confidence in who I think are scum.

Also, yes I began ignoring you because I was fed up with you. At this point tho I find it hard to believe you are scum, and our win condition involves bringing together lost town, so that's what I'm doing.

[RLotus]

Binatog, give me your thoughts man

My thoughts:
I didn't read about Mini's past games, but this game she played town in the early phase on first day, but suddenly I saw her only joining your wagons, which kinda pings me. I want Emp to post tho. I don't know if Emp is lurking or just an AFK player. She also didn't post a single reads list.

Possible teams imo: {Emp, Mini}, {Mini, Maduisha}, {Madiusha, Emp}, {Rock, Mini} with last being unlikely teams.

Can I ask why you thin Emp and mini is the most likely team?

Also, when did you decide you think Mini is mafia? Did you think she was towny yesterday and your mind changed? If so when/why?

[RLotus]

I'm betting half my soul on town!Mini, but if this means I can pursue RLotus tomorrow then so be it.

I don't get why you're so condifent on mini based solely on meta

[RLotus]

Mini and I is such a parnoid world

[RLotus]

paranoid*

[RLotus]

like the easiest solve here is:

Mini-RLotus

although it's probably not that simple

Can you explain why you put Mini and I together, and especially why you read me scum at all

[RLotus]

im annoyed at being paired at mini after making such an elaborate case on her and pushing her all day

[RLotus]

out of all the teams you could come up with...

[RLotus]

is it mass claim time already

[RLotus]

Mini is trying to allign me but i do NOT consent if that isnt obvious

[RLotus]

Mini is trying to allign me but i do NOT consent if that isnt obvious

yes that much was obvious

this game would be so much easier if you guys could find me town idk what I do to be scum but whatever

[RLotus]

could be emperor binatog

[RLotus]

im happy to treat you as town if mini flips town, but not sure the best way to play today

ROCK SAYS IM MAFIA AFTER MINI FLIPS TOWN AAAAAAA

[RLotus]

so
Bintaog thinks it is Mini Emperor
Mini thinks it is Emperor Binatog
Emperor thinks it is Mini

What I find strange is how binatog flipped his read on Mini from yesterday and Mini flipped her read on bina from yesterday. I am trying to see the motivation here. Is their purpose to distance? Seems logical in this scenario. It's possible one of them is genuine. There was already suspicion on Mini so are Bina and Emperor taking advantage of that?

I also find weird how easily emperor jumped on my side, even though that is the conclusion I would expect him to come to. Wish he posted more.

[RLotus]

ug

[RLotus]

VOTE: binatog
I'm happy with binatog

[RLotus]

I believe that's E-1 btw

[RLotus]

you are not gonna like my answer

[RLotus]

you are not gonna like my answer

You think me?

yea

[RLotus]

if not you then emperor

[RLotus]

could be rock too, I'm really kinda lost if it isnt you mini

[RLotus]

Maduisha put on a great performance if she is scum

[RLotus]

this game is such chaos

[RLotus]

could be emperor binatog

didn't you say im town?

yeah Im having some doubts

[RLotus]

what troubles you?

Well, BM and Maduisha are very strong town at this point

Rock's thought process today has been towny, so he is somewhat town to me, and well everyone keeps reassuring me about his tonwiness

Initially I just thought mini/bina, but Mini is being strange I don't know if Im as confident on her now as before

so that leaves you

[RLotus]

i still want to vote inside of mini bina today tho

[RLotus]

also it's strange how all three of you are allying with me, since I probably could have been pushed over by now

idk dude Im confused

[RLotus]

also it's strange how all three of you are allying with me, since I probably could have been pushed over by now

idk dude Im confused

what do you mean?

If bina and mini is the team it seems like the path to least resistance would be for at least one of them to call me scum, since maduisha and rock already want to vote me today

tbf bm hadnt said he thought I was scum with mini yet, so maybe you and bina decided to vote mini thinking it would be me, bm, you, bina voting mini

but maybe mini and bina just wanted to distance by voting each other

[RLotus]

who did you track

[RLotus]

Binatog, claim please

see post 900

what was this about

[RLotus]

starting to think I was dead wrong

[RLotus]

yup wanted to see if mini was online and saw him

[RLotus]

well he certainly isnt coordinated with mini

[RLotus]

he seems genuine about not knowing its wrong to fake claim as vt

but maybe he just got caught out? idk

[RLotus]

talk to me about this

i've lost confidence in mini and bina being scummy independtly

and im far less inclined to believe bina and mini are partners now, which was the most likely team in my head

[RLotus]

I agree he seems genuine.

The counter-argument is:

Is it really intuitive for town in their 2nd ever game to choose to fakeclaim a power role? It's an unexpected move to say the least.

Where did he learn about breadcrumbs, and "baiting scum to kill me"? It feels a little gambity

How did he know to claim Tracker?

well he crumbed tfn and then claimed tracker, I don't necessarily think he "knew" to claim tracker

[RLotus]

The players Ben and Norfolk gave me a friendly approach

[RLotus]

well he certainly isnt coordinated with mini

if you get what I mean

[RLotus]

well he certainly isnt coordinated with mini

if you get what I mean

i think i get what you mean, and also disagree, if that makes sense?

hm ok

anyways, I think if bina is scum were more than likely not in the jk + vt set up seeing how easily he backed down

[RLotus]

Did you want me online for a reason?

to see if youre feeding him the claim or something

[RLotus]

oh lmao he did crumb tracker

[RLotus]

in your PT

[RLotus]

anyway I need to re-evaluate
UNVOTE:

[RLotus]

Do not fake claim a power role as town! While it may help you avoid getting eliminated, you might cause a real PR to out themselves by counterclaiming - then the mafia will know who the PR is, and you will probably get eliminated for lying to town. Feel free to fake a claim as scum, though, if you think it would help.

did you see this in the intro post as well

[RLotus]

What does your PoE suggest?

I don't know what my PoE is anymore

Before my town were me, BM, Maduisha, you. Flip flopping between you and emp.

[RLotus]

this game is hysterical

[RLotus]

RLotus please tell me you don’t agree with this stupid idea of a mass claim

I think it is fine for reasons that I'm going to be vague about

[RLotus]

Mini and bina throwing haymakers

[RLotus]

Damn I think you may be right

Now that I look back at it he has been shamelessly PR hunting. Pushing mini and I today when her and I makes no sense as a team, and we happen to be 2 of not very many people who haven't insinuated VT

[RLotus]

Actually wanting mass claim fits scum!BM wincon because it gives him an excuse to be alive as the universal town read on day 3 if all PR are outed and the mafia kill is telegraphed due to that.

Fuck no. I'm getting brain rot. Someone help me...

Pretty sure BM knows who the PR is

[RLotus]

Vote Count
Binatog- Maduisha, Mini
Emperor- Rock
Mini- binatog
Not Voting- RLotus, BM, Emperor

[RLotus]

If BM really is scum, he could just lurk away and still win. That reaction to partner!Bina is completely uncalled for.

I think people will start becoming suspicious if he keeps staying alive night after night

[RLotus]

Scum!BM knowing who the PR is would not be the point, but rather the remaining PR becoming public knowledge that would erase suspicion of his slot if he were to be alive D3, because we would all consider it a given that the PR would die instead.

True, but if a PR dies tonight regardless I think he has a fine narrative as to why he is alive.

In the scenario that bina goes down today, and then BM makes it to final 3, I don't think it's a free win for him at all. There ought to be some questioning of him then.

Honestly, I think he is just doing what he wants bc he thinks he is untouchable at this point. Ignoring everyone question asked of him, acting as if it was ridiculous that mini would shade him, not bothering to explain his reads, and potentially just blatantly helping out his partner.

This makes a lot of sense to me in a game that has started to make no sense.

[RLotus]

Why would he start a wagon on Bina at all if that's the case?
Mini's posts up until that point (assuming {BM, Bina}) strongly hint PR.

1. To distance.
2. To make it seem natural the way he bounces around on different people when he is PR hunting.

I saw him do something very similar to this in newbie 2040 with his partner.

[RLotus]

Y’all cool if I hammer?

Whoa, whoa, whoa slow down there, being a little hasty

no one is hammerable atm, but you are welcome to try

[RLotus]

VOTE: binatog

[RLotus]

Ill wait for the PR stuff but

damn near certain on BM

[RLotus]

VOTE: RLotus

Mini, are you a PR?

I dont want to answer this right now

dont you have the game solved at this point

[RLotus]

hold on you didnt track me night 1?

[RLotus]

hold on you didnt track me night 1?

Yes but that doesnt exactly clear you it couldve been Binatog that did the kill that night if you are scum

I really believe Rock is town but I suppose it could be them too

you think the roleblocker didnt visit ?

[RLotus]

anyway I was sure without the tracker result
VOTE: BM

[RLotus]

ya

[RLotus]

I dont know much about roleblocker meta
but I figure you always rb there since the chance is pretty good with rock and maduisha both slipping vt day 1

[RLotus]

I dont know much about roleblocker meta
but I figure you always rb there since the chance is pretty good with rock and maduisha both slipping vt day 1

Would they block a person who did VT slip though?

I really dont know and its so stressful

no I mean you got two vt slips and the 2 mafia, so 4 possible prs, 2 chances to stop the tracker with rb and kill

[RLotus]

ah nvm its just 1/3 since they wanted to kill jk forgot

[RLotus]

then its you or rock more likely rock since I have trouble seeing you with binatog

[RLotus]

I read that in normal games mafia prs cant multi task
and I think newbies are normal

[RLotus]

can I quote the wiki?

[RLotus]

In the wiki under normal games

Mafia must specify which member is performing the factional kill each night. A mafia member may not both kill and use a power role in the same night by default.

[RLotus]

I cant fnd anything I might just wait for Sirius to answer because I am stressing so bad

its just bm

[RLotus]

Well that was compelling BM, not sure at all anymore

[RLotus]

UNVOTE:

[RLotus]

you mean emp

[RLotus]

is the mod allowed to answer whether mafia can multitask or not?

[RLotus]

could ask Mod to confirm in thread!

well she did haha

[RLotus]

the things that make me unsure are the fact that it totally makes sense that she tracked me from the dialogue between BM and Mini at the end of day 1

seems really strange that binatog tried to fake claim after mini softed, and when I say softed she laid it on pretty thick

and if bina missed that she was softing, why would he back down to BM so easily in the 1 PR setup

I also kind of had it in my head when I saw Maduisha die that BM's play was to push Mini, because emp, maduisha, and I had all expressed that we thought BM was mafia and if we are all alive it will be hard for you. This way, BM can bring Rock and I to final, and Rock has been very adamant about BM town.

[RLotus]

you mean emp

BM because scum!him roleblocks 100% of the time

if he rbs then it is a lot easier to think mini is telling the truth, I'm not sure it's 100%

[RLotus]

It's virtually auto for me at this point, but rock thinking BM is confirmed comfirms my paranoia about a me + Rock + BM final three.

VOTE: BM

[RLotus]

bro what is your fixation with me this game

[RLotus]

Eh whatever, one of the reasons I backed off of her yesterday is because I thought her being PR explained her play on day 1, but i realize the last game I played with her she was or and was nothing like that, she’s probably just scum
VOTE: Mini

[RLotus]

ggs

[RLotus]

yea

[RLotus]

btw BM my purpose wasn’t to criticize your reads on day 1 that is just how my reads were forming around you

[RLotus]

Spoiler:

I'm going to give my full reads, because I am pretty happy with my conclusion.

BM- pretty obvious town, I don't think I need to go into detail

Rockhopper- I believe I see what BM and ben saw, I don't know if I would say I "know" he is town, but I will have faith in their read.

Emperor - I know this will be my most controversial read, but I strongly believe he is town at this point. My main argument as to why is the wagon that formed on him. BM, Binatog, Mini, and Enchant voted on him, and then Maduisha claimed intent to hammer. The people not on the wagon were me (who I know is town, Ben (who flipped town), and Rock(who BM "knows" is town. So, from my perspective, either his partner must have voted on him or both of the mafia voted on him. Or, we are wrong about rock. Now, I understand how you can put me and him as the team, but obviously I know this isn't true. To me, the most likely conclusion is both mafia voted on him.

Maduisha- I've unfortunately come around to her being town. Firstly, the way she openly is admitting to sheeping BM seems too blunt for a mafia to do. And, even though she is voting with BM, she does have opposing opinions to him at times, which shows she is still trying to solve the game and it implies that she isn't trying to push an agenda. Furthermore, she has stated the same read on me for same/similar reasons, which is something I do when I really believe in my read, so I am inclined to believe her read on me is genuine.

Mini- I strongly believe this slot is mafia. The way she has formed her reads are directly in reaction to the opinion's of BM. I had a hunch somoething like this was going on yesterday, but after looking through the thread Mini seems the most obviously doing it to me. When BM tunneled Emperor, Mini jumped on him as well. When BM tunneled enchant, Mini jumped along. When BM put suspicion on Binatog and then reverted it into believing he is town, Mini suspiciously also came to the conclusion that he is town.

Binatog- I believe this is Mini's most likely partner. I read through Binatog's last game and it is strikingly familiar the way he acts around Mini as he did to his mason partner that game. On post 272 (not sure how to link sorry) he implies in a round about way that Mini is town by asking about Mini's reads on myself and Maduisha. He then goes on to sheep Mini's supposed reads on post 301. I think he misunderstood what Mini's reads actually were, because he puts both myself and Maduisha scum. This is strange in it of itself because I don't understand how from a town perspective you don't see the dichotomy between myself and Maduisha.

TLDR: I think the team is Mini and Binatog

A very accurate read, yet you didn't pushed Mini day 2.

true, I took a bit of a detour on BM haha, good thing they convinced me in the end

[RLotus]

I want to apologize to RLotus and BM for shitpushing them

Hey no worries