Newbie 2087 | Celebrating Betty White | End!

[Somnus]

I hereby declare this town BETTYVILLE! Let's rid it of scum!

[Somnus]

Golden Girls Townbloc January 13th Member List

Basic Membership

Ahri

Pending Acceptance of Basic Membership

Somnus

Despite my knowledge on The Golden Girls being woefully inadequate, I humbly accept. I think I can trust you...for now. Please don't betray me with any scummy scum shenanigans.

[Somnus]

Random Questions:

(1) What name should we call you by?
(2) What's your mafia experience like?
(3) What's your favourite mafia role?
(4) Have you played League of Legends, and if so, what's your favourite champion?
(5) Give me one player in this game who you think will probably be town, and one player who you think will probably be mafia (not yourself).

I'll play along since most of us aren't here yet and we're officially in a club of 2 members.

1.) Somnus
2.) Looks like I've played about 6 games offsite over the last year or two.
3.) As town, as lame as this sounds, vanilla townie. I also enjoy playing as the cop. As mafia, the one time that I got mafia roleblocker was pretty fun.
4. No League of Legends for me.
5. No clue, as only three of us have posted.

[Somnus]

only 6 games offsite?? that's interesting, are all of these in person with friends (i.e. party game), or?

Nah. Other forums. Haven't played the in-person version and I don't know that I'd enjoy it.

[Somnus]

I've mostly played on a forum dedicated to a pretty popular band from the 80's. I'm gonna hold off on mentioning it for the time being because there's a lot of very NSWF content on the forum. If you are absolutely deathless curious at the end of the game, I'd be more than happy to tell you the exact site.

Fast games can definitely be more fun. It varies, I suppose. If a game is taking a while but there's interesting stuff going on, I don't mind it taking a long time.

[Somnus]

[img]https://tenor.com/view/betty-white-danc ... if-8173211][/img]

Did I image correctly???

[Somnus]

Apparently not

[Somnus]

One more try without the extra bracket.

Fail???

[Somnus]

Much appreciated, Progo!

[Somnus]

Hah! Not really familiar with them. Off to wikipedia I go.

[Somnus]

Hah! Not really familiar with them. Off to wikipedia I go.

Well, now you have to tell me what band it is.

GnR. Like I said, I don't want to elaborate more than that. Lots of content on the forum not suitable for here

[Somnus]

What's your initial read on Ahri?

Seems like a laid back, fun townie. I like her posting style. I don't think it makes for a good game when all 9 players are super serious the entire time. She wants to win but she also wants to have fun. I dig it.

As for why most of my posts have been off-topic, until you had posted, we were still waiting on 5 players to enter the thread. There's still 4 people who haven't posted. So for that reason, not much of a read on anyone at this point.

[Somnus]

Both. I believe she gives off early town vibes (which doesn't mean a whole lot 3 pages in). Early on, unless someone really trips up, I think active posting is a good sign more often than not. I've played in games where the most active poster gets targeted quickly on Day 1, only to inevitably flip town. As far as Day 1 goes, I tend to be much more suspicious of people posting very little or not at all.

[Somnus]

Hey yall! this seems like a fun crowd to play with, and I look forward to the game!! We're all sharing how experienced we are? umm I have like 8-9 years from EpicMafia (2012 till it died) then have been here since, wouldn't say I'm a pro at this, always learning!! And uhh you can call me Andante/Anda/anything close, I really don't mind,

Just gonna say sorry ahead of time, I'm usually strongest early game, and I'm gonna be V/LA till like Jan 18th/19th really busy with IRL stuff right now, probably going to try and show up tomorrow and give thoughts, but 16-18 probably can't say anything, we'll see what happens!

My early thoughts thus far? umm nothing is really standing out yet, but that's cause nothing game related is really happening. I like Progo trying to get a wagon on me going to get something to happen, however, I don't really recommend voting people for not showing up, like, if people just never show up, they get replaced, it's a lot better to have like 2-3 of yall vote someone who you know is around and will give you reactions. Now you'll probably go "It worked! Andante showed up!!!" yeah I'm here, but it's morning, and this'll likely be all you get from me today. Also, just keep in mind when yall are wagoning someone, have an idea of how many votes are on that person. As a general rule, Do not put someone at E-1 unless you are ok with limming them. So uhh please don't make people E-1 off the rule of "they haven't talked" thanks!

Alright got stuff I need to go deal with, might try and come back later today, if not, I'll be back roughly this time tomorrow

First of all, welcome. But secondly...

I'm not a big fan of this. While I'm not thrilled that you're going to be contributing little to nothing through most of Day 1, I do understand that real life happens. Your first post in the game is advising people to go after active participants in the game and let people who are posting little to nothing to just coast by and get rewarded for doing so.

I'm also not a big fan of anyone telling people how they can use their vote. Someone who lays down the hammering vote isn't more to blame for a potential mislim than the person who cast the first vote on them. It's a weird high-horse to be on with your first post of the game, intentional or not. Doesn't mean my reaction is, "OMG, MAFIA!" but I don't like it.

I'm likely holding off on voting for anyone for the first few days (IRL days, not game days). We still have a player who never entered the game and is presumably going to be replaced.

[Somnus]

Actually, two players who haven't entered the game.

[Somnus]

Hey yall! this seems like a fun crowd to play with, and I look forward to the game!! We're all sharing how experienced we are? umm I have like 8-9 years from EpicMafia (2012 till it died) then have been here since, wouldn't say I'm a pro at this, always learning!! And uhh you can call me Andante/Anda/anything close, I really don't mind,

Just gonna say sorry ahead of time, I'm usually strongest early game, and I'm gonna be V/LA till like Jan 18th/19th really busy with IRL stuff right now, probably going to try and show up tomorrow and give thoughts, but 16-18 probably can't say anything, we'll see what happens!

My early thoughts thus far? umm nothing is really standing out yet, but that's cause nothing game related is really happening. I like Progo trying to get a wagon on me going to get something to happen, however, I don't really recommend voting people for not showing up, like, if people just never show up, they get replaced, it's a lot better to have like 2-3 of yall vote someone who you know is around and will give you reactions. Now you'll probably go "It worked! Andante showed up!!!" yeah I'm here, but it's morning, and this'll likely be all you get from me today. Also, just keep in mind when yall are wagoning someone, have an idea of how many votes are on that person. As a general rule, Do not put someone at E-1 unless you are ok with limming them. So uhh please don't make people E-1 off the rule of "they haven't talked" thanks!

Alright got stuff I need to go deal with, might try and come back later today, if not, I'll be back roughly this time tomorrow

Fair enough. UNVOTE: Andante.

So... VOTE: Cat Scratch Ferver,

because I'm a dog person

because you voted for me!

Is this a defensive/retaliation vote or do you genuinely sniff Mafia here?

[Somnus]

I like Ahri so far, but yeah, it's a bit premature. People are going to go after each other, vote each other, and put pressure on each other for reactions. It's part of the game and everyone, myself included, should be ok with it. I'd be curious to see if she's as defensive about anyone else who joins the super serious townbloc.

[Somnus]

I don’t know anyone in this game. I’ve been on the site for less than two weeks. Any interactions I’ve had with the players in this game began yesterday and have been in this thread only. So no, you are incorrect in that assumption. I like her posting style and i think she gives off early town vibes. That’s the extent of it so far on my end. I don’t know why she’s so defensive of me and is already 100% certain I’m town, but I don’t have a problem with it for the time being. Again, maybe it goes back to our silly townbloc membership from the first couple pages. Or maybe I accidentally made a deal with the devil and in reality, she’s actually using me as a shield to protect herself. I don’t think the latter is the case, but I suppose time will tell.

[Somnus]

I don’t know anyone in this game. I’ve been on the site for less than two weeks. Any interactions I’ve had with the players in this game began yesterday and have been in this thread only. So no, you are incorrect in that assumption. I like her posting style and i think she gives off early town vibes. That’s the extent of it so far on my end. I don’t know why she’s so defensive of me and is already 100% certain I’m town, but I don’t have a problem with it for the time being. Again, maybe it goes back to our silly townbloc membership from the first couple pages. Or maybe I accidentally made a deal with the devil and in reality, she’s actually using me as a shield to protect herself. I don’t think the latter is the case, but I suppose time will tell.

I'm more asking what you like about their posts. I mentioned tone, which is basically just saying their posts "feel" townie. Tone is a read that is not really based on "What?" the person is saying, but instead "How?" a person is saying it. I wanted to clarify this because I'm not really sure what you mean by "posting style" because from one angle I can see posting style as a tone read. But I don't know, which is why I'm asking. Further, a tone read has nothing to do with your experience with that player. It just has to do with the feel of the posts.

Like, I ask about a tone read, because I think Ahri's tone is not bad at all, so I'm wondering if that's why you like their posts. AFAICT, you have tone reads and content reads and meta reads, which are all different. I'm saying I think Ahri's tone is good, but their content is bad.

Ah. I think I understand what you're saying now. In that case, yeah, posting style certainly isn't indicative of alignment. It's just an early feeling. There's not much to go by. I referenced it earlier on, but I've played in games where the most active poster usually get eliminated on Day 1 or Day 2. I don't have a ton of games under my belt, but whenever that has happened, each time, they have flipped town.

My assumptions, as well as anyone else's, are very much flawed and subject to change in the early parts of Day 1. I don't have a hardcore town vibe from anyone so far, and absolutely no scum vibe on anyone. I need more information and I need the people who have posted little to nothing to get involved first before I can gauge things better.

For whatever it's worth, I think most of our content has been mediocre to bad so far (which I suppose is fairly normal early on) and I think maybe her bad content perhaps stands out to you more because she has the most posts in the thread so far.

[Somnus]

Man, I figured I was going to be several pages behind once I finally got on here tonight. Since it’s been super slow, I’m going to reread the thread tonight, take notes, and look for anything relevant.

[Somnus]

Andante, why aren't you voting? Do you usually not vote?

To be fair, I haven’t voted either. By my count, there’s only been 5 total votes cast so far by 3 people. I’m not against the tactic of early votes to get people talking. I tend to vote carefully, and I don’t want to ignore the fact that 1 person who never showed up is being replaced and another hasn’t joined the game yet. I don’t want them coasting by.

[Somnus]

Fair. I’ll be home to re-read the whole thread and take notes in about an hour. I’m out in the frigid cold on mobile right now but wanted to see how the game was going.

[Somnus]

Hello all.

Hey! Welcome! Thanks for squeezing us into your schedule!

VOTE: MalcolmTucker

[Somnus]

Welcome back, Ahri. You may have a tough time reading PizzaPleb.

[Somnus]

Yeah I'll post them now. They're from last night, so they're mostly up to date. When I hopped on here earlier, I was going to post them and was debating holding off until tomorrow since you had just posted your huge analysis and I didn't want to flood the topic with huge notes from two people right at the same time.

Also, I know there'll be one or two people who jump on the fact that you and I ended up with mostly the same reads, but these were typed up last night, before Malcolm even entered the game and before you re-emerged.

[Somnus]

Player: Ahri
------------
-Quickly wanted to see who would join the townbloc (9)
-Invited Somnus into the townbloc (11)
-Polled the players to gain some insight on their experience/playing style (12)
-Quick vote on Andante based on his name (14)
-Votes for LicketyQuickety for refusing to name someone supspicious on page 1 (19)
-Clears Somnus of any chance of being Mafia despite little to go on (28)
-Suspects Lickety more than Progo. Keeps vote on Lickety (33)
-Good vibes from Cat Scratch before she's even posted? (37)
-Thinks mafia team is Lickety and Malcolm, even though Malcolm hasn't posted (37)
-Feud with Lickety continues (57)
-Defends Somnus immediately from Cat Scratch, even though Cat votes for Progo (76)

ANALYSIS: Chatty, but as pointed out by others, has offered very little actual content. Has made a slow-starting game more fun, but hasn't offered much of value so far. Is the overly-defensive stance towards me because of the townbloc thing? Is she a good townie looking out for someone new to the site? Is she planning on betraying me later, and I'm essentially her shield to keep a vote off of her for as long as I'm in the game? She also either forgot about or lied about having been scum in a previous game on the site, which was pointed out by Cat Scratch. This isn't particularly alarming to me, but it's not completely insignificant either.

Verdict: Leaning town but I need to see some actual game-related content from her in these next few days. Otherwise, I will have to re-evaluate this stance, as well as my position in the Super Official Golden Girls Townbloc. After a quick start, she has largely fallen off the map and hasn't been posting.


Player: LicketyQuickety
-----------------------
-Questions Ahri asking who everyone suspects on page 1 (15)
-Refuses to answer Ahri's survey (17)
-Their feud continues (20, 23)
-Answers the survey but refuses to suspect anyone (27)
-Again, feud continues (56)
-Backs off of Ahri (58)
-"This is way too premature" in regards to Ahri defending Somnus (97)
-Questions if I like Ahri based on her tone and not necessarily alignment (100)
-Further questions to Somnus on the above. Notes that Ahri's tone is good, content is bad (102)
-Asks Andante what her read on Ahri is (104)
-Feuds with Andante for not having a read on Ahri yet (107)
-Notes that Ahri has had weird behavior: "back off of Somnnus" and lying/misrembering having played a game as scum (111)
-Is Ahri's behavior playstyle or alignment oriented? (118)
-"The main thing I don't like from you is that you can't defend your view" (regarding Ahri) (120)
-Town reads on Pale Ale and Cat Scratch for investigating Ahri (121)
-Town reads Progo for unvoting Cat Scratch (122)
-Lightly Town reading Somnus for feeling pretty pure. (123)
-Process of Elimination leaves suspects as Andante, Malcolm, Ahri, Pizza. Malcolm and Pizza haven't posted (123)
-When Andante points out that that's too many town reads, considers removing Somnus from list of likely town (126)

ANALYSIS: Not afraid to mix it up and get confrontational with the other players early on. I think this speaks more to play-style than alignment. Not sure if this is hardcore tunneling of Ahri or if it's because Ahri had been the most active poster early on and drew a lot of attention on herself. We will see if he continues to focus on Ahri. Turns his attention on Andante, but the focus is still primarily on Andante's lack of read on Ahri. His town read on Cat Scratch is due to...yep, you guessed it...investigating Ahri. Light town read on me, but has 3 others ahead of me as pro-town. Suspects are Andante, Malcolm, Ahri as far as active players, and both of the inactive players.

Verdict: Slight town lean. I'm not sure. Early aggression can be read as pro-town. Nothing particularly alarming or questionable in here.

Player: ProgoWoshua
-------------------
-Receives a vote from Cat Scratch almost immediately. "Well, that's rude!" (68)
-3 minutes later, tosses a vote onto Andante for not having shown up yet (69)
-Unvotes Andante after their first post in which she warns of putting someone at E-1 early on. In the same post, proceeds to toss a vote onto Cat Scratch (71)
-Unvotes Cat Scratch because "I really doubt she's mafia" (81)
-Certain between Cat and Ahri that there's at least one townie (82)
-Comments on Cat Scratch exposing an inconsistency in Ahri hiding she has played as scum. Concludes both players are likely town and Ahri made a mistake (86)
-Seems overly apologetic for not knowing game-related abbreviations. "Apologies for the confusion", "I promise this won't happen again". I found this a little suspect. Nothing major, however (91)
-Confirms that the vote on Cat Scratch was just in defense/retaliation. This isn't a great sign (96)
-Thinks Ahri is trying way too hard to get on everyone's good terms, while Lickety is defending his position against everyone he disagrees with. Plays the naieve townie card. "Would scum really try to draw attention to themselves this early in the game? This is literally my first game on the site, so I don't quite know where the meta is right now. But without other information, I'm giving a townlean to both of them" (131)

ANALYSIS: Seems unsure of himself. Understandable, as it's his first game. Tosses a vote on Andante for not having shown up, but is way too easily talked out of it after one post. Tosses a defensive/retaliation vote on Cat Scratch. I'm not going to go too far with this one, but retaliation votes are more often from mafia players than town. Could just be inexperience. Inexperienced players are also likely to lash out with retaliation votes.

Verdict: Kind of suspicious. I'm getting a "I'm new but super town, guys!" vibe. It might actually be authentic. I'm not sure. Again, there's nothing particularly alarming here but the behavior is at least a little suspcious.

Player: Cat Scratch Fever
-------------------------
-Upon entering the game, asks for Somnus' read on Ahri (60)
-Points out that Somnus and Progo's posts have been off-topic. Votes for Progo to start an early wagon (61)
-Wants clarification on whether Somnus' town vibe from Ahri is based on alignment or personality (63)
-Discovers that Ahri has in fact played as scum once on the site before. This could potentially end up significant later on (66)
-Notes that Ahri coming to Somnus' defense so early is "weirdly strong tone for this stage of the game, especially on a post where I didn't even end up voting for Somnus" (83)
-Getting wagons going early in the game isn't indicative of alignment (85)
-Has Andante's opinion on Progo changed after Progo unvoted? (129)
-Points out that Andante keeps popping in but not answering questions (136)
-Belives Pale's first post reads as a townie (138)
-Andante seems town. Likes that she's posting reads, but disagrees with some of her content (141)
-Asks why Andante isn't voting. At this point, 4 active players, as well as 2 who haven't entered the game, have not voted (142)
-If andante thinks early wagons are important to move the game forward, I'd expect her to be voting in particular. Game feels sluggish, i suspect because there's little voting happening. I encourage everyone to vote! (146)

ANALYSIS: Wants to get the game going with votes very early. Again, I see that more as style of play and not alignment. Focuses early investigations on Ahri, as Ahri was the most active poster/focal point in the early parts of the game. She doesn't seem to trust Andante at first, but comes around to trusting her as Town. However, goes back to poking at Andante to put out a vote if Andante believes early wagons get the game going.

Verdict: Completely and utterly undecided. I don't have a lean here one way or the other yet.

Player: Pale Ale Dog
--------------------
-Kind of cringe first post. Nothing suspicious though (67)
-Townie vibes on Cat for investigating Ahri. Also thinks Ahri likely made a mistake (72)
-Goes after Progo for basically copying his post about Cat/Ahri. Nothing vicious or noteworthy, but worth mentioning (133)
-Quickly accepts Progo's response and thanks him for "being the 1st person to speak to me so far" (135)
-Believes Andante and Lickety were going after each other for town reads. Mentions that Ahri, Somnus, and Progo haven't done any investigations. Points out that we haven't heard from Malcolm yet (143)

ANALYSIS: Hasn't posted much yet. I think he and Progo are going to play/approach the game in a very similar manner. Has mostly stated information rather than analysis. Could be read as a mafia tell, but like Progo, I think it's more likely inexperience and he'd rather someone else take the charge and lead.

VERDICT: Completely and utterly undecided. I don't have a lean here one way or the other yet.

Player: Andante
---------------
-First post, points out that she's usually strongest in the early game but isn't going to be available much at all in the first week or so. Likes Progo starting an early wagon, even on herself. Does not recommend voting for people who haven't shown up. Believes it's better to go after the people who are currently playing. Preaches to people to have an idea of how many votes are on a person and to not put someone at E-1 unless you're ok with eliminating them. I found this post VERY alarming (70)
-Reiterates that she feels Progo is townie (79)
-Pretty sure that Somnus is town, Lickety leans scum. Will explain later (103)
-Nothing on Ahri, "the final 2 not TRed are maf". Which two? (105)
-Fairly confident Somnus is town from post 101 (109)
-Tries to explain Ahri's backoff comment regarding Somnus as a playstyle thing. "If 2 of my TRs are fighting I'll yell at them to focus elsewhere" (113)
-Series of posts going at it with Lickety. Scumreads him for making minor stuff significant. Likes people moving the game along with votes to put pressure on them and getting them to talk (117)
-Again, will answer a question later (119)
-Believes that Lickety has too many town reads already (124)
-Somnus is the one town read she understands right now (127)
-No town read on Ahri yet. Little of what Ahri has said has been game related.

ANALYSIS: I REALLY didn't like that first post. She came into the game, announcing that she wouldn't be very active in the early going (real life happens), and I didn't buy the whole "I like that Progo is starting a wagon on me to get the game going!". I also strongly disagree with the notion that we only vote for people who have shown up. It excuses people who haven't bothered with the game at all. What if we got super unlucky and the 2 players who haven't shown up are our 2 mafia? Or we get slightly unlucky and 1 of the 2 who haven't shown up is mafia? However, with that said, Andante ended up being more active early on than I was expecting. She didn't back down when pushed by Lickety and also says that he leans scum. There's a couple of things she said she'd get back to answer and either gave a vague answer or none at all.

VERDICT: Ehhh...she's pretty convinced that I'm town, which is nice, but I'm less confident in her alignment than she is of mine. I believe the only player who she is suspicious of so far is Lickety. I'd say slight Mafia lean, but nothing particularly alarming here.

[Somnus]

As far as your reads, I think so far, we're moooostly on the same page. Maybe I just need to get better at scum-reading, but there's not one person right now that is jumping out to me as like "That's our best D1 elimination/mafia". If I had to name my 3 most suspect right now, it's probably Andante, Malcolm, and Progo.

[Somnus]

Just a quick correction on the analysis part on Lickety: I listed his suspects and mistakenly included Malcolm as one of the active posters (which, at the time, he was not), as well as one of the inactives. Obviously, he's not both. At the time of my notes, he was inactive. Carry on.

[Somnus]

As far as your reads, I think so far, we're moooostly on the same page. Maybe I just need to get better at scum-reading, but there's not one person right now that is jumping out to me as like "That's our best D1 elimination/mafia". If I had to name my 3 most suspect right now, it's probably Andante, Malcolm, and Progo.

hb LQ?

I'd currently put him 4th, behind the aforementioned three. Also, welcome, Strange.

[Somnus]

Ahri: I love having you in the game and I'm digging your reads and all, but at some point, you're going to have to give everyone, myself included, an explanation for why you've been my biggest cheerleader from page 1. While it's been flattering, it is starting to come off as a, "I'll wear your skin" kind of thing. I don't blame anyone who is suspicious of it.

Pale Ale Dog: This is the analysis I had of you as of a little less than 48 hours ago when I typed these up on Saturday night (posted yesterday). I still don't have much to go by so far.

Player: Pale Ale Dog
--------------------
-Kind of cringe first post. Nothing suspicious though (67)
-Townie vibes on Cat for investigating Ahri. Also thinks Ahri likely made a mistake (72)
-Goes after Progo for basically copying his post about Cat/Ahri. Nothing vicious or noteworthy, but worth mentioning (133)
-Quickly accepts Progo's response and thanks him for "being the 1st person to speak to me so far" (135)
-Believes Andante and Lickety were going after each other for town reads. Mentions that Ahri, Somnus, and Progo haven't done any investigations. Points out that we haven't heard from Malcolm yet (143)

ANALYSIS: Hasn't posted much yet. I think he and Progo are going to play/approach the game in a very similar manner. Has mostly stated information rather than analysis. Could be read as a mafia tell, but like Progo, I think it's more likely inexperience and he'd rather someone else take the charge and lead.

VERDICT: Completely and utterly undecided. I don't have a lean here one way or the other yet.

[Somnus]

I'm reading the Complete List of Abbreviations. I promise this won't happen again.

It was just defense.

I'll just quote these two posts for reference

@Somnus @CSF @LQ what do y'all think of these two, it was mostly skipped by in analysis iirc

and progo pls if you're town explain to me why you need to justify that it was "just defense", this phrase is literally the only thing I have against you right now

I addressed it. I think it's sketchy but I don't know that I'm willing to vote for him. At least not now.

I'm going to need time to digest the last several pages, because a lot has been posted since last night. I've only given today's posts a quick read so far.

ANALYSIS: Seems unsure of himself. Understandable, as it's his first game. Tosses a vote on Andante for not having shown up, but is way too easily talked out of it after one post. Tosses a defensive/retaliation vote on Cat Scratch. I'm not going to go too far with this one, but retaliation votes are more often from mafia players than town. Could just be inexperience. Inexperienced players are also likely to lash out with retaliation votes.

Verdict: Kind of suspicious. I'm getting a "I'm new but super town, guys!" vibe. It might actually be authentic. I'm not sure. Again, there's nothing particularly alarming here but the behavior is at least a little suspcious.

[Somnus]

Hey. I'm terrible at multi-quoting and I think it looks ugly as sin, so I'm gonna toss out a few shorter posts with my thoughts on recent developments.

I already deduced you're town a long time ago.

................................ sorry?

I guess I would be willing to hear you out how you deduced this, but deducing anything in a Mafia game is pretty much impossible. The only time it is possible is if you have a Town or Scum clear as an alignment cop.

There are just very few times where deduction actually works in Mafia. Most reads are more probable than not given the right information, but deducing is something that I personally just don't think can be done with any certainty.

This seems nit-picky. I'm still suspicious of Progo, but this just seems like hopping on him for a word choice that I don't think was really even questionable. I mentioned in my annoyingly-long notes that Progo comes off as either very suspicious or incredibly just happy to be here and go with the flow/try to stay alive for the experience. I'm still undecided on if he's just a super nice guy or trying to hide that he's scum.

[Somnus]

I don't really like the reasoning you have there though, I feel like there are more sideline players than pogo and if you saw their reads post, their reads are generally aligned with us

what I wanted your opinion on was his defensive nature lol

Idk I haven't really noticed that much defensiveness from him tbh. He seems more overly apologetic than anything. Like 297 is a weirdly apologetic reaction that could be awkward scum not knowing how to respond.

And by sitting on the sidelines, I mean there's a difference between posting and not doing much with your posting, and being busy IRL.

He actually still hasn't reacted to my scumread on him... I just get the general feeling that he's unsure how to react to certain things.

I mean sure

I'll vote him now just for a wagon to form but do you not feel as though their reads allow them very little room to maneuver if mafia? (tr'ing me, somnus, then you, then SM, then LQ)

like that's my biggest issue with progo being mafia right now is that their reads do not offer them much room in playing the game

VOTE: ProgoWoshua

This is a good point that I hadn't considered. He's in a weird spot. The people he has town-read the hardest are all pretty suspicious of him. That's a pretty unfavorable spot to be in in his first game.

[Somnus]

[float=][/float]

woah that pink and teal lol uhhh haven’t forgotten bout yall, hopefully i’m back tomorrow afternoon, if not i’ll be here sometime the 19th, these colors are not easy to quickly skim on my phone so uhhh no additional thoughts.

I’m still town though!!

Ugghhh....

VOTE: Andante

[Somnus]

Progo is by all accounts a new player (as they've started), any inconsistencies being pointed out could quite easily be related to that. Not getting enough of a vibe to start a bandwagon yet. Quite frankly some players are a lot more confidence than anyone realistically should be at this point in the game, unless they're just trying to tactically draw out errors.

I hear ya. I really do. But you're not often going to be in a game where someone comes out and says, "Hey, everybody! I'm scum!". Day 1 isn't a total crapshoot, but it's the day that you have the least amount of information to work with. We're poking and prodding and hoping to find something that sticks.

[Somnus]

Sorry for being apologetic I guess.

There's not much else to say. I already deduced you're town a long time ago.

Even so, I think it's worth engaging in a conversation with the people on your wagon to try and change people's minds, so if you're town, town isn't voting town the entire day.

Alright, I'll give it a shot.

First, do you agree with this post from Ahri?

like progo

My issue with you being town: You have a really carefree attitude sprinkled in with some logic, and the two defensive posts in the middle of your ISO just stick out so much

[...]

My issue with you being mafia: if you're mafia, your reads limits you and your partner's gameplay drastically

[...]

I personally don't see why there's anything weird or contradictory about someone (yourself or otherwise) generally being quite carefree while then getting quite defensive so early into the game. Again, we've got such limited info that people are taking any small things which interests them and generally twisting it ever so slightly to suit their own logic, or to look like they're a confident player with a good read on the game when most of us are ultimately in the dark to an extent. Either way our first vote is likely to end up being somewhat random and based on guesswork unless someone makes a major mistake.

I wouldn't say random, but again, we only have so much to work with on day 1. I think we're closing in on the point where most people have a pretty good idea on 1 of just a couple people that they'd be willing to stick with a vote on for day 1.

[Somnus]

As a great man once said, you must start somewhere.

THIS! ^

[Somnus]

like I'm thinking about it in this perspective:

if we vote out progo, and they flip mafia -> fabulous, but they don't have many relevant interactions with people
if we vote out progo, and they flip town -> what info do we actually get? their reads are still aligned with ours, Somnus and CSF are still town, Ahri is still (maybe) town, LQ is still logically town, and the bottom 3 + lurkers are still at the bottom, there's no significant pushers on progo that we can check tomorrow, and we lose an actually decently active poster

versus if we vote out afk, and they flip mafia -> fabulous, but they don't have many interactions
if we vote out afk, and they flip town -> an afk is gone from the game, the rest of the players we can get decent information on

versus if we vote out controversial player (i.e. Ahri, Andante, LQ) and they flip mafia -> fabulous, and we get interactions
if we vote out controversial player, and they flip town -> the people pushing them now look a bit worse (for example on Ahri town flip, LQ looks worse, while Somnus, CSF look better) and (on LQ town flip, Ahri, Andante looks worse, CSF, Malcolm look better)

that's my position on today's vote

obviously, I can see how this can be seen as a fencesit, especially 5 days before deadline, a sort of insurance that if progo ends up flipping town, I can say "hey guys I tried to tell you not to" or smth like that, while if he's mafia I can try and save my mafia partner

but I genuinely feel that this vote could be better used, I'll eventually listen to the opinions of my townreads though

I do want to use an ML in PAD / LQ / Progo today (which goes severely against my initial position against afks and lurkers) but I do want to hear more from Malcolm and Andante in the coming days before making an ultimate decision on reads

I'd argue that I potentially look worse if you flip town, even though I'm town and I believe you are too. I think there's a player or two who aren't convinced

[Somnus]

like I'm thinking about it in this perspective:

if we vote out progo, and they flip mafia -> fabulous, but they don't have many relevant interactions with people
if we vote out progo, and they flip town -> what info do we actually get? their reads are still aligned with ours, Somnus and CSF are still town, Ahri is still (maybe) town, LQ is still logically town, and the bottom 3 + lurkers are still at the bottom, there's no significant pushers on progo that we can check tomorrow, and we lose an actually decently active poster

versus if we vote out afk, and they flip mafia -> fabulous, but they don't have many interactions
if we vote out afk, and they flip town -> an afk is gone from the game, the rest of the players we can get decent information on

versus if we vote out controversial player (i.e. Ahri, Andante, LQ) and they flip mafia -> fabulous, and we get interactions
if we vote out controversial player, and they flip town -> the people pushing them now look a bit worse (for example on Ahri town flip, LQ looks worse, while Somnus, CSF look better) and (on LQ town flip, Ahri, Andante looks worse, CSF, Malcolm look better)

that's my position on today's vote

obviously, I can see how this can be seen as a fencesit, especially 5 days before deadline, a sort of insurance that if progo ends up flipping town, I can say "hey guys I tried to tell you not to" or smth like that, while if he's mafia I can try and save my mafia partner

but I genuinely feel that this vote could be better used, I'll eventually listen to the opinions of my townreads though

I do want to use an ML in PAD / LQ / Progo today (which goes severely against my initial position against afks and lurkers) but I do want to hear more from Malcolm and Andante in the coming days before making an ultimate decision on reads

The bolded/underlined part is a good point. I hadn't considered that if he claims a power role, we'd need some time to see if there's a counter claim/come up with another wagon to start. I don't have a problem voting for Progo. I've been on the record of being pretty suspicious of him for a while now. I can't help shake the possibility that he's just naieve/sheeping or whatever. If we're closing in on a vote on him within the next day or 2 at the latest, I'll switch my vote to him and hope for the best.

[Somnus]

I quoted the wrong post/point above. Long day. Sorry. Meant to point out where you said we'd need time in case our vote ends up being progo and he's claiming a power role.

[Somnus]

like I'm thinking about it in this perspective:

if we vote out progo, and they flip mafia -> fabulous, but they don't have many relevant interactions with people
if we vote out progo, and they flip town -> what info do we actually get? their reads are still aligned with ours, Somnus and CSF are still town, Ahri is still (maybe) town, LQ is still logically town, and the bottom 3 + lurkers are still at the bottom, there's no significant pushers on progo that we can check tomorrow, and we lose an actually decently active poster

versus if we vote out afk, and they flip mafia -> fabulous, but they don't have many interactions
if we vote out afk, and they flip town -> an afk is gone from the game, the rest of the players we can get decent information on

versus if we vote out controversial player (i.e. Ahri, Andante, LQ) and they flip mafia -> fabulous, and we get interactions
if we vote out controversial player, and they flip town -> the people pushing them now look a bit worse (for example on Ahri town flip, LQ looks worse, while Somnus, CSF look better) and (on LQ town flip, Ahri, Andante looks worse, CSF, Malcolm look better)

that's my position on today's vote

obviously, I can see how this can be seen as a fencesit, especially 5 days before deadline, a sort of insurance that if progo ends up flipping town, I can say "hey guys I tried to tell you not to" or smth like that, while if he's mafia I can try and save my mafia partner

but I genuinely feel that this vote could be better used, I'll eventually listen to the opinions of my townreads though

I do want to use an ML in PAD / LQ / Progo today (which goes severely against my initial position against afks and lurkers) but I do want to hear more from Malcolm and Andante in the coming days before making an ultimate decision on reads

I'd argue that I potentially look worse if you flip town, even though I'm town and I believe you are too. I think there's a player or two who aren't convinced

how the hell do you look worse if I flip town, you become locktown if i flip town lmao

I don't know. I'm trying to put myself into the shoes of others and how it would look to them. Maybe I'm wrong.

[Somnus]

wow not even null, I got null scum?

to my knowledge I haven't even done much, and when I tried to spend 5 minutes, called it quits with the horrible to read colors (sorry if you love them, but the pink and teal are terrible on the eyes)

How caught up are you andante

uhh not very, and we're 390 posts in?? bruh. I wasn't even sober for any of the posts I did post.. I plan on fully catching up tomorrow though. Sorry yall for the poor game from me here :/ I was sad, drank away those problems, then got busy, and uhhh now we're good. I promise I'm never this bad in games, the timing though was just yeah.. but hey, we good! and I have no idea who maf is, unless I SRed someone... *checks ISO* LMAO (I was gonna go "Yeah I SR LQ" but looking at my other posts, I have to uhh makes sure it's an actual sr

hahahaha I'm so sorry for the bad game yall!!! no more alcohol rest of this game!! (if I don't die soon, that may be a lie...) but I'll fully catch up tomorrow and go from there!! I am town!! just a useless town... hopefully maf hasn't taken my role as "most helpful town"

like I'm thinking about it in this perspective:

if we vote out progo, and they flip mafia -> fabulous, but they don't have many relevant interactions with people
if we vote out progo, and they flip town -> what info do we actually get? their reads are still aligned with ours, Somnus and CSF are still town, Ahri is still (maybe) town, LQ is still logically town, and the bottom 3 + lurkers are still at the bottom, there's no significant pushers on progo that we can check tomorrow, and we lose an actually decently active poster

versus if we vote out afk, and they flip mafia -> fabulous, but they don't have many interactions
if we vote out afk, and they flip town -> an afk is gone from the game, the rest of the players we can get decent information on

versus if we vote out controversial player (i.e. Ahri, Andante, LQ) and they flip mafia -> fabulous, and we get interactions
if we vote out controversial player, and they flip town -> the people pushing them now look a bit worse (for example on Ahri town flip, LQ looks worse, while Somnus, CSF look better) and (on LQ town flip, Ahri, Andante looks worse, CSF, Malcolm look better)

that's my position on today's vote

obviously, I can see how this can be seen as a fencesit, especially 5 days before deadline, a sort of insurance that if progo ends up flipping town, I can say "hey guys I tried to tell you not to" or smth like that, while if he's mafia I can try and save my mafia partner

but I genuinely feel that this vote could be better used, I'll eventually listen to the opinions of my townreads though

I do want to use an ML in PAD / LQ / Progo today (which goes severely against my initial position against afks and lurkers) but I do want to hear more from Malcolm and Andante in the coming days before making an ultimate decision on reads

HOW AM I A CONTROVERSIAL PLAYER??? I literally just haven't posted?? I told yall I was VLA, WHAT ABOUT THAT MAKES ME CONTROVERSIAL?

not explaining reads = controversial??? like excuse me... last I checked, not explaining reads doesn't make someone a controversial player??

I feel better about my current vote now, but if I need to switch to Progo, I will.

[Somnus]

it's LQ and PAD go next

You're gonna have to explain this to me.

[Somnus]

I'm well aware I'm in the poe right now, nothing I did even deserves to be higher, but like, high activity does not always equal town. Like, I have high activity as both town and maf, I'm almost always TRed more as maf. it's so easy for maf to look towny. but what it comes down to is who maf is pushing, like, Sommus right now, I'm heavily questioning the intent behind the push on me, I'm LHF. bottome of the poe, VERY easy for anyone to make a "case" and push right now, shouldn't be a surprise to anyone, like 2 legit posts in my iso?? yeah, but I'm not a fan of this "hey look you showed up, I'm not gonna try and engage with you, but instead just go "yeah I like my andante vote" like, Sommus and Cat Scratch, are complete opposites. Cat Scratch is trying to engage with me, ask questions, follow up on old questions, meanwhile Sommus is all "YEP STILL MAF!!!!" like, leaning Sommus maf, Cat Scratch town. I like Cat Scratch's current effort to like try and actually figure me out

I don't know if you're mafia. I have a few people I suspect. I'm not even sure that my vote is going to end up on you. I don't think you've handled your return very well. It's nothing personal.

[Somnus]

okay welp

Where did Somnus and Strange go?

at least there'll be spicy content for everyone to read next time they check in

Progo is at E-2 btw

I posted a lot earlier and then the thread absolutely exploded and it's been hard to keep up. I have a little time left tonight but I'm just re-reading.

[Somnus]

mb ig I didn't vote correctly

VOTE: ProgoWoshua

Is this E-1? I just want to make sure we're clear.

[Somnus]

but LQ I'm really curious to how you can see me as town with progo as mafia lol

I'm not sure if this is me being overconfident in my out town gameplay but

1. CSF and LQ, two general trs of the game, have voted progo and are pushing on him
2. Progo, the main vote of the day, has tr'ed Ahri as one of their top 2 reads
3. Somnus (and to a certain extent, CSF) have tr'ed Ahri, and these two players are generally tr'ed
4. Ahri randomly goes "ok I'm flipping off progo, it's PAD and LQ", flipping attention off of Progo, a town, and onto two other town, one of who is decently tr'ed by the table
5. LQ goes "Progo Ahri is likely two mafia" and Progo makes a post that Ahri extremely dislikes
6.

(In your world)

Ahri is frightened by a Progo / Ahri call, when Progo is the one being voted.

Now let's stop at step number 6. Disregarding wifom, why in the world would Ahri be afraid of a Progo / Ahri call when the vote is on Progo? Especially when Progo has already hard tr'ed Ahri? After Progo flips town (in your world) Ahri looks so much better, both for being tr'ed by Progo, as well as trying to flip off of them.

Regardless of what you might think, even though you and me have been massive posters in this game LQ, CSF is the one that will likely end up deciding today's vote. And I've been varying on CSF's town to null list, so there's legitmately no reason for me to start doing some shenanigans when a town is about to be voted, no?

Like I could be wifoming but what's the point?

Your argument is that I'm afraid of the progo / Ahri call, which is reasonable if the vote is on me and progo chats badly, but why should I care about that call when progo is the one being voted?

I have the honour to be,
Your obedient servant.

A. hri

Like I already said, you could be Mafia trying to push through Progo to discredit me. That's where the Town!Progo Scum!Ahri read plays into it. I mean if Progo is Town here, then you kill two birds with one stone by Limming Town!Progo.

Also, IDK why you say Cat is the deciding factor here. We still need to see what Andante and Smnus and Malcolm and SM do. The Lim is not dependent on any one person.

I'll tell you what Andante, Somnus, Malcolm, and SM are going to do

1) Andante's going to pop in, say a few words, complain about being SR'ed, then pop back out
2) Somnus is going to vote with CSF and (hopefully) me because they seem like a personality who votes with their trs
3) Malcolm is going to continue to afk and be a nonfactor
4) SM is going to wait for someone to FoS him and OMGUS, ultimately resulting in a vote that doesn't impact D1

CSF is the consensus locktown because people disagree with my read on Somnus and you had some sussy going on LQ

again, let me reiterate that progo had me in his top 2 trs, limming him provides nothing lol, I can push you perfectly fine today without having to lim Progo (which I actually did (as town)! before he outed mafia!)

Andante is going to be active when they get off V/LA. That's one thing I'm waiting for.
I'd be very pleased if Somnus votes with their TRs, but I don't think they are doing notes for no reason.
I still want to see how Malcolm votes. He's in all likelihood going to vote at some point.
SM is probably not going to be super active. They are Null for this reason.

IDK who is SRing me atp. The only person considering me as Scum realistically is Progo. Andante seems to be seeing me differently atp and no one else has really voiced SRing me. To that effect, I don't think many people are SRing you either - just me in my tin foil house. People are pretty much universally TRing Somnus atp and they are probably thread spewed Town atp, same as Cat. People want to see more from Malcolm and they are probably mostly a Null read. SM is basically doing the minimum and I think they are generally a Null read. Most people are pending a read on Andante.

So generally, I think based on people's general reads in the game at this point are something like:

Spoiler:

Ahri:

Town
Cat/Somnus
Malcolm/Andante/SM
LQ/PAD/Progo
Scum

Andante:

Town
Cat
SM/PAD/Progo/Malcolm
LQ/Somnus/Ahri
Scum

Cat:

Town
Somnus/LQ/Ahri
SM/Andante/PAD
Malcolm/Progo
Scum

LQ:

Town
Cat/Somnus/SM
PAD/Andante/Malcolm
Progo/Ahri
Scum

Malcolm:
Null: All

PAD:

Town
Cat/LQ
Ahri/Malcolm/Progo/Somnus/Andante
SM
Scum

Progo:

Town
Somnus/SM
Andante/Malcolm/PAD
LQ/Cat/Ahri
Scum

Somnus:

Town
LQ/Ahri
PAD/Cat/SM/Malcolm
Andante/Progo
Scum

SM:

Town
LQ/Cat
Progo/Malcolm/Somnus
Ahri/PAD/Andante
Scum

If any of this is inaccurate, let me know.

So let's add this up:

This is about how the thread is reading each person.

Lvl 1: 2 Points
Lvl 2: 1 Point
Lvl 2: 0 Points

12: Cat
11: Somnus
9: LQ, SM
7: Malcolm
6: PAD
5: Andante
4: Progo

So roughly:

Town

: Cat, Somnus

Town Lean

: LQ, SM

Null

: Malcolm, PAD

Scum Lean

: Andante, Ahri

Scum

: Progo

Close. I know you've mentioned repeatedly that you're mostly interested in hearing from the experienced players, but this is where I'm currently at:

Somnus:

Town
CatScratch, Ahri
Lickety, Pale Ale Dog, Strange Matter, Malcolm
Andante/Progo
Scum

I wanted to hold off from butting in too much once the thread exploded last night. I was having a bit of a hard time following it at that pace and I figured adding another person into the mix was going to make it even tougher to follow. I know Ahri will vehemently disagree, but I don't see what Progo said as an accidental mafia slip. Poor choice of words, maybe, but I read the entire interaction from his questionable post to now three times and I'm just not seeing it. With that said, I don't feel like digging up the specific post right now, but Cat said something along the lines of "his reaction/explanation looks worse than the post you're going after him for" (something along those lines).

Ahri, I disagree with your reason for jumping back on the Progo wagon, but I think it's the right call. Kinda like using two completely different math formulas but getting to the same answer. I mentioned early in the game that I'm usually pretty careful with my vote (I'm sure Andante would disagree and that's perfectly ok) and you were all over the place and thought you had the game figured out a couple different times last night. I want to give him a chance to at least attempt/finish explaining himself later on when he's on, but unless something significant gets unearthed between now and this evening or whenever, I'm ok with putting him at E-1, or if he's already at E-1, I'll announce intent to hammer and deal with whatever ramifications come from it.

UNVOTE

[Somnus]

I haven't been on since my post this morning and haven't read the last couple pages yet. Long day. I'll be back in a couple hours.

[Somnus]

Oh. I thought I was several pages behind. Guess not. Ok. Catching up will be easy.

[Somnus]

Somnus, if Ahri is the scum I'm looking for, then she brought your trust since the beginning of the game, and pretends to keep that trust until you help her mis-eliminate someone in an ELo situation.

Please, be more skeptical of Ahri. Don't play with emotion. Play with logic.

Always play with logic!

This is fair. I mentioned that as a possibility very early on. I haven't dismissed it, but I don't think it's a likely scenario.

[Somnus]

There are two ways they can do that. The reckless way, with both scum jumping on my wagon wagon and getting me eliminated right away. Of course, the first one would pretend to have reasonable doubts about me, and the second one would fake a towny intent to hammer.

And the second way is the cautious one, with one scum voting for me hoping to draw intent to hammer from another townie, while the second one keeps a low profile, so that if their plan is found out, one of them can keep hiding.

Well Somnus has already said they're planning to vote for you

But tbh, I think anyone trying to push through an elimination right now would draw a lot of suspicion. Because it's way too early to end the day imo.

Which is part of the reason I bowed out from the chaos last night to re-read the billion pages that appeared. We no longer have to make sure we have time left over for a role reveal, since he already did that prematurely at E-2. We don't have to use up all 10 or 11 days or whatever, but at this point, especially after his role reveal, we don't absolutely have to rush into anything. I'm leaning towards a vote for him currently though.

[Somnus]

Some of this is rehash and some of it is new. I know I include seemingly irrelevant details, but you never know what will crop up later. Feel free to skip to the bottom if you don't want to read all of that.

Player: ProgoWoshua
-------------------
-Receives a vote from Cat Scratch almost immediately. "Well, that's rude!" (68)
-3 minutes later, tosses a vote onto Andante for not having shown up yet (69)
-Unvotes Andante after their first post in which she warns of putting someone at E-1 early on. In the same post, proceeds to toss a vote onto Cat Scratch (71)
-Unvotes Cat Scratch because "I really doubt she's mafia" (81)
-Certain between Cat and Ahri that there's at least one townie (82)
-Comments on Cat Scratch exposing an inconsistency in Ahri hiding she has played as scum. Concludes both players are likely town and Ahri made a mistake (86)
-Seems overly apologetic for not knowing game-related abbreviations. "Apologies for the confusion", "I promise this won't happen again". I found this a little suspect. Nothing major, however (91)
-Confirms that the vote on Cat Scratch was just in defense/retaliation. This isn't a great sign (96)
-Thinks Ahri is trying way too hard to get on everyone's good terms, while Lickety is defending his position against everyone he disagrees with. Plays the naieve townie card. "Would scum really try to draw attention to themselves this early in the game? This is literally my first game on the site, so I don't quite know where the meta is right now. But without other information, I'm giving a townlean to both of them" (131)
-Couple of overly friendly posts here that just seem really fake to me. Could just be a really nice guy and I'm going to feel pretty bad if he gets eliminated early and we all misread him (134, 154)
-Ahri and Somnus are extremely town for pushing the scumhunt forward. Cat Scratch and StrangeMatter likely have town intentions. Slight Town Lean on Lickety. Not much activity from Pale Ale Dog. Considers Malcolm a lurker. Quite suspicious of Andante (228)
-Questions Ahri for being so defensive of Somnus (263)
-Handles himself quite well against Ahri's suspicions here (290)
-Didn't know retaliation votes look scummy. "This is my first game on the site" (297)
-Sorry for being apologetic. Already deduced Cat Scratch as town long ago. Uh oh? (318)
-Apologizes to Lickety for apologizing. Oh my Lord. Please stop. (320)
-Notes that everyone who is suspicious of him, he has town-read. This is a really good point. Tough spot to be in. (331)
-Is pushed into aggression by Ahri and renounces his previous beliefs in Cat Scratch, Lickety, and Ahri. Changes his vote here to Lickety because "he was the one I was most divided on" (335)
-Cat Scratch is trying to get him involved in actual scum-hunting. It seems forced, but he does try. Asks Cat Scratch if she believes Ahri's sentiment that he's being too carefree but with a couple of defensive posts in the middle (348)
-Has a good understanding of WIFOM. Wasn't expecting that. Props (365)
-Doesn't back down. Still wants an answer from Cat. Alright, my opinion of him is starting to change a bit (383)
-Gives it back to Ahri that his reads no longer align with hers. He's showing guts here. I like it. Main suspects are Ahri, Lickety, and Cat Scratch. However, these are all the people he town-read pretty hard earlier. Reads change throughout a game. But again, I believe all 3 of these players had a vote on him at the time. (413)
-"I think she pretends to rule that out by flipping town right now" in response to Lickety's comment, "There's nothing ruling out a Progo/Ahri team". This is the post that sent Ahri absolutely bonkers. Is this a comment about bussing? Maybe I'm dumb. I don't think he outed himself here as scum as Ahri vehemently suspects, but it is a confusing comment (436)
-"Once I flip town, investigage Ahri, Lickety, and Cat". Again, these were the exact three who had votes on him at the time (443)
-Ahri urges him to role claim now with 3 votes on him, which I think was a really bad play for us. No one had put Progo at E-1 and I doubt anyone would have quick-hammered him. He outs himself as vanilla townie. I blame Ahri for this and not Progo. He didn't know better. Ahri should (454)
-To Ahri: "I'm warning you. You need to prepare how you're going to explain your ridiculous outburst to the rest of town tomorrow". Probably fair (462)
-Unvotes Lickety here and votes Ahri. Again, retaliation votes, especially mid-debate, are not a good look. It's not enough on its own to make him look scummy, but most of his votes have been retaliation votes. He's showing guts now and more confidence than I did in my first game. Much respect. He continues to name Ahri, Lickety, and Cat Scratch as his top scum-reads, despite the fact that there wasn't really any pressure on those 3 at the time, and until this interaction, he had town-read at least 2 of those 3 pretty hard (472)
-Current reads: Ahri, Cat or Lickety. Exactly 1 in this group. Suspects StrangeMatter the least. If Ahri is the first scum, Somnus is definitely not the second (528)
-Good analysis concerning the members on the current wagon to vote him off. "Either way, I expected another vote on my wagon by now. But there still only three votes on my wagon, which means one of the scum is already ON the wagon (Ahri, Lickety, and Cat Scratch), with the second scum keeping a low profile. By this point, I had expressed that I'd be willing to put him at E-1 (560)
-In regards to Cat's: "I think anyone trying to push through an elimination would draw a lot of suspicion". "Are you saying that it's likely that Somnus is scum then?".


ANALYSIS: For most of Day 1, he has seemed really unsure of himself and kind of just doing what people tell him to do. It's his first game. I think he just wants to survive Day 1, which I completely understand. However, he has only really tried to make reads on people and list suspects when he's pushed into it. Seems content to just coast along with a "Please don't vote me, I'm town!" kind of attitude at first. Tosses a vote on Andante for not having shown up, but is way too easily talked out of it after one post. Tosses a defensive/retaliation vote on Cat Scratch. Later on, puts a retaliation vote on Ahri. Not a big fan of this. This would later become a pattern. The comment that sent Ahri into orbit was puzzling. I didn't take it as a scum slip, but it's not a great look. The explanations to it, in my opinion, look more bizarre than the comment itself (Cat Scratch mentioned this well before me)

Verdict: He's been a bit confusing to me. I've been suspicious of him through the entire first portion of Day 1, then less and less so as he began to assert himself more, and then even more suspicious than ever. His character arc has been interesting, if you want to call it that. He's not my top suspect, but he's been pretty high up there through most of the game. I'd feel ok about taking our chances on him being the elimination on Day 1.

[Somnus]

Somnus, since Progo isn't their top suspect

Andante. I haven't ISO'ed StrangeMatter since they joined yet though. I'm probably going to have to wait until night 1 to do so but if Day 1 is still going to last a little while, I'll likely get a chance to before then.

[Somnus]

@Somnus are you going to keep your long block notes for the rest of the game until you die lol

Sure am!

[Somnus]

I think we're kind of at a standstill. Earlier on, I expressed why I was willing to vote for Progo, and it wasn't because I thought he accidentally scum-slipped. Shortly after I did so, a couple players backed out and said we needed more time, and in one case, someone straight-up unvoted for him. That's not inherently scummy. I'm just pointing out that it happened and now with Pale Ale Dog out of the game, it seems like the consensus was to gather more information or wait for Pale Ale's replacement. But with a deadline in 3 and a half days, unless a wagon starts on a vacant slot, that slot is pretty much going to be irrelevant for the remainder of Day 1, and there's a decent chance that we only have 8 votes to work with on Day 1.

I read all of your analysis on the previous page, Ahri (putting my notes to shame) and while I'm not going to attempt to break it down point by point, it does make sense to me. You have put a lot of effort into the game. Probably more than any of us. Again, I don't agree with your reasoning for hopping back on Progo. But I agree with the outcome. It's no secret that I've town-read you for the time being, but even if I were pretty null on you at this point, I'm trying to picture what Day 2 would look like without your input.

This is a much more intense game than the laid-back, reckless games that I have played before this.

[Somnus]

About Ahri:

Okay, Ahri's behavior is troubling. It seems that she thinks there's absolutely no way I'm not mafia. It could be that's she's mafia and is lying, but that would mean she's intentionally hyping up a wagon that she knows will flip town. I don't think there's a reason for mafia to do that.

So for now, UNVOTE: Ahri. I'm not completely crossing off the possibility she's mafia, it just doesn't seem very likely right now.

About LQ:

[Long explanation on why I suspect there's mafia among Ahri, Cat and LQ]

This is actually not bad given you are Town.

This can be genuine. He may actually be convinced by my argument (with the assumption that I'm town, which is fair). Or it could be that he's really mafia, and wants to be least suspected of the three. In short, his actions are sensible as both town and mafia.

About Cat:

[Part of the long explanation]

Well Somnus has already said they're planning to vote for you

But tbh, I think anyone trying to push through an elimination right now would draw a lot of suspicion. Because it's way too early to end the day imo.

This could also be genuine. Or it could be that she's mafia and want to discredit me so that even if I died and flips town, she can argue that I was simply wrong. In short, her actions are also sensible as both town and mafia.

Do you still believe that exactly 1 of these 3 is scum?

[Somnus]

I low-key want to TR Ahri's effort. Not like Effort in and of itself is AI, but they just keep going like the energizer bunny and that makes me think they are probably Town.

I'll go back to Progo if necessary, but Andante has also been pretty fishy.

This has pretty much where I've been at through most of Day 1 so far.

[Somnus]

I don't think Ahri is town based on her effort of trying to push Progo. I've been re-reading the game, and mostly skimming it, and I don't think it's a townie thing to do. I'm looking it as more a null-thing but I think ahri is more scummy for other reasons, namely just other posts in general. I can go back through tomorrow and point out which ones specifically.

Also, welcome, Korina.

[Somnus]

Ok. I need another brain to to analyze Progo's infamous comment from 436 and tell me if it actually makes sense if you swap out the word "intend" for "pretend" like he mentioned.

[Somnus]

Ok. I need another brain to to analyze Progo's infamous comment from 436 and tell me if it actually makes sense if you swap out the word "intend" for "pretend" like he mentioned.

For starters, that comment was made with Ahri's self vote in mind.

Right. I do get that. I've been one of the people saying all along that I don't read what you said as a scum slip.

[Somnus]

I'll vote tomorrow. It's been mostly between Progo and Andante for me since early on. I've been suspicious of Andante this game and was the only one who had a vote on her a few days ago. I unvoted to see how the Progo situation played out and just recently, votes are now starting to pile onto Andante. My suspicions haven't wavered, but I'm wondering why now?

[Somnus]

Progo, I do still want to see that follow up to the rest of your reads list.

I'm working on it. Sorry, had to deal with real life. It sucks.

Same. I've had some nonsense going on outside of the game and I feel like Day 1 is dragging. I'm certainly at the very least partially responsible for the standstill we've been at it. I'll give my thoughts here in a few moments.

[Somnus]

Ok. I was going to put her at E-1 but I'm sure as hell not going to quick hammer anyone.

Andante, it just feels like you're working against everyone or most of us in this game.

[Somnus]

The continuation of my reads:

TOWN LEAN

Somnus

• While I'm still taken aback for how quickly and how intensely Ahri has been Town Reading Somnus, I still agree with that. Nothing in their ISO seemed to suggest they're anything but a Townie who likes to solve the mystery.
  
  
  Veredict:
  I believe they're town.

StrangeMatter

• First of all, Ahri's Post 579 was
  completely
  uncalled for. I don't blame them at all for jumping on the Ahri wagon.
  
  Acts like they want to do investigations, and yet they didn't give their reads on many people. This can be considered scummy, because this leaves enough ambiguity to change their strategies later.
  
  The first time a wagon on me was formed, StrangeMatter defended me. In that situation, I would expect scum to push against me. If if they don't outright vote for me, I expected at least for them to express doubt about me, so that they could vote me later. They defended me instead, so this is evidence of them being town.
  
  
  Verdict:
  I believe my third point outweighs the second. So I believe they're town.

NULL

Korina

• Not much from that slot before the replacement. Pale Ale Dog was mostly afk, but he did gave a TR to Cat, LQ and Ahri, and a SR to StrangeMatter.
  
  Korina, suspects Ahri, and it's fine wagoning on Andante or Malcolm. Their reactions are in line with what I would expect for someone who's catching on, regardless of being town or mafia.
  
  
  Verdict:
  Because of them just showing up, I don't have much to say about them.

MalcolmTucker

• He haven't posted much, but I don't immediately buy the "lurker = mafia" mentality.
  
  He suspects Ahri and Andante over general suspicious behavior.
  
  
  Veredict:
  I don't have much to say. He didn't give me much to work with.

SCUM LEAN

Andante

• She confessed to being drunk during every post she made during her V/LA. During that period, she suspected LQ and argued with him.
  
  After the V/LA, she admitted to being suspicious and claimed that anyone who says she's town has TMI and it's mafia. She then pointed out that Ahri's "I want to hear more of Andante" and calling her "controversial" are probably clever ways to avoid saying "Andante is town". She's been suspecting Ahri since.
  
  Meanwhile, Cat is questioning her and Somnus is analyzing her posts, both of them scumleaned Andante. Andante TRd Cat for putting in the effort, but SRd Somnus for... I guess tunneling?
  
  She TRs me and agrees with me that there was mafia in my wagon. But she's still suspecting Ahri, so that might be the reason.
  
  Votes Pale Ale Dog's slot as soon as he asks for a replacement, to "give the new person pressure". No one followed her lead, but she does express her intentions to scumhunt that slot.
  
  Post #664: "that is so many words. uhh if Ahri feels that confidently in something, I'm down to sheep". This is the most problematic post from her. At this point, she TR me and SR Ahri (she'll even vote Ahri again once it is clear that her vote towards PAL was going nowhere). And yet, she's willing to flip that 180º and vote me with Ahri because of her long post explaining why. Later, she'll argue against the "effort = town" mentality, which just makes it more inconsistent.
  
  Korina (PAD's replace in) shows up. Andante interpreted Korina's Post #753 as TMI. I can't say if she's seriously suspecting Kotrina, or if she's just following through with her words about scumhunting PAD's slot.
  
  
  Verdict:
  If she's town, her strategy is to act as suspicious as possible in order to catch someone with TMI. However, I don't agree with her TMI accusations against Ahri and Kotrina. It also sounds like a bad plan, because wouldn't mafia try to cast more suspicion on a townie that's casting suspicion on themselves? That's why I'm more inclined to believe Andante is mafia.

I have to say that Progo has handled himself quite well the last few days. I feel like if he gets out of Day 1, he's still going to be under a lot of scrutiny in Day 2 though. As a correction and to defend Andante here a little, she didn't tunnel on me. She made one comment about me looking suspicious for scum-reading her but if I recall, she has since read me as town. I think it would be more suspicious if she didn't at all at this point.

My notes are lacking at this point as far as StrangeMatter and Korina. Because I figured there weren't likely candidates for a Day 1 elimination at this point, I reasoned that during Night 1, I'd be able to go through their ISO's again and take detailed notes on what I've seen.

[Somnus]

*Because I figured THEY weren't likely candidates for Day 1 elimination at this point

[Somnus]

I don't know what to do. I wish LQ was here

I'm down with an Andante Lim. If this flips Town, I don't mind Limming Progo/Malcolm next. If Andante flips Scum, then I guess it's back to the drawing board, but now we did our job so I would feel good about that.

OK then I'm ready to end the day with an Andante lim too

Since you two already have your vote on Andante, I'll plan on doing so in the late afternoon or evening, assuming nothing drastic changes between now and then.

INTENT TO HAMMER

[Somnus]

Sorry. Poor color choice. Didn't mean to copy the mod.

[Somnus]

Ok. Fair enough. I think we're all kind of ready to move on from Day 1.

VOTE: Andante

[Somnus]

Welcome back, everyone. I won't be home for another couple hours but I quickly skimmed the last couple pages from today. As far as StrangeMatter's questions on the wagon...oh, she's gone.

[Somnus]

eh, you should always reassess after flips, which isn't fencesitting. avoids confbias.

This is where I'm at too. I'm kind of hitting the reset button on my reads. I don't think it sat well with a lot of people, including myself, that you seemed so willing to compromise between 1 of basically like...4 people for Day 1.

[Somnus]

I want to try something.

Everyone, I want to know what do you think of me and why. The more details, the better.

I'm really not sure, Progo. I've been back and forth on you the whole game, which is why I was hesitant to put a vote on you in Day 1. There are some retaliation votes that I wasn't a fan of in Day 1, but there's more than that. The infamous post in 436, as I've stated several times, I didn't take it as a scum slip. I think we're all going to feel pretty stupid (except for Ahri) if you end up scum. And then I think you handled yourself well for a little while in your assessment of the wagon that was temporarily on you and I haven't ruled out the possibility.

Again, I'm pretty undecided on everyone right now. I thought Andante was the closest thing we were going to get for hitting scum on Day 1, and that didn't happen.

[Somnus]

Hi, please convince me you’re not scum, because via poe, I think your slot is scum, and the rep out makes me further think that.

I think Cape should at least have a chance to read the thread first. I extended the same courtesy to both StrangeMatter and yourself.

[Somnus]

Why not? The group was 3 people: Andante, Korina, and Malcolm. There are 2 scum, and I had reasons to think everyone else was townier than those 3.

And uh, context matters. we were like ~2 days from deadline and given how slow people were with moving their votes, I wanted to broadcast who I was willing to lim that day to get a lim through.

Ok. I find that reasonable. Again, I fully admit I was part of the reason Day 1 took so long. I had the only vote on Andante pretty far into Day 1 and then with the Ahri/Progo incident, I unvoted to try and figure out what was going on.

[Somnus]

Also, welcome, Cape.

[Somnus]

LQ:

Town
Cat/Somnus/SM
PAD/Andante/Malcolm
Progo/Ahri
Scum

Went back to look at Lickety's involvement towards the end of Day 1. He had posted this. I don't know if it's worth putting much stock in it, especially since he ended up being town.

[Somnus]

Yes. You're both right.

Again, I want to give Cape some time to you know...actually read the thread, but I finally did some digging into StrangeMatter's ISO during night 1 and there's a couple times I just kind of went, "huh?". A lot of it I dismissed though because of the ongoing feud.

[Somnus]

I'm not sure, currently. This has been mentioned several times in the thread, but I think people are getting carried away with, "I don't like your posting style, Therefor, scum", particularly when it comes to you. I don't put a ton of stock in meta, and in the not-so-serious games I've played offsite before, no one really cared enough to research the previous games of others. I'm leaning towards doing so tonight, and the ones I'd have to work with are: Ahri, Cat Scratch, Korina, and Strange Matter (for the slot, at least). I believe the rest of us remaining are new.

[Somnus]

I'll cast shield of protection over Somnus / CSF so I'm always limmed before them and if I am limmed after flip they become conftown

also I'll ask for Somnus's opinion on SM after the notes you've taken so far if it's possible they could just be openwolfing with negative logic posts

because like I stated the combo that makes the least sense is Malcolm / Progo

but after rereading the first post between PAD/Progo doesn't seem w/w and Korina / Malcolm with PAD going "Hi Malcolm, so I've tried to catch up each time I log on, and it can be hard work" is some
lmao

idek what to make of this game anymore I could be completely wrong on Somnus or CSF but again I'm not exploring that this game so there is no fencesit thank

LQ if you're in specchat and see either Somnus / CSF scum prob just don't check into this game anymore it'll only hurt you and I'll apologize on loss

not rly to you Andante your reads were p bad

Sorry, I missed this before. So I said before I hadn't had a chance to really deep-dive into StrangeMatter's ISO while we were nearing the end of Day 1, and it became pretty apparent that either Andante, Progo, or Ahri was going to be eliminated. StrangeMatter was...fairly consistent throughout Day 1, although I didn't necessarily agree with her reads. Then towards the end of Day 1, just kind of flips after defending Progo all this time. Again, reads change, but it seemed so sudden. NOTE: This doesn't make Progo look bad. It makes StrangeMatter's behavior look odd, in my opinion.

Player: StrangeMatter
---------------------
-Subbed in for inactive PizzaPleb (178)
-Somnus pinged as town, although effort does not equal alignment indicative (193)
-There's a series of posts here commenting while catching up on the thread
-Doesn't trust townblocks at all (216)
-Series of posts responding to Cat Scratch and Ahri. Accuses them of ganging up and "unintentionally misinterpreting my posts (224)
-Wants to know Ahri's opinion of lurkers (259)
-"The best thing to do about a lurker is to force them to have some level of content[...]otherwise they're just low priority and or low hanging fruit for anyone to just jump on" (280)
-Doesn't see defensive voting as summy (299)
-"something about Ahri's posts are just worded strangely and I can't put my finger on why" (301)
-Doesn't feel that Progo is over-the-top defensive (327, 329)
-Because of Ahri's early town read on Somnus, doesn't believe they're both mafia. Ahri's push on Progo looks scummy (356)
-I left out the exchange with Pale Ale Dog here since he's no longer in the game, but he had voted for her and StrangeMatter didn't like the reasoning
-Ahri looks bad from the Progo incident on page 18 (494)
-Begins to town-read Malcolm for his line about finding inconsistencies in logic. Newbie town comment (536)
-Like several of us, did not like that Andante put a vote on an empty slot (548)
-Town-lean: Malcolm, Null-Scum: Andante, Scumlean: Ahri. Currently lacking on reads on everyone else (575)
-I'm leaving out the argument with Ahri that I think got pretty heated between both of them, and it didn't add to the game
-I do think she is right to call out Ahri here for saying to sit down and let others do the work. We're all a wide range of experience and posting activity, but we all need to work together (609)
-Lickety looks all over the place regarding Progo in his ISO (653)
-Ahri is playing very different in this game than in her 1 scum game on the site (697)
-"Of all the people who I'd just flip for info it'd probably be Ahri/Progo here so I don't understand what the point of the Andante wagon is" (762)
-Votes for Ahri (779)

[Somnus]

Her post from 697, unless I'm misreading it, would seem to indicate that she thinks you're town here. But then she votes for Ahri and is suddenly fine with Progo elimination. I don't know.

[Somnus]

Is this in regard to what Ahri said or what Progo said? ^

[Somnus]

Sorry, I missed this before. So I said before I hadn't had a chance to really deep-dive into StrangeMatter's ISO while we were nearing the end of Day 1, and it became pretty apparent that either Andante, Progo, or Ahri was going to be eliminated. StrangeMatter was...fairly consistent throughout Day 1, although I didn't necessarily agree with her reads. Then towards the end of Day 1,

just kind of flips after defending Progo all this time

. Again, reads change, but it seemed so sudden. NOTE: This doesn't make Progo look bad. It makes StrangeMatter's behavior look odd, in my opinion.

I'm not seeing the inconsistency?

SM just thought Ahri/Progo would give the most info.

also do you mind spoilering your notes? since it's a wall of text on mobile.

The statement itself isn't inconsistent. In fact, I'd agree that if the goal was to flip the person(s) who would give us the most information on Day 1 rather than who we think is scum, it likely would have been either Ahri or Progo.

As I said, SM's stance throughout most of Day 1 was pretty consistent. It's the fact that SM spent a very large portion of Day 1 defending Progo and going after Ahri, then one of their last posts of Day 1 seems to indicate they'd be fine with flipping Progo. Again, this doesn't reek of scum to me, but it's worth pointing out, especially in tandem with the comment in 697: "Ahri is playing very different in this game than in her 1 scum game on the site". No follow-up except a vote for Ahri very shortly afterwards.

[Somnus]

I feel the need to point out that Cape has done a terrific job on such short notice, regardless of what his alignment ends up being. The SM slot was only vacant for a couple hours, and he came in, read the entire thread, posted and explored his reads. That's not easy to do, especially in a slot that I was a bit weary of at the start of Day 2 and that I know Ahri hasn't jived with this game (whether it's from scum suspicions or just personality clash, or both).

With that said, he has either come in and been a good town leader on Day 2, or he's trying and doing a pretty good job of cleaning up what I view potentially could be a mess that was left in that slot from his predecessor. If Cape had been here from the start of the game or through most of Day 1, I'd have a pretty hard town lean there. I'm kind of at a loss as far as that slot right now, because I would town-lean cape and scum-lean StrangeMatter. Obviously, both can't be correct.

[Somnus]

@Progo, where were you going with your first post from this dayphase?

I wanted to force everyone to express their opinions of me. If someone says that I'm likely town and then jumps on my wagon once it gains traction, then they would be suspicious.

However, most people did not respond to that. I have no idea if it just got buried or if someone's avoiding to answer it.

Good morning, Progo.

I imagine you saw it, but I did answer you in post 925 at the top of page 38. There was a lot of activity at the start of Day 2, so it's possible that it was buried. I won't speak on behalf of any of the other players still in the game.

Lickety's post in 526 is an interesting take where he assigned a point system based on where he thinks everyone's reads currently were at. Glancing through it again, it seems more or less accurate with where we were at at the time. If he was correct, no one at that point had you as their town-leans. However, that doesn't mean that everyone thought you were scum, obviously.

If the game were operating under "Make a Wish Foundation" rules, Lickety's dying wish was to go hard at you on Day 2. Obviously, he's no longer around. That doesn't mean his assessment was correct and it doesn't automatically (and perhaps not even likely) mean that him being night-killed was to avoid that scenario. But it's at least a possibility.

[Somnus]

Alright. I re-read all of Day 2 a couple times and I'm going to spam some posts, including my updated reads here.

[Somnus]

I don't really know what to make of Korina. I'm trying not to fall into the trap of judging someone by their posting style. Saying that you tend to look scummy as town isn't really a viable defense though. I agree with a lot of your reads but I don't have a feel for where you are at the game. Have you read the entire thread now at this point?

[Somnus]

Ahri: I know there's a few people who disagree, but I see her actions as a lunatic townie. Maybe I'm the only one who is glad that we have a role like that here. She does tend to tunnel in on one person and is convinced she has solved the game, and then 10 minutes or so later that read completely changes. I don't see Ahri/Progo as a viable scum team. The interaction starting from the 436 post is just wildly too risky for that. Ahri/Malcolm would actually be pretty hilarious, but I don't think it's likely. Again, Ahri/StrangeMatter(Cape) would have been a hilarious play, involving someone pretending they couldn't stand Ahri and leaving the game as part of the plan. Doubtful. If Ahri/Cat is the scum team, they've probably more or less won the game already. I don't think it's likely. I think Ahri is town and her methods/posting style rub some people the wrong way.

Cape: I already voiced my concerns over the slot, so I'll keep it short here. Cape seems pretty hardcore town, and as previously mentioned, if he had been in that slot the whole game or through most of Day 1, I wouldn't likely even be questioning it. StrangeMatter's reads were bizarre. With that said, I think Cape has done enough in Day 2 that I couldn't justify putting a vote here today.

Cat: I do like that she's still pushing the game forward. I think most of us lack the experience, confidence, or both to be able to do that at this point. This could come from scum who is controlling town, and again, if so, bravo. I think most people expected Cat to be killed Night 1.

Korina: Some of the same concerns that I have with the other replacement slot. Pale Ale Dog gave us very little and just appeared as a shy player who either didn't know what he was doing or wasn't that into it. Korina has come in and drawn attention, although attention doesn't necessarily equal scum. I don't know what to think about your approach to this game or if you've even fully caught up. Again, if you're town, telling people that you tend to always look scummy probably isn't the way to go.

Progo: Back and forth on him the whole game. I've discussed this just recently at good length. Again, it was like...500 posts again now, but looking at Lickety's point system ranking of where he felt everyone was at with their reads, not a single person had Progo as a town lean at the time. Maybe that has since changed. I think Cape mentioned he had a slight town lean on Progo.

Malcolm: Didn't really have much as far as reads on Day 1 except Ahri as scum. I think he's had a better Day 2, but most of his assessment at this point is still mostly Ahri is scum. I believe StrangeMatter was the only one town-leaning Malcolm on Day 1, although according to Lickety's 536 post, he believed StrangeMatter had Malcolm at null.

[Somnus]

2. So were you just townreading consensus town players for the sake of it at the beginning of the game and not actually believing it? That's what I'm confused about now.

At the start, I had no idea how to play the game, so I just let other people do the thinking for me.

Surely if you understood the very basic objectives and goals of the game though then you'd still be able to formulate your own thoughts and opinions in that regard? I get why you wouldn't want to go in too heavy (personally it can seem a bit desperate to me if someone is determined they've caught someone a few hours into the game), but would it not then make sense to sit back and see how others are playing and suss them out? Instead of trying to blend in by just agreeing with what others say?

I'm not trying to defend my past self here. I agree that my play style made no sense.

Sorry. I couldn't help it. We haven't had a GIF since very early in the game. Carry on.

[Somnus]

StrangeMatter's reads were bizarre

I would argue this also would go for Malcolm as well which is kinda why I was leaning Cat over him. Like is it within Malcolm's interest as mafia to push Ahri and say Ahri is scum for -undisclosed meta reasons-? I am not too terribly sure about this.
Sorry for clogging up the thread, I have just been catching up since last night on my phone where it's just easier to do this then multi quote

You're not clogging up the thread. It's fine. Things are moving slowly right now which is sometimes a nice break.

Would it help if everyone listed their pool of like 2-3 scum candidates? I feel like I have a general idea of where everyone is, so maybe it's not necessary, but there seems to be a general consensus regarding a couple of people.

[Somnus]

In addition to that, I don't mean to speak on behalf of Malcolm, but I think:

1.) He genuinely finds Ahri annoying and
2.) He genuinely thinks Ahri is scum

I don't think his push is solely or even primarily personal. I disagree with his read on Ahri for now, but that doesn't mean it's invalid. I'd like to think that no one is taking accusations and votes in this game personally.

[Somnus]

For me, my current pool would be {Malcolm, Korina, Progo}.

I haven't ruled out the other 3, but I'm probably not reassessing that until after Day 2. An Ahri/Cat team means they've openly dictated the game and pushed to try and get Progo limmed Day 1, but didn't get the support and so hopped off. I've mostly ruled that out. Same with an Ahri/Cape team, considering I'm coming around to the idea that Cape's slot is clean and StrangeMatter just played odd (in my opinion). Furthermore, the feud between Ahri and StrangeMatter didn't feel like theatrics. You could make the argument that they were partners and StrangeMatter still was legit frustrated, but I doubt it. My current stance is that Ahri and Cape are very likely town. I'm not as convinced of Cat, but Cat is probably town.

Korina is all over the place and doesn't seem invested in reading everything that transpired before Pale Ale Dog left the game. I mostly agree with their reads, but I'm not too sold on the idea of Cape being scum at this point. I'm not entirely ruling out the possibility of a Malcolm/Progo team and that we're getting Keyser Soze'd by someone who ventured over here from MafiaUniverse or whatever (again, doubtful, but ignoring the possibility doesn't seem practical).

Ahri is town, Cape is town, Cat is probably town.

The game has kind of slowed to a crawl the last few days after a quick start to Day 2. For now, I'll put in what I'll call a placeholder vote.

VOTE: MalcolmTucker

[Somnus]

no, see, I believe town would go "there's nothing to SR. Andante is just being voted off of giving no content"
the way you phrased that, sounds like you believe I'm town, but your last line is like "andante is maf! thus I voted her"

I don't have a strong belief that you're mafia. In my read of you, I tried to explain what was your strategy assuming you're town and concluded that it didn't made much sense, so I leaned mafia. I voted for you hoping to force you to claim, but your recent post made it clear you don't plan to, so I'm stuck.

I'm sorry if this is a newbie thought but...

Shouldn't the second Mason claim? The game is now essentially without PR, and the second Mason is now essentially a named townie. If they claim now, they could instantly be cleared of all suspicion, or set up an easy PoE of two if mafia counterclaims for some reason.

I didn't comment on this before, but I probably should now. As town, there are very few instances where you should want other townies to be in a spot to claim, especially early in the game. We already had three townies claim on Day 1: two of them prematurely, and one of them refusing claim other than their alignment (essentially claiming vanilla townie, as Cat mentioned). It's not an ideal outcome.

[Somnus]

How so? I said that he believes Ahri is scum. I didn't say I did. It literally says that in the rest of the post.

[Somnus]

In addition to that, I don't mean to speak on behalf of Malcolm, but I think:

1.) He genuinely finds Ahri annoying and
2.)

He genuinely thinks Ahri is scum

I don't think his push is solely or even primarily personal. I disagree with his read on Ahri for now, but that doesn't mean it's invalid. I'd like to think that no one is taking accusations and votes in this game personally.

If this thought actually holds true, your vote on Malcolm contradicts this

As a follow-up to this confusing comment, I guess what you're implying is that if Malcolm is guaranteed town, then his scum-read of Ahri comes from a legit place and not from a place of personal disdain, and that anyone who thinks Malcolm is legit reading Ahri as scum would have to assume that he's town. But again, we don't know that. I'm offering that as a possibility on the condition that he's town. I'm leaning that he's not town. There's no contradiction.

[Somnus]

That actually sounds pretty reasonable to me. I do want to point out one thing that I've seen mentioned in the game a few times though. There seems to be this idea that scum players rarely drop out of games and that it's disproportionately town players who do so. Taking a quick glance through some of the recent completed newbie games, scum players absolutely do drop out, arguably at a higher rate than town players (don't quote me on that). Just look at the last several completed newbie games on here. Town-reading Cape is fine. I've done so as well, despite some questions I had about the slot at the start of Day 2, but the idea that he can't be scum because his predecessor quit the game is rather faulty, and the last however many newbie games shows that.

I don't know how much I'll be around tonight, so in the unlikely event that a wagon somehow dramatically springs up...

UNVOTE: MalcolmTucker

[Somnus]

I'm going to have an insanely busy Monday and Tuesday, so I'm probably going to have to cast my final vote of Day 2 tomorrow. I'm kind of leaning Korina at this point.

[Somnus]

Well that was an interesting read on Sunday evening. I'm finishing up going through two more ISO's. I'll have some notes/quotes to post before I go to bed later. Welcome back, everyone.

[Somnus]

I'm not sure I get the logic there in how that rules them out as partners at all. By the same notion, are we ruling out Malcolm for the exact same thing? It was such a ho-hum "Everyone can be mafia, but you're probably town lol" comment.

[cut]

These are the relevants posts PAD made imo but honestly they're all just a bit boring to read imo, no offense ;-;

I don't know if it's because I'm jaded or whatever, but it seems null across the board, I agree with their TR on CSF, their TR on LQ is viable given they've made logical decision this game but again I have bad vibes from him

anyways 5/10 bc null

Can't say I'm offended - they were quite boring and hardly ground-breaking.

I still have an itch about both Progo and Malcolm T using my post to make town reads on me

- as well as CSF of course, though she's town for me anyway. [CSF, I know you will probably say why but your posts are just very investigative and you put pressure on the players you are asking - I know you probably disagree with me but I think LicketyQ is in the same bracket].[/quote]

[Somnus]

Bah. Quoting fail. Point stands though. Bottom part of the post is from Pale Ale Dog. Top is me, middle is Ahri

[Somnus]

Ok. I don't want to spam 6 or 7 long posts here at the very start of Day 3 in the middle of the night, so for tonight, I'm just going to post Late-day stuff from Lickety from Day 1 and then Late-day stuff from Cat from Day 2.

LicketyQuickety: Late Day 1
---------------------------
LQ:

Town
Cat/Somnus/SM
PAD/Andante/Malcolm
Progo/Ahri
Scum
(Later town-read Ahri, scum-read PAD slot, voted for Andante). (526)

Ahri Town Read: To be determined
Pale Ale Dog Slot Scum-Read: Correct!
Vote for Andante: Incorrect, along with myself, Cat, and Progo. Korina also voted here too

I'm down with an Andante Lim.

If this flips Town, I don't mind Limming Progo/Malcolm next

. If Andante flips Scum, then I guess it's back to the drawing board, but now we did our job so I would feel good about that. (816)



Also, I don't think Korina should leave the PoE any time soon. (822)

Good read

I do think Progo looks really bad here if you flip Town, so I'd probably push them D2 if you flip Town.

Korina also looks Sus with the way they are approaching this game

which seems to be to not really give much in the way of spicy takes. They are SRing Ahri IIRC, which, Ahri was seriously considered Scummy by a few people (like me) so there's reason to push there.

IDK what SM is doing anymore

. They seem to not really have many takes at all.

Ahri is weird and IDK how I feel about them but their effort seems a bit Townie to me

(like I mentioned before).

And Malcolm has also pushed Ahri, which I kinda get on one level because Ahri is very chaotic and that seems to be a kind of playstyle clash with Malcolm, but I guess

I don't get how Malcolm goes from having everyone as Null to being so sure Ahri is Scum

.

That leaves Cat and Somnus who I think are both obviously Town.

(825)

Correct on the first one, but like...they were mason partners so kind of a given. I haven't flipped yet but I'm going to go ahead and say that his top two town reads were correct.

You were 100% on there being one Scum in Cat/Ahri/myself and an Andante wagon pops up and you ditch that. (827)

If Andante flips Town, it makes you look opportunistic.

(to Progo) (831)

[Somnus]

Cat Scratch Fever: Late Day 2
-----------------------------

ummm why not Malcolm today? He's like a consensus scumread I think?

(@all, if you townread Malcolm, I'd like to hear why.) (1092)

No takers, but now looking back, I think a lot of our comments to each other ended up getting buried in Day 2. It was kind of a sloppy day in general.

I'm assuming you haven't found a better scumspect in the last few days, since your vote is still on me.

We've already talked about the posts of mine that you didn't like that I think are mostly attributed to your lack of context when you first read the game.

The other posts of mine that you didn't like basically boil down to personality, either the tone didn't rub you the right way or b/c you thought it was performative or something.

I'm hate scumposting and generally do the bare minimum to get by. I loathe talking to people in real time because I have to think a lot to get my story straight, so I have to take notes as scum, whereas I can talk off the wall for hours as town. Just do a 5 min skim of some of my past games and I'm interested to see if you think I'm still scum here, because with ~3 days left, your parked vote should be better placed.

That's not why he's scumreading Ahri. That boils down to:

- Ahri's doing weird, unpredictable things that are scummy, such as the self-vote and accusing Progo of scumslipping.

- There's one scum off and one scum on wagon, and Ahri is most likely scum offwagon.

Scum have to be pushing somewhere anyway, why not Ahri? Pushing someone doing outlandish things is easy to do.

I also think Korina's 180 on Ahri overnight as also suspicious, and struck me as perhaps both scum didn't want to both be pushing Ahri at the same time. (1127)

There's a lot to unpack there. The vote on Cat by Cape wasn't going to go anywhere, and that became pretty clear by late Day 2. Cat was trying to make a case for Malcolm, but kept her vote on Korina almost the whole day, and was correct.

If I'm scum here, I have no reason to counterclaim Korina.

I would just wait until the night to NK Korina instead. (1157)

Very true. I had the benefit of reading this hilarious incident about half an hour after Night 2 began, and so maybe I just see it in hindsight, but it seemed extremely obvious that Cat has no reason to counter-claim there as scum. I don't even know how practical a counter claim in this kind of open setup with 7 players left really was. I'll be kind of curious to hear from both Cat and Korina post-game, but Korina was essentially dead. I had said the night before all of this happened that I was going to likely going to have to get my last vote of Day 2 in on Sunday and that I was leaning for Korina. Cat had one idle vote on her all of Day 2 that never gained any momentum, unless you count Korina's desperate vote following the counter-claim.

If this were true, I definitely wouldn't have counterclaimed. I would have just pushed another wagon today after your claim. There's no need for me to get into this gladiate situation where I am guaranteed to die.

ughhhh Malcolm get back in here and hammer your buddy already xd (1163)

TBD. I'm not as convinced as Cat was, even though he's in my pool.

You're both in basically everyone's PoE, so if you're both scum, you need to vote each other to distance. (1167)

Fair, but at that point in Day 2 it was pretty risky. The walls were closing in on Korina, and I had already expressed my likelihood to vote for them on Day 2. Malcolm also at some right before Progo switched his vote had 2 votes on him (he'd have 3 if I hadn't unvoted Saturday).

Although why Malcolm is not crossvoting Korina is a little bit beyond me. I will think some more. (1168)

Again, reading back at it in hindsight, it seemed incredibly obvious to me that Korina was full of it, but I wasn't there live. I'd rather him be careful in those spots than make a quick/ill-advised vote, especially since it's very likely he's never been in that spot before.

btw, this post makes it really likely that PAD/Korina's buddy was someone who wasn't active in the beginning. Which basically narrows the pool down to Malcolm or Cape. (1177)

Good catch by Cat in the middle of a counter-claim. Don't know if it'll end up being true, but it's quite the observation.

Ahri is almost never scum with Korina imo.

You have to admit that it would be a really hilarious scum team

Progo's recent vote switch typically comes from town.

Really? Disagree. Can't complain about the result though

I haven't reread Cape or Somnus because hangover and lazy, but that's where I'd look in the event Malcolm flips town. Still flip Malcolm first though. (1184)

To be determined, but I agree that Ahri wouldn't be in my pool of who I'm looking to go for on Day 3

[Somnus]

VOTE: ProgoWoshua

go next

Why me?

bc ur maf

and im in too many games so this one needs to finish so I can play more

I know you've more or less checked out of this game, unfortunately, but I'm hoping you can at least provide details on your stance here.

[Somnus]

What in the hell did I just read?

[Somnus]

Ok. For starters...can people stop proposing these ridiculous 1v1 gladiator battles? This is a team game. If I agreed to this nonsense, which I don't, you'd easily get my vote right now, Progo, just based on today.

Ahri has been convinced you scum-slipped on Day One. I'm not, but it's something that has loomed over your head since post 436. Lickety planned on tunneling you hard Day 2 and he ends up dead Night One. Ok, there's a lot of reasons he could have been the night kill though. They certainly don't all involve you. He also wanted to push hard on Malcolm and Korina after you.

I hate that Ahri has basically given up on this game since early in Day 2. I really wish I read her as scum because it would be a pretty easy vote on Day 3. Unless she set up a bussing situation with Korina starting late Day 1 and then decided to coast to a quiet victory the rest of the way, I don't think she's scum. If we see a Day 4 and she and I are both somehow still around, I'll reassess my stance here, as I've done at the start of both Day 2 and Day 3.

With that said...no one should EVER read someone voting for themselves and then open-claiming mafia as pro-town. And then you changed your mind roughly an hour later (regret for throwing the game?). I hated when Ahri self-voted on Day 1 and thought it was a bad play, but I at least understood the situation she was setting up. I disagreed with it, and still do, but I at least understood her reasoning. Anyone who sees that play that you made here and says, "Wow! Such town!" will look arguably scummier than you.

This isn't personal. I like you as a person and you seem like a good dude. I don't know how you survive Day 3 with those posts though. And I say that for a few reasons. We went into Day 3 with two shots to lim the remaining scum. Despite not having any power roles left, that's not too bad. Let's say you somehow now survive Day 3 and we do in fact end up in a Day 4. Out of myself, Malcolm, Ahri, and Cape, 2 of those 4 are going to be in a vote with you still around and the insanity/open-mafia claim you just did is going to weigh in on the decision, rather than looking at everything else.

Here's the Outcomes I see:

1. If you're scum and you did this, I feel bad for Korina, and it's going to feel somewhat hollow if this is how we win. I'd still take it, but it'll feel kind of cheap.

2. You're town, and you go into a 2:1 on Day 4 (what mafia in their right mind is going to night kill you now?) with what you just did weighing heavily on the decision and potentially costing town the game.

3. You're scum and somehow coast to an easy scum victory now because people were insane enough to read what you pulled here and go, "Wow! What a townie move! Definitely not scum!". This one seems the least likely, as I doubt anyone is giving you townie points for any of this.

4. You're town and get voted off Day 3 for putting yourself at E-1 and open-claiming mafia after someone put a single vote on you with their entire argument literally being, "bc ur maf".


All four scenarios suck, with the first one sucking the least. In addition to all of that, with this post:

"I just picked one at random. But if you insists" (1145), I'd be concerned with you casting the game-deciding vote if we see a Day 4.

If you're scum, Korina is likely going to have a bone to pick with you post-game. If you're town and you helped give the game to scum by doing this, myself and 5 other people are going to have a bone to pick with you post-game. Even if you somehow flip town, I can't say I would have blamed Cape for quick-hammering you there. Same goes to Malcolm if he had been around during that. If ever there was a reason to quick-hammer someone, I'd say open-claiming mafia is right up there near the top of the list.

Again, you seem like a good dude and regardless of your alignment, I hope this isn't you basically quitting the game and mafia in general and then having regrets shortly thereafter. But to me, for all of the reasons I just outlined, I don't see how you can survive Day 3 here.

I'd like Ahri, Cape, and Malcolm to weigh in before I vote.

[Somnus]

I think we have a pretty good idea of where everyone would stand in a potential Day 4. I'm not worried right now about who I would vote for in Day 4 though. I reassess at the start of each Day anyway after going through notes and ISOs. What I am worried about is going into a potential Day 4 with the uncertainty of this Day 3 incident still clouding a game-deciding vote. I'm going to be a little annoyed if Progo ends up flipping town, but I think it would be a bigger disaster to go forward without having an answer from what occurred here on Day 3, and letting an open-mafia claim and self-vote stroll into the end-game with no answer.

I think most of us have it narrowed down to 1 of 2 people who would likely be night-killed now, especially after yesterday's debacle, but I'm not going to do mafia's job for them and name who would make the most sense. I also think all of us have it narrowed down to 1 or 2 people if we see a Day 4. Like I said though, I'm not concerned with deciding my Day 4 vote now, especially since we may not even see a Day 4. For Day 3, I'm going to make the play that I think gives us a better than 1/5 chance (1/4 when you remove yourself) of catching scum on Day 3 and ending the game, and at worst, removes the uncertainty from yesterday.

VOTE: ProgoWashua

This is E-1

[Somnus]

I misspelled the name, but close enough.

@mod: Also, not that it matters now, but the most recent vote count says 4 were not voting instead of 3. Now it's 2.

[Somnus]

UNVOTE: ProgoWoshua

who's mafia, Progo?

UNVOTE: Ahri

Malcolm and Cape are my two picks.

I won't be back on until much later this evening/tonight, but you do realize that this completely destroys the entire narrative you've set up over the last two days, correct? It also contradicts the assertion you've had for most of the game that one of the three people who had votes on you on Day 1 had to be mafia (2 of them are dead). That second point, I can easily explain away as a read naturally changing. That happens. Some of mine have as well over the course of the game. The first point though, based not just exclusively on the timing, just looks opportunistic, as Lickety said at the end of Day 1.

[Somnus]

Yeah this just isn't adding up to me, Progo. Ahri has made it clear that she believes the pool is down to you and Malcolm and that she doesn't care which one goes first (assuming we even see a Day 4). I don't operate that way and I reassess at the start of each Day phase, but it's just a difference in playstyle. I don't think Ahri temporarily unvoting you really changes her overall stance here.

And since you quickly walked back your mafia claim and now are saying that you believe Ahri is town, it means that the 1v1 you proposed on Wednesday and then reinforced on Thursday was going to be between two people you believed to be town.

The timing of this couldn't have been worse. Both your unvote, as well as your whole perspective changed once Cape had a vote on him and Ahri at least temporarily unvoted you. Opportunistic. The amount of effort Ahri is putting into the game at this point bears little to no consequence.

If you're scum, then great. Game over. If you're town, I don't think going into a game-deciding vote with this still clouding the decision is beneficial to town at all. You potentially flipping town isn't great, but as I said before, going into an end-game vote without any clarity here seems like the worst possible scenario to me.

[Somnus]

https://wiki.mafiascum.net/index.php?ti ... _All_Liars

Eliminate (Lim) All Liars is a longstanding mantra in the mafiascum.net community. Quite simply, most Townies have no reason to lie about their actions, motivations, or roles. Many newish Townies will attempt to lie in attempts to gambit, and fail miserably by hurting the Town in the process.

These lies can be indistinguishable from deliberate scum gambits, and leaving them unpunished reinforces the behavior as a viable option for scum.

For example, Vanilla Townies who try to roleclaim Doctor in an attempt to draw the Mafia's Night-kill tend to cause the real Doctor to counterclaim them, thus definitely causing the Mafia to target them. In addition to this, scum have been known to deliberately fakeclaim Doctor with the express purpose of drawing a counterclaim for this reason. The elimination of the Vanilla Townie is then justified.

Generally, gambits are not successful. If they were, they would probably be on this wiki or otherwise public knowledge. Thus, rather than wind up on the receiving end of Eliminate All Liars, it is best not to try to gambit unless you fully understand the implications of your actions. This comes primarily with experience.

Eliminate All Liars is also why scum should not wantonly gamble with the Town's patience as well.

[Somnus]

It's literally on the site's wiki. I've given my extensive reasons for my vote. Can you at least explain yours?

[Somnus]

We've essentially got two shots at finding mafia: if it's not Progo there's a big risk the town loses.

Because of that,

the Town has better odds if the game reaches ELo with either me or Ahri dead.

That's why I open claimed Mafia. I thought that if I was more valuable dead than alive, then I would die in the craziest way possible to squeeze every last bit of info, to give the remaining townies the best shot at ELo possible.

But I was weak. I gave in and back down pretty much immediately. I actually regret giving up. I should have seen the end of it.

I agree with the first part, but the group seems to think otherwise at this point. As for the 2nd and 3rd part, I'm not buying it at all and you quickly changed your mind on it anyway. We didn't gain any info. Only confusion.

[Somnus]

I don't feel like there's much more that I can add here. If you guys feel that pushing Malcom through today is the right play, it looks to me like you have the votes. If you're right and it ends the game, I'll take it and you can take some shots at me post-game while we celebrate. However, I'm not a fan at all of giving the Day 3 deciding vote, as well as potentially a game-deciding vote on a Day 4 to a player who:

-Put himself at E-1
-Open-claimed mafia
-Quickly walked it back
-Gave flimsy explanations for it
-Went from reading Ahri as scum virtually the entire game to suddenly reading Cape as scum the exact moment that Cape had a vote on him and Ahri unvotes, and it became clear Ahri wasn't realistically getting voted off today
-Gave more contradictory explanations for doing so

I'm not even town-reading Malcolm. I'd put him at null or a slight scum-lean. I just think that the worst case scenario of a Progo lim where he flips town looks significantly better and clears up a lot of stuff for a potential Day 4 compared to the alternative. Do as you feel is best.

[Somnus]

Hey, Progo. Pretty early here so I'm going to keep it brief for now. Just some quick comments.

Somnus vote Progo tmro btw if this somehow doesn't flip scum

which it should

I highly doubt Cape is mafia

oh also Cape

I highly doubt Somnus is mafia

his fencesitting is stupid

Now I"m suspicious of Ahri again. She TRs both Somnus and Cape, but at first only tries to coach Somnus. Later, she realize her mistake and addresses Cape as well. Do you pretend to kill Cape tonight?

I noticed after the thread was locked that I committed the same dumb translation error as last time. The Portuguese word for "Intends" is "Pretende", which seriously messes with my brain.

Even before you cleared that up, I noticed that when I got on Sunday evening to read how Day 3 ended. It's not dumb. I get the confusion. I do think that clears up the Day 1 incident and clarifies that it wasn't a scum slip. So I'm willing to unofficially strike that incident from the record books, so to speak.

[Somnus]

More importantly, I have exactly 0 reasons to kill Cape as Mafia. Cape was far more likely to not vote for me than you two are.

I don't really agree with this though.

IF

you're scum, I don't think you have a viable option for a good night kill there. While I was the one who ended up with a vote on you (as well as Malcolm), Ahri and Cape seemed more convinced you'd flip scum than I was (in my opinion). They certainly went after you harder in the last page or so of Day 3. I can't pull up quotes at the moment, but somewhere towards the end of Day 3, Cape said something along the lines of "I believe it's Progo but his thought process is convoluted" or something to that effect. I gave my reasons for voting for you while acknowledging that you could in some bizarre universe still end up flipping town. Despite that, I felt it was not only a good chance to hit scum and end the game, but it would at the very least avoid this exact confusing scenario for a Day 4 that I was hoping wouldn't come to fruition and warned about in a couple of my posts in Day 3. We now have zero clarity.

You basically had all 4 of the other players still in the game scum-reading you on Day 3, and almost inexplicably, only two of them voted for you. I don't think your Day 4 looks particularly more promising with Ahri/Cape or Somnus/Cape. With that said, I'm trying really hard to keep an open mind here.

[Somnus]

I stand by my point from the last twilight.

Ahri knew Cape was going to be killed at night, so when townreadind both Somnus and Cape she only tried to coach Somnus at first.

She immediately realized her mistake, and addressed Cape on her following post.

Maybe. I'm just going to give myself a headache going through a WIFOM infinity loop of reverse psychology if I try to rationalize it though. I'm more concerned about what Ahri seemed to hint at in the last post of Day 3, which made it sound like you were certain that we were even going to see a Night 3. Could be a POV slip on your part. I don't know.

[Somnus]

VOTE: Progo

[Somnus]

[Somnus]

Thank-you. Good game to you and everyone. I'm genuinely sorry, even though I probably shouldn't be. I'll have more later.

[Somnus]

Honestly, I didn’t believe Sommus was going to flip town for a majority of this game since (credit to CSF for pointing this out but) was just Information Instead of Analysis.

We're all happy for you. Good game to you as well, I suppose.

[Somnus]

First of all, thank-you and good game to everyone.

Sooo...I lied. Yeah, I'm mafia, so that's not a surprise. But I lied very early in this game. This was actually my first game ever. I learned what mafia was less than two months ago. To be fair, I had a game offsite start 3 days after this one that I felt I had to join, since I was the one trying to revive mafia on the site. It was a disaster. I played somewhat well but the game was fucked from the start. A townie refused to play and was signed up against his will and was mod-killed instead of replaced, townies bandwagoning to try and vote off other obvious townies, etc. No power roles. Typical 9 player mountainous or whatever. A terrible game that lasted one week and ended when I was mis-limmed on Day 4.

But yeah, I learned what mafia was around the 2nd week of December and dove into the Wiki on here pretty hard and read through some old games on the other site that I played on. I didn't go into this with a plan to be the obsessive note-taker. It just kind of happened. I don't plan on doing that in my next game. Maybe again in the future.

I had everything in the world stacked against me in this game. No one mentioned it during the game, and I wasn't even sure if it would be breaking rules or etiquette to do so, so I didn't, but I imagine you're all aware that the game had to be re-rolled before it began. I was one of those weirdos who was actually excited and somewhat relieved to receive my "Vanilla Townie" role, only to be gut-punched with news that the game was being re-rolled and that I would be a Mafia Roleblocker. Weird, right? Excited to be a Vanilla Townie and crushed to find out I'd be a Mafia Roleblocker.

I was stressed out through a lot of this game starting on Day 2. Both my original scum partner and I had literally never played before. Pale Ale Dog said he used to enjoy reading through games and trying to solve them as he went along, but he had never played and wanted to give it a shot. As we all know, about a week into it, he realized he hated playing mafia and quit. He said he won't be returning to the site. Nice guy, but it clearly wasn't for him. And we can laugh about it now, but I was genuinely annoyed at the time with the way Korina kind of stormed into the game and brought all kinds of scum attention. I thought that all of the hard work I had done was instantly being destroyed, but it ended up working out in our favor. You did well, Korina, although you stressed me the hell out at first

[Somnus]

Somnus, I thought you played really well. The Newbie Queue can be intimidating for Newbie scum, and even players who are experienced at mafia on other sites. You have no idea of the skills, strengths and weaknesses of the other players. And while that true in reverse and as mafia new to MS players can take advantage of being unknown and underestimated, it's still usually a hard slog to the finish line.

Your kill choices, in particular were great. Getting a mason on Night 1 and not losing a partner on day 1 in the mason setup makes for a much easier game, and you and Korina pulled off both of those challenges.

Thank-you, kindly. That means a lot to me. And thank-you for hosting. I can't wait to re-read the entire thread.

[Somnus]

Individual Comments:


Andante: I'm sorry you didn't get to play longer. Maybe the soft, squishy part of my heart will die off with more games as scum, but I legit felt bad for you and the way you went out.

LicketyQuickety: I talked Korina into me night-killing you instead of Malcolm. Sorry about that. You played well, even if your time in this game ended up being pretty brief.

Korina: I mentioned it above, but you stressed me the hell out when you came into the game, suggesting all of these wild gambits and whatnot. Don't take this personally, because I'm laughing as I type this. It worked out. You're chaotic and you like to gamble. And I did some brief meta-diving of you and counter-claiming is kind of your thing. I had to play it off in Day 3 like you were doing it to survive, but you and I both knew that wasn't the case. It ended up drawing out the other mason. Hilariously, we were likely going to kill Cat on Night 2 anyway, but confirmation that she was the other mason was a nice bonus. My only regret is that I wasn't around when it all went down, as the plan was for me to bus for extra town credit. Despite us being drastically different playstyle-wise, it all worked out and you certainly earned this win as well.

Cat Scratch Fever: You were an active force in both Days 1 and 2 and kept the game going whenever it showed hints of stalling. You played well, and again, if it makes you feel any better, you were likely getting killed Night 2 as a result of your play anyway.

MalcolmTucker: Like Andante, I genuinely felt bad for you through most of the game. Virtually no one was town-reading you, and yet you handled yourself with ridiculous amounts of class and dignity. The original plan on Day 3 was in fact to get you into Day 4 and rely on Ahri or Cape to mis-lim you. I was bummed at first that things were swinging onto you instead of Progo, but well before the end of Day 3, I realized it was going to work out in my favor. I genuinely did try to get you into Day 4 at first though. My "fence-sitting" as Ahri put it was because I knew Progo was going to jump on and mis-lim you. Me not being on that Day 3 wagon was just to give myself more townie credit. I know we can't comment on ongoing games, so please don't, but just know that I've been following along and I'm rooting really really hard for you right now. I won't elaborate further.

Cape90: Major props for jumping in on such short notice on Day 2 and reading through the entire thread. I went back and forth on whether to Night Kill you or Ahri. I'm not sure how much it would have mattered, but I literally spent hours over the last couple nights out for long walks going through every possible scenario. I originally was considering no-kill, but figured the group would likely vote no-lim on Day 4 anyway.

ProgoWoshua: You're insane, Progo, and I love it. You, Andante, and Malcolm were the ones I felt bad about in this game. For some reason, it doesn't feel as bad to night-kill, but pushing you on Day 3 and briefly on Day 4 did make me uncomfortable. As I said before, it was never personal. I hope you keep working on the Wiki stuff. Yes, I checked it out. Nice work. You're a good dude and I'd love to be town teammates with you in the near future. Just...maybe don't self-vote and put yourself at E-1 when we inevitably end up town together

Ahri: I meant what I said. You were an absolute joy to have in the game, particularly in Day 1. You did force a lot of the interactions and a lot of the reads people made were because of things you did. I know you got side-tracked by various other games somewhere during Day 2 in here, but I genuinely hope that you and I are on the same team in the near future. I'd prefer to roll town for my next several games, but an Ahri/Somnus scum team would be siiiiiick.


This game took a lot out of me. By Day 3, I was double and triple-checking before every post to make sure I wasn't making some POV slip. I loved it and I'm going to be playing more (after taking a few weeks off to relax and re-read this entire game), but I couldn't wait for it to be over. You're all great. My only regret is that I couldn't share a victory with all of you, but I hope I get to soon.

[Somnus]

Korina: I mentioned it above, but you stressed me the hell out when you came into the game, suggesting all of these wild gambits and whatnot. Don't take this personally, because I'm laughing as I type this. It worked out. You're chaotic and you like to gamble. And I did some brief meta-diving of you and counter-claiming is kind of your thing. I had to play it off in Day 3 like you were doing it to survive, but you and I both knew that wasn't the case. It ended up drawing out the other mason. Hilariously, we were likely going to kill Cat on Night 2 anyway, but confirmation that she was the other mason was a nice bonus. My only regret is that I wasn't around when it all went down, as the plan was for me to bus for extra town credit. Despite us being drastically different playstyle-wise, it all worked out and you certainly earned this win as well.

I was aware I did lmao. I don't really like playing the game with the intent of "I must be totally serious playing this game and make the most optimal move every single time" - I prefer playing gambits and whatnot for the sake of fun, and if that costs me the game, it costs me the game. I think that's a difference of playstyle though. I don't really tend to play serious games like newbies very often because of that fact. I really only replaced in because Fferylit posted in the MS discord she needed a replacement, and I just kinda went "ok I need something to do for a little while." (Speaking of which, if you're planning on sticking around the community, you are eligible to join the MS discord. The thread about it is here.)

What I was not expecting was getting paired with you. You were super strong from quick glances, and I felt very comfortable doing the dumb things with you, in an already chaotic game. Hell, having multiple people claim on D1 made the game much easier to play from, and I felt less bad about trying to be chaotic to try to obscure you a little bit more. You're a strong player for certain. I also don't think we would've done as well if we didn't try to coordinate as much in the Scum PT. My only regret as well was that we didn't coordinate more on stuff, or talk more. Talking in *any* PT is a double-edged sword. On one hand, you and your partners get more information between each other and can coordinate stuff more easily, and whatnot. On the other hand, the major downside is it's easy to unintentionally reveal information that you wouldn't have already if you coordinate a lot.

Haha. Agreed with all of this. We played drastically different style-wise and that probably actually worked out for the best. Glad you were able to step in.

[Somnus]

Well done, Somnus!
By the way, Town, don't feel bad about the loss.

Much-appreciated. Thank-you!

[Somnus]

Thank-you, Progo and Cat. Enjoyed playing with both of you.

Yes, it started to get more difficult as the player pool shrank. I actually stopped taking notes after Night 2 entirely. I kind of had a feel for where everyone was and what the plan/backup plan should be. It was fun but stressful. Can I be town for the next 4 or 5 games, plz?