micro 1096: planned idea [game over]

[Black]

VOTE: Ausuka

[Black]

Oh yeah, been a bit since we've played a game together Black.

I think the last time we played was when we caught Kira

Shall we catch some wolves?

[Black]

You weren't the only one that got tunneled on Gimli that game

[Black]

VOTE: Black

You are supposed to be my bestie and voting me is really rude actually.

It's an RVS vote though which is a term of endearment!

[Black]

Does Koba always talk so much

[Black]

Black is my first serious townread.

- Corinne

Why? Are you Dragon?

[Black]

Corinne

Also is this tag based on the Neil Gaiman book?

[Black]

suspicious how shaddowez is the only person not to have posted. hiding something....? too afraid of the pressure me and roden are putting him?

This seems like a stretch

[Black]

That's an even bigger stretch

[Black]

The game started less than 24 hours ago. Not to mention shaddow is a very sporadic poster anyway. He may be scum but it's not because he hasn't posted yet

[Black]

suspicious how shaddowez is the only person not to have posted. hiding something....? too afraid of the pressure me and roden are putting him?

This seems like a stretch

its a true statement!!

I don't think it's true that it's suspicious to have not posted yet

[Black]

[Black]

it's ok black will be angry at me too

Nah, I would have done the same thing if I were you

[Black]

Not really sure how to feel about tris. Pressuring someone that hadn't even posted kinda felt like she was trying to do stuff to earn town points

There's like this undertone of joking that I'm getting with tris's posts that makes me think she's not being serious and that is making it hard for me to read her. The whole "shaddow is sus" to "shaddow is conf town" just feels like a joke, and I'm wondering if scum!her would post this way to back out of reads or something

[Black]

I think she could be but I'm really not sure atm

[Black]

Koba just feels like they enjoy filling the thread with nonsense but I'm assuming this is just how they play

[Black]

Ok uh black I'm sorry you have to find out this way but the entire shadow wagon thing was a rvs meme

Oh. What's the context?

I'm hoping this knowledge will give you new and exciting input on the game

Actually the opposite. I feel like I'm back at square one now

[Black]

Also I've never seen the phrase "let her cook" used in a not joke context either

I use this phrase non-jokingly all the time XD

[Black]

VOTE: HPE

[Black]

UNVOTE: Ausuka
RVS E-2... scawy!

Why so afraid?

cause a flip this early is a terrible idea lol

I'm curious why you didn't say this in 87

It feels more like you were riding the fence in that post when I would expect someone with this belief to be more critical of the shadow wagon

[Black]

UNVOTE: Ausuka
RVS E-2... scawy!

Why so afraid?

cause a flip this early is a terrible idea lol

I'm curious why you didn't say this in 87

It feels more like you were riding the fence in that post when I would expect someone with this belief to be more critical of the shadow wagon

Not sure what non-criticality you're reading from "completely and utterly terrifying"

What are you terrified of exactly? Scum getting a quick misfade on someone?

[Black]

UNVOTE: Ausuka
RVS E-2... scawy!

Why so afraid?

cause a flip this early is a terrible idea lol

I'm curious why you didn't say this in 87

It feels more like you were riding the fence in that post when I would expect someone with this belief to be more critical of the shadow wagon

Not sure what non-criticality you're reading from "completely and utterly terrifying"

What are you terrified of exactly? Scum getting a quick misfade on someone?

i dont understand how you go from 135 to 138. first you were saying that hpe wasn't critical enough of the shadow wagon, but then you're questioning it as if it was too critical of the wagon.

I think you misread me. I wasn't implying it was being too critical in 138. I asked it that question for a reason

[Black]

VOTE: HPE

UNVOTE: Ausuka
RVS E-2... scawy!

Why so afraid?

cause a flip this early is a terrible idea lol

I'm curious why you didn't say this in 87

It feels more like you were riding the fence in that post when I would expect someone with this belief to be more critical of the shadow wagon

Not sure what non-criticality you're reading from "completely and utterly terrifying"

What are you terrified of exactly? Scum getting a quick misfade on someone?

That's a lesser concern compared to a painfully early shot in the dark funny ass flashwagon being basically devoid of info other than "well why did you guys flip them so early" to which everyone shrugs and says "shitpost". NO VCA, NO post-flip recontextualization of interactions, NO seeing who die hard townread the scum flip, nunna that. The longer a day goes, the better it is for town (in the long run atleast).

Do you think scum was pushing the shadow wagon?

[Black]

Ok uh black I'm sorry you have to find out this way but the entire shadow wagon thing was a rvs meme

Oh. What's the context?

I don't think there is really much context here. People were just RVS shitposting? Tris said something that seemed obviously ironic and me and Koba joined in.

Ok, I didn't get that vibe. 58 felt like an actual read to me. What made you think tris was shitposting here?

[Black]

that just reads as an obvious joke to me? and it is also strongly indicated by the "so you must be his partner" immediately afterwards

Yeah idk. Maybe tris is some jokester or something and I'm just not familiar with her? I assumed they were actual accusations. I see players say that type of thing all the time and actually mean it

[Black]

I disagree with the assessment that scum wouldn't vote for their partner before they've posted

I don't really think it makes sense to locktown shadow for the reason HPE is giving, but I also don't know why scum would make that read. It doesn't really benefit them at all unless shaddow is their partner

[Black]

Didn't remember the Ausuka vote, it didn't last long enough to be in a VC though

I don't see what Black has to do with anything

HPE is trying to say it doesn't think I'm scum and therefore can't be a shadow partner

[Black]

ZERO solidarity on these mfs. True mafia never vote their pal needlessly..................

They do when they're trying to distance, or when they're trying to convince players like you that they aren't partnered

[Black]

anyway if you'll excuse me its time to do a bunch of situps and go out into the freezing snowing tundra

Be safe!

[Black]

I think HPE's reactions and responses to his wagon feel fine. There's a sense of entitlement in his read regarding the e-2 stuff and it makes me think he actually believes what he's saying

VOTE: Roden

His vote and subsequent conversation with HPE felt more opportunistic than the Rogue's

[Black]

If HPE is town then I think it would have been easy for scum to hop on the wagon and add pressure there

[Black]

I think HPE's reactions and responses to his wagon feel fine. There's a sense of entitlement in his read regarding the e-2 stuff and it makes me think he actually believes what he's saying

yeah hey who is "he" here

I'm terribly sorry!

[Black]

{HPE, Roden, tris} maybe town
{black, koba} idk
{shaddowez, rogues, vulpix} maybe scum

I don't understand why you think Roden and tris are town

[Black]

i absolutely cannot read roden historically to be clear

[Black]

That escalated quickly

[Black]

It feels like Roden was overjustifying his scumread on HPE a little

[Black]

I think town!Roden could try something like that to win the 1v1 I suppose

[Black]

I always scum read replacements and once when Margot is done with her catchup and reads list I'm probably going to scum read her too.

- A

I don't like how preemptive this feels. Why do you always scumread replacements?

[Black]

I always scum read replacements and once when Margot is done with her catchup and reads list I'm probably going to scum read her too.

- A

I don't like how preemptive this feels. Why do you always scumread replacements?

It's the way how they give out their reads afterwards when they are done catching up and I scum read replacements who don't bother on catching up which looks like they are not trying to figure out the game.

- A

But surely you've seen town replacements that have done both things before. It happens quite often. So it doesn't really make sense for you to automatically scumread replacements

[Black]

VOTE: Flare Fluff

It feels like they are positioning themselves to hop on the Roden/Margot wagon

Plus I kinda wanna let Margot cook

[Black]

VOTE: Flare Fluff

It feels like they are positioning themselves to hop on the Roden/Margot wagon

Plus I kinda wanna let Margot cook

That's not positioning on what I did. It was talking about my experience about replacements and I recently had an experience with a replacement I had from a completed game I felt bad about myself.

- A

VOTE: Flare Fluff

It feels like they are positioning themselves to hop on the Roden/Margot wagon

Plus I kinda wanna let Margot cook

you and ausuka have been on A about off, and now your narrating she positioning herself when she was previous explaining her reasons. lol if i didn't know better maybe you to are itching to get town out.


how many games have you played with A?

~H

Sure, if you're town then it wasn't positioning. But if you're scum then I think the whole "I always scumread replacements" and "I'll probably scumread Margot too" thing was meant to set yourself up to hop on a mobile wagon

[Black]

But surely you've seen town replacements that have done both things before. It happens quite often. So it doesn't really make sense for you to automatically scumread replacements

this is normal thing, imo. and seen people not liking scum roles only to sub out. it basically 50/50 but seen it more on other forums.


~H

I don't think it's normal to always scumread replacements, especially if, after awhile, you start to notice that there are townies doing the things you are suspicious of (posting reads after catching up, or not catching up at all)

Even if replacements are scum half of the time like you are suggesting (which I disagree with btw, at least in my experience replacements have been town like 80% of the time), I still don't think that's a good reason to scumread someone

[Black]

ok lmao with black! seriously!

you have been voting on off, on wagons Xd while accusing A, of doing this! A chan, on the other hand is voting someone she suspects.

Huh? I accused A of positioning herself to join the leading wagon. I don't think there is a correlation between what I've done this game and what A is doing with her Margot read

[Black]

There is yet to be a good argument made against me.

The problem with you is your town lock on Shadow still doesn't make sense to me. You town lock Shadow because the players voting him at rvs can't be scum with him and the players who didn't vote Shadow can't be scum with him because you town read 2 of the players who didn't vote him and the other 2 players who didn't vote Shadow you are not town reading which are the 2 hydras and you didn't explain on why Shadow can't be paired with the 2 hydras.

- A

It has gotten me wondering if you have been fabricating reads because of this.

- A

Why do you seem to have an issue with HPE townlocking Shaddow but you don't seem concerned that Margot is townlocking Ausuka? Especially considering you are suspicious of both Margot and Ausuka. I feel like town!you would have asked Margot about her read there

[Black]

Low-key paranoid that HPE might be trying to pocket me with the synergy stuff but I do town lean it so I'm going to wave this thought off for now

[Black]

Again, maybe it's because I clocked the shadow wagon as a joke, but I do see this as a potentially easy/potentially opportunistic way to jump onto Tris?

I thought tris was being serious with her read, and in that world I feel like it was a scummy read. I didn't even jump onto tris though so I'm not sure why you are scumreading this

[Black]

I always scum read replacements and once when Margot is done with her catchup and reads list I'm probably going to scum read her too.

- A

This is what I'm referring to re: your Margot read. You don't have one yet but you are setting yourself up to scumread her, which I read as opportunistic

I would like H to explain why she thinks what we are doing is similar

[Black]

There is yet to be a good argument made against me.

The problem with you is your town lock on Shadow still doesn't make sense to me. You town lock Shadow because the players voting him at rvs can't be scum with him and the players who didn't vote Shadow can't be scum with him because you town read 2 of the players who didn't vote him and the other 2 players who didn't vote Shadow you are not town reading which are the 2 hydras and you didn't explain on why Shadow can't be paired with the 2 hydras.

- A

It has gotten me wondering if you have been fabricating reads because of this.

- A

Why do you seem to have an issue with HPE townlocking Shaddow but you don't seem concerned that Margot is townlocking Ausuka? Especially considering you are suspicious of both Margot and Ausuka. I feel like town!you would have asked Margot about her read there

Margot literally said in the thread she will talk about her read on Ausuka and I wanted to wait and see what she says. If I disagree on the read and it's not convincing for me then I will talk about it with her.

- A

Ok, that's fair

[Black]

Who are you talking about in the last sentence?

You and me

H said this:

ok lmao with black! seriously!

you have been voting on off, on wagons Xd while accusing A, of doing this!

A chan, on the other hand is voting someone she suspects.

I don't understand what point she was trying to make here

H also said this:

Reading back I have noticed Roden and black flip flopping with votes

though not sure how it done on this forum, but usually town keep switching vote where i played. though could be scum, if scum confident here.

~H

So I find it weird that she would assume scum switch votes a lot here when town switch votes a lot where she comes from. Why would she think this forum operates any differently? And you can let H answer this, I don't expect you to read her mind

It's not scummy to switch votes around. I do it all the time

[Black]

This may be an unpopular opinion but I actually think static reads are more wolf indicative than reads that change all the time

[Black]

And where do I fit in?

(Also please don't use the "L" word. We say lim or fade or something similar here )

Pedit: oh ok

[Black]

What if it's just the two hydras

[Black]

What if it's just the two hydras

nah

Do you think Rogues is town?

[Black]

What if it's just the two hydras

nah

Do you think Rogues is town?

[Black]

Ok so you're just going to ignore me

Bet, we can play that game

[Black]

VOTE: Two Level 1 Rogues

[Black]

What if it's just the two hydras

me and a are town. why do you think it two hydra?

~H

I don't really think this anymore. I have another pet theory

[Black]

I don't really think this anymore. I have another pet theory

just because i say town, does not mean you take it to face value 100% that depends on the player, but i already see people twisting it excuse to further shade.

~H

I'm confused by what you are trying to say here

[Black]

I'm confused by what you are trying to say here

I think it best you reply to A then, since you like to parrot others who seem confused train.




~H

???????

[Black]

Can you just explain what you meant in 480 and stop taking little shots at me

[Black]

Can you just explain what you meant in 480 and stop taking little shots at me

how can you not understand someone saying town, does not mean 100% yes i do it more out habit, if bothered by it. it your choice like other reading to decide if town, or like the other use that as excuse to say that scummy. either way i am see people use this as easy excuse to say scum would play like this. but meh

it either 50/50

i already explained it early, do you get it!?


~H

Look I'm not trying to be rude (even though you clearly are for some reason?) but your English is not very good, so sometimes when you say things I don't really know what you are trying to say. Even now I still don't know what point you are trying to make, but just forget it. You clearly seem to be irritated that I'm confused so I don't even really want to bother anymore

[Black]

[Black]

Flare Fluff, I think you misunderstood what I said in 478. Your response in 480 didn't really make sense in the context of what I was saying, so I told you I was confused. You said you didn't care and said I like to parrot others that seem confused. I asked you to explain what you meant and you said "how could you not understand" and "do you get it?!" which felt really condescending

I wasn't trying to be rude or insulting, I was trying to explain to you why I may be having a hard time understanding the point you are trying to make. I'm sorry if you felt insulted

[Black]

1. you ask me about your pet theory
2. then i answered this, with town claim is 50/50 but from your pet theory you think i am not town. so perhaps i should went with just 50/50 for claims.
3. you say i didn't answer your pet theory.

Just to clarify, in 478 I said I don't think both you and the other hydra are scum anymore. My pet theory involves Rogues being scum with someone else

[Black]

VOTE: Flare Fluff
Slot is a liability regardless of alignment tbch

I can see where you're coming from but I don't really think this is a good vote unless you think they are scum

[Black]

It feels like FF is scumreading people that scumread them, which I think is more likely to come from town? Idk, I think it's odd how their read on me changed after I unvoted them and said I didn't really think they were scum anymore

[Black]

It feels like FF is scumreading people that scumread them, which I think is more likely to come from town? Idk, I think it's odd how their read on me changed after I unvoted them and said I didn't really think they were scum anymore

i am not scum reading everyone who suspect me, this is false.


~H

You moved me to town after I stopped pushing you. You moved Koba and HPE down after they voted for you

It feels like there is a correlation between how people are handling your slot and your read on them, and I think that is more likely to come from town

[Black]

I come back and turns out I have missed nothing important. It just looks like to me players here don't like the way harle writes her readslist.

- A

Do you have a readslist?

[Black]

Koba is either trolling or they're scum. Maybe both

When I had the thought that both hydras could be scum, they said "nah", and at the time they scumread FF

That would imply they don't think Rogues is scum but now they want to hammer them

[Black]

nope, someone else pls vote

i bet u

Are you trying to say these posts aren't an indication that you want someone to put Rogues at e-1 so you can hammer them?

[Black]

Koba is either trolling or they're scum. Maybe both

When I had the thought that both hydras could be scum, they said "nah", and at the time they scumread FF

That would imply they don't think Rogues is scum but now they want to hammer them

put them at e-1 and we'll find out

I'm already voting for them. Pay attention

[Black]

Dammit I forgot this game existed

I am not very good at hydraing

One sec

This could be a lie I guess but if Rogues actually forgot about the game I wanna say that's probably +town for them. I'm never going to just forget about a scum game

[Black]

VOTE: Ausuka

I think I'd rather go here

I'm getting Backup6 vibes from the way she's expressing her thoughts. It's hard to put into words but it kinda feels like she's overexplaining herself a little. I didn't like the way she jumped on the Rogues wagon. 553 feels scummy to me

[Black]

Uh why would that be +town for me

I literally have a history of AFKing in scum games.

- Corrine, to be clear

Do you have any examples of this other than Flavorless Hell? In that game you admitted IRL stuff made you go afk

[Black]

I probably can't explain it in a way that would satisfy you but it feels reminiscent of the scum game of hers I linked where she feigned uncertainty and overexplained herself quite a bit

[Black]

What? No I was asking Black to stop tunneling Fluff.

I don't think I was tunneling them at all. I was just having a conversation with them

[Black]

Not that it really matters but I don't like being misconstrued

[Black]

Uh why would that be +town for me

I literally have a history of AFKing in scum games.

- Corrine, to be clear

Do you have any examples of this other than Flavorless Hell? In that game you admitted IRL stuff made you go afk

Uhhhhh

No I don't have any other examples other than FH.

So you don't have a history of this at all

[Black]

Sure. I don't really think you are scum anymore though. My read wasn't very strong to begin with and it was based on a couple of minor things plus a weak association read with someone else. I like what you've posted today

[Black]

I think it's more likely that there is scum on your wagon and Ausuka's vote feels the worst to me

[Black]

i went and looked at the game i had played with ausuka b4, and she does actually seem different there than here... but i can also think of reasons why tht might be. but, im feeling less good about townreading her. but also havent actually reviewed her iso so i need to do that! ! !

Yeah, I don't really think meta arguments are super reliable but sometimes the vibes are hard to ignore

Part of my Ausuka vote is just process of elimination. I don't really think either of the hydras are scum at this point, which is funny because yesterday or the day before I had a theory that it was both of them. I'm having a hard time reading you/Margot this game so I'd rather keep you around to sort you better. Shaddow and Koba could be scum, I don't think I would mind voting either of them today tbh

[Black]

i think margot could be a scum

Yeah I was just looking over her ISO actually. The Ausuka townlock feels weird

What is pinging you about her?

[Black]

Yeah Roden didn't feel great either

I could probably go Margot today, but I would prefer Ausuka

[Black]

Idk I think this progression by tris almost feels fake?

I think I know what you mean

If Ausuka flips scum I think there's a decent argument for scum!tris. Tris is defending her and trying to get a counter wagon going while at the same time questioning her read on Ausuka and saying she needs to look into it more. Feels a little wishy washy in a partnered type way

This is purely an association scumread on Tris though because I think if Suki flips town then this whole progression would be +town for tris

[Black]

Is Koba always this useless

[Black]

Start of day phase when I saw ausuka and tris talking cats, it doesn't look like to me 2 scum would treat each other like that.

- A

I don't see how this makes them unpartnered. Scum don't always ignore and avoid each other

[Black]

Why are you trying to convince rogues that they're town instead of just thinking, like, not everyone values scum games as much as you do

That wasn't what I was doing at all

[Black]

Yeah, you are misunderstanding it. Dragon said he had a history of flaking as scum and I asked him to provide examples. I didn't ask him that to try and convince him he was town, I was trying to get more information to determine if my read was poop or not

[Black]

What does your readslist look like atm suki

[Black]

Ok but my point is that if he thinks he as scum would forget about a game why would you need proof of that

He was asking me why I considered it +town of him and used his "history" as a reason why I shouldn't. It's not like he said "I would forget about a game as scum" and I said "no you wouldn't", he specifically said he's done it before. I wanted to make sure I wasn't overlooking any games where he did this

[Black]

Ok but my point is that if he thinks he as scum would forget about a game why would you need proof of that

He was asking me why I considered it +town of him and used his "history" as a reason why I shouldn't. It's not like he said "I would forget about a game as scum" and I said "no you wouldn't", he specifically said he's done it before. I wanted to make sure I wasn't overlooking any games where he did this

I think there are two ways I can read this post

If you're saying "he didn't say he would forget about a game as scum", him saying he believes he has done it before is definitely that

If you're saying "he did say that but what he specifically said was that he'd done it before, but I wanted additional context" that makes more sense to me, but I guess my question is like, why is that important to determining the quality of your read in this context when he already said the read wouldn't apply to him (and I do think that, like, whether or not you value scumgames highly is very personal)

I do think my first post about this subject was too snippy, I was in a bit of a bad mood, sorry for that

I don't understand why you are ignoring part of the context of the conversation

If he had simply said "I would forget about a game as scum" then I wouldn't have argued with him, and the conversation would have ended there. It was the fact that he said he had done it before that made me question him further

[Black]

This argument seems completely pointless

[Black]

Suki what is your read on Koba?

[Black]

I think I'd be ok with a FF lim based on reactions and what seems to be ATE more than a valid defense of their actions, but also think we need to consolidate based on time. Not willing to move to Ausuka right now.

This one is willing to go FF but it'd prefer Margot rn. Ausuka is off the table for me, this one would like to get back into the game proper D2 and look at slots besides Margot/FF. Just rn its too annoyed here and getting caught up elsewhere to be super present.

I feel like this is the first time you've even mentioned Ausuka. Why do you townread her?

[Black]

HPE could be an Ausuka partner

[Black]

I think the entire Ausuka wagon is town actually

[Black]

Kinda iffy on Margot but I think I'm starting to lean town there

[Black]

you seem pretty set on ausuka maf, black

I'm not super confident but I do have a fairly strong gut feeling about it

do you townread rogues now? why?

I liked their exchange with me yesterday. I would say it's more of a townlean though

[Black]

I think I'd be ok with a FF lim based on reactions and what seems to be ATE more than a valid defense of their actions, but also think we need to consolidate based on time. Not willing to move to Ausuka right now.

I don't think FF is happening today. You should consider Ausuka or Margot

I'm also willing to flashwagon Koba if there is enough interest there

[Black]

@shaddow - ignore the above comment, I just realized you are already on Margot

[Black]

That's 3 people willing to vote Koba. Do we have 4 and 5?

[Black]

black i remember you telling me that you have a strong gut feeling i'm scum every time you play against me. is there, like ... any reason you don't appear to be taking that into account at all

I have taken that into consideration. That's why I'm willing to fade Koba instead

[Black]

Suki the attitude and sass when you are talking to me is lowkey annoying

[Black]

But whatever. That's just how you talk to people sometimes. I will just learn to deal with it

[Black]

HPE what does your readslist look like atm

[Black]

HPE can you talk about your town read on Ausuka on 158. You put Ausuka as town and you never gave a reason on why you put her as town.

- A

Wagon comp sucks ass, which makes me lean town on Ausuka when no one above null is voting for her.

Are you saying in this post you town read Ausuka for being voted by town and you town read the players who voted Ausuka at start of day phase?

I need more elaboration on how you got to town reading Ausuka for being voted by two other players you are town reading.

- A

Ok this is getting ridiculous now after 760.
NOBODY

ABOVE

NULL. Black has fallen to null to me for her posturing towards Koba that this one disagrees with and dislikes, Rogues have been nullscum for a while, and Margot/You are outright scumreads. No one that this one townreads is voting Ausuka. Ausuka is being voted by scum. How did you come up with this one saying Ausuka is town for being voted by its townreads??

That's a pretty weak reason to drop your townread on me. Why is my Koba stance scummy?

[Black]

That doesn't really explain why you think it's scummy. Do you think I'm scum with Margot?

[Black]

That doesn't really explain why you think it's scummy. Do you think I'm scum with Margot?

This one doesn't even think you're scum, jesus. It nettles me that you townread FF

and

Margot, but right now you're just "weird vibes for that Koba position".

If you don't think I'm scum then dropping me to null for wanting to fade Koba makes even less sense. Like I could maybe see your reasoning if you thought I was trying to save Margot but that's not the case

[Black]

This just feels like you trying to emphasize your "Ausuka wagon sucks" read by artificially taking away your townread on me

If one of HPE/Ausuka flips scum I'm auto flipping the other

[Black]

Yeah I'm just gonna stop engaging with you now. You clearly don't know how to keep your composure

[Black]

This just feels like you trying to emphasize your "Ausuka wagon sucks" read by artificially taking away your townread on me

If one of HPE/Ausuka flips scum I'm auto flipping the other

can u try to like focus more on understanding the mindset that brings ppl to have a conclusion instead of assuming that they disagree = they must have scum mindset

I tried to understand why HPE thought me trying to fade you was scummy, and I still don't get it. It only makes sense to scumread that if it thinks I'm trying to save my scum buddy Margot. If you can think of any other reason I'm more than willing to listen

[Black]

This just feels like you trying to emphasize your "Ausuka wagon sucks" read by artificially taking away your townread on me

If one of HPE/Ausuka flips scum I'm auto flipping the other

can u try to like focus more on understanding the mindset that brings ppl to have a conclusion instead of assuming that they disagree = they must have scum mindset

I tried to understand why HPE thought me trying to fade you was scummy, and I still don't get it. It only makes sense to scumread that if it thinks I'm trying to save my scum buddy Margot. If you can think of any other reason I'm more than willing to listen

Again, at NO point did this one say it scumread you for that. It's not reasonable to say that any drop in a townread is inherently a scumread.

If you no longer townread me due to me wanting to fade Koba, wouldn't that imply that you think it was a scummy move?

[Black]

Town do foolish stuff all the time, so I don't think dropping your townread makes a lot of sense here. It's fine though. I'm not trying to attack your reads. I only want to try to understand them so I can sort you better

I would say I have a very weak townlean on Margot btw. It's not a full on townread

[Black]

This just feels like you trying to emphasize your "Ausuka wagon sucks" read by artificially taking away your townread on me

If one of HPE/Ausuka flips scum I'm auto flipping the other

can u try to like focus more on understanding the mindset that brings ppl to have a conclusion instead of assuming that they disagree = they must have scum mindset

I tried to understand why HPE thought me trying to fade you was scummy, and I still don't get it. It only makes sense to scumread that if it thinks I'm trying to save my scum buddy Margot. If you can think of any other reason I'm more than willing to listen

shrug i was clearly acting in a way thats meant to garner negative attention and it is not that far fetched to think scum might take that bait to try to remove me for the game for it

Ok, I can see that. I don't think this was going through HPE's head though since it admitted it didn't think this was scummy of me

[Black]

To me it just feels like HPE is trying to make his "Ausuka wagon sucks" read more relevant and prominent by taking away his townread on me for what I consider to be a pretty bad reason. I think this could imply they are partnered. I'm not convinced about this because I'm not even confident that Suki is scum, but that's where the idea originated for me

[Black]

It's* townread, sorry

[Black]

I'm trying really hard to get your pronouns right. I've never had to call someone "it" in my entire life. I know I need to be better and I really am sorry for fucking up. I understand how important it is. I'm just an idiot that doesn't develop new habits very well

I promise it won't happen again

[Black]

margot, I will be 100% hammering you over ausuka here so your best chance of surivval here is to vote flarefluff and hope people switch

You don't believe her claim? Hammering her over Ausuka would be throwing

[Black]

If we're not doing Ausuka today then we should switch to Koba

[Black]

so maybe learn the setup youre playing b4 you try to educate me on claims

Awww did I push a button?

[Black]

You can't touch my ego

[Black]

You are meaningless to me

[Black]

Koba I don't think we'll be switching to FF. So I think if you want to hammer then you might as well do it

[Black]

Koba I don't think we'll be switching to FF. So I think if you want to hammer then you might as well do it

i never had considered your vote in this equation so i dont care, i was already operating under the assumption that town was operating against a 3rd mafia

Says the person who has actively tried to seem scummy all day

And when I said "we", I meant the playerlist. You're not going to make an FF wagon happen so go ahead and hammer the town PR

[Black]

FF is town. Margot is probably town

We should fade Suki or Koba today

[Black]

VOTE: Rogues

e-1

[Black]

We kill them

[Black]

Yeah I'll start lighting the candles

[Black]

Should I take my clothes off?

[Black]

Honestly I think that might lure him in?

[Black]

I'll keep them on for now. Brb let me grab the sacred text

[Black]

*dusts off the worn and tattered book and starts reciting something in Latin*

[Black]

Sick page top

[Black]

SWAMPERT AND DRAGONAIR, PLEASE PRESENT THYSELVES

[Black]

Thank you for your contributions tris. Try to watch out for the candles

[Black]

Hopefully theres a contingency plan for dragon claims mason or whatever

I would offer to join the spinning but again tired

You're not gonna like this but the contingency plan should probably be to just fade you

[Black]

Hopefully theres a contingency plan for dragon claims mason or whatever

I would offer to join the spinning but again tired

contingency: nolim and we all go "womp womp" at the start of d2

Would you rather no lim or fade Ausuka?

[Black]

Um. Ok

[Black]

@tris
@Koba

Hopefully I can count on one of you to help me fade Ausuka if Rogues claims mason

[Black]

Night suki!

[Black]

We probably just trust them if they do and fade them D2 if the actual mason comes out. Or the mason can counter before the deadline and we just fade them now

Not sure what the best play would be but this would be my guess

[Black]

I think HPE has had some scummy takes here. It doesn't know if it would rather no lim or fade Ausuka even though it only has a slight townlean on Ausuka based on her wagon composition. And now it wants to fade Rogue through a mason claim

It is either scum or playing with an anti-town mindset

[Black]

I don't think Rogues will come back. Thomith is from the UK and it's almost 2 am there. Dragon I don't know where he is from and it looks like to me his timezone is closer to Thomith.

- A

Actually this is a good point. Dragon is in Europe somewhere

[Black]

I still think Ausuka is town. I'd unvote, but that's as good as hammering at this point, so fuck it

VOTE: Rogue[\vote]

Wait, still? You put someone you think is town to e-1?

[Black]

Yes. It looked like there were only two viable wagons, and as certain as I felt that Ausuka was town, I am even more certain that I am town, so I brought the votes in line because I didn't want to tantrum throw

I guess this makes sense. I forgot you were the leading wagon at the time

[Black]

Yes. It looked like there were only two viable wagons, and as certain as I felt that Ausuka was town, I am even more certain that I am town, so I brought the votes in line because I didn't want to tantrum throw

I guess this makes sense. I forgot you were the leading wagon at the time

this makes like no sense at all??

It absolutely does. If Margot is town then she doesn't know Ausuka's alignment. Why would she not vote for the wagon that gives her the best chance to survive?

The correct play would be to try to push a different wagon but if she's not going to do that then the survival vote is the next best thing

[Black]

"hmm, today i will vote one of my townreads because i do not wish to die" JUST VOTE A SCUMREAD???

If she doesn't think any of the other wagons would get enough support so close to the deadline then the Ausuka vote makes sense

[Black]

Like there are times you gotta know when to fold 'em even as town. Self-preservation at all costs is stupid.

This is an awful take

[Black]

"let me just lay down and die instead of voting for someone I townread but could still be scum"

like what

[Black]

@margot, can you choose a player to visit with your ability, for the purpose of tracker/watcher? preferably someone you scumread/arent townread. perhaps giving 2 different names might be good.

Sure. I'll visit Koba and Black

Since when do you scumread me?

[Black]

Like there are times you gotta know when to fold 'em even as town. Self-preservation at all costs is stupid.

This is an awful take

"let me just lay down and die instead of voting for someone I townread but could still be scum"

like what

at that point you might as well just fuckin do whatever! don't just throw everything at the wall when you're getting voted up as town, contribute meaningfully.

I agree with you that contributing and trying to push a wagon on a scumread is the correct play, but considering everything Margot has said about being ill and not being able to do much today, I think the vote makes sense as a second option

[Black]

@margot, can you choose a player to visit with your ability, for the purpose of tracker/watcher? preferably someone you scumread/arent townread. perhaps giving 2 different names might be good.

Sure. I'll visit Koba and Black

Since when do you scumread me?

pretty sure she just misread bc i included the word townread in that sentence

Oh lol

[Black]

yall this is just mafia theory arguments

god fucking damn it black you turned me into a theorycrafter nerd

[Black]

Actually no Black is probably fine here because it would be tantamount to suicide to uberpush Ausuka then nightkill her. But also, why the fuck would scum nightkill her when she was at E-1 and could probably be reasonably assumed to be a viable mislim candidate?

The Ausuka kill makes sense to me. She was pretty much conf town after the Rogues flip

[Black]

tentative PoE of [shadow, flarefluff] with an extension of black based on how they moved onto the rogue wagon

This is WIFOM but I would probably just have stayed on the Ausuka wagon as scum

I like this PoE, minus me of course

[Black]

this one would say intent to hammer please claim etc etc but its probably not going to really be here for that

this one would say intent to hammer please claim etc etc but its probably not going to really be here for that

UNVOTE:

go ahead ill be here

sure whatever have fun VOTE: Rogues

The top post makes me want to include HPE in my PoE but I don't understand why it wouldn't just ghost after that if it were scum. Instead it voted for Rogues in the bottom post, which makes me think it's probably town

[Black]

I don't really understand why Margot is cleared? Sure she hammered Rogues but Rogues was going to be hammered anyway. I don't necessarily think she's scum but she's not conf town

[Black]

VOTE: shaddow

I think this is more likely to flip scum than FF

[Black]

I can town clear tris and koba (and therfore myself as well)

Ugh, I may not be able to clear them as easily as I thought. I

can

confirm roles, but that's not as useful

Is there any reason you shouldn't elaborate on this?

[Black]

After seeing Rogues flip mafia my readslist looks like this

Town: tris, DkKoba
Null: everyone else

- A

Why tris?

[Black]

Thoughts up to page 5:
Koba is probably town
vibes wise I don't like HPE
Ausuka - Idk her posting is giving me slightly weird vibes but I don't think this means she has to be scum. I also haven't ever been in a game with Ausuka so I am not rly sure how to read her (oh wait nvm I just realized I HAD been in a game with Ausuka but I was scum). Uhhhhh actually I guess she has different vibes to that game so that could mean she's scum? Dunno
tris - literally 0 clue how to read
everyone else hasn't even made an impression on me.

VOTE: HPE

E-1

Why HPE over Ausuka when you have similar reasoning ("vibes"), but actually have more to say about Ausuka?

I don't like how Rogues never answered this question, instead they just unvoted HPE. shaddow never following up on this feels bad too

[Black]

I think that figuring out how to get to a desired outcome is highly common - for instance, at end game scum probably have a pretty good idea of who they want with them, so then they have to figure out how to lim the rest of town. @Rogues
why don't you think scum would work backwards?

I never had a thought process like this as scum?

shaddow doesn't follow up on this either

[Black]

this one smells opportunist

Not my fault Black and Roden decided to also scumread you after you were being scummy.

this one smells opportunist

Not my fault Black and Roden decided to also scumread you after you were being scummy.

Your fault for having a bad read, tho

Okay then what towny thing did ypu do this game?

This could be distancing theatre but my gut tells me HPE/Rogues are not scum together

[Black]

town leans

koba -lean town from there post and fluff early game
tris lean town, from there post and fluff early game
margotrosa- lean town, redon vs HPE look like tvt, redon got frustrated bye HPE and left.
HighPrincessErinys the attitude looks like scum town with aggressive attitude. Scum would likely avoid this type of play, so lean town. but very scum town attitude.


scum leans

Ausuka -early day 1 vote, reason cautious, later feels off. there not much scum haunting beside label others as Maybe reads, with out further reason.
Shadow -not much around because busy

Two Level 1 Rogues
(hydra of DragonEater70 & Thomith) tbh this could be scum, with low activity. but more on null/scum

~H

koba -lean town from there post and fluff early game
tris lean town, from there post and fluff early game
margotrosa- lean town, redon vs HPE look like tvt, redon got frustrated bye HPE and left.
HighPrincessErinys the attitude looks like scum town with aggressive attitude. Scum would likely avoid this type of play, so lean town. but very scum town attitude.

Update Two Level 1 Rogues to town, reads after iso.

~H

This read change feels a little weird

[Black]

Not surprised at rogue flipping scum after they twisted my words early as emotional, before later trying to correct themselves.


~H

What did you see in Rogues' ISO that made you move them to town?

[Black]

Idk I think this progression by tris almost feels fake?

I sorta agreed with Rogues at the time but I don't really think Rogues would be the first to point this out if tris was their partner

[Black]

I think it's just shaddow here

[Black]

I think shaddow/Rogues threw some softball questions at each other but never really seemed interested in sorting each other

[Black]

My action card is completely useless

[Black]

any way its my birthday. i dont have to think

Happy birthday tris!!!

[Black]

What if it's just the two hydras

we should go back to this

I'm ok fading FF but why do you think shadow is town?

[Black]

VOTE: Flare Fluff

[Black]

Welp

UNVOTE:

[Black]

I don't think it's Koba

So it's either HPE or shaddow

[Black]

Actually no Black is probably fine here because it would be tantamount to suicide to uberpush Ausuka then nightkill her. But also, why the fuck would scum nightkill her when she was at E-1 and could probably be reasonably assumed to be a viable mislim candidate?

well there was that little counterwagon onto rogue that happened from 2 wagons.

im assuming im going to be considered clear for the rest of the game atp

Why are you cleared?

[Black]

Actually no Black is probably fine here because it would be tantamount to suicide to uberpush Ausuka then nightkill her. But also, why the fuck would scum nightkill her when she was at E-1 and could probably be reasonably assumed to be a viable mislim candidate?

well there was that little counterwagon onto rogue that happened from 2 wagons.

im assuming im going to be considered clear for the rest of the game atp

Why are you cleared?

wow rogue just died mysteriously

Are you implying you should be clear because you voted for scum? You know that's not how it works right?

[Black]

Like I think you are probably town but clear is a stretch

I agree with you that it would be a pretty bad play, but if your goal was to use it as an argument for why you should be locktown then it's not completely out of the question

[Black]

You're being a bit dramatic

[Black]

If you think the play clears you then how exactly would that make you dumb if you are scum here?

[Black]

VOTE: HPE

[Black]

cant vote ff OR margot in good conscience. thats fucked up

Well yeah, FF is a mason. But why is Margot suddenly clear fypov?

[Black]

cant vote ff OR margot in good conscience. thats fucked up

Well yeah, FF is a mason. But why is Margot suddenly clear fypov?

Still willing to believe town!Margot for the moment for hammering scum. It's not exactly "clear" but it's "ok you have a second chance to not post like a goofass and convince me"

I'm having a hard time believing that her hammering in a situation where Koba was already the designated hammer vote would make you reverse your game-long scumread on her. You've been adamant about Roden!scum and Margot!scum. Is the hammer really that big of a town tell to you?

[Black]

VOTE: shaddowez

Methinks its here or on Black.

This isn't just giving Margot a second chance. You've completely removed her from your PoE

Why do think scum!Margot wouldn't hammer in that situation?

[Black]

Actually no Black is probably fine here because it would be tantamount to suicide to uberpush Ausuka then nightkill her. But also, why the fuck would scum nightkill her when she was at E-1 and could probably be reasonably assumed to be a viable mislim candidate?

VOTE: shaddowez

Methinks its here or on Black.

Also there is a disconnect between these two posts

[Black]

Yeah I'm not really buying this drastic read change on Margot. Meanwhile HPE is still keeping the door open to push there with posts like 1051

I think HPE is just scum here

[Black]

Yeah, go ahead and curse, use that AtE. Get mad. It won't save you

[Black]

I don't feel like I'm exaggerating anything btw. HPE has been dead set on Roden/Margot scum the entire game and I don't think Margot's hammer would be enough to make it think she's cleared

seeking a replacement for Roden.

Let's simmer down, then. All my vexation aside Roden slot is still obvscum and there's no shot in hell 264 is made by town.

My gut is saying Margot/Flare Fluff but this one is only really confident about Margot because there hasn't really been an improvement over Roden.

That's 3 people willing to vote Koba. Do we have 4 and 5?

Koba vote stinks. Feels like a diversion to kill the shitposty goofball compared to Margot who can't supply a single well-reasoned post.

Flare Fluff + Koba could kill Margot here and now

HPE what does your readslist look like atm

shaddowez

DkKoba

Ausuka

tris
Black

Two Level 1 Rogues

Flare Fluff

MargotRosa

Rogues could probably go to nullville all things considered but this is otherwise how things stand for me.

HPE can you talk about your town read on Ausuka on 158. You put Ausuka as town and you never gave a reason on why you put her as town.

- A

Wagon comp sucks ass, which makes me lean town on Ausuka when no one above null is voting for her.

Are you saying in this post you town read Ausuka for being voted by town and you town read the players who voted Ausuka at start of day phase?

I need more elaboration on how you got to town reading Ausuka for being voted by two other players you are town reading.

- A

Ok this is getting ridiculous now after 760.
NOBODY

ABOVE

NULL. Black has fallen to null to me for her posturing towards Koba that this one disagrees with and dislikes, Rogues have been nullscum for a while, and Margot/You are outright scumreads. No one that this one townreads is voting Ausuka. Ausuka is being voted by scum. How did you come up with this one saying Ausuka is town for being voted by its townreads??

Yes. It looked like there were only two viable wagons, and as certain as I felt that Ausuka was town, I am even more certain that I am town, so I brought the votes in line because I didn't want to tantrum throw

PLEASE flip this fucking slot tomorrow

[Black]

Yeah, go ahead and curse, use that AtE. Get mad. It won't save you

You could atleast

try

not to (attempt to) push buttons, Black.

I'm not trying to push buttons, just like I wasn't trying to exaggerate. I legitimately feel like your scumread on Roden/Margot was super strong and your ISO supports that. And now Margot is somewhat clear in your mind based on a hammer that would be pretty easy for scum to do and get away with. I'm just not buying that this is a real read. There's no need to get upset simply because I think you're scum. If I'm out of line then tell me, but I don't think that I am

[Black]

that last quote is why i went "wut" after the daystart statement from HPE lol

Why haven't you moved your vote back yet

[Black]

At the same time this one still isn't a fan of you trying to drum up support for Koba INSTEAD of Margot.

Why does this bother you? I had a slight townlean on Margot at the time and I wasn't townreading Koba

[Black]

At the same time this one still isn't a fan of you trying to drum up support for Koba INSTEAD of Margot.

Why does this bother you? I had a slight townlean on Margot at the time and I wasn't townreading Koba

Cause your townlean on Margot was dumb.

Well first of all I disagree. But for the sake of the argument let's say she is scum and the read is dumb. Town have dumb reads all the time. Why is this particular read scummy to you?

[Black]

If not for Rogues flipping scum and it being down to 1 scum, this one would say you two might be partnered and you're trying to cover for her.

I don't even see the point in mentioning this

in general this one just really disagrees (disagreed? Rogues really did complicate things.) with, on the other end, your Koba read too.

Fwiw I disagree with my old Koba read too

[Black]

I still think it could be Koba tbh

HPE -> shaddow -> Koba probably wins us the game. I don't think it's Margot

[Black]

that last quote is why i went "wut" after the daystart statement from HPE lol

Why haven't you moved your vote back yet

bc i dont need to

You also don't need to be self voting but here we are

[Black]

i, as scum, compromised with someone I had a hammer on, while also having hammer on someone else who objectively cannot be scum with me now, to wagon my own scum partner, instead of hammering someone who I could have just feigned I felt forced to hammer and not even had my hands dirty due to the wagons just existing

no, i am just not clear, youre so right. we have to consider koba is a dumbass doing a stupid play with unknown roles angle

u are so right!

might as well just vote me out now :'( VOTE: koba

no no go on we need to consider i am a big dummy

The more I read these the more I feel like they are way over the top

I don't think we ever fade Koba before we resolve the HPE/shaddow slots but I think we fade them over Margot in ELO if it comes down to it

[Black]

that last quote is why i went "wut" after the daystart statement from HPE lol

Why haven't you moved your vote back yet

bc i dont need to

You also don't need to be self voting but here we are

yes i do, its part of my role

[Black]

i, as scum, compromised with someone I had a hammer on, while also having hammer on someone else who objectively cannot be scum with me now, to wagon my own scum partner, instead of hammering someone who I could have just feigned I felt forced to hammer and not even had my hands dirty due to the wagons just existing

no, i am just not clear, youre so right. we have to consider koba is a dumbass doing a stupid play with unknown roles angle

u are so right!

might as well just vote me out now :'( VOTE: koba

no no go on we need to consider i am a big dummy

The more I read these the more I feel like they are way over the top

I don't think we ever fade Koba before we resolve the HPE/shaddow slots but I think we fade them over Margot in ELO if it comes down to it

over the top for who

It feels like overly dramatic AtE, like the type scum would make to get a townie off their read

[Black]

i, as scum, compromised with someone I had a hammer on, while also having hammer on someone else who objectively cannot be scum with me now, to wagon my own scum partner, instead of hammering someone who I could have just feigned I felt forced to hammer and not even had my hands dirty due to the wagons just existing

no, i am just not clear, youre so right. we have to consider koba is a dumbass doing a stupid play with unknown roles angle

u are so right!

might as well just vote me out now :'( VOTE: koba

no no go on we need to consider i am a big dummy

The more I read these the more I feel like they are way over the top

I don't think we ever fade Koba before we resolve the HPE/shaddow slots but I think we fade them over Margot in ELO if it comes down to it

over the top for who

bc its like wild that you are so worried about 1v1ing me at this point,if we reach final 3 this isn't going to go the way you think because in that scenario you are objectively the right kill. im pretty sure we win with HPE atp but GL getting your way if you are scum when the only person that would hammer me in f3 is a mason and if theyre brought to f3 it will be obvious that they are there because of you, although it will probably work because FF is definitely the type to be susceptible to extreme confbias

I'm not trying to 1v1 you. I'm trying to make sure you don't deepwolf your way to a victory and try to AtE everyone off of fading you just because you bussed your scumbuddy

You shouldn't even make it to F3 considering everyone townreads you but me. So if you do then you should absolutely be yeeted

[Black]

Actually you know what, fuck it

VOTE: Koba

I want to resolve this before HPE/shaddow now

[Black]

Yeah I'm going to get hit with personal attacks and I'm sure Koba will talk about how bad I am at the game and yadda yadda but I don't really care. I had a theory they were scum with Rogues early D1 and I want to resolve this now