Shell Game (Day 4)

[Cat Scratch Fever]

Hi I'm a miller

[Cat Scratch Fever]

Dunnstral feels town

Ohlivion's questions feel off

VOTE: oblivion

[Cat Scratch Fever]

To those who have expressed town reads on it, can it ask for a deeper look into the why behind those sentiments from each of you, for the purpose of its mental models?

For CSF, can you explain which of the questions it asked gave that reaction and why?

your questions feel like you're trying to probe but are latching onto the wrong things in a way that feels +scum. It's mostly gut but I'll try to articulate-

Spoiler:

My thoughts so far:

Sunflower in post 13 struck me the wrong way as I wasn't expecting that post from fireisredsir, and then they had a lot of filler type posts. They then call me towny and I'm not sure what they are basing that off of either with the 4 posts I had before.

ActionDan's post 86 rubs me the wrong way because I don't agree and don't know how they reached their conclusions. Perhaps they can explain.

It... is a little concerned by this. Ignoring the part about Sunflower, what part of ActionDan's posting was strangely reached to you? This slot is calling the player who scumclaimed as an opening scum, which it thinks doesn't need much explination? Certainly there's ways to end up on either side of that read but explaining?

You appear to be an experienced player, can you explain to it why this read in particular is rubbing you the wrong way for not explaining their conclusions when half of it appears somewhat Face Value to it?

For this one, dunnstral already gave a different read on sunflower, which was 50% of Dan's list.

And like... What's the harm in asking Dan to articulate reasons when the game is this early? Even if the answer may be obvious to you.

It turns out the answer probably wasn't what you expected. What did you make of that btw?

Spoiler:

I will RVS as long as I feel like it, thanks.

What even makes you so sure it was RVS though?

Can you explain why you are taking a hostile/adversarial position to this line of inquery? It has a hard time believing you can't see that your entrance is above the line of suspicious and overtly drawing attention, so it wants to understand what the motivation of your doing this is? What do you aim to accomplish with this tact?

Did you miss posts 28 and 30 in your read through?

Setting that aside though, I don't really agree that the post is hostile

[Cat Scratch Fever]

What confuses it is that you are saying that asking questions towards players to garner their intent is pro-town but call its questioning anti-town, despite it being pretty clear and apparent that it is asking questions to determine how people think and approach the game state. It can't help but wonder if this is because it prefers to ask questions from aggressors to determine their mindset instead of asking questions from those in already defensive positions who have their guard up?

Both town and scum are going to ask questions but you were asking questions that I didn't think town would ask. It wasn't apparent to me that you were trying to grasp how people approach the game, and tbh it's still not, but it's probably more worthwhile for me to just see how you develop reads from here

[Cat Scratch Fever]

I think shello is town

Firebagel feels awkward and stilted as scum in a way that I'm not sensing here and is probably town too

[Cat Scratch Fever]

CSF, Dann

you're meta reading firebagel?

Yeah

I know that's probably annoying given she's an alt but I feel pretty good about my alt guess and ability to read her

[Cat Scratch Fever]

VOTE: morph

Interested in hearing more about this

[Cat Scratch Fever]

felt like getting off ActionDan based on something said in the hood

picked morph for funzies

What did he say?

[Cat Scratch Fever]

can someone add me to the hoods

As stupid as it may sound, I actually townread this because it deeply resonated with me lol

[Cat Scratch Fever]

can someone add me to the hoods

As stupid as it may sound, I actually townread this because it deeply resonated with me lol

Dannscum running circles around Detective KittyCat

I'm trying my best, but life is generally more difficult without opposable thumbs

[Cat Scratch Fever]

I think shello is town

Firebagel feels awkward and stilted as scum in a way that I'm not sensing here and is probably town too

This is Firebagel's first game on this account. Are you privy to secret knowledge or is this some kind of reaction test?

Not a reaction test, 361

[Cat Scratch Fever]

people keep being overly eager to paint meta reads off incomplete/inaccurate data with no shame or concern whatsoever and the fact that some of them are doing it as town is annoying

Who are you sub tweeting here?

[Cat Scratch Fever]

Wait ActionDan, why did you suss my miller claim if you were a cop?

[Cat Scratch Fever]

I'm also just curious when each member figured out it was a dethy

[Cat Scratch Fever]

I'm also just curious when each member figured out it was a dethy

For me, i didnt know the name was dethy (ive never played in one before, as far as i can remember idk!) but i figured out it was like this when dragons said something is obvious and then i looked at the name of the thread for the very first time. sounds extreme but i sorta just accepted it as a hood. thought i was the only one with this role.

I think I believe you

[Cat Scratch Fever]

Just fire, and to answer him it is unnecessary.

I am not the arbiter of why scum would claim Miller after ascetic, only that it does not fit the setup as I see it.

What was your view on the setup when you doubted the miller claim?

I was close to certain we had 4 cops on a cycle of reliabilites plus one scum of some sort (cop inventor or not)

Pedit. I believe I contemporaneously more or less figured out the setup when the Miller was claimed from memory.

Was the bolded a cause and effect, as in my miller claim jolted an "aha!" moment about the hood for you?

This question is more for the other members of the hood, but I also recall ActionDan said there was "0 or 1" scum in the hood. When did that happen in the hood, and does the timing line up with his narrative here? like after he saw my claim, did he continue to push the possibility of 0 scum in the hood?

[Cat Scratch Fever]

I am voting dan for the CSF shade while being a supposed cop

You're voting him. Apparently based on the miller thing. Is there more?

Well I think the timeline of events makes it sus unless i am misunderstanding how things went.
I think actiondan was saying CSF before the outing of neighborhood, miller doesn't make sense until dan found out that there is cops. He then went to "that doesn't make sense with the creativity of game, which is weird for him to say imo because that implies understanding the game setup in some deeper way or what cephrir would design. Both seem fishy to me.

I also just think actiondan is the least townie of that whole neighborhood.

This is kinda pinging me even though I'm suspicious of dan as well


758 feels like jumping the gun

[Cat Scratch Fever]

AD i am like a little wary that his signaling to me/townreading to me was strange given his apparent mindset that scum would also be informed.

I'd be interested in hearing from Dan about this but from everything else you've described, I'm not sure scum would be the first one to propose that everyone has the same role

[Cat Scratch Fever]

also we didn't decide it's a dethy we were like "hey this is kinda like dethy". which. it isn't dethy. can we stop pretending it's dethy im so tired

I'm kind of confused. do you not think there's 1 scum in the hood anymore?

[Cat Scratch Fever]

also we didn't decide it's a dethy we were like "hey this is kinda like dethy". which. it isn't dethy. can we stop pretending it's dethy im so tired

I'm kind of confused. do you not think there's 1 scum in the hood anymore?

i didn't ever think it was a for sure thing. i said it was the most elegant. but i am not particularly willing to take it for granted that we can make assumptions here

What do you think Klick?

[Cat Scratch Fever]

I know Cephrir gets grouchy when people assumes things like "there must be scum in the hood"

But creating a setup that strongly alludes to dethy (if not explicitly) and also essentially threatening town if they don't eliminate scum within it feels remarkably punishing if there isn't scum, even for him

[Cat Scratch Fever]

I don't think marci, ActionDan, or STD are scum

Was there more to ActionDan beyond the initial mindmeld over 0/1 scum in hood?

[Cat Scratch Fever]

Idk, not feeling very confident in who is scum in the hood ATM

I liked Spiffeh's push here:

VOTE: Brian Skies

[Cat Scratch Fever]

Idk, not feeling very confident in who is scum in the hood ATM

I liked Spiffeh's push here:

VOTE: Brian Skies

Does this represent a change of your Oblivion read? If so, elaborate?

Ummm sort of. I think its posts generally feel agenda less. 1013 is a good example where it gives me the overall impression that it's just doing its own thing in figuring things out.

But I'm also having a hard time following its thought processes and reads on players in the game. It might be due to how it approaches the game, e.g. its treatment of the FireBagel slot seemed like an uncharitable scumread to me, but it was actually townreading Firebagel the whole time...? I guess I'm still in a wait-and-see mode. I'm interested what conclusions its drawing from its questions, specifically with Pooky but also more generally.

I mostly wanted to move my vote

[Cat Scratch Fever]

What is your mental model of Firebagel and how did that help you arrive at the conclusion that she is town?

[Cat Scratch Fever]

tbh I think Firebagel decided her entrance into this game before she even got her role PM because her account is a play off of Firebringer, who is known for claiming scum every game

But thanks for answering, that seems like a believable thought process at least

[Cat Scratch Fever]

tbh I think Firebagel decided her entrance into this game before she even got her role PM because her account is a play off of Firebringer, who is known for claiming scum every game

But thanks for answering, that seems like a believable thought process at least

wait, it thought those connections were just jokes based on the name, is the account really actually a joke account trying to mirror firebringer's playersytle?

I don't think she's trying to mimic all of Firebringer's playstyle, just the part where he jokingly claims scum (her account creation was motivated by Firebringer based on her signup post). The rest of her playstyle seems true to her usual self.

[Cat Scratch Fever]

i think that town!klick is capable of finding scum!me. he did it very well recently

i think regardless of alignment he knows that he doesn't have reason to think im scum here

the difference is that i think if he's town he would also know that if we're both town there's a decent chance we can find each other. the fact that he doesn't have reason to think im scum would make him doubt. im on the other side here, not fully confident that klick is scum, and that makes me question AD and marci

the way that his reads on AD and marci progressed from hesitancy/uncertainty to full-on confidence isn't supported and just isn't really believable to me coming from town!klick

this is what i mean by calling the play positional.

i think that those reads became solidified out of necessity

and not out of justified reason. and i don't think that's how town!klick plays

Thinking about this some more, why would scum!Klick feel the need to narrow his PoE within the hood down to you?

[Cat Scratch Fever]

tbh I think Firebagel decided her entrance into this game before she even got her role PM because her account is a play off of Firebringer, who is known for claiming scum every game

But thanks for answering, that seems like a believable thought process at least

wait, it thought those connections were just jokes based on the name, is the account really actually a joke account trying to mirror firebringer's playersytle?

I don't think she's trying to mimic all of Firebringer's playstyle, just the part where he jokingly claims scum (her account creation was motivated by Firebringer based on her signup post). The rest of her playstyle seems true to her usual self.

Yeah, I don't know Firebringer well enough to actually keep it up, but that was definitely the idea.

But what is my 'usual' playstyle? Does Oblivion seem accurate in describing it from what it's seen here?

By "usual" playstyle, I meant that you're not trying to deliberate obfuscate your posting. For the most part you're posting things you would normally post on your main

And hmm, it's right that you're lighthearteded at times and you'll generally say what's on your mind, but I don't think you're "off the cuff." I think Oblivion's thought process was typed up quickly and checks out enough that I think it's real though

[Cat Scratch Fever]

Yeah, I don't know Firebringer well enough to actually keep it up, but that was definitely the idea.

But what is my 'usual' playstyle? Does Oblivion seem accurate in describing it from what it's seen here?

By "usual" playstyle, I meant that you're not trying to deliberate obfuscate your posting. For the most part you're posting things you would normally post on your main

And hmm, it's right that you're lighthearteded at times and you'll generally say what's on your mind, but I don't think you're "off the cuff." I think Oblivion's thought process was typed up quickly and checks out enough that I think it's real though

You realize this doesn't really give me enough to be able to assess your thoughts here.

Thoughts on what?

[Cat Scratch Fever]

I don't know quite frankly. Maybe you're surprised by how quickly I was able to figure out who you were? I'm not sure why you would be though.

[Cat Scratch Fever]

Caught up.

VOTE: firebagel

I personally don't want to kill in my hood today, but d2 on should probably within until we get the scum. If we kill now we don't get the night result.

It's also dangerous if scum kill the recipients of our inventions

Why are you voting firebagel

[Cat Scratch Fever]

I don't know quite frankly. Maybe you're surprised by how quickly I was able to figure out who you were? I'm not sure why you would be though.

Well I'm not even sure that you have! You're being vague enough about it. I don't think it's unreasonable that you could guess who I am but I wasn't expecting anyone to do so here so your level of confidence in both that and your read is strange to me.

And I sorta feel like if you're guessing right, this conversation should give you some more doubt on your read.

I think your use of emojis at the end of sentences gives you away. Or do you remember when I read biancospino off of the Activity Overview?

[Cat Scratch Fever]

Warm pup might also be scum, btw.

VOTE MEEEEEEEE

I lose my ability to rearrange hoods if I vote, which will make my wincon of making the alignments of living players in the hoods match really hard to achieve.

Bingle, you're the main character

[Cat Scratch Fever]

I actually think Bingle's role is pretty towny? Giving scum an advantage for being in a hood

and

giving them the power to move people around doesn't make sense to me. Unfortunately it doesn't seem like he can prove his role today

[Cat Scratch Fever]

Warm pup might also be scum, btw.

VOTE MEEEEEEEE

I lose my ability to rearrange hoods if I vote, which will make my wincon of making the alignments of living players in the hoods match really hard to achieve.

Wait how do you know there are hoods plural?

p-edit: oh, maybe

[Cat Scratch Fever]

viewtopic.php?t=80680

Relevant mod meta.

Hey I was in that game!

[Cat Scratch Fever]

Spiffeh can you talk a bit more abt your read on ydra / my slot please?

Also firebringer?

~ skitter

I'd vote fb

[Cat Scratch Fever]

I also agree with whomever said that penguin power not materially engaging with the game is scummy

I'm used to him being more in the background as town and building wagons, but this feels like an imitation of that

[Cat Scratch Fever]

VOTE: firebringer

[Cat Scratch Fever]

also i just have this nagging feeling that one of the people pushing action dan for the timeline inconsistency of the cop/miller thing is scum so why not firebringer

Wasn't that only me and Firebringer? And I admitted that it wasn't a smoking gun.

I did as well

[Cat Scratch Fever]

i also do not think shading every single other person in the hood at some point is a scum tell

Are you still townreading sunflower and if you are, can you explain why?

[Cat Scratch Fever]

I think the cakez slip is fairly suspicious. I like morph's timing argument. And in addition when you review his posts from this recent burst, whenever he quote responds to someone else, he has done so within 5 minutes and typically within 2-3 minutes. So I get the sense that he was refreshing the thread a lot.

The only time he took ~10 mins to respond was to poiky's accusation.

VOTE: Cakez

I also think it was suspect that Brian Skies didn't react to the cakez thing at all. I think he might've been the only player around the time to post but not comment on it, but instead voted firebringer.

[Cat Scratch Fever]

@firebringer, yeah i think that's the more likely scenario

But when I'm scum, there are a lot of times when I don't know how to react to something so I just... Don't lol. Someone once called it "selective." So I guess he could also just be scum in a similar position without Cakez ig. I haven't really found much townie about Brian before this either

[Cat Scratch Fever]

I think if you put a gun to my head I’d feel pretty confident saying

Brian/Cakez/Gypyx/(sunflower/klick)/super secret pocket read

But that could just be copium.

I would eliminate any of these people minus klick

[Cat Scratch Fever]

the whole cakez was too affraid to post thing and was too slow to respond stuff is really really dumb guys.

Like are u listening to urselves on that shit?

Do u all remember even what ur talking about with regards to the question? The question from pooky was about how he knew it was notsci but not read anything. The answer can be as simple as he read 2 pages prior.

IT can be that fucking simple, and yet we have people here taking it like there is a some sort of grand mystery that cakez has to hide from because he got outted.

Fucking dumb as shit.

Hell, i have been hounded for stuff like that where i say "I haven't reaad shit" and actually read a few pages prior and then people focused me down for this "INCONSISTENCY". No its called me exaggerating that i am very not well read on the game so i didn't tell u that i haven't read everything which is true.

I actually thought this initially took, but the one post that he happened to be slow to respond to was that pooky post? Ehhhhh

[Cat Scratch Fever]

morph the cat (fferyllt & Cabd)
Firebringer
Hermit Crab (anonymous hydra)
Bingle
Lukewarm
Cat Scratch Fever
Oblivion
PookyTheMagicalBear

Why are Firebringer and Bingle so high?

[Cat Scratch Fever]

VOTE: csf

why?

[Cat Scratch Fever]

Shello and Goodbye who do you think are the scum on the FB wagon if you're doubting your scum read there?

i really did not like bagels vote
the timing of it was not good. i think that while bagel might be more inclined as both alignments 2 vote for firebringer because interaction, gimmick, it was just gross 2 me. skitter feels the same

- ydra

Sorry you don't have a sense of humor, but I think getting Firepup to join his own wagon was hilarious XD

Can you do the same trick but with Cakez?

[Cat Scratch Fever]

Thank you Herobagel

[Cat Scratch Fever]

Dann can you talk about why sunflower is town?

[Cat Scratch Fever]

I think both Sunflower and Klick's posts/cases on each other were towny and

I can case that more specifically tomorrow

, but it reminded me of a TvT in a lot of ways because of the specific ways they both basically took personally how the other was going about reading the other. I think sunflower would have reached for other resources if they wanted to "1v1" klick

I'd be interested in hearing this. Reading it earlier, I felt like Sunflower might've started with the conclusion that Klick was scum, because I didn't think he was thinking about what scum!Klick's motive would be.

I do think point 3 has merit

Did you have any thoughts about his vote on me? I don't feel heavily sussed or sussed at all this game, so leaving a vote on me with an insipid explanation seems unlikely to go anywhere

[Cat Scratch Fever]

they are also making a lot of posts that I think they would think would get scum read if they were scum, but they are posting them anyway

i don't expect this point to be particularly salient to anyone but it is true

If you could quote them in a spoiler? It's easier to digest than relatively abstract statements

[Cat Scratch Fever]

I also think it was suspect that Brian Skies didn't react to the cakez thing at all. I think he might've been the only player around the time to post but not comment on it, but instead voted firebringer.

The whole thing about timestamps and whatnot has never been something that's been in my repertoire, so I don't know why anyone would be expecting a reaction from me.

As far as I'm concerned, we're lucky to get any Cakez at all considering he should still be on V/LA.

I guess that's plausible bc no one else seemed to think it was interesting

[Cat Scratch Fever]

I think Dann came out and wrote that bit on morph bc he didn't like their sunflower push more than anything, I didn't really get the impression he was doing it to get townread

[Cat Scratch Fever]

I miss Klick

[Cat Scratch Fever]

do you think me being emotionally detached is scum indicative

o shit that's a good post

i do think it's scum indicative but the way dann is going around it kinda makes me think no

can you explain more why you thought it was scum indicative initially and why that's a good post

Well, the way you're replying makes me think you're legit beliving in your own towniness, and

also i just don't think you play around me like that as scum? Of course you might know how to pocket me but whatever

i originally viewed it as scum indicative cause it felt like as town you weren't really trying to hide your emotions so much? it's a bit of just me and my big mindset theory which is slowly crumbling each time i'm wrong, idk, think i'll go back on that read if stuff changes

Gypyx, do you think Dann and Spiffeh would be playing around you specifically this game, given how many other more vocal people are in this list ?

I noticed you used a similar argument with Spiffeh - "Spiffeh is scum because he would say this specific thing to deliberately pocket me in particular" but I'm not sure I buy that you truly believe that.

[Cat Scratch Fever]

The game is a lot if weird discussions that don't really mean much to the people not involved

It's hard to assert myself like I typically can.

I believe this as I feel this way as well

Did you have thoughts on Cakez and the "timing" of his response?

Spoiler:

I think the cakez slip is fairly suspicious. I like morph's timing argument. And in addition when you review his posts from this recent burst, whenever he quote responds to someone else, he has done so within 5 minutes and typically within 2-3 minutes. So I get the sense that he was refreshing the thread a lot.

The only time he took ~10 mins to respond was to poiky's accusation.

VOTE: Cakez

I also think it was suspect that Brian Skies didn't react to the cakez thing at all. I think he might've been the only player around the time to post but not comment on it, but instead voted firebringer.

[Cat Scratch Fever]

I got you csf

VOTE: cakez

[Cat Scratch Fever]

do you think me being emotionally detached is scum indicative

o shit that's a good post

i do think it's scum indicative but the way dann is going around it kinda makes me think no

can you explain more why you thought it was scum indicative initially and why that's a good post

Well, the way you're replying makes me think you're legit beliving in your own towniness, and

also i just don't think you play around me like that as scum? Of course you might know how to pocket me but whatever

i originally viewed it as scum indicative cause it felt like as town you weren't really trying to hide your emotions so much? it's a bit of just me and my big mindset theory which is slowly crumbling each time i'm wrong, idk, think i'll go back on that read if stuff changes

Gypyx, do you think Dann and Spiffeh would be playing around you specifically this game, given how many other more vocal people are in this list ?

I noticed you used a similar argument with Spiffeh - "Spiffeh is scum because he would say this specific thing to deliberately pocket me in particular" but I'm not sure I buy that you truly believe that.

I'm a slot that usually lives to ELo, i think my opinion is pretty important to the scumteam

i do agree that point wasn't a masterpiece though, kinda my brain running on an ego theory

I actually like this response

[Cat Scratch Fever]

Spoiler:

okay here's my list of things that I think Sunflower posts as town that for Various Reasons I don't think they post as scum

I don't think scum!fireisredsir ever declines the chance to show off their special ability to generate Unique and Towny thought processes for the whole thread to see, which makes me think 221 where he declines to further explain his ActionDan read is a town post

I think 485 is kind of too scummy to be scum. I expect an informed fireisredsir to be averse to posting something like this if people are making accurate meta reads left and right. It's just too blatantly following a scum agenda and complaining about the state of the game. I do see an uninformed fireisredsir making this post regardless because he's disappointed in the quality of people's sorting

i think 671 is a towny impulse to just get all the info out and I think it's kind of a surface-level scummy post that scum wouldn't feel the pressure to make because they figure the info will all come out eventually anyway

I think sunflower wasn't very confident klick was scum until 1247 when Klick insinuated he was very confident Sunflower was scum. Having been on both sides of this interaction before, I think this type of OMGUS instinct comes from town a lot more often than not, and scum!Sunflower would be more likely to keep his cool and keep his options open

there are some posts like 1854 that feel underbaked and kinda surface level scummy. like fireisredsir says something is AI but doesn't elaborate. I don't think fireisredsir would have any trouble pulling a complex towny thought out of this observation, but instead he just leaves it as that which I think is indicative that when he's posting his thoughts they are genuine, towny, half-baked observations

all that being said, I would feel 1000% more confident in my fire read if jupiter started playing

Okay, so here is a question. Actually a series of questions?

Do you think it is correct to eliminate inside or outside the Dethy today?

What are your reads on the 5 dethy members?

I think Klick and Sunflower are town
I think ActionDan is weakly town
I don't really have a read on STD
I think marci is scummy

I don't know if it's correct to eliminate inside or outside the dethy. I think it's probably healthier for the overall game state if it's at least an option to eliminate outside.

what I do know is that I don't want the lim locked between two (imo very strong) players who I also think are town

I can almost feel your frustration at Jupiter not posting because it's stopping you from getting a better read, and I think that's pretty towny

whereas I had a fleeting thought earlier that other people could've been bringing it up to shade

I think the omgus point is kinda valid

I don't really agree with the other points but I don't think it's worthwhile to engage point by point

Anyway i think Dann is one of my strongest town reads tbh. I've mindmelded a lot with his posts; the sunflower read was kind of my hang up but eh

[Cat Scratch Fever]

I also like the Brian wagon

[Cat Scratch Fever]

Can someone explain to it why people are suddenly swarming on Marci? From it's view nothing has changed from the reasons that made her town before?

Aside from Marci, where's your head at wrt the current vc?

[Cat Scratch Fever]

Gypyx doesn't really feel like scum

[Cat Scratch Fever]

i want to join cakez because wagons but i also want gypyx and she's just so close to being a competing wagon

hold the line penguin...hold the line.

I don't really understand why you want the gypyx wagon

[Cat Scratch Fever]

I've done quite a bit of reading, I'm trying not to post snippets because if I do I will make at least two pages of posts in a row

But I just wanted to say that I've ISO'd CSF and she is a lot more obvtown than I remember, even earlier on

What changed?

[Cat Scratch Fever]

I'm also surprised they have not come at me more cutthroat-ly because I know especially Cabd is an absolute monster when it comes to dunking his scum reads and it seems like they bought into the slip argument against me pretty strong.

That's not a bad observation

[Cat Scratch Fever]

VOTE: Brian Skies

That's 10 votes on him

[Cat Scratch Fever]

Marci makes me feel like I should be prepping for retirement or something

[Cat Scratch Fever]

idle thought that someone who initially pushed that it was best to lim within the dethy hood but then let that opinion fall away as consensus settled on being willing to look elsewhere is probably more likely to be scum who wants the time triggered benefit

not necessarily someone whose mind changed but someone who is ignoring their prior principles

idk who this applies to if anyone and im not planning to research rn

Dann, is this what you would call a bread crumb trail

Spoiler:

in general fireisredsir is not really trying to look town this game, and as scum they plant bread crumb trails, do little reflective step backs, and do random towny conspiracy theories all over the place

[Cat Scratch Fever]

Marci makes me feel like I should be prepping for retirement or something

when talking to another user on this site and they said stuff like "what's a CD?" i felt like it was my time to die in an old folks home

Oh my god, a CD not even a cassette tape

[Cat Scratch Fever]

~_~

[Cat Scratch Fever]

I'm leaving to eat tapioca pudding and drink prune juice

[Cat Scratch Fever]

Its not just ur slot.

Cakez efforted and then people unvoted.

It just looks a bit weird esp cuz alot of it was "i like that post" but not actually engaging on it.

I dont even have a read on the dude but looking at thr unvotes i was like

WTF

I found his explanations fairly believable

Like his townread on dunnstral that he's struggling to put into words. His read on me does seem like a read he would make if he just speedread 120 pages. The suspicion on morph for pushing the timing thing, but not actually voting there

It also helps that Brian has felt like a soggy biscuit the last few times he posted in the thread, so it's not exactly hard to feel good about moving there

[Cat Scratch Fever]

I've generally liked their posts and they feel town to me. I know others are concerned about the lack of the Jupiter head, but I think that's a silly reason to discount the effort already put in by the head that is actually playing.

The Jupiter thing might be one reason some people are scum reading sunflower for, but I don't think that's the primary reason.

It feels like you're not really internalizing the arguments made in this game. You kinda did this with the firebringer wagon earlier too in 2651, because that wagon was started with legitimate reasons to scumread FB. It feels disingenuous

[Cat Scratch Fever]

How did you come up with that list, bingle?

[Cat Scratch Fever]

I think pooky made some valid points like Cakez's penguin townread felt premature

But I still prefer Brian to Cakez

[Cat Scratch Fever]

i don't see the reasons for cakez scum. I know i misread him all the time so im going to outsource my read on him but like wtf is the case there?

I repeat what i said like 10 pages agon brian skies, I get the feeling and reason he is wagoned. ITs just the fact he is always wagoned day 1 in games i play with him and he is always town when it happens that makes me go that this is bad.

I just really want to elim bingle and im too lazy to case him or lead the charge there. Nor do i think anyone will listen to me (but honestly just using that as an excuse not to put in the effort to try)

This post is pinging me

[Cat Scratch Fever]

i don't see the reasons for cakez scum. I know i misread him all the time so im going to outsource my read on him but like wtf is the case there?

I repeat what i said like 10 pages agon brian skies, I get the feeling and reason he is wagoned. ITs just the fact he is always wagoned day 1 in games i play with him and he is always town when it happens that makes me go that this is bad.

I just really want to elim bingle and im too lazy to case him or lead the charge there. Nor do i think anyone will listen to me (but honestly just using that as an excuse not to put in the effort to try)

This post is pinging me

What part?

a) it feels whiteknight-y of you while not really committing to the townread

b) I guess I'm surprised by how much he wants Bingle

[Cat Scratch Fever]

I get and agree with A but what is pingy about B? I see town!Fire wanting a Bingle elimination just as much as scum depending on whatever Bingles alignment is. Bingle has been dropping in my reads too. His play and trajectory around me don't make sense and something in his tone sounds weird to me too.

How much he wants Bingle eliminated ("really want") feels exaggerated and fake given he doesn't even want to case or push Bingle

[Cat Scratch Fever]

I think you can use thumb tags instead of img, Luke

[Cat Scratch Fever]

The post from FB also feels designed to give "look I have strong opinions on the game!" vibes but without anything to actually back it up

[Cat Scratch Fever]

I'm back to thinking Cakez is town and don't want him eliminated.

I remember his scumgame as being posture-y and faking overconfidence (and getting kinda pissy when getting correctly scumread lol). His posts left little room for nuance and was full of little phrases like:
- "this post is scummy af"
- "this post is such bullshit wtf??"
- "trash readslist bro"
- "i

never

get any feels of town motivation or genuineness behind them they feel very perfunctory"
viewtopic.php?sid=&f=56&t=90425&user_select%5B%5D=26092

How he's posting here feels more natural to me in contrast. When he's processing new info, he seems more unsure of himself but is still trying to calibrate

[Cat Scratch Fever]

wow I feel so important

The little miller that could

[Cat Scratch Fever]

The post from FB also feels designed to give "look I have strong opinions on the game!" vibes but without anything to actually back it up

No but really, who thinks this is how i operate as scum. This is like thinking my scum game is in fact very weak when I take a lot of pride in my scum game.

shrugs
I could be wrong about your specific motivation but it was still a scummy post
I also have a hard time believing you think I'm scum for this

[Cat Scratch Fever]

I do think town who has given up in Brian's position would have at least claimed by now

[Cat Scratch Fever]

Town

morph the cat (fferyllt & Cabd)
PookyTheMagicalBear
Dunnstral
Spiffeh
Hermit Crab (anonymous hydra)
Dannflor
Firebagel

marcistar
Save The Dragons
Shello and Goodbye (Ydrasse & skitter30)
experience ActionDan
SirCakez
Lukewarm

Gypyx
Oblivion
Klick

Bingle
PenguinPower

Firebringer
Brian Skies
Sunflower (JupiterXV & fireisredsir)

Scum

[Cat Scratch Fever]

Reminder to not give the invention to me in case we want to have all cop shots targeted at me

Or pooky bc ascetic

[Cat Scratch Fever]

Wait, are we actually just waiting on 'organization' that is just people squabbling over names like kids at recess picking teams?

Worse still they've figured out the names but are waiting for klick to confirm

I think klick can just figure it out later, sorry klick

[Cat Scratch Fever]

pooky we gotta kill this guy

good work and then i’ll bring him out back

here's my crumb btw

Why pooky?

[Cat Scratch Fever]

awwooooo

I think number of pagetops is a scum tell everyone

pooky we gotta kill this guy

it was just a convenient moment to do it

- ydra

No I meant, why did you kill pooky, not why did you crumb there

[Cat Scratch Fever]

Spoiler: me being annoying

Maybe the condition is if mafia is still alive in the dethy hood at a certain point

[Cat Scratch Fever]

@mod I'm vla until Sunday

Sorry something came up

[Cat Scratch Fever]

Why are they on the same level as marci in your reads, then?

And why does that make Save the Dragons town?

oops. i was trying to multitask and forgot to reply to this.
they were on the same level, because of interactions in our hood.
for why i think std is town, i would say it would be both for reminding me about the mod note and for hood interactions.

Which pages of the game thread have you read?

[Cat Scratch Fever]

Isn't that everyones role in the dethy

i have no clue.

Is this possible? I thought it was discussed within the dethy that every member has the same role.

[Cat Scratch Fever]

Isn't that everyones role in the dethy

i have no clue.

aintnoway that's a real thought experience is having

Actually...

Didn't experience acknowledge a list of where each inventor should be targeting in the hood? How can they think their role is unrevealed still?

this is a good point

[Cat Scratch Fever]

Hmm I think it's possible experience truly didn't know they were all cop inventors. It lines up with why he offered to claim in the first place.

But if scum received the same unreliable cop inventor role as everyone else, they really do not need to be pre-informed that the neighborhood was a dethy. If that's the case here, a lot of why I started thinking ActionDan was town (genuine progression while figuring out the setup) gets thrown out the window.

experience's attitude towards this game seems... criminally negligent. My impression of his towngame is he pops in to ask the most random questions but at least he's thinking about the game in some capacity. I don't really see that here

VOTE: experience

[Cat Scratch Fever]

Aside from experience, I'm not wholly convinced Sunflower is town. I don't really see the other 3 as scum however (for Firebagel, STD has surpassed my impression of his scum range), so I think we should try to find the scum in the hood today

[Cat Scratch Fever]

Also do you think it’s unreasonable for people to not be buying your explanation here?

Assuming you’re Town, do you feel anyone on your wagon is specifically capitalizing on your mistake to push your mis-elimination?

PEdit: @Experience

i mean, it's reasonable people doubt my explanation but not when they're misconstruing my posts and then proceeding to use that as the crux of their case. (like, sure, go ahead and say 'i don't trust experience' but it's annoying when it's like 'experience not knowing that the hood inventors were all the same = experience must be scum dumbtelling')
as for who i think are capitalising on my mistake, i'm not really sure. at this point, it seems like my wagon has either way-too-confbiased hero wannnabes or scum who know they can get away with voting me because they can hide behind the former.
the one thing tho is that really, i can't the difference so i'd be lying if i told you i could.

Whoa the writing style here sounds really different

[Cat Scratch Fever]

Firebringer and gypyx are fine wagons but I think we should be voting within the hood

I still think Cakez is town

[Cat Scratch Fever]

Also do you think it’s unreasonable for people to not be buying your explanation here?

Assuming you’re Town, do you feel anyone on your wagon is specifically capitalizing on your mistake to push your mis-elimination?

PEdit: @Experience

i mean, it's reasonable people doubt my explanation but not when they're misconstruing my posts and then proceeding to use that as the crux of their case. (like, sure, go ahead and say 'i don't trust experience' but it's annoying when it's like 'experience not knowing that the hood inventors were all the same = experience must be scum dumbtelling')
as for who i think are capitalising on my mistake, i'm not really sure. at this point, it seems like my wagon has either way-too-confbiased hero wannnabes or scum who know they can get away with voting me because they can hide behind the former.
the one thing tho is that really, i can't the difference so i'd be lying if i told you i could.

Whoa the writing style here sounds really different

This is what he's capable of when he actually puts his mind to things.

I maintain experience not understanding the claims in the neighborhood is a nulltell, and I regret making it a focal point of discussion. If folks want to eliminate him based on other reasons, that's fine, but, like, do it for good reasons and not NAI ones. I don't think it's impossible for his recent posting to come from him as town but shrug. I'm going to reread again.

I see, I actually had the thought that someone else wrote that post for him but nvm I guess

[Cat Scratch Fever]

Fellow crusties, gimme your top two scumreads from the dethy hood. I have something to check.

-HM

Actually I’ll just say this out loud.

Pooky called from

hell

dead PT and he said blood god needs more blood. I say we pick out two people from the hood who are being universally scumread, and blow them up over two days for the blood god with no questions asked.

ATM I’m leaning Sunflower / experience only because I am townreading other three more.

-HM

I support both this general notion and the specific poe

[Cat Scratch Fever]

Also do you think it’s unreasonable for people to not be buying your explanation here?

Assuming you’re Town, do you feel anyone on your wagon is specifically capitalizing on your mistake to push your mis-elimination?

PEdit: @Experience

i mean, it's reasonable people doubt my explanation but not when they're misconstruing my posts and then proceeding to use that as the crux of their case. (like, sure, go ahead and say 'i don't trust experience' but it's annoying when it's like 'experience not knowing that the hood inventors were all the same = experience must be scum dumbtelling')
as for who i think are capitalising on my mistake, i'm not really sure. at this point, it seems like my wagon has either way-too-confbiased hero wannnabes or scum who know they can get away with voting me because they can hide behind the former.
the one thing tho is that really, i can't the difference so i'd be lying if i told you i could.

As for the actual content of this post, "hero wannabe" is a strange description of some of his voters. I don't think voting experience is a "hero" vote by any metric, maybe lazy is anything

[Cat Scratch Fever]

fire was like shell game's out! but u gotta study for your quiz. play shell game later. and i was like ok. and then i never returned to shell game until now LOL. that's mb
anyways im gonna continue reading if there are no further objections towards my completely nonexistent d1 play thx

How is this coming along?

[Cat Scratch Fever]

What do u think of dueling wagons on u and experience

it's fine i guess

Do you think scum can be anyone else in the hood

[Cat Scratch Fever]

Gypyx, it does seem like you came in while getting wagoned, decided someone wagoning you had to be scum, and did some half-baked analysis and are now tunneling wolfbae for ? reasons even though you're also not confident in your reads

[Cat Scratch Fever]

experience definitely is checked out, but I don't know why that makes him town over scum

[Cat Scratch Fever]

That said I'm pretty 50/50, and I don't know how to get to a point where I will feel really confident about one of {experience, Sunflower} over the other, so I'll vote either

[Cat Scratch Fever]

Why are we killing experience over sunflower, again?

I have the same question

can you talk about your read on me

Never had any reason to townread you and i can see a universe where experience's play comes from town and i want to lim in the hood

What reasons do you have to townread experience though?

[Cat Scratch Fever]

Why are we killing experience over sunflower, again?

I have the same question

can you talk about your read on me

Never had any reason to townread you and i can see a universe where experience's play comes from town and i want to lim in the hood

What reasons do you have to townread experience though?

Is scum that clueless?

If he isn't groupscum, he's just playing solo like any town

So then he'd just be clueless but I don't know what that says about his alignment

[Cat Scratch Fever]

I think it's RH9 yes

[Cat Scratch Fever]

UNOFFICIAL VC

experience 9 (Firebringer, Dannflor, CSF, STD, wolfbae, Penguin, Sunflower, Lukewarm, Gypyx)
Sunflower 3 (Dunnstral, Shello, SirCakez, Spiffeh)
Gypyx 2 (Hermit, Firebagel)
wolfbae 1 (Gypyx)

Not voting 5 - Oblivion, experience, Bingle, morph, marci

With 20 alive, it takes 11 to feed to a dragon.

Deadline: (expired on 2024-05-16 20:12:00)[/color][/area]

[Cat Scratch Fever]

it's RH9

I'm pretty sure sunflower is just trolling you

[Cat Scratch Fever]

brian wagon: [spiffeh, morph, marci, lukewarm, dunnstral, sunflower, pooky, cakez, penguin, csf]

I'd say the first six on my wagon are probably town.

if brian was town reading partners they were probably better positioned without a likelihood of flipping soon

imo like spiffeh or dunnstral

probably dunnstral, I don't really scum read spiffeh anymore

meh the more Dunn posts today the more I think he is likely just town and me holding the scumread was cope in the face of not wanting to be wrong

I think if there's scum in the night market it's likely Firebringer, and I think he looks bad in particular if the ActionDan slot flips scum - he was parked there for most of Day 1 but not really doing anything about it, and I think that's a slot that scum are likely to look at and go "how is this not getting scumread more"

I agree with the firebringer read but reviewing his posts actually makes me want to move to sunflower. He jumped on Dan kinda fast over the miller fos whereas I remember dunnstral and Dann had a more natural seeming approach

[Cat Scratch Fever]

Oh but I want to see a flip and we're getting so close ~_~

[Cat Scratch Fever]

I did have a thought that maybe scum have a backup bus driver and that's why they didn't care to save Brian

Choosing from a pool is better than sticking to a specific person

[Cat Scratch Fever]

---[] time? I would love to see a flip before I sleep

[Cat Scratch Fever]

Any reason not to just VOTE: Sunflower?

[Cat Scratch Fever]

i spent like 100 posts scumcasing morph in the neighborhood last night

Oof

[Cat Scratch Fever]

Can’t relate but I’m happy for you cakez

[Cat Scratch Fever]

Any reason not to just VOTE: Sunflower?

My only concern is that we pretty hard signaled this to be the next elim, and we know there is a bookie :/

There’s a claimed role that can nullify that though, I assumed shello would’ve used it yesterday

[Cat Scratch Fever]

i think it is possible, that's it's a ruse to get us to kill all the dethy members

i want to throw that out there and see if there's any taste for it

reason being is that i can't figure out who's the scum but my reads have been atrocious all game so what do i know

gth i would do marci tbh but im not very confident in that

marci's day 1 posting seemed like she was uninformed about Brian's alignment. It has this meandering quality about it that makes me think she was considering his alignment instead of setting out with a specific read

wolfbae's defeated attitude is weirding me out a bit, but I really liked his D2 posts and still want Sunflower flipped

Spoiler: marci

Ok so there is little room for scum to hide.

but also it looks like brian skies is pretty afk. its possible for an easy push that way so im a bit wary.

more than brian skies, i am concerned about dunnstral, esp if actiondan winds up being the scum in the hood. dunnstral is easily more active and i can see some reasons here, though i understand the associations im building makes me biased.

mmm thats true. but im just saying i dont agree with some brian skies srs until i see more activity from there. hes null for me rn.i dont get how anyone could get any more unless if im reading too far into it?

I actually like spiffehs read on brian skies. I think its very cash money and makes me think more about brian skies alignment. I think brian skies does leave alot to desire, despite the fact i like his post.

The interaction with me began around 990, with the morph interaction beginning around 1026. I also like the read retraction on marci in the sequence of posts beginning in 1059 also felt town to me.

Oblivion's Dethy speculation is similar to where I'm at in that I feel as though it's probably best to table the Dethy hood for a day unless we feel really good about an elimination there.

I do like how Oblivion segued from the Dethy spec into discussing reads. I feel as though scum love to discuss setup spec, and Oblivion didn't just let the conversation linger there. They took initiative and moved the topic elsewhere. I agree the retraction on Marci feels town as I feel scum are less likely to just change their reads like that.

This just feels town??

Like why mention scum love setup spec of all reasons to tr someone? It feels like brians thinking of the game as a whole instead of looking for easy to make reads.

The interaction with me began around 990, with the morph interaction beginning around 1026. I also like the read retraction on marci in the sequence of posts beginning in 1059 also felt town to me.

Oblivion's Dethy speculation is similar to where I'm at in that

I feel as though it's probably best to table the Dethy hood for a day unless we feel really good about an elimination there.

VOTE: STD

?

What makes you feel "really good" about dragons then?

I dont track between these posts.. am i just slow?

im bored of the game thread as of late, esp of brian

im bored of the game thread as of late, esp of brian

Why am I the subject of your ire?

What do you want to do today wrt your hood?

cuz i looked at your posts and yawned

Let’s start one

VOTE: Brian Skies

am i wrong to tr this? it feels so natural.

VOTE: brian skies

[Cat Scratch Fever]

I want to hear more from oblivion today

[Cat Scratch Fever]

The selection of marcis posts you quoted look like she was trying to throw a bone to Brian several (but not 7) times before giving up because he couldn't be saved

Like "I agree Brian is scummy, but dunn is scummier"

And "I kinda townread this, does anyone else?"

And "hey Brian what are your thoughts about x?"

I think if she were trying to divert Brian, she didn't need to call out Brian randomly in 2078, which was before he was getting wagoned

[Cat Scratch Fever]

i think marci is comfortable playing that way as scum and I think people are vastly underestimating marci's capabilities as scum

why is she scum?

[Cat Scratch Fever]

i think marci is comfortable playing that way as scum and I think people are vastly underestimating marci's capabilities as scum

why is she scum?

i think her trajectory on brian reads partnered and manufactured (yes i realize this was a 180 on my previous read but past me was being dumb), and i don't think she's focused on the things town would be focused on

like her entrance to today was calling people scum for voting sunflower and not focused on who could be scum in her hood at all, I think she's more focused on optics and positioning than figuring out the game

Sorry I think this is just a reach

Spoiler:

I think im back to susing my gal gypyx. Partly for being one of the 2 insta votes on sunflower, other part for todays posting.

I forget.
Were the cop shots used?

my items were stolen

@std/wolf/marci/sunflower
Do you think there's scum in your hood, and if so, who?

I think there is, but im unsure on who it is. i think theres points against all of them, but if i had to say i think theres the most against wolfbae but idk even.. i like his solving in the hood.

Im also ?? on firebringer for thinking theres no masons.

woah so am i the person you thought was aggressively and blatantly wolfsiding?

[Cat Scratch Fever]

Marci also claimed fruit yesterday

[Cat Scratch Fever]

I don't think Spiffeh's position on handling the dethy is that surprising or wolfy bc I also think it'd be really difficult to find the scum in {Marci, std, wolf}

[Cat Scratch Fever]

I'm miller

[Cat Scratch Fever]

I'm miller

by the way is that like the normal kind of miller where you only show as guilty to cops or something more intricate?

It's the normal one. Specifically it's the first one here (insane gets inno result on me):

Spoiler:

Actually, does an insane cop come back with an inno on a miller?

Depends on Miller wording, actually. The standard Miller of

“you investigate as though you were mafia” yes,

a potential variant of “any investigative targeting you will receive x result” no.

[Cat Scratch Fever]

There wasn't a weird push on experience. More explicitly... why wasn't there a weird push opposing? Where was the setup by players preparing for the flip? Where was the motility?

Like... correct it if you feel differently but it really views this game and the way yesterday went as the ultimate manipulation of a bunch of ego driven players who love their intelligences and egos stroked and their final reads heard... who were all lead wrong and astray and now we're following through on the second half of that outcome.

Can you explain this again? I don't understand how you got to the conclusion that because experience flipped town, Sunflower will flip town as well

I don't particularly get the sense of today being a waiting room for an inevitable Sunflower elimination. If anything I'm surprised by how many pushes in different directions people are making to avoid a Sunflower elimination, first marci then a little bit in STD's direction

[Cat Scratch Fever]

i'm about here too wrt reads so i'm just stealing it. i would move dragons down a little and penguin up i think. the partial solve i lobbed out earlier to skitter was

sunflower/firebringer/gypyx

or something which does not feel Correct to me but i'm having a hard time picking out who is wrong in this list and who the last person could be assuming 5

- ydra

That was my solve at some point, but I don't think fb/gypyx is that likely based on 4764 (especially with experience having flipped town!). I would guess Gypyx is town and I'm not sure who I'm overlooking

[Cat Scratch Fever]

No no, I understand what's being asked, just not why. Literally only one other inventor shot even got a result last night so there isn't exactly a great framework here, and how exactly would comparing them solve it better now even if we had five results? We have players who investigate as known alignments so that provides instantaneous feedback. To use the one result that we have as an example, it was targeted at CSF and got an innocent. Assuming it wasn't redirected or lied about, it has to be either Naive or Inverse because that's wrong. Targeting the same inventor's invention at a known innocent next should clear up which it was because Naive will still give an innocent but Inverse will make the innocent look guilty. Am I missing something about why all the other inventions matter?

Are you simply saying that you will claim it tomorrow when someone else has used wolfbae's copvention

[Cat Scratch Fever]

Speaking of, I would like a copvention. There's only so much wheat to be milled, corn to be ground yknow

[Cat Scratch Fever]

Scum can steal cop shots in addition to fruit? Can marci confirm if she lost both or just her fruit

[Cat Scratch Fever]

man I just want to eliminate Cakez

I understand we don't want to right now because mechanical reasons blah blah blah

but I don't believe that guy believes a word he says

Which posts?

[Cat Scratch Fever]

how do I keep falling for that shit

[Cat Scratch Fever]

Oh yeah I was surprised gypyx correctly assumed FB had a cop shot >_>

Firebringer who did you try to cop?

[Cat Scratch Fever]

Could an uninvolved third party tell me if this is towny or scummy from the penguin

What specifically?

I gut townread penguin with his unprompted softs today and quick swap off of Cakez day 1, but it's not a very confident read

[Cat Scratch Fever]

Spoiler:

Spoiler: Updated claims

Dethy

MAKING CALIBRATION PROGRESS

Marci's first shot went to sunflower, was used on CSF. Inno result. Naive or inverse.

Wolfbae's first shot went to firebagel. Results unclaimed

NOT MAKING CALIBRATION PROGRESS

sunflower's first shot went to shello. Unused. Also did not give a second one.

STD's first shot went to firebringer. Claiming it failed to work

Experience's first shot went to Marci. Stolen.

Cat Scratch Fever

- Miller

Notty/Bingle

- mason fruit vendors.

Shello

- Oddskeeper (Tries to out guess the bookie) turned off vig.

Firebringer

- fortune teller. Failed to fire night 1 and 2. Night 1 he forgot to submit an action. Night 2, he chose to use a cop-vention.

• past - tracker a past night
  
• present - snarglefargle (??)
  
• future - set up a future redirect

PenguinPower

- Claimed some kind of role that would want to guess the night kill, but not the specific one. Claimed to target Hermit night 2.

Apparently claimed something in their hood, but I don't know what

:

Dunnstral
Cakez (maybe another fruit vendor based off something hermit said, but unclear)

Unclaimed:

Gypyx
Spiffeh
Oblivion
Lukewarm
Firebagel
Dannflor

Mech wise:

Bingle
HC

CSF
Shello

To varying degrees, I'm taking the four of these as a given that they're town. CSF being miller makes sense in a dethy setup. A dedicated doc to the second scumkill fits well with an ascetic real doc mechwise, and the novelty of oddskeeper with a known backup bookie rings true. If the primary bookie was town they would have claimed by now, because we absolutely could have triggered that ability given a reason to do so. Pengy and Shello are not S/S but I kinda think Pengy is scum from a little bit of awkward feels around the early townread of me. It just seemed weird that he specifically would have that read that early. I think marci being stolen from is significantly scum indicative, actually. Especially in the case that Cakez is scum. Experience was already dead. If scum really wanted to mess with town calibrating cops, they would have been better served stealing a different copshot. I think this is a case where the thief was used to go "Oh, look, I was targeted by scum, I can't be scum myself" instead of an actual attempt to prevent the cops from doing something long term. I actually think Fire's claim is maybe town? Like, I don't know why he doesn't use the future redirect N1 as scum, and that looks like a true claim. I don't think it's impossible for scum to have multiple redirection roles in a 'Shell Game' game, but this is maybe town indicative of FB. I'm straight up not worried about the thief Notty's worried about, so limming outside of copventors doesn't seem interesting to me.

What is the connection between Cakez and Marci?

[Cat Scratch Fever]

@CSF what is your current read on Firebagel? You mentioned early having a good idea of who they are and how to read them, and I don't see any recent commentary on them.

She's still a strong townread. She doesn't strike me as a very confident scum player, and I think she would be more go-with-the-flow if she were scum here

Both her STD push and the insistence on not claiming her result I think are things that she believes in and wouldn't do if she were scum. her refusal to claim her result also makes me think she doesn't really care about how she's perceived

There are also some little things I townread like the small aside earlier about how scum NK'ing her here would be a win for her

[Cat Scratch Fever]

I think Bingle's mech argument for scum!marci was the most compelling scumcase yet, but weren't fruit receivers informed that they could not do anything with the fruit?

That implies someone can do something with fruit, and perhaps the fruit was the end goal, not the cop shot.

Spoiler:

@spay- does the fruit seem to imply it can be used for something

the note says that to my knowledge it doesn't do anything. It secifically says that I can't do anything with it.

When I read the PM I thought that maybe something has to happen before I learn more about it or can use it in some way, but your idea about fruit thievery makes sense, too.

@spay- does the fruit seem to imply it can be used for something

the note says that to my knowledge it doesn't do anything. It secifically says that I can't do anything with it.

When I read the PM I thought that maybe something has to happen before I learn more about it or can use it in some way, but your idea about fruit thievery makes sense, too.

But clearly someone can. Thanks.

[Cat Scratch Fever]

I suppose Thief could be the sole interaction with fruit but that feels kinda meh

[Cat Scratch Fever]

Oblivion and Firebagel, who do you want to eliminate today?

[Cat Scratch Fever]

I guess that answers my question

id much rather sheep STD who has good instincts and i think is town here.
If im lost i think he has way better at figuring out best elims.
Also petapan lost his mojo this game so him calling cakez never going to elim cakez screams "this is a good push to do"

Personally i am neutral on cakez even to this point. I can't read him, ill admit it. This isn't a personal read anymore. I don't trust my ability to do so after failing so many times in so many games. I don't trust peta ability to do so either.

Ouch, this feels like an unnecessary discredit

[Cat Scratch Fever]

For it, Cakez is the perfect fit of the player who is seeking to perpetuate this game state. The player who benefits from it the most and the player who is pushing for the weakest positioned players to die first almost exclusively. It hasn't seen Cakez buck up once to a player who had more social capital than them. Almost as if Cakez is intentionally pushing players he thinks he can best, rather than developing real reads.

Given the morph flip and how I'm townreading the people early on the Brian wagon, I don't particularly think scum have to be well positioned here

[Cat Scratch Fever]

For it, Cakez is the perfect fit of the player who is seeking to perpetuate this game state. The player who benefits from it the most and the player who is pushing for the weakest positioned players to die first almost exclusively. It hasn't seen Cakez buck up once to a player who had more social capital than them. Almost as if Cakez is intentionally pushing players he thinks he can best, rather than developing real reads.

Given the morph flip and how I'm townreading the people early on the Brian wagon, I don't particularly think scum have to be well positioned here

First of all, Cakez isn't the best positioned, so it doesn't know why this is your point.

Second of all, it really does think there needs to be 1 to 2 very deeply positioned scum for how yesterday happened and how the game is progressing to be the case.

You're literally saying Cakez is scum because he is pushing the weakest positioned players

[Cat Scratch Fever]

Oh, and you're saying "no actually i think if we just eliminate the least active most low hanging fruit players we just win"?

You genuinely believe that at this point with how the game is going?

Your point about low activity feels like a different point than what we were arguing

Sunflower has been active. Idr if Cakez scumreads Firebringer anymore, but he has been active too. Neither are well positioned

I do feel like these popular scumreads are in the right direction; one miselimination does not mean the train has completely derailed

[Cat Scratch Fever]

A better comparison might be how I'm approaching Sunflower / Firebringer today is really similar to how Cakez is approaching Sunflower / Oblivion today

Or maybe Shello

[Cat Scratch Fever]

im town btw

i also was very convinced morph was scum so lemme reset a bit i want to try again at least

Did this happen? I don't remember any major read shifts from you, except marci went from high confidence scumread to low confidence scumread

[Cat Scratch Fever]

im town btw

i also was very convinced morph was scum so lemme reset a bit i want to try again at least

Did this happen? I don't remember any major read shifts from you, except marci went from high confidence scumread to low confidence scumread

yes

prior to morph flip i thought it was morph/marci/[spiffeh or luke] + 1

now i think it's somewhere around [marci or std]/dunn/cakez? + 1

I feel like it's the same people in your POE though, which strikes me as not having changed very much

Spoiler:

Sunflower who do you even think is scum??

[Firebringer, Firebagel, Lukewarm]
[experience, morph the cat, Dunnstral, Gypyx, SirCakez, PenguinPower, Cat Scratch Fever]

here's a lazy poe

[Cat Scratch Fever]

It doesn't feel like you reset your reads after the morph flip, because you have the same general null-to-scum reads

Maybe you did reset and drew the same conclusions as the first time around, but I feel like the flip should have upended your reads more

[Cat Scratch Fever]

I think Hermit's vote on you was actually E-1, do you have anymore thoughts?

[Cat Scratch Fever]

There would be like no point to him voting you rn, Luke

I want to see a sunflower flip

[Cat Scratch Fever]

Guys I hate to break it to you but you fucked up by not shooting Cakez into the sun on Day 2

Aside from the fact that he is painfully scummy, even if he is somehow town it would still be optimal to just kill him, find his alignment, and then have full knowledge about Day 1's competing wagons and being able to analyze the wagons properly with that knowledge.

VOTE: Cakez

Why is he "painfully scummy"?

[Cat Scratch Fever]

actually if i were to update reads list i would say goes something like:

{STD}
{Spiffeh, Cat Scratch}
{Penguinpower, Dunnstral}
{Firebagel/Luke Warm} ---Null
Everyone else i want to nuke with varying degrees.

Bingle/Hermit would still be near the bottom.

When/why did you start townreading me again?

[Cat Scratch Fever]

firebagel i can't tell if ur trolling or not reading

You said you don't remember why you decided to target wolfbae. Dunnstral is attesting to having advised you to use your action on someone outside the dethy hood. It sounds like you knew what it does.

So how the heck is it useful information to find out who an inventor gave a cop shot to?? Why would you do that? You know what they're almost certainly doing and it's probably going to be outright claimed by them and confirmed by the target. You could be trying to find someone making a night kill and you did this instead. Like wtf man. I guess it being delayed info makes it slightly less likely to be a scum role than if it was for the current night, but the way you used it feels like you wanted to make a show of confirming your action rather than be useful.

fairly sure if he was looking to make a show of confirming his action he wouldn't actively spit in my face when i tried to reach out to him

I don't follow the logic here

[Cat Scratch Fever]

firebringer targeted me with his role, which confirms his role name. I have been probably one of the more vocal defenders of Firebringer in-thread at time even if I've wavered (but then I've wobbled on all my reads). If he was "making a show of confirming his action" with the intent of pocketing me he probably doesn't actively reject me when I try to reach out to him and accuse me of being scum with cakez. That feels very un-tactical.

I guess I don't really see why he has to be pocketing you if the goal was to confirm his action

[Cat Scratch Fever]

Were you informed that you were tracked or visited by fortune teller?

[Cat Scratch Fever]

Why is he "painfully scummy"?

I hadn't read all game and don't really intend to, but from what I read:
-His reactions to being called out for a scumslip on Day 1 were bad
-His posting doesn't show a town thought process. Feels maybe performative/coached.
-His reads are bad in a scummy way IMO
-I felt like he was coasting at various points in the game

can you elaborate on the last 3 points, like which posts feel performative, which reads were scummy etc.

[Cat Scratch Fever]

I guess I sympathize a lot with Dunnstral's general approach to the game, since I was also fairly content with the direction of the game up until Sunflower's flip

Which makes it difficult for me to see his actions yesterday as necessarily "scum content with the gamestate" over "town content with the gamestate"

At the end of the day I was actively seeking other's takes on Sunflowers because I got a town ping from them right before the end and nobody would even talk to me.

I don't think this is at all an accurate description of what you were doing.

Here is what you posted:

does my posting look like i've given up to you?

you're saying the only possible elimination today is you so yes it does look you've given up

ok first i do owe StD a post talking about my reasons for finding sunflower scummy before today

Spoiler: cakez talks about sunflower

AMA

can you elaborate more on the csf + hermit + morph + sunflower ones?

also did you wolfread morph at all before the luke case or did you read it and then apply it back if that makes sense?

- ydra

-snip-
Sunflower has some individual posts that pinged me, a lot of which were already called out in thread. 116 feels weirdly overwritten and not like real thoughts. 222 sounds kinda fake to me. 1226 gives me the same vibes as 116, idk if I'm just misreading the tone? like these reads feel very noncomittal and like they aren't backed up by anything. hmmm I will say after finishing the ISO re-read it wasn't as bad as I remembered, their posts have improved recently. i would probably put them in scummish instead of bottom scum on reevaluation.
-snip-

Sunflower has also gone quiet
I want to explore wagoning both of these slots tomorrow

im doing this for my firebuddy

town:
[hermit crab]
[oblivion, dunnstral, dannflor]
[shello&goodbye, lukewarm]

lean town:
[save the dragons]
[firebagel, bingle]

nulltown:
[gypyx, penguin]

conflicted:
[marci, sircakez, spiffeh, pooky, marci]

lean scum:
[morph the cat, actiondan, klick, firebringer, CSF]

scum:
[brian skies]

this readlist sucks im townreading too many people and i don't even really believe in my leanscums. something is wrong

ActionDan hasn't been in the game for a while now, and you just made this readslist?

I have some issues with Sunflower's response to Spiffeh's case in 4254

-In general I agree with Spiffeh's overall assessment that the entire defense is basically self-metaing that they wouldn't play this way as scum. The problem with that for me is Spiffeh's arguments aren't really related to meta at all. So I don't really find "oh I wouldn't play like this as scum" to be a compelling argument.

-Some of the thoughts stated in the post don't seem real to me. For example, Sunflower claims that they were playing pro-town by being inactive day 1 because of how many posts the game was getting. But as a townie, I think it's clearly most important to have your voice heard in thread and to engage others. I don't think townies strategize this way - intentionally posting less to help town?? That just doesn't seem like a legit defense at all. Another point I disliked was the argument that only town would have crumbed in this situation. I find that to be obviously not true across Mafia as a whole, but even specifically to this game, Sunflower's stated awareness of this argument essentially renders it mute because they can twist their own meta to fit the defense.

-I am also not a fan of their defense against Spiffeh's (and mine and some other people's too I think) argument that their vote on Brian was bussing. Saying there was no credit to be gained in voting Brian is not true because there has already been discussion about who was pushing Brian vs who was pushing me, and when I am inevitably eliminated or vigged this game Day One is going to come under a lot of scrutiny as to who was trying to save Brian by pushing me. Sunflower would have looked even worse if they had continued to sit on their vote on me instead of moving to Brian. So maybe there wasn't a ton of towncred to be grabbed from this situation but there certainly is scum motivation for this kind of vote maneuvering.

Sunflower who do you even think is scum??

Sunflower who do you even think is scum??

[Firebringer, Firebagel, Lukewarm]
[experience, morph the cat, Dunnstral, Gypyx, SirCakez, PenguinPower, Cat Scratch Fever]

here's a lazy poe

You are one of the popular elimination candidates today, which is coming in roughly 72 hours, and the best you can offer is a lazy poe?

Like Sunflower's recent posts have also given me the checked out vibes, but it feels like the Brian kind of checked out where they are scum caught in the headlights, I don't feel any sort of town passion or emotion there

the tl;dr is
all game sunflower's posts to me have not felt like they come from a townie's POV. they feel very weirdly written to not rock the boat and to make it very easy for them to change positions based on movements in thread read trajectory. look at the readslist i pointed to day one, they had actiondan on there and he had been replaced for a while at that point. that doesn't look to me like a town going through their reads on the playerlist and making a list, because you would notice stuff like that. i don't understand how they have been unable to offer any real scumreads or pushes well into day three at this point. even before their self-proclaimed inevitable elimination today they hardly had any scumreads they were pushing.
i also found it suspicious that they were mostly absent at the EoD Day 1 when Brian was getting yeeted, they basically only showed up to drop a vote on him and dip. spiffeh has talked about this a lot already.

Though this was the one post in his ISO that I didn't like because 6496 is right there as is his Oblivion case in 6514

[Cat Scratch Fever]

Huh I didn't see the latter half of 6496.

Casing Oblivion means what though?

It was the follow up to 6496

[Cat Scratch Fever]

yeah everyone who has completed their cop check should claim it

[Cat Scratch Fever]

Also Lukewarm (who I replaced btw if you somehow missed that) received a cop invention N2 and it returned inno when I investigated Marci. If the person who handed out the invention could claim, then assuming they also gave a cop shot on n1 we should be able to pretty confidently be able to tell their sanity.

Why marci over cakez or a different person in the dethy hood?

[Cat Scratch Fever]

kind of surprised dunnstral wasn't pressing firebagel to do this too

He did do this yesterday tbf

[Cat Scratch Fever]

Actually I am looking back in our hood and SirCakez had a completely different explanation over the night compared to 6709. They said that people were TMI on Sunflower being town the last day. They didn't even accuse me at all in the hood over night.

In fact I talked about how I felt there were weird scumreads on me and SirCakez responded saying people were looking for places to pull scumreads out of.

Not 100% on what that means but it doesn't seem to be suspicion.

VOTE: SirCakez

What Cakez allegedly said in the hood is surprising though, considering both 6465 from yesterDay and his entrance toDay

[Cat Scratch Fever]

Cat Scratch Fever - CSF is in this game? Whoa.

Whoa!

[Cat Scratch Fever]

Did anyone get wolf's cop shot last night

[Cat Scratch Fever]

It's probably meaningless

Yeah probably

If I had really cool info I would've been all over the place waving it around by now, trust me XD

I guess I can confirm I used both the cop shots, and I cannot yet ascertain whether they're reliable or useless. Leaning towards the latter but I'll let you know if that changes.

You got guilty both times? Who?

[Cat Scratch Fever]

Who are the egos running the game?

The people who unflinchingly ignored its attempts to stop a sunflower elimination and just told it essentially to shut up and be quiet while it happened, including players who decided it was scummy for trying to stop that even before a flip occured, lol.

Players SO CONVINCED they are right that they cannot have their minds changed even by arguments that, guess what, turned out to be RIGHT. It is willing to bet even NOW those players won't be convinced.

It made this argument yesterday. Its mind hasn't changed since its argument yesterday. It has only grown to give less fucks and be actively dreading opening this game for lack of a strong desire to interact with any of it. Rather than lack, consider it an aversion.

Sircakez is the top wagon today; what do you make of that

[Cat Scratch Fever]

Dunnstral what do your reads look like atm

[Cat Scratch Fever]

cat scratch ur tendency to just continue to ask questions and not even care if they get answered instead of just sharing opinions is becoming a meme

I do care if they get answered but not answering also means my opinion on you (generally and specifically) doesn't change

[Cat Scratch Fever]

And you remain a scumread...

Not by virtue of not answering but bc I don't really understand how you got to your reads

[Cat Scratch Fever]

Huh...

Spoiler:

I won't give you the satisfaction of confusing me though and will instead say it's because I'm making good progress on my generous glass of wine

I could more forthcoming with my thoughts though that's fair

I don't really understand firebagel not claiming her targets anymore, presumably she targeted someone she scumreads last night instead of a calibration shot, so why isn't her result relevant to share with the class?

For oblivion, I genuinely don't get why it feels the way it does. It's top scumread sircakez is getting pressured! And at the same time, I don't think the cakez lim is a foregone conclusion. It feels like the game is the most up-in-the-air it has been since early day 1. I'm trying to work through ISOs and do a little bit of a reset and I think other people are too(?) So I don't know if the emotion is faked or if it's misreading the game state (or if I'm misreading the gamestate lol)

The dunnstral question was just humoring wolfbae's scumread there

[Cat Scratch Fever]

Dunnstral what do your reads look like atm

Hermit Crab
Bingle
Marci

DragonEater
Csf
Spiffeh
Gypyx

Oblivion
Penguinpower
Firebringer
Firebagel

Dannflor
Save the Dragons
Wolfbae

SirCakez

Something like this

Why is gypyx so high and Dann so low?

[Cat Scratch Fever]

I just read gypyx's ISO, and I don't really follow how her Cakez read developed & why she's so confident in her scumread on Cakez or town!me. She feels metadive-able though

[Cat Scratch Fever]

<long quote>

this is cherry picked to hell

I agree, actually

Actually I am looking back in our hood and SirCakez had a completely different explanation over the night compared to 6709. They said that people were TMI on Sunflower being town the last day. They didn't even accuse me at all in the hood over night. In fact I talked about how I felt there were weird scumreads on me and SirCakez responded saying people were looking for places to pull scumreads out of. Not 100% on what that means but it doesn't seem to be suspicion.

VOTE: SirCakez

Cakez I'm interested in your response to this

Dunn either lied or was weirdly vague for some reason about the timeline because the thing he mentioned about when I said people were looking for places to pull scumreads out of happened during the day.

[Cat Scratch Fever]

Cakez's catch up reaffirmed my townread there after I started losing confidence in it

[Cat Scratch Fever]

@CSF, at your request:

Spoiler: the wall of Cakez

First of all, this vote sounds overconfident in a scummy way, and knowing Brian flips scum it's like super likely it was just TMI:

Now
VOTE: BRIAN SKIES

All of his posts sound like wet toilet paper being thrown at a wall. He's probably sad his teammates already decided to bus him.

(also timing is perfect for a bus considering this VC:)

VC 1.11

Brian 7 (Spiffeh, morph, marci, Lukewarm, Dunnstral, Sunflower, Pooky)
SirCakez 6 (CSF, Firebagel, STD, Brian, Shello, Dannflor)
Gypyx 3 (Penguin, Hermit, Bingle)
Sunflower 1 (Klick)
Pooky 1 (SirCakez)
Spiffeh 1 (Gypyx)
Bingle 1 (Firebringer)

Not voting (Oblivion, experience)

With 22 alive, it takes 12 to combust.

Deadline: (expired on 2024-05-09 04:07:00)

VOTE: cakez

Second thing:

AMA

can you elaborate more on the csf + hermit + morph + sunflower ones?

also did you wolfread morph at all before the luke case or did you read it and then apply it back if that makes sense?

- ydra

With CSF I get the vibe she is kinda following the crowd and there's not much original scumhunting going on. Her last two votes were Firebringer and me and both of those wagons were detailed and started by other players. and 2732 seems like it is again setting up another wagon hop. if you iso there's not a lot of actual scumhunting going on besides questioning other people's townreads and repeating talking points other people generated

Sunflower has some individual posts that pinged me, a lot of which were already called out in thread. 116 feels weirdly overwritten and not like real thoughts. 222 sounds kinda fake to me. 1226 gives me the same vibes as 116, idk if I'm just misreading the tone? like these reads feel very noncomittal and like they aren't backed up by anything. hmmm I will say after finishing the ISO re-read it wasn't as bad as I remembered, their posts have improved recently. i would probably put them in scummish instead of bottom scum on reevaluation.

Hermit has been irking me because they have been poking at me pretty much constantly from the "slip" moment and i feel like they are not trying to look at things from a neutral PoV and determining what alignment I am, they are trying to take what i post and fit it into scum!cakez boxes. there was more posting in the hood while i was reading that got me irked further by this but i also recognize im just annoyed with them right now so i don't think it's a route i'm gonna pursue today

Morph is kinda the same thing but I have other reasons to think they are scum aside from this pattern. I'm trying to just disregard the whole slip argument they made and write it off as NAI because i think it's really dumb and i don't have an objective take on it. In regards to your second question I would say I had some of these vibes from Morph before the Luke and Bingle arguments but they kind of crystallized what I was feeling into words. Like I remember while I was reading thinking that Bingle literally just wrote my mind down in this post:

Cabd’s posting feels like he’s trying to be sudsing things but not actually being sudsing things.

I'm also surprised they have not come at me more cutthroat-ly because I know especially Cabd is an absolute monster when it comes to dunking his scum reads and it seems like they bought into the slip argument against me pretty strong. I suspect it could be because they don't want to burn a lot of cred on my town flip, although that might be too surface-level of thinking but that's the Occam's Razor explanation

Cakez, care to put more words to your firebagel read?

She kinda gives me the same vibes as CSF but it's more egregious, like Shello said CSF has some posts that I can see some town motivation/thought process, but I'm not getting anything like that from Firebagel. Theres not really any original thought process at all, it's just following the consensus wagons again like CSF. I don't know who she is and I wish I did.

His read on you (CSF) sounds really bad faith, I think you are very towny tone-wise (I'm comparing you to datisi micor where you were town and to the large normals both of which you were scum, and it's obvious you are town), and I think that to scumread someone for sheeping other people is really silly, especially in a day 1 of a 22-player game.

The read on Sunflower here and the read on Firebagel both sound, tonewise and in general, like not actual thoughts that SirCakez has? They sound very performative like he's trying to come up with explanations of his read as he goes.

Also I just disliked his readlist in 2901.


As to coasting, IDK if it's like, super egregious, but his first few posts on start of day 2 definitely pinged me as coasting, and similar to posts Cakez has made when he was scum in Eminence in Shadow (pretty sure I've used this line as scum against town!Cakez in Creative Mafia but this time it's for real).

I actually don't dislike your case. Even if I disagree with the conclusion, I think you wrote this as town as the justification here seems pretty reasonable and touches on some of the reasons why I still harbor some doubt over Cakez's alignment

Though I did want to point out that I don't expect Cakez to know how to read me, no offense Cakez.

[Cat Scratch Fever]

Firebagel can you claim your results or at the very least explain why you refuse to do so

[Cat Scratch Fever]

petapan is good at the game yes but it is still possible to accurately town read good scum players and I think if you try to imagine what wolfbae’s goals would be as scum this game they don’t line up with his actions

Maybe my brain is too level 0 for this game, but if you think Cakez is scum, doesn't it make a lot of sense for wolf to kick up a fuss as scum here, esp if the traitor speculation is correct?

I don't really get why you were willing to sheep him earlier

[Cat Scratch Fever]

VOTE: Penguin

[Cat Scratch Fever]

I will say upfront: I saw votes on penguin and unless there is a more solid case than "not doing much", that is a bad wagon. While nothing he has done has made him solidly town, there are some minor things that make me doubt him being scum. It is still entirely possible he could be scum, but eliminating Penguin and having him flip town today helps nothing, and still leaves us with the same controversies we have today. It would be very likely game-losing. Don't create a shrugyeet.

Admittedly I didn't know Penguin was v/la, but the point about him not receiving any pressure in spite of skating by the whole game is salient

[Cat Scratch Fever]

I think wolfbae's point about marci not vociferously defending her top townread is fine. I didn't actually realize cakez was her

top

townread even though I just read her ISO earlier today

I guess my biggest hang up about the case is - do you expect Marci to be more effectively towncasing Cakez and convincing hearts and minds here? She doesn't really seem like that kind of player to me. She's repeated multiple times that she townreads cakez, and that's kind of all I expected her to do based on my impression of her....

[Cat Scratch Fever]

Spoiler:

Mostly because wolfbaes pushing him yes.

If wolfbae wasnt obvscum i would prob be voting dunnstral rn.

Just vote Dunn or Penguin, Wolfbae is not happening today. If he's scum it'll become more apparent down the line.

No! Why should I? Im voting who i believe is the scummiest. Im sure you guys dont need my help to wagon.

that's not how you play large games

Why hand over my vote to something i dont believe in! Bffr

see i feel like you're forcing it even now

I dont think ive ever openly voted something im not confident in. I much more prefer being confident with who im voting - or the most confident i can be

Marci does demonstrate a lack of interest in supporting a different counterwagon even though the primary elimination contender was shaping out to be her townread. Surely any counterwagon is preferable to Cakez fhpov at this point?

penguinpower is by far not my preffered elim.

i will 100% never vote cakez.

im fine with wolfbae or gypyx.

I saw someone mention danflor so im wondering is that fleeting thought or does anyone actually sr him?

Why not Penguin Power?

[Cat Scratch Fever]

Dunnstral's case is a little bit of taking the weakest of wolfbae's case and using it to push him instead of talking about the more meaty parts of the case

I actually agree if wolfbae is scum here, the rest of his post probably accurately describes his agenda, but that part doesn't sit right

[Cat Scratch Fever]

happy birthday STD!

[Cat Scratch Fever]

If he's scum it'll become more apparent down the line.

Interesting, SirCakez had a very different opinion on the last 2 dethy eliminations

I didn't understand this
(The link to the original quotedidn't get copied)

[Cat Scratch Fever]

Dunnstral's case is a little bit of taking the weakest of wolfbae's case and using it to push him instead of talking about the more meaty parts of the case

I actually agree if wolfbae is scum here, the rest of his post probably accurately describes his agenda, but that part doesn't sit right

What parts do you feel I haven't addressed?

I pointed to what I felt was scummy.

I feel like the listing out the number of people scumreading you was only a secondary point in the case. The primary point was that she should care more about defending Cakez over you because cakes is under much more pressure, which I think is definitely true given how this day has played out

Since you didn't say anything about it, it makes me think you didn't take issue with the highlight of the case

[Cat Scratch Fever]

Can we maybe kill outed scum sircakez before going back in the hood actually

How is Cakez outed?

[Cat Scratch Fever]

I promise to provide a read on Marci/Wolfbae situation in the next 5 hours but opening this game thread and reading all the really good points and well thought-out posts from a bunch of people who are currently on opposite sides of the game board, and having to decide which side is right and which is wrong, is making me want to go back to sleep.

this is very relatable lol

Mafia have a roleblocker because Firebringer claimed roleblocked on night 2

I don't think we can assume this as there isn't anyone else to corroborate that there is a roleblocker nor can we assume Firebringer is town

It is possible that Marci is a traitor and the mafia team still stole from her without knowing... or for like, wifom I guess, but that seems unlikely to me.

Or if you think Cakez is scum, marci could also be scum with Cakez

[Cat Scratch Fever]

I would vote Marci over Cakez I think, but the idea of voting within the dethy and potentially missing again fills me with dread

I don't really want to vote Dunn either, mainly because of his claim + this game feels scumsided so far with how little reliable info we have, I was expecting another investigative to be out there

[Cat Scratch Fever]

However if Firebringer is mafia you can replace roleblocker with announcing fortune teller and they are not a thief or a bookie

If I understand correctly, no one in the 6p hood (besides maybe Spiffeh but I still strongly townread him) can be either the thief or the bookie. Should we be eliminating outside the 6p hood today?

[Cat Scratch Fever]

Oh right there's no evidence he is compulsive

[Cat Scratch Fever]

However if Firebringer is mafia you can replace roleblocker with announcing fortune teller and they are not a thief or a bookie

If I understand correctly, no one in the 6p hood (besides maybe Spiffeh but I still strongly townread him) can be either the thief or the bookie. Should we be eliminating outside the 6p hood today?

I think SirCakez can be multitasking with the fruit.

Couldn't this argument be made for anyone though?

[Cat Scratch Fever]

VOTE: Firebringer

I just want to vote my top scumread.

The primary reason I have seen to townread Firebringer is that he is not enjoying this game, which I don't think is a good reason because i have seen people who generally prefer the Mafia alignment not enjoy a scum game here and there, including Firebringer. He already expressed his distaste for the morph-controlled gamestate in early day 1. He could also be faking disinterest while town ran around in circles idk.

I simply do not find his mason scumread believable. He has this strong, inexplicable scumread on Bingle, which I don't think he ever elaborated on. His justification for this persistent read is that the masons are still alive, even though invests are almost always a higher priority kill target than masons. Even more so in this case, as the masons are partly negative utility (this is assuming the fruit vending benefits scum more than town).

The part that has puzzled me is why does Firebringer do any of this as scum, which is valid. Others have pointed to various people (Dunn, primarily) for being overly content with the bad gamestate yesterday when Sunflower was the inevitable elimination. Another much less obvious way to avoid rocking the boat is to tunnel the mason claims, since no one was going to take that read seriously at that juncture. I think this looks worse for Firebringer in particular, because he has tacitly opposed to the Sunflower lim

[Cat Scratch Fever]

SirCakez can be one of those 3 while also being a multitasking Fruit Vendor to fit in with the hood.

Sorry I feel like you've explained this 3 times now but I still don't get why SirCakez multitasking is more likely that Firebringer multitasking.

[Cat Scratch Fever]

I don't remember if this was in the neighborhood or in the thread but someone linked a more recently completed scum game and this game and that one felt very different to me. There is an absence of the false bravado and pretending to not care in this game that I remember seeing a lot in Cakez's scum games.

Yes I agree with this especially the false bravado

[Cat Scratch Fever]

I was actually just reviewing that to try and find examples, and realized it was mostly his day 1 content that made me feel that way

He did a step back yesterday when he saw a post that made him doubt Sunflower and then try to case Oblivion, and I think that was the towniest thing that stood out to me in the last 2 game days.

I remember you said it was performative, and I suppose it could be, but I don't think that's something scum Cakez would do. He seems almost singularly focused on getting the day's miselimination as scum.

I think his reach out to STD to talk about Sunflower was also towny; Cakez seems to avoid this kind of discourse as scum.

[Cat Scratch Fever]

marci - don't townread anymore think all she has done can be faked as scum her. I think i gave her too little credit day one as others pointed out about what scum her is capable of
cakez - im neutral on but willing to yeet. Was just sheeping STD here tbh
yourself(dannflor) - u been floating in my consideration pile for awhile now. I get House of Dragons vibes from you every once in awhile when ur not doing much. Like your comfortable with the gamestate so you slide back into not doing much.

thats about where i am at with throwing my votes around right now. Ive put wolfbae in town just because he probably would just keep pushing marci here instead of giving up.

okay thanks i think ur probably town

What why?