Mafia 75: Return of the Mafia! TOWN WINS (really late)

[Imat]

Lloyd, looking through, admittedly, as little as I have, but seeing many things that concern me, I'd like to question your own vote hopping. First post you made was a random vote with no explanation. Now I hear you have changed votes, perhaps more than once, and once again failed to explain your vote at the time. It seems to me that you are throwing out votes to either protect yourself, because you are Mafia or the SK, or that you are trying to garner more votes because you are the Jester. Either way, you aren't Pro-Town as far as I've seen.

Nevertheless, I'll hold my vote until I thoroughly look through whats been posted.

[Imat]

Quite right, was gonna edit it out, but forgot, and another post would look rather pathetic...But still, evidence does seem to point towards Lloyd is some degree, though I'm still not done looking through posts...

[Imat]

I'm still sticking with Lloyd, I don't like how he votes, without any explanation, and while that may not be enough to kill him, he also changes his vote, again laving no explanation until pushed to do so. Seems like something a guilty person would do to me, just throw out blame and avoid taking it himself. And while that is what we are all doing, he seems to have done it more than most. Therefore...

Vote: Lloyd

[Imat]

I suggested Jester because its a dangerous role, however we can't worry about a Jester until we have some sort of proof of that. As Townies, our only power as a group is the lynch, so having a role that reverses that into a negative causes me to hold my tongue. However, I find it unlikely that Jester's are played often (I wouldn't really know, just guessing based on other comments). Therefore I disregarded my statement. I think, while the chance is there, the odds of having a Jester in this game are minimal and therefore we can vote, not so much safely, but more securely.

Also, I am a newb to this forum, so I don't really see the point of random voting. See if someone gets defensive, perhaps? I think we should make every vote count, otherwise what good is having said vote?

[Imat]

I suggested Jester because its a dangerous role, however we can't worry about a Jester until we have some sort of proof of that.

Then why the heck bring it up in the first place?

Because you can never disregard a role completely, thats just a bad move in general. So I'm saying we should realize that there is the possibility, however unlikely, of a Jester, but that we can't let that stop us from trying to find the real killers here.

And, now thats its been described, I do see the point of random voting a tiny bit. However, I still feel it has its own major drawbacks.

[Imat]

My opinion on the Jester talk: I'd prefer we avoid discussing the possibility until someone appears to be one.

Exactly what I was trying to get at, I was just hounded for moving to slowly in that direction. Anyways, Lloyd has somewhat redeemed himself in my eyes, so I believe I'll need much more concrete evidence before voting again...As long as we're out of this random voting stage, that is.

[Imat]

Just a question, which may or may not be better put in another part of the forum, what does FoS stand for? The S is probably Scum, but I can't figure out the rest...

[Imat]

Ah, I see. Well, thats something I haven't picked up from the other forums...

[Imat]

It seems to me that armix has been hounding BM for awhile, even though, in my opinion, BM has answered each question satisfactorily. What I don't see is armix being questioned for his overzealousness in this particular lynch, where, as its been stated, a townie is more likely to be lynched than our true enemy, the Mafia. Care to comment on this at all armix?

[Imat]

I just feel like you are hounding somebody down with obvious intent to kill when he may not be lying about being the Miller. It may not be the best strategy for a Miller to reveal himself, but its not the worst either. I'm saying that BM has satisfactorily answered every question given him and yet you still fight tooth and nail for his lynch. His behavior also doesn't seem as scummy as you obviously think, Scum would tend to avoid some of the questions posed to him, as you have done on occasion. My point is, you are looking scummier than BM IMO. You may not be Mafia either, but you need to answer more of the questions people are starting to ask about you before I can give any kind of answer to that.

[Imat]

Well, I now have no clue who to vote for, so I'll continue to watch these debates. The only people who worry me now are the ones who don't post much.

Also, I believe I forgot to do this,

Unvote

[Imat]

Armix, you are beginning to look Scummy again. The minute the pressure leaves you you attack BM with all you've got. However, unlike last time, I won't jump to your vote right away. I'll keep watching people's responses and see what happens. However,

FoS: Armlx

[Imat]

I guess I skipped over the part where nano was under suspicion. I'll have to go and reread that. For now, however, I maintain the last vote I made, which I'm pretty sure was unvote, and my suspicions of armlx.

[Imat]

Agreed.

FoS: Rosso Carne

For jumping on a bandwagon first thing when its already later into the first day. Suspicious, if you ask me, though not enough to warrant a vote.

[Imat]

Also, whats the Votecount

Mod

?

[Imat]

Explain, Khel, how what you just posted is any different. You want to hop on the Imat bandwagon should it come up later.

Also, I didn't vote Rosso because I see where the suspicion is in his post, but it isn't nearly enough to doom him. Other players have been much more suspicious, mainly armlx IMO, so I actually voted them. One comment and a bandwagon vote do NOT warrant a vote, as Khel seems to think. If he continues to act suspicious, then yes, I will vote for him, but as it is he makes one post, not enough to show his intentions or alignment, so I simply wanted to apply pressure to get him to speak up. Think what you want of that, but I won't vote him without more scummy behavior.

[Imat]

Agreed.

FoS: Rosso Carne

For jumping on a bandwagon first thing when its already later into the first day. Suspicious, if you ask me, though not enough to warrant a vote.

Explain to me how this being an FoS instead of a vote makes your post any less suspicious than the one you are FoSing Rosso for, seing as how, content-wise, they are otherwise almost identical.

Sry, misread the question. To answer it, its not any less suspicious, and looking back I really could've worded it better to explain it. However, I believe I explained my reasoning above, so take a look at that for my reasoning behind the FoS.

[Imat]

I could've sworn I was "echoing" Khel, and that issue has already been resolved, though I'd also like to hear what Rosso has to say in explanation of that last comment...

[Imat]

Nope, it was definitely Khel who said it. BM was speaking of another player, not you.

[Imat]

Also, lashing out at somebody when suspicions are thrown on yourself is something I'd expect scum to do...Now you have something more to explain to Rosso, and it doesn't help that you were already suspected.

[Imat]

It'd be A FoS, neither FoS nor Finger start with a vowel. And I agree, killa seven changing the wording is suspicious, if it was on purpose. I can't prove that, and unless you can, I won't even FoS him without some explanations from him.

[Imat]

I know GSGold was replaced in another game I'm in, so probably no luck there. Don't know about the others though, I hope this game ain't falling apart...

[Imat]

Hes jumping on too many bandwagons without any explanation. This is beginning to look like an easy lynch, if he doesn't explain his most recent vote.

[Imat]

I'd say at this point that Nano is no longer a lurker but a mia player.

Killa Seven has been around from day 1, however, and has said some things before his most recent posts that I'm not sure about. I'll look back and see if I can dig up some of his earlier posts, but right now oEJo seems the most scummy. Even early in the game he only surfaced when called out, contributing not as much as I'd like, and he made one or two comments which particularly struck me. I'll look back for those as well, let him answer to them.

[Imat]

He does say kill everytime instead of vote, but hes said it before with no daytime killer result from the mod, so he has no special daytime powers. Vote restriction to kill instead of vote would be pointless...

[Imat]

Hes switching wagons, something we've called others on...However, tlp is probably a better wagon than nano for the simple reason that hes actually here...

But, seeing as how I'm going to jump on, just to keep him from ducking under this one, I need something more finite than what you all are throwing out. To add to it, I question why he says "I don't want a deadline and no lynch," but proceeds to delay the game by unvoting. Seems like a contradiction, paired with his quick retraction of the vote under pressure, it looks like a Scum move.

Vote: Tlp

However, oEJo has continued looking Scummy by trying to stay off of the Wagon. Either hes waiting for more people to drop down the hammer or he wants to avoid voting fellow Scum, either way his post seems like a Scum tactic.

If I haven't already,

FoS: oEJo

[Imat]

Sorry, I think I need to

UnVote

,

Vote: Tlp

. If that makes a difference due to old votes.

[Imat]

Please, no more votes. We still have many to go, but my vote was for pressure, not a quick lynch. Get us a

Vote Count!!!!

!

[Imat]

Wagons work much better when the person responds to them. Has anybody seen Tlp since we started the wagon or should we ask for a prod?

[Imat]

Well, he hasn't really responded to the Wagon, which makes the Wagon much less useful. Now, instead of gaining insight into Tlp's role, we just gain useless side arguments. I don't like that. I'm not asking for a lynch, just pressure, which can be used to gather unknown details about players. Without the target of the bandwagon responding, it falls apart and we're left back where we started.

[Imat]

But he has a role that is easily proven. So he is a Power-Role. Perhaps hes tired of all the attention. Perhaps that in itself is Scummy. This is an interesting turn for you, Matt.

[Imat]

BM pretty much said everything relevant about the Matt S case, but something else of note was that all the people voting TLP were fairly scummy to start with.

6 (now 7 i think) of us are all fairly scummy? Let's see some evidence of that please.

He meant that most (Since he corrected this) of the people, including myself, have been called out for Scummy behavior at some point in this game. Its kind of a stretch to say that all Scum will vote the easy vote, but its a valid point nonetheless. However, Tlp still hasn't really explained himself, instead choosing more of the martyr approach. Not a complete martyr approach, but there is a vague hint of it in his post 610. But, more importantly, he wants a quicklynch to escape the deadline which hasn't even been mentioned by anyone else. Could be a Scumtell, could be fear of a no lynch. However, his inability to explain his reasoning very well has led me to keep the pressure on him. I don't think he needs many more votes, if any, to coax answers out of him, but for now I see no better candidate. That is, unless EJ does something truly dripping with Scumtells.

[Imat]

Rosso has tipped everybody's Scumometer. I haven't really decided if he Scum or just making many mistakes that he shouldn't be. Too eager for the Kill (Lynch), contradicting himself, practically asking for votes. However, I'm fine with a Tlp wagon still because his attempts at explaining himself still don't satisfy me. Townie claim is rather weak, not really a Scumtell unless he wants to play it safe. In a game this large, however, Power Roles are far more common, so a Power claim would be safe...It seems I've just talked myself out of the BW, I've explained his actions far better than he has...

Unvote: Tlp

Still, I'm not so sure about Rosso, his eagerness would be a stupid Scum mistake, not a Scumtell.

[Imat]

Of all the players, BM, why did you choose killa seven specifically? I've read suspicions about Ninja and Armlx as well, I don't see why you picked out seven from the group.

[Imat]

Ummm...What? Back this up somehow? Explanation at all? This looks like a degradation into random voting again...

[Imat]

...Can we please stop the randomness we've fallen back into? BM had a reason to vote lloyd, to try and catch Scum. killa fell into his trap, as did two others, but BM thought killa to be the most Scummy. So he voted killa, simple as that. Its also possible, knowing BM's other trap, that asking farside to vote killa was another trap. Perhaps he was looking at farside to see if he'd be easy to sway the vote of, perhaps marking him as someone who wants a quick lynch, somebody usually anti-town.

Thats was kind of how I took it, though BM may have had other reasons. Scum won't ask each other for votes, and even if they did, they wouldn't vote the same way when asked. Number one way to expose yourself as Scum: Vote with Scum or give your vote to the quickest Lynch.

[Imat]

...Can we please stop the randomness we've fallen back into? BM had a reason to vote lloyd, to try and catch Scum. killa fell into his trap, as did two others, but BM thought killa to be the most Scummy. So he voted killa, simple as that. Its also possible, knowing BM's other trap, that asking farside to vote killa was another trap. Perhaps he was looking at farside to see if he'd be easy to sway the vote of, perhaps marking him as someone who wants a quick lynch, somebody usually anti-town.

Thats was kind of how I took it, though BM may have had other reasons. Scum won't ask each other for votes, and even if they did, they wouldn't vote the same way when asked. Number one way to expose yourself as Scum: Vote with Scum or give your vote to the quickest Lynch.

You, my friend, are VERY perceptive.

Which goes against everything he has done so far. Good learner.

I don't know what to say to this...I think BM was being sarcastic, but that could just be me being paranoid. I think armlx was being sarcastic as well, but not so much jokingly but in a "That may point him out as scum" way. Again, could be paranoia, I have trouble knowing when people are being sarcastic when praising me...Character flaw, if you will.

Anyways, Lloyd's vote counter was both overly large and underly telling. The fact that he bothered to make the list gives me a slightly greater Town read from him, but the fact that it wouldn't tell us anything unless somebody had voted with every single wagon doesn't really give cause to post it, giving me cause to suspect Lloyd of trying to appear a hunter while posting nothing of value. Pretty much eliminates the alignment of the entire post.

Rosso still doesn't make large posts, I don't understand why the pressure left him. Because he didn't post enough of an explanation to make a wagon interesting?

Still, I don't really know about the killa wagon. Perhaps I just missed something. I'll have to reread his posts or something. Or, if anybody else wants to explain their suspicions, I'll look into those specifically. Either way I'm going to reread him, so I'll get back to you all.

[Imat]

Killa 7: First post says hes drunk and can't post for that and because he hasn't caught up. A day later, posts another one sentence post, misinterpreting rosso and voting him at the same time. 3 days later (And a few hours),

wait. You think we have a second recruiter? or just that the recruiting is delayed?

Confused

BM

well next to his name it says "delayed" cult recruiter so that seems like what it is

Which neither answers the question (Two were posed), or is a correct analysis. 4 days later says hes been gone for two days, ignores all discussion, wants us to calm down on "Vig talk," and questions oEJo's vote (Which he already explained, somewhat poorly I might add). 1 Hour later realizes oEJo's reason for the vote and agrees with it. 2 more days and he wants an explanation of why oEJo's logic doesn't make sense. 6 days later says why BM's miller claim is Scummy but, without anything to back it up, says BM is Town. 4 days later (I hope I'm not off on this), takes everybody else's evidence and says simple "I told you (Ross) was guilty." A day later says that BM wants a wagon on him just because hes new but doesn't answer the suspicions placed on him (Even though, in the same post, he says "Anybody have any questions for me?"). 1 Minute later: Agrees that he hasn't posted much and will try to talk more. 7 hours later: Minimizes his "Told you he was guilty" comment by calling it a joke, maintains he didn't change the wording of BM's "Crack under pressure" comment, and continues his "Any questions for me?" without answering to earlier suspicions. 2 days later wants an explanation of EJ's vote on him. 3 Days later posts a random quote from EJ and says "Ummm...Ok." Proceeds to say that he forgot a quote and hopes no one gets confused...Which we all were. 2 days later laughs at the "And a Claimed Miller shall lead them..." 5 Days later explains that his vote has always been on Rosso and asks where hes been. 2 Days later: His infamous jump to the Lloyd wagon. Still little explanation of this or the Rosso vote. 7 hours (Or so) later calls BM out on changing Farside's vote so easily, big OMGUS. Hasn't posted since.

Fattierob: Votes himself? The heck? First post too...replaced by andycyca for future reference.

WhoMe?: Votes himself #682

Lloyd: Votes himself #683

Both of which are jokes BTW.

Page 29: Forever stretched out by Lloyd.

So, I have my analysis of killa 7. His random vote for Rosso (I think we can assume random, it was fairly early on) and his later vote on Lloyd had little to nothing in the way of explanation. He also carefully avoided answering to suspicions against him while still asking "Any questions for me?" Also, his time between posts may be an attempt at lurking. Finally, and this worries me the most about him, he promised more in the way of post length before his Lloyd vote but has yet to post much in any of his posts, at most one line (Excluding purposely placed breaks). I haven't really seen any analysis from him, just his vote on Rosso without explanation and his vote on Lloyd without explanation. Scum hunting from killa? Relatively nonexistent.

Vote: Killa Seven

There. Answer to those suspect actions killa and then you may not have anymore "Questions" to answer to.

[Imat]

Shoot, didn't do that quote right. I wonder what I did wrong? Probably forgot the second [/quote]

Fixed

[Imat]

kaleidoscope, not to burden us with even more walls of text, but could you please give reasoning? a Scum ticker doesn't tell us your thoughts at all, nor does it allow people to properly defend themselves if you misunderstood something. So, at least give us your thoughts on Armlx that paint him as Scum to you.


Also, if killa 7 is MIA, my big post of bigness holds true for his replacement, the replacement is responsible.

[Imat]

Only explanation I have for Lloyd's recent miller masons comment is that...Masons vote together, and since you have his vote to use as well, and you are a claimed Miller, Lloyd becomes a Miller Mason? Other than that, I can't make heads or tails of why anybody would post a comment like that except to claim...

Can a Mason even be a Miller? Or vise versa?

[Imat]

Ok, not that everyone has the same opinion, but I'm really getting tired of people hiding behind the Meta. How people play the game takes a conscious effort. Therefore its not all too difficult to change the way you play. There's no possible way you can disregard Scumminess on the wisdom that "This is just how they play." So What? If thats how they play, lynch them every game. Scumminess should not and can not be ignored because thats just how they play. If they're lynched for playing like that, lesson learned. If not, we come to this situation where they could act as Scummy as they want and people will DEFEND them. Meta is NO excuse not to lynch. For all of you who believe Meta is equivalent to the Bible of Mafia, you're only making it harder for the Town to win. So please, lose the Meta idea that seven and Rosso, or any other player for that matter, are untouchable, it should not be considered at all in this lynch. And, back to my comment that play style can change: If they play as Town and act a certain way, whats stopping them from acting that same way as Scum with the knowledge that people will see this and say "Hey, they must be Town again." The only the holding them back is their own intelligence, and to insult that would be condescending. In other words, they ain't dumb, don't treat them as such.

And armlx, what about those two comments makes them "Good posting?" Do you have nothing of your own to add?

[Imat]

Ok, Khel, to answer to your post:

First, it does make sense that lynching them for Scummy behavior would end it. You wouldn't act in a way that gets you lynched without fail. If they're Town, they'll be better players in the future. Not saying thats a great outcome now, but perhaps in a future game you'll thank people who didn't pay attention to Meta. If they're Scum, they'll be better on both sides as well. This is what I'm hoping for, but not necessarily what'll happen.

Second, how do you know they're Town? Doesn't it make sense that if everybody expected you to act Scummy and so passed you off as Town, you'd continue to act Scummy as Scum? What I meant with my post was that we Can't judge their alignment based solely upon Meta. In fact, I meant that Meta shouldn't affect it at all. We should look at how they act, regardless of Meta, and put pressure on them to play less Scummy if they are Town or lynch them if they are Scum. I explained that play style can be changed as easily as it is created, if not more easily, so we can't form any arguments based on Meta. Every single argument based on Meta is inherently flawed. That is what I was trying to get at, and I think I succeeded. If you still have confusion, I'll try and explain specific parts.

Also, why I think killa IS Scum: He doesn't hunt at all. He makes a one sentence post every few days and gets away with it. Nowhere in these posts does he explain the votes he has given or provide evidence against another player. When questioned about this, he retreats into a "Any questions for me?" stance and refuses to comment on others tells. Strong Scum evidence.

Why others think he is Town: Because he's acting Scummy, he must be Town. Its how he plays.

Which one is more convincing?

[Imat]

But, if you get lynched enough for a certain behavior, won't you say to yourself, "Self? Should I maybe change my play style to be less Scummy?" I'm operating on the assumption that people can and will learn from their mistakes. If you get lynched for Scumminess enough, you won't act Scummy anymore. Its a learning process.

Besides, if they aren't lynched for Scumminess, they have the best cover for acting Scummy ever.

I'm not saying this doesn't have its drawbacks, but its certainly not a bad plan for learning up the players.

[Imat]

Unvote

The request being don't act so Scummy?

Claiming vig is interesting, especially after all the talks of who the vig should kill...Coincidence? we'll find out tonight, I suppose.

Well, next on my list was either oEJo or, much less happy with this lynch, rosso. oEJo would have to be my top suspect, but we'll wait for replacement.

[Imat]

Hmmm...Interesting development in farside...

Not Vig, first of all.

If Farside is the Vig...I don't think he should've claimed. Now we can lynch killa and he may by the vig, then Farside gets a kill and is lynched. 2 potential Townies to get at one SK?

Or we could let both live and they'll probably target each other...Still a Vig down, which I don't like.

I'm not saying Farside is lying, but claiming doesn't seem to be the best plan IMO.

[Imat]

Wait, what? Are you saying Farside is Scum now? I would've thought you'd call her the SK, not all the way to Scum...

[Imat]

I agree, Peers has acted hasty. However, thats a null IMO. I'm sure you realize why, and I don't really feel like pointing it out on the extremely small chance that Scum don't get it. Also, I'm lazy like that...

And BM, I was under the assumption that Mafia was Scum and SK's were something else entirely. But I suppose anything Anti-Town could be Scum. Now I know firsthand what happens when I assume...

[Imat]

Gah, I fell behind...I left off at like 2nd for the motion, I need to take all this in. Anything important happen that I missed?

[Imat]

Woah, Killa, what did you mean by the role blocked comment? Did I miss a Mafia Roleblocker claiming or was this a slipup from you? I mean, it doesn't matter seeing as how the general consensus is for your lynch, but if you are Mafia and not a roleblocker this is very telling of what kind of roles your partners may have.

And I'm rather certain the viggee isn't a real role. So far Lloyd has jokingly claimed as a Mason Miller and a viggee, going anywhere with these claims?

[Imat]

I believe BM said not to waste an Investigation on him because he's a Miller, not a roleblock. In fact, I'm not sure BM ever mentioned RBing anybody at all...I'm not quite sure where this came from.

And TS, that better have been a joke...

[Imat]

I have no idea what you two are on about, but I'll let that go for now. However, I want an explanation of what, exactly, a cult cop is. Many of you seem to think its a Cop who gets guilty on Cult, but I'm more of the persuasion that he is a Cultist who retains his Investigative powers.

And a guilty on BM doesn't make him any less nulled than before. Scum also come up guilty, or at least Mafia do, so saying hes more innocent now because a Cop got a guilty on him is false. Which is exactly what we discussed much of Day 1.

[Imat]

Not much of Rosso's play makes sense.

But, you bring up an excellent point. I see which option the Cult Cop is, thanks for clearing that up. Even Rosso wouldn't play that bad.

[Imat]

Sorry for another delay. As I'm saying in all games, I'll have to read what I've missed and relay my thoughts when I'm ready. Lost my internet for a week.

[Imat]

And herein lies the problem Rosso. You don't post enough for your own good. You got away with little content Day 1 but the games has stepped up a bit. Join in the Hunting. I myself haven't done very well this game, but I'm hoping to change that over the next few game days. If you can make a decent length post defending yourself I'm sure some of the less certain players on your case will back off. When that happens you can prove your worth to the us by making larger, more detailed posts more often, participating in the Hunting as it were. If you were to participate more you could easily lower people's suspicions of you. Most of them are based on inactivity and willingness to hammer people, no matter what.

[Imat]

...Didn't this same thing happen yesterday? And didn't much good come of it? So why question it now? Honestly, staying in the day phase is a GOOD thing people. Peers's constant need for night is really starting to look bad. It could mean a couple of different things, but I'm leaning more towards the Scum side for him.

If any other short day advocates wish to know why we're delaying, just look at the previous day. Also, and this is very important as well, we're not all sold on Rosso Scum.

I, personally, am undecided on his claim. I'm leaning more towards Town for him, kind of because of the obvious question, "Why would Scum act so stupidly with the Claim?" Of course, that leads into WIFOM. But his response to his wagon I felt was good. What I don't like is the fact that I told him to participate more and he has yet to do so. I can't imagine him surviving much longer without explaining himself and helping in the Hunting aspect of this game, but for now I'm happy letting him be. We have plenty of time left in this day, plenty of unheard voices and such. Lets delay as long as possible, the best thing we can do right now is keep discussion going.

[Imat]

Here's why I thought Rosso's response to the wagon on him was good: He didn't mindlessly attack another player in order to save himself. I've seen Scum do it plenty before. I felt his response of "I tried to claim, I tried to help, but people still went after me" was more Town than Scum, though I suppose thats opinion isn't it.

[Imat]

Many of them are nonresponsive, I've already stated my reasons for opposing the Rosso lynch. Certainly they aren't good, glad dahill picked up on that, but they are what they are. I just don't think Rosso is as worthy of a lynch as you all seem to think. Also, I'm not fine ending the day yet. I think we have all this time to do what we want, look into who we want, that we shouldn't waste it by ending the day early. Yeah, night things will give us information, but so does discussion, and we'd be stupid not to take all the information we can get.

[Imat]

FoS: Skitzer

for the exact vig-leading that has gotten us into trouble two nights in a row and which others had asked to stop mear posts before. Honestly, I feel we shouldn't discuss vig targets, its gotten us into trouble more often than not...Also, what happened yesterday when we also asked for a halt of vig-leading? I'm looking back at those who threw out names, see if there's a common thread.

[Imat]

K-Scope, why do you think TSPN is Scum? I may have missed some big post of reasoning on your part, but I doubt it.

Instead I find it likely that you're content to lay low and follow the lead of other. Honestly, I can't see much Pro-Town about your last two posts, and I'm starting to think that assessment will hold true if I reread you. Can you, therefore, post YOUR suspicions of TSPN that lead you to ignore the trend of the past few days (Finding Scum then delaying the Hammer to try and find others) and try to rush yet another lynch (Noting that I'm not saying hes the one who pushed each lynch, necessarily)? Then, just to give us an idea of where you're standing, can you perhaps give a name for an alternate suspect or two of yours...Unless you only suspect TSPN of being Scum, that is.

[Imat]

What is your position on vigging BM?

It's a waste of a kill.

I disagree here. I think it could easily confirm BM's role. Also, the way the Vigs have been going lately tells us we need to change something. I'd say that this is actually the most logical use of the Vig tonight, or at least the safest.

[Imat]

I'm thinking I need to catch up again, especially with questions posed at me...I'm also starting to think some kinda force is trying to drive us apart, trying to break our focus. Don't get me wrong, I'm perfectly fine with people making cases. However, the timing of it, when BM, CKD, and TS, three of the top suspects, are being heavily looked into, seems suspicious to me. I think we may need to take a good long look at those diverting our attention with a weak case...Not to mention those players who offer no input whatsoever but still vote people. Yes, Peers, I'm looking at you. I'll have to reread Tar's case, but I'm almost looking at it with suspicion when her input on other, more suspect players, is somewhat lacking.

[Imat]

Mod:

Given the lage number of plyers in this game and the relative frequency of posts, I would like to declare that I'll be away for the next few weeks due to tests and whatnot. If you deem this as too long, I'll gladly allow myself to be replaced, at your discretion. If no, I'll be back as soon as my schedule clears up again.

[Imat]

EBWOP: If not**

[Imat]

Two, should be. Anymore and complications have ensued...