Magician's Mafia: The Hypnotists, Game Over

[Tasky]

howdy everybody.
I replace animorpherv1. I skimmed quickly over the thread and it will take me a little to reread everything.
will post a catch up post as soon as I can

[Tasky]

ok. I reread the whole game a second time.
as soon as possible I will post a catch up post

[Tasky]

Ok, so here comes my big catch up. I am going to do this chronologically starting from beginning of day 2. I am going to analyze certain things on day 1 on request but it just get's too much otherwise.

• GhostWriter 335/336: you know what they say about the "well-that-sucks-tell", right?
  
• Katsuki 338: slight scumtell. useless comment and goes in the "w-t-s" too.
  
• Katsuki 340: the "vote for stretching" part is just awful. first impression of Katsuki already is scum now.
  
• Toogeloo 341: the first paragraph is total bullshit. the rest of the case on Seraphim is solid, but he hasn't done anything REALLY scummy. I'd really like to hear a defense though and do agree that he is the worst lurker.
  
• I'm not going to comment on Raz unless I see a connection with another player.
  
• Ellibereth 353: What do you mean with the "Black Mists's entire Iso"-thing. haven't seen any ISO on him by you.
  
• Black Mist 357: This post really looks horrible
  a priori
  . If is AtE. But I kind of understand her and I don't think her attitude is scummy. Black Mists, I'd like you to start actually scumhunting. You may have a different playing style, that doesn't necessarily mean your conclusions have to be wrong. I'd just want to hear those conclusions.
  
• Ellibereth 359: I don't think I like this post. You really seem serious about Black Mist. I fully understand the
  theory
  behind it, but I also think you have to see what's ACTUALLY happening. Black Mist
  could
  be scum, I am not denying that. I just don't think she is scum
  because
  of her current playing style
  
• GhostWriter 366: I start disliking how GW continues to post the obvious and try too look like he put much effort into it.
  
• danakillsu 368: what you are
  saying
  is total bullshit. that "excuse to kill a townie" - thing just makes no sense. BUT I felt too that something was fundamentally wrong with the D1 hammer. Wouldn't know what, though. Maybe it will emerge later
  
• Toogeloo 370: Well, technically it's OMGUS. And I absolutely do not like the "Too quite" - line.
  
• Antihero 372: please explain this post a little better. I absolutely did not understand your reasons behind it.
  
• Razgriz 373: I
  could
  see this as a scum-bus. I'll have to do an analysis on Razgriz's voting pattern though to really judge that.
  
• GhostWriter 378: hmm. I do not know what this whole coaching is supposed to be. we are not in a newbie game. But it does make me feel a little better about you, because I felt like doing something similar some minutes ago. Don't know you though, maybe you coach as scum too.
  
• Toogeloo 379: This post does not feel right at all. First I think it's scummy in general to talk to someone else as if they were an authority. It's definitely a form of buddying. Also I find your early claim-fish scummy here.
  
• danakillsu 386: Why the hell are you claiming so early? You are definitely NOT making you look more pro-town to me.
  
• Ellibereth 392: If you are so sharp as you claim, how comes you haven't caught Raz yet. I know it's easy to talk after the flip, but he was REALLY scummy.
  
• Ellibereth 394: See, you saw Raz's scummyness (at least it looks that way). I don't understand why you kept him out of your suspects. Didn't want to lose your scumbuddy without fight?
  
• Razgriz 398: I lol'd at this post.
  
• Katsuki 399: I kinda like this post. makes me feel better about you again. but weren't you
  already
  voting Raz?
  
• danakillsu 401: this post looks extremely forced. scummy.
  
• Razgriz 402 doesn't look like a bus to me, actually.
  
• Katsuki 409/MPR 414: Why would he claim early D1? Is that how you would play as Miller? Why?
  
• Toogeloo 419: Trying to save your buddy? I totally do not understand how you can really believe what you said. considering you also brought evidence
  against
  your own point in the post after. scum-points for you, dude.
  
• Toogeloo 450: It starts to really get scummy how much you focus on lurkers.
  
• Toogeloo 454: The third paragraph is really scummy. You are contradicting yourself badly. on one side you say we should hunt for the worst lurker, on the other side you think there is scum to be found in the active players.
  
• Toogeloo 459: That seraphim-martyr-story is just nonsense, why don't you just drop it?
  
• danakillsu 477: You are far from cleared, but I don't think you should be our lynch today.
  
• Katsuki 491: Why are you in such a hurry to lynch?
  
• Ellibereth 492: You are aware that the last time you posted a similar analysis you were NOT saying to vote Raz?
  
• GhostWriter 500 looks terrible anxious. that is a slight scumtell in my eyes.

Conclusion:
I think dana is playing bad. I actually don't think he is so confirmed scum as someone pretends him to be. However, I DO think that Toogeloo is scum. The evidence I showed is slim, I know, but I think it is absolutely not to dismiss. additionally something about him just doesn't add up; call it a feeling but I really do not get a town-read from him.
Also I do not Ellibereth as so confirmed town as you all seem to do. He started the "sheep me or die"-attitude in a Fate-ish manner but it somehow felt forced to me, especially as he hasn't really been consequent about it. I have no real reasons for believing him to be scum, but I also have absolutely no town-reads from him.

[Tasky]

• MPR 509 DO NOT DARE TO QUOTE ME AGAIN! Btw: I do not agree with you. I don't think Miller should claim early (at least not always).
  
• Ghostwriter 510... look here. 500 was anxious becouse you feared to get attacked for quoting. so you wanted to show how much you were angry at yourself
  
• Toogeloo 512:
  -> I do not think scum would lie just to not have a night kill analyzed, considering there wasn't much to analyze anyway
  -> Oh sorry about that "too quite" thing. I thought you meant it as a scumtell againt danakillsu
  -> You can ask a specific players opinion without showing that you are sure they are town. You never know. You better do not take the pressure away so quickly. Additionally, couldn't you have just spoken to the town in general? And then, I can't really see how GhostWriter is so confirmed town you make it look.
  -> Well, stop WIFOM'ing then.
  -> I'm too pissed by lurkers, but that doesn't make them necessarily scum. There are players who don't like to be town and therefore post less. Or players who simply have RL-issues. Or players who flaked totally independently of alignment.
  -> I see Seraphim as the worst lurker. That doesn't mean he is scum. Just that he is lurking most and in the most anti-town way.
  -> lol. is that something you are proud of?
  -> Re: Re: Conclusion: Yeah, you are right: VOTE: Toogeloo
  
• @Mod
  : is the semi-quoting thing Toogeloo did in post 512 considered quoting?

[Tasky]

• danakillsu 521: I somehow see some strange things in Katsuki and while I was rereading he was the first that seemed a little scummy. But somehow his later play put him back to null again for me. I accept you case, I think it ought not to be dismissed. I just feel more comfortable with voting Toogeloo right now.
  
• Cogito Ergo Sum 529: I really want more than just the vote there.
  
• Budja 533: What do you mean by "unopposed wagon". How do you exclude that MPR's vote on Raz was bussing? Why don't you think it's likely?
  
• Toogeloo 535:
  -> well, acting antitown isn't optimal play if you are town.
  -> Why do think I am town? What about my intro-post was so townish, considering I "misrepresented at least 3 people"
  -> What exactly is you case on Cogito?
  -> Do YOU believe Dana is town? or are you just sheeping the masses? I yes, what made you change your mind?
  ==> I'll stick with my vote on Toogeloo. your post hasn't made anything at all that I would consider townish.

To all:
1. MORE TOOGELOO VOTES PLEASE
2. KEEP ACTIVITY UP. THIS GAME IS TOO COOL TO LET IT DIE.

[Tasky]

@Toogeloo

no wait. I think you didn't understand what I said:
you stated that being antitown and town is not bad play, so I said that it isn't optimal. this is a stylistic device used to convey that it is in fact bad play.

>> I said you "looked" town. <<
lol. I know you didn't declare me town. the question still stands: Why do I LOOK town to you?

>> So, who's tunneling now, hmm? <<
You call

this

tunneling?
lol.

@Katsuki

shouldn't it be "dana first, then seraphim, then toogo" then?
Do you think Toogeloo is scum?
why are you posting in caps?

[Tasky]

I really don't like Elli's attitude here.
DO YOU THINK DANA IS TOWN, YES OR NO?

[Tasky]

dana-wagon is fail wagon.

accepted votes:
Toogeloo
Katsuki
Ellibereth

[Tasky]

HEY, GUYS! STOP THIS NONSENSE!
there is absolutely no use to quicklynch dana
additionally I get town vibes from him.
considering the speed of the wagon, I conclude there has to be some scum on it

e.g. I absolutely don't like Elli's flipflopping (dana is scum, dana is town, dana is town, dana is town, vote dana)

Ellibereth 561: Why is sheeping Katsuki good play? Do you think he is town? Why?
Budja 562: What exactly do you agree with? That we ought to sheep Katsuki? Why? So basically you are sheeping Elli who is sheeping Katsuki?

DAMN, WAKE UP!!

also I feel dana's last worries about Hypnosis to be sincere.

PS: Black Mist, if you are still in this game, POST! I wanna see your comments on this matter

[Tasky]

Re: Ellibereth 572, show me then. just because everybody is in the set {people who THINK to see something}+{scum} it doesn't mean dana is scum. How do you explain your flip flop there? ANSWER MY QUESTIONS. YOUR CAPS ARE NOT GOING TO GET YOU AROUND THEM!
Re: Toogeloo 573, I don't understand the second part of your statement? you see what everyone's on about, dana should go

regardless

(

?huh?

)
Re: DGB 574, yes. But why do YOU think it?

[Tasky]

10.)

If you notice there has been a lynch, stop posting.

[Tasky]

Re: SpyreX 583

"Mos Def at least 1 of (Kat, CEG, DGB) are scum. As per D1"

I think I can agree with that. not much gained though, since we are 10 players and assuming 4 scum (which seems reasonably considering they are the only anti-town faction) there are 3 left. so there is one scum every 3,33 players.

"After Raz's AWESOME STATEMENT that I can't believe you went along with I'll put money on there being a split D2 leaving (Anti, Ghost, MPR, Elli, TOG) / (SpyreX, Katsuki, DrippingGoofball, Tasky, Cogito Ergo Sum) as the split."

what awesome statement are you talking about.

"D3 I dont even know you chuckleheads. Why, lord, why. I'm thinking we're looking at a 1/1 split again (Anti, SpyreX, Ghost, Tasky) / (Kat, MPR, GES, Elli, DGB, Toog).

Now, comes the fun part:
Tasky is town.
Ghost is town.
That means the D3 Split points at Anti. Which, oddly enough, was one of my picks before I did this analysis (yea, you can't "trust" that. yea, you can also shut it)."

I am totally not sold on this split thing. I can agree that the day two split probably has 2:1 (or 1:2) scum, but I totally don't think it is impossible for the two that all scum were on the wagon. look, everyone was shooting at dana, the wagon went terribly fast. I really wouldn't be surprised if all scums were on it.
and, btw, I'm absolutely not sure yet whether you or Ghost are town.

Re: DGB 585, Why do you think I am town?
Re: DGB 596, Why do you think SpyreX is town?
Re: DGB 574, What happened to this?

Re: Toogeloo 587, yeah, you are scum.
why exactly are you voting Anti? Why aren't you voting Katsuki?
what would you do if I claimed cop with a guilty on you?


Re: Katsuki 595, what did the dana flip tell you? how could you be so sure they were scum day 3 when they actually were town?
your scumminess level is quite high.


Re: Ellibereth 572/Toogeloo 573, NOW TELL ME, WHAT WAS THERE BETWEEN THE LINES THAT I MISSED?

@PEOPLE:

answer my questions:

Re: Ellibereth 572, show me then. just because everybody is in the set {people who THINK to see something}+{scum} it doesn't mean dana is scum. How do you explain your flip flop there? ANSWER MY QUESTIONS. YOUR CAPS ARE NOT GOING TO GET YOU AROUND THEM!
Re: Toogeloo 573, I don't understand the second part of your statement? you see what everyone's on about, dana should go

regardless

(

?huh?

)
Re: DGB 574, yes. But why do YOU think it?

PS: every townie on dana's wagon can consider himself an idiot.

[Tasky]

The awesome statement was the I got bussed yo especially by dana during that vote. That, REALLY, should have been a near-clear.

ok

[Tasky]

^
QUOTES MUST STOP! NOW!
"I don't know" looks very much like a phrase a scumbag could be using to hypnotize someone.
the only thing keeping me from voting you right now is that I think toogeloo is scum

PS: why am I obvtown?
PPS: at least you are voting the right person right now.

[Tasky]

Re Katsuki 603:
I posted only one word, and the hypnophrase has to consist at least of 3 to work.

ANSWER MY QUESTIONS!!!

[Tasky]

"Yeah Tasky I'm ignoring your stuff on purpose until Kats and I sort some stuff out."
try sorting stuff out fast, then.
what sort of stuff?

4.)

The Hypnotists

may

be able to hypnotize a player to do two things on the same night. If this occurs, the hypnotized player will only fulfill the second task if "triggered" during the subsequent Day. If a "trigger" occurs, the hypnotized player must be quoted by the player who hypnotized him or her, while

exactly

saying a phrase

of at least three words

under the quoted post.

[Tasky]

Re: Toogeloo 615

"First of all, you linked 587 where I specifically stated in my post what I saw in between the lines, what Katsuki had posted, and what got Elli and Budja to switch their votes."

-> whatever it was between those lines, IT WAS WRONG! you told me "Tasky, everybody sees it, just you aren't". I didn't see it. and it turns out THERE WAS NOTHING AT ALL.

"Finally, I doubt very seriously you have any kind of scan on me, and it is more likely you are using it as a bully tactic to get more votes on me when you have nothing at all."

look. if you were town, you would say "you can't have a scan on me", cause it would just be plain impossible. if I claimed to have a guilty on you, and you are town, THE ONLY POSSIBLE CONCLUSION WOULD BE THAT I AM SCUM.
it's not a question of doubting or not doubting. it is certainty. the uncertainty in your post points strongly to the fact that you don't know whether or not I have an investigation on you.
more scumpoints for you

oh, I still have to vote you today:
VOTE: Toogeloo

@Katsuki

: do you know what Ellibereth is talking about when he talks about "sorting stuff out"? I don't want you to tell me what exactly is going on, I just want to know whether you know what's going on.

[Tasky]

WHICH PART OF NOT QUOTING IS SO HARD TO UNDERSTAND?!

The problem, Tasky, is you used a hypothetical question on me, and this latest post is you reaching trying to misrepresent what I said because I didn't say it specifically to your liking. I flat out told you that you are using this hypothetical situation to more than likely garner votes on me. It's not going to work, and you are going to look very, very, stupid in the end. Why do I have to call you scum when I know for fact that this is just a tactic you are using (because you have nothing else), and you are simply tunneling on me? I have no interest in calling you out for being stupid, and your gambit is not going to work.

ok

[Tasky]

Ellibereth, you should be "sorting out stuff" with Katsuki.
I'll give you time until Tuesday 23:59 (UTC+1). You better have explained everything satisfactorily by then.

[Tasky]

@mod. does posting the trigger phrase and then quoting trigger the action or has the phrase to be AFTER the quote?

[Tasky]

Re: DGB 633, How am I supposed to know? why do you think that?

[Tasky]

This bit is the scummiest right here: D1 - Early vote on Raz. This vote STAYS while discussing other options (Black Mist, Dana).

Who did that?

why is that scummy?
Raz did flip scum, didn't he?

[Tasky]

I kind of expected more from Tasky in his first post in over 2 days too.

I am currently struggling to have time for the games I'm in, so I'm not posting much. also, I'm absolutely not getting what's going on right now. I just read a lot of spam right now.
maybe someone could post his thoughts CLEARLY and well structured. I just see enormous vote analyses and stuff, without much said or done.

PS: Toogeloo, I lol'd at your "loltaskyquote".

[Tasky]

we have one weak left until deadline. Elli, your time to "sort things out" with Katsuki is over.

also, more people need to vote Toogeloo or show me nicely and clearly why I should vote someone else. If you already did and I missed it, show me where.

also, FOS: Katsuki+Ellibereth.

[Tasky]

^then show me why Antihero is scum. I somehow must have missed the main case.

[Tasky]

Re: SpyreX 714. yeah, I saw that post. it is a description of facts. I fail to see why that does indicate scummyness. also I don't understand what you mean when you say "Wellllll".
especially I totally don't understand why "

Early vote on Raz. This vote STAYS while discussing other options (Black Mist, Dana).

" indicates scummyness.

[Tasky]

"

I am rather perplexed at anti-scum. Personally I thought he was town D1, because at that time, I was scum with him in another game, and his scum-play was painfully obvious and bad.

"
don't forget that it's much easier to spot scummy behavior if you know someone is scum.

also, do you think Anti is scum, yes or no?

[Tasky]

especially I totally don't understand why "

Early vote on Raz. This vote STAYS while discussing other options (Black Mist, Dana).

" indicates scummyness.

someone still owes me an answer to this.

[Tasky]

UNVOTE: VOTE: Ellibereth.

[Tasky]

damn, guys!
do something!
Elli, POST SOMETHING SIGNIFICANT, NOW!

[Tasky]

10.)

If you notice there has been a lynch, stop posting.

STOP FUCKING POSTING.

lol.

[Tasky]

hi. good morning everybody.
just checking in. don't have time to post right now.
will look over things tomorrow.

[Tasky]

1. I want DGB to explain what that whole wagon analysis is about. I really didn't see the point in that.
2. I want CES to explain which conclusions he gets from his Quote-analysis.
3. I want Ellibereth and Katsuki to explain their situation. You avoided this long enough already.
4. Sorry Toogeloo, I think I really had missed your claim.

I'm waiting to cast my vote until requests 1-3 get fulfilled.

[Tasky]

VOTE: DrippingGoofball

[Tasky]

^what are you talking about?

[Tasky]

UNVOTE: VOTE: Katsuki

[Tasky]

hey! someone there? Vote Katsuki please and stop lurking.

[Tasky]

^
I don't think so. CES's post 777/778 look genuine. And scum would have known that. So I'm leaning town on him right now. And he is definitely not worse than Katsuki.
Actually, I'm beginning to have suspects on you, DGB.

FoS: DGB

. Your whole votecount-analysis thing is really just a filler. You haven't concluded

anything

useful at all, or if you have you have failed to state it. I really can't understand what you are doing at all.

PS: KEEP ACTIVITY UP, PLZ!

[Tasky]

what does "going through the motions" mean?

[Tasky]

@mod: could we get a massprod?

[Tasky]

^
what narrow group of players do you think scum is in?

_______________

since something has to happen we'll do something:
I'll randomly determine a person (I hope I manage to use the dice-tags), say player A, and that person will pick another player, say B. Then A will post a list of all of us from towniest to scummiest based on how he/she thinks B would make that list. Then B will post his/her list and then pick another player C, etc. until the last player writes a list on how he/she thinks A would make a list and then A posts his/her list.

1.) Tasky
2.) SpyreX
3.) Ellibereth
4.) GhostWriter
5.) Katsuki
6.) DrippingGoofball
7.) Toogeloo
8.) Cogito Ergo Sum

Original Roll String: 1d8

1 8-Sided Dice: (7) = 7

[Tasky]

damn, dice tag fail. someone who's able to use them, please use them.

[Tasky]

since something has to happen we'll do something:
I'll randomly determine a person (I hope I manage to use the dice-tags), say player A, and that person will pick another player, say B. Then A will post a list of all of us from towniest to scummiest based on how he/she thinks B would make that list. Then B will post his/her list and then pick another player C, etc. until the last player writes a list on how he/she thinks A would make a list and then A posts his/her list.

1.) Tasky
2.) SpyreX
3.) Ellibereth
4.) GhostWriter
5.) Katsuki
6.) DrippingGoofball
7.) Toogeloo
8.) Cogito Ergo Sum

Original Roll String: 1d8

1 8-Sided Dice: (4) = 4

this. I'll just say that SpyreX starts, arbitrarily.

_______________________

Toogeloo. Don't overestimate our power.
1. Tracker is extremely weak in this kind of setup, since kills happen indirectly.
2. DGB doesn't seem to be a real watcher, since he doesn't know

who

hypnotized.
3. The Great Zandolfini is a quite weak role. Knowing that you were hypnotized doesn't really help you to catch scum.
4. The JOAT is the only decent role here. But don't forget that the roleblock rarely works in town's favor and that the chance of actually getting a successful protect or a successful investigation is quite slim.

SpyreX, I do not yet think it's time for a massclaim.

I'd like DGB to explain those "reliable messages" better. And I would like you to share ALL of that messages. since you got two recently, I assume you got one every night.

@mod:

assume scum hypnotizes player A to kill player B. If A get's roleblocked, will B die?

[Tasky]

^
The goal is to:
1. make everybody commit themselves to their scumreads and townreads.
2. make everybody analyze others better by forcing them to guess THEIR reads.


_____________________________

oh, I forgot that Fate was a watcher. I agree now that something doesn't add up.
-> I want DGB to explain NOW what those "reliable messages" are about!

[Tasky]

"because I'll sure tell you I'm not thinking that way and if my list makes an AHA and turns sweet candy into poo I'd be unhappy"

???

[Tasky]

CES, why do you think DGB is scum?

[Tasky]

DGB, GET IN HERE AND JUSTIFY YOURSELF!!

NOW

[Tasky]

the problem is that DGB's last post was 3 days ago. It really feels like scum trying to avoid answering.

[Tasky]

DGB, can you choose who's hypnosis to know about? If yes, why did you make the choices you did?

[Tasky]

why did you suspect me?
must have missed (or forgotten) your case on me. could you restate it?

[Tasky]

yet he writes:
"

but I have targeted two players I suspected (yourself, Tasky - and CES)

"

[Tasky]

I want to hear NOW, why he suspected me at that time.

[Tasky]

damn, deadline approaching.
I'd say we lynch Katsuki

[Tasky]

you all vote katsuki. simple

[Tasky]

^lol. this confirms it.
we are lynching Katsuki today.

[Tasky]

Damn. I guess we need this lynch.
I think we are doing this wrong, but as as deadline is today, we don't have any choice but to lynch. and since you don't seem to want to come and lynch Katsuki and I don't expect everybody to be online until then...

unvote, vote CES

still feel this is wrong, though.

@CES: CLAIM NOW!!

[Tasky]

DO IT, NOW. and I may be voting someone else. had missed that deadline lynch thing

[Tasky]

I do not believe CES is scum.

unvote, vote Katsuki

. This is definitely the right thing to do.
CES has given me town-vibes all along and his last post feels town.

[Tasky]

oh, and

FoS: SpyreX

. his last reactions didn't seem town at all.

[Tasky]

Ohh taskers WHAT about that seems town.

don't know, just a feeling.
I am getting town-vibes all the whole day from CES.

[Tasky]

I am not completely sold on any of them, though I do think it's either CES or DGB as scum. I like the DGB lynch better because of the confirmation we get from it in the end as it would assure either CES or Tasky as town and limit tomorrows actions. We lynch Katsuki and regardless of the result we are probably still in the same position tomorrow forced to choose between CES and DGB.

we will be in ALMOST the same position. the only differences will be:
1. having Katsuki's flip helping us to decide between CES and DGB
2. if DGB is town, she will be able to investigate one more time which could be crucial.

If you think that you are going to lynch Katsuki anyway tomorrow, you might as well lynch him today and have more information tomorrow to decide on how to proceed.

Today is kind of a coin flip I think, hopefully giving us all the info we need to close this out tomorrow, but this last minute scramble back and forth on Kat and CES does raise an eyebrow.

Why does it reais an eyebrow? Do you think scum is involved badly or something like that? Please elucidate your thought.

PS: Toogeloo, you better roleblock the mafiakiller or the one being hypnotized tonight. Tonight you should spend a while trying to figure out how scum acted up to now and how they'll act in the future.

[Tasky]

"I like how tasky is trying to coax tooge into using his one-shot RB tonight.
It's posts like these that I am having a very hard time believing that tasky is town."

Well, yeah. I just told him that IMO tonight is the time to use it. Of course he will then decide on his own.
What problem do you have with that exactly?