Mini 584: Sudo_Nym Presents- Over!

[icemanE]

That post alone no. But his saying my scum hunting act is terrible is worth a vote. Do you think his logic for voting me correct?

No, not particularly.

[TDC]

It's cute that you use the same logic that I voted you for to accuse me as well.

What I'm saying is I don't like when Z says "don't vote for X" then you jump in and say "EUREKA!! Z and X are scumbuddies!" That's not super-sophisticated analysis to me as much as it is opportunistically trying to look like you're scumhunting.

hmm...opportunistic you say...Dude, the whole game is opportunistic. We pick apart what little tidbits of information and reactions we can until people break. So yes, I am opportunistic as well as everyone else that is playing this game. Bad Logic Lowell.

vote: Lowell

I don't understand that post, unless you have a different definition of opportunism. This is what a dictionary says:
"One who takes advantage of any opportunity to achieve an end,

often with no regard for principles or consequences.

" (underlined for emphasis).. so no, mafia is not to be played opportunistic.. at least not if you're town.

Clearly, we should continue to bandwagon mafiassk until he makes a substantive post.

It's been quite some days, so I guess we could also ask the mod to

prod MafiaSSK?

note: I'll be gone from Friday till Sunday, and also next week from Saturday till Monday. (Will be able to post in between)

[Sudo_Nym]

ZeekLTK 5

-

CaptainCake, icemanE, TDC, Nanosauromo, FaerieLord

mafiaSSK 2-

TheSweatpantsNinja, Johoohno

Greasy Spot 2-

Marmalade, Lowell

FaerieLord 1-

ZeekLTK

Lowell 1-

Greasy Spot

With 12 alive, 7 votes are required to lynch.

[TheSweatpantsNinja]

The 'opportunistic' scumtell is a bad one unless you are very, very, precise in its definition.

[Marmalade]

Surely asking for a claim should happen at L-1, not -2, FaerieLord? I do agree that this is slightly scummy, although I'm pretty sure this could be a policy decision. However, I'm pretty happy with his Zeek hate, which was pretty well argued, I'd say.

I also like Ninja's pressure of FaerieLord, since he clearly is making an effort to scum-hunt. Not sure that I like Ninja though. Something about his interactions with Zeek bug me. And also, the MafiaSSK thing is a bit weird -- feels like a contrived attempt to saved Zeek's butt.

I like Lowell's entrance, although I am a bit curious why he doesn't mention anything about Zeek in his secondary analysis of players post.

So basically you're admitting that you are scum and if I'm a vig you'd quicklynch me (to go "1 for 1")?

It's things like this that make me suspect you. Just blatant attacks with no real evidence behind them, just to save your own butt. I reiterate that I find Zeek most scummy not because of the initial reasons, but because of his OMGUS

responses

to attacks made against him.

I totally don't like GreasySpot's Lowell vote, especially since his response to Lowell seems to be "sure, I'm opportunistic, but so is everyone!" Er... no. That said, I agree that he's really not the scummiest person here at the moment, so voting for him seems relatively pointless.

unvote

.

Not sure who is most suspicious, since I don't really want to vote Zeek yet, but I think I might re-read Johoono, since some of his posts I remember being slightly odd.

[Marmalade]

Zeek:

I have asked you to respond to my suspicion that you are just attacking people who attack you. All you have said is that "I do this when town," which is not at all conclusive.

I invite you to respond to my previous post on the issue:

I'd like to know why Zeek, in his seeming re-read of the thread, ignored my post which accused him of merely attacking all those who attacked him. Since this is a significant reason why I suspect him, I'm concerned that he'd just ignore this.

That's what I always do when I'm town, ask TSPN.

1. Why didn't you think to address it? It sounds like you were trying to avoid the points you couldn't defend.
2. Saying "I always do this as town" is pretty inconclusive meta. For this to be balanced,

we need to know if you do the same as scum, or differently.

[TheSweatpantsNinja]

And also, the MafiaSSK thing is a bit weird -- feels like a contrived attempt to saved Zeek's butt.

I get a protown read off of zeek this game, so I've no interest in lynching him, but I'm also not just going to sit around and watch while you try and get seven votes, I'm going to continue to scumhunt (or in this case, lurkerpressure.)

[icemanE]

@Sweatpants

Out of curiosity, did you you know Zeek before this game? He made it sound like that earlier.

[TheSweatpantsNinja]

I do. In fact, I just mislynched him. I'm slightly concerned that my guilt over having mislynched him last game will make me too likely to think he's town in this one. . . but, well, I'll just try to watch out for that.

[Johoohno]

@ Lowell (response for post 159): I thought something like this might come up for my vote on MafiaSSK. I could also had done the other way around (kept my vote on ZeekLTK and FoS:ed MafiaSSK), but that wasn't as a good an alternative since a FoS seemed to small to wake up MafiaSSK and to keep my vote on ZeekLTK seemed dangerous since he was pretty close to a lynch and I wanted more people to weigh in before any lynch.

I am also pleased that Natirasha (reluctant poster) is now replaced by Lowell (eager poster). I am in general pretty close to the policy "Lynch all lurkers", or at least want to shake them to life. I know I'm not the most frequent poster here, but there is a lot going on IRL for the moment.

@ ZeekLTK (response for post 161). Yes I know that you'd only been away for a few days, but you were a lot more active before, and that is why I called out the shift in your post frequency.

I will make a re-read and re-evaluate things while I wait for MafiaSSK to return (or get replaced).

[ZeekLTK]

I am also pleased that Natirasha (reluctant poster) is now replaced by Lowell (eager poster)

Eager, for now. Lowell was also in the game with TSPN and I and was replaced because he was too inactive...

[FaerieLord]

I am also pleased that Natirasha (reluctant poster) is now replaced by Lowell (eager poster)

Eager, for now. Lowell was also in the game with TSPN and I and was replaced because he was too inactive...

So you ignore marmalade's question so that you say that Lowell might leave this game?

*sigh*

[Greasy Spot]

Opportunistic applies to everyone. I'm not saying you take every opportunity but I'm saying Mafia is a game of opportunities and you either take them or not. Sometimes they are good opportunities and sometimes they are bad opportunities. I voted Lowell to illustrate to him that his vote on me was an opportunistic reasons which I didn't find valid.

[Lowell]

Did I just get accused of quitting already?

[TheSweatpantsNinja]

No, you've been good this game. Zeek and I just lol'ed a little at you being an "eager poster." I mean, c'mon. Its a little funny.

[MafiaSSK]

Sorry for not telling you guys, but my play style really is lurking and observing at the same time. I'm still learning.

I do. In fact, I just mislynched him. I'm slightly concerned that my guilt over having mislynched him last game will make me too likely to think he's town in this one. . . but, well, I'll just try to watch out for that.

How recent ago was this mislynch? Did you really think he was scum?

[FaerieLord]

Sorry for not telling you guys, but my play style really is lurking and observing at the same time. I'm still learning.

I do. In fact, I just mislynched him. I'm slightly concerned that my guilt over having mislynched him last game will make me too likely to think he's town in this one. . . but, well, I'll just try to watch out for that.

How recent ago was this mislynch? Did you really think he was scum?

Post more. Lurking is not helpful to the town

Also, why did you choose that question to ask? There were a lot more things you could have picked out, what made you pick out that one?

[MafiaSSK]

If TSPN was focused on the game, then he could have mislynched Zeek on purpose, so that he could rely upon it and use it to protect his scumbuddy.

[TheSweatpantsNinja]

Post more. Lurking is not helpful to the town

Anyway, the Zeek incident was about 2-3 weeks ago. . . and I'm not going to talk more about an ongoing game, but feel free to read it yourself. Mini 533.

[icemanE]

Sorry for not telling you guys, but my play style really is lurking and observing at the same time. I'm still learning.

Yeah man, if all you're gonna do is lurk, there's no reason to have you alive anyway, so try to be more helpful if you can.

[TheSweatpantsNinja]

So, your theory is. . . I intentionally mislynched zeek in that game, just so I could come up with a plausible reason to not go after zeek this game? Now

there's

a stretch.

[icemanE]

So, your theory is. . . I intentionally mislynched zeek in that game, just so I could come up with a plausible reason to not go after zeek this game? Now

there's

a stretch.

QFT, that's a little out there.

[ZeekLTK]

I briefly commented on Lowell because it was late at night, I was just checking the thread briefly and didn't have time to make a full response.

But okay, what do you want me to address?

I "missed" a post by Marmalade partially because I was responding to Johoohno's post (which was right next to it) and partially because it didn't appear to be anything important to respond to.

Yes, the post accused me of attacking people who attack me. So? Yes I do that. Congrats. Now please tell me how that is scummy though.

It's easier (for me, at least,) to find scum by seeing how people are attacking known townies rather than to try to find scum between people who are attacking each other of whom I don't know either role.

At this point in the game (Day 1!) the only townie I know of is me, so anyone that attacks me seems more scummy than anything else, because I know they most likely have ulterior motives other than "trying to win for the town". Especially when I haven't really done anything to warrant being attacked.

For example, this is what has happened on Day 1:

-I made an off-handed comment saying "are we going to lynch Cake or what?"

-Some people wondered about this, but only FoSed me and didn't vote.

-I responded to these "suspicions" by pointing out that no one knows Cake's role, so he could be scum, and if he was that wouldn't really make me suspicious now, would it?

-After this cake OMGUS voted for me (so why is it "scummy" if I attack people who attack me, but it's not when Cake does it?) and iceman voted for me to try to prove to TSPN that he was "scum hunting" (even though I don't think he actually was).

-Then, on 3 votes, FaerieLord and TDC, two players who had not contributed to the game at all up to this point, come in with very opportunistic votes against me. (to be fair, Faerie waited a bit to actually vote, but continued to try to attack me while using "FoS").

-Okay, back up for a second. All I did was make a comment and then question the logic of some FoS against me and all of a sudden I have 5 votes against me. And the fact that I know I'm a townie gives me good reason to assume that some of these votes are not genuine townie votes, they are opportunistic scum votes who are trying to mislynch a townie.

So, Marmalade, what course of action do you propose would be better at finding and rooting out the scum who have voted for me other than to attack them back?

[ZeekLTK]

However, given recent posts by MafiaSSK I would consider voting for him if no one else wants to try to figure out which scum have voted for me.

[TheSweatpantsNinja]

(Deja vu): The problem is, zeek, is that

we don't know you're town.

And how easy is it for scum to make that argument? I don't have a problem with OMGUS votes (like, I hate it when I make a case on someone who's voted for me and they try to dismiss it with OMGUS), but when your lead argument is "they voted for me", to us, that's useless information, and its a bad argument. And people who make bad arguments tend to be scum. So, OMGUS is scummy. And definitely unconvincing.