Mini 584: Sudo_Nym Presents- Over!

[Johoohno]

Well, two people close to cleared (that being GS and TSN). I'm waiting for Celebloki's catch up now.

When my other ongoing game goes to night (which will be soon since it is deadline for Friday) I'll try and find time to reread and add my thoughts.

[Celebloki]

I will be caught up today. I am on Page 15 atm. Work is interfereing with my usual Mafia playtime =(

[icemanE]

Here, just waiting for Cele's wrapup.

[Celebloki]

Allright, I am caught up. I am not one for big posts but I will say a few things. Over the last few pages I am not convinced that Iceman is scum. Right now my personal opinion on the most scummy player is Lowell, my beliefs for this is basically summed up by Iceman's recent posts against him. I will join him with my vote.

Vote: Lowell

My top candidates for pro-town players are:
TSPN
FL
GS(hes doomed to be NKed imo)
and I get some Pro-town vibes off of TSQ.

In short I think that Iceman and TSQ participate is a lot of good scumhunting and don't feel right away that wither is very scummy.

As for the rest of the players I don't really know what I feel about them yet, my more iffy people are Johoohno and TDC but nothing major has peeked my interest yet.

[Johoohno]

@ celebloki:

I see your case on Lowell and will do a reread to see if I'll join you with a vote or if I find someone else more wordy of it. However, I really dislike your listing of most protown players - partly because I don't agree with your idea of who's protown, partly because I don't like you trying to hand scum a list of suitable night kills.

[Johoohno]

EBWOP: Wordy or worthy - whichever you like

[icemanE]

@ celebloki:

I see your case on Lowell and will do a reread to see if I'll join you with a vote or if I find someone else more wordy of it. However, I really dislike your listing of most protown players - partly because I don't agree with your idea of who's protown, partly because I don't like you trying to hand scum a list of suitable night kills.

MAAANNN, Johoo, it would be tough to argue that TSPN and GS aren't protown at this point.... FL is debatable (he certainly comes off as protown but hes not as safe a bet as the other two).

[TheSweatpantsNinja]

Yeah, in general, I agree with not listing pro-town players, but since I'm more or less confirmed, I'm not too worried about it. . . in the sense that I'm probably going to be dead two nights from now anyway.

But, generally, yeah, listing pro-town players, not good.

[Sudo_Nym]

Vote Count:

icemanE 4

-

TheSweatpantsNinja, Lowell, Thestatusquo, Sir Tornado

Lowell 3-

icemanE, Greasy Spot, Celebloki

Celebloki 1-

Johoohno

With 11 alive, 6 will lynch.

[icemanE]

This game has died down, hard. We should decide on a lynch and go through with it.

[FaerieLord]

I'd rather reread a bit the thread (will do, tomorrow). Try not to lynch anyone by then

[FaerieLord]

Post 0: Rejects to random vote. Justifies a weak vote
Post 1: Gives a recap of the game
Post 2: Asks Captain Cake for a clarification
Post 3: Re justifies his weak vote
Post 4: Tells Greasy to start scum hunting (ironic, no?)
Post 5: Agrees with TSPN
Post 6: Re justifies his weak vote (even though everyone is ignoring it) and puts a FoS on Zeek.
Post 7: Asks MafiaSSK why he is still voting Nanosauromo
Post 8: Agrees with TSPN again. Votes MafiaSSK for more content. Applies lurker pressure, while still keeping his eye on Zeek
Post 9: Justifies his vote on MafiaSSK, saying he is trying to wake him up. Also, keep an eye out for post 11. In this he said he "is generally close" to "Lynch all Lurkers"
Post 10: Recap on every player. This was a good post
Post 11: Says that it is easy for scum to win using "LaL" policy, since it's more probable that town lurk than scum lurk, since there are more town. He also changes his reason for voting MafiaSSK. He goes from pressuring lurkers out to the reason he gave in his recap.
Post 12: Says voting lurkers is not scum hunting, though not anti-town. See posts 8 and 9
Post 13: Asks Greasy to start scumhunting again
Post 14: Asks everyone to post, and justifies once again his vote for MafiaSSK
Post 15: FoSes Iceman for role-fishing
Post 16: Bumps for replacements
Post 17: Turns again to voting MafiaSSK for content pressure. And Justifies his FoS on Zeek
Post 18: Asks Greasy to do something again and asks for replacements
Post 19: Argues about game lagging, asks once again for prods and replacements
Post 20: Tells Zeek to post questions, poses two questions for the replacements. Second Good post
Post 21: Says once again that his vote on MafiaSSK was to get content.
Post 22: Says he is still suspicious of Zeek, but still doesn't want to hop on.
Post 23: Says I'm trying to start a "claim train", where I only asked for one claim. Compares two completely different scenarios.
Post 24: Says Greasy isn't being helpful, but says that he never is.
Post 25: Unvotes Greasy (another "call out" for a lurker apparentely) and asks for contribution for Greasy again
Post 26: Asks me to clarify
Post 27: Asks for Prods again
Post 28: Calls out greasy for "setup knowledge"
Post 29: Calls out another lurker, CaptainCake. See post 11 again.
Post 30: Says TSQ is stretching, but says he is probably right
Post 31: Glad Greasy came back (And wants content again)
Post 32: Asks Surye for clarification
Post 33: Says he will reread and post thoughts
Post 34: Tells Celebloki he is ready to jump on the wagon
Post 35: Clarifies

Now, seeing all these posts, I want to ask you all, where has Johoohno posted content, apart from post no. 10 (and even that is to a certain extent, since material from it was reiterating what others said.) To me, this is an example of lurking in plain sight. Another thing I didn't like about Johoohno is his constant justification of his votes. Also, see his flip-flop on his vote on MafiaSSK. Started out as a vote so that he would post content, then it became a "buddying up" case, then once again it became to post content. Another flip flop is his stance on lurkers. Notice how he was against in post 11, because he said scum could have something out of it? He voted lurkers, THRICE! MafiaSSK, Greasy and CaptianCake. I also want you all to notice how he hasn't been on a single wagon of relevance. Zeek only got an FoS from his. No vote on Iceman either, and no vote on lowell either. Though he does say that if celebloki's analysis takes foot, he will jump on it. The amount of fence sitting he has done in this game is astonishing. So yeah, all that considered, I think this warrants a:

Unvote, Vote Johoohno

[icemanE]

Faerie - your case on Johoohno feels nearly identical to my case on Lowell - lurking, not posting useful content, fence sitting... what is the main difference you see between Lowell and Jo?

[icemanE]

One difference I see is your mention of wagons, and how Jo never joined the big ones - Lowell joined almost all of the big ones, how is that not scummier than not joining them?

[FaerieLord]

Not joining means you are trying to remain out of the spotlight. Also, notice how Johoohno did that whole flip-flop in ideas and voting reasons. Lowell has yet to show such inconsistencies

[icemanE]

Not joining means you are trying to remain out of the spotlight. Also, notice how Johoohno did that whole flip-flop in ideas and voting reasons. Lowell has yet to show such inconsistencies

I agree that Lowell hasn't shown those inconsistencies but at the same time, Lowell has kept himself away from committing inconsistencies but sitting on the fence. Almost every time he makes a point or a vote, he says something like "but I'll also do THIS". It's the same principle, in a different application. Instead of flip-flopping on ideas and voting reasons Lowell is doing the same in his bandwagoning.

[FaerieLord]

The thing is, even though Lowell is pretty scummy as well (I'm glad that you are finally putting all your thoughts into posts), a Johoohno lynch will provide us with more information in my eyes than a Lowell lynch, especially in the interchange Johoohno had with CaptianCake in the beginning.

[TheSweatpantsNinja]

That's a pretty solid case on johoohno. I would consider him a reasonable second choice to iceman.

[Thestatusquo]

FL, why is iceman town?

[FaerieLord]

I don't see him as town or scum, but at least he is contributing to the thread.

Johoohno, on the other hand, is not.

[Thestatusquo]

Why is contribution indicative of alignment?

[icemanE]

That's a pretty solid case on johoohno.

I would also like to know what YOU see as the major difference between the Lowell case and the Johoono case - please give me a real answer and not just some witty quip.

[Thestatusquo]

That's a pretty solid case on johoohno.

I would also like to know what YOU see as the major difference between the Lowell case and the Johoono case - please give me a real answer and not just some witty quip.

Interesting in this response.

[icemanE]

Also, TSPN, I really don't understand how you're still so convinced that I'm scum. I've been nothing but pro town this entire day. One thing you should know is that this is my second ever mafia game - during a reread of my games, I can definitely see a huge improvement in my play, and I don't really see how you can miss my participation, unless you're just ignoring it, which it really seems like you are. Is the only thing you see wrong with me the poorly constructed mafiaSSK case? Is that really it?

[FaerieLord]

Why is contribution indicative of alignment?

It's not. But I'd rather have a scum helping town, then a scum not helping town