Open 78: Friends & Enemies (Over) - before 608

[icemanE]

You're probably going to dismiss this as an OMGUSy reaction

I don't dismiss posts. I consider them. You should think about doing the same. OMGUS is a scum tell, and thusly, while the tally of your OMGUS posts rises, I don't dismiss them - rather, I watch them accumulate, and along with them, your level of scumminess rises.

You're correct, rofl, that FoS doesn't get us anywhere. As such:

vote: dcorbe

However, rofl, you are nailing this farside case HARD and I don't know that she's as scummy as you make her out to be. The case on her seems to be A. Her low level of activity, B. Her inconsistency, and C. Her poor reasoning behind her vote. These are all decent scum tells, but I'm not sure she needs to be lynched IMMEDIATELY as you state in your most recent post. Is she the best candidate for a lynch so far today? I would say so, at this stage, but I'd like to do a little more talking before we take that step, call me reluctant or what you will but I'm in no rush to kill. I'd like to see what we can get from our other scummy players - currently I'm looking at dcorbe, as you can see.

I await farside's post tomorrow. I think that will advance the game and perhaps be a deciding factor in the course of the Day.

Votecount as of post 175

farside22 - 4 (Roflcopter, Mr. Blonde, Grimmy, dcorbe)
dcorbe - 1 (farside22, IcemanE)
Grimmy - 1 (Celebloki)

Not Voting - 5 (Pokerface, Surye, Rishi, Korts, Tekkactus)

7 to lynch

[Korts]

alright, I'm here, read through, PBPA of rofl coming soon.

[Korts]

Roflcopter, post by post

Posts 0-4:

confirm/RVS/offtopic

Post 5:

dcorbe wagon is being ridden by scum, methinks

unvote, vote: farside

Why farside, out of all the players?

Post 6:

dcorbe wagon is being ridden by scum, methinks

unvote, vote: farside

I was wondering when someone would say that. But BW work on helping conversation and this game is more silly at this point.

your vote did nothing to actually promote game related conversation, and the fact that these votes are still silly makes a four vote wagon even more suspect.

Double standard. Did rofl's vote do anything to promote said discussion?

Weak scumtell

Post 7:

accuses farside of buddying up to him. Nothing particular here.

Post 8:

still think the dcorbe case is a real reach. farside wagon is good.

Not exactly participating in discussion. Only restating previous opinion.

Weak scumtell

Post 9:

thats pretty fatalistic. i still think farside's the right play.

See comment to Post 8.

Weak scumtell

Post 10:

ok what? convincing? i think her fatalism is having exactly the effect she wanted on you guys.

Pretty normal reaction to farside's claim.

[

in regards to my promised PBPA on him

]
why me, in particular?

I sense uneasiness.

Post 11:

its never too early to reach an honest majority and lynch somebody.

deadline lynches suck.

Still not real contribution. Also, brings up deadline to scare the town into lynching farside, even though the mod had said nothing about a deadline being imposed.

Weak scumtell

Post 12:

I don't like how defensive dcorbe gets at simple comments such as below.

how is "being defensive" a scum tell?

Valid point, although answered in the stead of dcorbe. b]Weak scumtell[/b] Also, again, just a one-liner.

Post 13:

asks for my reason for PBPA, says "doing a PBPA is fine". I feel this latter statement is in contradiction with Post 10 in that I felt uneasiness in Post 10 on the topic of the PBPA.

Post 14:

further clarifies his reaction to the promised PBPA. Choice of words: "I don't see myself as an obvious choice"--self-conscious scum? [/speculation]

Post 15:

Some of what I wrote didn't come through. He was defensive on a simple matter. It sounded pissy. There were 4 votes but not everyone was serious at the time and

sometime BW help to find scum

or get someone worked up that turns out to be scum.

i agree, the dcorbe bandwagon led me to you.

There's nothing that can be said about this.

@korts: pbpa to your hearts content. i don't mind scrutiny, but there's not going to be much to see. if you really thought farside was a bad bandwagon, i'd expect you to look at the people who jumped on without their own reasons.

Again, self-conscious scum? There's not much to see, granted, because it's mostly one-liners.

Post 16:

pokerface's big post was full of awesome but he really needs to pull the trigger and actually vote for somebody, foses get us nowhere.

Vague buddying-up attempt?

The attack on farside is pretty much justified.

Summary:

No real substance, therefore no real read. Not especially scummy, I don't see the effort (although now I'm just being a hypocrite) what with all the one-liners. Gonna have to do a more serious reread.

[Rishi]

Post 5:

dcorbe wagon is being ridden by scum, methinks

unvote, vote: farside

Why farside, out of all the players?

I also don't like the "wagon is being ridden by scum" statement. With a seemingly innocuous statement (with no basis in fact - there was almost nothing to go on at that point), he gets to cast suspicion on a few different people with absolutely no backlash.

[dcorbe]

You're probably going to dismiss this as an OMGUSy reaction

I don't dismiss posts. I consider them. You should think about doing the same. OMGUS is a scum tell, and thusly, while the tally of your OMGUS posts rises, I don't dismiss them - rather, I watch them accumulate, and along with them, your level of scumminess rises.

You're correct, rofl, that FoS doesn't get us anywhere. As such:

vote: dcorbe

All I'm really trying to do is respond to you. If I weren't responding I would have earned your vote anyways. You said yourself the OMGUSy reactions were more indicative of my play style than my alignment.

Is there anything other than what we've discussed and what I've attempted to address other than what you feel are OMGUSy reactions that you feel the need to put your vote on me?

[icemanE]

All I'm really trying to do is respond to you.

Right, but the way you're responding, i.e. in an OMGUS fashion, is what's telling me you've got something to hide.

If I weren't responding I would have earned your vote anyways.

I don't think that's the case. I didn't vote for you until 5 posts ago, after your OMGUS posts accumulated.

You said yourself the OMGUSy reactions were more indicative of my play style than my alignment.

Hmm, I don't recall saying that. I do remember Rishi or rofl or someone else saying that, I'll look for the quote, Regardless I don't really agree that a scummy, OMGUS playstyle excuses someone from suspicion.

Is there anything other than what we've discussed and what I've attempted to address other than what you feel are OMGUSy reactions that you feel the need to put your vote on me?

I feel that's enough to warrant a vote at this stage in the game.

On another note, your most recent post is the most legitimate, least OMGUS post I've seen from you in awhile, which is a good sign.

[icemanE]

The vote on dcorbe is not because he doesn't have an avatar (though that's not helping). It's his general attitude. He's really defensive and lashing out at people. Pretty much every post he's made has been pissy. This doesn't necessarily mean he's scum - more likely he's just a jerk.

This may be what you're referencing, dcorbe. I read through my posts and didn't see anything of the like - maybe I missed it, though. If that's the case, point it out.

[roflcopter]

ok korts, i'm not sure that assessment of me was entirely fair, but i'll get into the gritty details of which of your points i really disagree with later, for now i have a couple of questions for you.

what makes one line posts scummy?

what do all those 'weak scumtells' that you mark against me add up to?

in other news, rishi's most recent post makes me pretty sure he's town.

[Korts]

rofl, you're right, that analysis wasn't fair exactly. But what do you expect when PBPA's function to prove someone's scumminess? And you've pretty much got it all wrong. My main deduction was that there is nothing inherently scummy about you, as of now, that I could find.

One-liners aren't all that scummy by themselves (hence weak scumtells), but consecutively short replies mean low contribution, which doesn't really help.

All those weak scumtells don't add up to anything, though, because there's nothing to connect them, and I'm sure I'd be able to find as many small tells in anyone's posting. You're just not trying hard enough for my vote.

[farside22]

I marking this as my next game to read through. Will hopefully have something today later on. Thanks

[roflcopter]

One-liners aren't all that scummy by themselves (hence weak scumtells), but consecutively short replies mean low contribution, which doesn't really help.

i don't think my contribution has been low at all. my posts are short because it doesn't necessarily take a lot of words to say what needs to be said, and in this game i've found that my opinions and points can be made in very few words. that doesn't make them any less valid than a game where i post walls of text. my activity levels have still been some of the highest in this game.

[Korts]

You're taking this the wrong way again, rofl. I didn't say your contribution was low, I wanted to say that consecutively short replies may cause low contribution. I may have been unclear, though, sorry.

[roflcopter]

right. i think we're in too many games together

[farside22]

Okay I read through. Couple of things. First of all I would say Pokers comments about defensive or non defensive is really a non tell. I don't agree with the article, but knowing how I behave in some instances I guess it is a non tell. Now that I've see dcorbe playing in other games I see that in general he gets defensive when any pressure is added. Since the games are on going I won't say anything further about them, but I think it's just the way he is.
Finally on the I'm buddying up comment. I'm not sure why you think I'm buddying up. I figured in reality I would be lynched. Claiming townie usually does not have people unvoting. I get iceman's point on his reasoning for unvoting, but Korts is so back and forth on issues that just struck me as scummy.
First he unvotes after the claim. Then he talks about doing a PBPA on rofl for some odd reason. Why not do it on everyone. Then I find the PBPA really reaching to make minor scum points. I feel this is a set up to make rofl look scummy day 2 after I'm lynched and shown I was truthful in my claim.
On to those I find townie:
Rishi
Poker
Rofl
Iceman
And no I'm not explaining my list. I am not giving scum an advantage, but I would like to warn some people to be careful what you say and how you talk to people. If I can see something that looks like protection and knowing there is a mason group I'm sure the scum can too.

unvote:
vote: Korts

[Korts]

right. i think we're in too many games together

Yeah, I have to think hard now to figure out what the case is here

Farside, I don't know why I unvoted. To tell you the truth, I was pissed. But the logic was pretty much that the way you pointed at dcorbe with "when I'm gone, look at him" was pro-town because you didn't say "lynch him", rather "look at him". Pretty lame, yeah.

[Grimmy]

Okay I read through. Couple of things. First of all I would say Pokers comments about defensive or non defensive is really a non tell. I don't agree with the article, but knowing how I behave in some instances I guess it is a non tell. Now that I've see dcorbe playing in other games I see that in general he gets defensive when any pressure is added. Since the games are on going I won't say anything further about them, but I think it's just the way he is.
Finally on the I'm buddying up comment. I'm not sure why you think I'm buddying up. I figured in reality I would be lynched. Claiming townie usually does not have people unvoting. I get iceman's point on his reasoning for unvoting, but Korts is so back and forth on issues that just struck me as scummy.
First he unvotes after the claim. Then he talks about doing a PBPA on rofl for some odd reason. Why not do it on everyone. Then I find the PBPA really reaching to make minor scum points. I feel this is a set up to make rofl look scummy day 2 after I'm lynched and shown I was truthful in my claim.
On to those I find townie:
Rishi
Poker
Rofl
Iceman
And no I'm not explaining my list. I am not giving scum an advantage, but I would like to warn some people to be careful what you say and how you talk to people. If I can see something that looks like protection and knowing there is a mason group I'm sure the scum can too.

unvote:
vote: Korts

I personally think that the PBPA of Roflcopter made him look more town than anything else. The analysis of rofl basically eliminated anything I may have thought was scummy.

Grimmy
knows that rofl loves bandwagons. all the time. every time. its who he is.

[Grimmy]

right. i think we're in too many games together

ditto.
I have to look back sometimes and make sure im not bringing up a point that one of you guys said in another game we are in together.

Grimmy
yeah, that grimmy

[Mr. Blonde]

Just checking in...

[Korts]

Just checking in...

real helpful...

[Mr. Blonde]

Well, I gotta read back and come with better analysis... just wanted to remind I'm still here... Bit busy IRL right now.

[farside22]

Mod: Please prod Celebloki who has not posted since the 5th

[Celebloki]

No need to prod, I have just looked at the game and will try to pencil in a re-read and post by tomorrow. Been busy as I have just started 2 summer classes.

[Rishi]

Well, I gotta read back and come with better analysis... just wanted to remind I'm still here... Bit busy IRL right now.

Well, let's give you at least a little motivation to post something meaningful.

Vote: Mr. Blonde

[Mr. Blonde]

Rishi: Well, let's give you at least a little motivation to post something meaningful.

I do not need extra motivation to post. Just time...

dcorbe: I meant to ask you, Blonde, whether this comment was aimed at me or dcorbe. Either way I don't really follow how its a scumtell and I assume you're joking, as you did when I asked Grimmy to get one.

Was just joking. (I meant to joke about "not having avatar => scumtell")

Rishi: Still want something from Mr. Blonde, though.

Farside's vote on dcorbe (68) seems very opportunistic and there's I missed if there's some reason to vote dcorbe (dcorbe is explaining this well in post 155 quite well I think). This opportunistic vote is the main reason I'm voting Farside.

---

Farside lists townies:

On to those I find townie:
Rishi
Poker
Rofl
Iceman
And no I'm not explaining my list. I am not giving scum an advantage

Giving absolutely no reasons <= this is not "scum advantage" if we know: it could be town advantage. Now it just creates confusion.

Bit scummy I think.

---

I'm also missing why Farside is voting dcorbe.

dcorbe also reasons his vote by saying "just feels" (gut tell without any reasons is bit suspicious).

---

As for others:

I find IcemanE saying bit odd words:

These are all decent scum tells, but I'm not sure she needs to be lynched IMMEDIATELY as you state in your most recent post. Is she the best candidate for a lynch so far today? I would say so, at this stage, but I'd like to do a little more talking before we take that step, call me reluctant or what you will but I'm in no rush to kill.

So, farside is the best candidate for lynch - yet IcemanE votes dcorbe?

[icemanE]

So, farside is the best candidate for lynch - yet IcemanE votes dcorbe?

Yeah, farside is still the best candidate, but being the best candidate (i.e., the most scummy) doesn't mean we've got to kill her right now - there are still going to be at least 3 scum going on into day 2, and if we're fairly sure farside is scum on day one, it makes sense to look into others, since we've got the time. I want to check everyone out before we kill someone - just because you've got a scum doesn't mean you have to kill it right then and there.

I'm also missing why Farside is voting dcorbe.

I think she's voting Korts, but you're right, her dcorbe vote was weird.

dcorbe also reasons his vote by saying "just feels" (gut tell without any reasons is bit suspicious).

Yup.

I think you've got something wrong in your reading - first off this quote is from me, not dcorbe:

dcorbe: I meant to ask you, Blonde, whether this comment was aimed at me or dcorbe. Either way I don't really follow how its a scumtell and I assume you're joking, as you did when I asked Grimmy to get one.

And the VAST majority of post 155 is actually a mis-formated post 154, which is also my post - the only thing dcorbe says in that post is:

You mind explaining why you think I'm scummy instead of trying to subliminally plant the idea into everyone's head?

It must have taken you a little while to think through and type all of that out. You could have taken 5 extra minutes to explain it.

Which is not an explanation of anything, just a question pointed at me ...So I'm going to go ahead and assume that you are actually talking about MY explanation in 154.

Mod if you could fix that quote tag it would be a big help.