Newbie 595 - Game Over!

For Newbie Games, which have a set format and experienced moderators. Archived during the 2023 queue overhaul.
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Post Post #575 (ISO) » Thu Jun 12, 2008 4:13 am

Post by Vel-Rahn Koon »

Since q was alone from the get-go he would send in a running commentary of his thoughts for his night kills and actions. I told him I'd respond to them at the end of the game.
q21 wrote:First, random musings. If all you care about is the night action skip to the end.

Okay, so at this point I know there is only one townie power role as both mike and I were are/were simple goons. It was a shame that he had to go... but he had to go. He was dead anyway and I wasn't going come into the game as public enemy number 1 and not be on that bandwagon.

The conundrum comes down to: kill an IC (all of whom are town), or hunt the role. If the role is a doc then targeting an IC increases the chances of my NK failing... as I expect a doc to heal an IC over a Newbie. If the role is a cop then that could screw me. I think I'll leave the ICs alone, I like the current dynamic (read: Litral v Muerrto). I was thinking massive or starkmoon - but there's nothing to say that they'll change their play style all of a sudden and their current play style isn't hurting me... also leaving them alone may get people to suspect those even less experienced than myself.

Walnut is I think trying not to be too noticeable... he tries to end all altercations as quickly as he can... but he does seem to be looking for responses from people. He may be that town role... maybe. Its worth a shot...

KILL WALNUT


I'm overanalyzing this all way to much aren't I... I'm probably wrong too. But anyway.
Hunting a power role is always a b!tch. You know from the setup that there has to be one there, and I think that if you saw something in Walnut's play that you should take a chance on it. This assumes that taking out Walnut isn't going to screw you over later on down the line, which I didn't think would happen to you, since you seemed to be considering future play with the Litral v. Muerrto comment. The next best action, IMO, is to take out an IC player to get rid of experience. Sometimes taking out a lurker can be beneficial, but it also takes away a potential hiding place, as you're getting rid of someone who automatically looks suspicious for not participating.
q21 wrote:Okay, that day went fairly well I think. Just in general game terms W!nt3r's attitude for most of his rather short stay wasn't terribly good. From a scum point of view though it did help me, I think. It meant I could leave my vote on him and watch him kill himself... when I saw he'd been around for a bit I did worry that his contribution might warrant a removal of vote. As it is no one should target me for hitting someone who was fairly well hated.

As for the night kill then. I need to have as few ICs remaining as possible at end game as such I would like to start killing them now. My role hunt with Walnut was a failure - but I haven't given up the role hunting thing completely. If I can remove the role before end game I reckon I could make a fairly decent claim for the other role (you know the one that doesn't exist...). Obviously the sooner I find him the better as I can engineer circumstances to make my claim as believable as possible with more time.

As such I am going to combine both ideas and hit the IC most likely to have the power role. Muerrto's willingness to be lynched makes him an unlikely target and Starkmoon's absence makes it near impossible to get a read on shaka!!. As such:

KILL MASSIVE


He shows competence, which is almost enough by itself. But his comments that he wouldn't vote Litral indicate that he has a possible innocent find on him. Also I think Massive's death would WIFOM point to SA... not that I'm going to be the one bringing it up, mind... but someone might.

Anyway, there is my night action, I look forward to the beginning of day three.
This was a dead-on read of massive's play. I've got nothing else to say here, the analysis is brilliant and speaks for itself.
q21 wrote:I've been throwing around the idea of a no kill and claiming doc protecting Litral. But as a Doc I should have protected Massive N2 as I even stated that he was an IC I trusted. If asked why I didn't protect Massive night 2 I can't give a decent answer and its a question that I would almost certainly be asked.

Kill Litral


Lets see if I can pull of the end game, my first on MS. I've done it on another site, but that was with players I know very well and a generally faster style of play.
Good call on the fake claim. IMO, don't overcomplicate things with your lies so that you can keep them all straight :) Probably not an issue here on a forum game since you have enough time when posting to make sure you have it all straight, but why make it harder.

Overall you played an excellent game, considering Mike completely left you hanging.
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Post Post #576 (ISO) » Thu Jun 12, 2008 4:50 am

Post by q21 »

Now that I've finally finished a game here... apart from AITP... I have to comment on the game speed. I play most of my mafia on malazanempire.com where the games are just so much quicker. There is only ever one going at a time... because when the days are 36 hours long you can't play more than one game at a time.

I get frustrated here sometimes because I know I can get 30 - 40 posts in a RL day... but that would just be talking to myself here most of the time.

Also, our core group of players is generally the same from game to game so we know each other fairly well and as you'd expect there are a fair number of rivalries floating around... so we always use alts... except from time to time and then the badlists really come into play...

Its also fun when you're scum and you alt-guess and kill the bastard to vig killed you last game, etc...
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Post Post #577 (ISO) » Thu Jun 12, 2008 6:26 am

Post by Muerrto »

Well, this game not only had a ton of replacing but it also had Starkmoon and Winters(one couldn't help it and one couldn't play, respectively) so don't think of it as a traditional example.

Sorry Batt, I really thought Q bussing Mike that hard core was a bit much.

@Q: While Mike not posting had to have been frustrating. Since no one else had mentioned him(for some reason, why HADN'T we?), why call him out like that? I'm all for bussing but why do it if you don't have to?

Good game people. Long, drug out, frustrating lol, but good game.
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Town - Win=9, Loss=10
Mafia - Win=5, Loss=4
Abondoned = 3

I feel for the rest of the players every time I get a town PM.
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Post Post #578 (ISO) » Thu Jun 12, 2008 7:07 am

Post by Litral »

q21 did really well this game, I believe. My scumdar rang very little from what he said, besides readying himself to lynch both me and Muerrto.

It's a pity that the town suffered from a lack of participation and bickering (partially initiated by yours truly).

I did not particularly enjoy how much attention I got for trying to get mike replaced instead of hammered, but it did teach me an important lesson: that mafia is a game of the majority trying to root out the minority, and so doing anything a minority would do is dangerous and should be carefully thought out.
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Post Post #579 (ISO) » Thu Jun 12, 2008 7:37 am

Post by Muerrto »

Litral wrote:I did not particularly enjoy how much attention I got for trying to get mike replaced instead of hammered, but it did teach me an important lesson: that mafia is a game of the majority trying to root out the minority, and so doing anything a minority would do is dangerous and should be carefully thought out.
QFT. While town's #1 job is to find the scum, your #2 job is to avoid doing anything scummy that will cause a mislynch and take suspiscion off the real scum. You learned that lesson well and quickly. You'll do well in future games. Logical, ordered thinking.

Sorry again for the loss people but because of Starkmoon's unique situation I simply had no read on Battousai whatsoever and Q21 was able to buss his partner easily since he NEVER posted.

Speaking of which, has anyone heard from Mike? He picked up his prod so he was still reading I assume. Q?
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Games - 31
Town - Win=9, Loss=10
Mafia - Win=5, Loss=4
Abondoned = 3

I feel for the rest of the players every time I get a town PM.
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Post Post #580 (ISO) » Thu Jun 12, 2008 8:03 am

Post by Muerrto »

My town ratio sucks lol
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Town - Win=9, Loss=10
Mafia - Win=5, Loss=4
Abondoned = 3

I feel for the rest of the players every time I get a town PM.
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Post Post #581 (ISO) » Thu Jun 12, 2008 8:23 am

Post by Battousai »

Ya it does :P

Just noticed you have another scum loss...
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Post Post #582 (ISO) » Thu Jun 12, 2008 8:55 am

Post by Muerrto »

Yeah, Oman nailed me on a fake claim because the real doctor protected me instead of Oman...the CLAIMED COP!!!

Oman was like, no one would fake claim not protecting the cop. I was like, no one would NOT protect the cop lol. So yeah, how the heck could I predict the doctor would screw up and get me lynched lol
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Games - 31
Town - Win=9, Loss=10
Mafia - Win=5, Loss=4
Abondoned = 3

I feel for the rest of the players every time I get a town PM.
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Post Post #583 (ISO) » Thu Jun 12, 2008 9:00 am

Post by Vel-Rahn Koon »

Muerrto wrote:My town ratio sucks lol
Heh, you should see mine. :D
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Post Post #584 (ISO) » Thu Jun 12, 2008 9:02 am

Post by Muerrto »

Ouchie
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Games - 31
Town - Win=9, Loss=10
Mafia - Win=5, Loss=4
Abondoned = 3

I feel for the rest of the players every time I get a town PM.
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Post Post #585 (ISO) » Thu Jun 12, 2008 9:04 am

Post by Vel-Rahn Koon »

Yeah I pretty much suck. I keep waiting for it to all come together for me and it never does.
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Post Post #586 (ISO) » Thu Jun 12, 2008 9:07 am

Post by massive »

It was the best opportunity to do so. We had lynched scum on day one and had one day of mislynching available to us. A confirmed townie SHOULD have made the process easier. *laugh*

(also, remember there was still the possibility of a doc at that point)
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Post Post #587 (ISO) » Thu Jun 12, 2008 10:01 am

Post by q21 »

Muerrto wrote: @Q: While Mike not posting had to have been frustrating. Since no one else had mentioned him(for some reason, why HADN'T we?), why call him out like that? I'm all for bussing but why do it if you don't have to?
2 Reasons

1) Someone was going to do it eventually... why not me.

2) Its exactly what I'd have done as a townie and since he was contributing nothing his lynch wasn't going to hurt me. I would still need 3 town lynches to win.
"I can't not give mad props to the murderbot 9000 that was q21." - Spyrex, after Scummies Invitational 2010.

You know those times when you wish you could think of something really funny or interesting to say, but just can't?... Yep, this is one of those times.
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Post Post #588 (ISO) » Thu Jun 12, 2008 10:07 am

Post by q21 »

Muerrto wrote:
Litral wrote: Speaking of which, has anyone heard from Mike? He picked up his prod so he was still reading I assume. Q?
I have never spoken to Mike in ANY form... I don't plan to.
massive wrote:It was the best opportunity to do so. We had lynched scum on day one and had one day of mislynching available to us. A confirmed townie SHOULD have made the process easier. *laugh*

(also, remember there was still the possibility of a doc at that point)
Yeah, but for that I'd have had to be a roleblocker, so I'd have just blocked you and gone of hunting the doctor.
"I can't not give mad props to the murderbot 9000 that was q21." - Spyrex, after Scummies Invitational 2010.

You know those times when you wish you could think of something really funny or interesting to say, but just can't?... Yep, this is one of those times.
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Post Post #589 (ISO) » Thu Jun 12, 2008 10:11 am

Post by Battousai »

Exactly, the mod pointed out that mike was the player's problem and anyone reading that page would have noticed it and said something. But that is what made me a little suspicious of you, q21. You FoS'd him as lurkerscum, to me at least, if you voted instead and not post about 4 people and saying 1 of them is scum, I would have leant towards Muerrto being scum.
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Post Post #590 (ISO) » Thu Jun 12, 2008 10:20 am

Post by q21 »

You people want to compare win ratios?

Between here and MalazanEmpire.com I've finished a total of 10 games (this excludes the merc games which aren't really mafia) and won 4... 2 of those wins came from the 3 games where I started as scum... the other game where I started as scum was my first ever game.

Of those games I've only survived the game 3 times (all wins) and most of those 7 deaths came came within the first 2 nights... there's a reason I have the title of "Condemned of High House Mafia".
"I can't not give mad props to the murderbot 9000 that was q21." - Spyrex, after Scummies Invitational 2010.

You know those times when you wish you could think of something really funny or interesting to say, but just can't?... Yep, this is one of those times.
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Post Post #591 (ISO) » Thu Jun 12, 2008 10:35 am

Post by q21 »

War in Heaven just ended - add another town loss to that previous post.

I feel for the rest of the players every time I get a town PM.
"I can't not give mad props to the murderbot 9000 that was q21." - Spyrex, after Scummies Invitational 2010.

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Post Post #592 (ISO) » Thu Jun 12, 2008 10:39 am

Post by Muerrto »

q21 wrote:I feel for the rest of the players every time I get a town PM.
Ditto OMG QFT I'm stealing this for my Sig btw :lol:
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Games - 31
Town - Win=9, Loss=10
Mafia - Win=5, Loss=4
Abondoned = 3

I feel for the rest of the players every time I get a town PM.
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Post Post #593 (ISO) » Thu Jun 12, 2008 10:42 am

Post by q21 »

Enjoy it... At least you have a few town wins on MS... I have none.
"I can't not give mad props to the murderbot 9000 that was q21." - Spyrex, after Scummies Invitational 2010.

You know those times when you wish you could think of something really funny or interesting to say, but just can't?... Yep, this is one of those times.
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Post Post #594 (ISO) » Thu Jun 12, 2008 10:49 am

Post by Muerrto »

But my problem isn't just that I lose, it's that I'm sooo bad at nailing the scum and soo sure of myself that I CAUSE the loss lol

Shrug, I enjoy being scum anyway, maybe subconsciously I do it on purpose. :twisted:

GO SCUM!
Show
Games - 31
Town - Win=9, Loss=10
Mafia - Win=5, Loss=4
Abondoned = 3

I feel for the rest of the players every time I get a town PM.
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Post Post #595 (ISO) » Thu Jun 12, 2008 10:52 am

Post by Vel-Rahn Koon »

Muerrto wrote:But my problem isn't just that I lose, it's that I'm sooo bad at nailing the scum and soo sure of myself that I CAUSE the loss lol

Shrug, I enjoy being scum anyway, maybe subconsciously I do it on purpose. :twisted:

GO SCUM!
Ok, that's my exact problem. I hyperfocus on someone for all the wrong reasons and I don't bother to step back and actually think. It's rather sad in my case lol.
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Post Post #596 (ISO) » Thu Jun 12, 2008 10:52 am

Post by q21 »

Scum is definitely my favourite side to play... so I pay more attention... so I play better.
"I can't not give mad props to the murderbot 9000 that was q21." - Spyrex, after Scummies Invitational 2010.

You know those times when you wish you could think of something really funny or interesting to say, but just can't?... Yep, this is one of those times.
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Post Post #597 (ISO) » Thu Jun 12, 2008 10:57 am

Post by q21 »

Vel-Rahn Koon wrote:
Muerrto wrote:But my problem isn't just that I lose, it's that I'm sooo bad at nailing the scum and soo sure of myself that I CAUSE the loss lol

Shrug, I enjoy being scum anyway, maybe subconsciously I do it on purpose. :twisted:

GO SCUM!
Ok, that's my exact problem. I hyperfocus on someone for all the wrong reasons and I don't bother to step back and actually think. It's rather sad in my case lol.
Oddly enough one of my best moves as a townie (was BP too) was to get the cop to L-1 on day two and force a reveal... then the doc healed the cop for the rest of the game and the cop kept giving us innocent finds - thereby cutting down on possible scum... we then found and lynched the scum in two more days.
"I can't not give mad props to the murderbot 9000 that was q21." - Spyrex, after Scummies Invitational 2010.

You know those times when you wish you could think of something really funny or interesting to say, but just can't?... Yep, this is one of those times.
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Post Post #598 (ISO) » Thu Jun 12, 2008 11:03 am

Post by Muerrto »

IF you have a doc. Otherwise you have a dead cop and get yourself lynched hehe.

But ditto on the focusing. Especially in newbie games. I forget that just because someone slipped up doesn't mean they did it maliciously, but that they simply...slipped up. But the opposite of that is forgiving tells so I'm like...must...maintain...balance...
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Games - 31
Town - Win=9, Loss=10
Mafia - Win=5, Loss=4
Abondoned = 3

I feel for the rest of the players every time I get a town PM.
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Post Post #599 (ISO) » Thu Jun 12, 2008 11:15 am

Post by Super Archivist »

q21 totally pwned us! D:

Dunno if I'm ready to jump into a big game yet... I always second guess myself every time I'm suspicious of someone and stuff... It's funny, when I'm reading a game, I always think of stuff I would say if I was in it, but when I actually played a game, I couldn't think of anything! DX

Anyway, great game q21! :D

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