Mushroom Kingdom Mafia (Game over!)

[goborage]

Pop has zero value? Does that mean he can't use items?

Mod edit:
Visible votecount:
Riceballtail (1): skitzer
Gimbo (1): Riceballtail
Surye (1): somestrangeflea
somestrangeflea (2): Gimbo, armlx
Cream147 (1): Alabaska J

Not voting (17): iamausername, Phoebus, sideney, Surye, killa seven, Gremwell, mr. incrediball, TheSweatpantsNinja, Alabaska J, farside22, andersonw, malthusis, FaerieLord, Cream147, Korts, ashmite84, goborage

With 22 alive it takes 12 real votes to lynch.

[Gremwell]

I think it just means he has no "real vote" toward a lynch, honestly I don't see why Gimbo put up such a stink about reveling the other mushroom property. Don't we see the real vote count on a majority lynch anyhow?

I was thinking about it and I was musing that Bowser's main goal is to find and kidnap Peach, which would be a quicker win than wearing down the town until they're outnumbered, so as long as you can protect yourself from flowers you should be alright. while a double voting townie would be a better target than a random townie, they also know your not peach so that may save you, from bowser's NK anyway

any thoughts? I know this thought wouldn't really effect the game play but it was just something I was thinking about on the bus.

also I know it means little coming from me but I feathered TSN, because I was suspicious of the coin pooling idea, and he checked out, for what its worth

[populartajo]

Yey Im alive.
So my votes dont count? Let's prove it.

Vote : Cream

[populartajo]

Oh I forgot there's a real votecount....
Why do I have the feeling that 1Up Mushroom special property is not as powerful for scum as I expected?

[armlx]

^ please justify why, do you have a better option?

2nd.

Pop has zero value? Does that mean he can't use items?

Pop is still valuable. He can discuss and scum don't really have incentive to kill him, especially with the whole confirmed not Peach thing.

also I know it means little coming from me but I feathered TSN, because I was suspicious of the coin pooling idea, and he checked out, for what its worth

Thank you for sharing, it helps. Also, why would it mean less coming from you?

[TheSweatpantsNinja]

Ah, yes, the patented TSN plan of, "suggest plan no one else agrees with, get investigated, become confirmed, no longer have to explain actions" plan strikes again.

Srsly though, I still think we should pool some coins. I also don't think flea saying gimbo isn't confirmed is suspicious, because he's not confirmed. He's almost definitely town, but not confirmed. I don't get gimbo's reluctance to reveal the ability, but again, he's almost definitely town, so whatever.

I dislike armlx pursuing him for it, as it sort of boils down to semantics.

Unvote, vote armlx.

[somestrangeflea]

I see no reason Gimbo should be anything BUT confirmed townie at this point

I do. Namely "not confirmed townie".

your pressing the issue is really scummy.

Only because you say so.

No, I'm referring to how you tried to push the rest of the town into pressuring Surye with you.

Which is scummy because..? Kinda hard to get a wagon on your own...

The correct procedure is just ask, not put votes down.

"Just asking" wasn't going anywhere.

He is less confirmed then Gimbo by being completely unconfirmed.

You don't say "less full" for a glass that's completely empty...

You seem awfully concerned with not being lynched.

That's because being lynched is a bad thing.

1st point: No, I didn't. I've said Gimbo should reveal, and said that your way of trying to go about it is scummy.

Because..?

2nd: Except I'm right.

Because you say so.

3rd: See above

See above.

What common action? Trying to start an indirect wagon on a confirmed townie?

You said "creating a wagon". Not the same as "trying to start in indirect wagon on a confirmed townie", which isn't even right as it implies that I was trying to get Gimbo lynched...

I have a feeling your stated and actual reasons differ, hence my post. Replacing stated reasons with intended reasons is a part of making cases, amirite?

Not when your only evidence is "because I say so".

I misrepresented nothing.

Well I'm convinced.

Explain to me from a mod-balance perspective how Gimbo can be scum.

I don't play "Outguess the Mod".

I don't play with the assumption that the game will have an equal (or near-equal) chance for each faction to win. I don't play with the assumption that setups will be finely tuned to be as unswingy as possible. Hell, I don't play with the assumption that Day 1 isn't LyLo.

The only assumptions I make about

any

setup are these:
1. There is at least 1 scum in it.
2. The town is bigger than in the largest scumgroup.
3. The mod won't lie.

How do you counterbalance a scum with an item which revives someone and takes their vote?
Give a townie an item which revives someone and takes their vote. Well that was easy.

There are probably tens (maybe hundreds) of other ways, but, since I'm a player, it's not my job to work any of them out.

[armlx]

I do. Namely "not confirmed townie".

You are cleary A) Scum or B) someone with no clear concept of the set up metagame or game balance

Only because you say so.

No, because trying to unconfirm people who actually have no chance of being scum is scummy.

Which is scummy because..? Kinda hard to get a wagon on your own...

Except your wagon was based on bad premises to begin with. Your justification was bad logic on someone you weren't trying to wagon.

"Just asking" wasn't going anywhere.

Except it did get somewhere.

You don't say "less full" for a glass that's completely empty...

You are working with semantics here.

Because..?

Not wanting confirmed townies = scummy, but thats not even the point here. You accused me of derailing a conversation, except everything I stated was on topic.

Because you say so.

No, because Gimbo is actually impossible to be scum and your insistence that he could be is nothing more then a thin scum ploy to set up a mislynch.

See above.

I was referring to the top of the post where I explained how it wasn't a contradiction.

You said "creating a wagon". Not the same as "trying to start in indirect wagon on a confirmed townie", which isn't even right as it implies that I was trying to get Gimbo lynched...

If you weren't trying to get a lynch, why did you place a vote instead of just asking unkindly?

The only assumptions I make about any setup are these:
1. There is at least 1 scum in it.
2. The town is bigger than in the largest scumgroup.
3. The mod won't lie.

How do you counterbalance a scum with an item which revives someone and takes their vote?
Give a townie an item which revives someone and takes their vote. Well that was easy.

There are probably tens (maybe hundreds) of other ways, but, since I'm a player, it's not my job to work any of them out.

Well, assumption 3 is a crap shoot, and there's so many more things you can straight up assume. 2 of these are

Targeted or delayed revival is either a town 1 shot or a zombie cult.
Double voters are pro-town unless the set up gives you an inordinate amount of town power to make you think otherwise.

Your balancing solution is terrible BTW. The strength of that ability for scum is beyond believable. Scum double votes are way too powerful, especially in a hidden real vote count system. Early hammers, auto-winning end games, etc.

[Korts]

The armlx-SSF to'n'fro is just pointless. I'm leaning slightly towards agreeing with SSF, but only because I agree that Gimbo is far from being 100% confirmed, and because armlx is trying to make a (I assume lynchworthy) case from completely subjective points.

Again, I promise that I'll make time for an explanation of why farside is scum.

[Lawrencelot]

Notice:
This Friday, I will go on vacation for 4 weeks. The first days of my vacation I will not have internet access at all, after a week or so I will be online every now and then. Flameaxe will take care of votecounts, and if for some reason he doesn't (I don't know if he'll be going on vacation) the visible votecounts can be done by any player. If you have urgent questions, pm Flameaxe, if it's not so urgent you can just pm me and I'll answer as soon as I'm online.

I will set a deadline when I know more about my activity, the deadline will then probably be somewhere near 3 weeks from now.

Two players are V/LA, andersonw and Phoebus.

This is added to rule 17 just for clarification: After anyone has enough real votes to lynch, the game is in twilight until the lynch scene is posted, and voting/unvoting can not prevent that person from being lynched anymore.

[farside22]

The armlx-SSF to'n'fro is just pointless. I'm leaning slightly towards agreeing with SSF, but only because I agree that Gimbo is far from being 100% confirmed, and because armlx is trying to make a (I assume lynchworthy) case from completely subjective points.

Again, I promise that I'll make time for an explanation of why farside is scum.

I wait with baited breathe

[ashmite84]

Well, so much for my plan. Ah well.

[Gremwell]

I said it doesn't mean much coming from me because unless someone feathered me during the night, or I missed something in my read throughs I'm not confirmed town

[Riceballtail]

We now have two confirmed town. Awesome. Tajo and TSN. I still don't think Gimbo is 100% confirmed just because of the item. I'm not saying he is therefore lynchworthy, but that he has no way to prove his role just because of a mushroom he held in his possession. This armlx/ssf debate needs to stop now.

And now for something constructive:

@Gob: You had a poison mushroom, it makes me be somewhat suspicious, but I understand your confusion about how to use it. I'm fairly sure you're town, for what it matters.

[Gimbo]

wait..RBT, so you take Gremwell's words that he did feather TSN and that TSN is 'confirmed' while i'm not.


1) you r related to gremwell somehow and you slipped
2) you know something about TSN that we don't

so which is it?

[Riceballtail]

A feather is a confirmation, a claim with an item is not. Just because of my claim people still don't think I'm town. So you tell me hm?

[TheSweatpantsNinja]

Gimbo, there's a difference between being investigated and having an item which makes you more likely to be town.

[Gimbo]

but who ever said Gremwell is telling the truth? am i missing something?

as far as i know, in this game, 2 ppl are confirmed town, me and pop, thats it.

[armlx]

I said it doesn't mean much coming from me because unless someone feathered me during the night, or I missed something in my read throughs I'm not confirmed town

Actually, I don't see why anyone wouldn't accept a town result on someone at this point, so long as its not a very, very bizarre case (ie top 2 scummiest people are the 2 people involved). I don't think scum would go out of their way early to link themselves to a false result.

[Riceballtail]

but who ever said Gremwell is telling the truth? am i missing something?

as far as i know, in this game, 2 ppl are confirmed town, me and pop, thats it.

FALSE!

You are NOT confirmed town.

And then you accuse Grem of lying? I have half the notion to lynch you for saying this garbage. If you are going to say you're confirmed town, then you should be saying TSN is too, since there's at least as much evidence his direction than yours. You are defeating your own defense.

[Korts]

but who ever said Gremwell is telling the truth? am i missing something?

as far as i know, in this game, 2 ppl are confirmed town, me and pop, thats it.

FALSE!

You are NOT confirmed town.

And then you accuse Grem of lying? I have half the notion to lynch you for saying this garbage. If you are going to say you're confirmed town, then you should be saying TSN is too, since there's at least as much evidence his direction than yours. You are defeating your own defense.

This is good posting.

[armlx]

Gimbo, there's a difference between being investigated and having an item which makes you more likely to be town.

This is a good way to explain why Gimbo's post was off track.

FALSE!

You are NOT confirmed town.

And then you accuse Grem of lying? I have half the notion to lynch you for saying this garbage. If you are going to say you're confirmed town, then you should be saying TSN is too, since there's at least as much evidence his direction than yours. You are defeating your own defense.

This is not. Threatening to lynch someone far more confirmed then anyone except maybe the 2 people mod confirmed town is not good play.

[Riceballtail]

Then, by that merit, I'm confirmed too right?

[armlx]

Then, by that merit, I'm confirmed too right?

Somewhat. Your role is not meta-confirmed town by being a reviver and double voter, 2 pretty much exclusively town roles. I think you are likely to be town as disabilities like you have are usually pro-town, but there still is a fair chance it could be a scum role, especially as only the non-item/coin part of your role has been demonstrated.

[iamausername]

Pretty sure no one is actually

confirmed

town, technically.

popular, Gimbo, TSPN, Gremwell and Riceball [in that order] are all likely town, though, based on their claims/items/whatever.

Really need to do a reread to figure out who is likely scum.