Mini 617 - Scottish Mafia, Game Over

[Mirth]

~Headdesk~

"There's a bandwagon already" is not a valid reason to vote someone. Also how can you agree with me if you have had no opinion on the matter the whole time? Why are you agreeing with me just when its convenient? I don't like this towns love of quick lynches. We have all the time in the world (see: no deadline) to discuss before coming to a consensus and here you are just willing to agree with whoever is the loudest.

[starkmoon]

[col color=white]Player[col color=white]Votes[col color=white]Voting [col color=white]Lowell[col color=white]3[col color=white]Mirth, q21, empking [col color=white]q21[col color=white]2[col color=white]Lowell, rolfcopter

[col color=white]Not Voting : [col color=white] Cybele, massive CC09

8 alive, 5 to lynch.

As always, if there is a mistake, let me know.

Mod is an insomniac, bear with me till I get some sleep.

[Empking]

People have voted for q21

If you don't want to people to have their views effected by your analysis, don't post in the thread.

[Mirth]

Or maybe you can think for yourself? Thread opened yesterday, jumping on the first wagon that appears right after the thread opens without testing if my arguments have any merit is not playing, it's baa-ing along.

[massive]

I want to state that I am here (just not on the weekends) and I resent anyone suggesting I'm not contributing. Just because I happen to get myself solidly behind lynches and contently leave my vote on who I think is most suspicious doesn't mean I'm not contributing. But I need to read (actually) the last three pages again and I imagine more-than-skim Mirth's gigantor post.

[Mirth]

Not the amount you post, Massive, rather how a lot of you posts sound hollow or dont bring in anything new.

[massive]

I hate massive

I feel the love. *sniffle*

Not the amount you post, Massive, rather how a lot of you posts sound hollow or dont bring in anything new.

Do you really believe this? You were praising my reasoning as for the possible alignment of Cybele/dcorbe at the beginning of Day Two. I'm possibly the ONLY person who thought he had a good reason for voting kuribo (and I still maintain that it's ludicrous to say you are "pushing a bandwagon" when you aren't actually ON said bandwagon). I don't like being grouped with CC09, specifically.

Empking:

So you are saying that you think q21's "concern about godfathers" is more likely to come from someone town-aligned?

Who cares about a mafia godfather? Someone who plans to plant the seeds of doubt in all investigations.

And finally here's my intent to vote. I think this sentence is ludicrous. If the Mafia has a roleblocker (as a pro-town wouldn't block Empking), why do they need to "plant the seeds of doubt" about a godfather? A Mafia roleblocker can sit on Empking until the cows come home and render him useless. Do you think q21 would "plant the seeds of doubt" about JUST Mirth? Because that's what you're saying in that post.

FOS with intent to vote

on Lowell.

[Empking]

I'd probably put the concern about godfather at a null tell but definately not a scum tell.

Mirth, I saw your point of view, researched it and saw that it was the best lead we had. That's all the testing I need.

I have to say, I haven't found Massive's posts not bringing anything new. I'd say that out of the players alive, he bought the most new things. At least on day two.

[Lowell]

First of all I don't believe its a mafia roleblocker. I believe Emp is the cop and Mod's comments were an indication that she forgot to send emp his result.

The fact that a player keeps trying to push the godfather idea is an unsettling one. It means someone doesn't want us to take future cop investigations at face value.

[q21]

well, mirth, what i got from reading your post by post (yes i did read it, and will probably comment on some of the details later after re-reading it because it was a big, meaty post) was that you disagree with the way i play this game and that i r dumb. i'm sorry you think so, but i have to disagree with your assessment of q. he was thankfully kind enough to drop a realllllllly scummy line just now to help me back myself up though.

therefore I think you are pretty much cleared,

though there is still the godfather possibility.

bolded to make it more obvious what is so freaking scummy. he's trying to legitimize a future lynch on the person (you, no less) who is

confirmed innocent

by what essentially just became a

mod-confirmed

cop, damage control post from the mod notwithstanding. am i the only one who finds instigating godfather paranoia to be really, really scummy?

... stuff aimed at Mirth...

vote: q21

Your vote doesn't surprise me, like I said earlier, you're like a dog with a bone. That said, why is it scummy to refuse to rule out any and every possibility?

...

based on the erratus lynch ALONE kuribo and dcorbe were obviously not scum, even if you think dcorbe was a flaming idiot because of the way he built cases.

the very fact that he worked so fucking hard to build the case clears him.

on top of that our resident masterclass cop has an innocent result on dcorbe which should only be icing on the cake, but your golden boy q still for some hare-brained reason wants you

in the running to be lynched.

WHAT!?

The bolded bit is so much wifom its laughable. Scum work extremely hard to build cases so that townies get lynched. If anything they have to work harder to paint guilt where there is innocence.

because of who he was attacking/defending (Hindsight is 20/20.)

this was in re: my q21 vote and case.

and here is the crux of the case, which apparently nobody fucking gets. scum sight is ALSO 20/20. the scum know, in real time, who is scum and who is not. so somebody defending the scum and attacking the townie is not scummy because in my hindsight i see dead scum and living cop confirmed townie, its scummy because at the time they were live scum and live townie and the scum KNEW THAT, and moved to try to CHANGE THE COURSE OF THE WAGON FROM SCUMPARTNER TO NONSCUM. jesus. sorry if i'm a little ticked off by mirth's post by post analysis of my apparently mongoloid intelligence.

If you hindsight is what you're basing your case on on why were you accusing me of this on day one, when you had no hindsight. What if I was right? I could quite easily have been. Maybe its you with the 20/20 scumsight? You saw your scumbuddy getting hammered and when you saw me make what was, at best, an oblique defence for them you commented on it in the hope that you could use it against me in the future.

[q21]

First of all I don't believe its a mafia roleblocker. I believe Emp is the cop and Mod's comments were an indication that she forgot to send emp his result.

Firstly:

Just got the reply. I got no result.

This would indicate roleblocker.

The fact that a player keeps trying to push the godfather idea is an unsettling one. It means someone doesn't want us to take future cop investigations at face value.

When did I keep trying to push the godfather idea? rolfcopter had to go an fish that line out a four paragraph post. And I hadn't mentioned it again until someone he brought it up.

[roflcopter]

why is it scummy to refuse to rule out any and every possibility?

it is scummy to bring up the possibility of a godfather on the cop innocent because you are trying to take away the town's most potent weapon against the scum, confirmed innocents, which if the town accrues enough of become a literally impossible obstacle for the scum to overcome, by undermining every single cop investigation, past present or future. the people who benefit the most from a town that is paranoid about the possibility of a godfather are the scum themselves.

The bolded bit is so much wifom its laughable. Scum work extremely hard to build cases so that townies get lynched. If anything they have to work harder to paint guilt where there is innocence.

but dcorbe was working hard to paint guilt where there was in fact guilt, at a point in time where if he hadn't been doing so the likelihood of erratus being lynched would be much lower. of course the scum work hard to lynch innocents, but the scum don't work hard to lynch their own fucking scumpartners, which is what "the bolded bit" was saying. i can't believe mirth thinks you are any less of an idiot than the rest of us.

If you hindsight is what you're basing your case on on why were you accusing me of this on day one, when you had no hindsight. What if I was right? I could quite easily have been.

no, sorry. at the time, you were the only person trying to stop the erratus lynch and start a dcorbe wagon in its place. everyone else was all over erratus' case and for good reason. he was mind bogglingly obvious. i called it like i saw it on day one, and then when we had role-reveal confirmation of erratus being scum i pursued you for the transgression.

[roflcopter]

When did I keep trying to push the godfather idea? rolfcopter had to go an fish that line out a four paragraph post. And I hadn't mentioned it again until someone he brought it up.

hiding it in a four paragraph post is a great way to plant the seeds of doubt in the town's head without calling a hell of a lot of attention to the fact that you're trying to do so. i "had to go and fish that line out" because it was incredibly scummy, and attention did need to be called to it in particular.

[q21]

why is it scummy to refuse to rule out any and every possibility?

it is scummy to bring up the possibility of a godfather on the cop innocent because you are trying to take away the town's most potent weapon against the scum, confirmed innocents, which if the town accrues enough of become a literally impossible obstacle for the scum to overcome, by undermining every single cop investigation, past present or future. the people who benefit the most from a town that is paranoid about the possibility of a godfather are the scum themselves.

So you are saying that it is impossible for Mirth to be a godfather or for Empking to be insane? Should we implicitly trust everything she says? Mirth being scum is highly unlikely and I no longer think she is (as opposed to D1 and early D2), but it is a possibility. You are doing more to spread "godfather paranoia" than anything I have done.

The bolded bit is so much wifom its laughable. Scum work extremely hard to build cases so that townies get lynched. If anything they have to work harder to paint guilt where there is innocence.

but dcorbe was working hard to paint guilt where there was in fact guilt, at a point in time where if he hadn't been doing so the likelihood of erratus being lynched would be much lower. of course the scum work hard to lynch innocents, but the scum don't work hard to lynch their own fucking scumpartners, which is what "the bolded bit" was saying. i can't believe mirth thinks you are any less of an idiot than the rest of us.

dcobe worked hard to lynch Erratus? At the beginning he himself said that it was simply a pressure bandwagon a number of times. Later he jumped of the EA wagon onto me at the first given opportunity. When you mentioned about working hard on cases I thought you were talking about his D2 Cybele case. His pushing on EA proves nothing about his (now her) alignment.

If you hindsight is what you're basing your case on on why were you accusing me of this on day one, when you had no hindsight. What if I was right? I could quite easily have been.

no, sorry. at the time, you were the only person trying to stop the erratus lynch and start a dcorbe wagon in its place. everyone else was all over erratus' case and for good reason. he was mind bogglingly obvious. i called it like i saw it on day one, and then when we had role-reveal confirmation of erratus being scum i pursued you for the transgression.

If everyone else was all over Erratus and my transgression was so obvious why did you go after Empking before me? The reason that the EA wagon started was not good imo and I said that. I found dcorbe's actions scummy and I said that too. I am not the kind of player who will follow something simply because the town thinks that way. The "chainsaw defending" case was bad yesterday and its still bad today.

When did I keep trying to push the godfather idea? rolfcopter had to go an fish that line out a four paragraph post. And I hadn't mentioned it again until someone he brought it up.

hiding it in a four paragraph post is a great way to plant the seeds of doubt in the town's head without calling a hell of a lot of attention to the fact that you're trying to do so. i "had to go and fish that line out" because it was incredibly scummy, and attention did need to be called to it in particular.

There is nothing wrong with pulling out a line you think is scummy from a post (although I disagree that it was scummy). In this post I was simply pointing out that Lowell was wrong when he said that I kept trying to push anything.

[Mirth]

I don't like being grouped with CC09, specifically.

You're not. You're in the "needs more content" category. Coheed is in the "has pretty much not posted any content" category.

Lowell: there's a different between "no mod PM" and "no result" Also how do you explain both the cop *and* the confirmed innocent being alive?

no, sorry. at the time, you were the only person trying to stop the erratus lynch and start a dcorbe wagon in its place. everyone else was all over erratus' case and for good reason. he was mind bogglingly obvious. i called it like i saw it on day one, and then when we had role-reveal confirmation of erratus being scum i pursued you for the transgression.

At the time an Erratus lynch was not yet warranted. Y'all *lost* most of a day by rushing to a lynch that you had no need to rush to. You gave up the oppurtunity to test the reactions of everyone else except Erratus. Even if it was mindboglingly obvious, you only say this because he was lynched scum. If he came up town, you'd have though "Oh, what a shame, he just has a stick up hid behind." Day one is meant to gather information about everybody, not just the lynch. That was not accomplished.

[Cybele]

It look like its between him and q21, I know I'm pro-town and I was afraid of godfathers so it can only Be lowell. I also agree with mirth's logic.

It's not just between q21 and lowell. Points have been made against rofl and massive as well. Massive was being just as scummy as lowell, he just didn't perform that suspicious hammer.

[Mirth]

Don't forget to but yourself on that list, Cyb.

[Cybele]

Don't forget to but yourself on that list, Cyb.

Excuse me. Good points have been made against massive, myself, lowell, etc. and pretty much everyone here.
If I skipped over myself, it was out of self-preservation.

[Cybele]

First of all I don't believe its a mafia roleblocker. I believe Emp is the cop and Mod's comments were an indication that she forgot to send emp his result.

Firstly:

Just got the reply. I got no result.

This would indicate roleblocker.

Not necessarily. It could also indicate that he's dead. I was a naive cop in my first game, and on the second or third day I investigated someone who was also NK'd the same night, and I got 'no result'. I'm not saying this is convention, but since the mod decides how to handle certain situations, it's a possibility.

[massive]

I still am not seeing the "distribution of godfather paranoia" as a scum tell.

[Empking]

It look like its between him and q21, I know I'm pro-town and I was afraid of godfathers so it can only Be lowell. I also agree with mirth's logic.

It's not just between q21 and lowell. Points have been made against rofl and massive as well. Massive was being just as scummy as lowell, he just didn't perform that suspicious hammer.

But they were thew only two with votes.

Mod:

If You can anwer this. Would the cop get a result of no result if his victim was killed?

(I used "the cop" so the mod wouldn't not answer the question for fear of confirming me.)

[Mirth]

It look like its between him and q21, I know I'm pro-town and I was afraid of godfathers so it can only Be lowell. I also agree with mirth's logic.

It's not just between q21 and lowell. Points have been made against rofl and massive as well. Massive was being just as scummy as lowell, he just didn't perform that suspicious hammer.

But they were thew only two with votes.

~headdesk~ SO. FRAKKING. WHAT?!?!

This is exactly what I mean. Just because other people are voting for someone, doesn't mean you should too. If you don't like the wagons, start your own, try to convince other people of *your* opinions. You are just blindly sitting back and following.

Hell, you are the single scummiest person in this game. Alas, you appear to be the cop. That is a shame.

[Empking]

They were the only two with votes. So they were the only two I said it was between.

But I do like one of the bandwagons so I don't see a reason to start one on someone I don't find as scummy as Lowell.

[massive]

First of all I don't believe its a mafia roleblocker. I believe Emp is the cop and Mod's comments were an indication that she forgot to send emp his result.

So, you are saying that you believe that Empking is a cop, you think that starkmoon failed to send out a result, and rather than giving him an ACTUAL result, told him he got no answer? With his target dead and revealed in the thread? Can you explain WHY you believe this? Because I honestly do not think you are this naive.

[Lowell]

Because he died??? Isn't that a reason?