Mini 626 - Crew vs. Pigs - GAME OVER!!

[Matin]

I want to see what the mod does at this point, but I do believe the claim. I've never had a player seemingly quote a mod PM before, does is it always result in a modkill? If there's a modkill does the mod always/never give a full coroner report?

[Goatrevolt]

I want to see what the mod does at this point, but I do believe the claim. I've never had a player seemingly quote a mod PM before, does is it always result in a modkill? If there's a modkill does the mod always/never give a full coroner report?

Why do you believe the claim? What do you think about my recent trifecta of posts on the topic?

[darkdude]

Interesting. To me it seems like Ennui cracked under pressure. I don't believe his claim, because as pointed out by Goat, his claimed NK-immunity is quite different from mine. I assumed we have other power roles on our side, but not ANOTHER bulletproof (albeit one-shot).

Anyways, I said what I said about the nature of DD's "bulletproof" status because I had a feeling that his state of affairs was similar to my own, one-use-only piece of crap. I tried to spur discussion of it, because I felt that betraying the nature of my own roel would bring about suspicion, but that's already happened, so what the hell.

One problem with this. If you wanted to test our claims, you would have done so long time ago, when Raider asked you at post 133, here

http://mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopic.ph ... 57#1148857

And also, why would you doubt my claim if the first thing you said after my claim was "Soudns true to me."?

Also,

FOS Fonz

.

Ennui is getting scummier each post and he's saying he doesn't see ANY scum tells?

[raider8169]

I want to see what the mod does at this point, but I do believe the claim. I've never had a player seemingly quote a mod PM before, does is it always result in a modkill? If there's a modkill does the mod always/never give a full coroner report?

Why do you believe the claim? What do you think about my recent trifecta of posts on the topic?

Im in the same boat so I will answer atleast for me. I do believe his claim however his goal could be different. WATCHER OR TRACKER sounds like a role for a townie though. I dont see what scum would do with that.

[Kison]

Ennui, I think you're scum.

Unvote

Vote : Ennui

Answer me this : What is your role name? Why did you not find it odd that the flavor behind Dark Dude's supposed night-kill immunity, as described, did not match your own? Your reaction to what he explained fails to meet the expectations I'd have for someone with the ability and information that you've given to us.

[Matin]

Why do you believe the claim? What do you think about my recent trifecta of posts on the topic?

To start, it reads like he quoted from his role PM and he later admitted to doing so. Secondly, if he was scum, I don't think he'd run the risk of claiming it was a direct quote from his PM and then have to face a bunch more suspicion as to why he wasn't mod killed.

[Goatrevolt]

Im in the same boat so I will answer atleast for me. I do believe his claim however his goal could be different. WATCHER OR TRACKER sounds like a role for a townie though. I dont see what scum would do with that.

Watchers/Trackers are those kinds of roles that you can see on scum just as well as town. As scum, they're good for finding town power roles. As town, they're good for finding scum making night kills or catching people in counterclaims.

Don't let his watcher/tracker claim fool you into believing he's town. His night kill immunity simply doesn't fit with DD's claim.

[Cass]

Well, I think Ennui is scum. I believe his claim, I also believe he left out the part where it said he's a cop who wants to get all of this mafia crew arrested (or whatever the scum pm says). The 'standard issue vest' thing is pretty convincing. He's a pig. If he isn't mod-killed, I'm all for lynching him.

[Goatrevolt]

Why do you believe the claim? What do you think about my recent trifecta of posts on the topic?

To start, it reads like he quoted from his role PM and he later admitted to doing so. Secondly, if he was scum, I don't think he'd run the risk of claiming it was a direct quote from his PM and then have to face a bunch more suspicion as to why he wasn't mod killed.

Yeah, I believe he quoted from his role PM. I don't see any reason why him quoting his role PM at all means he's town in any way.

I suspect the mod is going to come in the thread and say "Yes he gets modkilled" or "No, he's fine." Him telling the truth about quoting his role PM isn't going to result in any more suspicion on him, and is not an alignment tell in any way.

[The Fonz]

Don't let his watcher/tracker claim fool you into believing he's town. His night kill immunity simply doesn't fit with DD's claim.

Why does this necessarily mean that Ennui, and not DD is scum? Answer: it doesn't.

[raider8169]

Well, I think Ennui is scum. I believe his claim, I also believe he left out the part where it said he's a cop who wants to get all of this mafia crew arrested (or whatever the scum pm says). The 'standard issue vest' thing is pretty convincing. He's a pig. If he isn't mod-killed, I'm all for lynching him.

Ohh, good call Cass, standard issue sounds like something that a cop would get.

As far as scum having the tracker thing, I guess its possible. I never thought of it like.

Vote Ennui

[Matin]

Yeah, I believe he quoted from his role PM. I don't see any reason why him quoting his role PM at all means he's town in any way.

I suspect the mod is going to come in the thread and say "Yes he gets modkilled" or "No, he's fine." Him telling the truth about quoting his role PM isn't going to result in any more suspicion on him, and is not an alignment tell in any way.

Ahh..I get you're drift...

I took the "Watcher" role, in this setup where the town are actually mafia, to imply it was a flavor of cop....

Did you consider that? Or also consider that DD could be lieing?

[Goatrevolt]

Don't let his watcher/tracker claim fool you into believing he's town. His night kill immunity simply doesn't fit with DD's claim.

Why does this necessarily mean that Ennui, and not DD is scum? Answer: it doesn't.

No, it doesn't, but do you honestly think DD's been scummier than Ennui? I'd like to hear you comment on my reasons for finding Ennui scum, since you've kind of just brushed by it. Did you read the bulletproof vest point?

Also, you said that you're willing to cut Ennui some slack for being a newb. His discussion about multiple scum groups reads like the ultimate noob scum mistake of revealing information you shouldn't know. Thoughts?

[darkdude]

@ Cass:

Why the quick switching of opinion? You unvoted him as soon as he supposedly mod quoted, and now you suspect him scum again?

@ Raider:

Actually, remember I said how my role leads me to believe there are scum power roles? This would be the case.

@ Fonz

Why are you only looking at the claim? As you and others have said, my claim (nor Ennui's) are not tells on their own. But if you take a look at Ennui's recent behaviour and the context of the claim you would find many holes and inconstancies. I'm really liking my FOS on you now. Maybe you would like to explain why the case we have on his doesn't fit with you?

[Goatrevolt]

Ohh, good call Cass, standard issue sounds like something that a cop would get.

Haha. Cass, people seem to listen to you when you say stuff yet ignore me when I say it . Next time I want to get a point across, I'll try to funnel it through you .

Or also consider that DD could be lieing?

I'm 98% sure it's Ennui as scum and not DD.

[raider8169]

@ Raider:

Actually, remember I said how my role leads me to believe there are scum power roles? This would be the case.

I do remember that but I was thinking more like scum had maybe 2 kills a night or something more scummy like.

[Matin]

Haha. Cass, people seem to listen to you when you say stuff yet ignore me when I say it . Next time I want to get a point across, I'll try to funnel it through you .

Or also consider that DD could be lieing?

I'm 98% sure it's Ennui as scum and not DD.

Oh, only 98% huh? lol..

Really, to your point the standard issue thing is compelling. The role implies investigator of some sort, which I immediately assumed was pro-town. I guess it is possible that the scum had an investigator..

[Goatrevolt]

Oh, only 98% huh? lol..

Really, to your point the standard issue thing is compelling. The role implies investigator of some sort, which I immediately assumed was pro-town. I guess it is possible that the scum had an investigator..

Realistically, I'm more like 100%, but I gave a 2% buffer just in case. This is the most convinced I've ever been about a day 1 lynch since I've been playing mafia. Every single sign points towards him being scum.

Also:

Ennui2778[4] Goatrevolt, DD, Kison, raider

Is what I've got his wagon at right now. We just need 3 more brave adventurer's to lynch us some scum.

[Kison]

Sweet Zombie Jesus...

One of them is lying. They both claim a mutual ability yet the flavor does not match. Dark Dude's matches the cop VS mafia theme of the game while Ennui's doesn't. Ennui reacted to the

contradicting

flavor described by Dark Dude by thinking it made his role

more believable

??? Hello? McFly??? Top that off with the shameless Chen bandwagoning.

Also,

- Scroll down to the last quote in this post.

- Who the heck knows if Ennui's even telling the truth about the tracking/watching?

[forbiddanlight]

Alright, alright, I'm convinced. I try not to piggyback logic, but as usual, goat hit on the main points and there's not much one can do with it. I think that's why I felt uneasy about the claim. I subconciously noticed some of these things. So...sorry to flip flop again, I'm sure I'm gonna catch hell for it, but

unvote, vote Ennui

. I said I didn't like his claim, I'm putting action behind those words.

[The Fonz]

@ Fonz

Why are you only looking at the claim? As you and others have said, my claim (nor Ennui's) are not tells on their own. But if you take a look at Ennui's recent behaviour and the context of the claim you would find many holes and inconstancies. I'm really liking my FOS on you now. Maybe you would like to explain why the case we have on his doesn't fit with you?

Your claim is the most notable thing you've done. Also, I was responding to someone who said your claim is a town tell. It's not, because if you're town it shouldn't have been made.

Ennui is the opposite- the 'standard issue BPV' thing is actually the single biggest reason to believe him scum. Though it's irrelevant in any case, since if that is a direct quote, I can't see how cicero has a choice but to modkill. And if he doesn't, there's a lynch all liars case.

[Matin]

You guys make solid points..

But I don't understand the urgency? Seems like he's either getting mod killed or lynched at this point anyway, so wouldn't it be better to see if he's modkilled and then get a chance at a second lynch before any NK's?

(I'm assuming a modkill doesn't result in twilight)

[The Fonz]

Whether a modkill ends the day or not is at the mod's discretion.

[forbiddanlight]

But I don't understand the urgency? Seems like he's either getting mod killed or lynched at this point anyway, so wouldn't it be better to see if he's modkilled and then get a chance at a second lynch before any NK's?

For balance reasons, it SHOULD. Otherwise, the game gets all screwed up. At least, my personal opinion.

[raider8169]

But I don't understand the urgency? Seems like he's either getting mod killed or lynched at this point anyway, so wouldn't it be better to see if he's modkilled and then get a chance at a second lynch before any NK's?

For balance reasons, it SHOULD. Otherwise, the game gets all screwed up. At least, my personal opinion.

As before the claim he had like 5 votes I assume it will end the day however it doesn't matter until the mod chimes in. This is still in the control of us to figure out if we want the lynch or not. Lets make the mods life a little easier and just lynch the guy. I would rather not end the day on anything other then a lynch as then we dont have the bandwagon to go off from for the next day.