Open 785: Secrets of the Anuket Topaz [Game over!]

[Almost50]

They get NK'd immediately. You cannot protect your Top TR because there are no PRs, protective or otherwise

[Menalque]

I think ydrasse is pocketing me u guys

It’s very rude to pocket people u know ydrasse. I can forgive u but only if you promise ur town, okay?

[Menalque]

They get NK'd immediately. You cannot protect your Top TR because there are no PRs, protective or otherwise

There isn’t a NK until N3?

[Menalque]

And frankly if the game is lost from a universal TR dying N3 then the game is lost anyway

[Almost50]

They get NK'd immediately. You cannot protect your Top TR because there are no PRs, protective or otherwise

There isn’t a NK until N3?

And they get confirmed if we eliminate Mafia on D1/D2. Hiding your TRs may result in the confirmation of those you were not sure about and thus help you catch scum still by virtue of shrinking your elimination pool.

[Snowblaze]

VOTE: Snowblaze

Is this because of Holden’s post, or because I haven’t posted in a while?

@Holden, if you must try and get me killed, you could at least spell my name right. Anyway: my original vote on Fredrick was more a gut ping than anything else. It’s kind of hard to put it into words, especially a few days later, but I thought he was just opportunistically hopping on wagons.

I unvoted because I thought his remark on scum not having daytalk was a townslip after finding out that scum did have daytalk. Probably should have made that slightly clearer.

As for my post with the RCE vote, that’s probably because I didn’t really have any scumreads (still don’t, I guess). And it wasn’t “why everyone else can’t be scum” it was more “why I don’t want to vote for other people”.

[Menalque]

They get NK'd immediately. You cannot protect your Top TR because there are no PRs, protective or otherwise

There isn’t a NK until N3?

And they get confirmed if we eliminate Mafia on D1/D2. Hiding your TRs may result in the confirmation of those you were not sure about and thus help you catch scum still by virtue of shrinking your elimination pool.

Oh, right

Yeah that kinda makes sense but I think it’s prob dumb to assume that scum can’t get a fairly good sense of who perceived who how, and being reserved about reads makes it harder to hit scum on D1/D2 anyway

[Menalque]

VOTE: snowblaze

[Eevee]

I rescrubbed the decks again and it was tiring... A50 brings up a good point about RCE - I can see that coming from enthusiastic town. Also, RCE's mechanic's talk which Eve doesn't like isn't so bad since I realised I did something similar recently; I will talk to her about it!

Actually, I like Holden's wall! VOTE: Snowblaze

~Eva

[Fredrick A Campbell]

VOTE: Snowblaze

Is this because of Holden’s post, or because I haven’t posted in a while?
...

It is because of Holden's post.

[Eevee]

Correction: end of D4 or N4's start

Pending confirmation they could win by the start of D3. If the wincon for mafia is actually "all living members must escape to win" and not "majority members must escape to win" meaning 2/3. I don't want to talk more about this until nsg confirma something but I want it to be known.

i don't like this post because if you're actually scared of mafia not knowing about this yet by saying "I don't want to talk more about this until nsg confirma something" - then why make this post at all? you're telling mafia they could win by the start of D3 - that's definitely gonna get them thinking and would probably make them realise what you're talking about if they hadn't already - makes me think you made this more for show than actually being concerned about that

~Eve

Almo what do you think of my reasoning here and why does town!RCE make that post?

Holden regarding your thing about me defending Ydrasse - that's me answering Craig's question while explaining my earlier stated reasons for town leaning her - i don't get your qualms
the easiest way to read her properly though is with a reaction test:

Spoiler:

5784

sorry about the jumpscare
how does this make you feel Ydrasse?

~Eve

[RCEnigma]

Almo what do you think of my reasoning here and why does town!RCE make that post?

Hope you don't mind me stepping in here but town isn't negatively impacted by my statement. If nsg gets back to me that scum can't kill scum then it's void. If she gets back to me that scum can kill scum then I make it known in thread anyway. Even if scum weren't aware of it there is the possibility. The alternative there is that scum discovers it's possible and town is still in the dark about it.

That said I don't think anyone outside of menalque at the time has the wile to make that play. A50 still could (:

[Eevee]

I don't want to talk more about this until nsg confirma something but I want it to be known.

then why did you say this part? that gives me the impression you weren't going to make it known scum could kill each other if they could, just in case they didn't realise

~Eve

[Chemist1422]

awkwardly rolls in having taken in none of the info from the last few pages

hi

[Eevee]

hey Misty we're gonna host a great play for the ship later and we need performers - you in? and can you recommend any other good actors and actresses on board?

~Eve

[RCEnigma]

I don't want to talk more about this until nsg confirma something but I want it to be known.

then why did you say this part? that gives me the impression you weren't going to make it known scum could kill each other if they could, just in case they didn't realise

~Eve

Nsg hadn't said anything yet.

[Chemist1422]

hey Misty we're gonna host a great play for the ship later and we need performers - you in? and can you recommend any other good actors and actresses on board?

~Eve

wait are we on a ship

...

[Almost50]

Almo what do you think of my reasoning here and why does town!RCE make that post?

Because he didn't receive a red PM and didn't even read the rules thoroughly?? I mean, the rules explicitly state:

The Mafia win when all living members escape.

There is no mention of "majority" here, so RCE didn't read that (and I'm sure the win con in the role PM is identical because it would be a mod discrepancy if they gave us something in public and something else to scum in private).

Now let's discuss the possibilities: 2 Scum Eliminations on D1/D2 = Scum instant loss
1 Scum Elimination on D1/D2 and they canNOT have a "majority" escaping because NO ONE will escape by the end of D2.
No Scum Elimination on D1/D2 = still can't win by the "start" of D3 because only one scum would escape by the end of D2 and they need to make it through D3 for a second one to escape (and that's EVEN if we assume -somehow- "majority" which I already said was a misconception)

So, RCE was wrong. Plain and simple.

Now let me ask you this: What is the SCUM motive behind this post, given scum daychat is also announced in the rules. If RCE had doubts or was unclear about the rule (which -again- is not possible from my PoV given it's an explicit win con statement) why wouldn't he have asked in the scum PT?

[Almost50]

Almo what do you think of my reasoning here and why does town!RCE make that post?

Hope you don't mind me stepping in here but town isn't negatively impacted by my statement. If nsg gets back to me that scum can't kill scum then it's void. If she gets back to me that scum can kill scum then I make it known in thread anyway. Even if scum weren't aware of it there is the possibility. The alternative there is that scum discovers it's possible and town is still in the dark about it.

That said I don't think anyone outside of menalque at the time has the wile to make that play. A50 still could (:

I dunno where you got the idea that scum could have been allowed to kill scum. It's VERY rare for a mod to allow scum to kill their partners, and its usually in a "special setup" (I seem to recall one Open Setup that does) so maybe that's where you got the idea, but I can confirm I have never thought of it tbh.

[Almost50]

I don't want to talk more about this until nsg confirma something but I want it to be known.

then why did you say this part? that gives me the impression you weren't going to make it known scum could kill each other if they could, just in case they didn't realise

~Eve

And what if you/me/anyone else decided to ask NSG for themselves and found out that Scum can kill their partners and that RCE -who had already said he was asking NSG- didn't tell us the truth?? Come on.

[Almost50]

I mean, if you ask something in public you are opening the door for others to also ask it. If you ask it in private and still mention it in public that is identically the same (except it may open the door for different wording leading to different answers in some cases, but this is an Open so that's not really a concern).

The only way this is scum driven is if RCE wanted to see if he could win as early as the start of D3, and in that case he would have NOT said it in the open at all, but rather asked in the scum PT and kept the answer to himself (and his partners)

[Almost50]

hey Misty we're gonna host a great play for the ship later and we need performers - you in? and can you recommend any other good actors and actresses on board?

~Eve

wait are we on a ship

...

[Eevee]

no Almo you don't follow me

RCEngima tried to give the impression he didn't want scum to realise they could kill each other if they hadn't already, and asked a question privately to the mod
but if that's the case, he shouldn't be making that post in the first place since it could possibly alert scum that they can kill each other

the scuminess of that post has nothing to do with the act of misunderstanding the rules - it has everything to do with the intent of the post and the disconnect betweent the thought process behind it and the actual act of making and posting it
you ask for scum motivation? there doesn't need to be a

specific

motivation for that post - the scum motivation for any post like that is to give out content and get yourself not scumread
you and RCE aren't invited to perform for the play - you can still have tickets to view it though

VOTE: RCEnigma

~Eve

[Eevee]

I mean, if you ask something in public you are opening the door for others to also ask it. If you ask it in private and still mention it in public that is identically the same (except it may open the door for different wording leading to different answers in some cases, but this is an Open so that's not really a concern).

The only way this is scum driven is if RCE wanted to see if he could win as early as the start of D3, and in that case he would have NOT said it in the open at all, but rather asked in the scum PT and kept the answer to himself (and his partners)

again: i am not suggesting RCE could be scum who was actually unsure about the answer of this question - if he's scum he most likely knew the outcome of the question before asking it - probably from a rules clarification in his PT
the scum motivation to ask that is for town points and to look good for it

~Eve

[Eevee]

Now let me ask you this: What is the SCUM motive behind this post, given scum daychat is also announced in the rules. If RCE had doubts or was unclear about the rule (which -again- is not possible from my PoV given it's an explicit win con statement) why wouldn't he have asked in the scum PT?

I dislike this. Don’t you think it’s very very easy for scum to say something publicly that they could’ve said in the scum pt to seem townie?

~Eva