Mini 611 - Troy, Meet Helen (Game Over)

[Farkshinsoup]

I've done a lot of vote hopping today, no doubt about that. And yes, I want to run a wagon on whichever scummy player I have the best chance of getting lynched. Many people have admitted to the same thing in this game. There's nothing scummy about being strategic with your vote to make sure that scum gets lynched (especially since we haven't even lynched one of them yet)

[charter]

Bah, it seems the LG wagon has lost all hope. I STILL think he's the most definate scum, but I'll settle for Walnut.

unvote, vote walnut

Fark, trying to play off your frequent wagon hopping with legitimate reasons ("There's nothing scummy about being strategic with your vote to make sure that scum gets lynched (especially since we haven't even lynched one of them yet)") certainly isn't helping you in my mind. I would just use the defense, "I know I'm town, so I'd rather someone else scummy get lynched". It would have been much more believable than your trying to supply actual reasoning for the votechanging.

[Tinsley]

I'm just pointing out that since you've joined the game, you've been pointing fingers at myself and Fark without trying to build a case. If you're going to accuse Fark/farside for that reason, it's only right that we look at you for the same reason.

farside22 didn't scumhunt. Sorry, Farkshinsoup, that you inherited an already-caught scum role.

That’s the only reason you’ve given for suspecting Fark, so if there’s another reason, what is it? While we're on the subject, what scumhunting have you done?

What was your question about Walnut?

You said you weren’t wild about Walnut’s proposed lynch while earlier in the game you said you didn’t mind the Walnut hate. What made you change your mind?

Tinsley, what do you think of Lord Gurgi?

I don’t like the fact that he seems to just jump on whatever bandwagon is most popular. I also didn’t like how he jumped off the charter bandwagon after it got called out (as did Fark). But I would feel more comfortable lynching Fark.

Fark – In post 632 you said you were going to keep looking at me. Did you find something that made you want to change your vote back to me? You think that both I and LG OMGUS’d you, what made you decide I was more lynch worthy?

charter – You stated in post 608 that you think Fark is just a townie that is wrong in his assessment of the game, but your most recent post suggests that you think he could be scum, are you starting to change your mind on him?

[charter]

I keep flipping back and forth between Fark being town and scum. I have no problem with him being lynched because he has been quite scummy, but I'm not sure if he's scum or just scummy, but I would much rather prefer LG or Walnut. I would first like to do a reread of him before he does get lynched though (if we go that route).

[Mizzy]

Vote Count:

Farkshinsoup 3 (Thesp, Tinsley, Lord Gurgi)
Walnut 3 (Macavenger, CF Riot, charter)
Tinsley 2 (camn, Farkshinsoup)
charter 1 (Walnut)

Not Voting:

ShadowGirl

10 Alive = 6 to lynch!

[camn]

Urgh. Camn just voted someone who wasn't even on the LoS she posted 1 page ago. I don't know how to digest this at all. I'm also bothered by the fact that your trend on Charter is: Scum+Vote -> Misguided town -> LoS #3 -> "Maybe not so bad!"

That's why I don't like lists. I suspect everyone. Because I have gotten burned PLENTY of times by some great scum who never made ANY list. I'm sure you have too. So I keep an open mind

And would you rather I just made up my mind on charter, and totally disregarded everything that happened afterwards?

[CF Riot]

I've only played one online game of mafia outside this one. And that was around 3 or 4 years ago. I don't have a policy on lists, I just know "keeping an open mind" is very similar to blending in with the crowd. Opinions change, but if every one of your suspects is as likely to be voted for as the other it leaves you open to kill with the crowd and never take heat for it. Therefore, that excuse means nothing to me. As for Charter, I don't think the amount of action he's taken warrants the amount of times you've flip-flopped on him.

We had a full day with no posts. We need to start heading towards some real decision, because I'm starting to think this:

I think extra time does more to help scum recover from early missteps than it does provide useful information.

is right.

[camn]

I Know.. I seemed to bring everything to a halt.

c

ps..
CF.. I don't need an "excuse".

You want my honest opinions? I will give them to you. That is my life's work My opinions change with new information. Plus.. your characterization is off. This is how MY mind works:

Scum = must die.
Misguided town = probably SHOULD die
LOS #3 = third in line to Die
"maybe not so bad" = OK to put off dying until tomorrow.

You see there is no flip flopping.. it's just a matter of degree.

[Lord Gurgi]

Camn would be my kind of vig, guns blazing and all that.

[Mizzy]

If there are too many days of little to no posting, I will set another deadline. So post more!

[Walnut]

Charter is still my first choice for today. I laid out a case on him in post #501 which still stands. I think some people got on the wagon a little hurriedly, so when challenged were left without much to say for themselves. Do bear in mind that no player has to come up with all of the ideas by themselves, you can say "I agree with that argument". It is not like we are rival detectives who each have to find their own evidence and are not allowed to share.

I am still highly suspicious of Thesp, but see him as a prospect for tomorrow rather than today.

My view of Tinsley as misguided townie is tending more towards scum as the day wears on. Given the current lack of interest in Charter, I will

unvote; vote Tinsley

(But keep your eye on Charter- he is still the top of my list)

[Farkshinsoup]

Fark – In post 632 you said you were going to keep looking at me. Did you find something that made you want to change your vote back to me? You think that both I and LG OMGUS’d you, what made you decide I was more lynch worthy?

It comes down to this:

I think Fark decided he didn't quite have enough votes to lynch charter, so he decided to start a Tinsley bandwagon to appeal to Thesp. If he could get Thesp to vote with him, then he just needed two more non-scumbuddy votes.

This crappy argument + OMGUS + Day 1 voting = my vote for you.

[charter]

Walnut is scum. LG is scum. LG also sucks for killing me in EBHOBANOHAR before I even knew the thread was up and for knowing I was scum in it.

Walnut contradicts himself in his last post. He says "you can say 'I agree with that argument'" but then gives this as his reason for voting "My view of Tinsley as misguided townie is tending more towards scum as the day wears on" which is essentially trying to give his own reason for his vote rather than just agreeing.

I'll do a reread of Tinsley when I get a chance and see if I can support this bandwagon.

[Walnut]

I didn't say "

the only reason you can

vote for someone is by agreeing with an argument someone else has put forward", I said "you

can

agree with an argument someone else has put forward."

Charter continues to amaze me. As I said in #501, he will claim anything, as absurd as it is, in his efforts to lynch me. CFRiot, do you still think that "his cases are presented very poorly, but do make sense if you interpret them a bit." applies to this post of his?

[charter]

So then you're whole reason for wanting to lynch Tinsley is his misguided townie is TENDING to give you scum vibes? That's a pretty weak reason on day two to lynch someone.

[Tinsley]

So you’re voting me because I decided not to vote for someone I didn’t find scummy, and MY argument is crappy?

By the way my crappy argument/prediction is looking like it’s coming true. You’ve got your loyal followers (camn and Walnut) on my bandwagon now. With charter doing a reread, ShadowGirl set to return any day now, and Thesp more than willing to drop the hammer, it looks like you might get someone other than Walnut lynched. Nice work scum!

Walnut – What made you change your mind on me?

[charter]

After a reread of D2 (day 1 is too long for me right now) I don't want to lynch walnut today. There's reasonable doubt in my head that he's scum. There is no reasonable doubt that LG is scum in my head. I've also switched back to fark being scum and would be ok with his lynch.

I don't think Tinsley is scum. This is based largely on the end of post 565 and my assumption that LG is scum and Walnut stands a good chance of being scum.

I don't like how Tinsley doesn't vote fark in 573, Tinsley, why did you not vote Fark then?

Ok, LG's post in 577. He is trying to place suspicion on Camn right after she gets off my wagon. He doesn't do this to Fark either, just Camn...

Tinsley brings up a good point in 597. I'm happy with lynching Fark today.

Riot, in 629, you suspect five people. Five!

Fark in 623 - "I'm leaving my vote on you for now, but I'm going to keep looking." Oh dear.

unvote, vote Fark

Yes I think Fark is scum, and No I don't think Tinsley is scum.

[Farkshinsoup]

And I'm back down again.

charter, please read Tinsley's post 715. What part of my master plan do you not understand? After your re-read, you were supposed to vote for Tinsley. Tinsley! If you switch right away, I'll spare you later.

Tinsley, your logic is flawed - I really like the way that you've set it up so that the more people find you scummy, the more it's a result of my scummy plans. There are valid reasons why people are voting for you, and just because they are, that is not proof that I orchestrated this bandwagon in advance.

The fact that you keep floating this hare-brained idea tells me that my vote is in the right place.

[Tinsley]

I don't like how Tinsley doesn't vote fark in 573, Tinsley, why did you not vote Fark then?

Post 573 was my initial reaction to Fark, at the time, I really didn't suspect him as post 565 says.

It wasn't until after post 573 that I started thinking about what had happened with Walnut/Fark's wagon on you, the fact that SG was going to be gone for several days, Thesp's assessment of me, and the fact that you had earlier said that you were tempted to vote me. It seemed convenient that Fark's reread resulted in (weak) evidence against the next easiest lynch.

[Lord Gurgi]

Day's gone on too long,

Mod: Could we get a deadline?

.

I'm noticing that both Walnut and Fark are voting for Tinsley now. I would say we should wait for ShadowGirl, but I don't think she would contribute anything to break us out of the petty arguments.

[Farkshinsoup]

FoS Lord Gurgi.

Did you just ask for a deadline?! That's pretty damn convenient, since that bandwagon against you just recently evaporated.

I really don't want to have to switch my vote AGAIN, but I'll do it if you don't convincingly explain to me why you requested a deadline.

[camn]

By the way my crappy argument/prediction is looking like it’s coming true. You’ve got your loyal followers (camn and Walnut) on my bandwagon now. ...

Just as a detail, I'd like to point out one thing.
There was no vote on you when I voted you. I joined no wagon...... but I am a little impressed/concerned with the speed it has grown.


@Tinsley
You think I am Fark's follower? Please explain why.
Do you mean we are both scum?
Are you speculating we are Masons? a Cult? Lovers?
whats the deal?

@ Walnut-
what DID change your mind?

@Fark
DID you orchestrate this wagon in advance?
you wrote this:

If we manage to lynch Tinsley today, I'll be looking at LG hard tomorrow

What does that mean?

[charter]

Me not suspecting Tinsley has not much to do with you Fark. It's largely because I am positive LG is scum.

I'll gladly revote LG if anyone but Fark is willing to.

[Farkshinsoup]

Me not suspecting Tinsley has not much to do with you Fark. It's largely because I am positive LG is scum.

Yeah, I got that charter, I was using you to make a sarcastic point to Tinsley. I should not use sarcasm - so easily misinterpreted. (Please do not interpret that last statement sarcastically.)

@Fark
DID you orchestrate this wagon in advance?

No.

you wrote this:

If we manage to lynch Tinsley today, I'll be looking at LG hard tomorrow

What does that mean?

I said that in the same post where I switched my vote back to Tinsley from LG. As you can tell from my post, I wanted Tinsley lynched. At that point, yeah I was hoping that Thesp would switch his vote over to Tinsley, because, again, I wanted him lynched. So "we" means you, me, hopefully Thesp, and anyone else that wanted to lynch him.

Remember Tinsley is saying that this was my plan from the START, that I've been manipulating everyone to lynch him.

Let me ask you this:Do YOU think I orchestrated this wagon? If you do, then vote me. If not, then don't.

(again, zero sarcasm in the above statements. No appropriate emoticon.)

[Lord Gurgi]

FoS Lord Gurgi.

Did you just ask for a deadline?! That's pretty damn convenient, since that bandwagon against you just recently evaporated.

I really don't want to have to switch my vote AGAIN, but I'll do it if you don't convincingly explain to me why you requested a deadline.

I'm asking for a deadline because discussion is becoming petty and pointless. If you're honestly pinning asking for a deadline as a scum tell then I bow to your almighty framing abilities.