Mini 624 - Game Over!

[Battousai]

Dang, I thought I caught him in a lie. I always thought trackers only knew if who they targetted had a night action.

If you want a defense about my role, you can look at my posts. When there were two claimed cops D1, I never ruled out there being 2 cops in the game (because I knew at least one of them had to be telling the truth). I wanted Max to tell us if he was allowed to investigate himself, because I asked the mod that myself (if he lied I would have had him in a lie).

[Wumbo]

Coming back in, yes, I'm just a blue, thank God. I don't think I would be keeping up any better otherwise.

I find it hard to believe there's a tracker in a 4 cop game, but that's just me.

We're not at LYLO or MYLO because 2 mafia are dead, so I'm up for letting the cop do his actions and find out his sanity and/or having tracker track, but then again it's easy to fake your investigations, especially if tracker is lying.

I

fos: StrangerCoug

for now. I thought the self vote was really strange.

[StrangerCoug]

Mod: I am having technical difficulties with my Internet connection right now, and I'm posting from the library. I'm not going to call myself V/LA just yet, but if I take too long between posts, go ahead and replace me outright.

[StrangerCoug]

I'm more confident in my vote, by rethinking what StrangerCoug has claimed. SC said he tracked Max. Why would you do that? If Max was scum, then SC would have gotten the result that Max left his house. If Max was cop, the

only other option

Max could be, then SC would have gotten the result that Max left his house.

You are confusing the tracker for what I think is the reporter (the role Inspector Godot fakeclaimed).

Why would you track someone you KNEW was going to leave their house?

Because maxwellhouse wasn't confirmed cop. If the person he went after died in the morning, then that meant he was scum. Basically, I was trying to confirm his alignment.

I like Litral's #523 and Cass's #524.

[Litral]

Okay, no, I don't think Coug's claim corresponds to what he posted earlier. But his role seems too useful to lynch, especially this early.

I want to hear if geraintm has a role...

[StrangerCoug]

Mod: The technical difficulties mentioned in post #527 have been resolved. Thanks.

[StrangerCoug]

Hello?

[Battousai]

I think we are just waiting on geraintm to claim. Let's just go along and act like he claimed vanilla townie until he posts.

SC: Your voting me because you don't think there are 3 cops in the game. Please tell me why couldn't there be 3 cops, Nhat's role, and according to you, a tracker in the game? Why did vote yourself and not keep your vote on me? I know your original reason was because you think I counterclaimed you, but you had reread my role and decided to vote yourself. Why not just change your reason to doubting the legitimacy of there being 3 cops?

[StrangerCoug]

SC: Your voting me because you don't think there are 3 cops in the game. Please tell me why couldn't there be 3 cops, Nhat's role, and according to you, a tracker in the game? Why did vote yourself and not keep your vote on me? I know your original reason was because you think I counterclaimed you, but you had reread my role and decided to vote yourself. Why not just change your reason to doubting the legitimacy of there being 3 cops?

I can buy two cops, a forensic investigator, and a tracker. As I said, if geraintm is not a town roleblocker, then the roleblocker must be scum. I do doubt the existence of three let alone four cops. Given Dark wingstalker's lynch and what he flipped, chances are maxwellhouse was insane (according to MafiaWiki, there are rarely both a paranoid cop and a godfather). If there are three cops, the two sanity distributions that I see most likely are sane/naïve/paranoid and insane/naïve/paranoid. Two cops, one sane and one insane, isn't exactly likely, but I do find it believable.

What's that one type of theme game where all the townie roles are cops with differing sanities?

[Cass]

I think we are just waiting on geraintm to claim. Let's just go along and act like he claimed vanilla townie until he posts.

I can't do that. Everything shifts depending on what he claims (4rth cop, roleblocker or neither). I really do not want to draw conclusions until I know. This is annoying.

Mod: could you pretty please prod geraintm for us? His absence is holding up the game for all of us.

[geraintm]

sorry, i was away from thursday till sunday and have only got back on now, just seen the thread is open. the thread was locked so i couldnt say i was away. will catch up later today

[geraintm]

ok, have read the thread, my head hurts
i am vanilla townie, which i am very glad about. this game is way too messed up
too many cops.
i'll post my thoughts on the game later, but will quickly say i didnt like bat just going ahead and making the assumption i am vanilla
also dont like anyone who is making assumptions that there arent as many cops asappear to have been claimed, it seems to me that the game has been set up by the mod to be some sort of cop themed game.
with so many roles, i am making the assumption that there is a roleblocker on teh bad guys side

but i will comment more on the actualy claims in a secondary post, but had to get in my role as you all wanted it

sorry again for not being around sooner

[Cass]

Thanks geraint Now we can move on.

My thoughts on this whole situation:

1) 2 dead cops, 1 claimed. Personally, I tend to believe Batt's claim. 3 cops and at least one other investigator makes me think none of the cops was sane. That makes Batt naive and his results null. Max was paranoid or insane, Chenhsi idem.
2) Strangercoug: the only claim right now that is a source of information. He claims tracker, implies a roleblocker and clears Litral. So, either SC is mafia, or the last mafia is a roleblocker.

Conclusions: with no protective roles and no roleblockers on the side of town, 1 NK both nights makes it pretty safe to assume there was three mafia, no SK. Meaning one mafia is still alive. Quite possibly a roleblocker.

Assuming SC is honest makes my suspects: Wumbo & geraintm. Alternatively, SC could be lying, which makes him scum. But I tend to believe SC actually, Litral wasn't the safest name to lie about.

[Cass]

Addendum: to Stranger, Battousai and Litral, there's of course three suspects rather than two: Cass, Wumbo & geraintm.

Litral proposes no-lynch, but with this limited pool of suspects, all claimed vanillas, I think it's much better to lynch someone. On gut I'd say Wumbo. But I should really reread and see if there's evidence on either one of them.

[Litral]

I'm not willing to believe SC because it is less sensible for the scum to block him only for Night 2 and not Night 3; they should've thought they managed to block the doc. But I'm not willing to lynch a possible tracker this early, either.

I think Wumbo fits the bill. I don't think geraintm is scum. Wumbo, however, has been posting little content ever since we let him off the hook.

[Litral]

If our tracker is real he'll almost 100% be killed in the night. So let's wait for that.

[Cass]

How about this plan:
- we lynch wumbo
- if he isn't scum / the game hasn't ended, Stranger tracks me or geraintm (don't tell us who)
- Battousai checks Stranger (only one he hasn't yet, so)

Gives the scum something to think about. But I'm fairly sure Wumbo is our man anyways. So let's end this today

Vote: Wumbo

[Cass]

In case anyone wants another reason to vote Wumbo - Godot 'investigated' him during night two, 'clearing' him:

Night 2: Investigated Wumbo. He hasn't posted much and I was interested to see if he was a scum trying to go under the radar or possibly a power role keeping quiet. Unfortunately I was told that he was at home, so I guess he's just a normal townie.

[geraintm]

Ok, as promised, my thoughts

I said I wanted to hammer, but whatever.

why? why did you want to hammer so badly. if you wanted to vote, then you should have

bat's claim
well, nice he got an innocent on me
which post did i edit though bat??
what did you mean by "If I'm naive, then scum will not kill me because they are afraid of my results"? am confused

agree that you have either found 3 townies or are naive

I want the last cop claim. I hope there is one.

sorry, am confused here
what do you mean, you want the last cop claim. you mean you want the last cop to claim? and why are you so sure there is a cop to claim?

Since Battousai effectively counterclaimed me,

Vote: Battousai.

didnt counterclaim you, but your reaction to vote so quickly was interesting to put it mildly

Did you just self-vote? Why?? Three cops... I guess that proves differing sanities.

i dont normally metagame, but this does seem like some sort of cop themed game the mod has set up, with it all to do with people wandering the streets at night. i must say, i am kinda surprised that there hasnt been a false positive result come up.

All right, fine! I don't care if I'm royally screwed over; I want to do something to move the game along, damn it!

Unvote: StrangerCoug
Vote: Wumbo

Stop sitting there.

huh, did you vote for wumbo because bat is claiming either you or wumbo is scum?

Unvote: Wumbo

for the moment. Now engage in discussion.

I find even three cops hard to believe, Cass. If there are four cops, then there

MUST

be one sane, one insane, one paranoid and one naïve. If there are three cops, then I don't think we have both a sane and an insane cop.

I do believe the roleblocker should claim if he's town, as I believe. If there is a mass claim and the roleblocker doesn't claim such, then I'm pretty sure whoever the roleblocker is is scum.

why do you think there is a roleblocker wh is town? with so many investigation roles, seems only fair that the scum get a blocker to try and even things out.

Four cops, a tracker, a forensic investigator and a town roleblocker against only at most four (and probably three) scum? I find that very difficult to believe.

I find it hard to believe too, but I said I

THINK

the roleblocker is town (he or she may be scum). I also think Battousai is lying.

whoa whoa whoa
bat is lying? why is he lying? why are you voting for him? i dont see why you are, you havent explained at all!

cass - i would have liked you to have left cougar try and explain it for himself rather than you helpfully give your reasoning

If there are three cops, the two sanity distributions that I see most likely are sane/naïve/paranoid and insane/naïve/paranoid. Two cops, one sane and one insane, isn't exactly likely, but I do find it believable.

What's that one type of theme game where all the townie roles are cops with differing sanities?

S/N/P i can buy
I/N/P i find hard to believe, that basically cripples the town with 3 cops who are all getting wrong/unhelpful results doesnt it??

i keep getting the feeling that cougar knows more than he is letting on,
and cass' last post seems a good find to me
i am agreeing that wumbo looks like the person i wouldlike to get rid of most, unless there was a reason for thispost

Anyway, yes I was at home last night. I'm nilla townie as I always claimed, though it's a shame they didn't fall for my power role bid.

because someone spotted him at home last night that i have missed. has anyone claimed to have seen wumbo at home at night?

[Cass]

Yep, Godot. Who was lying scum. No one has investigated Wumbo for real, as far as I know.

Battousai: claims cop, innocent on Cass, geraintm & Litral. At least one of these is true (five mafia seems excessive ), so he isn't insane. Could be naive though.
Strangercoug: claims tracker. Tracked Max to DWS night 1. Got roleblocked night two. Tracked Litral night three (he went nowhere).

Add to that: Cass, Wumbo & Geraint have claimed vanilla. Litral hasn't claimed cop or roleblocker. SC tried to track me the night he got blocked.

[Cass]

I think the set-up the way it seems to be makes perfect sense:
- Town has three non-sane cops. Two are useless, one could be useful.
- Town also has a forensic investigator. All the crazy cops walking around at night balance this quite powerful role. Imagine all four investigators had claimed at once, with conflicting results. That would have caused a pretty confused situation and scum could easily have claimed cop as well.
- A tracker. Now this one seems a bit excessive, so I'm not 100% sure I believe it. Willing to give him a chance to confirm himself though.

- Scum has a GF to confuse investigations even more, and a RB for balance.

[Cass]

Sorry for the posting spree; I'd been waiting for quite a while to put my thoughts down I have to agree that StrangerCoug has said and done some weird things.

@Stranger:

Let me tell you guys that I am a tracker and that maxwellhouse did indeed investigate Dark wingstalker Night 1 (the latter of which we all know xD). I tried to track Cass Night 2, but got roleblocked. Litral did not submit a night choice Night 3.

1) Why did you investigate me night 2? Why Litral night 3? Can you paraphrase the results the mod pm-ed you night 2 and 3?

I think the roleblocker is town and blocked me by mistake trying to block the Mafia, but I'm not 100% sure.

2)Why did/do you think the roleblocker is town?

Since Battousai effectively counterclaimed me, Vote: Battousai.

He didn't, you misread, but even so:
3) There are multiple cops in this game. Why couldn't there be multiple trackers?

Have you ever misinterpreted what you thought was a counterclaim against you? That's what I'm guilty of, and I know what that means; therefore, my vote stands. Now kill me.

No, I haven't, but if I had, I'm pretty sure 'kill me' would

not

be my response.
4) I still don't get why you felt obliged to vote yourself after a simple misunderstanding. Nothing disastrous happened, as far as I can see. Care to explain your thought pocess a bit more?

All right, fine! I don't care if I'm royally screwed over

5) Why would you be royally screwed over?
6) Why did you unvote Wumbo again, so soon after you voted him?

I'm not against a no lynch if we have no other information to gain today, but right now we should be trying to find the third and most likely final scum. I'm going to vote: Battousai again for the time being, but no lynch should be a last resort here.

7) Yet you say you think Batt's a liar in that same post. Why would you support a no lynch then?

I am against massclaiming.

8) Why? Seeing as you started the claiming today.

Meaning geraintm is the roleblocker and/or the roleblocker is scum (assuming, of course, it exists).

9) Why would you doubt the existence of a RB? Your own credibility depends on the presence of one...

I was afraid I blew it. That's all I'm going to say.

10) How mysterious. You sure you can't say anything more?

If there are three cops, the two sanity distributions that I see most likely are sane/naïve/paranoid and insane/naïve/paranoid. Two cops, one sane and one insane, isn't exactly likely, but I do find it believable.

11) That sounds as if three cops is more likely than two cops. Yet you think Battousai is lying. Why?

12) How do you feel about lynching Wumbo today?

[geraintm]

cass, after having read your post, what are your thoughts on cougar. right now, i am sitting here just going huh? he doesnt allow an easy read and it feels like he is a walking contradiction...

[Cass]

Right now? Confused, and very curious about what he (thinks) he is doing. I hope to have a clearer opinion after he answers my questions.

[Battousai]

I'm going to make a double post. First post in response to a lynch, second for questions directed at me.

Why are you guys so eager to vote Wumbo? Is it because Godot claimed to have investigated him? Don't you think it's possible he investigated the most scummy TOWNIE to garner Wumbo's support and to add credulence to his claim since he also claimed to have investigated imaginality? Also did you forget DWS on D1? DWS tried to get Wumbo lynched and the way he did it makes me believe DWS wasn't bussing.

Now I'm willing to concede SC could be innocent (I haven't investigated him, so it's not fact), but I think we should lynch him based on the fact that if he is scum, we could be screwed in the end. We have 6 players left. If we lynch (starting at bottom of player list) Litral, I could be killed this night. That leaves 4 players alive tomorrow (3 townie, 1 scum) If SC is scum, all he has to do is claim to have tracked geraintm to my house, making him the last scum. So your only choice in lylo would be to listen to SC's claim or lynch SC.